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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 178 post(s)
noob cavman Expert Intervention Caldari State 848	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:04:00 - [11611] - Quote Scout Registry wrote: Since when do Biotic Scouts lobby for nerfs against Brick Scouts? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=149208&find=unread Brick or Biotic, all Scouts might be OP next build. No one wants that. We won't know whether or not (nor the extent thereof) until we've played the post-hotfix 1.8. We Bastards should consider holding off on presenting nerf packages until we've had ample time to discuss the ups and downs of each. Lightning gets a pass because he's a god-d*mn Legend. Damn biotic meth heads. Always jumping the gun I want to be a caveman! Ccp: DENIED YOU DRUNK Proto scouting is not stomping Well maybe a little
noob cavman Expert Intervention Caldari State 849	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:15:00 - [11612] - Quote Damn im full of the vinegar today. **** you insomnia! Also double postin like a... I just cant I want to be a caveman! Ccp: DENIED YOU DRUNK Proto scouting is not stomping Well maybe a little
Ninja Troll General Tso's Alliance 107	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:22:00 - [11613] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: Ninja Troll wrote: Today I used the SP rewards to get this character to a level 5 Gal scout. However, after deep reflection I've decided to switch to the Caldari scout in 1.8. With the anticipated surge of new scouts, I expect few will use dampeners or have level 5 damp skill. I'll be using a complex precision enhancer, so fewer scouts will be able to sneak up on me. Will use 2 complex prec enhancers to hunt most Gal scouts, which should be the most popular scout. Thanks Haerr for your awesome Scanning Table. Still deciding whether to keep my Nos Nothi character as a L4 Min scout or switch to a proto Gal scout. Ah... going Caldari? I will be taking the opposite route and maxxing out the sensor fits for most of my G-Spook suits. Complex damp and whatever range mod I can fit in the low with a green jar. High will be best precision money can buy. Hunting scout newb's and wannabe EZ converts will be so, so easy... I see so many of 'em with my passive scanning now and my precision is only 36 and change on my dragonfly. They are 'practicing' now I guess... but, what are they practicing? Dying? Even with no skills you should at least throw some dampeners on there... Yeah it's going to be fun hunting tanked scouts. My original character is getting more SP for dropsuit respec, so will make it a Cal scout instead. The current plan for my scout suits in 1.8: 1. Ghetto Troll= Proto Cal Scout. Then use extra SP for Min Scout later. 2. Ninja Troll= Proto Gal Scout. 3. Alt= Adv Amarr Scout. I look forward to testing the new suits with the MSMG + NK/SMG for the new event. SG Scout. I enjoy killing Heavies, Snipers, and Scanemies
TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1784	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:37:00 - [11614] - Quote so with 1.8 coming out, I'm expecting to see a lot of "new scouts" in the Scouts United channel. I just hate the fact that so many people are becoming scouts because they plan on abusing them and building them like invisible assaults. also, I was thinking, can one honestly call themselves a scout if they build the suit exactly like an assault? (1000 ehp scout gk.0) just something to think about, but we have this thread I suppose, to differentiate between who the true scouts are, and those who just plan on using them because they think they'll be OP. Anime > EVERYTHING
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 1784	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:48:00 - [11615] - Quote Its a light assault TranquilBiscuit. Wont be OP, just better than assaults for the moment. There is a significant difference. Drop it like its hat.
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 1464	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:51:00 - [11616] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Scout Registry wrote: IMHO, Speed vs HP comes down to personal preference, playstyle and the task at hand. What works one build may not the next; there is no right or wrong choice. Unless, of course, you chose to be a f*cking sissy coward and pilot an HAV. Thank you so much for posting this. Makes me feel more welcome into the scout community! :) I am a scrub though. Dont forget that. Dude, you are definitely welcome here. o7 Double posting like a Kaiser.
Quik Django Nos Nothi 117	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:57:00 - [11617] - Quote Has anyone actually tried building some theoretical assault suits for 1.8? Do scouts really outperform them or is this just panicked scaremongering? I'd like to see some fits please :) Django Quik's alt if you hadn't figured that one out!
