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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Liner ReXiandra
Sparks Inc Zero Hour Alliance
115
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Posted - 2014.05.06 18:46:00 -
[451] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote: The problem is that they aren't MOVING THE GAME to a new platform as promised, they're creating a NEW GAME on the new platform and abandoning the old one.
Semantics? Or did you think they would let you shoot a PS4 player in the face while you were playing Dust on your PS3?
That'll be another first in computer gaming. |
Bremen van Equis
The Exemplars Top Men.
1
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Posted - 2014.05.06 18:48:00 -
[452] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:[quote=Liner ReXiandra][quote=CCP Rouge]
I can't disagree with the choice to move to PC; though I'm interested in why this move was made now; and not when Dust 514 was announced many years ago. It was the first question on everyone's mind back then:
"why develop a shooter that should last for years on a console that's nearing it's end of life?"
Sony approaches CCP (or vice versa) to barter Sony's financial support for CCP's EVE community. Sony gets a boost in end-of-life sales for the PS3, CCP gets to try its hand in the console community and make some $$ along the way.
...and if more of the community came over to DUST they would have continued support and an a port/sequel on PS4...but that didn't happen.
Just a guess....... |
The Noob Destroyer
Pradox One Proficiency V.
802
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Posted - 2014.05.06 19:21:00 -
[453] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:From this thread.John Demonsbane wrote:Finally, to CCP: Eventually such shoddy treatment of your players is going to catch up to you.
Saberwing and Logibro can do all the damage control they want, but the simple fact of the matter is, we were misled for months about progression of this game, being encouraged to buy aurum with the promises of new content and long-term progression in the same format. Now we know better.
Maybe you guys really are competent programmers and the PS3 really was the only issue. I doubt it, but letGÇÖs say thatGÇÖs true. That is completely unrelated and does not excuse how you treated a very loyal group of players.
Moreover, to do this, and then be faced with obvious disapproval by your customers, and say essentially nothing for 48 hours, is pathetic, and reeks of incompetence, contempt, or both.
Even still, days later, the following things that, honestly, almost any well run business would have done by now to demonstrate a commitment to customers, have not happened:
1)An actual apology - Saberwings short and bland one, buried in a thread, is insufficient, and heGÇÖs not even the one who should be doing it. Rouge has said nothing even remotely contrite to date.
2)Concrete explanations of how our concerns will be addressed and why this happened. The responses to our concerns have been nebulous at best, and late GǪ I mean, why not mention right away characters would be transferred over if that was your plan? That would have cooled a lot of the rage. The fact that you didnGÇÖt makes me suspect you are backpedaling on the original plan, which is a bad one anyway, predicating all this on a game thatGÇÖs not even greenlit by the CEO!
3)Some type of good-faith offer to refund, at the very least, the last month or two of aurum sales. Changing plans and using your own intellectual property as best you see fit is one thing. But misleading customers into paying for something they are not actually getting is another. Is it a classic bait and switch? Maybe not, but I can make an argument that hyping boosters and the origin pack just days before FanFest, is very very close. No amount of backpedaling, dubious promises about Legion features and character transfer can erase that one!
You do those three things, CCP, and you will restore most of our faith in you (however misplaced) and may get me back as a customer. Otherwise, IGÇÖm not interested in supporting you as a company any longer.
Good day to you, sirs!
This.
CCP fanfest 2014
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Kratek Heshan
United Colonial Empire Army Freek Alliance
45
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Posted - 2014.05.06 19:23:00 -
[454] - Quote
ccp should support the community if all our request put it on the ps4 or both pc so go ccp listen to your fans costumer and the community and yeh ccp you promised all the new maps and other things you will put on dust514 last fanfest now we saw it now its on legion all your promise are all lies we should be playing that lava map right now but its on legion ;( |
Villanor Aquarius
WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men.
180
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Posted - 2014.05.06 19:26:00 -
[455] - Quote
For everyone asking about details on how characters would transfer over and other specifics, they don't know yet. Legion seems to have some serious legs on it for the short time it's been in progress but you can't possibly expect them to know these details yet and frankly I would be deeply disappointed if they did as it would mean they are once again focusing in too narrowly before nailing down the broad issues of the game.
For feedback, I have a computer that is not particularly bad but is nowhere near great and I have no problems running eve on middle graphics with some effects on, for two different clients. CCP has done well with EVE in making it very forgiving on a range of computers.
