Mad because its not an AR?

Crutch much?

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

Mad because its not an AR?

If a MD user has time to fire all 6 rounds at you, which takes over 6 seconds, what were you doing with your main weapon AND sidearm in the meantime???

Honestly,

Your aiming at people feet do you really need 6 shots?

And the AR is the easiest weapon in dust at all ranges.

Actually I am at peoples heads... it just lands at their feet.

And this dead horse again? Really?

The flaylock hasn't been dead a whole day and the AR users are screaming nerf again..

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

Crutch much?

If a MD user has time to fire all 6 rounds at you, which takes over 6 seconds, what were you doing with your main weapon AND sidearm in the meantime???

And the AR is the easiest weapon in dust at all ranges.

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

I guess no one explain to me why a noob tube needs six shots?

Maybe CCP can pipe in

screaming what! who is screaming!

At the end of the day bud, you're using a noob toob and aiming at peoples feet... with 6 shots

Sure it does, it super skill intensive to face smash your jump/spacebar and shoot the ground.

Your not the only one playing I could be killing your teammate or you could be ontop a building spamming shots off only seen this once so far but the guy went 33-0 everytime I shot him he'd run to the middle of the building to where I can't shoot you but you can shoot off from there

You'll kill yourself up close if you're not careful- gets worse the better MD you have.

So teamwork and tactics = nerf now?

So teamwork and tactics = nerf now?

Awesome. Thx for the info Reggie.

The fact of the matter is if you can't kill me on even ground with your duvolle before my freedom kills you, you're not as good as we all (you) think.

Or maybe someone is actually better than you..

Crutch much?

He will go after every weapon in the game that beats him next it will be forge guns or HMG's

How many shots do you think it should have so that it wouldn't be a crutch?

Hey bud how about you put on your big boy pants and attack a Team Player district

and we can see who is better: My Ar or your Noobtube

if not then STFU

Nope havnt died by a hmg this build forgeguns can be annoying but they have to actually hit you but go on mam since you know everything

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

Your not the only one playing I could be killing your teammate or you could be ontop a building spamming shots off only seen this once so far but the guy went 33-0 everytime I shot him he'd run to the middle of the building to where I can't shoot you but you can shoot off from there

I really don't think

Its balanced because I just bad applies to me.

6 shots for a noob tube

4 or 5

Crutch much?

Have you tried using the weapon? Have you tried using it competitively?

The MD isn't exactly an all-powerful weapon IMO, I can get 5x's more kills in a match with an AR, and with less effort too.

The MD excels at being annoying and getting lots of assists, but that is about all it excels at.

Have you tried using the weapon? Have you tried using it competitively?

The MD isn't exactly an all-powerful weapon IMO, I can get 5x's more kills in a match with an AR, and with less effort too.

The MD excels at being annoying and getting lots of assists, but that is about all it excels at.

Your point being?

It's like you guys just won't stop until pinpoint-accurate weapons with no splash damage are the only things left in the game.

Guess it's time to put in sawed-off bolt actions and make this a REAL shooter.

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

He is crying about it because he can't stand being killed by anything that he isn't using himself.

It's simple really. Some people don't have any tolerance for diversity. They won't be happy until they turn DUST into a1v1 dueling match so they can demonstrate their elite shooting skills.

They can't stand the thought of a messy battlefield where they may die because someone got the drop on them with a situational weapon. They rage whenever they die to anyone they don't consider as elite as themselves. They compensate by deriding anything other than their choice of weapon as "noob" weapon. That way they don't have to take responsibility for having died and their fragile ego can remain intact.

The sad thing is that they can actually be quite good shots. Skill doesn't necessarily factor into who is going to fall prey to this way of thinking. In their mind every battle should be an exactly even contest, mano a mano. If you shotgun them in the face or MD them from a roof you are lousy cheating scum who is using a noob weapon to win, because you certainly couldn't beat them if you were using their weapon (like a real man).

The only cure is to realize that DUST is modeling a messy battlefield with many different weapon systems that all have different strengths and weaknesses and if you die to one it doesn't necessarily mean you are "bad" or that your teammates should laugh at you. It shouldn't threaten your ego if you get popped by a shotgun to the face.

Just let the rage go and enjoy the diversity that is DUST.

Then don't let people get close. Stay at range.

Gal logi sorry lol.

semi auto noobtubes are as good an idea as contact nades

semi auto noobtubes are as good an idea as contact nades

Crutch much?

