We are looking forward to your feedback!

Cool stuff!

On replenishing ammo supply:
Recall / Re-Deploy?
Swing by a Supply Depot?

On missing items:
Figure A appears to be missing a number of current vehicles. Is the grid comprehensive?

Where are logi and assault dropships? I take it we will be getting an asset refund for this if youre removing our vehicles for beta testing?

... the lack of other current vehicles goes back to the original idea of stripping things down to "base" models of things and adding specialized vehicles back later.

They went away with the enforcers and marauders.

Where are logi and assault dropships? I take it we will be getting an asset refund for this if youre removing our vehicles for beta testing?

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

I'm really happy to see CCP take the positive steps in allowing the community to provide feedback regarding these changes before they are actually implemented. I hope this will become the norm in the future and not the exception.

oO yeh thats quite a rework I take it your leaving AV guns alone as part of this process

I hope so. Before they touch AV we have to see how well the new vehicles will be. And I mean we have to see it in action.

As long as proto AV is out there, these tanks, from the stats will be even bigger coffins than the current batch.

Thankfully they aren't making us beta test this stuff since we've officially released.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they're addressing it, but I'm getting kind of pissed with this whole ******* process. How the **** am I supposed to decide where I want to put my SP when things change so drastically like this? I mean, to the point where many vehicles have now been removed, with the promise that they'll be back soon....hmm...I seem to remember a tank that was taken out to come back "soon"....

The Black ops HAV's got a MAJOR buff... thats why you dont see them any more

Wasn't there another class of tank that was removed as well? I could definitely be wrong.

Regardless, it's been an awful long time now to figure out how to reverse said buff :/

Marauders... they just went to the shops to get some smokes... they'll be back any min... you'll see.... YOU'LL ALL SEE!!!!

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

Long time tanker here this sounds great. rail tanks have been so overpowerd due to there range and damage but hopfully ammo will make them less dominant

My small suggestion, add 1,2,3,4 for vehicle active mods. Granted this might make keyboards a tad more 'op' but i just hate the current system of middle mouse and then look at what you want most of the time causing my camera to follow which in a HAV is a pain in the wallet... i once went to use my repairer while escaping.. turret lifted up and hit a railing. Collision damage. Dead.

Thankfully they aren't making us beta test this stuff since we've officially released.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they're addressing it, but I'm getting kind of pissed with this whole ******* process. How the **** am I supposed to decide where I want to put my SP when things change so drastically like this? I mean, to the point where many vehicles have now been removed, with the promise that they'll be back soon....hmm...I seem to remember a tank that was taken out to come back "soon"....

I can appreciate that you need to reduce noise in your data, but how is further limiting tankers supposed to help in that regard?

2H/3L on an armor tank? How is that going to produce any sort of variety in fits? It would seem very likely that there will be yet another stage of one fit to rule them all.

I do appreciate the irony though. People complained about not having enough PG to fill their slots, so you took the slots away. Clever.

Even temporarily, taking away assault dropships would be a crippling change to our dropship pilots: We wouldn't have a lot of reason to bring them in matches. Dropship pilots are only needed for transport for a small portion of a match.

I mean seriously, armor we could get with one plate and one repper is less than 6000.

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

Lol, lol, and lol. One use of a heat sink module and blaster ammo is gone. Fewer slots than current MLT vehicles. A Limbus now will have more slots than the Madrugar once this comes. No 180mm plate.

One good thing is that we now get fitting optimization skills to reduce resource requirements.

What we really want is explanations as to why he made the changes this way and not any other way.

I mean seriously, armor we could get with one plate and one repper is less than 6000.

Could you elaborate on the blast radius values for turrets?

Yeah, they look...odd. Maybe they're listing circumferences now

You want your nose cut off because you don't like how it looks. Why should rails be gimped because you can't be bothered to fit a tank with one?

180 plates were replaced with Complex 120's (roughly the same armor values)

Better Armor Hardeners means you can survive longer on the front-line. Resistances are always going to be better than raw HP when the **** hits the fan.

