*Sigh* I'm guessing you don't like being told you are wrong? Well..... you're wrong.

That table is trash, in reality 2 complex damps + the passive dampening skill brought a medium suit under 15db - I'd actually suggest that CCP math was way out and that 2 complex damps + the passive from the skill gave you a 75% reduction to profile - giving a medium suit with 2 complex damps a 12.5DB profile.

But what the **** do I know? I only ran a Medium suit with 2 complex damps for all of 1.7 and never got scanned, ever. So obviously I'm talking ****. So **** off you ******* ********.

*Sigh* I'm guessing you don't like being told you are wrong? Well..... you're wrong.

That table is trash, in reality 2 complex damps + the passive dampening skill brought a medium suit under 15db - I'd actually suggest that CCP math was way out and that 2 complex damps + the passive from the skill gave you a 75% reduction to profile - giving a medium suit with 2 complex damps a 12.5DB profile.

But what the **** do I know? I only ran a Medium suit with 2 complex damps for all of 1.7 and never got scanned, ever. So obviously I'm talking ****. So **** off you ******* ********.

CCP Rattati announce to remove the dampening effect of the cloak the Hotfix Alpha. I think that make Min scout with lower tier have no ground to stand. It will force Min scout to fit 2 damp at least to stay compete with other, and the low tier has only 2 slots. So we have to drop code breaker.

I think this nerf will drive people to select gal scout even more to bypass that.

The ability for scouts to passively scan wide areas for their squad means that they're essentially a walking, permanent wall hack for 5 other people. After the cloak change, the Gal scout will be able to see everything above 23.79db within 75m while being undetected himself (if he builds for it). The Cal scout will see everything above 14.91 for the same radius, which creates a barrier that most scouts can't enter unless they get torn to shreds by the 5 other people.

If you want Cal scouts to remain as the hunters of other scouts, then they should have to hunt down enemies themselves. So aside from removing the shared passive vision, I'd suggest the following changes (based loosely on Jebus' suggestions).

Cal scout: short range precision scout hunter
25% precision
25% reduction to nova knife charge time (nova knives are a cal weapon)

Gal scout: ghost
25% dampening
25% cloak regen

Min scout: hack and run
25% hacking speed (Min scouts get a higher base stat for this anyway, no need to buff it more)
10% bonus to biotics (with their high base melee damage and speed, this opens up a lot of options)
edit: Someone pointed out the numbers on +25% on biotics, so changed it to +10%

Ama scout: squad scan support, scans most suits except scouts
25% bonus to ferroscale and reactive plates (I've heard changing movement penalties is hard to make work, so this makes more sense)
25% scan range (gives Amarr their own E-war role and makes sense considering their weapon choices hit out to similar ranges)

Also, I'd like to note that while balancing around PC makes some sense considering it's the only full team vs full team mode right now, it has the issues of a limited map pool and limited playerbase. If they're serious about balance changes, I'd rather see full team FW enabled and have them take those figures into consideration too. FW is open to far more people and uses maps outside just the limited large socket selection.

To all these stupid people trying to reduce the scan range of scouts - go DIAF.

Scouts do recon. Its their job to scan for the squad, just like logis ress/resupply/revive/occasionaly scan.

While true it would be much better if just LoS targets show on squads tacnet than anything a Cal Scout is passively picking up.

The ability for scouts to passively scan wide areas for their squad means that they're essentially a walking, permanent wall hack for 5 other people. After the cloak change, the Gal scout will be able to see everything above 23.79db within 75m while being undetected himself (if he builds for it). The Cal scout will see everything above 14.91 for the same radius, which creates a barrier that most scouts can't enter unless they get torn to shreds by the 5 other people.

If you want Cal scouts to remain as the hunters of other scouts, then they should have to hunt down enemies themselves. So aside from removing the shared passive vision, I'd suggest the following changes (based loosely on Jebus' suggestions).

Cal scout: short range precision scout hunter
25% precision
25% reduction to nova knife charge time (nova knives are a cal weapon)

Gal scout: ghost
25% dampening
25% cloak regen

Min scout: hack and run
25% hacking speed (Min scouts get a higher base stat for this anyway, no need to buff it more)
10% bonus to biotics (with their high base melee damage and speed, this opens up a lot of options)
edit: Someone pointed out the numbers on +25% on biotics, so changed it to +10%

Ama scout: squad scan support, scans most suits except scouts
25% bonus to ferroscale and reactive plates (I've heard changing movement penalties is hard to make work, so this makes more sense)
25% scan range (gives Amarr their own E-war role and makes sense considering their weapon choices hit out to similar ranges)

Also, I'd like to note that while balancing around PC makes some sense considering it's the only full team vs full team mode right now, it has the issues of a limited map pool and limited playerbase. If they're serious about balance changes, I'd rather see full team FW enabled and have them take those figures into consideration too. FW is open to far more people and uses maps outside just the limited large socket selection.

