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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 178 post(s) |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2783
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Posted - 2014.04.08 15:01:00 -
[12961] - Quote
Been having some fun making up non-scout scout counters for my scanner are useful thread here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=154433
So far I have a mlt caldari medium frame with only BPOs that can scan 'most' scouts and a std gal logi that will scan pretty much everyone. Feel free to join in.
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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IgniteableAura
Pro Hic Immortalis
830
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Posted - 2014.04.08 15:18:00 -
[12962] - Quote
Watching some old vids makes me miss knifing....so I am going to spend all the SP I get from the event back into winmitar scout.
% based HP mods might cause some issues on heavys. In order for them to even be remotely useful they need to have a decent bonus, or the only frames using them will be heavys. If the bonus is high enough for med frames to use them, then heavys will be OP if they stack plates. Regardless of stack penalty as that will be negated as higher and higher percentages stack on top of one another.
Gal sent has base 1143 hp. Add even 60% on top of that with stacked mods and you have sentinels with >2000hp. Talk about brick tank. Add the skill bonuses and they won't ever go down.
Percentage mods are a different beast as they can easily overcome the stacking penalty on heavy frames.
Honestly they need % based armor and shield mods as well as absolute. The heavy frames can utilize the %based far better while the lighter frames can use the absolute mods. That would give CCP much more balancing power.
PHI Recruitment
or PHIsh Tank in game
Youtube
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Quil Evrything
Triple Terrors
1195
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Posted - 2014.04.08 16:30:00 -
[12963] - Quote
Brokerib wrote: Just a thought on this. I like the idea of % based armor modules, but it does disadvantage low HP suits.
And by "disadvantage", you mean... People would have to play low HP suits... as low HP suits. This is a problem??
Only to people who like abusing low hp suits to be out of their class.
Appia wrote: The percentage to mods is not an idea unique to quil, but it will get shot down quickly by the slayer-logi-loving crowd.
And by that you mean, "the devs".
I tell ya, DUST514 could be truly awesome.. if it wasnt for the devs having content modifying authority
Write code, make pretty 3d graphics, but leave the game balance to proper game designers, you bastards!
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Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2793
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Posted - 2014.04.08 17:25:00 -
[12964] - Quote
Quil Evrything wrote:leave the game balance to proper game designers, you bastards! Are there any anymore? Since Fox Four left us for the more pleasant climes of Eve (did Nullabor go too? haven't seen him much in a long time either), has anyone seen any devs referring to themselves as designers?
Maybe they've all been hushed away working on Dust's 'next evolution' all this time... maybe...
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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Ninja Troll
General Tso's Alliance
137
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Posted - 2014.04.08 18:11:00 -
[12965] - Quote
The recent cloak hotfix may be causing a new bug. Not sure if it's just for scout suits. It seems that switching suits at supply depot is keeping previous suits info. I'm going to do more tests, specifically for scan profile.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2035968#post2035968
Pimps don't cry.
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Ghost Kaisar
Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad.
4082
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Posted - 2014.04.08 19:52:00 -
[12966] - Quote
Appia Vibbia wrote:Ghost, I challenged you to a breach flaylock duel!
Choose your suit of choice, I'll run the same fittings unless you use an Assault suit.
Min Scout
Basic Breach Flaylock
Enough shields to guarantee that you must land two direct shots in succession to kill target.
Bring Nanohives.
Lots of Nanohives.
We might have to plan this on non-tdome times. My schedule won't let me t-dome now
I got my cloak and daggers, I'm a very happy Ghost
I hack at Mach V
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Spademan
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1172
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Posted - 2014.04.08 19:54:00 -
[12967] - Quote
Ghost Kaisar wrote:Appia Vibbia wrote:Ghost, I challenged you to a breach flaylock duel!
Choose your suit of choice, I'll run the same fittings unless you use an Assault suit. Min Scout Basic Breach Flaylock Enough shields to guarantee that you must land two direct shots in succession to kill target. Bring Nanohives. Lots of Nanohives. We might have to plan this on non-tdome times. My schedule won't let me t-dome now
Whenever this happens, I want to watch
I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special.
Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
2805
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Posted - 2014.04.08 20:03:00 -
[12968] - Quote
Spademan wrote:Ghost Kaisar wrote:Appia Vibbia wrote:Ghost, I challenged you to a breach flaylock duel!
Choose your suit of choice, I'll run the same fittings unless you use an Assault suit. Min Scout Basic Breach Flaylock Enough shields to guarantee that you must land two direct shots in succession to kill target. Bring Nanohives. Lots of Nanohives. We might have to plan this on non-tdome times. My schedule won't let me t-dome now Whenever this happens, I want to watch Front row for me as well
KRRROOOOOOM
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
2805
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Posted - 2014.04.08 20:05:00 -
[12969] - Quote
Hotfix did indeed mess with cloak, switch to different suit type and the glitch does not happen.
KRRROOOOOOM
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Ninja Troll
General Tso's Alliance
140
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Posted - 2014.04.08 21:45:00 -
[12970] - Quote
Llast 326 wrote:Hotfix did indeed mess with cloak, switch to different suit type and the glitch does not happen. I'm referring to this morning's hotfix which fixed that cloak bug. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2034825#post2034825
I'm going to try to reproduce the new bug and do some scan profile tests. Switching to other suit fixed the new bug too.
Pimps don't cry.
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Spademan
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
1174
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Posted - 2014.04.08 21:48:00 -
[12971] - Quote
Guys, I accidentally infiltrated the Commando registry
I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special.
Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
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Llast 326
An Arkhos
2806
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Posted - 2014.04.08 22:03:00 -
[12972] - Quote
Ninja Troll wrote:Llast 326 wrote:Hotfix did indeed mess with cloak, switch to different suit type and the glitch does not happen. I'm referring to this morning's hotfix which fixed that cloak bug. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2034825#post2034825I'm going to try to reproduce the new bug and do some scan profile tests. Switching to other suit fixed the new bug too. Ah I think the Nanite injectors have been suffering from some other odd glitches as well. Like odies that don't exist and such
as a Wise Bastard once said
KRRROOOOOOM
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
44
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Posted - 2014.04.08 22:35:00 -
[12973] - Quote
This Week's Top Three Trollhards:
* Shotguns should have 1 shell / clip and reduced RoF * Cloaks should emit a constant, buzzing sound * Nerf Kin Cats ... to buff the Amarr Scout (?)
Bang?
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Patrick57
6816
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Posted - 2014.04.08 22:59:00 -
[12974] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:This Week's Top Three:
* Shotguns should have 1 shell / clip and reduced RoF
How the hell would a reduced RoF affect a Shotgun with just one shell?
Hell is empty and all the devils are here.
-William Shakespeare
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Matticus Monk
Ordus Trismegistus
1598
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Posted - 2014.04.08 23:01:00 -
[12975] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:This Week's Top Three:
* Shotguns should have 1 shell / clip and reduced RoF
How the hell would a reduced RoF affect a Shotgun with just one shell?
Hence the stupid....
I don't think this kind of IQ draining dribble will rub off on us. We will keep each other solid and bring any strays back from the brink...
Double posting like a Kaiser.
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
48
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Posted - 2014.04.08 23:01:00 -
[12976] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:This Week's Top Three:
* Shotguns should have 1 shell / clip and reduced RoF
How the hell would a reduced RoF affect a Shotgun with just one shell? Thank you, Patrick.
Bang?
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Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance
5818
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Posted - 2014.04.08 23:55:00 -
[12977] - Quote
I'm trying to be a good boy anx use only ADV suits, I swear, but not using proto against stacked teams usually ends badly for sin.
Oh I get kills, lots of um, but at the expense of getting my chocolate behind patted.
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja
Forum Warrior level 5
STB-Infantry (Demolition)
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Murt Lesp
Leviathan Battalion
159
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:02:00 -
[12978] - Quote
Why is it that I can double my warpoints by sniping? When did I get so useful at range?
