Skillup

?

I am skilled up? I have like 12 million SP. The problem is not me. The problem is what this game will look like to people thinking about playing the game. There is nothing that I can spec into to fix the bluky strafe speed mechanics.

If the game is bulky with boring shooting mechanics people won't play it. So far I have never gotten into one gun fight that got my adrenaline going or afterwards I was think "that was epic".

Please people don't try and make this about me. This about the future of dust.

last build was for strafers but people cried

last build was for strafers but people cried

sorry, but it doesnt work that way.....if you wanna move faster mod up or go with a lighter dropsuit...dont like getting splashed to death? wear a walking tank.....


whether the game needs an overall change to movement speed or not, i think CCP has found a sweet spot and it shouldnt be changed. Heavies arent supposed to be sprinters. I actually appreciate what they have done with heavies moving slower while charging forge guns. I say that being a forge gun user. it just makes sense. Would like the charge indicator back tho.

How ya gonna feel when we get EW and someone throws a webifier at you and you suddenly cant move and get absolutely buttraped by some guy lol. itll probably happen to all of us sooner or later

You are looking at it from a tank drivers perspective though. How it will benefit you. Not how the game mechanics will effect the success of the game.

um...no im not....read the post you just quoted.

In addition, you dont have to walk around on the ground 100% of the time to know how these mechanics work. No one starts out being a tank driver.....

um...no im not....read the post you just quoted.

In addition, you dont have to walk around on the ground 100% of the time to know how these mechanics work. No one starts out being a tank driver.....

You can tell me to get in a tank all you want. That doesn't adress the issue with the bulky gun mechanics of this game. I did read the post. You don't want heavies to have a speed boost so it won't effect your tank camping.

i never told you to get in a tank.....in my first post talking about a walking tank i meant the amarr heavy suit....

and to noc, yes i agree. i also used militia tanks but you cant always have a tank out, so i use my heavy.
sometimes i still use militias to test the vehicle queue, hate losing money to that ****.

Sorry I misread. Heavy suit does need a speed boost.

CCP do not handhold people with large amounts of aim assist and slow strafe speeds. God forbid this games gun mechanics actually take skill.

The whole point of the heavy is that its slow and bulky......if you NEED more speed use a speed mod, thats why there are skills and market assets you can buy for speed.....

your complaining about something that already has a solution you wont use

edit: if you dont like that.....well sorry bud, there are no god suits in this game

In replication redlining was virtually nonexistent. (there were a few isolated occasions where it did happen, but that was one side might have been stacked with good players. Replication was fast and very in your face in terms of action. Tears started flowing on the forums that people were moving too fast and nobody would stay still so a care bear could get a kill. Generally speaking eveybody liked the strafing speeds because it gave the game identity and was different from every other game on the market that caters to ADS play.

CareBears claimed DUST was supposed to be this "tactical" team based shooter almost akin to something you would find in a SOCOM trailer.

E3 build comes gameplay is slowed down people can't strafe as well as they could last build. So what happens? Redlining happens. People quit out of games or resort to sniping behind the redline. Matches are one sided and this game becomes boring.

In replication redlining was virtually nonexistent. (there were a few isolated occasions where it did happen, but that was one side might have been stacked with good players. Replication was fast and very in your face in terms of action. Tears started flowing on the forums that people were moving too fast and nobody would stay still so a care bear could get a kill. Generally speaking eveybody liked the strafing speeds because it gave the game identity and was different from every other game on the market that caters to ADS play.

CareBears claimed DUST was supposed to be this "tactical" team based shooter almost akin to something you would find in a SOCOM trailer.

E3 build comes gameplay is slowed down people can't strafe as well as they could last build. So what happens? Redlining happens. People quit out of games or resort to sniping behind the redline. Matches are one sided and this game becomes boring.

That was a typo. I meant to say heavy doesn't, sorry.

EDIT-I'm full of fail today. First a misread and then a type. MY BAD.

Redlining happens because Plateau snowballs to hell in the first 60 seconds and despite militia drop uplinks, somehow they get left with one spawn, and it is a very crappy spawn. It isn't the new speed, which is virtually identical except for heavies.

Redlining happens because Plateau snowballs to hell in the first 60 seconds and despite militia drop uplinks, somehow they get left with one spawn, and it is a very crappy spawn. It isn't the new speed, which is virtually identical except for heavies.

I'm actually wondering what kind of shooter CCP wants to turn this into mechanics wise, because I've never heard any statements about this. Do they want a 'quick fast paced twitch shooter' or do they want a 'slow bulky shoot for hours on end shooter'? Genuine question.

