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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 178 post(s) |
Kaeru Nayiri
Ready to Play
1172
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:04:00 -
[36031] - Quote
As far as I know, yes that is absolutely correct.
However a prototype scanner on a vehicle is a -very- rare thing. Moreso than double sidearm caldari commando.
They're very hard to fit for dropships without digging deep into the tank. The advanced scanner (36db) is a lot more forgiving to fit.
They do go out for 80meters but they must be used persistently. When the vehicles leaves the area, targets only stay pinged for a few seconds and disappear again, so the vehicle has to stay in the area to constantly re-ping them.
EDIT: On second thought, it might be useful on an LAV, epecially the saga-II which comes prefit with that unique 60% hardener. Flip on the hardener while scanning and drive near the ennemy, odds are you will survive long enough to be useful, maybe even get away. New meta incoming?
Know what cannot be known.
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J0LLY R0G3R
And the ButtPirates
2948
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:17:00 -
[36032] - Quote
Militia: Precision: 46db Cooldown: 60sec Pulse Interval: 30sec Radius: 80m
basic : Precision: 46db Cooldown: 60sec Duration: 30sec Radius: 80m
enhanced: Precision: 36db Cooldown: 50sec Active Duration: 30sec Radius: 80m
complex: Precision: 28db Cooldown : 30sec Active Duration: 30sec Radius: 80m
Just off the marketplace. My tank has 2 complex scanners on it No I am not a tanker but I has a tank.
The ButtPirates Now Accepting Applications. XD
TheYoutube
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Kaeru Nayiri
Ready to Play
1174
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:24:00 -
[36033] - Quote
Rusearch analysis:
mulling over 20 or 18 db scout, here are the important bits I noticed (old news to most of you, I know):
at 20 db, you can't hide from Medium Frame Inner ring, no precision mods necessary (very common) at 20 db, you can't hide from a CalScout Middle ring, if he's using all 4 highs for precision (convinced this is a myth, and there is no such thing as a Cal Scout with 4 precision mods :3)
next stop is 18 db, saving me from the 2 scenarios above, still have to worry about: at 18 db, you can't hide from ANY scout's inner ring, no precision mods necessary at 18 db, you can't hide from an Amarr scout's middle ring if he's got both highs used for precision mods (not impossible) at 18 db, you can't hide from a sentinel's inner ring if they're rocking a single precision mod. (kinda cool, actually)
I'm only posting this in case someone might find it useful. None of this is new, all the data is already available, not making any statements with this. Just putting here in case anyone else who runs min scout might be curious. I, personally, haven't sat down and actually thought about dampening values since fall off, so this was something overdue for me.
Know what cannot be known.
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Vyuru
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
192
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:27:00 -
[36034] - Quote
Kaeru Nayiri wrote:As far as I know, yes that is absolutely correct.
However a prototype scanner on a vehicle is a -very- rare thing. Moreso than double sidearm caldari commando.
They're very hard to fit for dropships without digging deep into the tank. The advanced scanner (36db) is a lot more forgiving to fit.
They do go out for 80meters but they must be used persistently. When the vehicles leaves the area, targets only stay pinged for a few seconds and disappear again, so the vehicle has to stay in the area to constantly re-ping them.
EDIT: On second thought, it might be useful on an LAV, epecially the saga-II which comes prefit with that unique 60% hardener. Flip on the hardener while scanning and drive near the ennemy, odds are you will survive long enough to be useful, maybe even get away. New meta incoming?
I did not know that the saga-II came with a prefit hardener, that's good to know! |
Kaeru Nayiri
Ready to Play
1174
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:30:00 -
[36035] - Quote
It's a special unique hardener called Reactive Deflection Field, and it reduces damage 60% instead of 40. It's not on the blueprint, it's in the BPC saga-II you can buy on the market. I could be wrong but I think you actually need a point or two in LAV to use it, sorry if that is incorrect, it's been awhile.
Know what cannot be known.
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Kaeru Nayiri
Ready to Play
1174
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:37:00 -
[36036] - Quote
J0LLY R0G3R wrote: [...] My tank has 2 complex scanners on it No I am not a tanker but I has a tank.
That's badass !!
Know what cannot be known.
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Ghost Kaisar
Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback
11067
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Posted - 2015.05.13 21:40:00 -
[36037] - Quote
Mybo buff?
