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Vitantur Nothus wrote:

One Eyed King wrote:

Vitantur Nothus wrote:

Cass Caul wrote:

$19USD for skill reset? I deffer to Iggy's comment on that.

Going to disagree with both of you on this. $20 is more than a fair price for a respec.
Flip burgers for a couple hours and you too can reallocate years of SP investment.
Seriously, what is $20?

And to compare that to Destiny? You guys have drunk the KoolAid. Bungie is going to take you for $20 every couple months. And for what? A new dungeon and sparklies? Its no different from World of Warcraft.

Dust has to generate revenue to stay alive, and I commend CCP and CPM1 for coming up with things we'll actually enjoy spending money on

Destiny isn't the only comparison.

You also have to take into account opportunity cost, in which case you could go online or to Gamestop and purchase a used, entirely full game for 20 or much less.

That could also mean half a tank of gas for some people, and a week or so's worth of getting back and forth to work.

Its all relative.

Before Dust, I'd drop $20 on a used game without blinking an eye. If it wasn't complete sh!t, I'd keep it and play it for a week or two. Rinse, repeat. Week after week. This adds up to far more than I've spent on Dust over the past couple years. And I've bought lots of goodies.

I agree that $20 is relative, but to keep things in perspective, we must compare entertainment expenses with like kind (i.e. not food, gas, clothing or beer).

