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TheGoebel
Kite Co. Couriers
93
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Posted - 2013.07.26 16:58:00 -
[631] - Quote
Text Grant wrote:Gorgoth24Reborn wrote:Text Grant wrote:Are the devs just in denial about how much armor sucks or do they hate us? The problem is that overpowered gets balanced before underpowered. CCP is still balancing flaylocks, log suits, contact nades, murder taxis, etc. trying to knock all the overpowered stuff into line. It's only after this that I see them taking a serious look at underpowered things. This is besides the token advance in armor tanking given in 1.2 which, let's face it, didn't improve armor tanking by leaps and bounds. Or at all. It helped sheild tankers and commandos 1.2 was pretty awful. We first saw the numbers in an E3 video. We knew they wouldn't work and created this thread to say so. That's right, this 32 page post is only a month old and was created to balance those new modules before they came out. As you can tell it was an abject failure.
Worst yet there are so many issues on CCP's plate that it's like we just got a drink by a busy bartender, it's wrong but we'll never get a chance to order again. |
Mobius Wyvern
BetaMax. CRONOS.
2705
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Posted - 2013.07.26 21:20:00 -
[632] - Quote
TheGoebel wrote:Text Grant wrote:Gorgoth24Reborn wrote:Text Grant wrote:Are the devs just in denial about how much armor sucks or do they hate us? The problem is that overpowered gets balanced before underpowered. CCP is still balancing flaylocks, log suits, contact nades, murder taxis, etc. trying to knock all the overpowered stuff into line. It's only after this that I see them taking a serious look at underpowered things. This is besides the token advance in armor tanking given in 1.2 which, let's face it, didn't improve armor tanking by leaps and bounds. Or at all. It helped sheild tankers and commandos 1.2 was pretty awful. We first saw the numbers in an E3 video. We knew they wouldn't work and created this thread to say so. That's right, this 32 page post is only a month old and was created to balance those new modules before they came out. As you can tell it was an abject failure. Worst yet there are so many issues on CCP's plate that it's like we just got a drink by a busy bartender, it's wrong but we'll never get a chance to order again. After reading the CPM AMA transcript, I'm confident that we're going to see a change in the balance work coming out of CCP.
I will agree though, that having been given the numbers accidentally via the Market scroll in that trailer, and suggesting that they were non-optimal, we still ended up with them released the way we had feared.
Actually, there was even a Dev post in one of the threads on the topic "reminding people that all values are subject to change before deployment".
Welp. |
TheGoebel
Kite Co. Couriers
93
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Posted - 2013.07.28 04:07:00 -
[633] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:TheGoebel wrote:Text Grant wrote:Gorgoth24Reborn wrote: The problem is that overpowered gets balanced before underpowered. CCP is still balancing flaylocks, log suits, contact nades, murder taxis, etc. trying to knock all the overpowered stuff into line. It's only after this that I see them taking a serious look at underpowered things. This is besides the token advance in armor tanking given in 1.2 which, let's face it, didn't improve armor tanking by leaps and bounds.
Or at all. It helped sheild tankers and commandos 1.2 was pretty awful. We first saw the numbers in an E3 video. We knew they wouldn't work and created this thread to say so. That's right, this 32 page post is only a month old and was created to balance those new modules before they came out. As you can tell it was an abject failure. Worst yet there are so many issues on CCP's plate that it's like we just got a drink by a busy bartender, it's wrong but we'll never get a chance to order again. After reading the CPM AMA transcript, I'm confident that we're going to see a change in the balance work coming out of CCP. I will agree though, that having been given the numbers accidentally via the Market scroll in that trailer, and suggesting that they were non-optimal, we still ended up with them released the way we had feared. Actually, there was even a Dev post in one of the threads on the topic "reminding people that all values are subject to change before deployment". Welp.
Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Bonuses?
CCP Remnant has expressed he wanted to get the bonus system up to part in current design. While this would see like a short sight in design this is probably largely attributed to 'deadline design.' But with the new bonus system things can get far more interesting on the current suits in buffing or niching every class into its own corner much better giving even the base suits a reason for their use that would make those familiar with eve instantly recognizable in the Tech 1 to Tech 2 progression strengths and weaknesses of every role. So interesting bonuses such as Amarr and Gallente relationship with armor tanking with one focusing on hp the later on speed.
