What is everyone's opinions on the buff to nanite injectors proposed for Delta?

The same amount of shield replenished as armor? Sounds freaking awesome.

5% bonus to needle repair amount

Would this make anyone I revived invincible for a minute if I use the State Kaalakiota Injector?

I am proto Amarr Logi / Scout / Sentinel / Assault


The state of "support roles" in Dust is terrible. My scout is 10x better for uplinks compared to my logi. This is because my scout is able to see far better run faster and carry a just as useful number of uplinks.

This is the case for a couple of reasons:

The bonus does not apply after switching suits (I am actually okay with this as it is fair to the guys running rep tools or scanners)
I only get a bonus to uplinks which makes my proto suit nothing more than a lag bomb waiting to happen
Fitting a full set of proto uplinks ensures I will be very squishy.


My proposal for logis just a couple of days ago was this:

As a ROLE bonus logis receive an efficiency bonus to all support equipment similar to the current racial bonuses as well as a bonus to the nanite injector.

As a RACIAL bonus 5% per level reduction of cpu/pg to the racial equipment. Obviously this would accompany an increase in pg/cpu of all of the equipment involved.



What you get out of this:

If you want to run multiple types of equipment or run a large number of passive equipment you need to specialize into your primary type to make room for the equipment not made for your suit.

If a non logistics suit wants to carry their own ammo for example they are penalized.

People that run multiple logi roles are rewarded for their extra work and not forced into choosing which to make better.

You again...


So,by forcing logis into choosing which equipment to make better...

It prevents logis from being forced into choosing which equipment to make better...

Lolwut?

That's like saying "you can save your right hand from being sawed off"
"You just have to saw your right hand off".

Mind = Blown

Yes me again.

They are not being forced into making one piece of equipment better. They are being presented with the ability to run multiple roles OR more equipment once they have specialized a suit. The concept is not that complicated. Lets see your proposal.

Input and feedback is being sought regarding the state of support play within Dust, and how to improve the experience and effectiveness.

When responding to this thread please note your primary role / primary context for use of each item being commented on so that proper context can be applied.

Cheers,
Cross

A lot of my experience comes from a support role in general. I was a support logi since closed beta up until 9/19 when I switched over to the scout role. I don't have much current experience in the logi role, but all those sp spent into support items remains.

I understand that support logi should have the best equipment offerings. But that shouldn't make those EQ useless to other suits. Mostly that relates to uplinks. They really aren't useful until you hit level 4 links. They need better variety, I would fit uplinks that can spawn faster but had limited uses. But most of the links are the same across the meta levels.

Repair tools are in a nice spot. Having an installation repair tool back would be nice. I don't know why they took out the axis. Especially since they have now buffed installations it could be more useful. Repair tools need a better lock on mechanic. It's frustrating to lose locks when a blueberry runs in front of you. Would be nice if you could designate your targets. Either through a mini game mechanic where you hold r2 until a symbol pops up, or by the "squad leader menu" that's specific for logi.

People saying repair tools aren't strong enough must not be using the core focused. That thing turns on god mode and the flux variants allow you reach out and touch even scouts.

Lack of any shield repping mod Is still frustrating. It continues to reiterate that armor tanking is better. I remember using the logi lav to shield rep people.....it was awesome. The tools are there ccp just removed them. Shield reppers could have cool downs, so they have wave of opportunity,

Logi don't need huge tanks. I think it would be relevant if logi got similar bonuses as sentinels. So they had better "resistance" to damage, that way it's not a straight HP buff. I logi just fine from a cal scout stacked with shield and armor and that only hits about 600 total hp. It's a hard line to draw and still keep slayers out of the class.

That said, equipment spam still needs fixed. People shouldn't be able to spam as much EQ. Especially near supply depots. There should be a radius around a depot where you can't drop anything,

Oh and depots should replace EQs. It's just silly to swap in and out of suits to get more hives.

From this i take it there is no necessity to look at the logi/support role in Dust. As 'necessity' deems it ok, that is despite the number of issues raised here in this thread and in others over the last year.

Is it that none of these issues can be resolved via hotfixes ?