How much does 2x deal?
Currently listening to: Max Anarchy OST
Old School Scout, watch out for the knives
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Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
844
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Posted - 2015.05.13 22:03:00 -
[36038] - Quote
In reply to Kaeru, interesting profile considerations.
It has occurred to me before that, although my 1 damp Gal scout hides from Gal logi unfocussed scans (a major threat), my 2 damp Min scout can also hide from unmodded inner rings and non-Gal-logi focussed scans. So I don't feel as bad for losing the extra mod.
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Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
844
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Posted - 2015.05.13 22:17:00 -
[36039] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Hey guys, I'm planning on a featuring a guide on the fundamentals of Scanning this week on the Biomassed.net blog.
Would anyone be willing to sit down on Skype with me in the next day or two and go over some of the details with me so the guide can be as accurate as possible? If Haerr is available, I'd highly recommend him. If he isn't, I'd be glad to fact check with you, though I'd prefer to do it here with the guys rather than on Skype. If you're looking for values, the Scan Table on Page 1 is up-to-date. Protofits is also up-to-date and accurate (recently confirmed). There a few "rules" which aren't readily outlined ... * Profile and Precision values are rounded to nearest whole number * Ties go to the scanner * Passives Scans remain up while incapacitated * Passive Scans are shared squad-wide Anything else, guys? Almost forgot! Denak's experiment. Say your profile is 28 dB and you're pinged by a 28dB active scanner. If you activate cloak while painted, you will remain painted even if your profile dips below 28dB. I guess the rings are explained well enough in the scan table.
How about the fact that direction arrows are shown for active scans but not passive.
Targets scanned by a higher margin between profile and precision show up brighter on radar (correct me if I'm wrong here).
Activating a cloak reduces your passive scan range by 85%.
All active scanners share results team wide, except for focused scans which share with squad. |
sir RAVEN WING
3587
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Posted - 2015.05.13 23:07:00 -
[36040] - Quote
1800 guys.
Day 6/30 Calscout Knifer/Last of A Kind/Sneaky
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Cross Atu
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
4669
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Posted - 2015.05.13 23:21:00 -
[36041] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Kaeru Nayiri wrote:I hear you Arkena, I just want you to consider something, though. Right now they make the most $$$ because of the way the system works, as described in previous post. If we switched this over to a strictly keep what you kill system, they would go from making the most to making the least faster than the time it takes to miss twice with a breach shotgun! Add to this that their suits costs the most (due to equipment) and they are extremely squishy (more often than not they die to core locus grenades not even aimed at them).
So while it would be fun and rewarding to keep what you kill, it will benefit slayers considerably more than anyone else. (anyone else including, people focused on uplinks, logis with reps, dropships with gunners, people who focus on keeping scans up, etc). I don't want the game to focus any more on "the kill" then it already does. I am already seeing people forego hacking just to kill more people.
Not disagreeing with you, just want to add food for thought. I always assumed "Keep what you Kill" really meant "Your Team Keeps what it Kills". Like....value of stuff destroyed is put in a pool that is then divided between everyone on the team, so Logis would not screwed due to low kill counts. Hmmm ... I wouldn't mind "keep what you kill" as "keep what you kill". My GalLogi is killing just fine while keeping up scans, and I imagine AM and CA Logis can do the same. I can definitely see repper Logis being at a disadvantage, but aren't these the ones who are topping the WP leaderboards? They'd gain less salvage, but they'd still be pulling in the biggest EOM paychecks. ? Problem being that even those EOM paychecks are often still leaving dedicated support players "in the red" with regards to ISK earnings. Topping the WP leaderboards is by no means an assurance that you're going to break even on ISK much less have a chance at making any kind of profit.
It has been a long standing truth that most dedicated support players have to run another roll to fund their support play (or run bpos). It is not a universal truth, but it is a common situation. It is also worth noting that I'm citing support play specifically here because someone just being in a logi suit and using 1-2 of their equipment slots can often not be playing dedicated support and really is not applicable in this context.
0.02 ISK
CPM 1 mail me your feedback and remember to have fun!
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
6257
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Posted - 2015.05.14 00:23:00 -
[36042] - Quote
I think people often underestimate vehicle scanners. I more or less have them on all of my fits. Being able to omnidirectionally track tons of infantry within the range of my main turret? Yes please.