Do you know how hard it is to hit a moving target that's doing the 2 step shuffle with direct damage with a weapon that has an arced to the projectiles flight path? unlike an AR? lmao

Hail king AR, hail AR 514.

Must be what his boss Reg yum told them to say.

no, i make fun of reg's pro AR rants too... just as he trolls me when I talk about HMG's...

difference of opinions... ikr! what a concept!

4 or 5

Hell no! A lot of it isn't opinion. There are a lot of instances where the AR is plainly the wrong weapon to bring to the fight.

Just wondering, whats the furthest range you can fling a mass driver round from say on top of the buildings at delta and echo on the bridge maps? Cause they don't seem to be affected by falloff damage the way ar's are, to the guy who says regnum uses flaylock, lol! He uses smg's you nerd. To the guys talking stats...are you adding in the 130% to armor? The m/d and flux combo is ludicrous because the falloff shield damage is virtually nonexistant at proto levels so you don't have to be remotely accurate to kill with it, just close. So I think it needs a nerf, not sure. Does it suck to get hit by a guy from up top and not have any way of getting away from it because cover doesn't work unless you get underneath something or find cover large enough not to get hit by splash? Oh yeah did I mention his window of vulnerability while shooting that thing is extremely small because you have no charge time? It's pretty annoying.

Forge gunning from god knows where in a pub match when your in a squad of .5-5mill sp players aren't likely to figure out how to counterplay the forger, as the range and the fact it's av is just lolz. The fact it takes a heavy suit with at least 900 ehp to use the thing...is even more frustrating. I spent one game recently spending the whole match trying to counter play 2 forge gunners who managed to get up top on the Towers map. It's frustrating.

(1)MD's can be suppressed long enough to get up to them by a teammate with a TAC AR or Imperial SCR. MD's function as force multipliers on the field and inherently don't have a 1v1 solution to them. Thats kind of the point of tactical shooters not everything has a 1:1 solution nor should it.(2) For arena battles in small map small number situations fine there is a point to be made.
But in 16 v16 HTFU and come up with counters. I hear squashing a MD with a Dropship is quite effective too.

So I have a question..just because I stayed with the Imp tag makes you think I suck and can't get into any good corps? What would make you think that?

Awe, did Ragenum get killed by a Mass Driver? Poor baby.

So I have a question..just because I stayed with the Imp tag makes you think I suck and can't get into any good corps? What would make you think that?

Don't let him jiggle your jollies. You're better than that. Even though I didn't like that stupid llav kill you got on me at the beginning of a game recently (sent ya fanmail) at least you were good enough to use a non explosive based weapon and get 7/1 with some ****** blueberries. o7

Did you ever play in PC battles? Never saw you in any of their videos.

You probably don't even lift. You were just a cheerleader

Lift yeah bro I'm sure I got a lot more muscle than you, didn't you know I quit before pc? Never gave it a shot didn't feel like waiting now I'm back but the rest of imps have left

I see why you where the imps tag then. Your just their cheerleader and want to wear their Letterman's jacket.

Do ARs really need 60 shots? crutch much? Should be 40 rounds.

Was that the game where we were dicking off at the beginning? Someone said teamplayers so I took off ran you over then went assault because I wanted to win but hey you guys are pretty damn good

That's kind of my point Reg, a good ar user will always beat a good MD user unless MD gets the jump, or has high ground/cover. Its situational, at best, yet everyone on their mom, (that apparently means 1337 now too) want to see it die.

The plasma cannon and forge gune are the only things close to what a real "noobtube" is in the game. (Flay was ridiculous too but that was burst damage not OHK, which they didn't really fix..)

I hate all this whinning. Especially from the ppl who go from one OP flavor of the day to the next. Splash damage of MD is matched to slow projectile speed and low ROF, making it only effective for either mid range crowd control or CQC. Now lets talk about AR and its endless clip. You can literally miss half the rounds in a clip and still down a red dot with what's left in the clip. All self respecting FPS have slow projectile high damage RPG type weapons but it's only the BF/COD crowd in Dust who cry about these things.
It's funny when ppl throw terms like 'noob tube' around and apply it to traditionally UP weapons.

lol moron brings PC argument in. Though his corp abused previously flaylocks, contact grenades and forgeguns on rooftops against infantry. Invalid arguments.

You know what I hate? I hate people who get their bum bum spanked out of PC and then come on forums thinking they understand the game

Mass driver is a noob tube

Mass driver has 6 shots

Therefore, a mass driver is a noob tube with 6 shots.