NO SIR REDLINING HAPPENS BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU USE TANKS AND THERE IS NO DEFENSE FOR THAT EXCEPT FOR SPECING OUT IN THINGS THAT ARE EITHER BORING OR TOO EXPENSIVE

As far as the mechanics go. Dust is high health strafe and shoot fps. The strafe speed is really low and the health is really high.. (unless you are a scout.) This doesn't sit well with me. Health and strafe speed needs to be tweaked so the gun fights are a little bit smoother and gun game takes more skill. I'm not saying I want the health lowered. That would be a bad thing. I would like to see the strafe speed raised a little bit so that the game play runs smoother with how much health you have.

A lot of my gun fights turn into me aiming down sight holding R1 and getting a kill. If I strafe to much, it just takes the sight off the enemy. Allowing the target to hit me if he has good gun game. (of course you have to strafe in cqc.)

While dust itself might be deep and complex. The gun mechanics are not. A lot of people talk about the game being bulky but they can't really come up with a way to fix it or what the problem is.

Make this into a real strafe and shoot fps. What we are playing now just feels to slow and bulky.

Plateau's is a flawed map, but redlining is what happens when gameplay is slowed down.

MAG 2.0 beta vs. 2.0 retail is a prime example of this.

MAG 2.0 beta gameplay was incredibly fast and most games really felt like a true struggle. People begin to QQ and cry about gameplay being too fast for them although it catered to both players that can't do anything but ADS and also those that like to both hipfire and ADS.

MAG 2.0 retail rolls around and redlining is alive and well.

When gameplay is slowed down players play much more defensively and allows for people to camp much easier.

omni go away

you dont have to YELL

APOLOGIES I GET EMOTIONAL okay that was just caps lock

as much as dumbing down the game would kill Dust, so would turning it into tribes.....there is definitely a sweet spot.

for those lurkers out there....it was to get my point across....not trying to speed up the game to ridiculous amounts.

Replication was the sweet spot. If gameplay isn't sped up in the next build DS3 users aren't going to have much of a chance against KB+M players and the game will fail because people wanted it to play like a SOCOM trailer. (used for advertisement purposes only)

Personally, i find the strafe speed to be good at this point, as last build you were able to strafe ads to fast, as idk if anyone here actually has done that, but u cant run and stafe while ads fast like you could build. This build allowes good strafe speed for hipfire and reduced for ads firing which it should. Either skill into a scout suit to get upclose and hipfire or make each shot count while adsNot saying dont have skill, as have seen u play, but i think movement speed is actually one of the things i find that work really well

Personally, i find the strafe speed to be good at this point, as last build you were able to strafe ads to fast, as idk if anyone here actually has done that, but u cant run and stafe while ads fast like you could build. This build allowes good strafe speed for hipfire and reduced for ads firing which it should. Either skill into a scout suit to get upclose and hipfire or make each shot count while adsNot saying dont have skill, as have seen u play, but i think movement speed is actually one of the things i find that work really well

i agree, i think that the movement speed is fine in this build. proto, you cant say the game will break once KBM comes into play cause we havenst seen it implemented yet. you want more speed, get a lighter suit or mods and skills

You can't skill into anything to fix the bulky strafe speed mechanics.

skills and mods dont affect strafe speed?

Well then just nerf strafe speed. (it already is) Then buff actual strafe speed. Problem solved. It doesn't need to be "quake speeds". But is shouldn't be CoD strafe speeds either imho.

Higher strafe speed is a necessity. Just like having a gun or having a HUD.

One thing need to remember is strafe speed isnt constant like in CoD. Strafe speed DOES depend on your dropsuit, hence scouts are strafe fast, assault/logi med, and heavies dont strafe much since they are supposed to soak up bullets essentially

very good point. heavy suits play differently and you have to accept that play styles are different for each type of suit. If you are unwilling to be that complex in your gameplay then you just gonna have to accept that disadvantage.

Well then just nerf strafe speed. (it already is) Then buff actual strafe speed. Problem solved. It doesn't need to be "quake speeds". But is shouldn't be CoD strafe speeds either imho.

If you can create "virtual cover" just by wagging back and forth on the left thumbstick, then 90% of the map design is just backdrop for your "elite'" gunfights. We have mixed arms and cover, and sprint mods. You are SIGNIFICANTLY more stable from a nearly immobile stance, but no prone. This means they want good mobility between fights, but you shouldn't be dodging bullets unless you are scout vs heavy. And even then one mistake and the scout is spaghetti. You don't have to like it, but crossing open terrain is supposed to be very dangerous. That is why the defender spawn in Plateau is SO bad - completely open without cover.

not necessarily that is pure opinion. maybe CCP wants low strafe speed as a fundamental game mechanic

I wouldn't see why they would want that though. Its not really not a good formula for a high health fps imo. Watch the E3 trailer. The strafe speed is much higher. I am actually quite confident that they just lowered the strafe speeds until they fix hit detection.

I guess we will have to wait and see.

I wouldn't see why they would want that though. Its not really not a good formula for a high health fps imo. Watch the E3 trailer. The strafe speed is much higher. I am actually quite confident that they just lowered the strafe speeds until they fix hit detection.