Armor resists look to be staying at about what they are now. Skill based resist and two carapace hardeners works out about the same as the new 60% modules, although the current have better active times and shorter cooldowns.

So all in all an armor nerf, which is just what most of us feared.

Without an AV nerf, tankers should all just quit.

What two hardeners are you talking about? A plate and a repper, if we can fit them, then one hardener if we have anything left. Likely nothing in the highs.

I don't see any PG expansion units, or diagnostic units. Screwing over shield, again.

While we are on it, assuming these plans get readied up for 1.7, how long after that until we get the higher tiers of tanks?

Reducing us to basic vehicles is tolerable for a month, but not three.

Powergrid Upgrade Unit and CPU Upgrade Unit. They're there still.

I hope not. Circumference is a terrible way to gauge blast range. Diameter is better, imo - the distance from one side of the blast to the other. Circumference is just unnecessary confusion.

OMG, my favorite is the changes to vehicle command. We will get all racial variants unlocked just from skilling into one of them is pure awesomeness.

For dropship operations can we get a bonus to 20% to small turret clip size? Mainly to keep the rare dog fight from becoming an aerial ramming contest.

The hardeners are a potential issue if you're giving a 60% damage reduction on armor and 40% on shields or vice versa.

I'll edit this later, when I have more time to dedicate to this. Overall it seems like it will make things way more interstesting and opens up the floor for people who were holding out for racial vehicles. Well done guys.

180 plates were replaced with Complex 120's (roughly the same armor values)

Better Armor Hardeners means you can survive longer on the front-line. Resistances are always going to be better than raw HP when the **** hits the fan.

Powergrid Upgrade Unit and CPU Upgrade Unit. They're there still.

The Diagnostic Unit module granted a % increase to shields, shield recharge rate, and PG. Very good module for shield vehicles, not in the list anymore.

I like switching the CPU mod to a high slot, because no one wanted to use one anyway.

Move up, get hit, start to retreat, and pray that no one comes after you.

Looking at the shield booster numbers they make no sense.

286 CPU, and a massive 1048 to be able to not even rep back one Ishukone Assault Forge round? And you can do that once every thirty seconds with max skills?

Sounds like fun being that tanker.

Move up, get hit, start to retreat, and pray that no one comes after you.

This has been a rough year for your customers as we wait for what seems like simple assets. Adding a weapon, suit or vehicle in our preferred race seems to take forever. Your terrain and structure teams seem to be delivering though. At least we have that. I guess I just want an up-front answer as to what is going on with development. Why does it seem like we are waiting forever for new content and then current content is now being removed? Then, there is the PVE that I'm guessing has been shelved indefinitely. Dev blogs and posts that are "written" also seem to take weeks or more to be posted.

How people spawn in with an Ishukone and don't have an LAV immediately on hand are absolutely beyond my line of reasoning.

I already hound vehicles like a demon....

I don't see how you tankers aren't absolutely furious over this.

Where did this come from?...

We all saw this coming.

People thought tankers were just being cynical when we said they were going to nerf us again.

Here we are, getting nerfed.

Good thing these notes came out before I bought some aurum, now I know better.

Thanks for saving me money CCP!

So instead of whining about it, how about you propose something different?

I have two questions. The ROF for the small blaster is .07 which doesn't make sense to me being used to bullets per minute. Also what are small turrets going to be used for if their damage is capped at 25 for every tier level. I saw that the efficiency rating was bumped up to 60% which is good, but I want to know if lav vs lav using small turrets will still be a laughable fight.

I know. With the 1.5 patch notes coming out over a week before it hits and this weeks brfore it hits.......

Who are you people and what have you done to the real CCP?

Have you missed a boatload of threads to improve tanks?

I... i.... i just noticed the large missile launcher changes

is.. is it true. they are no longer burst but non stop hail of explosive goodness

Im going to need a new pair of pants after reading this. I forgive you for removing enforcers that i skilled into. and LLAV's. My proto missile launcher is going to have much much fun

So instead of whining about it, how about you propose something different?

