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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Sgt Bluewolf
Rough Riders..
Primus Federation
0
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Posted - 2014.02.27 05:24:00 -
[631] - Quote
Only respec I want I understand other arguments but this respec should be a given.
I may not be the top dog but at the end of the day I will always be the dog on top.
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Lorhak Gannarsein
Science For Death
1833
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Posted - 2014.02.27 05:57:00 -
[632] - Quote
lol@ 'excessive spam'.
Forge on for great justice!
Defend the meek! Destroy the weak!
Q-sync breaches into the rectum of everyone else!
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
1726
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Posted - 2014.02.27 05:59:00 -
[633] - Quote
This old thing is still going? Was all the racial heavy skill books on sisi?
"You people voted for Hubert Humphrey, and you killed Jesus."
Raoul Duke
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Buck Giroux
Its a Legitimate Strategy
3
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Posted - 2014.02.27 06:31:00 -
[634] - Quote
Here is my opinion, and something everyone should think about. Of course I would like a respec, change some things and not spec into things that turned out to be bad or not fitting fir my play style, this problem however could be forever gotten rid of if there was a way to test out things before you bought them in some sort of training planet. As far as new things coming out or changing, or new variants of suits a respec shouldn't be given. New things come out all the time, take the last car you bought, when the new model comes out you don't get a full refund so you can go spend it on the newest and best model. You just have tosave up and then get the new shiny weapon or suit that you want. So keep playing and earn the new toys, stop looking for a free hand out.
Go ahead and troll me Dust Bunnies...
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Crimson ShieId
Psygod9
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
143
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Posted - 2014.02.27 06:51:00 -
[635] - Quote
Buck Giroux wrote:Here is my opinion, and something everyone should think about. Of course I would like a respec, change some things and not spec into things that turned out to be bad or not fitting fir my play style, this problem however could be forever gotten rid of if there was a way to test out things before you bought them in some sort of training planet. As far as new things coming out or changing, or new variants of suits a respec shouldn't be given. New things come out all the time, take the last car you bought, when the new model comes out you don't get a full refund so you can go spend it on the newest and best model. You just have tosave up and then get the new shiny weapon or suit that you want. So keep playing and earn the new toys, stop looking for a free hand out.
Go ahead and troll me Dust Bunnies...
That actually brings up a good point... why the heck doesn't Dust have a test server where you can use all the gear with maxed out skills to see what you like? Eve does, so why not Dust? 
Sometimes I miss never seeing tanks in a battle... then I remember the mystical flying soma, and I can't help but smile.
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11633
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Posted - 2014.02.27 07:01:00 -
[636] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:Patrick57 wrote:Tallen Ellecon wrote:Zatara Rought wrote:Just here to say as a humble member of the community I am against respecs, but FOR a respec in 1.8 and anytime our invested choices are dramatically altered. I used to have that stance, but that would mean a respec every 6 months to year, and it's not really anti respec anymore. No exception unless they alter the tree itself. We all take the same risk. Every suit bonus in Dust is being changed.... Point being? No one of them changed the respective suit's function on a fundamental level. They still fill the same basic role with a little more racial definition. Edit: In case you mean that "changes to the tree itself" part. I'm pretty sure Tallen's talking about changed multipliers and topological changes to the tree.
I can't even be bothered to dig out the plethora of examples that show how suits are, in fact, having their fundamental roles shifted around.
If you're a casual you won't notice too much, but if you're a skilled player who painstakingly plans out their builds based on stats and synergy, you will in fact, in many instance, find that your build has been shuffled around, trivialized, or straight up removed.
Again, for casuals, this doesn't matter much. For those of us who take pride in making tight builds based on what is actually in the game, then this is a very serious issue.
Your roleplaying comes second to our statistical, in game assets.
Crimson ShieId wrote:That actually brings up a good point... why the heck doesn't Dust have a test server where you can use all the gear with maxed out skills to see what you like? Eve does, so why not Dust?
Liability.
Sony doesn't want to be responsible for melted PS3s
And also, not directed at Crimson, just this thread
Obligatory
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Malkai Inos
Onikanabo Brigade
Caldari State
1147
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Posted - 2014.02.27 09:43:00 -
[637] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:
I can't even be bothered to dig out the plethora of examples that show how suits are, in fact, having their fundamental roles shifted around.