At least with my AR I have to track people not just look at their feet

He is crying about it because he can't stand being killed by anything that he isn't using himself.

It's simple really. Some people don't have any tolerance for diversity. They won't be happy until they turn DUST into a1v1 dueling match so they can demonstrate their elite shooting skills.

They can't stand the thought of a messy battlefield where they may die because someone got the drop on them with a situational weapon. They rage whenever they die to anyone they don't consider as elite as themselves. They compensate by deriding anything other than their choice of weapon as "noob" weapon. That way they don't have to take responsibility for having died and their fragile ego can remain intact.

The sad thing is that they can actually be quite good shots. Skill doesn't necessarily factor into who is going to fall prey to this way of thinking. In their mind every battle should be an exactly even contest, mano a mano. If you shotgun them in the face or MD them from a roof you are lousy cheating scum who is using a noob weapon to win, because you certainly couldn't beat them if you were using their weapon (like a real man).

The only cure is to realize that DUST is modeling a messy battlefield with many different weapon systems that all have different strengths and weaknesses and if you die to one it doesn't necessarily mean you are "bad" or that your teammates should laugh at you. It shouldn't threaten your ego if you get popped by a shotgun to the face.

Just let the rage go and enjoy the diversity that is DUST.

Let's be cereal for a minute. A mass driver require no skills to use up close.

You know what I hate? I hate people who get their bum bum spanked out of PC and then come on forums thinking they understand the game

Mass driver is a noob tube

Mass driver has 6 shots

Therefore, a mass driver is a noob tube with 6 shots.


At least with my AR I have to track people not just look at their feet

Nerf ALL splash.
Gernades are too strong. Most MD players camp hard on roofs or sit back and cook fluxes. Less shots will nerf the roof campers, but just make the ground campers play even *****ier.

Nerf fluxes and it will be legit. Make gernades consume double the nanohive clusters they do now, and have all gernades capped out at 2 (Except for contact. 1 is probably fine, if not 0)

actually its entirely more entertaining when someone claims a team victory as their own.

Then takes it a step further and uses their victory by association to qualify all further comments of their own, and as a resource for discrediting all other opinions.

Your rationale for stating that the Mass Driver is a Noob Tube is non-existent, give reasons not rhetoric.

Regnum carries us all, my ffriend, he is the reason TeamPlayers ever won a match. Retroactively he increased morale and was our eve pilot before he joined. Also, he eats chicken.

^ this and chicken

@Billi Gene

Why don't you attack Teamplayers and see what happens

@Billi Gene

Why don't you attack Teamplayers and see what happens

Aww we wouldn't want Regnum going 40-0 with a Wolfman's now would we?

Best let the forum warrior wage battle here Reg I just wish people talked sense because I really do like debates, but his trashy trolling is worse than when my wife chews ice.

Im not an officer, :)

in either case ... are you still claiming that you are the sole reason for your corporation and alliance doing well?

and that when you go to battle all others on your team are of no consequence, that it is you and you alone that win the battle?

further, that this is the reason that you can come onto the forums making wild accusations without proof or facts, and criticize any who disagree?


cause you know... it kinda makes you sound like a dip stick.../just_saying...

^
Scared TBH

Why the **** are there so many **** threads about nerfing one ******* weapon or another?

The ******* MD is balanced.
The Flaylock got ******* better.
The HMG is still crap.
The FG got nerfed & is gonna get hit again.
Laser rifles? you can walk right up to 'em and *****-slap them.
H.A.V.s are getting nerfed.
Nova Knives got nerfed (Seriously, WTF?).
Shotguns got nerfed.
Need I go on?

lol.. I'm sure Reg can defend his words without a sidekick Zit :)

Why does a Mass Driver need 6 shots? Why does the Assault Rifle need 60?

Same answer.

HMG is fine, Spongly kills 8 people to every one death and he solo's fools by himself

Lazer rifle's will be fine once they fix the sights.

Forge Guns need a potential nerf against infantry, either a spread over distance or less blast radius so it takes more skill to hit, or maybe less splash damage, but getting 2 shot from a high place you can't get 2 doesn't off good counterplay.

Nova Knives are a sidearm, they are fine.

Shotguns are fine

Flaylock actually is still way 2 good as a sidearm, it's better than any other cept maybe the smg or scrambler if you're mad accurate, but for the noobs who can't shoot....Flaylock will save you...much like running murder taxi's or sniping from an obscure spot.

