so u want to swap the gal and cal role bonuses but that willl not change the fact that the other 2 suits are still garbage and without decent role bonuses, which dosnt warent a change to the 2 scouts that actually work correctly and are useful. the minmatar needs to get a sidearm damage bonus and a bonus to explosives and the amar needs something like laser damage bonus and maby cloak duration. the speed hacking needs to be put back on all logi suits and there u go probemfixed

You do know he's talking about 1.7 not 1.8?

Do you know the difference between Theory and Practice?

If so, it helps to get your Theory correct in the first place.

In 1.7 you received 25% dampening for Lvl 5 Profile dampening

http://dust514.wikia.com/wiki/Skill:Profile_Dampening

And whilst your math (apart from that) 'may' be correct? In practice, when you were actually playing the game (not just whacking off over some spreadsheets) it didn't work like that.

in 1.7 2 complex dampeners on a medium suit beat ALL active scanners.

Please give me a explanation how can those opposite their role? The change Gal with scan bonus in line with Gal logo and Cal with damp bonus will match with nova knife. I assume that you are enjoy the advantage of Gal so much and don't want to change it.
I think along those 4 scout Min scout is the most balance. Their bonus is useful and slot layout is flexible enough to select what do they want to do. E-war bonus with their slot layout give them too strong and over shine Amarr and Min.

We want to stick to the dampening removal on cloaks.

How, and you only have one stat to change, do we do that while not making Gallente scout the only viable (PC) meta?

Go!

Biotic bonuses make the knife bonus somewhat irrelevant as Min scouts get increased based melee damage anyway. Having bonuses to 2 different melee styles on a single suit is a bit pointless, especially when one of those bonuses is to another race's weapon. There's a debate to be had about which role the Min scout could benefit from more, I'm just going with the racial style ones.

Even with the cloak change, a single complex damp will still get you under gal/amarr scouts and 1c+1e will get you under everything else except gal logi focused scanners and cal scouts. You sacrifice range, but you're still spotting people for your squad in that situation. I'll rephrase my question that I asked: Does this make for interesting and engaging gameplay? Does squad view add more strategy to the game than it removes? Does it positively or negatively impact the game's balance?

explain to me how the gal scout is better, i dont understand. the cal scout is just as good as the gal. its the min and amar that suk

The Gallente is the true infiltrator which makes it the best at the "scout" role that has existed in Dust for a long time. The Gallente are the best at close quarters, at flanking, at ninja hacking, at dropping uplinks, at solo point defense, etc etc. They're the best for nearly everything because they are ghosts. They only have to give up 2 slots (a damp and a cloak) as opposed to 3 slots (2 damps and cloak) to become ghosts.

Caldari is at a close second because it forces Gallente and other scouts to lose a low slot for a damp to continue scouting. This is a fact that CCP should consider. A precision tanked Caldari is the norm in a competitive environment because THAT is the best counter to someone attempting to infiltrate

Arguably the BEST feature of a scout that should never be taken away from ANY of them is their ability to avoid detection. That's why you run a scout. To get behind enemy lines and hit them from where they least expect it.

If a scout fails to avoid detection they are a worthless asset on the battlefield because they cannot fulfill their role as a stealth unit. A scout who is constantly getting scanned via passive or active is better off in an entirely different suit or simply ehp tanking and playing the role of an assault because that's all they'll be good for.

Removing the ability for every scout to easily avoid detection is like removing a sentinel's ability to easily tank ehp.

Honestly it seems to me like they're not even sure how their game is currently played and why. I don't mean that to be rude. It just seems like they're out of touch with their own mechanics and player base.

The Gallente is the true infiltrator which makes it the best at the "scout" role that has existed in Dust for a long time. The Gallente are the best at close quarters, at flanking, at ninja hacking, at dropping uplinks, at solo point defense, etc etc. They're the best for nearly everything because they are ghosts. They only have to give up 2 slots (a damp and a cloak) as opposed to 3 slots (2 damps and cloak) to become ghosts.

Caldari is at a close second because it forces Gallente and other scouts to lose a low slot for a damp to continue scouting. This is a fact that CCP should consider. A precision tanked Caldari is the norm in a competitive environment because THAT is the best counter to someone attempting to infiltrate

Arguably the BEST feature of a scout that should never be taken away from ANY of them is their ability to avoid detection. That's why you run a scout. To get behind enemy lines and hit them from where they least expect it.

If a scout fails to avoid detection they are a worthless asset on the battlefield because they cannot fulfill their role as a stealth unit. A scout who is constantly getting scanned via passive or active is better off in an entirely different suit or simply ehp tanking and playing the role of an assault because that's all they'll be good for.

Removing the ability for every scout to easily avoid detection is like removing a sentinel's ability to easily tank ehp.

