So,logistics,the non killing suit (defensive),will be able to hunt other suits down(offensive),instead of hiding like a non killer should.(defensive )

And assaults,a killing suit(offensive),won't be able to actively hunt targets(offensive),but instead will be able to hide from them?(defensive)

Doesn't that seem slightly backwards?

dampened Shotgun Assaults?

Did we go back to Chromosome?

I can't remember the last time I saw a shotgun assault who was actually competent.

Thinking ahead ...

Assumes that Logis will receive a Precision buff and Assaults a Profile buff.
(see earlier posts)

Will bet Cross 1M Isk that Logi scan range will be buffed to 18-20m (max range 80-90m) and scan precision buffed to 42 dB (max precision 20dB). My money's on you guys becoming better Hunters while Assaults become better Hiders. Would be really neat to see Logi passives forcing Scouts to run damps.

Particularly if precision enhancing mods affected ... active scans.

I'm completely confused why Assaults are getting a profile damp when they are "Assaults".

Shouldn't their thing be scan range? Or maybe it's just the Gallente assault that's damped and you have the other Assaults doing the appropriate Assault eWar for their race.

Agreed. Scout EWAR functions are divided by faction; it'd be really neat if Rattati did something similar for Meds. Looking at the APEX assaults, only the GA got the damp ... maybe you're on to something :-)

I am so glad no one can read.

The weaponless logistics would be a variation not a replacement.

Just like the equipment they hold,logistics would have a non-combat variety.
Where the current gun toting logistics suffers base stat wise.
This new completely separate variety would sacrifice offensive power for defensive.

And as for hybrid hives being repurposed.

I'd prefer copy and paste current compact stats on amount refilled and cluster amount.
Still keeping 1 deployed per level.
STD- 1 carried
ADV- 2 carried
Pro- 3 carried

The smaller bubble would make them more useful to players that try to hide.
Eg.Snipers,scouts,etc

I'm completely confused why Assaults are getting a profile damp when they are "Assaults".

Shouldn't their thing be scan range? Or maybe it's just the Gallente assault that's damped and you have the other Assaults doing the appropriate Assault eWar for their race.

Ouch! We can't have 90 degree / 200m scanners pinging below 21 dB.
That'd completely remove any reason to ever run damps on an Assault.

While I am a big fan of bring DUST and EVE closer in conceptual design... it's a stupid idea for an infantry unit to have no ability to shoot stuff in the face. Almost every player will, at some point, have to run around on foot.

If such a player chooses a logi suit, I'm sure they would appreciate being able to shoot something in the face. I mean, look at Team Fortress 2 (which I haven't actually played), where the medic has some pretty amazeballs ability (so I've heard, at least), and still has a freakin' gun.

Even Blizzard's new FPS, with it's super-supporty-medic-class, still gives said class a freakin' gun.

TL;DR: don't replace the Logi's gun with a repair tool. It's stupid and a fail idea.

Addendum: racial repair tools is an admittedly cool idea. Still, no likes for you.

who suggested taking their gun away?

This thread is now officially long overdue for a blue tag. I know, Cross is handling it and handling it well, but still.

Well,the problem is the most worshipped Dev runs assault.
So our concerns will fall upon deaf ears.

Look at what he proposed for logistics before,a .25 speed nerf to below 300 eHP suits.
And look now,an active scanner nerf aimed at logistics.

Yet he has managed to sneak in a buff to his preferred class,the assaults.

Do you think he would allow any buffs if he was willing to nerf the speed of below 300 eHP suits (which were already slow)?
Or buff eHP when he said '240 eHP was fine "?

Let's just consider that for a second...
-Basics have 60 more eHP
-Basics are faster,with better regen
-Assaults have 160 more eHP (compared to their racial logistics)
-Assaults recently got logistics slots,so 8-9 (insanely OP with their base stats)
-Assaults sacrifice nothing,they maintain full speed and stamina
-Logistics has 300 eHP on Amarr
-Logistics is slower than basics
-Logistics has less eHP than basics
-Logistics costs more investment than basics
-Assault and logistics costs the same

So,for the same time and investment as assaults with 400 eHP base.
You get to be worse than basics,which take much less investment.

But hey it isn't all bad,your fits will only cost nearly 2x as much as a comperable assault.
With less offense,less eHP,less speed,less regen,mediocre eWAR,and as a bonus you'll get singled out first every time!
Come join logistics today*

*Must be a masochist to apply.



