*Decloak to weapon swap speed

Seems a bit fast for my own tastes but we don't need to bring this far too high it becomes a frustration and cumbersome and ruin the edge of a surprise attack. 2.5 sec max and lets try it 0.5 increments at a time

Forums are a super minority but why does your opinion outweighs everyone else's that comes to the forums? Your own personal opinion doesn't reflect the entire player base either.

When companies do their surveys, do they use one person's opinion or do they take a selected number of people for their control group? Although 100% of the community do not come to the forums....those that do is a better reflection than one man's opinion.

Secondly, you take the side which has the most supporters. I could be 1 out of 100 people asking for sights to weapons and gun customization. The other 99 could be against it with silly arguments for why there shouldn't be full gun customization. You still have to push for no gun customization because that better reflects the community's opinion.

Not to mention that who determines who's "most reasonable"???

One thing about IWS, he does listen to and for reasonable discussion. He spent a lot of time with us scouts, and it was greatly appreciated. Plus, he's actually a fun dude to have chip in on the inanity.

BUT~! I really wish he'd change his focus to getting bugs fixed and improving UI vs nerf campaigns. One thing that has been proven time and time again, is that CCP doesn't even really listen to the CPM anyways.

I think CCP is on a really good path finally, and 1.9 is looking up. I hope they move forward versus too much tinkering with stuff they get right.

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1999870#post1999870

I can sit and listen to your concerns just as much. What I do after that, you won't know.

There are topics I don't touch because of the nature of next and upcoming rendering the fight invalid.

I could work with these.

I get that, but his actions speak to me. He walked the walk and talked the talk in the scout forum.

What more do you want from the guy? He isn't saying anything outrageous. it's completely logical, and what a decent representative would do. That is how politics work.

My opinion is one of cpm; if you disagree with my views find another cpm that will; CPM Nova Knife is the most polar opposite of me in terms of stances on topics. I am more of a tuning fork that intelligent thoughtful and reasonable members of the community can strike a proper tune with. I reverberate their stances. I have nearly pitched for all play styles so far and suffered as they has as a player.

If you feel your voice is getting drowned out draw a truely good case for your own cause or find someone who can make that case for you really well and support them the best you can; CCP community team will pick it up. Those people you support typically become community leaders the CPM do listen to and often these folks wind up becoming nearly as influential or if not cpm themselves. Poor cases and poor passion is the reason why so many issues go mostly ignored or get defeated easily. There are people with very similar voice weight as the cpm save for the fact they don't have NDAs is the only thing separating the cpm from those great individuals.

Polls are an ultra minority with less than 0.0% of the community involved usually; let me ask what was the last poll you filled out? Last poll had less than 120 participants involved.

As for community driven changes done by other companies ask SOE's roadmap; plenty of negative score items getting developed first over the items that received multiple hundreds in the score.

Or worse yet the polls are poorly constructed; for example FFXIV ARR asked about what kind of new race players would like to see and one poll result was excessively overwhelming because it mentioned the bunny girls from ffxii. When in fact yoshi (creative director) wanted something more draconian and despite the poll results it seems the new race will be draconian like.

Hell there was one poll sent out by the Eve online team that errored out if you answered you where a female gamer on the poll declaring you were done with the survey.

UPDATE:
The 6 at STD, 7 at ADV, 8 at PRO mod slot plan would make mediums competitive, & slayer brick-tanked scouts won't be able to out-tank and outperform medium frames at their own jobs. There is no need to nerf scouts, simply raise mod slot count on medium suits and the brick-tanked scouts won't be an issue.


There are big problems with the medium frame slot layouts that need to be addressed. "Too long; didn't read" (TL;DR) version on post 2 (click here).



Slayer logi issue originates from the logis to tank more HP than their assault counterparts, allowing them to be more survivable killing platforms. This problem won't truly go away until the slots are handled correctly, just right now brick-tank scouts are bigger issue.

Logis sacrifice sidearms, mobility, & base HP in exchange for for 2-3 more equipment (equip) slots than their assault counterparts. That seems like a fair deal, but on top of the 2 or 3 more equip slots, there is some crazy weirdness with the slot layouts that leads to imbalance.

- At standard (STD) tier all logis (with the odd exception of the Amarr (Am) one) have inferior module (mod) slot layouts compared to the STD assault counterparts.
- Advanced (ADV) tier logis either get equal or superior mod slot layouts compared to their ADV assault counterparts.
- Prototype (PRO) tier logis all gain an extra low slot than their PRO assault counterpart, the caldari one also gains an extra high slot also.

Summary: logis underpowered (UP) at STD tier, balanced or overpowered (OP) at ADV, & all OP at PRO.