So this'll help. Couldn't tell when this is going to happen. I've been on a rage-cation for a bit here, I guess I'll stay put.
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Alena Ventrallis
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
28
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Posted - 2013.07.29 08:23:00 -
[634] - Quote
Bump |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
466
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Posted - 2013.07.29 20:38:00 -
[635] - Quote
still no dev response... |
TheGoebel
Kite Co. Couriers
93
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Posted - 2013.07.30 00:53:00 -
[636] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:still no dev response... I too would enjoy some news on this subject. They've put out twice as many dev blogs this year then the last two years combined so I know they are communicating finally but why the silence on this? |
Alena Ventrallis
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
30
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Posted - 2013.07.30 18:29:00 -
[637] - Quote
Bump again. |
Cat Merc
BetaMax.
3651
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Posted - 2013.07.31 13:24:00 -
[638] - Quote
meow |
TheGoebel
Kite Co. Couriers
93
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Posted - 2013.07.31 13:30:00 -
[639] - Quote
I'm beginning to wonder/worry that the flaylock nerf is all the armor balance we're going to get. Maybe CCP thinks their new modules are fine if not for that dastardly flaylock. |
Alena Ventrallis
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
32
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Posted - 2013.08.01 02:07:00 -
[640] - Quote
Bump, because I want to mae sure CCP doesn't forget this thread.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2179
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Posted - 2013.08.01 07:03:00 -
[641] - Quote
I'm back. Still no dev response though. |
True Adamance
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
958
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Posted - 2013.08.01 07:16:00 -
[642] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:I'm back. Still no dev response though. Their constant lack of attention to this thread is incredibly worrying.... |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2179
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Posted - 2013.08.01 07:19:00 -
[643] - Quote
True Adamance wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:I'm back. Still no dev response though. Their constant lack of attention to this thread is incredibly worrying.... I hear that they're taking note, though there's no evidence of it. I believe Cat Merc also managed to talk to CCP Wolfman on IRC:
[31/07/2013 22:13:05] A kitten: News from the front: Spoke with Wolfman on IRC [31/07/2013 22:13:09] A kitten: He's working on balancing armor [31/07/2013 22:13:21] A kitten: Infact he already had new plate numbers in the testing |
Jathniel
G I A N T EoN.
733
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Posted - 2013.08.01 09:08:00 -
[644] - Quote
Another bump. A quick blue tag from Wolfman would be nice, whenever he gets the chance. |
Musta Tornius
Cannonfodder PMC
541
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Posted - 2013.08.01 09:44:00 -
[645] - Quote
Confirming that CCP Wolfman spoke to the kitty. Unfortunately he wouldn't give us any armour numbers quite yet as they were still debating with CCP Remnant about specifics. So we still have to wait a while but at least it's being worked on which is great! |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2180
|
Posted - 2013.08.01 10:32:00 -
[646] - Quote
Musta Tornius wrote:Confirming that CCP Wolfman spoke to the kitty. Unfortunately he wouldn't give us any armour numbers quite yet as they were still debating with CCP Remnant about specifics. So we still have to wait a while but at least it's being worked on which is great! Thanks for additional confirmation. This is good news! |
BL4CKST4R
warravens League of Infamy
873
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Posted - 2013.08.01 23:57:00 -
[647] - Quote
Bump |
Text Grant
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
59
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Posted - 2013.08.02 09:50:00 -
[648] - Quote
Bump |
BL4CKST4R
warravens League of Infamy
876
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Posted - 2013.08.02 09:58:00 -
[649] - Quote
Was playing academy yesterday and I noticed most new players are Gallente. I really hope they fix the suits soon because that might be part of the bad NPE. |
Cat Merc
BetaMax.