I... i.... i just noticed the large missile launcher changes

is.. is it true. they are no longer burst but non stop hail of explosive goodness

Im going to need a new pair of pants after reading this. I forgive you for removing enforcers that i skilled into. and LLAV's. My proto missile launcher is going to have much much fun

Clearly you haven't been reading for the past four months or so, suggestions have been made, and ignored.

My biggest suggestion was to buff shield tanks to be able to compete with armor, and then tone down AV nades and fix the rendering on swarms. Tanks are not that bad.

Instead, it looks as though we are getting stripped down to basics, with standard suit levels of survivability. There needs to be a concrete plan in place to get us our full spectrum of models ASAP, because fighting proto AV right now can be unpleasant, in these new models it will be much more difficult.

I have, because I honestly don't care. CCP has a good concept layed out and they have three months to work on it. If you don't like what they have, say something in this thread since they're asking for feedback. "Improve tanks" is largely opinionated and circumstantial with everyone wanting Tanks to be God Mode like they were when Marauders were around and "improve AV" is largely opinionated and circumstantial with everyone wanting Tanks to be paper thin.

So, do what you want because any time someone throws out an opinion in one of these threads you just spew acid all over the place. Peace, I'm out.

I have two questions. The ROF for the small blaster is .07 which doesn't make sense to me being used to bullets per minute.

Understood. But think in the specific case of the ADS there should be an exception if possible; the principle of starting from the ground up is well and good, but don't cut off your nose to spite your face.

The ADS is just a completely different combat role from anything else in the game. Remove enforcers? Those tankers shrug and go back to using standard tanks. Remove scout LAVs? Can use a methana. Remove LLAVs? Well, the reps were already broken so no one used them for repping anyway and people will just use a LAV. But remove ADS... there is no similar replacement and people who were ADS pilots have nothing to fall back on except changing their entire gameplay experience.

Just some honest feedback. Thanks again for the 'work in progress' update.

Resists are going to be worse. Shorter activation times, longer cooldowns, plus you won't be able to run two and modulate them, you will need each of your low slots for a specific module. So unless you want to go without reps or plates, then you only have one hardener.

Just like last time, I don't like the general look of these changes, but even with these numbers it's hard for me to evaluate properly. Things come out when playing.

Overall, I have a negative reaction to the "waves of opportunity" rework for vehicles. Things I don't like, at a glance:
* AV will chase vehicles. As soon as cooldowns are off, vehicle will die. Forge gunners and swarm launcher players can be persistent and will chase
* How useful will a passive tank be against AV? It sounds to me like it might not be at all a viable build and will be vulnerable to dying quickly
* Having to time my attack for a "wave", and make sure I know my exit path, then exit, then sit back and wait for cooldowns while dodging AV that's chasing me, sounds very much like the opposite of fun. It sounds tedious
* 36 seconds (for armour) to make your entry, make the push, then retreat. 37 seconds (with complex and skills) to hide behind buildings until you're ready for your next 36 second dart.

I probably simply don't understand. For now, I cannot see how these changes are going to be better or, more importantly, fun. I just don't "get it" though, and maybe it will all come together when it's released and the approach will click with me.

It sounds good but, I think the limited clip, ammo, and what looks like a 10 (7.5 after skills) second reload time may limit it somewhat. However, the ALPHA damage looks like it may be extreme.

If I'm reading this right with direct hit damage you could put up 6000 damage in less than 2 seconds?

Seconded

Clearly you haven't been reading for the past four months or so, suggestions have been made, and ignored.

My biggest suggestion was to buff shield tanks to be able to compete with armor, and then tone down AV nades and fix the rendering on swarms. Tanks are not that bad.

Instead, it looks as though we are getting stripped down to basics, with standard suit levels of survivability. There needs to be a concrete plan in place to get us our full spectrum of models ASAP, because fighting proto AV right now can be unpleasant, in these new models it will be much more difficult.

I need an answer to a question before evaluating: Are vehicles becoming more equipment than class?

That would explain their unified skills and pathetic survivability.