Not positive the MD needs a nerf. But the fact is you get 2 shot by it with over 750+ ehp or 1 shot if you're not armor heavy and are hit by a flux (aka any good MD flux's and then cleans up with one hit kills from on high) while being able to jump back into cover immediately after firing to eliminate the ability to kill the user..........

Why does a Mass Driver need 6 shots? Why does the Assault Rifle need 60?

Same answer.

It's Zatara brah. ;P But you meant to insult cause you're pretty petty and would rather talk than play dust...here bro...i'll send ya some isk if ya like for your trouble. How much do you need?

the annoying twatts that keep strafing left to right and are almost impossible to hit.

HMG is fine, Spongly kills 8 people to every one death and he solo's fools by himself

Lazer rifle's will be fine once they fix the sights.

Forge Guns need a potential nerf against infantry, either a spread over distance or less blast radius so it takes more skill to hit, or maybe less splash damage, but getting 2 shot from a high place you can't get 2 doesn't off good counterplay.

Nova Knives are a sidearm, they are fine.

Shotguns are fine

Flaylock actually is still way 2 good as a sidearm, it's better than any other cept maybe the smg or scrambler if you're mad accurate, but for the noobs who can't shoot....Flaylock will save you...much like running murder taxi's or sniping from an obscure spot.

Not positive the MD needs a nerf. But the fact is you get 2 shot by it with over 750+ ehp or 1 shot if you're not armor heavy and are hit by a flux (aka any good MD flux's and then cleans up with one hit kills from on high) while being able to jump back into cover immediately after firing to eliminate the ability to kill the user..........

Oh yeah, cause the assault rifle can toss mini contact nades that do slightly less damage out at you after a flux that has no falloff damage?

i agree with everything said here, but the Forge Gun is a hard problem being that its a heavy weapon, limited to the heavy suit.

Nerfing the Forge Gun against infantry significantly lowers the survival of that fitting. I very seriously think that people just need to htfu and learn the angles to attack each tower type from as regards sniper rifles.

The MD suffers from an incredibly low ammo count, even with skills. Sitting on a hive will only get you so far with it. Given that height is premium for any MD range is not, MD must/should flee when presented with a dedicated opponent at longer range, there is just no reliable manner to counter this with a MD.

Hence the MD spam for tight interior maps.

I'll admit, HMGs aren't too bad. Have you looked at the Laser Rifles stats?....
Nova Knives are fine; point is, they got nerfed. Shotguns need better sight actually.... and hit detection. Forge Gunners have a bad reticule so, you have to be extremely careful when aiming, other wise you just waste ammo since its unlikely that you'll actually kill anyone with splash damage. Just please try weapons out before you decide if they have skill or no skill; I create Alts to test out different weapons and builds to see if they're really as OP as people say they are. Also, explosives do 1.2x damage to armor; armor tanking in general needs a buff; much like H.A.V.s. I got nothing to say about the Flaylock.

You mean like running a swarm launcher? Cept Heavies can et a sidearm guaranteed vs logi's runnng swarms who would be more screwed. Why make the forge gun a heavy weapon? The highest EHP suit gets the weapon you can 2 shot people from got knows where, oh and wait it was meant to be av so good luck counterplaying it?


With Flux's and nano's, a md is crazy good. With flux's you're basically giving a guy a flux nade and a contact locus nade you don't need to cook with a large clip. You 1, 2, or 3 shots all classes after fluxing them if semi accurate.

You mean like running a swarm launcher? Cept Heavies can et a sidearm guaranteed vs logi's runnng swarms who would be more screwed. Why make the forge gun a heavy weapon? The highest EHP suit gets the weapon you can 2 shot people from got knows where, oh and wait it was meant to be av so good luck counterplaying it?


With Flux's and nano's, a md is crazy good. With flux's you're basically giving a guy a flux nade and a contact locus nade you don't need to cook with a large clip. You 1, 2, or 3 shots all classes after fluxing them if semi accurate.

So someone built their fit around making their primary weapon most effective?

So thinking is OP now?

Who the **** said FGs were an AV weapon?

DESCRIPTION



Adapted from Deep Core Mining Inc.GÇÖs proprietary technology, the DCMA S-1 subverts conventional expectations of what a man-portable anti-material weapons platform is capable of. Despite its excessive weight and extended recharge times, the GÇ£Forge GunGÇ¥ as it has become known, is regarded as the most devastating infantry weapon on the battlefield, and an invaluable tool for those capable of wielding it.

