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Ares 514 wrote:

Kaeru Nayiri wrote:

Pseudogenesis wrote:

I think the ideal middle ground for ringers is one where they're restricted but not discouraged or made impossible. It's a really neat emergent mechanic and ties in perfectly with the idea of the immortal mercenary, so I'd hate to see it eliminated from the game.

Also, on the topic of CP, what will be done to prevent the most popular and active corps from dominating the game once it's been introduced? I like the idea but when I hear "The more activity, the more CP", I just imagine the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. How will smaller corps be able to keep up?

This is why recruiting temporary help should have a built in interface. A corps should have active recruitment and ways to pick up new players and permanently bring them under their wing, but they should also be able to issue contracts that can be fullfilled by other mercs.

IDEA

ExampleCorp doesn't have enough people to defend against an attack, so they issue a contract which becomes available in special contracts that can be fullfilled by those who meet the criteria.

The action of ISSUING this contract has a cost, in ISK, BMK or CP, whichever you prefer.

Meeting the criteria can become VERY interesting. We could create a rating system, have 3 star, 4 star or 5 star mercenaries based on ratings, or PC MU. The contract can be made out publicly, or to another corporation. True ringer only corps could be created by living off this system.

Interesting idea. I like the concept of it showing up in special contracts :) Might be better if a single corporation could accept/win the contract and then it only shows up in special contracts for that corp. As long as their is a CP cost (and maybe others) for creating these contracts it could work nicely.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 178 post(s)
Kain Spero Negative-Feedback. 4979	Posted - 2015.04.08 14:28:00 - [33211] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: yes, and if you really want to know I thought of a corporation warbarge that would have the final module a miniature wormhole generator, opening up wormhole space planets. And the next to last, a miniature warpdrive, to raid out of MH That there are even thoughts about getting Dust beyond MH makes me really excited. It implies to me a long term vision for Dust as a whole. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and Legion news
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 2177	Posted - 2015.04.08 14:38:00 - [33212] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Plastic nova knives or teacups and tiaras? We find out in one hour. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Vyuru Algintal Core Gallente Federation 100	Posted - 2015.04.08 14:43:00 - [33213] - Quote With all this cool talk of Corp stuff, I might have to look at finding a Corp to run with again. Been wanting to find a group that does more FW anyways, you can be LFS for awhile, even with the Kirjuun Heiian channel. I am really liking the recent matchmaker changes. It caught me by surprise to be tossed against better players like that, so I wound up getting butchered for a couple of games. But it's been really good for my sneaky scout game and now I'm going more 13/2 or 13/4 in games, with lots of hacks and running a good harassment game. It's been really beneficial and makes the games alot more fun. I still play too aggressively though sometimes, and I have a very bad tendency to keep going after a wounded target who knows I'm hunting them. A challenge is the spice of life however!!! Right now, Adv cloak/jump Min scout is fitting my preferred style of play perfectly, but I am looking to expand out of it and try something new. Anyone have any suggestions? Currently I'm skilling up the AR and Plasma Cannon for the Galmmando since I have the APEX suit, and you can never have too much PC goodness. I have seen someone who I think speed tanked a Min heavy, had knives and a heavy machine gun who was absolutely terrifying in his ability to sneak up behind an enemy formation, kill a few with knives, and mow down the rest of the people with the HMG.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 2177	Posted - 2015.04.08 14:50:00 - [33214] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: I lean toward, it will be insustainable to use a large percentage of ringers, a majority of the time. Really we just need a tunable CP cost factor per non corp non alliance member in battle however, the ringer may just join the corp before battle and leave afterwards. Do we need restrictions on such behaviour? I think you can create a metric for a player that flags them as a ringer without creating restrictions on corp hopping. Something that's more behind the scenes similar to the Mu score in pubs. I don't know the exact implementation but in a PC environment where you are "forced" to hire mercs to maintain your land...... Creating rules on corps just won't work when players can come and go as they please (that shouldn't be changed), it really needs to be a metric attached to a player; players take a long time to develop from an skill point and Mu perspective. If you hire a ringer, they won't be using a 20mil SP alt. If they do, that will help to even the playing field for the opposite team either way. You can't really influence your SP or Mu without some serious effort involved. I do like the contract style idea. RE: Restrictions on corp hopping. You could even implement a form of "jump fatigue" similar to Eve's jump mechanics. Where a merc gets a sort of "personality conflict" in which they don't understand whom they are really loyal to after corp hopping. We are talking about power projection after all...ha ha ha. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Ernest McRooney Nos Nothi 11	Posted - 2015.04.08 15:08:00 - [33215] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: LeGoose wrote: Someone post something unrelated and random. There is far too much coherent discussion going on here. http://i.imgur.com/K4ilXFU.png What the actual sh!t?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 8636	Posted - 2015.04.08 15:14:00 - [33216] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Plastic nova knives or teacups and tiaras? We find out in one hour. Definitely a boy! 5 months to go. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Pseudogenesis Nos Nothi 2514	Posted - 2015.04.08 15:52:00 - [33217] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: G Clone wrote: This would have to be formal procedures, controlled by the game-mechanics. Indeed! Pubs have Squad Finder. PC has Contract Finder (?). A place for ringers to market availability. A place for FCs to find what they need. / spitball This sounds like a fantastic idea. I'm all about stuff that adds more sand to our box, and this is a perfect way to do it. It should complete with a little optional merc bio detailing skills and previous employment Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
Flaylock Steve Nos Nothi 724	Posted - 2015.04.08 17:14:00 - [33218] - Quote I'm confused, we're talking about ringers. Basically highly skilled mercs going to PC for any given corp who pays right? Then also we're talking about raids right? But my question is what has been to done to help scouts which is something that needs to be done. If Pc was fixed and raids became a thing, it will be pretty much pointless due to failing performance of scouts. Nos Nothi is a scout corp am I correct? How well do you think our corp will do going up against assaults that can out-scout us? I think that needs to be fix before these corp raids and ringers situation was fixed or during/shortly after.
G Clone Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 38	Posted - 2015.04.08 17:20:00 - [33219] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: G Clone wrote: This would have to be formal procedures, controlled by the game-mechanics. Indeed! Pubs have Squad Finder. PC has Contract Finder (?). A place for ringers to market availability. A place for FCs to find what they need. / spitball This sounds like a fantastic idea. I'm all about stuff that adds more sand to our box, and this is a perfect way to do it. It should complete with a little optional merc bio detailing skills and previous employment This arguably removes sands from the sandbox, as it will force strict relations instead of ad-hoc and random relations. That said, I definitely like it, as it helps counter the randomness that is the infinite free accounts (indirectly) - in this game, structure is needed.
Pseudogenesis Nos Nothi 2516	Posted - 2015.04.08 17:57:00 - [33220] - Quote G Clone wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: G Clone wrote: This would have to be formal procedures, controlled by the game-mechanics. Indeed! Pubs have Squad Finder. PC has Contract Finder (?). A place for ringers to market availability. A place for FCs to find what they need. / spitball This sounds like a fantastic idea. I'm all about stuff that adds more sand to our box, and this is a perfect way to do it. It should complete with a little optional merc bio detailing skills and previous employment This arguably removes sands from the sandbox, as it will force strict relations instead of ad-hoc and random relations. That said, I definitely like it, as it helps counter the randomness that is the infinite free accounts (indirectly) - in this game, structure is needed. How so? I basically see this as being mercenary advertising. Get yourself out there and involved with the intricacies of high level Dust play. If done in the way I suggested it would let you express yourself and would put even more emphasis on "previous employment" (ie "I worked with X corp for a year") I think see what you're getting at, but I also think emergent gameplay can be encouraged through in-game rulesets. You can't have a sandbox without walls. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire Gû¼+¦GòÉGòÉn¦ñ I stabbed Rattati once, you know.

Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 923	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:03:00 - [33221] - Quote Pseudogenesis wrote: I think the ideal middle ground for ringers is one where they're restricted but not discouraged or made impossible. It's a really neat emergent mechanic and ties in perfectly with the idea of the immortal mercenary, so I'd hate to see it eliminated from the game. Also, on the topic of CP, what will be done to prevent the most popular and active corps from dominating the game once it's been introduced? I like the idea but when I hear "The more activity, the more CP", I just imagine the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. How will smaller corps be able to keep up? This is why recruiting temporary help should have a built in interface. A corps should have active recruitment and ways to pick up new players and permanently bring them under their wing, but they should also be able to issue contracts that can be fullfilled by other mercs. IDEA ExampleCorp doesn't have enough people to defend against an attack, so they issue a contract which becomes available in special contracts that can be fullfilled by those who meet the criteria. The action of ISSUING this contract has a cost, in ISK, BMK or CP, whichever you prefer. Meeting the criteria can become VERY interesting. We could create a rating system, have 3 star, 4 star or 5 star mercenaries based on ratings, or PC MU. The contract can be made out publicly, or to another corporation. True ringer only corps could be created by living off this system. Know what cannot be known.
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1436	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:14:00 - [33222] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: I think the ideal middle ground for ringers is one where they're restricted but not discouraged or made impossible. It's a really neat emergent mechanic and ties in perfectly with the idea of the immortal mercenary, so I'd hate to see it eliminated from the game. Also, on the topic of CP, what will be done to prevent the most popular and active corps from dominating the game once it's been introduced? I like the idea but when I hear "The more activity, the more CP", I just imagine the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. How will smaller corps be able to keep up? This is why recruiting temporary help should have a built in interface. A corps should have active recruitment and ways to pick up new players and permanently bring them under their wing, but they should also be able to issue contracts that can be fullfilled by other mercs. IDEA ExampleCorp doesn't have enough people to defend against an attack, so they issue a contract which becomes available in special contracts that can be fullfilled by those who meet the criteria. The action of ISSUING this contract has a cost, in ISK, BMK or CP, whichever you prefer. Meeting the criteria can become VERY interesting. We could create a rating system, have 3 star, 4 star or 5 star mercenaries based on ratings, or PC MU. The contract can be made out publicly, or to another corporation. True ringer only corps could be created by living off this system. Interesting idea. I like the concept of it showing up in special contracts :) Might be better if a single corporation could accept/win the contract and then it only shows up in special contracts for that corp. As long as their is a CP cost (and maybe others) for creating these contracts it could work nicely. Overlord of Broman
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 8641	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:15:00 - [33223] - Quote Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused ... Rattati's seeking input on specific topic. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Spademan Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 6225	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:23:00 - [33224] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: I think the ideal middle ground for ringers is one where they're restricted but not discouraged or made impossible. It's a really neat emergent mechanic and ties in perfectly with the idea of the immortal mercenary, so I'd hate to see it eliminated from the game. Also, on the topic of CP, what will be done to prevent the most popular and active corps from dominating the game once it's been introduced? I like the idea but when I hear "The more activity, the more CP", I just imagine the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. How will smaller corps be able to keep up? This is why recruiting temporary help should have a built in interface. A corps should have active recruitment and ways to pick up new players and permanently bring them under their wing, but they should also be able to issue contracts that can be fullfilled by other mercs. IDEA ExampleCorp doesn't have enough people to defend against an attack, so they issue a contract which becomes available in special contracts that can be fullfilled by those who meet the criteria. The action of ISSUING this contract has a cost, in ISK, BMK or CP, whichever you prefer. Meeting the criteria can become VERY interesting. We could create a rating system, have 3 star, 4 star or 5 star mercenaries based on ratings, or PC MU. The contract can be made out publicly, or to another corporation. True ringer only corps could be created by living off this system. When issuing it'd be nice if there was a public/private setting. In public anyone meeting the criteria (be that MU or whatever) could join, and if set to private you could enter the name of corp/corps to receive. What're you looking at me like that for? I'll shank you I will.
Kaeru Nayiri Ready to Play 924	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:27:00 - [33225] - Quote Spademan wrote: When issuing it'd be nice if there was a public/private setting. In public anyone meeting the criteria (be that MU or whatever) could join, and if set to private you could enter the name of corp/corps to receive. Exactly what I was thinking !! +1 Know what cannot be known.