Stats can be changed via hotfix,so can bonuses.

Remember charlie?
Assaults got eHP,slots,and a new bonus to grenade fitting.

"Necessity" when it's used as he has in that sentence means "we know the problems we just don't care,we like assaults more".

So yes,in a single hotfix, CCP can easily buff logistics.
At this point they are simply refusing to.

Incremental changes. Don't cry because you're not first in line.

Incremental changes. Don't cry because you're not first in line.

I gotta go with Adam of Eve here. Not that el operators sentiment is wrong, but I really don't think the proposal will have the desired effect.

Like i said earlier, I think what you will end up doing is adding a barrier to new players who night want to play logistics without discouraging spammers.

The key question is this: What about unlocking logi suits at level 5 prevents someone from simply skilling to level 3 in uplinks. making two scout fits with different combinations of links, and then simply dropping 5-6 uplinks before swapping out to their go-to brick tanked slayer scout fit?

(The correct answer is nothing)

Man, you guys got all bent up about spam and spam solutions when I stated and have restated that the raising of SP cost to enter Logistics would have a peripheral, ie. in addition to, benefit in limiting spam. Go back and read the first couple of pages of this thread and the countless other thread posted about buffing Logi stats. Pay close attention to the critisisms, to the posters talking about useless logis, spamming logis, WP whoring logis and how we don't desrve to be on equal footing in the battlefield because of those poor examples of logis behave. This idea is to address THAT.






DUDE. Your "counter-argument" PROVES MY CONCEPT.

The spammer, who wants to spam NOT spend, instead of grabbing an easily accessible logi frame of his choice, instead grabs a scout suit. MISSION ACCOMPLISHED, LOGI SPAM DETERRED.

The spammer now spams 2/3 the equip he would have, the spammed equipment is 0 bonused since it came off a scout and not a logi, and ultimately he likely receives fewer WP for his spamming effort since his equip spammed is lower quality and quantity than if he'd done it from a logi frame. And maybe, just maybe when spammer finds his spam rewards reduced he'll figure some sort of more worthwhile method of getting WP (like maybe hacking something?) and transition away from cheap spam tactics and into more relevant in-battle behaviour.

And again, over and over, limiting equipment spamming is only ONE possible, partial benefit. Will newbros look at it and shake their heads? Sure. But if they're serious about coming logi then it won't really matter. The SERIOUS will still join. And the posers will find other pastures.

Name me a suit outside logistics that has not been altered since Rattati came along. Only one I can think of is commandos, and I don't count the color change.

Serious question here...

Are you blind?
I mean seriously.

Any time anyone on these forums talks about equipment they always equate it with logistics.
In GD someone posted a video about a MLT frame spamming a MLT needle,then in their post said: "we need a way to punish careless logis".

Even though logistics had nothing to do with it.

Logistics has a bad stigma for no other reason than they're logistics.

You preventing people from using logistics won't change that.

Scouts will spam links and logistics will be blamed.
Scouts will spam hives and logistics will be blamed.

Logistics still will be blamed for the woes of lag even if there is only 1 on the field.

I personally went into a match and was literally the only logistics,the match lagged badly and i received hate mail for eq spam(from enemies and allies), even though my X-3 quantums (only 2 deployed) couldn't have done it.

I got that mail simply because my corp name had logistics in it.

TL;DR people hate logistics because there has never been a pure support role in a FPS before and it scares them.

It's funny how pokey said "incremental changes".

He must have forgotten the 150 eHP,extra slots,and grenade bonus assaults just got.

None of that is "incremental",when combined it's actually quite extreme.

Yet logistics must wait for these "incremental changes"?

Lol.

Truth is exposed,logistics isn't respected enough to receive the same kind of attention.

Notice I said "CPMs that still play the game" I would like to propose that CPMs that have logged less than 5 hours in the past 3 months get their tags removed or at least have their vote taken away until they are back up to speed and know the current situation of the game. Side note I know.

So lets earn some respect. Lets regulate our class and limit abusive access and watch our reputation change for the positive. Ain't no control greater than Self-Control.