While I agree, don't be so harsh on him.
Being CCP is the worst insult imaginable in DUST

I like the new slot layout, but there is one thing i fear, Dova..., no really, i don't want Cal assault to be a Min assault 2.0.

While a 2/5 slot layout is perfect for armor tankers i can't say the same for a 5/2 layout for shield tankers, high slot modules requires a lot of PG/CPU and an assault can't withstand that layout, on the other hand if you give to cal too much resources they would be imbalanced with other assaults, i would prefer to have a 4/3 slot layout on both min and cal.

Haha I'm sure I play this game just as much if not more than you. 37 mil sp from open beta.

Fact is dual tanking is part of this game. I learned this the hard way in the min assault. Why do you think pro cal assaults with 400 plus armor? You armor tankers lived through a golden age of armor tanking ever since the buff way back and this made you believe that a pure tank was possible. Meanwhile shield tanking has been a real struggle; dual tanking became a necessity.

Like I said though the issue isn't the slot layout, the ones Rattati proposed make sense based on lore. The problem arises from not having a high slot module which contributes to armor tanking. Shield tankers have regulators in the lows. So what do you do? Dual tank to survive.

Haha I'm sure I play this game just as much if not more than you. 37 mil sp from open beta.

Fact is dual tanking is part of this game. I learned this the hard way in the min assault. Why do you think pro cal assaults with 400 plus armor? You armor tankers lived through a golden age of armor tanking ever since the buff way back and this made you believe that a pure tank was possible. Meanwhile shield tanking has been a real struggle; dual tanking became a necessity.

Like I said though the issue isn't the slot layout, the ones Rattati proposed make sense based on lore. The problem arises from not having a high slot module which contributes to armor tanking. Shield tankers have regulators in the lows. So what do you do? Dual tank to survive.

Haha I'm sure I play this game just as much if not more than you. 37 mil sp from open beta.

Fact is dual tanking is part of this game. I learned this the hard way in the min assault. Why do you think pro cal assaults with 400 plus armor? You armor tankers lived through a golden age of armor tanking ever since the buff way back and this made you believe that a pure tank was possible. Meanwhile shield tanking has been a real struggle; dual tanking became a necessity.

Like I said though the issue isn't the slot layout, the ones Rattati proposed make sense based on lore. The problem arises from not having a high slot module which contributes to armor tanking. Shield tankers have regulators in the lows. So what do you do? Dual tank to survive.

Correct me about what? All I'm saying is armor tankers need a high slot module. Secondly armor has been much better than shields (recent shield buff is pretty balanced though). Both are facts.

Yep I remember the Golden age of shield tanking too.

Correct me about what? All I'm saying is armor tankers need a high slot module. Secondly armor has been much better than shields (recent shield buff is pretty balanced though). Both are facts.

Yep I remember the Golden age of shield tanking too.

if you really from Open beta you'd be here long enough to know that at the least shield tanking and armor tanking have had equal OP eras to each other.

In actuality, my experience from Mordu's private trials (closed beta) to now allow me to honestly say Shields have had a much, much longer time in the spotlight than armor has.

The sidearm was taken away from all of the other logi-suits back in beta to make a difference between playing logi and playing assault. Why they left it on the Amarr was dumb as it easily makes the amarr logi more powerful and more desireable than the rest. I agree that the bonus should be fixed to continue working as long as you don't switch suits upon death or refitting at a supply depot.

As for "sharing" slot layouts with the Gallente, it's done that way because in FW Amarr and Caldari are aligned against Gallente and Minmatar... This there needs to be balance between those two alliances. But even with the same slot layout, they are different suits due to the bonuses... Amarr get armor tanking bonuses while Galente get armor repairing bonuses. Similarly for the Caldari and Minmatar, Caldari get shield tanking bonuses, while the Minmatar get Shield regeneration bonuses. Or at least that's how it's supposed to translate from the equivalent EVE Online ship racial bonuses.

1. If we want less slayer scouts and more assault suits then we need better assault suits.
2. Module placement won't make a difference regarding that.

Cal scout has 1 low slot at std and adv
cal scout has 2 bonuses that require low slot to maiximize
even at proto having only 2 slots to maximzime 2 bonuses is useless
std and adv is even more useless with only 1 slot.
really on the right direction if you wanting to make the cal scout more worthless than the present amarr scout

So when do those skilled into cal scout get respecs. you replaced its role and gave it to amarr. then give it crap bonuses that both require low slots now wanting to make it even more useless changing the slots so they only get 2 low at proto. I dont think you can **** that suit anymore than you already plan to do. so only option is respec out of the crap you are making it into.