Honestly it seems to me like they're not even sure how their game is currently played and why. I don't mean that to be rude. It just seems like they're out of touch with their own mechanics and player base.

i run both gal and cal scout and i know how to counter each one and the gal scout has been known as the infiltrator since day one i dont care about the logi take the logi crap to another post this is a scout post u are suggesting the cal SCOUT and the gal SCOUT completely change roles this is wat i see as dumb i have another thread that explains how to fix the dampened brick scout so simply if u would look at another forum all u have to do is give armor modules a profile penalty

The Gallente is the true infiltrator which makes it the best at the "scout" role that has existed in Dust for a long time. The Gallente are the best at close quarters, at flanking, at ninja hacking, at dropping uplinks, at solo point defense, etc etc. They're the best for nearly everything because they are ghosts. They only have to give up 2 slots (a damp and a cloak) as opposed to 3 slots (2 damps and cloak) to become ghosts.

Caldari is at a close second because it forces Gallente and other scouts to lose a low slot for a damp to continue scouting. This is a fact that CCP should consider. A precision tanked Caldari is the norm in a competitive environment because THAT is the best counter to someone attempting to infiltrate

Arguably the BEST feature of a scout that should never be taken away from ANY of them is their ability to avoid detection. That's why you run a scout. To get behind enemy lines and hit them from where they least expect it.

If a scout fails to avoid detection they are a worthless asset on the battlefield because they cannot fulfill their role as a stealth unit. A scout who is constantly getting scanned via passive or active is better off in an entirely different suit or simply ehp tanking and playing the role of an assault because that's all they'll be good for.

Removing the ability for every scout to easily avoid detection is like removing a sentinel's ability to easily tank ehp.

Honestly it seems to me like they're not even sure how their game is currently played and why. I don't mean that to be rude. It just seems like they're out of touch with their own mechanics and player base.

this will fix the gal scout DUH AND THE BRICK SCOUT IS THE GAL SCOUT GOSH I NEVER CALLED U DUMB i said the switching of roles is dumb

Is dampening the ONLY good thing about the scout suit? I hate that all my competitive 1.8 fits HAVE to have a cloak.

Stop being so shortsighted. CCP can still change backend data on the fly, so get creative. All the scouts are too alike to make them interesting. And seriously, increase the penalty to armor plate stacking on scouts already. My 120lb scout should not be sprinting under 120lbs of armor plates.

Gallente is the only racial that shouldnt have to stack dampeners to stay off tacnet. Get over it. In fact, remove the range bonus and make it an armor rep bonus, like 2hp/s per level.

Now, with that said...

Caldari scouts shouldnt have to stack range and precision mods to see enemies at 50m. Give them a better racial bonus for each, but let them light up tacnet like a christmas tree. After all, they should accel at long distance weapons but suffer at close range. Besides, they already stack shields. Oh, and change caldari scout (only) sniper zoom to outline targets through walls.

Minmatar are supposed to be speed assassins, so give them better mobility (+.15m/s per lvl) and sprint (+.5m/s per lvl) stats and nerf their ability to tank...let them be NK glass cannons with crazy hack speed. Yes I'm talking crazy stuff, like 15m/s with kincats stacked...even if you have to goober it up by making it a duration skill.

Eliminate the (increased scout) armor stacking penalty for amarr and let them keep their stamina bonuses. Plus 10% gold thread content to their suit or something. Better yet, give them a heat buildup bonus to scr and lsr.

I'm tired of this lame tuning approach, make the game exciting and dynamic already. I want a reason to skill other scout suits.

The only way they'll make dampening less important is if they nerf the hell out of the tacnet. Meaning no more chevron wallhacks. No more showing what direction you're facing.

Getting scanned is the worst thing that can happen to you. Good players know how to use and abuse the tacnet system because it is OP as hell.

We want to stick to the dampening removal on cloaks.

How, and you only have one stat to change, do we do that while not making Gallente scout the only viable (PC) meta?

Go!

Call other people dumb but ignore the big picture is even dumber. They skill bonus are tie down together. BTW, this is Gal scout fix. if you talk about brick scout, go back to ur thread.

1) What I really want is irrelevant. If this is your angle, it makes more sense to recast Nova Knives as Minmatar technology. The biotic bonuses you've proposed would no doubt be well received; but our current Minja Community are knifers by training and tactics; let them keep their knives. Mr Musturd and Cyrius Li-Moody (veteran Minmatar Scouts) are both in your corp. You should hit them up for input before sh!tting on them.

2) Recon Scouts are not causing balance issues. They are easily countered. They are extremely vulnerable. They are easily killed. And once the dampening bonus is removed from cloak, GalLogi's will pick up them up with near minimal effort. As for "benefit the strategy of how the game gets played?" I have no idea what that means.

---

* I agree that CalScouts are at distinct advantage over Minmatar Scouts (and only Minmatar Scouts).
* I agree that Hotfix Alpha will reinforce this CalScout advantage over MinScout.
* Breaking everything to resolve one issue makes no sense; buff the MinScout, solve the problem.

-5% plate stack pen per lv

What would your thoughts be on these changes if they removed passive shared squad vision?

I need to follow up on this internally

HUD
* Added squad leader icon for player tags
* Added RDV drop off location icon for HUD
* Shared passive scanner vision for squads disabled (results of active scanners are still shared with squads)
* Team member chevrons now only visible when they are in line of sight. Squad chevrons remain visible and will still stick to the edge of the screen
* HP bars and name tag visible only for what you are aiming/firing at
* Hit indication from allied sources when friendly fire is disabled
* Updated name tags displayed while in the War Barge