I... i.... i just noticed the large missile launcher changes

is.. is it true. they are no longer burst but non stop hail of explosive goodness

Im going to need a new pair of pants after reading this. I forgive you for removing enforcers that i skilled into. and LLAV's. My proto missile launcher is going to have much much fun

Here's my initial takes on this,

• Dropships are still getting treated like light aircrafts when they are medium aircrafts. When comparing the new base HP, the LIGHT assault vehicle still has more base HP than the MEDIUM aircraft. I understand that the dropships have more modules and CPU/PG, but the base stats should also be reflective of what they are.
• There are way too many skills that do nothing but unlock stuff. I thought we made it clear we do not want that.
• Why are all racial vehicles being unlocked with the same skill? I mean, I'm not necessarily for or against it, but there needs to be consistency. If you are going to do it this way, then apply the same concept to dropsuits. If you will not, then make each race's vehicle it's own skill. Again, consistency is key.
• Small rail turrets still appear to be useless, especially when say a small missile turret does more damage with faster rate of fire and more splash radius.
• I understand the desire to go back to the basics, but you should really reconsider keeping the assault dropships in. These are more than just a subset of dropships, they are essentially their own vehicle class all together, a quasi fighter if you will. They have become far too fundamental to keep out even if just temporarily, and keeping them in will be crucial for gathering data on vehicle-to-vehicle combat balance.

Other than that, things are looking mostly good!

This is a HUGE missed opportunity for adding vehicle capacitors. CCP could reuse code from the stamina system to make it happen, and it makes so-much-more sense to balance around capacitors than long cooldowns. It gives drivers/pilots more freedom and flexibility which should help them perform better. It's easy to manage a single resource than multiple long cooldowns. It still allows for waves of opportunity and is consistent with your stated goals for vehicles. It would lead to more diversity of fittings, which should make the battlefield more interesting. It would appeal to existing EVE players and might draw them into DUST and vice-versa. It would set DUST above every other FPS in the market by having truly rich/deep tactical vehicle combat. It opens the door for so many interesting possibilities later.

There will literally never be a better time to add capacitors. It will only get harder to do later as you balance around long cooldowns timers, and may get so bad that you decide to never implement them because it would require another total rebalance. I beg you to reconsider.

Also, removing slots is stupid. It will result in very little diversity of fitting, making vehicles very similar, predictable and boring as hell.

What is it with you infantry believing we want tanks to be indestructible? You get grenades that do ~2000 damage against armor. That's not enough?

You haven't seen AV Rebalancing yet so how do you honestly know what's going on..?

You get a Railgun that does 1,800+ damage from 10x the range. A Large Missile Launcher that does more than that.

I'm sorry but basing an argument on three legitimate AV options: Swarms which do more damage than they honestly should, AV grenades which require you to be danger close and Forges which are actually pretty well balanced. Versus Tanks which are good for everything except AV.

I dunno what to tell you because it's not going to be what you want to hear. Obviously, CCP doesn't either.

You get a Railgun that does 1,800+ damage from 10x the range. A Large Missile Launcher that does more than that.

I'm sorry but basing an argument on three legitimate AV options: Swarms which do more damage than they honestly should, AV grenades which require you to be danger close and Forges which are actually pretty well balanced. Versus Tanks which are good for everything except AV.

I dunno what to tell you because it's not going to be what you want to hear. Obviously, CCP doesn't either.

People (Tankers mostly) are forgetting that the vehicles and WEAPONS are slated to rebalanced in the same patch.

Basically, we are going to have a whole new game when this 'patch' drops.

They want feedback.

I can only use current AV as a reference right, so unless you want me to sit back and demand the AV changes before commenting, it seems like your criticism is off base.

Railgun that can shoot other vehicles at 10x the range, testing last night, turret installation not locked onto me took me to get with 168m range with a rail gun for it to render, when locked on it rendered at 230m.... infantry rendering for the most is pathetic, then every so often the game will allow you to see them at 200m.

Large missile launchers that were changed to need virtually direct hits on infantry( a mass damage has a more effective splash system going) but good versus tanks and istallations.

dange close AV.... Or just on the other side of a wall, or in a scout suit.