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1436	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:28:00 - [33226] - Quote Ares 514 wrote: Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Pseudogenesis wrote: I think the ideal middle ground for ringers is one where they're restricted but not discouraged or made impossible. It's a really neat emergent mechanic and ties in perfectly with the idea of the immortal mercenary, so I'd hate to see it eliminated from the game. Also, on the topic of CP, what will be done to prevent the most popular and active corps from dominating the game once it's been introduced? I like the idea but when I hear "The more activity, the more CP", I just imagine the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer. How will smaller corps be able to keep up? This is why recruiting temporary help should have a built in interface. A corps should have active recruitment and ways to pick up new players and permanently bring them under their wing, but they should also be able to issue contracts that can be fullfilled by other mercs. IDEA ExampleCorp doesn't have enough people to defend against an attack, so they issue a contract which becomes available in special contracts that can be fullfilled by those who meet the criteria. The action of ISSUING this contract has a cost, in ISK, BMK or CP, whichever you prefer. Meeting the criteria can become VERY interesting. We could create a rating system, have 3 star, 4 star or 5 star mercenaries based on ratings, or PC MU. The contract can be made out publicly, or to another corporation. True ringer only corps could be created by living off this system. Interesting idea. I like the concept of it showing up in special contracts :) Might be better if a single corporation could accept/win the contract and then it only shows up in special contracts for that corp. As long as their is a CP cost (and maybe others) for creating these contracts it could work nicely. Thinking more about this i really like the idea. This way you have ringer corps and when a corp takes a contract like this they can then fill the PC battle as if it was theirs (i.e. the contracting corp would see the battle as grayed out or something and a note about it beeing contracted to corp X). Corp X could then use the same roles as if it was their PC battle for who can deploy to it etc. It would be cool if the corp that did the attack would see in battle finder who took the contract, so they would know in advance and could maybe coordinate attacks against the contracting corp if they hold districts. Imagine a situation where corp A gets attacked by corp B, they spend X CP and Y ISK to get corp C to defend it (the CP is to limit corp A's actions and the ISK goes to corp C as payment, would be cool if they could set two ISK amounts, one amount for a win and one amount for a loss). Then corp C has to bring their guys to do the battle, and if they in turn want to deploy ringers in it they would pay some CP for each ringer they bring. In this way CP could be used by corps that don't hold districts. /end ramble Overlord of Broman
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 8643	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:33:00 - [33227] - Quote Love the idea of working "Special Contracts" into the solution Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1439	Posted - 2015.04.08 18:35:00 - [33228] - Quote Thinking back to some earlier ringer costs and discussions. What if there was a new corp role, say 'Mercenary', that allowed those corp members to 'ring' in other non corp PC battles. Only mercenaries with that role could deploy to non corp PC battles AND whenever they did it would use up X amount of CP from the corp. This would limit both the amount of ringing that any given member could do. Just to prevent abuse i'd make it so that role couldn't be assinged to someone unless they had been in the corp for say 3 days or some such. A side benefit is that no one in a starter corp would have this role so they'd have to be in a player corp to do it. Overlord of Broman
J0LLY R0G3R And the ButtPirates 2627	Posted - 2015.04.08 19:23:00 - [33229] - Quote Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. The ButtPirates Now Accepting Applications. XD TheYoutube
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 9225	Posted - 2015.04.08 19:38:00 - [33230] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Plastic nova knives or teacups and tiaras? We find out in one hour. Using plastic knives is like using an aluminum baseball bat... Go steel or go home. Just make sure they are blunt, and your outlets are all secured. Besides, he will come with an innate sprint glitch for at least a few months, so he will have time to get used to the feel of the metal before he becomes mobile. Also, from what I understand, you have merely increased the probability of knives over tiaras, with tiara probabilities still above zero. Perhaps even both at the same time. Vyuru wrote: With all this cool talk of Corp stuff, I might have to look at finding a Corp to run with again. Been wanting to find a group that does more FW anyways, you can be LFS for awhile, even with the Kirjuun Heiian channel. Nos Nothi is planning on being a Pirate/Raiding Corp when the time comes. Keep that in mind if you are interested. IgniteableAura wrote: I think you can create a metric for a player that flags them as a ringer without creating restrictions on corp hopping. Something that's more behind the scenes similar to the Mu score in pubs. I don't know the exact implementation but in a PC environment where you are "forced" to hire mercs to maintain your land...... Something like, within a 30 Day rolling period, you get 0 Corp Goodwill points subtracted from the score for fighting with your Corp in PC, with 1 added for fighting for Corp X, and increasing the points added for each additional corp (or not). And the higher your Goodwill score, the higher your Ringer cost (maybe even a small increase to in your cost to your Corp). All numbers and mechanics pulled out of rear for brainstorming purposes. This could easily (theoretically at least), be implemented alongside a Corp Contracts system. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.