I guess we will have to wait and see.

What we have right now is COD in space in terms of strafe speeds

that my very well be the case, as its the best fixit they could have done without having to do an overhaul of the hit detection.

i am just of the opinion that all this strafing in open ground bullshit is stupid and people need to learn to use cover. Strafe speed is eralistic and fine. Use a lighter suit or deal with the current speeds. There are no god suits here....

nice post, its hard to understand why people complain about strafing speed when any good soldier would laugh at you trying to strafe back and forth in a gunfight instead of using cover....Realize that maybe the way you play is not the most efficient and that the realism CCP is striving for might bite you in the ass a lil bit

Head glitching behind cover is still very much a tactic in strafe and shoot fps. I see people doing it all the time. Not always effectively but they sure do try it a lot.

Realism arguments are negated since we are playing a scifi shooter with regenerating shield, lasers, and armor. When it comes to videogames gameplay trumps realism unless you are looking for authenticity. If CCP was looking for realism when I shoot at the treads on a tank after a certain damage threshold it should become immobile and even inoperable. Or when I drop gets shot in one of the thrusters it loses handling.

Shielding is cover in this game.

Slower game speeds has promoted the pile of crap that has been the E3 build of this game.

Realism arguments are negated since we are playing a scifi shooter with regenerating shield, lasers, and armor. When it comes to videogames gameplay trumps realism unless you are looking for authenticity. If CCP was looking for realism when I shoot at the treads on a tank after a certain damage threshold it should become immobile and even inoperable. Or when I drop gets shot in one of the thrusters it loses handling.

Shielding is cover in this game.

Slower game speeds has promoted the pile of crap that has been the E3 build of this game.

last build was for strafers but people cried

last build was for strafers but people cried

last build was for strafers but people cried

not necessarily that is pure opinion. maybe CCP wants low strafe speed as a fundamental game mechanic

Regardless of how futuristic the game is or how chaotic the battlefield will be, running in open territory on a whim should be discouraged and mercs should have to actually think. Raising the skill cap here. In any post i make here i will be coming from the opinion that complexity is better.

basically, "think before you act"

I don't really understand this post considering I can run across open terrain and just turn on any scrub that tries to shoot me in the back. Ccp made the health high so that skill is a more of a factor. In CoD If someone sneezes on you your dead.

So I am a bit confused by this post.

Still I don't think movement speeds should be nerfed in the name of complexity considering this is a high health complex strafe and shoot fps. Strafe speed adds to the complexity of gun fights therefor making dust a more complex game.

If I just wanted to blast people and head glitch behind cover, I would go play any other console fps.

You fundamentally don't understand* FPS games that aren't about circle strafing it seems.

*understand as in comprehend the playstyle and those who enjoy it

Shields are for people who don't take damage often or a warning layer for beefier guys to turn and engage a threat. Cover is for cover.

im not saying nerf speeds, im saying leave them as they are. I am not saying you need to hide behind cover like gears of war, i am simply saying circle strafing as an overall tactic is shenanigans.

why is having high health, tactical gameplay out of the question? We already have vehicle warfare with EW and orbital strikes. youve got enough to worry about already. You dont need to add to it by doing things that anybody whos ever fought wouldnt do in real life.

Okay, so your not risking your life cause its a game....fine, but you are risking your fittings which will be a lot more expensive soon. you can look at it the same way.

MAG COD and BF aren't circle strafers buddy. They are primarily ADS shooters.

Shields are cover in this game. If it wasn't for shields i guarantee people wouldn't run across the map without worrying about getting blown up.

Understand that a high strafing speed makes a good game that takes skill. A realistic game would be really boring and take no skill. Two shots to kill everyone. One shot extremely wounded.

lol interesting.....

edit: see how i added to that by quoting you?

Then CCP want the game to fail.
Enjoy.

JaZZa CCP wanting this game to fail is already evident by the fact the game is grind2win.

>>>>ADS shooter and circle strafing might as well be the same thing.
I'm sorry but I am going to have trouble taking anything else you say after that seriously.

One thing ive still yet to seeanyone address from my post is the idea of strafe ads vs hip. As like i said, whther is realistic or tactical, you shouldnt be strafing running in circles while you are in ads, hence the term ADS meaning you are trying to be pinpoint accurate, and running around in circles would negate the idea. At that point you would want to hipfire from normal ads ranges as that allows for your faster movements.

As i said, movements speed is fine now, as if you want to run around fast, use scouts & smgs which are mean to be hipfired essentially. Even CCP has said (i believe), that want people to play smart & use cover. Thats why we have buildings with lots of "trailers" to run around and hide behind for protection. If they wnated us to simply strafe our way out of battles theyd have less cover to be used.

But thats just my. 02

I'm done here Noc Tempre lost

, I bow down before your magnificence. .

