30-40% STFU

even 25% would be a benefit. The Logistics LAV has an inherent 25% reduction to it's damage output.

I think most people are aware of the Caldari Logistics ability to tank. It's written plain as day in their description, and it's being abused under the current mechanic. Not because it's a bad mechanic, but the fact there is NO downside to running said Logi... you give up a Sidearm, to gain:

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

I have a simple solution. Reduce the damage done by logistics Suits by 30-40%, across the board. Just a flat reduction in 'weapons' damage. (So Remote Explosives, Grenades etc are still as effective, but your guns are not.)

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

Don't change anything, flux grenades are devastating enough to shield-tankers. If I hear flux going off I have to run scared because my armor is so squishy. The assault bonus just isn't that good, and most people are carrying AV grenades to cope with murder taxis. Instead of making logistics suits worthless like the crybabies want, improve the assault class bonus.

I like the logistics suit and I can be a frontline attacker if I feel like it, GTFO.

I think most people are aware of the Caldari Logistics ability to tank. It's written plain as day in their description, and it's being abused under the current mechanic. Not because it's a bad mechanic, but the fact there is NO downside to running said Logi... you give up a Sidearm, to gain:

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

I have a simple solution. Reduce the damage done by logistics Suits by 30-40%, across the board. Just a flat reduction in 'weapons' damage. (So Remote Explosives, Grenades etc are still as effective, but your guns are not.)

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

You must be drunk, please go home.

If this were to happen I would drop my controller, delete Dust 514 and move on. You must have never played a logistics suit, if you did you would know that, aside from the CaLogi, we are extremely weak in the battlefield in terms of EHP and Mobility, and we can't defend ourselves well in 1v1 combat if we run out of ammo. No logistics suit can surpass its assault variant in terms of EHP and speed, except for the CaLogi, even with more PG and CPU, all it means is that we can use proto modules a little bit faster before we need CPU/PG skills but in the long run a assault suit is able to use all proto modules and a proto weapon, and have enough PG/CPU left for a nanohive.

@Jackal
Amarr LKogistics bonus increases survivability.

It's beacuse oh his high surv that we have very very few A-logi.
Dont make me laugh, if i want surv id better go gallente or minmatar. Amar logi is ALL about versatility.
People must stop watching numbers alone and TRY before speech about. If YOU do this, you will find that Amarr suit is usefull only at his AK0 (simply because is at proto lvl that you gain Side slot) and trade it with LACK of PG Vs other Logi but also vs amarr Ass.

Cosgar made a good topic, and show people that EXCEPT of CAL LOGI, all the others Logi are inferior to their ass counterpart.
So the only issue is the CAL Logi.
feel free to search Cosgar topic.


PS: following OP line of thinking why Ass are able to replenish or use equip, thats Logi work.So let's remove all equip slot from ASS suit....
This line show how wrong your ideas are

Amarr logis get 25% on already low numbers, if they were to use all their 3 low slots on armor reppers they only get 28.44 armor repair which is only 5 more repping than any other suit with 3 armor repairs. Also forcing somebody into a playstyle is no way to build a "sandbox" FPS, we are already constrained enough in this game as it is. Also I do acknowledge that there should be some role differences but cutting our damage, thus indirectly our survivability is no way to go. Why not just buff the damage of the assault suit by 10%? Oh wait here is a little fact you don't know, aside from the Caldari every assault suit can remove a shield for a Complex damage modifier and still have more EHP/Speed/Damage than its logistics variant.

I know people hate to quote it, but EVE Online is a sandbox game... if you want to shield tank as your speciality, you can heabvily modify a normal 'armor tanking ship, and ignore bonuses, or you can fly Caldari, or Minmatar (some of them anyway)

Sandbox doesn't mean EVERY suit should be able to be played ANY way, or we should just have a single suit with 4 highs, 4 lows, Light Weapon and Sidearm. No bonuses, nothing. Just a plain, suit, capable of being fit anyway you'd like.

Your right no suit should be able to play every single way, and thats why Logistics suits are relatively weaker, slower than a Assault suit, with less offensive capabilities.

Logistics suits are not 'relatively weaker' in most respects. You can fit more, you say that you can fit modules of higher tier earlier, and that assault catch up.

A Logi with those same skills (but being logi) can fit far more. % bonuses enhance those with higher base stats, and Logis have higher base stats.

