Old Min Logi:
20 shield recharge per second
5 second recharge delay
6 second depleted delay
6 damage threshold

New Gal Logi
25 shield recharge per second
5 second recharge delay
4 second depleted delay
9 damage threshold

How in any way shape or form am I "talking crap"? Please, enlighten me.

Look Doc he Change it to Std Dropsuit Bpos

I love the grenade changes. I-¦m a Thukker tribe fanboy and it always killed me not being able to use thukker grenades cause they were crap. Now I the to see them In the killfeed once in a while.


On a completely different but similar topic. I believe that the splash radius of Flux grenades should be increased considerably at least at prototype level. There really is no incentive to use anything beyond std and the damage increase at proto is really a nonfactor since there is no suit with that much shield. Normalize the shield damage to adv and add an extra 2 meters at proto level.

That will make them usefull at pro level.

Does the flux also works on HAV?

In that case, adv and proto do makes sense....

They work, but try to throw a flux nade at a moving vehicle and you'll understand why adv and proto don't make sense x)

I wonder why....

Makes me sad....

Why change this after the announcement? All feedback has been positive on this point.

According to this thread the two main areas of concern are grenades and AV balance - not BPO weapon trading.

CPM let's see you try to get this changed back.

Having to run 25m closer to an HAV or DS puts you 25m closer to the optimal range of RR and ScR. Infantry is the reason rational people like myself do not like the range nerf on swarms.

I am going to use proto fits, because they have the ranges and sliders that tell you what damage any given weapon does at what range.

Lets take a look at the Opimal ranges and damages of both

A Rail Rfile is 75m, effective range is 100m, We are concerned with 150m and Prototype stats.

Damage 75m : 397 base DPS, per round 51.70
Damage 100m: 139.19 base DPS, per round does 18.09
Damage at 150m: 92.8 base DPS, per round does 12.06 damage.
vs shields 10.86

Scrambler rifle:

Damage 75m : 715 base DPS, per round 71.5
Damage 100m: 243.75 base DPS, per round does 24.38
Damage at 150m: 92.8 base DPS, per round does 16.25 damage.
vs shields 22.43

At 150, sure you can be hit and take damage.

Compared to swarm fits:
412 (base shield) Minandos, at 150m Kalikiota RR needs 37.75 consecutive hits to break your shields,
Viziam needs 18.36

Calmandos (500 base shield) Kalikioota RR needs 46 consecutive hits to break shields Viziam needs 22.2 consecutive hits to break shields.

Whitout counting armor, both prototype weapons have to stop to either reload or deal with overheat. Thats if they hit you with every single shot they fire from 150m. Thats plenty of warning to stop looking at the sky.

At 150m, I think you are going to be alright from the troops. If anything I would be more worried about HAVs, who can sit still, take punishment and thier gunners have time to sight you. But only slightly worried.

That's on the assumption that all their troops are standing next to the tank. We both know that won't happen ever. Short of you being in the redline, or the enemy tank being in its own redline, enemies are almost always gonna be within range of you unless the area is cleared.

The problem with swarms has never been range. The damage projection it has is crazy because of how fast it fires and how much damage it can deal per volley.

And the fact you usually find out the swarmer is near by the first volly hitting you. Meaning the second volly is most likely in the air and you are getting ready to start locking on the third. With the hardner delay vehicles must have hardeners on before we know there is a reason for them. Again, i think even with swarm nerf, the overall bonus to potential av damage in the form of all explosives, melee, nk, ect. Nobody will be willing to bleed isk that fast. Tanking is dead. ads will only survive because flying is fun.

Hi there. You must've confused me with Soraya; please re-read the very first line of my feedback on the topic:

I agree that swarms are too good against dropships.

Unfortunately for Swarmers, there's more at play with Swarms than their oppression of dropships. Take Swarms vs HAVs, for example. Why even bother? To answer your question, Swarmers are not being paid +75WP per volley. Swarming is not at all a WP-intensive activity. It is, however, a very high-risk activity. Swarmers tend to die alot. They just do. If you don't care to take my word for it, try it sometime for yourself. Better yet, ask Rattati for Swarm Launcher kill/spawn efficiency numbers.

Are you not entertained?

"Max rotation-¦ 50" Commence operation barrel roll.

"Dropships are ok, Caldari need a PG buff" Coming soon. Hopefully

which is why swarms are also included in the weak spot increase for HAVs

breach range increase

Massive vehicle nerfs, no corresponding buff in lethality, and no creation of a distinct role for tankers.

Kind of meh.

Like the AV changes, forge should have been the best AV forever, but without a clear role for tanks(transport, scanning, or even as a functioning in PC/FW cru) it just means driving around outside large sockets.

Going to have to record what will surely be ridiculous deaths when infantry come up on masse and beat a tank to death. Jumping plc's were already ridiculous, this next patch should finally kill off vehicles for any competitive use.

I am worried about gunlogis with the Av changes happing, the only advantage the gunlogi has when close to infantry was that small arms would not break its shield regen and would require some actual Av weapons also people going round punching vehicles is completely a stupid idea. I get that you could do actual damage to one but how do you destroy a metal vehicle with your fists :/ and that it would most likely break your hands

Massive vehicle nerfs, no corresponding buff in lethality, and no creation of a distinct role for tankers.

Kind of meh.

Like the AV changes, forge should have been the best AV forever, but without a clear role for tanks(transport, scanning, or even as a functioning in PC/FW cru) it just means driving around outside large sockets.

Going to have to record what will surely be ridiculous deaths when infantry come up on masse and beat a tank to death. Jumping plc's were already ridiculous, this next patch should finally kill off vehicles for any competitive use.

Bear in mind that Gunnies are getting a recharge and depleted delay buff,as well as recharge rate buff. With a single PRO Shield Regulator you get a 2.25s recharge delay, which is the same as a max operation AFG's charge time.

It's not all bad for Gunnies!

I wish I could actual fit one on my gunlogi, as they cost way to much space to actually fit on, just like the dispersion stabilizer

Bear in mind that Gunnies are getting a recharge and depleted delay buff,as well as recharge rate buff. With a single PRO Shield Regulator you get a 2.25s recharge delay, which is the same as a max operation AFG's charge time.

It's not all bad for Gunnies!

Yeah...

Tell that to my Python

which is why swarms are also included in the weak spot increase for HAVs