I am pretty sure I addressed that. Nerf ADS strafe speed and then just put strafe speed back to what it was last build. Problem solved. You can't strafe your way out of anything if you can't aim. The person who has the better aim will win. Its all about skill. Since the game is already G2W lets at least make the gun fights about skill not corner camping/Cod tactics/camping. Thats lame imho.

Go back to CoD if you want a low strafe speed game TROLLOLOLOL

I jest.

If address it i missed it, as typing all this on my phone. Personally i find ads strafe speed to be perfect. The downside i see to increasing hipfire strafe, is that it will cater WAY to much to scouts. If they run adv/proto smgs, id say just about veryone will be donezo, as they are already are really hard to hit in a cqb situation, and with how fast RE can be SET (even with timer going into place), by time they set do a circle, they'll be able to set it off. Thats why i like how hipfire strafe is now. Overall i find the strafing gives everyone a good chance in all situations.

If heavy is caught in open w/o cover by assault he is in trouble. Scout catches heavy in cqb, heavy in trouble. Assault catches scout in midrange, he is in trouble, etc ... in all situaitons at moment, strafing can be effetctive whether its hipfire or ads; by altering it, it could cause more gameplay problems

you should tbqh

LOL

btw where is the real omnipotent one? Haven't seen him on the leader boards. zitro and lilmamaJ are moejoe wannabes.

This thread is a classic

Make this into a real strafe and shoot fps. What we are playing now just feels to slow and bulky.

Clearly CCP doesnt want the game to fail. You dont have to like complex battle simulators.....theres always arcade style shooters for ya bud.

edit: aimed at JaZZa01

The replication build was exactly this. But people complained because its wasn't "fast" enough. The result is what we have today. Ironically many of the people who complained left anyway.

IMHO the sights and hip fire in Replication for assault rifles was about right. E3 build totally sucks.

In addition to what's been said above. The E3 build and it's slower gameplay has lead to a defensive style of play which favors camping and promotes redlining. Last build redlining could happen and it was much worse than what we have now considering you could basically sit right on top of people as they spawn into the game. However though it wasn't prevalent because the gameplay was fast enough that matches could end up in a real struggle.

who needs ADS?

skill up sharpshooter and hipfire all the way across the map.

seems legit.

So you are complaining basically that because it is easier to kill what you are actually aiming at with the improved (still not fixed) hit detection is a bad thing? Is that what I'm really reading? You seem to attribute no credit to the insanely open map. In case you forgot, it was trivially easy to box attackers into the craterlake spawn and butcher them mercilessly there, and that was back when dropships couldn't dodge swarms and no militia uplinks. I think you have a bad memory of last build, but saying the game is worse off due to improved hit detection simply blows my mind.

somebody said ADS and circle stafing were the same thing. I declared that "X" person lost and left the thread.

You're posts aren't taken seriously after you said ADS and circle strafing were the same thing. Please leave this thread kind sir cause you lost.

I'm still trying to figure this out.

Strafing gameplay:
Find fastest armor available
Find bullet hose gun with high DPS that's only good in CQC to medium range.
Dance around target while jumping like a sugar plumb fairy
Beg for increased hip firing accuracy

equals "better" gameplay? More "pro" gameplay? "superior" gamplay?

However, taking time to aim down sight, land 7 to 10 shots at center mass and register a kill from distance = "bad", "inferior", "camper", gameplay?

Sounds to me like the aforementioned "pro" FPS strafing style is for twitch ridden ADD 12 year olds and the latter would be for the adults in the room.

I really didn't want to come back to this beta until they did another build as I really don't like this map all that much. But if I have to keep coming back here to keep you circle strafing jag offs from turning this game into a run and gun POS like you want...if you want to turn this into MAG 2 + extra speed, then I'll make sure I stick around to offer a counterpoint.

Mojoe, Piggy, and the rest of the kills over wins, grims over hours, and KDR whores are what helped to kill off any kind of meta for that game and turned into a stale piece of garbage like every other FPS I've seen come down the pike.

I'd prefer not to see you idiots do it with this one too.

ADS = Advanced Dodging Skills?

I'm still trying to figure this out.

Strafing gameplay:
Find fastest armor available
Find bullet hose gun with high DPS that's only good in CQC to medium range.
Dance around target while jumping like a sugar plumb fairy
Beg for increased hip firing accuracy

equals "better" gameplay? More "pro" gameplay? "superior" gamplay?

However, taking time to aim down sight, land 7 to 10 shots at center mass and register a kill from distance = "bad", "inferior", "camper", gameplay?

Sounds to me like the aforementioned "pro" FPS strafing style is for twitch ridden ADD 12 year olds and the latter would be for the adults in the room.