Equipment, especially in PC matches with the ability to throw down up to 6 or more drop uplinks, makes the difference. The ability to also throw down nanohives, makes a difference. Putting the Assault Suits on the back burner. Since they can fit only 1 piece of Equipment.

If Logis were nerfed by reducing their PG CPU to assault levels, it would have the same outcry, but it wouldn't hurt their ability to solo. I'd take that option. TYhis is posted as a possible solution.

There are 2 ways to stop logis being used as assaults:

1) replace the light weapon slot with a sidearm slot only
or
2) remove at least half of the hi and low slots

Logistics suits are not 'relatively weaker' in most respects. You can fit more, you say that you can fit modules of higher tier earlier, and that assault catch up.

A Logi with those same skills (but being logi) can fit far more. % bonuses enhance those with higher base stats, and Logis have higher base stats.

Logistics should be bringing support. I think the disconnect here is that many of you think logistics means medic.

I bring proto uplinks (don't remember cost) and proto nanohives (2x @ 28,000 isk). My suit costs a LOT more than an assault.

This is truly a case of pandering to stupid people if they nerf logistics suits.

The point of this debate is that Logistics SHOULD be focused on support, with lessened combat effectiveness, but greater survival.

I wouldn't say that lesser HP and a slower movement speed equals greater survival. I don't really see an adjustment for survival in your initial post?

The same as pandering to the stupid people nerfing tanks that cost far more than your Logi Suit.

The point of this debate is that Logistics SHOULD be focused on support, with lessened combat effectiveness, but greater survival.

Reducing their HP would result in them being eliminated far too fast to be of any use in the short term. This coupled with the fact that they can effectively do the same damage as an Assault means they bring two positives to the field simultaneously.

You don't look to the Guys hold a Swarm to take out Infantry at long range, nor the guy with the Shotgun.

Lower their combat effectiveness somewhat, make them less apt to be combative, but just as (in some cases more) survivable, so they are more supportive.

The same as pandering to the stupid people nerfing tanks that cost far more than your Logi Suit.

The point of this debate is that Logistics SHOULD be focused on support, with lessened combat effectiveness, but greater survival.

Reducing their HP would result in them being eliminated far too fast to be of any use in the short term. This coupled with the fact that they can effectively do the same damage as an Assault means they bring two positives to the field simultaneously.

You don't look to the Guys hold a Swarm to take out Infantry at long range, nor the guy with the Shotgun.

Lower their combat effectiveness somewhat, make them less apt to be combative, but just as (in some cases more) survivable, so they are more supportive.

Why not make the CaLogi racial bonus unstackable with the shield extender bonus and start from there? Sweeping changes are the reason we have Uprising. Let's not make the same mistake again.

Why not make the CaLogi racial bonus unstackable with the shield extender bonus and start from there? Sweeping changes are the reason we have Uprising. Let's not make the same mistake again.

I'd rather make it lower than make it not-stacking, or something else entirely. None of this "only sidearms" business though.

When I suggested limiting Logistic Suits to 1 or 2 sidearms the trade off was getting either more grenades or more equipment slots. If a suit only had 1 sidearm, it would get a extra grenade slot. If they had two sidearm slots they'd get an extra equipment slot. So while they might not be able to run AR's or SCR's, they'll be able to run both a Flaylock and an SMG or both Locus and Focus grenades.

Edit: But if you want us to use nothing but sidearms, then assaults and scouts should give up their equipment slots.

How about changing the Light Weapon Slot against a Side Arm Slot? This way they would play more like Medics. Also this would be MUCH BETTER instead of having a Dropsuit malus with "-30 to -40% Weapon Damage" I mean seriousoly. You can't seriously want that?

what about changing CalLogi bonus from buffing extenders to buffing regulaters? that would buff their survivability between gunfights instead of during gunfights

even 25% would be a benefit. The Logistics LAV has an inherent 25% reduction to it's damage output.

Also,

Caldari Logi bonus is not OP... its just that every other logi racial is crap.

Logistics passive reps is OP if anything is.

that would lower their survivability its only the caldari logi that outdoes its assault counterpart in hp

Give Logistics two side arm slots and give assaults two light weapon slots.

@Jackal
Amarr LKogistics bonus increases survivability.