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 178 post(s)
Cass Caul 1427	Posted - 2014.11.04 23:26:00 - [24451] - Quote Vitantur Nothus wrote: Cass Caul wrote: $19USD for skill reset? I deffer to Iggy's comment on that. Going to disagree with both of you on this. $20 is more than a fair price for a respec. Flip burgers for a couple hours and you too can reallocate years of SP investment. Seriously, what is $20? And to compare that to Destiny? You guys have drunk the KoolAid. Bungie is going to take you for $20 every couple months. And for what? A new dungeon and sparklies? Its no different from World of Warcraft. Dust has to generate revenue to stay alive, and I commend CCP and CPM1 for coming up with things we'll actually enjoy spending money on How is $20 worth it. New cap lets you play to your heart's content. That's a million SP every other week playing the amount I used to do. At 60M there isn't anything I need to skill into. At 60M there isn't anything I haven't skilled into. All there is is dumping skill points into Proficiency, extra ammo, and bringing up skills for suits I barely ever use to 5. Other than my hypothetical Pure Gallente build, which involves the 5 Gal suits, 4 Gal weapons, Forge Gun to Prof V with extra ammo V, and reload V (and sharpshooter where applicable). I mean, unless you take a look at Zatara's "I respec'd" thread and specifically go for the FotM suits (which is the accusation that someone made, not entirely true) you can't really spend your SP in a bad way. And as for the kool-aid, lol, like i'd spend real money on Bungie. That's hyperbole on my part, someone bought the game for me, they'll probably buy the expansion because "But Cass, I miss playing with you and have all this disposable income." But this "they brought in new **" is absolutely ***** bullshit. It's the crap people have been asking for since Uprising 1.1 And it's a partial experience of something we were promised to be a part of DUST since, a player market. Or buy-back itself is something that's been asked for since 1.2 Nothing new here, they came up with nothing. Saying something like that make syou look like you've bought into the IWS-style "CCP can do no wrong and I'll use every logical fallacy to defend them" BS. On Hiatus. This is my smartphone alt
Vitantur Nothus Nos Nothi 20	Posted - 2014.11.04 23:32:00 - [24452] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: Saying something like that make syou look like you've bought into the IWS-style "CCP can do no wrong and I'll use every logical fallacy to defend them" BS. Thank you for reminding me why I don't much care for you, Appia. I wish sweaty fatness upon you. Fatness from cheese.
Cass Caul 1427	Posted - 2014.11.04 23:39:00 - [24453] - Quote Vitantur Nothus wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Vitantur Nothus wrote: Cass Caul wrote: $19USD for skill reset? I deffer to Iggy's comment on that. Going to disagree with both of you on this. $20 is more than a fair price for a respec. Flip burgers for a couple hours and you too can reallocate years of SP investment. Seriously, what is $20? And to compare that to Destiny? You guys have drunk the KoolAid. Bungie is going to take you for $20 every couple months. And for what? A new dungeon and sparklies? Its no different from World of Warcraft. Dust has to generate revenue to stay alive, and I commend CCP and CPM1 for coming up with things we'll actually enjoy spending money on Destiny isn't the only comparison. You also have to take into account opportunity cost, in which case you could go online or to Gamestop and purchase a used, entirely full game for 20 or much less. That could also mean half a tank of gas for some people, and a week or so's worth of getting back and forth to work. Its all relative. Before Dust, I'd drop $20 on a used game without blinking an eye. If it wasn't complete sh!t, I'd keep it and play it for a week or two. Rinse, repeat. Week after week. This adds up to far more than I've spent on Dust over the past couple years. And I've bought lots of goodies. I agree that $20 is relative, but to keep things in perspective, we must compare entertainment expenses with like kind (i.e. not food, gas, clothing or beer). DUST equates around 50% of the money I've spent on PS3 games. I put in a fuckton of hours into this game. it's like $1 every 22 hours of gameplay. That's basically the ratio of money-game time I feel is necessary for a game to be worth the cost. Pokemon, Disgaea, Persona, Tales of-. Those are series I will buy in a heartbeat because I know that they will have that sort of investment for me. An investment of $20, for instant gratification, is not worth it. It's not 200 hours worth of gameplay On Hiatus. This is my smartphone alt
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5452	Posted - 2014.11.04 23:41:00 - [24454] - Quote Vitantur Nothus wrote: Cass Caul wrote: Saying something like that make syou look like you've bought into the IWS-style "CCP can do no wrong and I'll use every logical fallacy to defend them" BS. Thank you for reminding me why I don't much care for you, Appia. I wish sweaty fatness upon you. Fatness from cheese. I think you are mistaking fatness with allergic reaction in this case... 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7344	Posted - 2014.11.05 00:57:00 - [24455] - Quote Fun Fact: Zatara actually had to respec twice because he screwed up the first time. The whole squad laughed at him. By the way, I'm REALLY enjoying 1.9. Mainly because of all the vets that are coming back. I'm having good fights again! I'm running into EVERYONE that used to play this game it seems. Every other fight was "Dude look! This guy is back on!" And watching more and more OG FA come back. I got my Proto Min Scout, Min Commando, and Min Assault, and couldn't be happier. $20 well spent in my opinion. Frame rate is better, maps are better designed (that spire domination in particular), and despite some bugs, I feel like this is one giant step in the right direction for DUST. Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7344	Posted - 2014.11.05 00:58:00 - [24456] - Quote Vitantur Nothus wrote: Cass Caul wrote: Saying something like that make syou look like you've bought into the IWS-style "CCP can do no wrong and I'll use every logical fallacy to defend them" BS. Thank you for reminding me why I don't much care for you, Appia. I wish sweaty fatness upon you. Fatness from cheese. Edit: I don't expect anyone to entertain me for free. I am more than willing to spend a few bucks here and there for my entertainment, and as a nod to CCP for their progress. That doesn't mean I expect everyone to, nor does it mean I am blind to Dust's mistakes, shortcomings and opportunities. Edit2: There was a time when we could always count on you for fair an factual criticism, the good with the bad. I liked that Appia. The Bittervet is real Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5452	Posted - 2014.11.05 00:59:00 - [24457] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Fun Fact: Zatara actually had to respec twice because he screwed up the first time. The whole squad laughed at him. By the way, I'm REALLY enjoying 1.9. Mainly because of all the vets that are coming back. I'm having good fights again! I'm running into EVERYONE that used to play this game it seems. Every other fight was "Dude look! This guy is back on!" And watching more and more OG FA come back. I got my Proto Min Scout, Min Commando, and Min Assault, and couldn't be happier. $20 well spent in my opinion. Frame rate is better, maps are better designed (that spire domination in particular), and despite some bugs, I feel like this is one giant step in the right direction for DUST. Who else have you seen? 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2744	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:00:00 - [24458] - Quote 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5452	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:05:00 - [24459] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? Haven't heard anything about SG, but with Active Scanner spam, its difficult to say that the range nerf will have made much difference. I haven't played yet, so I couldn't tell you how it will affect lone wolves and hackers. 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7346	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:14:00 - [24460] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Ghost Kaisar wrote: Fun Fact: Zatara actually had to respec twice because he screwed up the first time. The whole squad laughed at him. By the way, I'm REALLY enjoying 1.9. Mainly because of all the vets that are coming back. I'm having good fights again! I'm running into EVERYONE that used to play this game it seems. Every other fight was "Dude look! This guy is back on!" And watching more and more OG FA come back. I got my Proto Min Scout, Min Commando, and Min Assault, and couldn't be happier. $20 well spent in my opinion. Frame rate is better, maps are better designed (that spire domination in particular), and despite some bugs, I feel like this is one giant step in the right direction for DUST. Who else have you seen? My God, so many. Morteshai Belmont SoTa PoP Skeletor Voltron Frost Kitty G3NOC1DE Kane Spero etc. etc. etc. I can't remember all of the names, but you get the picture. Lots of old vets and corps are hopping back on. I've nothing but good hard fights all day today. Very few "stomps", at least at first. FA has this bad habit of contesting the objective for a good 10-15 minutes and then pushing everyone out and not letting them back in. More than a few teams gave up after that. Only the strong came back to contest again. Playing against a sqd of Murphy's Law, Latino Corps Killers, and Kane Spero proved to be one of the more fun matches. Came down to like 20 clones by the end. People who were there: 8213, Jade Tech, K4thert, Kane Spero, etc. etc. FA also had a pretty OP squad on today. My Squad was: Ghost Kaisar Frost Kitty Skeletor Voltron Zatara Raught Derrith Eriador Iron Patriot We pretty much wrecked. Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.

Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2744	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:15:00 - [24461] - Quote From what Iv read, scouts now have equal eWAR to every other suit AS spam+team shared= shared passives but worse. "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7346	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:16:00 - [24462] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? I haven't run into a single good scout who has had problems today. Only the bad scouts are whining. Skel was fine. I was fine. Genocide was fine. Kitty was fine. Nobody complained. Cloak delay will probably get fixed though. SG hit detection is pretty dead on. Framerate has really improved (for the most part), and that has also helped HD a lot. Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5457	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:28:00 - [24463] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? I haven't run into a single good scout who has had problems today. Only the bad scouts are whining. Skel was fine. I was fine. Genocide was fine. Kitty was fine. Nobody complained. Cloak delay will probably get fixed though. SG hit detection is pretty dead on. Framerate has really improved (for the most part), and that has also helped HD a lot. Are you finding the Active Scanning being spammed non stop? 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2744	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:35:00 - [24464] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? I haven't run into a single good scout who has had problems today. Only the bad scouts are whining. Skel was fine. I was fine. Genocide was fine. Kitty was fine. Nobody complained. Cloak delay will probably get fixed though. SG hit detection is pretty dead on. Framerate has really improved (for the most part), and that has also helped HD a lot. Is the cloak delay still too short...? "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7349	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:36:00 - [24465] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Ghost Kaisar wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? I haven't run into a single good scout who has had problems today. Only the bad scouts are whining. Skel was fine. I was fine. Genocide was fine. Kitty was fine. Nobody complained. Cloak delay will probably get fixed though. SG hit detection is pretty dead on. Framerate has really improved (for the most part), and that has also helped HD a lot. Are you finding the Active Scanning being spammed non stop? YES I now have a proto Damped Assault fit. It works quite well for surprising people. Normal Assaults and Commando's can do just fine though. I just like surprising people. Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2744	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:38:00 - [24466] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Ghost Kaisar wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? I haven't run into a single good scout who has had problems today. Only the bad scouts are whining. Skel was fine. I was fine. Genocide was fine. Kitty was fine. Nobody complained. Cloak delay will probably get fixed though. SG hit detection is pretty dead on. Framerate has really improved (for the most part), and that has also helped HD a lot. Are you finding the Active Scanning being spammed non stop? YES I now have a proto Damped Assault fit. It works quite well for surprising people. Normal Assaults and Commando's can do just fine though. I just like surprising people. Im probably gonna run 2 damps, 1 reg, 1 kin cat on my Min Ass with triple shields and one energizer "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
Llast 326 An Arkhos 5222	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:42:00 - [24467] - Quote So TL;DR of Ghost's post is...everything is fine if you are in Vet SquadGÇª and running Assault MOAR Ladders
LeGoose SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 634	Posted - 2014.11.05 01:58:00 - [24468] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 2 questions: Is SG hit detection fixed? AND: Is the cloak range nerf as bad as I predicted? Haven't heard anything about SG, but with Active Scanner spam, its difficult to say that the range nerf will have made much difference. I haven't played yet, so I couldn't tell you how it will affect lone wolves and hackers. I ran 3 matches solo after work today OEK. Active scanner spam wasn't bad. Only had a couple of scan prevented messages. Mostly I didn't notice the spamming. In pubs the range Nerf while cloaked really didn't effect me. I would get close to the objective, decloak for a few seconds, recloak and make my approach with the Intel I just gathered, and then take out those who needed killing. Granted this was against the pub crowd and may be different in a more competitive match. My last match I went 19/7 mostly knifing in my quafe suit with 2200 wp. Also got a pile of isk from that match. The frame rates and overall improvements were really nice. Made cqc fighting really smooth. I ran into Ydubbs RND and demzor in a few matches. Good to see some of the old vets/super goods return. Click it! I dare you...
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7353	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:04:00 - [24469] - Quote Llast 326 wrote: So TL;DR of Ghost's post is...everything is fine if you are in Vet SquadGÇª and running Assault I ran Min Scout a lot too. Heck, Skeletor was even running Min Scout (I convinced him to spec into it) He had a blast. "It's fun isn't it?" Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5460	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:06:00 - [24470] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Llast 326 wrote: So TL;DR of Ghost's post is...everything is fine if you are in Vet SquadGÇª and running Assault I ran Min Scout a lot too. Heck, Skeletor was even running Min Scout (I convinced him to spec into it) He had a blast. "It's fun isn't it?" Did you have to run your max dampened fits a lot? 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?