Flaylock Steve Nos Nothi 724	Posted - 2015.04.08 20:42:00 - [33231] - Quote J0LLY R0G3R wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. Um okay, don't have a long beard, mine is short lol. Can't really play with it. But can someone point me to where this ringer talk started? So I can follow the whole conversation and maybe have some good input
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 9227	Posted - 2015.04.08 21:10:00 - [33232] - Quote Flaylock Steve wrote: J0LLY R0G3R wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. Um okay, don't have a long beard, mine is short lol. Can't really play with it. But can someone point me to where this ringer talk started? So I can follow the whole conversation and maybe have some good input Here. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
J0LLY R0G3R And the ButtPirates 2628	Posted - 2015.04.09 00:52:00 - [33233] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: J0LLY R0G3R wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. Um okay, don't have a long beard, mine is short lol. Can't really play with it. But can someone point me to where this ringer talk started? So I can follow the whole conversation and maybe have some good input Here. Spoiler alert: it isn't a picture of a beard. The ButtPirates Now Accepting Applications. XD TheYoutube
Flaylock Steve Nos Nothi 725	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:37:00 - [33234] - Quote J0LLY R0G3R wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: J0LLY R0G3R wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. Um okay, don't have a long beard, mine is short lol. Can't really play with it. But can someone point me to where this ringer talk started? So I can follow the whole conversation and maybe have some good input Here. Spoiler alert: it isn't a picture of a beard. oh that's a relief......
Dreis ShadowWeaver Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 2626	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:38:00 - [33235] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: J0LLY R0G3R wrote: Flaylock Steve wrote: I'm confused just play with your beard and nod here and there. they'll never be any the wiser. Um okay, don't have a long beard, mine is short lol. Can't really play with it. But can someone point me to where this ringer talk started? So I can follow the whole conversation and maybe have some good input Here. I think it was here. Creator of the 'Nova Knifers United' channel Caldari blood, Minmatar heart <3 I'm a monster
Dreis ShadowWeaver Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 2627	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:39:00 - [33236] - Quote R.I.P. NF. It was fun whilst it lasted... Creator of the 'Nova Knifers United' channel Caldari blood, Minmatar heart <3 I'm a monster
Forced Death Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 445	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:50:00 - [33237] - Quote Dreis ShadowWeaver wrote: R.I.P. NF. It was fun whilst it lasted... What happened? You're jumping all over Dreis! First TR, then RND, then NF, then RND again?!?! (join CORSY) Death by laser is imminent
Dreis ShadowWeaver Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 2628	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:51:00 - [33238] - Quote Forced Death wrote: Dreis ShadowWeaver wrote: R.I.P. NF. It was fun whilst it lasted... What happened? You're jumping all over Dreis! First TR, then RND, then NF, then RND again?!?! (join CORSY) NF has merged into RND. NF is dead. Creator of the 'Nova Knifers United' channel Caldari blood, Minmatar heart <3 I'm a monster
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 8651	Posted - 2015.04.09 01:53:00 - [33239] - Quote Dreis ShadowWeaver wrote: NF is dead. Or resting :P I seriously doubt we've seen the last the Kane Spero. PS: Queue times are pretty long tonight. 3+ min to get into Ambush (solo). Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 2182	Posted - 2015.04.09 02:34:00 - [33240] - Quote Dreis ShadowWeaver wrote: Forced Death wrote: Dreis ShadowWeaver wrote: R.I.P. NF. It was fun whilst it lasted... What happened? You're jumping all over Dreis! First TR, then RND, then NF, then RND again?!?! (join CORSY) NF has merged into RND. NF is dead. Dont be sad RND is a great corp............there was once a thought of megatron, ask some of the older members of RND and they will get a chuckle out of it My Youtube Biomassed Podcast



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