Giving assaults an hp buff wont help the assaults at all to what they are suppose to do which is to push, the scout already does that job even better than an assault which doesn't even makes any sense. The assault need bonuses that are rate of fire or damage to help them assault. Giving assaults 50 or 100 more hp will not help against those heavies who basically are like shooting a wall with three logis repping them.

Extra HP will help immensly.
My Commando feels fantastic to push with.
Combined with a smaller frame and faster speed, it makes that extra that much more powerful.

I'd rather see this than the ISK reduction for ADS. Possibly add a cheaper training' ADS that had the same flight characteristics as the ADS, but no turrets and maybe even no extra seats. I'm a new ADS pilot and collisions are by far my biggest death cause. I can usually escape AV, but crashes trying to learn maneuvers are expensive and the ADS handling is sufficiently different from the other DS I have to practice using it.

Min logi has 12 slots
gal logi has 12 slots
Cal logi has 12 slots
amar logi has 10 slots plus sidearm plus higher base stats.

.
.

Logistics are a support class, their entire role centralizes around supporting their team, so the inevitable question that I have toward all of this hoopla about the sidearms is: Why is the sidearm essential to the Logistics' role?
.
.

Can you make SP just a LITTLE bit easier and faster to get? Its pretty bad for me as i don't grind much for skill points but have 1 million sp waiting to be transfered

All,

After crowdsourcing, data crunching, reviewing internally and discussing with the CPM, we are ready with a non-finite list for Hotfix Charlie. As always, this is the narrative and any, all or none of the ideas may end up being implemented.

Hotfix Charlie
* Primary Objective Assault buff, we are looking at a HP increase, slight changes in slot layout and improved PG/CPU, slot based approach. Possibly improve Light Weapon fitting bonus. Possibly a slight speed increase.

* A slight HMG heat buildup increase

* Reduce Sentinel PG/CPU. Possibly a fitting bonus to Heavy Weapons.

* Installation buff, with a range and AI range reduction, reduction of granted WP for destruction.

* Blaster turret accuracy improvements, both Small and Large

* Modification of scout bonuses, with Amarr getting a precision bonus, a low radius strong field of scanning on top of a heavily armored suit, and Caldari retaining a long range scan ability.

* Minmatar will be improved by a Codebreaker fitting reduction, possibly KinCats as well. Possibly moving Codebreakers to High slot. PG increase.

* Nova Knife hit detection and damage improvement

* Reduced small rail range compared to sniper range

* Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots per tier, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. Same total of high and low slots as well per tier.

* WP for injectors, STD/ADV/PRO 25/50/75 WP

* Reactive Plates to 1-2-3 hp/s

* OB WP doubled

* LP payout increased x-fold

* Remove Ambush OMS or remove Vehicles from Ambush OMS

* Reduced ADS ISK price

Still under tech evaluation
* Disabling passive Scan sharing with squads
* Suicide/Bleedout/Overview option properly enforces that revival is not possible
* We have identified almost all the suits that have the wrong colors and are trying to get those fixed.
* Reduce ISK cost of early skillbooks for new players or free

Bugs/issues that need Client update
Pilot stacking bug
Unfair fall damage calculation
Unfair War points and distribution from OB kills
Directional arrow for enemies on minimap bug

Hotfix Delta or later
*Sidearm rebalance
*Sniper Rifle review
*Efficacy bonuses
*Further slot based PG/CPU updates based on necessity

You guys make it seem like the suits actually do the shooting lol. Why wouldn't the amarr suit be as strong as the cal scout suit after this bonus?

Also...the precision on amarr is horribad because you shouldnt' be able to use modules to enhance your bonus without giving up something. On Caldari, it's ideal because most of our tank comes from shields. So, it slows cal scouts from using enhancers because it makes the suit gimpy. An amarr gets most of its tank from low slots so they can stack double enhancers (which will be more than enough) and still have most of their health.

I remember the benefit from using a min logi suit before because you could stack damage mods and still stack armor to give you over 700hp of health. You shouldn't be able to do that...it should be a give and a take.