"That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032
Dust514 // Podcast & Blog
www.biomassed.net
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
9690
|
Posted - 2015.05.14 00:35:00 -
[36043] - Quote
Ghost Kaisar wrote:Mybo buff?
How much does 2x deal?
Haven't checked 2x in-game. 3x > 600
Shoot scout with yes.
- Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
9690
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Posted - 2015.05.14 00:39:00 -
[36044] - Quote
Varoth Drac wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Hey guys, I'm planning on a featuring a guide on the fundamentals of Scanning this week on the Biomassed.net blog.
Would anyone be willing to sit down on Skype with me in the next day or two and go over some of the details with me so the guide can be as accurate as possible? If Haerr is available, I'd highly recommend him. If he isn't, I'd be glad to fact check with you, though I'd prefer to do it here with the guys rather than on Skype. If you're looking for values, the Scan Table on Page 1 is up-to-date. Protofits is also up-to-date and accurate (recently confirmed). There a few "rules" which aren't readily outlined ... * Profile and Precision values are rounded to nearest whole number * Ties go to the scanner * Passives Scans remain up while incapacitated * Passive Scans are shared squad-wide Anything else, guys? Almost forgot! Denak's experiment. Say your profile is 28 dB and you're pinged by a 28dB active scanner. If you activate cloak while painted, you will remain painted even if your profile dips below 28dB. I guess the rings are explained well enough in the scan table. How about the fact that direction arrows are shown for active scans but not passive? Targets scanned by a higher margin between profile and precision show up brighter on radar (correct me if I'm wrong here).Activating a cloak reduces your passive scan range by 85%. All active scanners share results team wide, except for focused scans which share with squad. Excellent points, Varoth. I'm fairly certain that the struck-through item is incorrect, but I'll keep an eye out just in case. Have you observed this firsthand, and if so, in what setting? If this is happening, it is likely a bug (and I'd like to try to replicate it).
Shoot scout with yes.
- Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
9690
|
Posted - 2015.05.14 01:00:00 -
[36045] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Kaeru Nayiri wrote:I hear you Arkena, I just want you to consider something, though. Right now they make the most $$$ because of the way the system works, as described in previous post. If we switched this over to a strictly keep what you kill system, they would go from making the most to making the least faster than the time it takes to miss twice with a breach shotgun! Add to this that their suits costs the most (due to equipment) and they are extremely squishy (more often than not they die to core locus grenades not even aimed at them).
So while it would be fun and rewarding to keep what you kill, it will benefit slayers considerably more than anyone else. (anyone else including, people focused on uplinks, logis with reps, dropships with gunners, people who focus on keeping scans up, etc). I don't want the game to focus any more on "the kill" then it already does. I am already seeing people forego hacking just to kill more people.
Not disagreeing with you, just want to add food for thought. I always assumed "Keep what you Kill" really meant "Your Team Keeps what it Kills". Like....value of stuff destroyed is put in a pool that is then divided between everyone on the team, so Logis would not screwed due to low kill counts. Hmmm ... I wouldn't mind "keep what you kill" as "keep what you kill". My GalLogi is killing just fine while keeping up scans, and I imagine AM and CA Logis can do the same. I can definitely see repper Logis being at a disadvantage, but aren't these the ones who are topping the WP leaderboards? They'd gain less salvage, but they'd still be pulling in the biggest EOM paychecks. ? Problem being that even those EOM paychecks are often still leaving dedicated support players "in the red" with regards to ISK earnings. Topping the WP leaderboards is by no means an assurance that you're going to break even on ISK much less have a chance at making any kind of profit. It has been a long standing truth that most dedicated support players have to run another roll to fund their support play (or run bpos). It is not a universal truth, but it is a common situation. It is also worth noting that I'm citing support play specifically here because someone just being in a logi suit and using 1-2 of their equipment slots can often not be playing dedicated support and really is not applicable in this context. 0.02 ISK o/ Cross
I agree with you. Spitballing here, but I wonder ... would dramatically increasing EOM Isk payouts do more good than harm to gameplay?