Powered by a Gemini microcapacitor, the Forge Gun utilizes a stored electric charge to fire kinetic slugs at speeds in excess of 7,000 m/s, enough to penetrate even augmented armor systems. During the pre-fire charge, the forward armature locks into position, stabilizing the magnetic field and helping to shield the user from backscatter and the excessive heat produced. Power generation remains the single largest drawback of the current design, the onboard capacitor requiring a significant amount of time to reach full power after each discharge.
Specifications

Race: Caldari
Designation: DCMA S-1
Variant: Standard
Length: 135cm
Weight (loaded): 58.4kg
Weight (unloaded): 55.1kg
Max. effective range: 1,200m
Ammunition: Solid-state

And yet, the max effective range is 300m...

I doubt it with your AR skill IMO

MD wheel actually has 8 chambers. So it already came pre-nerfed.

Swarms are a light weapon, so they are anyones KITTEN. They Don't require the slowest suit ingame to fit them, in closed beta i had a scout suit swarm fit, to troll tanks with.

The FG has a low ammo count/low clip size, the suit that fits it has no equipment slot, so when you see a FG on a tower, you aren't looking at the work of a single player.... and more often than not, by taking myself out of the battle and finding the best angle to cover the tower from i can force the heavy to abandon their tower 9 times out of 10, getting a kill on them is great, but not necessary.


MD is crazy good, but so are most weapon systems when used appropriately.

Assault Scrambler Rifle is my current fave :P even if it isn't ideal for armor, most of the time i only have to rip shields to force a retreat.

because in a team game, numbers matter....

More like if it took great skill I'd have no problem with it, but putting a stamina mod on your suit and running around cooking flux's all game so you can one shot someone isn't creating good balance IMO, though I admit I could be entirely wrong.

I have a caldari assault suit with 500 shields a super fast regen shields rate and about 200 armor with a md. I can solo with it, because a flux and 2 quick shots that head towards an area while strafing (see ar's and such would have to aim here to make contact to deal damage, with my md strafing super fast is viable because no worries about lol spray and praying doing almost no damage) mops up 4 people.

I've never once played against you, so how would you know?

Although I will agree I am not the best player, but I can tell you this, it is MUCH easier to get AR kills than MD kills. I've been using an alt for the last week or two, speced into adv MD's, and it isn't as easy as you think it is. I used to think they were noobtubes too, until I actually used them. It's possible I am just too accustomed to AR's since I have been using them exclusively in this game for about a year now, but even so, using the MD isn't a cake-walk.

It greatly depends on the player and how they play, but going from a point and click weapon like an AR to a MD is a big difference. MD is highly situational, but the AR is good in every situation except long range.

Every time I use my MD, a thought crosses my mind "Killing that person, or persons, would have been easy if I was using my AR".

If a MD user has time to fire all 6 rounds at you, which takes over 6 seconds, what were you doing with your main weapon AND sidearm in the meantime???

are you doing this inside installations or out in the open?

Ive camped on crosswalks and rained death from above, and been almost entirely ignored by the pub proto-spammers below...was hilarious :P, wasnt wearing anything above ADV :P... and nothing on my adv suits are stacked, cause it messes up my numbers for restocking :P

any ways my point being, the MD is an area denial system. If it took a hit to damage, then it cant be any worse then it was in early/mid chromosome, and i was happy with the assault variant THEN.... on a Logi suit no less :P, because i used the system for what it was designed for... area denial and terror tactics.

So talk the talk... give solid reasons and not hyperbole and ill jump right on the band wagon... but nuff of the forum warriors bullKITTEN, who the KITTEN tries to shout down everyone but themselves... in a conversation?

You justified when I skewered you on your point about not being effective against infantry. I'm ok if it's good against infantry, but not from halfway across the map where an ar doesn't even get falloff damage and the only thing that can hit you is another forge or a sniper...that's good counterplay...

You're arguing with me not against me. I agree why not make the Forge a light weapon? If you can fit a plasma cannon...

Yout virtually can't one shot a forger so he comes out, drops someone with an assault forge, and then steps back into cover...NOT UNLIKE A MASS DRIVER!

MD Explosion and smoke from said explosion makes it very hard to aim at the attacker. So, maybe the answer is "Getting hit by explosion spam."