Tl;dr Don't expect a blue tag,the CCP (that favors assaults) is intentionally pushing logistics to extinction.

As is usual, I agree with a lot of what RedBleach said, in particular I've always liked the Logi as "light medium" instead of the "heavy medium", though there is a good case to be made the other way. But if you do that, like he said, you better be putting a pretty sizable HP buff on the table.

One place I do disagree though, is in the CPU/PG buff. Personally, while there are obvious issues with the Caldari CPU, and the Amarr logi PG has literally always been broken since it's creation... it was, what, some laughable amount like 20 PG at STD when it first existed?

But, I don't think that a fitting resource buff to the level of the assault is the answer. I would favor a more modest buff and then a 50-100% increase to the fitting bonus instead, to make it relatively easy to fit proto equipment but not proto weapons. This is just a sort of pre-emptive thing to stop the slayerlogi derpiness that is 100% guaranteed to follow any buff to logis.

By doing it with an EQ bonus you can very easily make the claim that the offensive capabilities of the suit will be at most only modestly better but the "intended" capability, as a support platform, is brought in line with the other frames.

I told Rattati (or at least I said it in a thread) that I skilled out of the Lohistics because I saw dark skies ahead for Logistics.

Repair tools, like everything else in the game has done so far, needs an anti-point farming mechanic built in. We nerfed nano hives and uplinks because they were too easy to just continuously farm points with, despite their usefulness to the team. The repair tool should be no different. I know points cut off if the person you're repairing hasn't done damage within a set amount of time, but the amount of points able to be accrued with a repair tool has been a bit laughable for a long time now (Reference: I-Shayz-I videos). I have no problem with a logi being able to work hard and do poorly k/d wise and still hit the top, I'm merely saying the repair tool allows a logi with a heavy or two to repair all match to be at the top in pretty much every match. All I'm saying is is that they are being a little overcompensated WP-wise for their role repairing. A slight drop to WP/rep cycle should smooth things out nicely, dropping it from 25 to 20 would probably even be enough.

Also, repairing the squad lead while he's dropping an OB for points? Totally dumb. Point farming, pure and simple, and for no good reason. This leads into another debate where nobody in a squad should get kills from the OB but all instead get assists since they aren't actually killing the enemy, but simply put: repairing the squad lead while he/she drops an OB should NOT award points.

Lastly, I recommend that the repair tool begins to overheat if you are repairing a suit who's armor is full already. Sitting in an objective repairing two heavies who are full on armor just to farm points shouldn't be a thing. Once a person you are repairing has full armor, your repair tool should start overheating. Make a logi have to pay attention to his job if he's going to be getting points for other people's successes. Just like a heavy has to watch his overheat to deal with multiple targets, a logi should have to pay attention to the one's he's caring for. I'll leave that one where it sits and let you ponder it for a bit.

TL;DR version

We need to change the end of match leaderboads and actual leaderboards so shallow s.o.b.s can stop tearing down ideas that are good for logis.


P.S. Payouts would also have to be looked at, and can we please change how we earn orbitals?

P.P.S. Changing the leaderboards like this would also improve new player retention because giving praise to a gamer is like giving crack to an addict.

After rereading this I realize that it really doesn't belong in this topic.

After running around with the injector without a squad:

First of all, running without a squad makes a logi more vurnable as you don't have teammates (to communicate) to protect you and that random have none to almost no situational awareness (with the consequences that you have to use your gun yourself more than usual to protect your pretty ass). This also leads to blueberries dying in places where it is too dangerous to revive. The case of joining a good squads are rare, but they are usually happy that you are using a proto-injector which leads in more patience to being revived (in the case if they do die).

It seems that enough people are calling for help, my problem HOWEVER is that people usually call TOO LATE for their revival:

In most cases I could have revived a blue dot successfully if they had called for help much sooner. By the time that they called for help the enemy team would have usually taken over the position, making a revive too dangerous or impossible.

When two dots died at one location and they both ask for help at a different time. I think this explains itself, it's a waste of effort/opportunity and I'm already wasting my time shooting red berries myself most of the time due to the stupidity of randoms.

On being revived myself (usually doesn't happen): lol people still time their revives badly, sometimes I'm already dead before I gain control over my character.

Possible solution:
Make it so that you can stab people and that they have to accept the revive after they got stabbed (oh, I guess this was proposed many times before....). I don't care if you give WP after he accepts the revive or not or divide it between a +35 "first aid" for the stab & +35 "Revive" for the actual revive or not at all. I want to revive and help my team efficiently in the first place.