Now that Legion has been started I just wish it had been greenlit long ago. It's a shame Dust took so long to get to where it did but Legion can take it where it should have been.
Focus entirely on Legion and make the game we all wanted to see.
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Draco Cerberus
BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance
904
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Posted - 2014.05.06 19:57:00 -
[456] - Quote
CCP Rouge wrote:Hey guys, sorry about not getting back to you earlier. HereGÇÖs some more info for you.
I want to address the concerns about character migration from DUST 514 to Project Legion if it goes ahead. There has been some concern about what I meant by GÇ£applicableGÇ¥. We are looking to migrate everything we can about characters from DUST 514, including names, corporation membership, skill points, assets and ISK. We have not yet decided how this would translate to the new items and progression system in Legion, but we want to make sure that the time and effort you committed in DUST 514 is carried over to Project Legion.
I wanted to address the questions about what type of payment model we are looking to use with Project Legion. I want to make it free-to-play, but it will be slightly different to how it is in DUST. I want CCP Z to cover it soon for you guys in a dedicated dev blog.
When it comes to DUST development I can tell you that we are currently looking at changes to Planetary Conquest, further iterating on item balance after Uprising 1.8 and some matchmaking improvements; all of which will be deployed as server-side updates. We currently don't have a date set for when you will get these updates.
IGÇÖll do my best to answer more questions, and IGÇÖll also get other devs to chime in with answers to your questions. Please keep posting your thoughts and questions. I apologize for anything bad I had to say about this idea. Sorry, I was under the impression that SONY would take control of the IPR and hold fast to whatever characters were made using PSNIDs and feel that the product will be greatly improved by moving to the PC. My outrage was also based on the short life of Dust as we know it, although with the slow development of features and maps I know now that I have been expecting too much out of an always in Beta product and old console.
You wouldn't happen to have a mold I could use to manufacture a coffee coaster out of my PS3 (GOTY Ed.) I can't seem to get my coffee cup to balance on it right.
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI
10763
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Posted - 2014.05.06 19:59:00 -
[457] - Quote
CCP Rouge wrote:Hi everyone. Me again.
Why PC first? For a few different reasons... It's a scalable platform. We can go high spec for the most demanding players in terms of Gfx, but we can also scale down to low/mid spec to get critical mass. It's also a good platform for the early stage of a project like ours. You can test and balance the game and the economy quite easily with fast turn-arounds. We can set people up in testing environments easily (eg. ISD in EVE). If you've seen the "CCP Presents" presentation on Saturday at Fanfest, there was a talk about CCP refocusing on its core tech competency, which is PC. It allows in the future the creation of a "universe" of products on the same platform. Again, this doesn't mean that we're not going back to console at one point but we need to focus on one thing at a time and deliver an awesome game, then things get easier.
Now I'd like to address (or repeat) something important for me. I know that a lot of you have been really disappointed and wanted to see much more on the future of DUST 514 in its current form and I absolutely understand that feeling. But the reality is that, while it's a great shooter, I repeat that it's not the base that can give us another EVE Online with 10+ years of epic battles where players can have a great experience whether solo, as the head of the deadliest squad or largest corp in the game. Give people the right tools to manage/achieve all that. A much clearer user experience that opens up that huge universe, always discover new stuff to shoot, to loot, to sell... A social experience where corps can advertise/recruit easily, where you see the main chat going crazy with people asking for groups, selling stuff, talking ****. Some of the stuff that makes me feel like I am in an MMO. All of these aren't tweaks, they are features forming a new eco-system for the game, a foundation you can then build on. No doubt that DUST 514 is a large piece of that foundation. We've accomplished so much and I've had a ton of fun every day since beta but it is not there yet. It requires a lot of work of course but also a different approach in how we design and execute on that vision. I can go on and on about how I see this evolve but we'll cover in more depth as we start sharing ideas and designs through dev blogs and such. So no new weapons while we spend years waiting for Legion to release...
Gû¦Supreme god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæGû+
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Stine Control
Carbon 7 Iron Oxide.
95
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Posted - 2014.05.06 21:15:00 -
[458] - Quote
The Plan : Dust 514 + EvE Legion - my thoughts |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
5412
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 21:17:00 -
[459] - Quote
Liner ReXiandra wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote: The problem is that they aren't MOVING THE GAME to a new platform as promised, they're creating a NEW GAME on the new platform and abandoning the old one.