Don't worry crimson its just ignorance.

not reading this entire argument but agree with proto on the 1st few pages of points he laid down

strafe speed last build was good, ppl sucked and cried cuz they couldnt hit **** and the strafe speed was the only thing that was gonna help even the odds on the whole ds3 vs kb/m but since its nerfed keyboard warriors will have the upper hand and yes slower strafe speed and movement speed generally makes ppl play more cautiously and camp more

lolno

Last build nothing worked and hit detection/frame rate issues and lag was through the ******* roof hence why scout suits never took damage and bunny hopped all over the ******* place

Even in this build hit detection is still off and scout suits benefit once again because of how fast they still move

The build is fine for me, speed is good and camping is mostly in vehicles tbh

ADS = Advanced Dodging Skills?

Damage grows faster than health and has a higher ceiling. So skill up is in fact the answer. Prototype vs prototype fights end faster than militia vs militia.

not for smgs those things are way up against proto suits. Not that I mind but with out dmg mods smgs are next to useless vs proto.

proto......

i dont even.......

no.


if you think circle strafing in open ground is good gun game you need to read tactics 101

if you think you should be able to ADS while running/strafing, read reality 101

if neither of these things is what you were implying in the above threads, sorry i just woke up

what part of being able to hold L1 and land 7 to 10 shots on a slow moving target takes skill?
holdin L1 and landing it on a fast moving target sure but slow? lol @ u
some of u ppl with little to no competitive fps knowledge and background talk like u know what represents skill in a shooter

KZ2 had the BEST use of ADS of ANY game yet
while alot of u think its "realistic" to be runnin with ur gun to ur face looking down the sights and being super accurate kz2 did it RIGHT....ADS was ONLY really useful when u stood STILL and for long range shots and u couldnt even spray u had to single shot or burst at mid range

also even tho we call it "hip fire" if u actually look at someones character who is not holding ADS the gun is actually NOT at their HIP but at their shoulder, so its more shoulder fire only lmgs and heavy weapons are actually by the hip and KZ2 was like this as well the gun was actually shoulder height

ima fix my earlier post by saying obviously you can run while ADS, but it sure wont be accurate.

Im a proud owner of 17 firearms and i can tell you you dont accurately shoot down the sight while running. Unless your a freaking spec ops killing machine.

Which, just to be argumentative at this point, DUST mercs are such freaking spec ops killing machines.

i was thinking that during my typing of the message and would agree.

im sure everyone would agree tho that ADS gunfights during a mutual circle strafe is shenanigans

If you were a spec ops killing machine, you wouldn't need to ADS while running...

One of my friends shot a clay pigeon from hip fire, and he was just trying to look cool. Imagine being trained with guns day in and day out... You'd be insane.

You gotta understand where I'm coming from. I'm an fps shooter that wants skill over everything else in the game. Most experienced shooters will agree that it is harder to hit someone when they are moving faster, therefore it takes more skill to hit someone while they are moving fast. We also need low bullet damage(which is pretty good in this game) so we can turn on the people with less skill then us.

Just because I'm strafing doesn't mean I'm not behind cover.

I'm still on the defense about tanks. I mean I can't really go anywhere because I will get destroyed by tanks. With dropships I'm 100% screwed because now i REALLY have nowhere to hide.

The go and destroy it yourself mentality has always been crap. If I was a completely awful fps I would gladly destroy all tanks and noobships. Since I try to specialize in killing people and going for and defending objectives, I can't really take out tanks or dropships. The tanks are more do-able with my remote explosives, but dropships are just insane. They were OP in Dark Night Rises, they are OP here.

not reading this entire argument but agree with proto on the 1st few pages of points he laid down

strafe speed last build was good, ppl sucked and cried cuz they couldnt hit **** and the strafe speed was the only thing that was gonna help even the odds on the whole ds3 vs kb/m but since its nerfed keyboard warriors will have the upper hand and yes slower strafe speed and movement speed generally makes ppl play more cautiously and camp more

You gotta understand where I'm coming from. I'm an fps shooter that wants skill over everything else in the game. Most experienced shooters will agree that it is harder to hit someone when they are moving faster, therefore it takes more skill to hit someone while they are moving fast. We also need low bullet damage(which is pretty good in this game) so we can turn on the people with less skill then us.

Just because I'm strafing doesn't mean I'm not behind cover.

I'm still on the defense about tanks. I mean I can't really go anywhere because I will get destroyed by tanks. With dropships I'm 100% screwed because now i REALLY have nowhere to hide.

The go and destroy it yourself mentality has always been crap. If I was a completely awful fps I would gladly destroy all tanks and noobships. Since I try to specialize in killing people and going for and defending objectives, I can't really take out tanks or dropships. The tanks are more do-able with my remote explosives, but dropships are just insane. They were OP in Dark Night Rises, they are OP here.

In playing with you, and some of the others top guys in the beta and prior experience, you simply CANT have a game based on pure skill. It sounds good to those who have it, but for everyone else, you essen5ially alienate probably 90% of the possible community, as those who arent to your skill level will probably lose 99/100 times.

