.02 charge up time is not even remotely significant. Look at the post immediately above yours:

Blink speed is actually 0.004 seconds on average ...
Average Blink Speed

lolrailgun

It has shell travel time, its not instant shot

It also dips

It has poorer splash damage then a FG

It requires a direct hit to kill whoever, that means a direct hit to kill that SL who is bunny hopping about 300m away

With any other turret on it the SL has a big advanatge since lolmissiles and blasters cannot reach 200m out currently

Squad size is 6 - thinking it will take 6 AV'er to kill a tank lolno

I have proto swarms, i can solo any tank but to make it easier i can team up with spkr with his proto FG and we can whack any vehicle alot easier

If vehicle pilots can use teamwork in tanking but also in AV and vehicle destruction why cant AV'ers use teamwork?

Besides, you're missing the point: if a tank needs to be opposed by several people in order to neutralize it, it unbalances the entire field of play. If it takes four infantry to neutralize a tank, for example, you're now fighting a 12 v 15 battle instead of 16 v 16. That's a big deal.

0.2 seconds guys, not .02 seconds. There is a major difference. Tempo 300 does represent 0.2 seconds between beats though. Also, though it may not seem like much while listening, that is even time for an AR to fire two shots (with time to spare).

Has a great point about scope though - ScR and RR could probably get a slightly greater magnification but I doubt it is happening.

My bad, you're correct about the timing.

The issue with the gun, however, is not that the AR comes out slightly ahead in a straight up fight.

It's that it matches the AR pretty close in a straight up fight, and has 75% longer optimal range.

That kind of range should come with a significant DPS reduction. The SMG still kills with it's tiny range, having the rail rifle's DPS brought down to SMG levels does not seem like an extreme reduction at all.

As it stands, it has potentially higher DPS than the AR while totally spanking it in the range department. The game doesn't need new ARs on steroids.

I would also like to see a video showcasing how these guns fire in both CQC and at range. hip fire and ADS in both cases prefered.

Probably a lower RoF since the breach was its placeholder.

Which brings up a question- what's the scope zoom going to be like on it?

No, the 0.2 charge Time will nerf it in close engagements.

No, the 0.2 charge Time will nerf it in close engagements.

A shell has travel time? It's close enough to instantaneous to be so. And if you want to talk about travel time, maybe we can talk about how long it takes swarms to get to your tank from 400m out.

The splash damage is still damage. The FG debate is another one entirely.

If you're fine with ignoring low amount sof splash damage, then swarms require a direct hit too.

Then hide near or behind a rock, structure or box of crates. The missiles are stupid and half will be destroyed while trying to turn a corner.

A tank still only takes one guy. Thinking it should take any more than one person to kill it is "lolstupid"

Of course they can. But if these changes go through, then they'll have to. Tankers don't have to use teamwork to get kills.

I should have known Spkr was your friend. I guess that's why you can't stop riding RND's d.ick whenever one of us posts something.

My bad, you're correct about the timing.

The issue with the gun, however, is not that the AR comes out slightly ahead in a straight up fight.

It's that it matches the AR pretty close in a straight up fight, and has 75% longer optimal range.

That kind of range should come with a significant DPS reduction. The SMG still kills with it's tiny range, having the rail rifle's DPS brought down to SMG levels does not seem like an extreme reduction at all.

As it stands, it has potentially higher DPS than the AR while totally spanking it in the range department. The game doesn't need new ARs on steroids.

No, it won't nerf it.

See? I supported my argument as well as you did.


...


Now let me try to be more civil. I honestly hope you're correct, but I doubt it.

The clip size is not small enough to counteract just holding the trigger and ignoring the 0.2 penalty. And you assume two people meet each other and start firing at the same time, while the vast majority of firefights start asymmetrically.

A smart player with a Rail Rifle is simply more cautious about what battles he fights. If he can negate the 0.2 penalty by firing first, he wins.

Having swarms at 5 and prof. at 4, these changes pretty much make this SP allocation worthless. I call for a respec.

You can't change a weapon this dramatically and not give something back, it's an entirely different weapon now.

Not everyone is going to train up the other races rifles up.