It's beacuse oh his high surv that we have very very few A-logi.
Dont make me laugh, if i want surv id better go gallente or minmatar. Amar logi is ALL about versatility.
People must stop watching numbers alone and TRY before speech about. If YOU do this, you will find that Amarr suit is usefull only at his AK0 (simply because is at proto lvl that you gain Side slot) and trade it with LACK of PG Vs other Logi but also vs amarr Ass.

Cosgar made a good topic, and show people that EXCEPT of CAL LOGI, all the others Logi are inferior to their ass counterpart.
So the only issue is the CAL Logi.
feel free to search Cosgar topic.


PS: following OP line of thinking why Ass are able to replenish or use equip, thats Logi work.So let's remove all equip slot from ASS suit....
This line show how wrong your ideas are

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

+1 to avoiding sweeping changes. +20 if I could.

no one has a comment on this idea?

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

Bro, do you even Logi?

That passive HP bonus is for survivability. Logis can repair everyone else, but who repairs them?

(You forgot the
- More slots (Nine hi/lo)
which is a tremendous advantage)

There are 2 ways to stop logis being used as assaults:

1) replace the light weapon slot with a sidearm slot only
or
2) remove at least half of the hi and low slots

I hope you know ONLY proto variants have problems so why can't we give assaults 1 more slot and problem solved, stop trying to overnerf

Yes, I run Caldari Logi. I could easily fit a passive armor rep module on my suit, like any logi with 4+ lows (except amarr but they dont count since they have a completely different layout).

I'm no logi, but what if you simply took 1H and 1L and gave an additional Equip. Slot to all logis.

My proto mini logi only has 4-4-4. The Cal Logi has 5-3-4, the Gal Logi has 3-4-5. Flux vs Cal Logi nullifies whatever racial bonus and 5 high slots they have. Which other suit can claim that one piece of equipment does that to thier bonuses? Their armor amount at level 5 armor upgrades makes them a 2 bullet kill with the right gun and they may not need to rep armor but unless they use Shield regulators (maxed out) they take a good 7-10 seconds before they get any more health. Thats 7-10 seconds of kitten kitten kitten. The Caldari Logi is perfectly balanced from what I can tell. If they are causing problems for you then you obviously need flux grenades.

OFC I was talking about CAL logi which has the slot advantage in addition to racial bonus advantage on the field of survival.


Fluxes are too situational, they are far LESS scary than locus grenades even for shield tankers as you won't be instakilled but rather have nice chance to step into cover. The armor difference is not that big, excluding armor tank fits themselves.

Shield depletion recharge timer is NOT 7-10 for proto Cal Logi. With single regulator (always easily fitted) the time naked is somewhere 3-4 secs. Maybe less. And that's shield OUT timer.

Right and you still have a problem shooting and killing them? You must not have that new scrambler rifle that cuts through shields..... or a flux grenade or a logibro to resupply you with flux grenades or an RE which would insta kill that logi...

I think most people are aware of the Caldari Logistics ability to tank. It's written plain as day in their description, and it's being abused under the current mechanic. Not because it's a bad mechanic, but the fact there is NO downside to running said Logi... you give up a Sidearm, to gain:

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

I have a simple solution. Reduce the damage done by logistics Suits by 30-40%, across the board. Just a flat reduction in 'weapons' damage. (So Remote Explosives, Grenades etc are still as effective, but your guns are not.)

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

My proto mini logi only has 4-4-4. The Cal Logi has 5-3-4, the Gal Logi has 3-4-5. Flux vs Cal Logi nullifies whatever racial bonus and 5 high slots they have. Which other suit can claim that one piece of equipment does that to thier bonuses? Their armor amount at level 5 armor upgrades makes them a 2 bullet kill with the right gun and they may not need to rep armor but unless they use Shield regulators (maxed out) they take a good 7-10 seconds before they get any more health. Thats 7-10 seconds of kitten kitten kitten. The Caldari Logi is perfectly balanced from what I can tell. If they are causing problems for you then you obviously need flux grenades.

And you still think everyone pointing out things too strong are QQing as they are killed by them?

How about giving all other suit more Equipment Slots, instead?

They are all faster, except for Heavies, and more durable then us, except for Scouts, and all can kill better then use with a sidearm.

Also, Logis are the only class that can (properly) defend itself when running A/V weapons.

This, one flux and I'm squishier than a scout.

-Heavies have already been nerfed so nothing needs to be done, although making tuba noises when they walk would be funny.