No reason for the Caldari (Cal) logi only having 2 equip at STD instead of 3; it isn't gaining anything extra compared to other STD logis or its assault counterpart for the sacrifice. The STD Cal logi is UP even compared to the other UP STD logis.

There is also the issue of the Am medium slot layouts. 1.8 has Am mediums shifting from hybrid tanking (equal shields & armor) to predominantly having armor; this requires a slot layout change of more low slots for effective armor tanking. Right now the progression of Am mediums is odd, they start with more high slots (2 at militia (MLT) & STD).

Am assault has less mod slots than other assaults. Yes it has a tiny 30 more base HP than the Caldari and Gallente assault, a small advantage already countered by being the slowest assault. It should be noted that the Am scout, Am sentinel, & Am commando also has more base HP compared to the other races' dropsuits of the same roles, yet these other Am suits aren't forced to give up a slot; they shouldn't have to give up a slot, and neither should the Am assault since the extra HP is already balanced by the speed loss. This problem makes the Am assault suffer the most from the brick-tanked scout problem, since the Am scout has more mod slots at STD-ADV than the assault, and same mod slot count at PRO; this allows the Am scout to surpass the Am assault in HP, while being faster, having a 2nd equip, stealthier, etc.

Give basic frames a purpose, in 1.8 there is 36 STD-PRO basic frames; way too many suits in the game to have be completely useless; useless because they're inferior versions of the specialized suits (ex: assaults, scouts, etc), & they can't even be used as a way to save money since they cost the same as the specialized suits; there is no reason to use a basic frame after unlocking specialization. We should never have 36 items that are worthless. For more on the basic frame issue go here.

Basic mediums should be generalized middle-ground between the assault & logi, it would make the assault truly specialized by comparison instead of just being basic frames with bonuses added. It would also give players the ability to test-drive both assault & logi roles before specializing; right now you can test out the assault role with a basic medium, but can't test a logi role with their parent basic frame. Current set up is bad for testing roles.




Part 1: assault & logi

Give the Cal logistics 3 equip slots at STD. Also 4 equip at PRO (reduce mod slot from 9 to 8 in exchange).

Give all assaults the same number of mod slots.

Equalize the mod slot layouts for assaults & logis of the same race & tier:

Assault & logi STD (high/low)
Am: 2/4
Ga: 2/4
Ca: 4/2 (+1 equip for logi)
Min: 3/3

Assault & logi ADV
Am: 2/5
Ga: 3/4
Ca: 5/2
Min: 4/3

Assault & logi PRO
Am: 3/5
Ga: 3/5
Ca: 5/3 (+1 equip for logi)
Min: 4/4

Part 2: basic medium frames
To fix the aforementioned issue, basic medium frames should have:

One more equip for a total of 2; this is why the Cal & Am STD logis should have at least 3 to start out with, it is to differentiate them from my proposed basic mediums.

1 less mod slot than their assault & logi counterparts. This is a tradeoff for more mod slots.

Basic medium MLT (high/low/equip)
Am: 2/2/2
Ga: 1/3/2
Ca: 3/1/2
Min: 2/1/2

Basic medium STD
Am: 2/3/2
Ga: 2/3/2
Ca: 3/2/2
Min: 3/2/2

Basic medium ADV
Am: 2/4/2
Ga: 2/4/2
Ca: 4/2/2
Min: 3/3/2

Basic medium PRO
Am: 3/4/2
Ga: 2/5/2
Ca: 5/2/2
Min: 4/3/2

Something else I'm not sure has been said yet, but you really don't need cloaks for stealthy gameplay. Day one of 1.8 I skilled an alt into gal scout with an HK4M shotgun (never trained any skills for it) and a basic cloak. I didn't need the cloak to be stealthy. The fact of the matter was that I was already effectively invisible because I wasn't on the radar. All I had to do was detect the bad guys and, since I know what direction they're facing, make sure I was standing behind something when they looked my way. Then when they would walk my way I'd hit the cloak, let them pass and then follow them to a spot where I'd ambush them. I even did this against 3 guys at once and killed two of them before the last guy took me down because I tried to kill him too instead of jumping over something and recloaking. On a character with around 4 million total SP. I had like 300 hp on that suit at most. I didn't need the cloak to do that, I could have just shot him in the head with my shotgun at point blank range as soon as he came into view. I used the cloak to make it easier to set up that kind of ambush.

.

Exactly it......people are acting as if they need cloaking to be stealthy. You can't see scouts on your radar as it is...especially since the scanner nerf. Cloaking has just allowed people to be cheesy..running around invisible for 15 mins

No problems with cloaks. Tanked scouts are a problem only because medium frames

There are scanner bugs it seems though waiting on fixes for those.

what bugs? I'm glad scanners got nerfed into oblivion. Big time crutch.

what bugs? I'm glad scanners got nerfed into oblivion. Big time crutch.