Forge guns..... Still unsure about these TBO, my main issue is how cheap they are compared to turrets. Ishy FG does 100(ish) less damage than a 900k proto type rail turret. breach does 1k more damage.

Rendering, while playing into the overall balance, isn't related to vehicle balancing. It's a symptom of a disease, not the disease itself.

Just as well, Breach Forge Gun requires the user to be completely immobile and Forge Guns in their entirety require the user to move slower when charging. A small window but a window none-the-less. Even then they have a maximum range of <350m (I'm not sure of this number specifically, I just know they can't go beyond that). Fix the rendering and that's no longer a problem for Rail-guns with 600 meter (redline) range.

This is a HUGE missed opportunity for adding vehicle capacitors. CCP could reuse code from the stamina system to make it happen, and it makes so-much-more sense to balance around capacitors than long cooldowns. It gives drivers/pilots more freedom and flexibility which should help them perform better. It's easy to manage a single resource than multiple long cooldowns. It still allows for waves of opportunity and is consistent with your stated goals for vehicles. It would lead to more diversity of fittings, which should make the battlefield more interesting. It would appeal to existing EVE players and might draw them into DUST and vice-versa. It would set DUST above every other FPS in the market by having truly rich/deep tactical vehicle combat. It opens the door for so many interesting possibilities later.

There will literally never be a better time to add capacitors. It will only get harder to do later as you balance around long cooldowns timers, and may get so bad that you decide to never implement them because it would require another total rebalance. I beg you to reconsider.

Also, removing slots is stupid. It will result in very little diversity of fitting, making vehicles very similar, predictable and boring as hell.

A few things I've noticed.

Dead skills.

LAV operation, HAV operation, and Dropship operation only provide benefits at rank 1, there is no reason to rank it beyond that.


Turret operation and small turret operation provide no benefit at ranks 2, 3 AND 4, compared to rank 1.

Vehicle command, Vehicle armor upgrades, core upgrades, electronics, engineering, large turret operation, large blaster operation, large railgun operation, large missile gun operation, small blaster operation, small railgun operation, and small missile launcher operation provide NO benefit at ranks 2 and 4 over the previous ranks.



Also, the most basic variant of something should NOT require a pre-requisite skill at 5. Training something to 5 should be to become the best, at something, or to get every last bit of performance out that you can. Not just a dead pre-req.

Let's give an example. Suppose I wanted to setup a caldari tank, the way caldari do everything. With missiles! I'll want the gunnlogi, two light missile turrets, a large missile turret, and a damage booster.

Aright, to get into the hull, I need...
Vehicle command to FIVE.

Let's look at the turrets
Well, I need...
Turret operation to FIVE
and...
Small turret operation to FIVE.

hmm, well, I had better put a damage amp on it, since I'm so busy burning my SP into pre-requisites that don't do anything other than let me train something that actually matters.
For that I'll need...
Vehicle upgrades to FIVE.


That is silly.


Crank those pre-reqs down to three. Also, it really sucks when a skill is JUST a pre-requisite for other skills.

Who are you people and what have you done to the real CCP?

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

Limiting the amount of slots makes me a bit sad and worried that the amount of "different" HAVs we will see on the battlefield will decrease due to customization limits.

Are armor repairers now passive?


An Eve style power management system with low or no cooldown(depending on module) would be a great way to manage modules(shield booster modules would need to be reworked).

If the stats for the mods are good enough to help with how they want to play the vehicles, (aka Armor can go really high on mady, and gunlogi can hit and run to a degree) then i feel the changes will be great, gona suck not having a damage varriant of vehicals, a logistics one, and a tanky one but i can wait a few months for them, but uhh.. gona need a respec if your gona keep changing everything QQ please ccp :3

Rendering, while playing into the overall balance, isn't related to vehicle balancing. It's a symptom of a disease, not the disease itself.

Just as well, Breach Forge Gun requires the user to be completely immobile and Forge Guns in their entirety require the user to move slower when charging. A small window but a window none-the-less. Even then they have a maximum range of <350m (I'm not sure of this number specifically, I just know they can't go beyond that). Fix the rendering and that's no longer a problem for Rail-guns with 600 meter (redline) range.