The problem with that is flux grenades still suffer from the same terrain glitches as all splash damage weapons.

I think most people are aware of the Caldari Logistics ability to tank. It's written plain as day in their description, and it's being abused under the current mechanic. Not because it's a bad mechanic, but the fact there is NO downside to running said Logi... you give up a Sidearm, to gain:

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

I have a simple solution. Reduce the damage done by logistics Suits by 30-40%, across the board. Just a flat reduction in 'weapons' damage. (So Remote Explosives, Grenades etc are still as effective, but your guns are not.)

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

No that is just cruel....quite often I will have to fight off a pack of people just to revive a squad member. I need to bite just as hard as the rest.

....quite often I will have to fight off a pack of people just to revive a squad member. I need to bite just as hard as the rest.

Oh yea and BTW I only get 1 weapon.... I don't have the luxury of switching to a side arm when my bullets run out.

Logistics Suits are designed to 'Support' not Attack...

A Tanky Support member is a boon to a team.

Logistics are MEANT to be support roles. It comes with the territory.

This isn't a hi creative solution, this is a simple solution that would stop people abusing Logistics...

as stated above, giving up your sidearm for all the benefits..

While Caldari Logistics are currently the most noted, the other logistics do gain all of the above, with the exception of the Higher Shield HP.

Minmatar Hacking Bonus, indicates a Support function.

Gallente Equipment PG / CPU reduction indicates a Support function.

Amarr LKogistics bonus increases survivability.

Caldari Logistics Bonus indicates survivability.

I wouldn't question Survivability, if it was tempered by a greater reduction in it's combat ability. ala Logistics LAV.

Yes At least about this they are... No offense Cross because you raise some really good points, I believe anyone who can put together his challenge suits should and quick before CCP nerfs/buffs something out of proportion and causes unnecesary QQ.

When I find something is killing me a lot I put together a counter suit that is equally devastating to my opponent, I don't hop on here and say _______ is OP nerf it, it kills me. If you are in a position where you are killing a lot of people then you may have gotten your fit right and it is just the matchmaking system that is messed up.

Yep. You're no good as support if you're dead on the floor - a problem I constantly face in my Logi G/1 fittings, which are extremely expensive to fit if I want to be able to survive as well as support. I don't even want to skill up into the Proto Logi, as I don't see the point of it's use in pub matches ( because the risk/reward doesn't balance out) and unfortunately I do not meet the minimum SP requirements of my Corp for PC battles.

Don't change anything, flux grenades are devastating enough to shield-tankers. If I hear flux going off I have to run scared because my armor is so squishy. The assault bonus just isn't that good, and most people are carrying AV grenades to cope with murder taxis. Instead of making logistics suits worthless like the crybabies want, improve the assault class bonus.

I like the logistics suit and I can be a frontline attacker if I feel like it, GTFO.

And that's gonna help the who game how? Instead of having one OP suit you would have two? Is that a step toward balancing the game? Ppl who run heavy and lol scout are already a slim enthusiast minority.

I have something to say, regarding people saying logis are suppose to do this, assaults are suppose to do this, ok maybe there originally meant for that.... but the point of the game and the most unique part for that matter is being able to take a suit and then change it and customize to meet your needs and wants as a player. As soon as caladari heavies come out I may want a cal heavy with an assault rifle, who cares if there not suppose to use ar's, I can use the suit as w/e and in any way I want. So people quit fussing about an assault logi ffs, if you think there too good, then skill into them. Bottom line if the suits are made to only be able to run them or be effective in 1 way, for example logi being logi, well then there goes our unique one of a kind customization. The ability to be unique and diffrent in your customization, is my favorite part of this game, and truly makes it diffrent from all others. Dont encourage ccp to ruin the game plz, if you dont like it, play blk ops.

To use an EVE term, you don't fit a Logistics Cruiser to do Damage, you fit it to repair and re-energize... if you want an Attack Cruiser, buy one.

But this is not EVE, this is a High custom FPS ( wath e3 trailer, play your own war).
What you need to do in dust to gain sp il KILL people.

I think the Cal.logi need to be look at. BUT for the sake of god, leave other logi ALONE. no other logi is OP

But the same principal applies to fitting...

Choosing a Suit is part of the customization process.

Well a big change like the one you suggest should come with a skill respec, because nobody will want to use a Logistics suits if they are made any weaker than they already are.