I'd be fine with a single one. And just to be clear: I'm talking about the broader sense of what a suit is supposed to represent. Not about some fringe edge case that some 20 people might have figured out.
If we're talking about "fixed PC squad" levels of build/team minmaxing then I completely agree. But for those people even so much as a 5% sprint speed nerf could easily be enough to destroy your "role" if you just so happen to be the guy spamming the uplinks.
So then we're back to respec after, well...anything at this point because somebody will always be able to make this case. The game was never designed with respecs in mind. If the kind of min-maxing you guys practice is not feasible under the current ruleset. Maybe you should change how you guys minmax instead of trying to change the ruleset. 
DUST Fiend wrote:Your roleplaying comes second to our statistical, in game assets. Meh. Not taking the bait.
You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
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Tallen Ellecon
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1490
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Posted - 2014.02.27 09:55:00 -
[638] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote: Things change so I must be refunded, the fact I've used it for 3 months be damned. I can do math therefore I'm right.
Condensed that for you.
Where is my Gallente sidearm? 1.8? When is that? SoonGäó514
"No blue tags make Tallen go crazy."
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lordeh42
ideas not tolerated
17
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Posted - 2014.02.27 10:35:00 -
[639] - Quote
I stopped using/buying AUR when they nerfed the caldari logi ages ago, if no respect on this round of nerfs I`ll probably just quit.
From a business point of view its not the greatest decision to annoy your client base to this extent. I had no problem using or buying AUR before, and probably wouldn`t again if the respect happened.
before you lot ask, NO you can`t have my ISK, I have none...lol |
Sam Tektzby
Better Hide R Die
264
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Posted - 2014.02.27 13:26:00 -
[640] - Quote
lordeh42 wrote:I stopped using/buying AUR when they nerfed the caldari logi ages ago, if no respect on this round of nerfs I`ll probably just quit.
From a business point of view its not the greatest decision to annoy your client base to this extent. I had no problem using or buying AUR before, and probably wouldn`t again if the respect happened.
before you lot ask, NO you can`t have my ISK, I have none...lol
Dont worry boyo CCP actualy dont have many changes, just two. I there will be no RESPEC i'll just wait in GTAV for DESTINY in Autumn.
Support - Tactician/Support
Deteis - Orator
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Rasatsu
Much Crying Old Experts
1100
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Posted - 2014.02.27 13:30:00 -
[641] - Quote
Respecs are like unlimited cake supply; it might taste good but you get fat and lazy. |
Crimson ShieId
Psygod9
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
152
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Posted - 2014.02.27 14:57:00 -
[642] - Quote
Rasatsu wrote:Respecs are like unlimited cake supply; it might taste good but you get fat and lazy.
Or you could use that unlimited regenerating cake to end world hunger.
Sometimes I miss never seeing tanks in a battle... then I remember the mystical flying soma, and I can't help but smile.
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Master Smurf
Nos Nothi
152
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Posted - 2014.02.27 15:06:00 -
[643] - Quote
Rasatsu wrote:Respecs are like unlimited cake supply; it might taste good but you get fat and lazy.
But serious people arent asking for around the clock every month a respec.
Many people against them favour this one because all the basic suits should now be in and changes have been made to redefine certain suits roles.
"Shine bright like a diamond"
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Master Smurf
Nos Nothi
152
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Posted - 2014.02.27 15:22:00 -
[644] - Quote
@Malkai Inos - re suit change
The easiest one is possibly the Minmatar Logi.
Also, take the reasoning of many on uplinks. The mechanic most people used was that of a scout. Use a fast, hard to be detected scout to go behind lines and plant uplinks. So maybe you skill scout and dampening and biotics and uplinks.
Now this will still work in 1.8 but because equipment is being nerfed and the Amarr Logi is being given a buff to uplinks, do you still want to go to the hassle of evading to put down an uplink that wouldnt allow fast insertion of troops?
- The new mechanic maybe use the logi and place at a forward point and not behind lines so now no real need for scout or dampening.
I just think in a game that is built on rewarding a person for the decisions they make and forcing them to live with those decisions you cant then change the reasons why people make those decisions and expect them to be happy with it or buy into that philosophy. It becomes meaningless.