Llast 326 An Arkhos 5224	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:07:00 - [24471] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Llast 326 wrote: So TL;DR of Ghost's post is...everything is fine if you are in Vet SquadGÇª and running Assault I ran Min Scout a lot too. Heck, Skeletor was even running Min Scout (I convinced him to spec into it) He had a blast. "It's fun isn't it?" I am looking forward to trying things outGÇª but I get back tomorrow And that's the 5thGÇª so all about the explosives MD FL and RE fit all day MOAR Ladders
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7356	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:18:00 - [24472] - Quote Oh my god this guy. "Do you even play Minmatar Scout?" Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2748	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:21:00 - [24473] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: Oh my god this guy. "Do you even play Minmatar Scout?" LOL thats hilarious "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5461	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:22:00 - [24474] - Quote Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2748	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:23:00 - [24475] - Quote ID personally like the san range nerf to be reduced to a 10-20% reduction...something that reduces slayer scout, but doesn't nullify eWAR at the same time "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
Llast 326 An Arkhos 5224	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:37:00 - [24476] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. Gotta give this guy a point because he did honour a Knife dual with me once, i believe. And let's face how many people did that in 1.8? MOAR Ladders
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 5463	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:46:00 - [24477] - Quote Llast 326 wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. Gotta give this guy a point because he did honour a Knife dual with me once, i believe. And let's face how many people did that in 1.8? He is the one that started the channel Nova Knifers United. 1.9 Where cloaked scouts give way to tanked scouts. Problem solved?
Cass Caul 1428	Posted - 2014.11.05 02:58:00 - [24478] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Llast 326 wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. Gotta give this guy a point because he did honour a Knife duel with me once, i believe. And let's face how many people did that in 1.8? He is the one that started the channel Nova Knifers United. That place has as many people as Scouts United a lot of times. I still remember my first knife duel https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1775882#post1775882 On Hiatus. This is my smartphone alt
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7359	Posted - 2014.11.05 03:00:00 - [24479] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Llast 326 wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. Gotta give this guy a point because he did honour a Knife dual with me once, i believe. And let's face how many people did that in 1.8? He is the one that started the channel Nova Knifers United. That place has as many people as Scouts United a lot of times. I left the Scouts United Chat because it became a cess-pool. The only scout chat I will use nowadays is Nos Nothi. I would cut him some slack, but dear lord he made some stupid posts. "I am already running two enhanced damps, what more can I do?" I dunno, maybe RUN TWO PROTO DAMPS!?! Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7359	Posted - 2014.11.05 03:01:00 - [24480] - Quote Cass Caul wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Llast 326 wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Cut him a little slack. He didn't even start until after FF, so he doesn't really have a full understanding or appreciation of the scout role the way those of us that played well before 1.8 do. I have squaded with him plenty of times. He is a decent guy, and definitely a dedicated Minja. Gotta give this guy a point because he did honour a Knife duel with me once, i believe. And let's face how many people did that in 1.8? He is the one that started the channel Nova Knifers United. That place has as many people as Scouts United a lot of times. I still remember my first knife duel https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1775882#post1775882 First I remember was dueling WhyCantIDie way back when. Commented on it here and was then told that the person was Sontie's alt Bullet Hell and Duct-Tape? Count me in! FA recruits get free officer BPO's. Enlist today. Must be a scrub to enter.



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