Saving my comrades in gunfights, one shot at a time
The Leviathan has Awoken and in hungers
That was an Execution - Pistol Headshot Kill
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Patrick57
6820
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:11:00 -
[12979] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:I'm trying to be a good boy anx use only ADV suits, I swear, but not using proto against stacked teams usually ends badly for sin.
Oh I get kills, lots of um, but at the expense of getting my chocolate behind patted. I'm having trouble running any tier of infantry in pubs lol. But, when I do, I only run Standard (unless I'm in my Heavy), and I get completely raped.
Hell is empty and all the devils are here.
-William Shakespeare
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Matticus Monk
Ordus Trismegistus
1600
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:20:00 -
[12980] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:I'm trying to be a good boy anx use only ADV suits, I swear, but not using proto against stacked teams usually ends badly for sin.
Oh I get kills, lots of um, but at the expense of getting my chocolate behind patted. I'm having trouble running any tier of infantry in pubs lol. But, when I do, I only run Standard (unless I'm in my Heavy), and I get completely raped.
Huh? What kind of infantry suits....? This doesn't sound like you....
Double posting like a Kaiser.
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jerrmy12 kahoalii
900
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:21:00 -
[12981] - Quote
Matticus Monk wrote:Patrick57 wrote:Sinboto Simmons wrote:I'm trying to be a good boy anx use only ADV suits, I swear, but not using proto against stacked teams usually ends badly for sin.
Oh I get kills, lots of um, but at the expense of getting my chocolate behind patted. I'm having trouble running any tier of infantry in pubs lol. But, when I do, I only run Standard (unless I'm in my Heavy), and I get completely raped. Huh? What kind of infantry suits....? This doesn't sound like you.... Laundry or short shorts.
Closed beta vet
Tears, sweet delicious tears
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Patrick57
6820
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:23:00 -
[12982] - Quote
Matticus Monk wrote:Huh? What kind of infantry suits....? This doesn't sound like you....
What do you mean?!
Hell is empty and all the devils are here.
-William Shakespeare
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General John Ripper
19461
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:23:00 -
[12983] - Quote
I ate spaghetti today. It was delicious.
My like count = Nominate Ripper 4 cpm petition
Sign it to let CCP know we are serious.
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Matticus Monk
Ordus Trismegistus
1602
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:25:00 -
[12984] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:Matticus Monk wrote:Huh? What kind of infantry suits....? This doesn't sound like you....
What do you mean?!
I mean are you using a suit you are not familiar with or something? I've played with you before and you never had too much trouble, that's all.
Double posting like a Kaiser.
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Patrick57
6820
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:29:00 -
[12985] - Quote
Matticus Monk wrote:I mean are you using a suit you are not familiar with or something? I've played with you before and you never had too much trouble, that's all.
Nah, I'm just bad.
But, my speed tanked Gallente Heavy is amazing.
I'd really prefer to be in my ADS than anything. I just don't have the money to make it a full-time thing.
Hell is empty and all the devils are here.
-William Shakespeare
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Ninja Troll
General Tso's Alliance
143
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:39:00 -
[12986] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:* Cloaks should emit a constant, buzzing sound I would prefer the music from Jaws when the Shark is about to attack. http://youtu.be/rW23RsUTb2Y?t=1m37s (NSFW-blood bath)
Regarding the new bug, I was able to duplicate it with other suit types. Fortunately scan profile seems to be ok. Not sure if there are other related equipment or suit issues.
Pimps don't cry.
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Brokerib
Lone Wolves Club
999
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:42:00 -
[12987] - Quote
Quil Evrything wrote:Brokerib wrote: Just a thought on this. I like the idea of % based armor modules, but it does disadvantage low HP suits.
And by "disadvantage", you mean... People would have to play low HP suits... as low HP suits. This is a problem?? Only to people who like abusing low hp suits to be out of their class. Ummmm...no. I'm not sure why so many scouts have a problem with it, but I think the assult scout is an entirely viable playstyle. While most of my fits have between 200 and 300 EHP, I also have a number of 'tanked' fits for assault work that range from 400-550 EHP. Because sometimes that's what I need. I'm still a low HP suit, just not 'look in my direction and I die' low.
