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zzZaXxx
The Exemplars
4
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Posted - 2013.06.26 21:08:00 -
[181] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:zzZaXxx wrote:The Ferroscale Plates are basically equivalent to shield extenders....except they don't benefit from passive recharge of course so they have to make room for reppers so only hald as effective as shield extenders. CCP am I missing something or are you? Quite. This is only one part of the problem, though. It'd be nice to see CCP realise that the solution is not just chucking on new (and bad) modules.
Yes. You pretty much provided the solution.
A) Increase plating HP across the board. B) Balance plating movement penalties. C) Increase armor repairer rep amount, while causing it to diminish over time D) Give Gallente (and Amarr?) dropsuits appropriate specs and bonuses E) Overhaul these new plates
I would add
F) Move Armor Repairers to high slots |
zzZaXxx
The Exemplars
4
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Posted - 2013.06.26 21:09:00 -
[182] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:zzZaXxx wrote:Quote:They're adding new stuff for shields. I doubt it'll actually be effective given the stated purpose, but if it is good then that'll throw the balance even further out of whack What's their stated purpose, I can't see any mention of that in the blog, do you have a link? At fanfest they said they'd reduce overall shield HP in favour of increasing regen. Somewhat like flux coils in EvE - which nobody uses, incidentally. Interesting to know, also yeah I've never seen an EVE ship with a flux coil fit (not that my even knowledge is exhaustive). Thanks for the info Cheers, Cross Shield Energizers would be useful for Caldari Proto Logi since they can have 660hp shield tanks with only 20hp/sec recharge, which would take forever. This mod could bring buffer and recharge more into balance, assuming there's a reason to use it instead of the current Shield Recharger mods. The reason is probably either lower fitting costs or better recharge bonus. Yes, they'd be useful for the currently superior tank. However, then you look at the other end, armour, where you have people with 450 HP and 12/13 HP/s. -only- 20 HP/s regen is nearly twice as much as a pair of complex repairers can regen. Buffing that significantly would make armour repairers completely laughable in comparison to shield regen.
Well maybe once armor becomes completely laughable they'll do something about it. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1215
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Posted - 2013.06.26 21:47:00 -
[183] - Quote
zzZaXxx wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:zzZaXxx wrote:The Ferroscale Plates are basically equivalent to shield extenders....except they don't benefit from passive recharge of course so they have to make room for reppers so only hald as effective as shield extenders. CCP am I missing something or are you? Quite. This is only one part of the problem, though. It'd be nice to see CCP realise that the solution is not just chucking on new (and bad) modules. Yes. You pretty much provided the solution. A) Increase plating HP across the board. B) Balance plating movement penalties. C) Increase armor repairer rep amount, while causing it to diminish over time D) Give Gallente (and Amarr?) dropsuits appropriate specs and bonuses E) Overhaul these new plates I would add F) Move Armor Repairers to high slots Pretty much, tho I'm of the opinion that "F" should be "put Reactive Plates in high slots", but it seems I may be in the minority with regards to this. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1323
|
Posted - 2013.06.26 21:55:00 -
[184] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:zzZaXxx wrote: Yes. You pretty much provided the solution.
A) Increase plating HP across the board. B) Balance plating movement penalties. C) Increase armor repairer rep amount, while causing it to diminish over time D) Give Gallente (and Amarr?) dropsuits appropriate specs and bonuses E) Overhaul these new plates
I would add
F) Move Armor Repairers to high slots
Pretty much, tho I'm of the opinion that "F" should be "put Reactive Plates in high slots", but it seems I may be in the minority with regards to this.
I would much rather see reactive plates in high slots than armor repairers in low slots. Frankly, though, either would make armour far, far stronger. |
zzZaXxx
The Exemplars
4
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Posted - 2013.06.27 00:22:00 -
[185] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Cross Atu wrote:zzZaXxx wrote: Yes. You pretty much provided the solution.
A) Increase plating HP across the board. B) Balance plating movement penalties. C) Increase armor repairer rep amount, while causing it to diminish over time D) Give Gallente (and Amarr?) dropsuits appropriate specs and bonuses E) Overhaul these new plates
I would add
F) Move Armor Repairers to high slots
Pretty much, tho I'm of the opinion that "F" should be "put Reactive Plates in high slots", but it seems I may be in the minority with regards to this. I would much rather see reactive plates in high slots than armor repairers in low slots. Frankly, though, either would make armour far, far stronger.