Scout Registry Nos Nothi 1670	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:57:00 - [11618] - Quote TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote: so with 1.8 coming out, I'm expecting to see a lot of "new scouts" in the Scouts United channel. I just hate the fact that so many people are becoming scouts because they plan on abusing them and building them like invisible assaults. also, I was thinking, can one honestly call themselves a scout if they build the suit exactly like an assault? (1000 ehp scout gk.0) just something to think about, but we have this thread I suppose, to differentiate between who the true scouts are, and those who just plan on using them because they think they'll be OP. Let's play a game called Its a Trap! CCP makes Scouts OP. CCP rolls out the oh-so-tempting Cloak. CCP gives everyone a Respec. Yay! Everyone goes Scout. All the way to Level 5 (must have Cloak bonus!). Scouts demand a Scout Nerf. Non Scouts demand a Scout Nerf. CCP nerfs Scouts in 1.9. Everyone has SP trapped. Just like the Flaylock, but more! Nyain San dodges the bullet. Because the entire time, they've been hiding in their Tanks like fcking pssy cowards.
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. Top Men. 1784	Posted - 2014.03.20 15:58:00 - [11619] - Quote Quik Django wrote: Has anyone actually tried building some theoretical assault suits for 1.8? Do scouts really outperform them or is this just panicked scaremongering? I'd like to see some fits please :) Scout fits are better. Drop it like its hat.
One Eyed King Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 707	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:00:00 - [11620] - Quote Look at this build and tell me something like this won't be a problem for 1.8. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/181/1170 I think there should be some leeway to add additional shields and armor to a scout suit, but if you have a higher ehp than an assult, you shouldn't be able to move so much faster, still retain the reduced profile etc. 916 ehp is close to heavy levels. On a character that has dampening maxed, it would be nearly impossible to detect, which is a weakness that makes heavies and medium frames more balanced. Its awfully early to say for certain, but I see lots of room for this type of outfit to be abused. Looking for the scout hangout?

Scout Registry Nos Nothi 1672	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:04:00 - [11621] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Look at this build and tell me something like this won't be a problem for 1.8. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/181/1170 I think there should be some leeway to add additional shields and armor to a scout suit, but if you have a higher ehp than an assult, you shouldn't be able to move so much faster, still retain the reduced profile etc. 916 ehp is close to heavy levels. On a character that has dampening maxed, it would be nearly impossible to detect, which is a weakness that makes heavies and medium frames more balanced. Its awfully early to say for certain, but I see lots of room for this type of outfit to be abused. That's the impetus behind Lightning's nerf request. Premature or not, I'm inclined to agree with some of this points.
Master Smurf Nos Nothi 238	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:10:00 - [11622] - Quote All because they didnt want to make the cloak a built in device. - The Cloak skill could have been placed as a 4x 6x or 8x skill to either increase duration or reduce cooldown. That would have allowed them to keep 1 equipment slot and provided a smaller buff to CPU/PG "Shine bright like a diamond"
Ninja Troll General Tso's Alliance 109	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:12:00 - [11623] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Look at this build and tell me something like this won't be a problem for 1.8. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/181/1170 I think there should be some leeway to add additional shields and armor to a scout suit, but if you have a higher ehp than an assult, you shouldn't be able to move so much faster, still retain the reduced profile etc. 916 ehp is close to heavy levels. On a character that has dampening maxed, it would be nearly impossible to detect, which is a weakness that makes heavies and medium frames more balanced. Its awfully early to say for certain, but I see lots of room for this type of outfit to be abused. Yeah this type of build will be common with Gal and Amarr scouts. Although I expect to see the RR or MSMG, with 2 complex shield extenders. Plan on hunting these people with my Cal scout. SG Scout. I enjoy killing Heavies, Snipers, and Scanemies
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 1465	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:15:00 - [11624] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: Quik Django wrote: Has anyone actually tried building some theoretical assault suits for 1.8? Do scouts really outperform them or is this just panicked scaremongering? I'd like to see some fits please :) Scout fits are better. Marginally less hp with faster speed, better scanning and profile. Better fitting space and two equipment. Many assault players were scouts back in early beta builds, it really isnt something new... This is the essence of the problem. There should not be a suit that is holistically 'better'. Only different. To obtain an advantage in speed, stealth, scanning, shield regen, hitbox, etc., etc.... typically one has had to make sacrifices, for instance run a scout suit with limited slots and fitting capacity. In 1.8 there seems to be no downside to using a scout over an assault suit. In my mind it's not about "my" scout v.s. the other guys scout, it's about scouts not overshadowing assaults. Sure, we receive a larger speed hit when using plates... but it's on top of a higher base speed and all the other benefits I pointed out; it doesn't add up. This does not equate to balance to me. I see no reason not to call it now - I'd like to think we, as scouts, could tell when we are gonna have an advantage which doesn't look equitable. Double posting like a Kaiser.