Another skill respect would just make something else the flavour of the month.

You chose your role, and choices have consequences. If what you play is nerfed, you shouldn't be given the opportunity to renege on your choice.

Another skill respect would just make something else the flavour of the month.

You chose your role, and choices have consequences. If what you play is nerfed, you shouldn't be given the opportunity to renege on your choice.

I chose APPLES but I got PEARS instead because they were out of APPLES. Not something I would have called a CHOICE.

Why are we still talking about a NERF? A quick glance over this thread would say enough if you ask me.

We've moved beyond discussion of the nerf.

We've moved into the realm of respecs it seems.

I thought we were talking about your idea to change logis to a useless dropsuit and that the current logis should just embrace that change.

Last time I saw LAVs mostly rack up skills by using their bumpers. Talking about turret-damage is stupid at this point and LLAVS gets other bonuses too, does that mean we get them too?

What about all the LLAVS are OP threads? Do they count? Why base a "balance" on something else that is" not balanced"?

Last time I saw LAVs mostly rack up skills by using their bumpers. Talking about turret-damage is stupid at this point and LLAVS gets other bonuses too, does that mean we get them too?

What about all the LLAVS are OP threads? Do they count? Why base a "balance" on something else that is" not balanced"?

Regardless of what they're being used for... "and if you think being run over by a car wouldn't kill you, i'm sorry.. but go step into the street and test it while wearing a suit of armor... you still wont come back", what I'm basing it on is the design PRINCIPAL... higher defencive capability, lower Offensive capability. Where as Assaults should be reversed... Higher Offensive Cap, lower Defensive cap.

Regardless of what they're being used for... "and if you think being run over by a car wouldn't kill you, i'm sorry.. but go step into the street and test it while wearing a suit of armor... you still wont come back", what I'm basing it on is the design PRINCIPAL... higher defencive capability, lower Offensive capability. Where as Assaults should be reversed... Higher Offensive Cap, lower Defensive cap.

The same as pandering to the stupid people nerfing tanks that cost far more than your Logi Suit.

The point of this debate is that Logistics SHOULD be focused on support, with lessened combat effectiveness, but greater survival.

Reducing their HP would result in them being eliminated far too fast to be of any use in the short term. This coupled with the fact that they can effectively do the same damage as an Assault means they bring two positives to the field simultaneously.

You don't look to the Guys hold a Swarm to take out Infantry at long range, nor the guy with the Shotgun.

Lower their combat effectiveness somewhat, make them less apt to be combative, but just as (in some cases more) survivable, so they are more supportive.

I see both LLAVs and logis killing people.
I don't see LLAVs supporting infantry or vehicles, I do see logis repping them both.
We should discuss LLAVs so they do more support too then.

If you want to discuss a possible solution then there should be a clear PROBLEM to begin with, maybe I missed it?

LOOK, THERE'S A MIN LOGI, QUICK OR HE'S GONNA HACK US TO DEATH!!!!!!!!

LOOK, THERE ANOTHER GAL LOGI,QUICK OR HE'S GONNA THROW ALL HIS EQUIP UPON US.

LOOK, THERE'S AN AMARR LOG...ah, no amar logi execpt Jastad and other few.....


Jokes aside, i beg you. STOP thinking hi-creative solution for easy solving problem, simply change cal logi bonus

and reduce the numbers of slots it has.

caldari logi has 9 module stots in total. that needs to be fixed.

CaLogis have the worse base stats out of all the logis and don't get a sidearm like the Amarr at proto level. They pay a price for those slots. Start with the racial bonus and see where that takes you.

Out of all the arguments for a nerf the one topic that consistantly is brought up are their shields. The flux grenade is the counter. It is fully anti shield and I can carry 3 of them at a time. If you want to dedicate an assault suit to killing caldari logis then you need 3 things. 1 flux grenades 2 scrambler rifle (proto if possible) 3 M-3 nanohive for grenade resupply. This can be done with any assault class suit even the militia assault and be successful. There is always a counter to the Cal Logi and as such it is balanced, just because it works for more than one thing well does not mean it needs a nerf.

Look at the above post, he says GODMODE like the Caldari Logi is the only one with a god mode. There are ways to fit ALL the dropsuits so that they survive like a God but they require the right skills to do so. They also require forethought, and the right circumstances to pull off. In the right circumstances you can also kill any player on the field, so just what is it that needs balance? The reason why the Cal Logi is a successfully skilled suit is the shield bonus and the fact that any player worth their salt realizes that Shield Upgrades 5 gives them 25% more shields. This is a suit that can have 90% of their HP wiped out with one grenade.