You also assume that during engagements you never let go of the trigger. From what I remember back when I didn't have a scrambler rifle, and what I see from streams and youtube videos, engagements with the AR usually always result in a seize fire at least once before the kill is made, so that's another moment the rail rifle has to charge up for 0.2 seconds.

likes
crazy space :11
CPM: 0

Crazyspace for CPM!

The problem with your argument is that one would then have to expect infantry to be highly effective against aircraft--or else, effective against whatever is effective against aircraft. The reason AV fits the rock-paper-scissors scenario is because AV infantry is weak against AI infantry.

Besides, you're missing the point: if a tank needs to be opposed by several people in order to neutralize it, it unbalances the entire field of play. If it takes four infantry to neutralize a tank, for example, you're now fighting a 12 v 15 battle instead of 16 v 16. That's a big deal.

All the same, I don't have an issue with the swarm launcher changes just yet. I think the range nerf is good, and the damage nerf is probably necessary after the recent ROF buff. We'll have to test it out against the changes to vehicles.

My thoughts on the new rifles and range changes so far:

• Combat Rifle: As a Minmatar player I have to say it looks fantastic. Almost too fantastic.

It all depends now on how the Burst ROF will transport over to the game. From the stats it seems that the DPS might be VERY good but as I said we'll have to see how this gun actually works in-game.

Assault variants seem pretty well balanced compared to the assault variants of the rest of the rifles.

The one thing that concerns me slightly though is the relatively low CPU/PG requirement, especially for the proto variants. It seems like the CR is way easier to fit than any other rifle, though DPS is not any worse, if not better, than those of the rest of the rifles.


• Rail Rifle: I'm not sure about this weapon.

DPS looks like it is comparable to the AR but with way more range.

But then the 0.2 charge up time and the reload of 3.2 seconds really make clear that this gun is not meant to be effective close range.

It would be a really decent weapon IMO if it was not for the Scrambler Rifle range buff.


• Scrambler Rifle: Wow, assuming that no other stats will be changed but the range, this will be an absolutely awesome weapon.

In comparison to the current Tactical AR stats you will get: more range, larger clipsize, less recoil, more damage, better ROF. Though these come at a hefty CPU/PG requirement, but still these changes have the potential to make this weapon VERY good.

And here comes my problem with this: Comparing the Kaalakiota Rail Rifle and the Imperial Scrambler Rifle, why would I ever prefer to use the Rail Rifle over the Scrambler Rifle assuming I have the CPU/PG to fit the SR?
For a mere +8 CPU and +3 PG I can use the SR which has no charge up time and is better in almost everything the RR does.

Either I'm missing something or the RR has something to it that's not represented through its stats. Maybe a Dev can share some insights of the RRs performance in the play-tests.


• Assault Rifle: Hm, looking at the stats of the rest of the rifles, I guess the slight range buff is absolutely necessary.

The gun is easy to fit, easy to use has very good DPS, and should still be an absolute beast in close to mid-range combat.

The one thing I'm concerned about though is my personal favourite: the Tactical AR. The range nerf (-10m) is quite hefty IMO and in combination with its slow ROF, small clipsize, huge hip-fire spread I don't see me wanting to use this weapon very much anymore.

All in all it looks like we get some decent new weapons soonTM. I'm hyped!

BTW I made s small spreadsheet with what all the weapons stats will look like with those changes. Including RPM and DPS for each weapon: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AkgH4oyiFeUAdFpjQW0wRExKazF6empxY0R2Rm9iV3c&usp=sharing

EDIT: Oh, also, please nerf ForgeGuns into oblivion. Those tower FG snipers are ******* annoying.

The base assault rifle is a "assault", fires in fast automatic fire.
Also gets a breach variant.
Also gets a burst variant.
Also gets a tactical variant.
So assault rifle is missing NOTHING, and gets EVERYTHING.

We wouldn't want to train anything but the gallente assault rifle , obviously.

There's no need to account for damage mods or proficiency when no amount of those are going to raise 2,000 damage to 6,000. And I'm using the current stats. 6 missiles at 330 damage. The bonus to armor would help a little, but I even gave you the benefit of the doubt and assumed you had no resistances (in which case you deserve to lose the tank).

One thing you guys should be aware of is that the Rail Rifle (all variants) have a 0.2 second charge time before they start firing at full auto (so it goes charge -> fire -> fire, not charge -> fire -> charge -> fire)