So you want to be able to hide from a prototype active scanner in the hands of a suit with a role bonus towards precision, by only using 1 module?

No, its a scouting role that spots enemies, but dont kill as effectively as a slayer scout.

yea, i'm just spamming, but him using all those range amps is the opposite of the brick tank problem.

Min scout: hack and run
25% hacking speed (Min scouts get a higher base stat for this anyway, no need to buff it more)
10% bonus to biotics (with their high base melee damage and speed, this opens up a lot of options)
edit: Someone pointed out the numbers on +25% on biotics, so changed it to +10%

another option is to make the base gallante suit a bit slower than the others, so they have to put a speed mod in a slot to compensate.

Loving all of this but Amarr has 4 lows so your range bonus would give them the same issue we want to eliminate - maybe make that a bonus to range extenders - my 2cents

Can we change the biotic bonus a bit?

@ Scouts
Gal will remain PC viable, though they'll likely become less common.
Cal will remain PC viable, due primarily to shared squad sight.
Why aren't we discussing how to make the other Scouts PC viable?
Why are we discussing additional nerfs?

They really need some negative.

All of their bonuses are critical to being a scout (which is good) but they all are low slot skills and the suit has 4 lows.

because that would be too hard for them. THey like to nerf ****, then de-nerf it 4 months later.

4 months? It was a nearly a year last time. How soon we forget.

FoTM "slayers" prefer the GalScout today, but they will not tomorrow if required to Dampen. In other words, Rattati appears to have solved the brick-tanked Scout problem. Though in doing so, he has (1) tipped the eWar scale in favor of Caldari Scout and (2) further marginalized the Minmatar Scout.

So, if I get only one change, I'd ask it to be:

Let the Minmatar Scout keep the cloak's dampening bonus.
Let him be the knife-wielding assassin in the shadows.

And if by chance I were permitted a second change:

Give the Amarr Scout a meaningful bonus.
Something to set him apart from the others.

4 months? It was a nearly a year last time. How soon we forget.

FoTM "slayers" prefer the GalScout today, but they will not tomorrow if required to Dampen. In other words, Rattati appears to have solved the brick-tanked Scout problem. Though in doing so, he has (1) tipped the eWar scale in favor of Caldari Scout and (2) further marginalized the Minmatar Scout.

So, if I get only one change, I'd ask it to be:

Let the Minmatar Scout keep the cloak's dampening bonus.
Let him be the knife-wielding assassin in the shadows.

And if by chance I were permitted a second change:

Give the Amarr Scout a meaningful bonus.
Something to set him apart from the others.

@ Scouts
Gal will remain PC viable, though they'll likely become less common.
Cal will remain PC viable, due primarily to shared squad sight.
Why aren't we discussing how to make the other Scouts PC viable?
Why are we discussing additional nerfs?

The ability for scouts to passively scan wide areas for their squad means that they're essentially a walking, permanent wall hack for 5 other people. After the cloak change, the Gal scout will be able to see everything above 23.79db within 75m while being undetected himself (if he builds for it). The Cal scout will see everything above 14.91 for the same radius, which creates a barrier that most scouts can't enter unless they get torn to shreds by the 5 other people.

If you want Cal scouts to remain as the hunters of other scouts, then they should have to hunt down enemies themselves. So aside from removing the shared passive vision, I'd suggest the following changes (based loosely on Jebus' suggestions).

Cal scout: short range precision scout hunter
25% precision
25% reduction to nova knife charge time (nova knives are a cal weapon)

Gal scout: ghost
25% dampening
25% cloak regen

Min scout: hack and run
25% hacking speed (Min scouts get a higher base stat for this anyway, no need to buff it more)
10% bonus to biotics (with their high base melee damage and speed, this opens up a lot of options)
edit: Someone pointed out the numbers on +25% on biotics, so changed it to +10%

Ama scout: squad scan support, scans most suits except scouts
25% bonus to ferroscale and reactive plates (I've heard changing movement penalties is hard to make work, so this makes more sense)
25% scan range (gives Amarr their own E-war role and makes sense considering their weapon choices hit out to similar ranges)

Also, I'd like to note that while balancing around PC makes some sense considering it's the only full team vs full team mode right now, it has the issues of a limited map pool and limited playerbase. If they're serious about balance changes, I'd rather see full team FW enabled and have them take those figures into consideration too. FW is open to far more people and uses maps outside just the limited large socket selection.