Assuming Isk weren't at issue, I'm still thinking about "keep what you kill" for down the road. There's time spent between matches these days, and it'd be pretty cool to have something to do while searching for battle. Enter the Warbage:Forge! Breakdown unwanted salvage into weapon components or vehicles parts. If you're still searching for battle, swing by the visit the Warbage:Foundry to cash in weapon components to research (and later manufacture) weapon attachments, or swing by the the garage to assemble new vehicles from reclaimed parts.
"Busy work" yes, but it'd be fun busy work. And a neat way to get people to interact with their Warbarges.
Shoot scout with yes.
- Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
7414
|
Posted - 2015.05.14 01:51:00 -
[36046] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Varoth Drac wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Pokey Dravon wrote:Hey guys, I'm planning on a featuring a guide on the fundamentals of Scanning this week on the Biomassed.net blog.
Would anyone be willing to sit down on Skype with me in the next day or two and go over some of the details with me so the guide can be as accurate as possible? If Haerr is available, I'd highly recommend him. If he isn't, I'd be glad to fact check with you, though I'd prefer to do it here with the guys rather than on Skype. If you're looking for values, the Scan Table on Page 1 is up-to-date. Protofits is also up-to-date and accurate (recently confirmed). There a few "rules" which aren't readily outlined ... * Profile and Precision values are rounded to nearest whole number * Ties go to the scanner * Passives Scans remain up while incapacitated * Passive Scans are shared squad-wide Anything else, guys? Almost forgot! Denak's experiment. Say your profile is 28 dB and you're pinged by a 28dB active scanner. If you activate cloak while painted, you will remain painted even if your profile dips below 28dB. I guess the rings are explained well enough in the scan table. How about the fact that direction arrows are shown for active scans but not passive? Targets scanned by a higher margin between profile and precision show up brighter on radar (correct me if I'm wrong here).Activating a cloak reduces your passive scan range by 85%. All active scanners share results team wide, except for focused scans which share with squad. Excellent points, Varoth. I'm fairly certain that the struck-through item is incorrect, but I'll keep an eye out just in case. Have you observed this firsthand, and if so, in what setting? If this is happening, it is likely a bug (and I'd like to try to replicate it). A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP.
MOAR Ladders
SpadeGǪ Remember your Warbarge
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
9690
|
Posted - 2015.05.14 02:01:00 -
[36047] - Quote
Llast 326 wrote: A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP.
Are you sure this is still happening?
Shoot scout with yes.
- Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
7414
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Posted - 2015.05.14 02:05:00 -
[36048] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Llast 326 wrote: A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP.
Are you sure this is still happening? As of two days agoGǪ yes Downed a Calmando because of it.
MOAR Ladders
SpadeGǪ Remember your Warbarge
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True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
19012
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Posted - 2015.05.14 02:11:00 -
[36049] - Quote
Pokey Dravon wrote:I think people often underestimate vehicle scanners. I more or less have them on all of my fits. Being able to omnidirectionally track tons of infantry within the range of my main turret? Yes please.
It's a real eye opener when you transition to Caldari Tanks and have to either eyeball it or get lucky with passive scans.
"That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die."
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Quil Evrything
Nos Nothi
2206
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Posted - 2015.05.14 02:53:00 -
[36050] - Quote
A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP. [/quote]
i agree. the issue is that ALL suits should be that way :)
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sir RAVEN WING
3593
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Posted - 2015.05.14 02:57:00 -
[36051] - Quote
METAGAME.
Day 6/30 Calscout Knifer/Last of A Kind/Sneaky
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Aero Yassavi
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
9822
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Posted - 2015.05.14 03:32:00 -
[36052] - Quote
Imperial Marine Light SKIN has me playing scout more often simply because it's the best Imperial Marine SKIN.
Made a topic in the Features and Ideas section that basically suggests increasing Amarr movement speed and decreasing Minmatar movement speed putting them at roughly +- 0.05 m/s of Cal and Gal. Good responses so far but I suspect no one who has read it yet is a min scout.
Amarr are the good guys
Join "PIE Ground Control" for secure Amarr FW syncing and orbital support
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Cross Atu
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
4671
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Posted - 2015.05.14 04:22:00 -
[36053] - Quote
After Roosevelt you can go straight to Christ. - - Kaeru Nayiri
CPM 1 mail me your feedback and remember to have fun!