On a first pass... skills that dont have an inherant bonus are back

And no given values on the armour Modules...
180mm plates gone?

Limiting the amount of slots makes me a bit sad and worried that the amount of "different" HAVs we will see on the battlefield will decrease due to customization limits.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Also nobody is going to believe that speel about "Temporarily" removing those dropships, since you said the same thing when you removed the marauders...

EDIT: I do have a concern with the posted stats for shields, you said in theory the shields would allow you to "hit-and-run" and were supposed to have a faster recovery time but lower EHP then the armor equivalents... However, I'm worrying that your new HP values are going to make it difficult for any shield HAV to survive any "quick" engagement without being blown to smithereens. A fast recovery time is meaningless if your EHP is too low to survive the "run" part of hit-and-run... It honestly looks like shield tanks are even more fragile then they are now, and that is deeply concerning for me...

Still somewhat disappointed in skills only unlocking...they need to provide a benefit.

My first concern is the ability to recall and redeploy. Its really quite feasible to use your active mods, run to the redline, call in new vehicle, recall old one. Without ever having to "wait" for cooldown timers.

Rails have too much ammo imo, with that total you can spend almost the entire game shooting and not run out.

Its really difficult to know exactly how much this will effect since pretty much this is an entire overhaul. Those are my first impressions. Can't really give an honest opinion since there are so many changes...without a viable way to test in game, its difficult.

Lastly, no response on giving back SP for vehicles your are removing....Or a SP refund for all vehicle related skills since this is such a large change in how skills are effecting aspects of vehicles.

Any possibility for someone to build/release a fitting tool?

Thanks for your hard work

I was rather surprised at the railgun ammo count, too. In BF4 (first Battlefield title to have vehicle ammo, I think) tanks have about 25 shells. Of course, in BF4, you'd expect your tank to die within a few minutes, too.

but I still like the overall direction you are going but ... : ( give me faith you aren't going to just make another post like this in 2 years, or that you care about adding in the rest of the tanks once the art is done asap : (

what if eve onlie was release but with other caldari and minmatar frigates, no one would of played it. It would of died, for real.

just have a plan... take the other tanks into account while balancing even if they aren't released yet ...

Thankfully they aren't making us beta test this stuff since we've officially released.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad they're addressing it, but I'm getting kind of pissed with this whole ******* process. How the **** am I supposed to decide where I want to put my SP when things change so drastically like this? I mean, to the point where many vehicles have now been removed, with the promise that they'll be back soon....hmm...I seem to remember a tank that was taken out to come back "soon"....

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

This is terrible all of it. Its SOOO BAD are you kidding me ccp?
Throw all this garbage away, yes its all garbage. Throw it away and simply buff the tanks now. You guys preached how your gonna change tanking blah blah blah this is your plan? This is terrible!!! I cant even stop saying how terrible this 0_0. Tanking is all about how long you can stay in the action. Neither a shield tank or armor will be able to "stay in the action" at all. One forge shot and ill be running. I wont have the module slots to properly fit the tank. Nor will i be able to get diversity without completely eliminating a strong point. You guys are pathetic. Nobody ask for the "gameplay to get reinvented". We wanted a vehicle buff thats it lol. All you had to do was bump up a few numbers and everything would have been fine. Shield tanking is a joke all that pg for a 1000 rep xD thats not even a milta armor rep now. Then on the other end for madrugars you plan on giving us passive reps. Um maybe if the plan was to have us redline sniping. Throw this garbage out and buff what we have. This **** would take so long for you guys to fix it would be sickening.

I think just about anyone would agree that a tank with three people inside of it should be more powerful than a tank with only one.

OK So.....

WHY USE BLASTERS AT ALL

As you progress through tiers for some reason the damage and RoF do not change at all but CPU/PG usage increases, no differences in ammunition, nothing. There is no reason to use anything other than basic.....explain.