Im not saying dumb it down, but it needs to be able to cater to a bigger community. This game already may take hits based on final graphis (as cod fanboys will compare it), the indepth game play and time required (as this generatiom is run bby12yr olds who want to run and gun and get all the OP gear ina day or two). By allowing to have at least the mechanics suit everyones needs, it will help the game in numbers.

As ive said in all my posts, i find the strafing to work fine now, as it gives u enough ability to dodge a few bullets and hit others. As need to remember, everyone should have a chance to wina gun fight, as you have guns/gear/skill to also affect outcomes. if not, you'll turn new people off to the game right away as what new person will say in a game where they have no chance to get a kill based on skills/game mechanics,/weaponary/gear?

Crimson, you clearly don't know what "bulky" means, so please stop using it or use it correctly.

"Bulky" means that something is large or takes up a lot of space. A big suitcase is bulky. A mattress is bulky. A heavy winter coat is bulky Gameplay is not.

In playing with you, and some of the others top guys in the beta and prior experience, you simply CANT have a game based on pure skill. It sounds good to those who have it, but for everyone else, you essen5ially alienate probably 90% of the possible community, as those who arent to your skill level will probably lose 99/100 times.

Im not saying dumb it down, but it needs to be able to cater to a bigger community. This game already may take hits based on final graphis (as cod fanboys will compare it), the indepth game play and time required (as this generatiom is run bby12yr olds who want to run and gun and get all the OP gear ina day or two). By allowing to have at least the mechanics suit everyones needs, it will help the game in numbers.

As ive said in all my posts, i find the strafing to work fine now, as it gives u enough ability to dodge a few bullets and hit others. As need to remember, everyone should have a chance to wina gun fight, as you have guns/gear/skill to also affect outcomes. if not, you'll turn new people off to the game right away as what new person will say in a game where they have no chance to get a kill based on skills/game mechanics,/weaponary/gear?

The 90% will only get outplayed 10% of the time. That seems fine to me. 99/100 times is just fail math on your part.

Actually it isnt failed math, i was saying by altering to cater to the needs of the elite u will alienate 90% of the community, which in no means equates to being out played 10% of the times. And my 99/100 means the elite 10% would beat the other 90% of the community 99% of the time if cater to the needs of the elite. In ANY game, you need to cater to the iddle, as it allows for more to play. And is just good business

Yet CCP wants listened to the cries of the minority and decides to add M+KB support.

Why would you ever cater to casuals? You're giving handouts and freebees to people who don't deserve it. Don't let CCP hold your hand like Treyarch and Infinity Ward do. This is what society has come to. A bunch of lazy people who expect to be gifted everything.

As far as the mechanics go. Dust is high health strafe and shoot fps. The strafe speed is really low and the health is really high.. (unless you are a scout.) This doesn't sit well with me. Health and strafe speed needs to be tweaked so the gun fights are a little bit smoother and gun game takes more skill. I'm not saying I want the health lowered. That would be a bad thing. I would like to see the strafe speed raised a little bit so that the game play runs smoother with how much health you have.

A lot of my gun fights turn into me aiming down sight holding R1 and getting a kill. If I strafe to much, it just takes the sight off the enemy. Allowing the target to hit me if he has good gun game. (of course you have to strafe in cqc.)

While dust itself might be deep and complex. The gun mechanics are not. A lot of people talk about the game being bulky but they can't really come up with a way to fix it or what the problem is.

Make this into a real strafe and shoot fps. What we are playing now just feels to slow and bulky.

who needs ADS?

skill up sharpshooter and hipfire all the way across the map.

seems legit.

I really enjoyed the strafiness of the last build, had a lot of fun fights. I think this build supports tactical group play a bit better(if only there was group play).

Two ways to nerf strafiness are lower lateral velocity and increased suit inertia. It feels like CCP adjusted both of these - slower speed and greater inertia. I think they could adjust them back just a bit toward what they were last build.

But to address the 'bulky' isssue: I think most of the bulky feel comes from poor controls, not reduced strafiness. Slow and inconsistent weapon swapping, the annoying wheel, slow 'nade tosses, inability to interrupt animations, losing sprint everytime you get airborne, losing scope when you reload, having to hit R1 twice because you pressed it before the animation completed, and more issues which we're all too familiar with.

Anyway, my point is fixing these thing would go a long way towards giving the game a lighter, sweeter feel.

Man I have to wonder how loud all these 'gun game' aficionados are going to cry once they add in stasis webs.

Semantics and nitpicking. Thanks for adding to the discussion.

I'm sorry, but after seeing you use the same word incorrectly dozens of times in one thread, I felt I had to point out that you don't know what the word means.

And no, it's not just semantics or nitpicking. I didn't know what the hell you meant, since that word makes no sense in that context. I had to try to figure out from context what you meant, and I'm still not entirely sure.

Yet CCP wants listened to the cries of the minority and decides to add M+KB support.

your complaining about not maintaining your scope when your reload? really?