My input,

Hotfix Charlie
* Primary Objective Assault buff, we are looking at a HP increase, slight changes in slot layout and improved PG/CPU, slot based approach. Possibly improve Light Weapon fitting bonus. Possibly a slight speed increase.------Definitely

* A slight HMG heat buildup increase---Increase dispersion instead

* Reduce Sentinel PG/CPU. Possibly a fitting bonus to Heavy Weapons.------Maybe, depending on how much

* Installation buff, with a range and AI range reduction, reduction of granted WP for destruction.------All around AI reduction please

* Blaster turret accuracy improvements, both Small and Large-----Increase a little

* Modification of scout bonuses, with Amarr getting a precision bonus, a low radius strong field of scanning on top of a heavily armored suit, and Caldari retaining a long range scan ability. -----Yes

* Minmatar will be improved by a Codebreaker fitting reduction, possibly KinCats as well. Possibly moving Codebreakers to High slot. PG increase.-----Keep Codebreakers in Lows. Otherwise, yes

* Nova Knife hit detection and damage improvement-----Yes

* Reduced small rail range compared to sniper range----Sure

* Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots per tier, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. Same total of high and low slots as well per tier.-----No. I like the variety we have now

* WP for injectors, STD/ADV/PRO 25/50/75 WP-----Please yes. Less reward for rusty needles

* Reactive Plates to 1-2-3 hp/s----Yes

* OB WP doubled----Increased, yes, but not doubled. Maybe 3000-3600?

* LP payout increased x-fold----Not x-fold. Increase a little bit.

* Remove Ambush OMS or remove Vehicles from Ambush OMS------Either separate the modes in the Battle finder or do nothing. I don't mind OMS with vehicles.

* Reduced ADS ISK price----No. ADS should be expensive, but effective. I want a sense of accomplishment in costing an enemy pilot a decent bit of ISK when I beat them.

Still under tech evaluation
* Disabling passive Scan sharing with squads----I like the idea of sharing in a small radius. If not possible, then remove shared passives.
* Suicide/Bleedout/Overview option properly enforces that revival is not possible-----Have a x second delay before needle is possible. During this x second period, you can choose to bleed out.
* We have identified almost all the suits that have the wrong colors and are trying to get those fixed.
* Reduce ISK cost of early skillbooks for new players or free----I have no objection with price reduction. Don't do free though.

So "good" uplinks can be left on the field, while you change to another logi? I think this is working as intended.

All,

After crowdsourcing, data crunching, reviewing internally and discussing with the CPM, we are ready with a non-finite list for Hotfix Charlie. As always, this is the narrative and any, all or none of the ideas may end up being implemented.

Hotfix Charlie
* Primary Objective Assault buff, we are looking at a HP increase, slight changes in slot layout and improved PG/CPU, slot based approach. Possibly improve Light Weapon fitting bonus. Possibly a slight speed increase.

* A slight HMG heat buildup increase

* Reduce Sentinel PG/CPU. Possibly a fitting bonus to Heavy Weapons.

* Installation buff, with a range and AI range reduction, reduction of granted WP for destruction.

* Blaster turret accuracy improvements, both Small and Large

* Modification of scout bonuses, with Amarr getting a precision bonus, a low radius strong field of scanning on top of a heavily armored suit, and Caldari retaining a long range scan ability.

* Minmatar will be improved by a Codebreaker fitting reduction, possibly KinCats as well. Possibly moving Codebreakers to High slot. PG increase.

* Nova Knife hit detection and damage improvement

* Reduced small rail range compared to sniper range

* Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots per tier, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. Same total of high and low slots as well per tier.

* WP for injectors, STD/ADV/PRO 25/50/75 WP

* Reactive Plates to 1-2-3 hp/s

* OB WP doubled

* LP payout increased x-fold

* Remove Ambush OMS or remove Vehicles from Ambush OMS

* Reduced ADS ISK price

Still under tech evaluation
* Disabling passive Scan sharing with squads
* Suicide/Bleedout/Overview option properly enforces that revival is not possible
* We have identified almost all the suits that have the wrong colors and are trying to get those fixed.
* Reduce ISK cost of early skillbooks for new players or free

Bugs/issues that need Client update
Pilot stacking bug
Unfair fall damage calculation
Unfair War points and distribution from OB kills
Directional arrow for enemies on minimap bug

Hotfix Delta or later
*Sidearm rebalance
*Sniper Rifle review
*Efficacy bonuses
*Further slot based PG/CPU updates based on necessity

All,

After crowdsourcing, data crunching, reviewing internally and discussing with the CPM, we are ready with a non-finite list for Hotfix Charlie. As always, this is the narrative and any, all or none of the ideas may end up being implemented.

Hotfix Charlie
* Primary Objective Assault buff, we are looking at a HP increase, slight changes in slot layout and improved PG/CPU, slot based approach. Possibly improve Light Weapon fitting bonus. Possibly a slight speed increase.