More like if it took great skill I'd have no problem with it, but putting a stamina mod on your suit and running around cooking flux's all game so you can one shot someone isn't creating good balance IMO, though I admit I could be entirely wrong.

I have a caldari assault suit with 500 shields a super fast regen shields rate and about 200 armor with a md. I can solo with it, because a flux and 2 quick shots that head towards an area while strafing (see ar's and such would have to aim here to make contact to deal damage, with my md strafing super fast is viable because no worries about lol spray and praying doing almost no damage) mops up 4 people.

But Master, does not the fire need water too? Does not the mountain need the storm? Does not your ******* need kicking?

You know that the TAC AR has enough range to make short work of a MD user by staying at such a range that it can be quite difficult to effectively lob rounds in?

You could have a whole squad running the setup you described, and they would still get blasted by a flux and a core locus grenade thrown by two guys.

On my heavy I pack fluxes just for groups of infantry that go shield tanking.

Complaining about someone using a flux and an armor biased weapon is ridiculous. Might as well just ask for all grenades to be removed from the game at that point.

Perhaps I was a little TOO vague in my answer. What I was getting at was that "People Miss". The only "real" problem that can be argued regarding a Mass Driver is that the Direct Damage of non-breach mass Drivers is slightly too high. Most people however, don't rely on the Direct damage and instead use the Splash to either surpress a large group of enemies or, in some cases hit targets that don't require many hits, but much accuracy (see scouts).

Mass Drivers have clear cut weaknesses that make them an extremely difficult weapon to use. A skilled player can overcome many of those weaknesses through sheer amounts of practice and talent but the weapon remains mostly situational. Using a Basic Mass Driver it takes roughly 2-3 shots to kill a scout of the same level, assuming of course that each shot hits. This is, in my opinion, acceptable because scouts are extremely fast and agile opponents with little HP and the Mass Driver is a natural counter to it's defenses.

An Armor Assault/Logi takes about 3-4 shots, again assuming all shots splash. Armor Assaults have higher Armor Value's than scouts but still go down pretty quick after the shields are gone thanks to the natural damage buff vs. armor that explosive rounds have. (which I think might be a little high.)

A Shield Assault/Logi takes about 3-5 shots, which is a lot more variable because of the Shield Tank vs. Damage output that comes from reliance on High Slots.

A Heavy takes 5-7 shots, all splash, depending on how Shield Tanked their suit is. Naturally that number can be augmented with direct hits on the Heavies body, larger and slower mass makes easier target, but again this is assuming all splash. Which means that in some cases the Mass Driver would need to FULLY reload in order to kill a well Shield Tanked Heavy.

This is based on my Experience using a Mass Driver WITHOUT Damage Mods. If you got insta-murdered by a Mass Driver then chances are he either landed a direct hit, is stacking Damage Mods (usually the case with Armor Assault Suits, since they don't need the High Slots for much.) or maybe both.

If you take into account the mass drivers weaknesses regarding fire rate, reload speed, and terrain. You can surmise that the reason it has 6 shots instead of 4 is so that you can actually defend yourself. There are times where using a Mass Driver, if you miss your target once and have to reload, your as good as dead. If the Mass Driver was limited to 4 shots, killing someone with it, in fair combat or otherwise, would be extremely difficult to the point of being under powered.

At least that's my Synopsis.

Keep the faith.

I'm giving reasons you aren't contesting...it's like carrying both contact locus nades and flux nades. and then spamming them...one hit killing everything unless you're on level ground in open terrain, then it takes skill assuming you're at range. A lot of skill.

i see no difference, between using your analogy on the MD than using it on Swarms. Apart from the obvious fact that swarms only affect tanks and that tanks are almost never popular with infantry.

Yes using the MD proficiently takes skill, using it as a FotM for tight ambush style fights is more akin to Spray an Pray, especially when a red knows to close the gap.

Limiting the Clip size or ammo count would in my opinion, nerf the system to near uselessness. I'd much rather see a splash damage nerf (and if possible, a radius increase :P).

I'm actually fine with not killing players and instead fighting for position and advantage, something which an area denial/terror weapon is quite handy for.

Oh yeah, so one guy with a mass driver can do the work of two guys with different nades....cept contact nades only get one and md's get 6...sounds fair? Honestly I've said before I'd love a nade that balanced out to do 130% to shield and 90 or whatever % to armor....provide more choices right?

I mentioned in an earlier post I played a match tonight when a guy sat on top of echo on the bridge map and was hitting alpha with impunity...a tac can't hit the top of the building at echo from alpha..read the post before you suggest driving a lav or rushing to get close to get on top and kill him please....