Back to the Min Logi - Why take away his fast hack time? You probably should take away a low slot or drop base speed so the suit is more reliant on squad tactics to get in and make hacks. That wouldnt negate a Min Scout who already knew they had to skill up hacking if they wanted to maximise their speed and stealth. Giving them an extra low and stamina regen would have been for them to use a codebreaker instead of a cardiac reg.
Now all that went Min Logi for that stated purpose will want to switch and they cant be blamed.
I'm sure they are other scenarios but I am just speaking of what I know because I am a Lv5 Min Scout.
"Shine bright like a diamond"
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NextDark Knight
Hellstorm Inc
League of Infamy
218
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Posted - 2014.02.27 15:34:00 -
[645] - Quote
FYI, I have almost 5m sp saved up for 1.8.. :p
Forge Changes needed Officer Splash 3.0, Proto 2.7 Advanced 2.5 Standard 2.1.
Original ROF needs to return!
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DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
11683
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Posted - 2014.02.27 16:30:00 -
[646] - Quote
Tallen Ellecon wrote:DUST Fiend wrote: Things change so I must be refunded, the fact I've used it for 3 months be damned. I can do math therefore I'm right.
Condensed that for you.
How does this address things being added that are backlogged, and the roles behind current in game assets being changed?
I know rational thought may be difficult for you, but by all means, take all the time you need.
Videos / Fiction
Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
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Lynn Beck
Granite Mercenary Division
Top Men.
810
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Posted - 2014.02.27 17:01:00 -
[647] - Quote
I'm currently a commando, but i use minmatar weaponry.
Currently this doesn't matter because the bonus doesn't apply to all amarr weaponry, but in 1.8 half my bonus is going to weapons I DON'T USE.
I'm sure there are many amarr healer logis who are ticked off that they now HAVE to skill uplinks to be effective. Gallente and their scanner, minmatar and rep tools.
What about minmatar assaults who used to play sniper?
What of acouts who now HAVE to skill cloaks to utilize their role, whereas currently they use rifle+knives and a remote explosive?
What of
No SP refund=academy stomping FOR DAYYZ
Proud owner of 69 'Fleshriver' Nk's.
No i don't buy AUR
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LowerThan SnakeShip
Ultramarine Corp
3
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Posted - 2014.02.27 17:21:00 -
[648] - Quote
i dont see how major changes cant come with out a respec as with the vehicle respec i saw alot of tankers and pilots who regret not going back into vehicles. i think it would not change much just some players are going to still make decisions they dont like and regret it and some will make decisions they like that will not upset any balance. then there will also be players who did a better job mapping out their class and they dont want the competition that players who spec'd into everything now being on their level will create. |
D legendary hero
Ultramarine Corp
1750
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Posted - 2014.02.27 17:33:00 -
[649] - Quote
CCP 33 pages of support. with only 4 people against a respec. DUST fiend even made a video for god's sake. just confirm it. we all know you want to.
Sou o Defendeiro dos derrubados_Pronto saberá justiça
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
EoN.
1885
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Posted - 2014.02.27 19:27:00 -
[650] - Quote
NK Scout wrote:CCP Logibro wrote:Due to the excesive spamming of topics related to the possibility of a respec, all discussion about respecs must take place in this thread. This includes any posts in support or against a respec. Any other topics anywhere else on the forums will be locked or deleted, and linked to this thread, and repeated starting new topics may result in a warning or bans as per the forum rules.
Note that this is not a confirmation that we will or will not be providing a respec in 1.8, this is merely a venue to discuss it. A respec should be givin because I have a proto amar logi, I have no ise for uplinks because I have 0 sp in them I was a complete noob when I spent 9 mil sp I am no longer going to be a logi, no need for rep tools or nanocircitry, need dampening skills.
You can't say you're in agreement because it would help you. You have to be in agreement because it's the smart thing to do.
I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
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Magpie Raven
ZionTCD
347
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Posted - 2014.02.27 19:32:00 -
[651] - Quote
Te only thing I have to add to this is that Respecs will be necessary every time tigns get totally changed. It ridiculous tha t we dont have all the racial stuff yet and until everything is in game then respecs are needed.