* A slight HMG heat buildup increase

* Reduce Sentinel PG/CPU. Possibly a fitting bonus to Heavy Weapons.

* Installation buff, with a range and AI range reduction, reduction of granted WP for destruction.

* Blaster turret accuracy improvements, both Small and Large

* Modification of scout bonuses, with Amarr getting a precision bonus, a low radius strong field of scanning on top of a heavily armored suit, and Caldari retaining a long range scan ability.

* Minmatar will be improved by a Codebreaker fitting reduction, possibly KinCats as well. Possibly moving Codebreakers to High slot. PG increase.

* Nova Knife hit detection and damage improvement

* Reduced small rail range compared to sniper range

* Move all logistics to the same number of Equipment slots per tier, removing the Amarr sidearm. Reduce Logi speed slightly and remove Cloak fitting bonus. Same total of high and low slots as well per tier.

* WP for injectors, STD/ADV/PRO 25/50/75 WP

* Reactive Plates to 1-2-3 hp/s

* OB WP doubled

* LP payout increased x-fold

* Remove Ambush OMS or remove Vehicles from Ambush OMS

* Reduced ADS ISK price

Still under tech evaluation
* Disabling passive Scan sharing with squads
* Suicide/Bleedout/Overview option properly enforces that revival is not possible
* We have identified almost all the suits that have the wrong colors and are trying to get those fixed.
* Reduce ISK cost of early skillbooks for new players or free

Bugs/issues that need Client update
Pilot stacking bug
Unfair fall damage calculation
Unfair War points and distribution from OB kills
Directional arrow for enemies on minimap bug

Hotfix Delta or later
*Sidearm rebalance
*Sniper Rifle review
*Efficacy bonuses
*Further slot based PG/CPU updates based on necessity

Min logi has 12 slots
gal logi has 12 slots
Cal logi has 12 slots
amar logi has 10 slots plus sidearm plus higher base stats.

Its called militia, already exists, very cheap.

Why would a supportive suit want to have a secondary weapon?

IN ORDER TO BRING A SUPPORTIVE LIGHT ARM FOR THE TEAM
For Grudds sake. Fourth time I have to emphasize this.


Supportive weapon like laser, mass driver, swarm launcher or something of the sort.
Yea yea with laser you can go 30/0 in an ambush yadi yaddi.

Still any one of those weps is a lolfit without a sidearm, no matter how murderous they are in optimal conditions.

So than don't bring a support weapon to the fight... You have a Light Weapon slot, that's pretty diverse in and of itself for a main weapon. Saying that you need a sidearm to make use of your support weapon in a support role to be more combat effective, on top of having the capability to have some incredible defense, is asking for everything.

IMO, should only be able to choose two out of Offense/Defense/Support. I don't see "because I want to use a support weapon" as a valid reason why we should give any other Logistics a sidearm - the Amarr works well enough with it because it makes some actual sacrifices to have that sidearm. Maybe try using that if you want to roll support weapons. What we certainly don't need is a Caldari Logi with a sidearm, thing is already combat effective without.

Focus on the equipment. Encourage Logistics to actually utilize the stuff that they're designed to use.

I was under the impression that they were suggestig removing a slot in exchange for the sidearm - essentially it'd be just like the Amarr Logistics only with a preference for shields.

I would like it if the two suits had 5/3 and 3/5 layouts respectively; that way their off-tank is minimal but their main-tank can be significantly supplemented.
I can't say I'm a big fan of adding an equipment slot, although I was the other day and could probably be convinced that way.



Essentially, rather than the MinLogi or GalLogi where they're actively logi-ing, even if it is only once per 40s, Amarr and Caldari logistics have no active ability. I'm not really sure about the whole 'CalLogi getting a sidearm' thing, to be frank; it seems to me that CalLogi's bonus is far more 'instant' in the sense that you don't drop hives for someone else to use five minutes down the track; you drop them because someone needs ammo or health now.
As opposed to Amarr Logistics whose bonus basically requires that it be a competent combat suit, simply because its bonus does not function when it's dead.
Were this changed I could possibly see fit to removing the sidearm (though I'd not be happy about it).


So in my mind it isn't about 'sacrifices' per se, but more about the actual functioning of the suit. As it is, Amarr is a reasonable combat suit. Without a sidearm it might as well just spam the links and hide behind everyone else.
Were the bonus' functionality changed it'd be more like the CalLogi in that it can afford to die simply because people will still be using its bonus.