Hmm...I like it. Instead of nerfing it just makes it more situational. See I'd rather they give both options a chance. Make one MD super small radius wise, but a lot of DPS, to reward accurate play (careful with RoF and Reload otherwise it'll be a new Flaylock)...then make the other with a lot of radius but less DPS (Splash feels like slightly more than a tickle...70-90 damage a hit)

Honestly, I'm not sure I want a nerf to the md, more just discuss it and come to my own conclusion. I just showed up cause Regnum threads draw out trolls I can laugh at.

Oh yeah, so one guy with a mass driver can do the work of guys guys with different nades....cept contact nades only get one and md's get 6...sounds fair? Honestly I've said before I'd love a nade that balanced out to do 130% to shield and 90 or whatever % to armor....provide more choices right?

I mentioned in an earlier post I played a match tonight when a guy sat on top of echo on the bridge map and was hitting alpha with impunity...a tac can't hit the top of the building at echo from alpha..read the post before you suggest driving a lav or rushing to get close to get on top and kill him please....

Sounds like you got "suppressed". There's always "that guy" doing "that thing" that annoys you when you try to hack an objective when he kills you. The situation you've described is no different than a Sniper or Forge Gun "Suppressing" an objective from atop a tower and they're MUCH harder to get rid of than a Mass Driver.

P.S. I support the implementation of an anti shield grenade that can kill.

Keep the faith.

No Doubt I was being suppressed, and I'm just fine with that...but from a longer range than any other weapon sans forge gun and sniper? Seems a bit extreme. The MD needs something akin to falloff damage..it can send rounds sailing forever, that was the point of the post.

Fluxes and Core locus both come with three. Considering that those two people can wipe out however many people you want to cram into the blast radius of the core locus, complaining about the use of a flux and MD seems needless. It would seem that at least some of the issue stems from the manner in which certain squads role, all jammed together so they can focus fire on their targets. The MD prevents this by forcing squads to spread out. Tactics at its finest.

As to the anecdote of the match, why not grab a sniper rifle and dome the guy? If he was sitting up on a roof, he could have been pegged by tank, forge, sniper, or attacked by dropship. With that many counters, it seems a stretch to be complaining. Also, at that range he was not throwing fluxes, so shield tankers would have been needing at least 3 splashes to get through the shields, so it isn't like you couldn't GTFO in time. It was just a tactical error that allowed him to stay up there. He only had impunity because you refuse to do what was obvious to kill him. Thats on you, not him.

It actually does have a limited range ( shot a long shot at a dropship that should have hit but the round exploded before connection... I think.) it's just ridiculously long. How would CCP justify the falloff though? and then to what degree? the Mass Driver wasn't meant to be a Short Range Weapon, and it's only usable at long range by the EXTREMELY skilled.

No Doubt I was being suppressed, and I'm just fine with that...but from a longer range than any other weapon sans forge gun and sniper? Seems a bit extreme. The MD needs something akin to falloff damage..it can send rounds sailing forever, that was the point of the post.

...Fails to read past relevant post referenced from earlier in the thread...I love ignorant people here. I'm so happy to learn and promote discussion till this happens....

The core you have to cook, the md is a contact grenade, huge difference. And if you read earlier we had this discussion and I even played around with putting all nades to 2 max and only supply depots can resupply them so it stops being grenade spam 514. If that happened and MD's only had 2-3 flux's for the match...then it'd be an area denial weapon, and only forge's would need a slight nerf vs infantry...potentially reducing splash to reward the accurate ones and prevent splash kills from nowhere.

...Fails to read past relevant post referenced from earlier in the thread...I love ignorant people here. I'm so happy to learn and promote discussion till this happens....

The core you have to cook, the md is a contact grenade, huge difference. And if you read earlier we had this discussion and I even played around with putting all nades to 2 max and only supply depots can resupply them so it stops being grenade spam 514. If that happened and MD's only had 2-3 flux's for the match...then it'd be an area denial weapon, and only forge's would need a slight nerf vs infantry...potentially reducing splash to reward the accurate ones and prevent splash kills from nowhere.

Man, you're a really likable guy. Prompting discussion like a boss.

Answer...no ******* clue. How they justify grenades coming out of nanohives is beyond me...or any other number of things..