Lurch, I know it seems ridiculously nitpicky, but it's like sprinting after catching air or pressing R1 a little too soon after reloading - the game doesn't register the button press. Plain and simple: bad control mechanics.

Lurch, I know it seems ridiculously nitpicky, but it's like sprinting after catching air or pressing R1 a little too soon after reloading - the game doesn't register the button press. Plain and simple: bad control mechanics.

I don't know how I missed this thread. +1 on everything you've said crimson.
Regarding the audience they're after see here. I dont know how many times I have to put out this link... Everyone should realise, this game isn't for the EvE terribads. It's for te console FPS player, with a bit of extra support for kb/m ect.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/04/29/dust-514-promises-to-be-a-game-changer-an-interview-with-ccp-games-ceo-hilmar-petersson
Strafe speed is currently too low IMHO. Last build was fun. This is not.
Note in that link, Dust wasn't going to be linked with EvE. Needs to be a game in itself really then doesn't it. Which means changes.

IDust is an FPS for console FPS players. If it fails in this aspect then CCP have failed in their mission. Lurch, you are not helping them succeed. For goodness sake you just run tanks and heavy suits. Really what can you add to discussions about strafe speed ect? "your opinion" is actually counter productive for the DEVs .

This game is going to fail if the gunplay isn't like replication once KB+M support is introduced.

interesting post but no matter how much you hope and pray, skill will not be the end all be all in this game. Period.

Money and corporations win.

HOWEVER, if your really into skill fights, then the gladiator arena with eSports is your place to be, cause that will have a preset listing of rules. Understand that all my posts are coming from the point of view where we are all in a contracted corporation battle.

I really enjoyed the strafiness of the last build, had a lot of fun fights. I think this build supports tactical group play a bit better(if only there was group play).

Your assumption of the majority of people joining DUST being from the console shooter community is a huge leap.

I hate to say this but the OP is trying to turn dust into something its not.

I adjusted my play style to the current as you put it "Bulky strafe mechanics" and you know what I noticed. I was fighting the way real troops do. Moving forward cautiously. Moving from cover to cover. Trying to check the map for intel. Moving with allies.

No one is running around the map pwning people with luck based spray and pray dodging. And personally I prefer it that way. Slower paced gives people a chance to strategize instead of: "OH I dodged more you loose!"

I wish I had a more constructive way of defending the current movement controls but that about sums up my feelings.

The OP continues to say the same thing over and over again: I dont prefer the current movement mechanics I want them to be faster paced."

Thats a request and an opinion not an argument.

Without faster strafing speeds KB+M players are going to dominate DS3 users.

Without faster strafing speeds KB+M players are going to dominate DS3 users.

lol @ ppl saying strafe speed was fine in the last build

Last build was broke from top to ******* bottom how can you say it was any good when ppl jumped across the screen because of framerate and lag?

Not as strong as with Lurch. Atleast Larheon posts constructive views instead of saying this is EvE on foot.

Alas we are to flipping bored since we cant shoot each other.

What I find very interesting is the fact that all those OP that continue to bash what we have been so graciously presented and invited to provide input to are continuously comparing it to the products of Activision and Electronic Arts. Both of these companies couldn't really give a rat's as* about the requests and input from their potential players and produce and release exactly what it is THEY want, not what their community is requesting or demanding.

I understand why people continue to compare there last 6 years of game with this one, it is the natural way humans figure what is good and what is bad: comparative analysis. Yet this is not a good enough reason, at least in my eyes, to continue to do so. Not to mention, and I have yet to see anyone to really touch upon this, the fact that you are attempting to compare 3 very different gaming engines and the application of those engines in the development of a vision. Most betas, like everyone has touched upon, are just glorified PR tools to drum up excitement over a game that just has improved mechanics (hopefully) and graphics (sometimes, just look at Black Ops 2, it looks worse than the first one IMHO). This on the other hand is a completely unique venture n the fact that it is expanding and existing universe while bridging the means of interaction.

@ Tony Calif: I have been reading your posts for some time. You seem to be unable to separate COD and BF3 from this experience. I understand why that can be so difficult. It is also probably the same set of reason why I REFUSE to play either games anymore. This game is having a TRUE beta, not just a PR stunt. Either you can enjoy it, or not. But the constant bashing is getting old. And i am too old to listen to it.

If this game has even just as much depth on release as what is being presented now, I will be happy. This is especially considering the fact that CCP continuously tinkers with and refines their games. That, I have to say, is very UNLIKE the makers of COD and the BF series. They have had some shinning moments, but the last 4 versions of each of these franchises (which they are used to JUST make money) have shown little growth beyond the development of Frostbite 2 by DICE.

It would seem to me that while you are continue to bash what CCP is attempting to build both in the game and the community, you present this image to me of a major developer, or a fanboy tea bagging them. But I guess everyone has their place in life.