Once we have something for every race in all categories like weapon types, dropsuits and vehicle. Then stop the respecs. I am against the idea of giving us back skill points everytime something is added to the game. But at the moment it is totally unfair. IN the future just dont release new things without a varient for each race and a respec wont be nesesary because everyone will be having to start at the same place |
The Robot Devil
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
1732
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Posted - 2014.02.27 22:29:00 -
[652] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:CCP 33 pages of support. with only 4 people against a respec. DUST fiend even made a video for god's sake. just confirm it. we all know you want to.
I still hope they don't just so I can sit back and laugh.
"You people voted for Hubert Humphrey, and you killed Jesus."
Raoul Duke
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Tallen Ellecon
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1492
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Posted - 2014.02.28 00:28:00 -
[653] - Quote
The Robot Devil wrote:D legendary hero wrote:CCP 33 pages of support. with only 4 people against a respec. DUST fiend even made a video for god's sake. just confirm it. we all know you want to. I still hope they don't just so I can sit back and laugh.
A respec would be nice, but it's unnecessary, and people begging for them here is almost as annoying as people on the EVE forums asking when Dust is going to be put on PC. I'd rather CCP not indulge them.
Where is my Gallente sidearm? 1.8? When is that? SoonGäó514
"No blue tags make Tallen go crazy."
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Sam Tektzby
Better Hide R Die
266
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Posted - 2014.02.28 01:02:00 -
[654] - Quote
Tallen Ellecon wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:D legendary hero wrote:CCP 33 pages of support. with only 4 people against a respec. DUST fiend even made a video for god's sake. just confirm it. we all know you want to. I still hope they don't just so I can sit back and laugh. A respec would be nice, but it's unnecessary, and people begging for them here is almost as annoying as people on the EVE forums asking when Dust is going to be put on PC. I'd rather CCP not indulge them.
Most annozing people is ignorant ones who thinks:"if something is not neccessary to me, its not neccessary for others", there is basicaly majority FOR respec and that important for game. I still wainting till some of antirespec boyos arive with some proper reason why RESPEC should not be made. But its still same story:"What i think i want.", nothing else and what is more important, nothing productive.
And honestly how long you will sit back and laugh, if that majority just leave and you will be pushed to play game with smaller numbers and after some time game will be lost, servers close and all that just by no people in?!
Respec can revamp community, if you are agains that you basicalz want to play dust alone and trust me, there is big amount of games on sigh.
Support - Tactician/Support
Deteis - Orator
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bamboo x
Eternal Beings
Proficiency V.
98
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Posted - 2014.02.28 02:05:00 -
[655] - Quote
If you guys could lock my respec petition that'd be great.
Please sign my 1.8 respec petition
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Sam Tektzby
Better Hide R Die
267
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Posted - 2014.02.28 02:42:00 -
[656] - Quote
Already did, you should put this respec on you sign too. There is bigger impact right now.
Support - Tactician/Support
Deteis - Orator
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
1733
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Posted - 2014.02.28 02:44:00 -
[657] - Quote
Sam Tektzby wrote:Tallen Ellecon wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:D legendary hero wrote:CCP 33 pages of support. with only 4 people against a respec. DUST fiend even made a video for god's sake. just confirm it. we all know you want to. I still hope they don't just so I can sit back and laugh. A respec would be nice, but it's unnecessary, and people begging for them here is almost as annoying as people on the EVE forums asking when Dust is going to be put on PC. I'd rather CCP not indulge them. Most annozing people is ignorant ones who thinks:"if something is not neccessary to me, its not neccessary for others", there is basicaly majority FOR respec and that important for game. I still wainting till some of antirespec boyos arive with some proper reason why RESPEC should not be made. But its still same story:"What i think i want.", nothing else and what is more important, nothing productive. And honestly how long you will sit back and laugh, if that majority just leave and you will be pushed to play game with smaller numbers and after some time game will be lost, servers close and all that just by no people in?! Respec can revamp community, if you are agains that you basicalz want to play dust alone and trust me, there is big amount of games on sigh.
You can give respecs all day long and it doesn't make the game better. If you want to grab new players and hold on to the ones you have then you need good content. Not constant respecs and tiny balance tweaks. Claiming that a respec will save the game is about as good as saying a respec will kill it. People want content to have fun with and the SP is one of the few pieces of content we have.
"You people voted for Hubert Humphrey, and you killed Jesus."