I agree it takes skills at extremely long range. my problem is with the flux combo contact nade and no falloff damage...I'm less concerned with cip or RoF. Not sure if I know enough to comment intelligently about the dps....but making it 110/90 sounds awesome.

Fluxes and Core locus both come with three. Considering that those two people can wipe out however many people you want to cram into the blast radius of the core locus, complaining about the use of a flux and MD seems needless. It would seem that at least some of the issue stems from the manner in which certain squads role, all jammed together so they can focus fire on their targets. The MD prevents this by forcing squads to spread out. Tactics at its finest.

As to the anecdote of the match, why not grab a sniper rifle and dome the guy? If he was sitting up on a roof, he could have been pegged by tank, forge, sniper, or attacked by dropship. With that many counters, it seems a stretch to be complaining. Also, at that range he was not throwing fluxes, so shield tankers would have been needing at least 3 splashes to get through the shields, so it isn't like you couldn't GTFO in time. It was just a tactical error that allowed him to stay up there. He only had impunity because you refuse to do what was obvious to kill him. Thats on you, not him.

Well I think an appropriate solution might be to have Flux grenades follow the same "Cooking" guidelines as regular grenades. One of the biggest reasons that the Fluxmass Combo is so effective is that the flux grenade can be thrown, and then after two seconds detonate without being cooked. Which means you can engage you opponent very quickly. Whereas cooking a grenade to achieve the same affect would give your opponent time to react to what your doing in a 1v1 scenario. Thoughts?

No Doubt I was being suppressed, and I'm just fine with that...but from a longer range than any other weapon sans forge gun and sniper? Seems a bit extreme. The MD needs something akin to falloff damage..it can send rounds sailing forever, that was the point of the post.

Thats false, and you would know if had actually used a MD

Flux 'nades have the same cooking as standard grenades.

Thats false, and you would know if had actually used a MD

If you're aiming down the reticle and one of the rounds lands near you it totally throws off the cursor and the same effect is repeated with each shot. No matter where you are within the radius, even when so far out of it that you arent harmed that effect triggers and it's ridiculous. It dumb to walk into areas and my screen starts shaking cause an MD is nearby.

...Fails to read past relevant post referenced from earlier in the thread...I love ignorant people here. I'm so happy to learn and promote discussion till this happens....

The core you have to cook, the md is a contact grenade, huge difference. And if you read earlier we had this discussion and I even played around with putting all nades to 2 max and only supply depots can resupply them so it stops being grenade spam 514. If that happened and MD's only had 2-3 flux's for the match...then it'd be an area denial weapon, and only forge's would need a slight nerf vs infantry...potentially reducing splash to reward the accurate ones and prevent splash kills from nowhere.

I'm not fishing through 9 pages to find a story about why you failed to use any of the many options at your disposal to counter what was obviously a threat.

You allowed someone with an area of effect weapon to bombard a point. You had options available, but chose none of them.

The FG problem was created by AR users who demanded that the HMG have the range of a baseball and the initial accuracy of an epileptic performing brain surgery with a hammer. You forced them onto the heights, now you want them back on the ground to outrange and massacre.

This MD QQ is pretty much the same. You seemingly want to be able to run in a tightly packed squad, focusing your fire on solo enemies with impunity. Because splash weapons counter this horde tactic, it has to go.

That happens when any weapon hits you, it's just more noticeable when your hit by something with a much more impact like a Mass Driver, Grenade, Plasma Cannon, or Forge Gun.

...This dude is so dumb I'm going to just lol at the fact you're in Zion and troll you from now on. I have massive respect for discussion, but you're failing at that.

You know, you can always change up your strategy. Don't engage a MD head on if they have a height advantage, count the rounds and rush them when they reload, use a TAC AR to wreck them at a range, try to get a height advantage, don't hide in the corner... all these different tactics are viable and fun because the MD for forces you to do something different than goin full Rambo with your 60 round plasma hose that's still the best all around weapon in the game. Seriously, I put the MD down to appease a QQer in my squad, complaining that I didn't deserve my "cheap" kills and pulled out an Exile with 0 sp. Did you know these things are hit scan, have almost 0 recoil and nonexistent dispersion? I barely had to ADS because it was so easy. Only thing I couldn't go toe-to-toe with were Duvolles inside 40m. Only noob tube I see in dust has 60 rounds in the clip. ****ing easy mode if you ask me...

...This dude is so dumb I'm going to just lol at the fact you're in Zion and troll you from now on. I have massive respect for discussion, but you're failing at that.