I know, I used to be a CALDARI Logi and found that the armor is not enough to withstand a TAC AR or HMG or Scrambler pistol/rifle or even a militia assault rifle for more than 3 shots or one burst. Dead is dead no matter how you get there, the vast majority of the Caldari Logis on the field are still dying and are not as OP as you claim them to be.

make it a requirement for logi's to have they're equip slots filled in order for fitting to be valid..

The 2 extra HP/s is worth it imo.

Gallente logis start with the same base stats and you know what we get? The weakest-slowest suit in the game we have the HP of a scout with the mobility of a heavy

CaLogis have the worse base stats out of all the logis and don't get a sidearm like the Amarr at proto level. They pay a price for those slots. Start with the racial bonus and see where that takes you.

Gallente logis start with the same base stats and you know what we get? The weakest-slowest suit in the game we have the HP of a scout with the mobility of a heavy

racial bonuses make minimal difference to the suit. the fact is the caldari logi has the more slots than any other dropsuit in the game. its ehp can pass a heavy ehp.

CLearly you haven't seen me in my LLAV repping Infantry, but I will agree that LLAVs need to undergo some change to be MORE conducive to support. But the principal, which you have yet to deny, is still the same...

The execution of it, is what I'm trying to provide a possible solution to.

Lesser suits can be instakilled by locus grenade as they have less HP.
Being instakilled is far far worse than surviving with ~100 armor HP.

First off, I know this has been talked over a thousand times.

Secondly, while I only have 4.5 million SP, I've specced into both Assault suits (pre-uprising) and Logistics suits (post-uprising), sporting Assault Rifles, Mass Drivers and Sniper Rifles ever since.-á

The thing is, Logistics suits seem to have an advantage over Assault suits and Medium suits for two simple reasons: damage output and wider slot configurations. A logistics suit can deal as much damage as a dedicated assault while providing their team with the boons of equipment slots, and also carry more modules at the same time. This pair of advantages are coupled with higher prices and SP requirements to properly use a logistics suit, and the missing sidearm slot. But come on, sidearm slots aren't that useful when compared to two extra equipment slots (one in the case of Amarr variants and three in the case of Minnie protos) and, usually, a extra pair of module slots. Logistics are almost as good as assault suits at frontline infantry, but they can also carry out multiple other tasks and excel at them too, which is disheartening for Assault suit players (Caldari shield build anyone? That kills the mood). Why not just get logistics suits instead? They're more expensive to fit, yes, but can perform a wider number of roles and, in some cases, be better at them.

What I suggest is the following: The light weapon slot in every logistics suit should be replaced by a sidearm slot, the Amarr having two slots and buffed CPU/PG to fit them.-á

Before you say anything, keep in mind that Logistics suits were, probably IMO, supposed to support other suits in battle, instead they are jack-of-all-trades able to spec into pretty much anything and everything, with some pretty overpowered variants in comparison to their assault counterparts (Caldari are way better, Minmatar and Gallente are slightly more versatile and fittable)-á

This is both an assault and logistics player saying this, I feel truly overpowered next to my squad when I KNOW for a fact that I'm not nearly as skilled as they are in shooters (Dust is my first) because I can lay down fire while keeping my squad up and running, netting me points I sometimes feel like I don't really deserve.-á

I've been wanting to spec out of logistics suits because of this feeling they give me, and again this is only a suggestion, so try to keep it civil.

There is no good reason. It's a lot of scrubs, that probably have low SP, who keep getting killed in pubs by Logis and they're convinced that it's the suit's fault. It has nothing to do with player skill. Medics shouldn't be able fight back!

Lol in a lot of FPS the medics run around with the biggest guns, LMGs and they get a side arm! In BF3 medics are the assault suits, but at least in that game everyone has a purpose Assaults = nanite and repair tool, Heavies = ammo, Engineer = remote explosives, and recons = scanners. Maybe there is a lesson to be learned here.

First off, I know this has been talked over a thousand times.

[sic]

so try to keep it civil.

1. Remove assault/basic frame equip slot and give to scout/light frame
2. Decrease 1H 1L per tier for logi suits.
3. Increase logi CPU/PG

done

CUT .