Armor repairers are already in low slots. Typo? |
TheGoebel
Kite Co. Couriers
4
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Posted - 2013.06.27 00:36:00 -
[186] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:
At fanfest they said they'd reduce overall shield HP in favour of increasing regen. Somewhat like flux coils in EvE - which nobody uses, incidentally.
Lets be fair here, eve shields are vastly different things. The reason flux coils don't work is because shield regen is tied to a timer, not a set amount. What I'm trying to say spaceship shields go from zero to full in five minutes(for example), the more potential shields you have the more points you get per second. While mercenary shields receive a set amount of points per cycle. I don't feel I've explained this well so I'm sorry. I'll try to answer any questions best as possible. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1327
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 07:24:00 -
[187] - Quote
zzZaXxx wrote:
Armor repairers are already in low slots. Typo?
Yes. This has now been fixed. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1220
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 07:29:00 -
[188] - Quote
TheGoebel wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: At fanfest they said they'd reduce overall shield HP in favour of increasing regen. Somewhat like flux coils in EvE - which nobody uses, incidentally.
Cross Atu wrote:Interesting to know, also yeah I've never seen an EVE ship with a flux coil fit (not that my even knowledge is exhaustive). Thanks for the info Cheers, Cross Lets be fair here, eve shields are vastly different things. The reason flux coils don't work is because shield regen is tied to a timer, not a set amount. What I'm trying to say spaceship shields go from zero to full in five minutes(for example), the more potential shields you have the more points you get per second. So if you're looking for high per second regen you have two options, less shields with a flux or more shields with about anything else. While mercenary shields receive a set amount of points per cycle. I don't feel I've explained this well so I'm sorry. I'll try to answer any questions best as possible.
If I'm following you properly you're citing the difference in the way Merc shields and Ship shields regen? Ships being scaled based while Mercs are pegged to a raw number, thus making something like the flux coil of more potential value to a Merc than it is if fitted on a ship?
If that's the case I would tend to agree it's more useful ground side than it is in EVE, is that what you were getting at?
Cheers, Cross |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1328
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 07:38:00 -
[189] - Quote
There's a rumour going around that flux coils will only affect base shield HP and not the HP given by extenders. This would be quite bad. I'm going to see if I can get confirmation. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1220
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 08:10:00 -
[190] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:There's a rumour going around that flux coils will only affect base shield HP and not the HP given by extenders. This would be quite bad. I'm going to see if I can get confirmation. So, trade a % of base suit shield HP for a higher overall total regen rate?
Yeah it'd be good to know if that's going to happen, if you do find confirmation on that post it here please and thank you.
~Cross |
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zzZaXxx
The Exemplars
4
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Posted - 2013.06.27 08:30:00 -
[191] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:There's a rumour going around that flux coils will only affect base shield HP and not the HP given by extenders. This would be quite bad. I'm going to see if I can get confirmation.
That would be in keeping with the Shield Upgrades bonus. I bet that's the case. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1328
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 10:42:00 -
[192] - Quote
zzZaXxx wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:There's a rumour going around that flux coils will only affect base shield HP and not the HP given by extenders. This would be quite bad. I'm going to see if I can get confirmation. That would be in keeping with the Shield Upgrades bonus. I bet that's the case. It does make sense, given the current state of maths, but it trivialises the penalty. One thing I'd really like to know is if it's a low slot or a high slot module. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
327
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 10:50:00 -
[193] - Quote
any idea on the stats of the armor modules? |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1328
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 11:03:00 -
[194] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:any idea on the stats of the armor modules? Haven't you seen them yet? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_LlH2c5dyA 1:10 in. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
327
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:25:00 -
[195] - Quote
I meant if they made any changes to those stats |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1330
|
Posted - 2013.06.27 14:29:00 -
[196] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:I meant if they made any changes to those stats Then no. Dev communication is as usual on the subject. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1234
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Posted - 2013.06.28 19:17:00 -
[197] - Quote
bump |
Sgt Kirk
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
717
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Posted - 2013.06.28 21:54:00 -
[198] - Quote
I would also like to point out (if you missed it I'm not sure) that the CPU enhancers take no CPU/PG to fit while PG enhancer modules take a nice but of CPU.
P.S. CCP will forever favor Caldari/Shields. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1367
|
Posted - 2013.06.28 21:55:00 -
[199] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:I would also like to point out (if you missed it I'm not sure) that the CPU enhancers take no CPU/PG to fit while PG enhancer modules take a nice but of CPU.