Cal scout has 1 low slot at std and adv
cal scout has 2 bonuses that require low slot to maiximize
even at proto having only 2 slots to maximzime 2 bonuses is useless
std and adv is even more useless with only 1 slot.
really on the right direction if you wanting to make the cal scout more worthless than the present amarr scout

So when do those skilled into cal scout get respecs. you replaced its role and gave it to amarr. then give it crap bonuses that both require low slots now wanting to make it even more useless changing the slots so they only get 2 low at proto. I dont think you can **** that suit anymore than you already plan to do. so only option is respec out of the crap you are making it into.

Awesome. No more sidearm on the Amarr logi.

Totally ignoring the community again. The more things change, the more they stay the same, CCP.

How about you don't let your OCD override variety and, you know, fun?

GG, CCP.

Moving forward with few changes without changing the whole layout of every dropsuit is certainly on the table as well. The logi sidearm f.ex. There are other "anomalies" that I would love to discuss, such as STD and ADV logi racial differences.

Have at it and keep it civil and constructive!

Hi all,

We want to have this formal discussion and get your input. We believe that the community has wanted to have some say on this issue for some time, and now that I am studying this data in detail, some things brush me the wrong way (or my OCD).

Dropsuit Slot Layout

First table is Current, next table is proposed, and third tracks the difference in slots between the two.

We don't need to do any changes to these layouts right now. However, with PG/CPU increases for the Assault class on the horizon, more based on a PG/CPU allotment per slot type, it would be the right timing to swap a high with a low in strategic places, or add missing slots.

The new premise is a single matrix of racial high/low arrangements and then tactical choices of the other slots (EQ, SA, W, G). The proposed matrix is also intended to be more thematically in line with EVE Online racial slots.

Amarr highest number of low slots
Caldari highest number of high slots
Gallente equal number of highs and lows, preferring lows
Minmatar equal number of highs and lows, preferring highs

Moving forward with few changes without changing the whole layout of every dropsuit is certainly on the table as well. The logi sidearm f.ex. There are other "anomalies" that I would love to discuss, such as STD and ADV logi racial differences.

Of course if you see some errors, please let us know.

Have at it and keep it civil and constructive!

not being able to outfit a 2-5 am ass?

show me/us the math, how is it radically much better/worse than a 3/4 ga ass?

The assaults needs 1 high and low slot increase minimum for all races. Second if you look at the Cal logi vs. Cal Assault the logi has less EhP but more slots and can offset this easy. To stop the Logi slayer from taking from the assault reverse the slots so the assault is now 5/4 and the logi becomes 4/3.

Increase the EhP for assaults by 20% would help a lot as well.

Just my opinion.

not being able to outfit a 2-5 am ass?

show me/us the math, how is it radically much better/worse than a 3/4 ga ass?

Aren't prescision enhancers in High slots?
Why do you feel the need to extend your BASE (As in without mods) 36m scan radius further?
Surely you want to make up for you short fall (Prescision) over improving you positive to above useful/faif levels?

Amarr:
148.5 * 2 + 300 = 597 HP (Amarr HP + Two Complex plates)
9.375 * 2 = 18.75 HP/s
6.368 * 1.126 = 7.17m/s (Complex kin cat)

Gallente:
82.5 * 2 + 262 = 427 HP (Two Complex ferroscales, to keep the same speed)
9.375 * 2 + 3 = 21.75 HP/s


You can try giving Gallente a kin cat, but that drops their repair rate to half of that of Amarr.
You can try to fit heavier plates, but that drops their speed to below Amarr.

Anyway you slice it, Amarr can do it better.
Heck if they don't care about speed, they can get 700+ armor easily.
Or they can get 30hp/s with that 597 armor.


As far as high slots, do you really expect me to fit shield extenders (dual tanking) to have a competitive suit?
Really?
And if the Amarrian fits extenders too, he still does it better, as a third extender doesn't cover up the HP difference.
Precision enhancers are pointless for Assaults.
Myofibril Stims are lol
Damage mods are lol and wouldn't make enough of a difference with stacking penalties.





So basically, how it should be:
Amarr = Buffer
Gallente = Repair

How it actually is:
Amarr = Best Armor tank
Gallente = Dual tank