Please post fits that show
1)Current Logi suit balance is improper within Med Frame line (note: suit balance not racial skill balance)
2)Post fits that use your suggested alterations showing how these changes are improvements along with descriptions of the intended role for each fit and why that fit best servers it.

Use fittings standers as per my "logi challenge", if you haven't seen one of these posts please inform me and I shall provide a link.

I look forward to seeing your proposed fittings.

Cheers,
Cross

I think most people are aware of the Caldari Logistics ability to tank. It's written plain as day in their description, and it's being abused under the current mechanic. Not because it's a bad mechanic, but the fact there is NO downside to running said Logi... you give up a Sidearm, to gain:

- More Shields
- More PG
- More CPU
- More Equipment

I have a simple solution. Reduce the damage done by logistics Suits by 30-40%, across the board. Just a flat reduction in 'weapons' damage. (So Remote Explosives, Grenades etc are still as effective, but your guns are not.)

Give them a detriment equal to their advantage. At the moment there is only one downside to running a Logistics Suit as an Assault, and it's nothing comparative to what you gain.

This damage reduction would be applicable to ALL Logistics Suits, putting them into a support role, where they should be. Not as a Frontline Attacker.

make it a requirement for logi's to have they're equip slots filled in order for fitting to be valid..

If Logis only had a Sidearm slot instead of a light weapon slot, then they'd be just as useful for Support and no where near as capable as Assaults.

Just swap the Logi Light weapon slot for a Sidearm slot. Anyone who disagrees only wants to keep their 3/4 Equipment slot Assault suit.

Sidearms will allow the Logi to contribute to DPS without being a Slayer-logi.

If Logis only had a Sidearm slot instead of a light weapon slot, then they'd be just as useful for Support and no where near as capable as Assaults.

Just swap the Logi Light weapon slot for a Sidearm slot. Anyone who disagrees only wants to keep their 3/4 Equipment slot Assault suit.

Sidearms will allow the Logi to contribute to DPS without being a Slayer-logi.

GTFO Sidearms have no range. I may as well equip a qtip for cleaning your wounds.

If Logis only had a Sidearm slot instead of a light weapon slot, then they'd be just as useful for Support and no where near as capable as Assaults.

Just swap the Logi Light weapon slot for a Sidearm slot. Anyone who disagrees only wants to keep their 3/4 Equipment slot Assault suit.

Sidearms will allow the Logi to contribute to DPS without being a Slayer-logi.

The weapon isnt a problem, its the logi's ability to stack armor/shields as well as assaults can while maintaining equipment options. Force players who want to be support play logi and those who want to go on a massacre assaults (remove the equipment slot).

PLEASE

Show us a vids when you go only with a side for al match, and let's see us HOW can you support.

until then, STFU

CUT.

KMA, I run Logi and I do well enough with Sidearms, not my fault you want to keep your light weapon crutch.

CUT

That's the Heavy role, they have that already.

Ok, let's make a CorpBattle vs Teamplayers,Sinergy or IMP and PLEASE, SHOW US HOW YOU SUPPORT WITH a sidearm.

I don't own a capture card (and I'm sure as **** not buying one to appease you), but ALL I RUN IS SIDEARMS OR AV.

So you can KMA too.

Logi =/= Slayer, swap the Logi Light Weapon slot for a Sidearm slot.

I don't need to prove **** to you. You just want to keep your Caldari Logi Slayer suit.

Hook your DVD burner up to your RCA outs and then back to the TV, it works for me and btw I want Video evidence. You can also use a cam corder or video camera attached to your computer but I want the vid.

I don't need to prove **** to you. You just want to keep your Caldari Logi Slayer suit.

flaylock doesnt count as a sidearm imo. why? bc its not a last ditch effort gun

As if I need to prove **** to you. CCP can read the logs and see how I do, that is all that is needed. Logi do not need a light weapon, they'll do just fine with a Sidearm.

TBH, Flaylock is the sidearm I am least skilled into.

Last bit of free intel any of you are getting.

I will continue to stand by my assertion that Sidearm-only Logi is THE way to solve the "Logis being used as an Assault" problem.

Let's see how you do well when the flylock gets Nerfed, because the ARcodboys are crying for it

@Draco Cerberus

No, actually, I need to prove nothing to you. I will not be bullied into thinking otherwise.