P.S. CCP will forever favor Caldari/Shields.
Added to the OP. Thanks for pointing that out. |
Aythadis Smith
The Generals EoN.
28
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Posted - 2013.06.29 02:05:00 -
[200] - Quote
Shields don't rust
Kudos on the thread
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
327
|
Posted - 2013.06.29 02:50:00 -
[201] - Quote
Aythadis Smith wrote:Shields don't rust
Kudos on the thread
You would think thousands of years into the future, with the advancement of technology and humanity as a whole we would stop using iron and steel as armor and use organic compounds which are lighter, stronger, can be organically mass produced, oh and they don't rust.
We know of these organic compounds today, by the way.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fullerene
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphene |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1382
|
Posted - 2013.06.29 12:44:00 -
[202] - Quote
The section on dual tanking will be up soon(tm). |
DRDEEZENUTSZ TWOpointo
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2013.06.29 16:01:00 -
[203] - Quote
I think it will be a bad idea for armor repairs to be in a high slot cause that will hurt armarr dual tanking abilities cause then they have to choose between extenders or armor repair which will make them worse then gallente and caldari. Reactive plates in the highs are better so Gallente can easily buff there total armor and regeneration. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1397
|
Posted - 2013.06.29 22:20:00 -
[204] - Quote
DRDEEZENUTSZ TWOpointo wrote:I think it will be a bad idea for armor repairs to be in a high slot cause that will hurt armarr dual tanking abilities cause then they have to choose between extenders or armor repair which will make them worse then gallente and caldari. Reactive plates in the highs are better so Gallente can easily buff there total armor and regeneration.
The Amarr dropsuits aren't particularly well done right now. I think it would be better to have an emphasis on a properly built and focused single tank rather than stacking modules for a dual tank - more on this when I finish the next section. |
DRDEEZENUTSZ TWOpointo
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
1
|
Posted - 2013.06.30 03:47:00 -
[205] - Quote
I think it will be a good idea to have standard plates like the ones you suggested with 230 hp and 10% speed reduction so they will be high h p and low fitting requirements but high speed reduction.
Reactive should be med h p and repair and be in high slot but have the highest requirement and med speed reduction so you can't Stack too many without being strapped for resources.
Armor repair should be the same as you suggested higher repair but gets slower as the battle continues these should have the 2nd highest requirement.
Ferro scale plates should be med h p no speed speed reduction and have med requirements.
And so the shield extenders will be low hp fast and natural regeneration but very high fitting requirements like how they are now. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1228
|
Posted - 2013.06.30 03:53:00 -
[206] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: The Amarr dropsuits aren't particularly well done right now.
Agreed and it's not just the Med frames either. I love the concept behind most of them (tho less clear on the intended role of the Sent Heavy) but the mechanical support is lacking. PG is weak on the Logi and another Low may be needed, and the Assault while it's bonus is great in flavor and theory doesn't do much good when the LR itself has been over-nerfed into a sad state that makes it less threatening than a side arm (I've taken out LR users with my SMG when they got the drop on me at long range that's just wrong I should have been a cinder).
/more on topic I'm looking forward to seeing that new section when you get it up
Cheers, Cross |
wild wendigo
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
3
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Posted - 2013.06.30 09:18:00 -
[207] - Quote
wanna thank the OP and others for doing all this skull sweat for us. I was playing as an assault but am finding the heavy class much more enjoyable right now.
Was thinking how about a high slot armor repper that at a basic level, gives the same repair output as a shield regenerator ( or whatever it's called ) and scales up the same. that would keep low slots open for plates and such. just a random thought before I hit my vacation at a medium pace. |
Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1036
|
Posted - 2013.06.30 10:32:00 -
[208] - Quote
I think a high slot module like "energized plating" that adds DR to armor would be a nice counterpoint to the Shield regulator in the low slot. The focus of shielding is already on flexibility of regen. Armor is about taking more punishment - damage resistance makes more sense to me in that context. |
Cat Merc
Oculus Felis
1319
|
Posted - 2013.06.30 16:02:00 -
[209] - Quote
meow |
DRDEEZENUTSZ TWOpointo
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2013.06.30 17:01:00 -
[210] - Quote
Hmm right now I think shields need a penalty but not Sig radius or increase hit box something like decrease in recharge bonous like 20% so they will have to sacrifice h p for better recharge which so it's like armor we have to sacrifice armor for better repair. |
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