Crunching the numbers with the new modules and such, removing both small turrets is going to sacrifice more DPS then you will ever gain from EHP, putting you at an advantage against infantry but at a noticeable disadvantage in HAV vs HAV fights.

Nice to know all the ships I just invested in wont even exist.

You might actually require a dropship or LAV to cover the withdrawal of a tank. Hmmm, that could actually encourage multi-unit tactics.

So instead of whining about it, how about you propose something different?

Hi guys,

...[/i]

Thanks for ******* me in the ass ccp. All that time I've spent training vehicles is now an absolute waste.

This ^^^^ really.

We went from the promise of pilot suits really changing the way vehicles behave and such to now, 2 delayed patches and now they are taking even more stuff OUT of the game!?!

This is madness and its BACKWARDS compared to every other game.

I honestly have no faith, not only that but there really doesn't seem to be a 'plan' at all here.

caps..

To really test the balance and get rid of the noise AV will lo have to be stripped down to the STD versions just like vehicles.

This isn't a nerf whine, but rather a realistic testing requirement unless you are trying to balance STD vehicles against PROTO AV.

This is terrible all of it. Its SOOO BAD are you kidding me ccp?
Throw all this garbage away, yes its all garbage. Throw it away and simply buff the tanks now. You guys preached how your gonna change tanking blah blah blah this is your plan? This is terrible!!! I cant even stop saying how terrible this 0_0. Tanking is all about how long you can stay in the action. Neither a shield tank or armor will be able to "stay in the action" at all. One forge shot and ill be running. I wont have the module slots to properly fit the tank. Nor will i be able to get diversity without completely eliminating a strong point. You guys are pathetic. Nobody ask for the "gameplay to get reinvented". We wanted a vehicle buff thats it lol. All you had to do was bump up a few numbers and everything would have been fine. Shield tanking is a joke all that pg for a 1000 rep xD thats not even a milta armor rep now. Then on the other end for madrugars you plan on giving us passive reps. Um maybe if the plan was to have us redline sniping. Throw this garbage out and buff what we have. This **** would take so long for you guys to fix it would be sickening.

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

Active vs. passive modules. There will be a far greater emphasis on active module use than ever before. The intent here is to create GÇ£waves of opportunityGÇ¥ that allow vehicles to be devastatingGǪ temporarily. Active modules will greatly enhance a vehicleGÇÖs attributes, but when they enter cooldown, the vehicle is left exposed and vulnerable to attack (more on this below). This back-and-forth allows infantry to engage vehicles, but do so knowing that the vehicleGÇÖs pilot has a short window in which he can drastically alter the outcome of any engagement.

Active vs. Passive modules

WeGÇÖre rebuilding everything with the idea that active modules will allow a vehicle to survive a single encounter, while passive modules increase its long-term surviveability across multiple encounters. Active modules will provide very significant bonuses, but once used their long recharge times leave a lone vehicle vulnerable to any follow-up attacks. Passive modules on the other hand provide permanent bonuses that are comparatively small. The breakdown is as follows:

Armor/Shield Hardeners (A): Massive, temporary reduction to damage received.

Used to survive short, high-DPS situations. Long cool down times discourage overuse.

The Logistics and Assault Dropships are going to be taken out temporarily, but they should be returning in the future. As was said in the first post, we want to go back to basics and get the core interactions working first. Then we can look at branching back out once we have a solid foundation.

2) A period of intense boredom for the pilot while he leaves combat to wait for his next godmode window

Hey guys

Yes, the Blaster damage numbers are likely a typo. I'll poke Wolfman and get some updated numbers when I can.

To really test the balance and get rid of the noise AV will lo have to be stripped down to the STD versions just like vehicles.

This isn't a nerf whine, but rather a realistic testing requirement unless you are trying to balance STD vehicles against PROTO AV.

You forgot to consider AV nerfs in CCP's update, post by OP is only about vehicles. AV thread should come in later, there's simply no way CCP could release the vehicles with AV being left untouched.

Hey guys

Yes, the Blaster damage numbers are likely a typo. I'll poke Wolfman and get some updated numbers when I can.