@Draco Cerberus

No, actually, I need to prove nothing to you. I will not be bullied into thinking otherwise.

And I won't be belittled into some stupid "role" classification that you think I need to be in just because I am a logi.

No it's not being bullied.

IT's called READ BEFORE POST.

We all made a 9 page thread of answer.

if you BOTHER to read, you'll see the all the LOGI are for a rework of the Cal.LOGI, the only e real problem.

Because, and that are stat talking ( feel free to search COSGAR Thread or CROSS ATU reply in this thread) LOGI are inferior to their Ass counterpart.

and again, stop counting what you do in pubscrub match, thta dosent count in balance terms.
Jeez they did with the Heavy and look what we have now....

BTW, Customization within Roles is what the game is about, otherwise CCP would just give us T3 Heavys and be done with everything.

I still stand by my assertion that Logis can make due with just a Sidearm Slot.

Also, so you know, I tried getting Heavys buffed (aside from their movement speed).

I would, but I'm busy playing. but as a preview

1. Scouts had 2 equipment slots prior to uprising and it was not unbalanced. 2 slots give scouts uplink + needle/explosive (keep in mind that scout cpu/pg is too low to fit super sniper + complex damage + nanohive + uplink)

2. Removing equip slots of assaults forces them to rely on logi's to supply ammo (or supply depo), thus preventing lone wolfing and encouraging assaults to run with a logi

3. Removing 1H+1L of each logi prevents them from taking the role of the assault's high EHP for frontline battle role and encourages a more supportive role (revive/repair/supply). However, the increase of CPU/PG will still allow them to stack complex/shield mods for survivability even on an advanced suit without hindering them from carrying equipment.

Personally, i would remove the basic frame suits altogether as well as the racial bonuses (but keep the role specific bonuses).

I still stand by my assertion that Logis can make due with just a Sidearm Slot.

Also, so you know, I tried getting Heavys buffed (aside from their movement speed).

So, you're saying that you want to keep your slayer-logi?

That is what I am hearing.

Logi NEED to be most useful in a support role, not good for support but ABSO-*******-LUTELY BEAST for Assault setups just in the name of "Customization".

BTW, Customization within Roles is what the game is about, otherwise CCP would just give us T3 Heavys and be done with everything.

I'd be interested in your participation in the Logi fittings challenge in support of this stance.
Do you have the standards or would you like a link?

You mis-read the description of the game plain and simple as well as having missed the trailer with the Heavy using a sniper rifle and plainly wouldn't understand why someone would fit a couple of tractor beams to a destroyer in Eve and float some salvage drones besides.

Scrubs gonna love their new scrub suit when they get it.

@Alaika

Oh BTW, i'm still waiting you tell me how my Amarr Logi is OP or superior to Amarr Ass.

I wouldn't dirty myself in one of those suits.

I trust in rust.

AH a GDR Reply!!!! now i like it.

I answer with the only answer a true Amarr can state:

Hey Min, do you know what have in common a Limbus tyre and a Minmatar? For both exist CHAIN !!!

Glory to the Empress

You think I'm RPing here? No, I just stick with the race I picked. Once I have explored it completely, then I'll go after the others

To solve the Caldari Logi issue simply get this to happen:

*the Caldari Logi's only handheld weapon is a Sidearm.


A fit with this can still be effective against infantry to some extent. Don't tell it's bad, I ran Minmatar logi (look at that fat hitbox) before Uprising with only an SMG and could still beat strong players. Also, read the description of the Caldari logi to see why Sidearm only (with all the preposterous health) is actually acceptable.

To solve the Caldari Logi issue simply get this to happen:

*the Caldari Logi's only handheld weapon is a Sidearm.


A fit with this can still be effective against infantry to some extent. Don't tell it's bad, I ran Minmatar logi (look at that fat hitbox) before Uprising with only an SMG and could still beat strong players. Also, read the description of the Caldari logi to see why Sidearm only (with all the preposterous health) is actually acceptable.

To solve the Caldari Logi issue simply get this to happen:

*the Caldari Logi's only handheld weapon is a Sidearm.


A fit with this can still be effective against infantry to some extent. Don't tell it's bad, I ran Minmatar logi (look at that fat hitbox) before Uprising with only an SMG and could still beat strong players. Also, read the description of the Caldari logi to see why Sidearm only (with all the preposterous health) is actually acceptable.