% increase on select modules while retaining a straight bonus on other modules increases options, while making all modules % based decreases options. The loss of diversity is a bad thing.
To elucidate, have some maths.
Using current armor modules and the GAL scout and sentinel suits to compare.
GAL scout base armor: 162.5 (130*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 756.5 (162.5+4(135*1.1)) increase: 465.5%
GAL sentinel base armor: 656.25 (525*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 1250.25 (656.25+4(135*1.1)) increase: 190.5%
In this situation, the GAL scout goes from having 1/4 the HP of a heavy, to having 6/10 of the HP of a heavy. I think most people could reaonsably agree that 750HP before including shields (232.7 stacking complex extenders) may be excessive on a light suit.
Now, using % increase module only (and modules giving a 20% increase on base total only to keep it roughly in line with the current heavy increase, and no stacking penalty or skill bonus).
GAL scout base armor: 162.5 (130*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 292.5 (162.5+4(162.5*0.2)) increase: 180%
GAL sentinel base armor: 656.25 (525*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 1181.25 (656.25+4(656.25*0.2)) increase: 180%
In this case, the scout remains at 1/4 the health of the heavy.
As you can see, putting armor modules on a scout at all becomes completely useless, regardless of the type of module. Not only does this remove what is a reaononable playstyle through over-nerfing assault scouts, it additional removes the purpose for any other scout to fit armor at all. A 32.5 HP increase is not worth the fitting costs and speed decrease for a complex module, while fitting any lower tier module results in effectively no increase. Thus reducing fitting diversity for the class as a whole in the attempt to try and balance a single fit type.
Now, on the other hand, have a look at a situation where fero and reactive plates retain their straight bonus, while the plate module gains the % bonus. Example just using complex ferro to maximise HP.
GAL scout base armor: 162.5 (130*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 492.5 (162.5+4(75*1.1)) increase: 300%
GAL sentinel base armor: 656.25 (525*1.25) low slots: 4 theoretical max: 1181.25 (656.25+4(656.25*0.2)) increase: 180%
While there is still a significant jump in the EHP of the scout, and it's worthwhile to fit armor, the change is no where near as significant. The GAL scout goes form 1/4 the HP of the heavy, to having 4/10. This reduces the ability of the scout to hard tank, while not removing the ability entirely, and additionally makes fitting alternate plate modules (ferro or reactive) worthwhile, which currently are next to useless. Scouts can still play as assault, but they will be properly light assault.
This would seem to me to be a more even handed solution, which does not disadvantage all scouts for the sake of a few. the numbers on the ferro and reactive plates may need to be reconsidered, but leaving them as a straight bonus makes them useful to lower HP suits, while high HP suits can still properly tank by making use of % based armor plate modules.
In effect, create a middle ground instead of pushing suits to extremes.
Hopefully that explains my position more fully.
And just as an addendum, I deliberately didn't compare the Assault/Medium suits in this post. Due to their relatively low starting numbers, they are inherently unbalanced against light suits when it comes to HP. Using the above maths and the current armor plate modules, a GAL scout can reach 9/10 of the HP of the GAL assault. There is limited reason to run the GAL assault as it stands, and a change to % modules will harm them in exactly the same way as the scouts, as their base HP are close enough to the scout to make almost no difference.
Knowledge is power
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Matticus Monk
Ordus Trismegistus
1602
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Posted - 2014.04.09 00:46:00 -
[12988] - Quote
^^ Excellent post.
I'd love to see something like this - % base for armor modules, with ferro/reactive retaining straight up armor HP boosts.
Double posting like a Kaiser.
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Murt Lesp
Leviathan Battalion
161
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Posted - 2014.04.09 01:55:00 -
[12989] - Quote
The current event ends at the next downtime, right?
The Leviathan has Awoken and in hungers
That was an Execution - Pistol Headshot Kill
Sitting on a hill, ready to kill
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
1003
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Posted - 2014.04.09 02:00:00 -
[12990] - Quote
Murt Lesp wrote:The current event ends at the next downtime, right?
Yes
Looking for the scout hangout?
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