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Pseudogenesis
Nos Nothi
2818
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Posted - 2015.05.14 04:47:00 -
[36054] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Aha, found him.
See you guys in a month.
o7 Damnit, the bastard left without giving me the chance to rant at him about how good Berserk is.
[heavy breathing]
Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ
I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
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dzizur
Nos Nothi
310
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Posted - 2015.05.14 05:40:00 -
[36055] - Quote
Quil Evrything wrote:A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP.
i agree. the issue is that ALL suits should be that way :)
[/quote]
Don't you remember? direction on passive scans in a 300 hp suit is OP, 3x active scanners on gallogi fine.. |
Weary Guy
56
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Posted - 2015.05.14 06:31:00 -
[36056] - Quote
Kaeru Nayiri wrote:Rusearch analysis:
mulling over 20 or 18 db scout, here are the important bits I noticed (old news to most of you, I know):
at 20 db, you can't hide from Medium Frame Inner ring, no precision mods necessary (very common) at 20 db, you can't hide from a CalScout Middle ring, if he's using all 4 highs for precision (convinced this is a myth, and there is no such thing as a Cal Scout with 4 precision mods :3)
next stop is 18 db, saving me from the 2 scenarios above, still have to worry about: at 18 db, you can't hide from ANY scout's inner ring, no precision mods necessary at 18 db, you can't hide from an Amarr scout's middle ring if he's got both highs used for precision mods (not impossible) at 18 db, you can't hide from a sentinel's inner ring if they're rocking a single precision mod. (kinda cool, actually)
I'm only posting this in case someone might find it useful. None of this is new, all the data is already available, not making any statements with this. Just putting here in case anyone else who runs min scout might be curious. I, personally, haven't sat down and actually thought about dampening values since fall off, so this was something overdue for me.
lol we dont have passive scans anymore....CCP screwed that up as well
Alt char
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Fristname Family name
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
143
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Posted - 2015.05.14 06:32:00 -
[36057] - Quote
on the topic of vehicle scans.. my heavy suits never get picked up by those.. militia scans :P and some active hand held ones miss me as well.. the funny thing is, i got 2points or 1 point into dampeners XD i wish i could see their reaction after scanning and then running around the corner into a hmg XD
but my poor minja gets picked up by everything cause i run speed all the time.... its fun but explains the negative kd i got..
Edit: my main was the heavy my scout has maxed scout trees including damps, range amps ect. and yes i know it gets scanned cause i got no damps.
Join the in game chat
Trading_Center and invite your trading buddies
look forward to seeing you there spread the word
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IAmDuncanIdaho II
Nos Nothi
2346
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Posted - 2015.05.14 06:53:00 -
[36058] - Quote
Llast 326 wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Llast 326 wrote: A huge issue that seems to go ignored on all scanning discussion and IMO is kinda a big issue. The newer introduced suitsGǪ Amarr and Cal Scouts, All non Amarr Heavies (Sent and Commando) show up on Passive Scans as a V that gives a facing for anyone paying attention. This is something that people should be aware of and should be addressed by CCP.
Are you sure this is still happening? As of two days agoGǪ yes Downed a Calmando because of it.
lol I'd always thought that chevron indicated a cloaked merc. Either way yeah it shouldn't indicate facing. |
IAmDuncanIdaho II
Nos Nothi
2346
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Posted - 2015.05.14 06:59:00 -
[36059] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:Imperial Marine Light SKIN has me playing scout more often simply because it's the best Imperial Marine SKIN.
Made a topic in the Features and Ideas section that basically suggests increasing Amarr movement speed and decreasing Minmatar movement speed putting them at roughly +- 0.05 m/s of Cal and Gal. Good responses so far but I suspect no one who has read it yet is a min scout.
Disclosure: Minja is my favourite fitting, and I speed tank it whenever I can.
I think you might kill the Minja if you take away their speed advantage. You will certainly remove some of the fun. |
Varoth Drac
Dead Man's Game
849
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Posted - 2015.05.14 08:49:00 -
[36060] - Quote
I have certainly experienced variation in the brightness of markers on tacnet. I haven't properly tested it, but fitting more precision seems to result in brighter markers. Has no one else experienced this?
As for chevron direction markers, I like how heavies show direction, CCP should make Amarr heavies do it as well. |
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