3743
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Posted - 2013.08.02 17:09:00 -
[650] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Was playing academy yesterday and I noticed most new players are Gallente. I really hope they fix the suits soon because that might be part of the bad NPE. The tutorial should tell them: "Oh, you're Gallente? Go Caldari or be ready to be punished!". |
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Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1381
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 00:45:00 -
[651] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Was playing academy yesterday and I noticed most new players are Gallente. I really hope they fix the suits soon because that might be part of the bad NPE. It might also effect the level of saturation within the meta of explosive damage. If the easy, and most frequent, kills are to be had against armor then a trend towards use of weapons which punish armor would make sense. Why kill one shield tanker when you can take out 3 armor tankers instead? (hence the vital need for diverse tanking methods which maintain parity, because without it the whole context of the game could slowly become distorted). |
BL4CKST4R
warravens League of Infamy
882
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 01:22:00 -
[652] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Was playing academy yesterday and I noticed most new players are Gallente. I really hope they fix the suits soon because that might be part of the bad NPE. It might also effect the level of saturation within the meta of explosive damage. If the easy, and most frequent, kills are to be had against armor then a trend towards use of weapons which punish armor would make sense. Why kill one shield tanker when you can take out 3 armor tankers instead? (hence the vital need for diverse tanking methods which maintain parity, because without it the whole context of the game could slowly become distorted).
It might even go as far as to where new players are told specifically not to level up Gallente and Amarr suits by other, experienced, players leading to a greater division between armor and shield tanking by player count alone. And then of course comes the part where the player base becomes comfortable with the majority being shield tankers that when armor tanking becomes useful players will cry OP and thus we will be nerfed So the sooner the fixes come the better.
EDIT: I feel I am threading close to the tinfoil debacle. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1382
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 06:52:00 -
[653] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Cross Atu wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Was playing academy yesterday and I noticed most new players are Gallente. I really hope they fix the suits soon because that might be part of the bad NPE. It might also effect the level of saturation within the meta of explosive damage. If the easy, and most frequent, kills are to be had against armor then a trend towards use of weapons which punish armor would make sense. Why kill one shield tanker when you can take out 3 armor tankers instead? (hence the vital need for diverse tanking methods which maintain parity, because without it the whole context of the game could slowly become distorted). It might even go as far as to where new players are told specifically not to level up Gallente and Amarr suits by other, experienced, players leading to a greater division between armor and shield tanking by player count alone. And then of course comes the part where the player base becomes comfortable with the majority being shield tankers that when armor tanking becomes useful players will cry OP and thus we will be nerfed So the sooner the fixes come the better. EDIT: I feel I am threading close to the tinfoil debacle. lol
It wouldn't be the first time something like that has happened in an MMO. However having seen how CCP copes with balance in the long term I have more confidence in the outcome for Dust.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2270
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 07:37:00 -
[654] - Quote
I wish the explosive damage was 120%/80% rather than 135%/70% - I keep getting instagibbed by grenade spam or mass drivers today.
EDIT: I know that's meant to be coming but I'm pretty sure it's not here yet. |
Text Grant
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
60
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Posted - 2013.08.03 22:07:00 -
[655] - Quote
Mass drivers are the new FOTM. Ever noticed how this has 30+ pages and no blue posts? |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2295
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 22:09:00 -
[656] - Quote
Text Grant wrote:Mass drivers are the new FOTM. Ever noticed how this has 30+ pages and no blue posts? They do seem to be very common right now. I'm reserving judgement on them until explosive damage is tweaked so they don't instagib me. |
kellyn whiteheart
ZionTCD
55
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Posted - 2013.08.03 22:31:00 -
[657] - Quote
i think the simplest stop gap at minimum should be just increasing the armor of all plates. ferroscale and reactive. that would help by giving more buffer then shields. making it so they can go toe to toe longer. just my opinion. after that a high slot armor mod would be nice. a damage reducer almost like what vehicles have would be nice. i think it was mentioned earlier |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
894
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Posted - 2013.08.03 23:02:00 -
[658] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Text Grant wrote:Mass drivers are the new FOTM. Ever noticed how this has 30+ pages and no blue posts? They do seem to be very common right now. I'm reserving judgement on them until explosive damage is tweaked so they don't instagib me.
Is there confirmation of explosive tweaking? |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
2295
|
Posted - 2013.08.03 23:04:00 -
[659] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Text Grant wrote:Mass drivers are the new FOTM. Ever noticed how this has 30+ pages and no blue posts? They do seem to be very common right now. I'm reserving judgement on them until explosive damage is tweaked so they don't instagib me. Is there confirmation of explosive tweaking?
Yes. There was a devblog saying that it would be 120% vs armour and 80% vs shields in the future instead of 135% vs armour and 70% vs shields. |
Text Grant
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
64
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Posted - 2013.08.04 18:43:00 -
[660] - Quote
Explosive dampening isn't enough. A resistance to damage added to the plates or put in a high slot would be happily accepted. |
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