@OP: I only hope that some of you find the wisdom to see the potential of what is begin presented and ultimately will be handed over to us. Once the actual game finally releases, this is going to be a game that we will watch evolve and mutate much like life itself, and that is part of the experience that CCP brings to the table that other developers wish they could. This is not to say that CCP has not had their short comings between what the promise in comparison to what they deliver, but such is life. What they have done is involve their community of players a hell of a lot more than any other game company I have had the pleasure and displeasure to interact with.

This is not me tea bagging CCP, just being realizing of the potential of the game, the vision and intention of the company, and of the community.

Higher strafe speed is a necessity. Just like having a gun or having a HUD.

+ 1
bring back strafe speed.

Game just feels slow now even with 3 x proto kinetics loaded

Fast mobility promotes good gun game lurch. Come to the fps side lurch. We are more elite and we have cookies.

................cookies?

1. High strafe speed takes more skill because it is harder to hit someone who is strafing. This makes aiming harder to do, henceforth more skill.

um....whether or not it makes it harder for someone to hit, and the "skill" differences that brings, the concept of strafing to dodge bullets is silly to me.

Strafing isn't meant to dodge a bullet that is "on target"...
Since it takes several bullets to kill, it's meant to get you out of the line of fire, in the hopes that the opponents aim is off enough to give you time to fire back. Moving targets aren't hard to hit because the bullet is too slow, their hard to hit because the timing of the shooter's aim is tested.

Strafing isn't meant to dodge a bullet that is "on target"...
Since it takes several bullets to kill, it's meant to get you out of the line of fire, in the hopes that the opponents aim is off enough to give you time to fire back. Moving targets aren't hard to hit because the bullet is too slow, their hard to hit because the timing of the shooter's aim is tested.

That means we look at things very differently. Strafing is to stop enemies from hitting you. If you want to run from your enemy you would want faster running speeds. Strafing is basically moving side to side.

Being able to track fast moving targets=skill in fps.

lol i know what strafing is.

Your post also explains why i think its great why speed mods dont affect strafing.

I am not trying to debate the fact that strafing is a legit way of killing an enemy before he kills you.

My points are:

#1 - Strafing speeds are fine as is because it discourages circle strafing, a silly tactic.

#2 - I love circle strafing because its usually in open territory, meaning i can splash you with my railgun from far away.

#3 - You either strafe slowly and utilize more health, or you strafe faster and wear a scout suit. You cant have both. There are no god suits.

#4 - I believe an overall increase to strafe speed is unneeded since most of the problems people are having with fights are due to hitboxing, which when fixed, is going to change the way a lot of you see shootouts.

#5 - DS3 players being at a disadvantage to KB+M players due to strafe speeds is bunk. That is not a movement issue but a control balancing issue, completely different things. CCP is really gonna have to tackle that the right way.

We aren't trying to make this game Quake Live. We want just a bit faster so it takes more skill for the 1v1's. It barely even matters to me because this weekend I will devote my booster and skill points to AV weaponry to show those nub munchkins who's boss.

IKR

I am tired of getting into a gunfight and it consists of me staring at the enemy while he stares at me and we both hold R1. Most of the time all you can do is hope you have more skill points.

Yeah... Very tactical game play indeed.

IKR

I am tired of getting into a gunfight and it consists of me staring at the enemy while he stares at me and we both hold R1. Most of the time all you can do is hope you have more skill points.

Standing in one place and holding R1 is epic game play yo. It gets my adrenaline going.

Yeah... Very tactical game play indeed.

sorry, but it doesnt work that way.....if you wanna move faster mod up or go with a lighter dropsuit...dont like getting splashed to death? wear a walking tank.....


whether the game needs an overall change to movement speed or not, i think CCP has found a sweet spot and it shouldnt be changed. Heavies arent supposed to be sprinters. I actually appreciate what they have done with heavies moving slower while charging forge guns. I say that being a forge gun user. it just makes sense. Would like the charge indicator back tho.

How ya gonna feel when we get EW and someone throws a webifier at you and you suddenly cant move and get absolutely buttraped by some guy lol. itll probably happen to all of us sooner or later

well im sorry thats how you play.......

Circle strafing is a legit tactic and is still quite prevalent in dust. Sorry you think its silly.

The control balance issue is that KB/M is even easier against slow moving targets. How easy do you want this game???

The problem people are having with gun fights is they are boring and slow as ****. Not the hit markers. Hit markers isn't even that much of an issue in this build. So I don't understand what point you are trying to make. Once hit markers are fixed people will play even more defensively because it will be even easier to camp.

You not wanting strafe speeds because they are silly is not a legit reason.

That's how 90% of my medium to long range gun end up. We both just stare at each other and hold R1.

You know if you guys really want to go play dust while the servers are down. Get on an LAN black ops server and put it to 200% health. There you go, have fun playing dust. Minus the tomahawks and killstreaks all that tomfoolery.