NB: I am not suggesting I should be able to switch suits and keep the bonus. I'd suggest that it'd make a lot more sense if, as long as I am/was in an Amarr Logistics I'm benefiting from the bonus. As soon as I'm in a different suit? Gone. My links are just like everyone else's and I might as well be Minmatar.

So in my mind it isn't about 'sacrifices' per se, but more about the actual functioning of the suit. As it is, Amarr is a reasonable combat suit. Without a sidearm it might as well just spam the links and hide behind everyone else.

NB: I am not suggesting I should be able to switch suits and keep the bonus. I'd suggest that it'd make a lot more sense if, as long as I am/was in an Amarr Logistics I'm benefiting from the bonus. As soon as I'm in a different suit? Gone. My links are just like everyone else's and I might as well be Minmatar.

Yeh, it's kind of a shoddy system overall to be honest. The whole thing about it though is that this appeal to 'racial equipment' was botched from the beginning and is entirely arbitrary. It goes off looks, if anything. I have notes from closed beta when we had CreoDron Dropuplinks, CreoDron/Allotek Nanohives, Viziam Repair Tools... Not sure how many of those are still in game but the fact that they exist(ed) goes to show that the equipment isn't restricted to certain races and we're more apt to provide a trickle-down effect to the other logistics.

This isn't to say that all Logistics should get bonuses to all Equipment - not at all. Although, having a dual bonus just makes sense. Amarr specializing in Drop Uplinks with a bonus to - I dunno - repair tools as a secondary. Not as good as Minmatar but still effective. That way they're not "twiddling their thumbs" as it was so vibrantly described but at the same time they're not trying to over-ride yet another combat role.

The overall goal, I think, is to encourage players to WANT to use those support options instead of just leaving the equipment slots blank and jacking up armor/shields to ridiculous levels solely because they can and we provide them the means to do so. I don't think it's too late for Logistics to actually utilize equipment to dynamically change the match and I seriously don't think we should default to, "Welp, mechanics suck, guess we'll make it another combat role" just yet.

Might as well just run Scout at that point what with it having two equipment slots anyway.

* Modification of scout bonuses, with Amarr getting a precision bonus, a low radius strong field of scanning on top of a heavily armored suit, and Caldari retaining a long range scan ability.

* Minmatar will be improved by a Codebreaker fitting reduction, possibly KinCats as well. Possibly moving Codebreakers to High slot. PG increase.

Yeh, it's kind of a shoddy system overall to be honest. The whole thing about it though is that this appeal to 'racial equipment' was botched from the beginning and is entirely arbitrary. It goes off looks, if anything. I have notes from closed beta when we had CreoDron Dropuplinks, CreoDron/Allotek Nanohives, Viziam Repair Tools... Not sure how many of those are still in game but the fact that they exist(ed) goes to show that the equipment isn't restricted to certain races and we're more apt to provide a trickle-down effect to the other logistics.

This isn't to say that all Logistics should get bonuses to all Equipment - not at all. Although, having a dual bonus just makes sense. Amarr specializing in Drop Uplinks with a bonus to - I dunno - repair tools as a secondary. Not as good as Minmatar but still effective. That way they're not "twiddling their thumbs" as it was so vibrantly described but at the same time they're not trying to over-ride yet another combat role.

The overall goal, I think, is to encourage players to WANT to use those support options instead of just leaving the equipment slots blank and jacking up armor/shields to ridiculous levels solely because they can and we provide them the means to do so. I don't think it's too late for Logistics to actually utilize equipment to dynamically change the match and I seriously don't think we should default to, "Welp, mechanics suck, guess we'll make it another combat role" just yet.

Might as well just run Scout at that point what with it having two equipment slots anyway.

You have a good point. But the amarr will have good precision with a 25+- meter range which isnt like the 65+- meter range and precision on the cal currently. If they want anything near as good as the current cal scout they have to gimp their tank like you are saying they should.

I think the change is fair with no range bonus on the amarr scout forcing them to sacrifice to exceeded their limit at a cost of their tank while the cal sacrifices nothing and can get 70meters ez.

Edit: slot layout can also be looked at by ccp so this could be a move in the right direction.

Cal early warning. Amarr short range certainty.

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By the same token, imo, the relative popularity of the minmatar logi is because it's bonus is the only one that is totally worth not using a scout suit to do the job.
-snip-