Scout Registry Nos Nothi 1673	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:37:00 - [11625] - Quote @ Monk I agree in spirit and on paper. But calling it now would likely fail to account for future unknowns. CCP has a history of "ninja" tweaks and changes to combat mechanics. They're also overhauling TTK, which is another huge unknown. Likely best to know all the inputs before commenting on outputs. My two cents, at least.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 3612	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:51:00 - [11626] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: I do cry a little inside when I see a scout take a fine precision instrument and dull it down with tons of plates. I agree with this. It also reminds me of Bourne. "You were given a Ferrari and your people treated it like a lawnmower!" Nothing says "F**K YOU!" like a direct Flaylock to the face. I've got 3k likes, I'll double post if I want to dammit!
Quik Django Nos Nothi 120	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:53:00 - [11627] - Quote Ninja Troll wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Look at this build and tell me something like this won't be a problem for 1.8. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/181/1170 I think there should be some leeway to add additional shields and armor to a scout suit, but if you have a higher ehp than an assult, you shouldn't be able to move so much faster, still retain the reduced profile etc. 916 ehp is close to heavy levels. On a character that has dampening maxed, it would be nearly impossible to detect, which is a weakness that makes heavies and medium frames more balanced. Its awfully early to say for certain, but I see lots of room for this type of outfit to be abused. Yeah this type of build will be common with Gal and Amarr scouts. Although I expect to see the RR or MSMG, with 2 complex shield extenders. Plan on hunting these people with my Cal scout. Okay, so I tried to make a gk0 assault that could outclass this and this is as good as I could get: http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/1492 It sucks balls. Same weapons/equipment setup, slightly slower, slightly less armor. Extra shields is really all it has going for it. And the ability to passive scan undampened scouts (except gallente). I tried making it less armor tanky and putting more shields on instead of being able to passive scan but ran out of PG. I think it's becoming more and more obvious that CCP really really needed to get their pass on the base stats and slots of medium suits done for 1.8 because no one with any sense would run an assault suit in this situation. Django Quik's alt if you hadn't figured that one out!
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 1468	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:54:00 - [11628] - Quote Scout Registry wrote: @ Monk I agree in spirit and on paper; we look OP by comparison to Assaults. But calling it now would likely fail to account for future unknowns. CCP has a history of "ninja" tweaks and changes to combat mechanics. They're also overhauling TTK, which is another huge unknown. Likely best to know all the inputs before prescribing outputs. My two cents, at least. It is always wise to leave an allowance for the unknown, true that. In a perfect world, CCP would look at Lightning's post, be like "Oh yeah, well... let's double check the math in that balancing equation guys... Okay, we were on the verge of making a mistake, maybe we should tweak a bit prior to release" But this world ain't perfect. It's new Eden! Plus, they have balanced by retaining the sprint bug, the "I can't climb a hill" bug and the shotgun and nova knife hit detection sucks bug, and the tanks are OP bug. Double posting like a Kaiser.
Master Smurf Nos Nothi 238	Posted - 2014.03.20 16:58:00 - [11629] - Quote Assaults are being pushed to used better weaponry and should be able to be deadlier. The ROF bonus would have worked too (for rifles and unbeknownst shotgun users) but that was shot down. Easiest solution is to swap the module slots for assaults and logis as we know highs and lows make all the difference. - They also should have the higher shield / armor regen rates or delays so eg. - give Gal assault the +3 and Cal assault the 50 HP or 3 second depleted delay "Shine bright like a diamond"
Appia Nappia Nos Nothi 394	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:14:00 - [11630] - Quote Ninja Troll wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Look at this build and tell me something like this won't be a problem for 1.8. http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/181/1170 I think there should be some leeway to add additional shields and armor to a scout suit, but if you have a higher ehp than an assult, you shouldn't be able to move so much faster, still retain the reduced profile etc. 916 ehp is close to heavy levels. On a character that has dampening maxed, it would be nearly impossible to detect, which is a weakness that makes heavies and medium frames more balanced. Its awfully early to say for certain, but I see lots of room for this type of outfit to be abused. Yeah this type of build will be common with Gal and Amarr scouts. Although I expect to see the RR or MSMG, with 2 complex shield extenders. Plan on hunting these people with my Cal scout. 2 damage mode, 4 complex plates, rep hive, cloak. Up until the confirmed damage mod nerf this was one of my builds. Since 1.2 I've used 2 enhanced plates, when the plate buff came I upped it to two complex plates for the same movement penalty at an extra hundred health. During the an SP event in November I let Roner General borrow my account, he did 4 plates on my Scout gk.0 back in 1.5 When fighting with Alpha-Damage weapons, the name of the game is to always have more HP than a single shot can do. When sniping, 1056 total HP is the goal. When shotgunning it was 500. With Aim Assist at its peak, the nadir of scoutly arts, Armor tanking was very effective. With the new weapons dealing more concentrated damage than an HMG, you still need the HP to survive long enough to get your third shot off. People that call armor tanking wrong, are usually just butthurt scouts that lose every confrontation with a Gallente scout . . . because their opponent wasn't stupid enough to run with a suit that could be killed from a single blast from a shotgun. Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.