Sorry but all manners of people do complain to me about every issue not just on the cloak subject.

hypocrite

What are you apologizing for? I'm just asking what bugs do the scanners have because I'm not aware of it. I used it to see the changes and I saw the changes as CCP stated.

If you want to fix this problem, if you consider it that, you need to make it so that cloaking is an either or proposition. People who are asking for even more slots on Assault and Logi suits are absolutely out of control. As a scout, pre-1.8, it was true - you could be "stealthy" but no more stealthy than any other suit in the game. It's true that on SOME radars you wouldn't show up, but most suits had a scan radius of 10 or something pre-1.8. So nobody used passive scanning anyway. They relied on their eyes. And scouts were just as visible as they've any other suit in that situation. Compound on to that OP rifles like the RR, CR, AR and SR (the latter two OP to a scout with 250 eHP) and scouts were needlessly slaughtered. We weren't (and aren't) fast enough to get away and we had no real method of actual "stealth". We could be sneaky, but we could be sneaky in a gallente assault suit with more slots, more PG and more CPU and more base armor and shields. The cloak was supposed to even the battle field. Scouts would still be squishy, but at least, if they were smart, they had a functional game mechanic that could help them overcome their inherent disadvantages. (for instance, if you're defending a point that suddenly gets overrun, you can hide, cloak, passive scan and wait for the opposing squad to leave before undoing their work - simple, annoying, efficient scouting).

The problem is "scouts" with 200 shields and 750 armor. I don't like these people. They're not now, nor have they ever been real scouts. They are assault holdovers from 1.7 who used to role in a gallente logi with 5 complex armor plates and damage modifiers up the wazoo. Now, they're fully brick tanked, running around in a cloak and are abusing, destroying, tarnishing everything the scout community has waited SO INCREDIBLY LONG for. They will inevitably say that "this is new eden", "all's fair" "it's a valid fitting" --- but everyone knows you're just abusing the game mechanic because you've invested so much of yourself in your KD/R that you don't care if you ruin the game for everyone so long as you protect your win button. Seriously.

That is why I am suggesting that fittings in which a cloak is used have a 50 to 75% reduction in armor and shield mod efficacy. brick tanking won't be a real issue then. Real scouts can continue to fight - not as light assault suits, but as paper-tin, invisible, fast, menaces on the battle field.

For?

Why should I explain the bugs when the first words out of your mouth was declaration you don't care for scanner's plight? Maybe someone else will be nicer to explain what is current broken with them.

I like people who think and see the bigger meta that is evolving.

Cloaks do what they're supposed to do, I don't know what you expect. They're pretty easy to spot while moving, and they don't allow you to use your weapon (without a bug, which will be fixed anyway).
Tanked scouts however are an issue because they can reach 700+ HP while still being faster, stealthier, better passive scanners, and having a 2nd equipment slot. They make assaults completely obsolete. While it is a problem, I don't think the issue is to keep scouts from being to tank HP; the game is about customizing your fit to be what you want to be, so if you want to tank your scout, you should be able to, this is why I think a better route would be to buff and change medium frame slot layouts so they won't be outdone at their own role by scouts.

Cloaks do what they're supposed to do, I don't know what you expect. They're pretty easy to spot while moving, and they don't allow you to use your weapon (without a bug, which will be fixed anyway).
Tanked scouts however are an issue because they can reach 700+ HP while still being faster, stealthier, better passive scanners, and having a 2nd equipment slot. They make assaults completely obsolete. While it is a problem, I don't think the issue is to keep scouts from being to tank HP; the game is about customizing your fit to be what you want to be, so if you want to tank your scout, you should be able to, this is why I think a better route would be to buff and change medium frame slot layouts so they won't be outdone at their own role by scouts.

Cloaks can still do what they're meant to do without having to make a player invisible for the whole game...or acting like a force field.

ARs, CRs, etc did what they were supposed to as well. They killed you...yet the community yelled for a nerf and received it. That applies to most nerfs that this game has seen.

As far as suits being restricted to what they were designed for...the only suit restricted is the assault suit. You can still be a logi/slayer, scout/slayer, and even heavies running around with ARs and RRs, etc. Brick tanking or not, I don't believe scouts were meant to be cqc slayers. Yet that's how they all play...its all hypocritical

ARs, CRs, etc did what they were supposed to as well. They killed you...yet the community yelled for a nerf and received it. That applies to most nerfs that this game has seen.