Raoul Duke
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Patrick57
5574
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Posted - 2014.02.28 03:05:00 -
[658] - Quote
RESPEC
I go negative in PC, yay
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Sam Tektzby
Better Hide R Die
270
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Posted - 2014.02.28 03:42:00 -
[659] - Quote
You can give respecs all day long and it doesn't make the game better. If you want to grab new players and hold on to the ones you have then you need good content. Not constant respecs and tiny balance tweaks. Claiming that a respec will save the game is about as good as saying a respec will kill it. People want content to have fun with and the SP is one of the few pieces of content we have.[/quote]
Nope at all.
Respec is just only logical way if there is implements what finaly can make game better for players. Game is good how players making it. There is nothing like game is good by itself.
The RESPEC can finaly give us a role what we want to play, not just something what is near.
Do you really thing, its a great idea to push players to choose something just near to they roles and leave it be like that, like really?!
Boyo honestly, if you will be in shoes of boyo who want be Minmatar heavy with racial gun and he speced to amarian just because there WASNT any other choise, do you really want to leave SPs in something what you will never use again?!
There is finaly chance for EVERYONE to make his own ROLE on battlefield, the WANTED ONE, and by your words this possibilities cant improve overal reception on players ingame already or the newbies who joined few weeks ago?!
Hell it will even take some boyos and gals back, for try or for comeback even.
Support - Tactician/Support
Deteis - Orator
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Malkai Inos
Onikanabo Brigade
Caldari State
1155
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Posted - 2014.02.28 06:45:00 -
[660] - Quote
Master Smurf wrote:
The easiest one is possibly the Minmatar Logi.
The minny Logi totally eluded me and i agree with this being a case to consider a solution. A full respec for everyone wouldn't be the first thing i'd be looking at though.
Master Smurf wrote:
Also, take the reasoning of many on uplinks. The mechanic most people used was that of a scout. Use a fast, hard to be detected scout to go behind lines and plant uplinks. So maybe you skill scout and dampening and biotics and uplinks.
Now this will still work in 1.8 but because equipment is being nerfed and the Amarr Logi is being given a buff to uplinks, do you still want to go to the hassle of evading to put down an uplink that wouldnt allow fast insertion of troops?
- The new mechanic maybe use the logi and place at a forward point and not behind lines so now no real need for scout or dampening.
The scout uplink case is interesting aswell but i'd argue that the increased movement speed and overall stealthiness still make it the superior "first rush"type of suit. He only has to offset the Logi spawn rate bonus by reaching the objective a few seconds earlier than the logi could to fill his role. I could be wrong but it looks like this will still be the case, come 1.8.
Let me put it thusly: Allowing your allies to quickly secure the perimeter by rushing the objective and dropping mid-tier uplinks is a fitting role for a scout. Maintaining a steady supply of new units through top-tier, bonused uplinks, seems to me like the very definition of a logistics task. So what it should be doing well, it will continue to do well.
Master Smurf wrote:
I just think in a game that is built on rewarding a person for the decisions they make and forcing them to live with those decisions you cant then change the reasons why people make those decisions and expect them to be happy with it or buy into that philosophy. It becomes meaningless.
Basically agreed. But when a problem (bad balance, huge changes) causes a certain symptom (devaluating decisions) then using a treatment (respecs) that, among others, causes the same thing (devaluating decisions) as a side effect doesn't seem effective to me at all .
Master Smurf wrote:
Back to the Min Logi - Why take away his fast hack time? You probably should take away a low slot or drop base speed so the suit is more reliant on squad tactics to get in and make hacks. That wouldnt negate a Min Scout who already knew they had to skill up hacking if they wanted to maximise their speed and stealth. Giving them an extra low and stamina regen would have been for them to use a codebreaker instead of a cardiac reg.
Now all that went Min Logi for that stated purpose will want to switch and they cant be blamed.
That's subjective but "taking the objective" doesn't seem like a logistics task for me so i can see why CCP decided to change it to a more appropriate suit namely the scout.
I agreed earlier that this is a pretty convincing case of "changed on a fundamental level". But an optional relocation of the Minmatar Logi to Scout would solve this problem almost entirely without affecting the whole game. The dropsuit command trees are symmetric so that should be possible to do.
Master Smurf wrote:I'm sure they are other scenarios but I am just speaking of what I know because I am a Lv5 Min Scout. Appreciate the input.
You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
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