icdedppul PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 118	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:16:00 - [11631] - Quote FYI: in game fix for sprint bug crouch and you can sprint again if your not dead already. I thought people knew this but its been coming up a lot in conversation the last couple weeks
Appia Nappia Nos Nothi 394	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:17:00 - [11632] - Quote Also just noticed that it was DJINN Marauder's creation. Honestly, the precision enhancer is being wasted. it gets you down to 28.8, not enough of a difference from 36 unless you are targeting the new-scouts that don't know what they are doing. Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1634	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:27:00 - [11633] - Quote Quik Django wrote: Has anyone actually tried building some theoretical assault suits for 1.8? Do scouts really outperform them or is this just panicked scaremongering? I'd like to see some fits please :) I have. Kinda meh. It made a small difference on my Assault ck.0, but my ak.0 and gk.0 builds didn't really change. Other than I felt more obliged to fit the rail rifle on the ck.0 and said "**** you CCP, Gallente bonus is terrible." The ak.0 certainly gained the most PG, enough to brick-tank it and use a Carthum Assault Scrambler Pistol... which apparently is now better than the Viziam for reasons other than clip size Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
icdedppul PFB Pink Fluffy Bunnies 120	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:45:00 - [11634] - Quote Appia Nappia wrote: Also just noticed that it was DJINN Marauder's creation. Honestly, the precision enhancer is being wasted. it gets you down to 28.8, not enough of a difference from 36 unless you are targeting the new-scouts that don't know what they are doing. actually it will probably be effective since there is no "Warning you have been passively scanned" we will all get lazy and decide that low slot could be used for something else besides a dampner
noob cavman Expert Intervention Caldari State 859	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:48:00 - [11635] - Quote To add a point to lightings post does he shield tank it? So he is running around at base shield with damage mods, precision enhancers? Thats what im getting out of this. Any attempt at ehp tank is wrong? I need that 400 armour to survive as a buffer as a complex rep is only 6-7 hp a second compared to your 40 hp shield regeneration, I need to sacrifice my suits main tanking to run it how he believes it should be. Whilst he can keep his shields? ummm..... wat? no really wat. You want a armour based dropsuit to forgo the most effective tanking ability to appease your sense of what a scout should be. that is the same as telling future cal scouts not to use shield extenders (its main tank and why it has a high hp recharge rate.) An opinion is like an ******** and everyone has one... but damn thats one flappy arse. I want to be a caveman! Ccp: DENIED YOU DRUNK Proto scouting is not stomping Well maybe a little
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 1471	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:49:00 - [11636] - Quote Appia Nappia wrote: People that call armor tanking wrong, are usually just butthurt scouts that lose every confrontation with a Gallente scout . . . because their opponent wasn't stupid enough to run with a suit that could be killed from a single blast from a shotgun. The main thing I'm getting out of this discussion is not really about how one must fit a scout suit (clearly we all have or styles) but more about the fact that massively tanking a scout suit is looking to be a way better option than using an assault suit in 1.8. Who, after looking at the facts, will choose the assault bonus and additional 100 or so HP over the reduced hit box, better stealth, extra low slot (which could be left empty) better passive scanning range and precision, better speed/strafe and in some cases better shield regen? Personally, I don't want to see this. All it will lead to is an underutilization of the assault suit, an influx of assault minded players using the scout suit and probably some over-buff to assaults or future scout nerf. If anyone is thinking that I am advocating for a singular scout playstyle, this isn't the case. I'm advocating for balance, and this is what I got out of lightning's thread. Double posting like a Kaiser.
noob cavman Expert Intervention Caldari State 859	Posted - 2014.03.20 18:59:00 - [11637] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: Appia Nappia wrote: People that call armor tanking wrong, are usually just butthurt scouts that lose every confrontation with a Gallente scout . . . because their opponent wasn't stupid enough to run with a suit that could be killed from a single blast from a shotgun. The main thing I'm getting out of this discussion is not really about how one must fit a scout suit (clearly we all have or styles) but more about the fact that massively tanking a scout suit is looking to be a way better option than using an assault suit in 1.8. Who, after looking at the facts, will choose the assault bonus and additional 100 or so HP over the reduced hit box, better stealth, extra low slot (which could be left empty) better passive scanning range and precision, better speed/strafe and in some cases better shield regen? Personally, I don't want to see this. All it will lead to is an underutilization of the assault suit, an influx of assault minded players using the scout suit and probably some over-buff to assaults or future scout nerf. If anyone is thinking that I am advocating for a singular scout playstyle, this isn't the case. I'm advocating for balance, and this is what I got out of lightning's thread. Lighting should have had you write it. I want to be a caveman! Ccp: DENIED YOU DRUNK Proto scouting is not stomping Well maybe a little
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1635	Posted - 2014.03.20 19:02:00 - [11638] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: Appia Nappia wrote: People that call armor tanking wrong, are usually just butthurt scouts that lose every confrontation with a Gallente scout . . . because their opponent wasn't stupid enough to run with a suit that could be killed from a single blast from a shotgun. The main thing I'm getting out of this discussion is not really about how one must fit a scout suit (clearly we all have or styles) but more about the fact that massively tanking a scout suit is looking to be a way better option than using an assault suit in 1.8. Who, after looking at the facts, will choose the assault bonus and additional 100 or so HP over the reduced hit box, better stealth, extra low slot (which could be left empty) better passive scanning range and precision, better speed/strafe and in some cases better shield regen? Personally, I don't want to see this. All it will lead to is an underutilization of the assault suit, an influx of assault minded players using the scout suit and probably some over-buff to assaults or future scout nerf. If anyone is thinking that I am advocating for a singular scout playstyle, this isn't the case. I'm advocating for balance, and this is what I got out of lightning's thread. Not something new. Gallente Assault has always been with worst one. Gal-Logi could tank better, with hive to regen HP and utility slots. Or you could go Gal-Scout and be an dampened assault with 2 fewer damage mods, more armor HP, and more movement speed. I've let some people borrow my account for a bit. Marauder has let at least one person use his. When they take the Scout for the first time they just build it like an Assault suit. They loved it. Though it didn't really matter this patch, 1.7 with CR or RR and damage mods was way better than being dampened. That wasn't something I ever really wanted to bring up, though, because it shows this was an issue before hand. +1 HS, and a nerf to damage mods is going to make this more evident. EDIT: Caldari is different though. Their bonus has a direct effect that isn't terrible. Amarr and Minmatar are debatable. They don't have the same slot layout +/-1 slot, instead they are both very different. And their bonus radically affects play-style. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
mollerz 2814	Posted - 2014.03.20 19:30:00 - [11639] - Quote Scout Registry wrote: Since when do Biotic Scouts lobby for nerfs against Brick Scouts? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=149208&find=unread Brick or Biotic, all Scouts might be OP next build. No one wants that. Especially us. We won't know whether or not (nor the extent thereof) until we've played the post-hotfix 1.8. We Bastards should consider holding off on presenting nerf packages until we've had ample time to discuss the ups and downs of each. Lightning gets a pass because he's a god-dmn Legend. Private and Public nerf discussions will be held. These discussions will not be civil. There will be broken furniture and stabbings. There will be name calling and feuds. There may* even be a new Quil. Isn't it a bit premature to have this type of discussions that ultimately will just turn into self fulfilling prophecies? Let us ban the entire discussion! You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
mollerz 2817	Posted - 2014.03.20 19:39:00 - [11640] - Quote icdedppul wrote: FYI: in game fix for sprint bug crouch and you can sprint again if your not dead already. I thought people knew this but its been coming up a lot in conversation the last couple weeks This bug makes me ill. It's the wrongest bug in the entire game's coded existence. Edit: Also, throwing a melee punch seems to fix it. You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla



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