Semantics? Or did you think they would let you shoot a PS4 player in the face while you were playing Dust on your PS3? That'll be another first in computer gaming. A crossover period, much like the transition periods in EVE Online when they gradually phase out support for lower-end PCs, was something to be expected.
And I don't think having people playing across both PS3 and PS4 is unreasonable for a team that allowed PS3 gamers to send targeting data to someone in a PC game that isn't even in the same genre, and have that PC player fire shots using that data which land back in the PS3 game. |
Regis Blackbird
DUST University Ivy League
177
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 21:35:00 -
[460] - Quote
@CCP Rouge
One of my prime interest in Dust was with the EVE - Dust link, and especially the orbital bombardment. As both a Dust and EVE player have have been on both sides of a strike (and sometimes simultaneously), and it was freaking awesome. With that said, the problem with this major feature was that very few people actually experienced it like I have, and most people were just tired of OB spam (this is something you actually should look at fixing for Dust by the way).
With Legion, both new and veteran players need to really feel apart of new Eden, not just cosmetic like chat or corp membership, but have mechanics that benefits both games.
- As a EVE player in want to hire mercs to do my bidding. When things go south, or I just feel like it, I want to bomb them to ... dust? . I want to scan for exotic material and hire mercs to go and get it from the clutches of evil drones. I want to transfer mercs in my ship to a new base station, and chat with them along the way.
- As a merc, I want to actively help capturing POS:es around planets. I want to go on solo cloaking infiltration missions behind enemy Guristas lines to sabotage their base. I want to assemble my team to ambush merc who are foolish enough to scavenge materials "in our space". I want to fight for the victory of the Caldari state while capsuleers fight in the sky.
Phuu, I guess you get my point. Please please please make meaningful interaction between EVE and Legion, and let the "sandbox" contain a multitude of various missions, not just Fed Ex quests killing drones to feed the Legion? economy.
And (this is a big one for me), explain all the in game mechanic in Lore. Don't let us just teleport around in the galaxy (without changing local chat), magically bringing all our assets with us, without explaining why... And preferably don't allow it, period.
And finally, please include this at launch of Legion (provided there is one). Take your time to get things right, and don't rush a half finished product out the door and say "we add it later". Let's do it right this time.
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villdoc
Better Hide R Die
8
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Posted - 2014.05.06 22:44:00 -
[461] - Quote
CCP Rouge wrote:Hi everyone. Me again.
Why PC first? For a few different reasons... It's a scalable platform. We can go high spec for the most demanding players in terms of Gfx, but we can also scale down to low/mid spec to get critical mass. It's also a good platform for the early stage of a project like ours. You can test and balance the game and the economy quite easily with fast turn-arounds. We can set people up in testing environments easily (eg. ISD in EVE). If you've seen the "CCP Presents" presentation on Saturday at Fanfest, there was a talk about CCP refocusing on its core tech competency, which is PC. It allows in the future the creation of a "universe" of products on the same platform. Again, this doesn't mean that we're not going back to console at one point but we need to focus on one thing at a time and deliver an awesome game, then things get easier.
Now I'd like to address (or repeat) something important for me. I know that a lot of you have been really disappointed and wanted to see much more on the future of DUST 514 in its current form and I absolutely understand that feeling. But the reality is that, while it's a great shooter, I repeat that it's not the base that can give us another EVE Online with 10+ years of epic battles where players can have a great experience whether solo, as the head of the deadliest squad or largest corp in the game. Give people the right tools to manage/achieve all that. A much clearer user experience that opens up that huge universe, always discover new stuff to shoot, to loot, to sell... A social experience where corps can advertise/recruit easily, where you see the main chat going crazy with people asking for groups, selling stuff, talking ****. Some of the stuff that makes me feel like I am in an MMO. All of these aren't tweaks, they are features forming a new eco-system for the game, a foundation you can then build on. No doubt that DUST 514 is a large piece of that foundation. We've accomplished so much and I've had a ton of fun every day since beta but it is not there yet. It requires a lot of work of course but also a different approach in how we design and execute on that vision. I can go on and on about how I see this evolve but we'll cover in more depth as we start sharing ideas and designs through dev blogs and such.
LOL CCP has BARELY gave us any of the features that were promised. The VITA app was a joke. Thanks for the good times
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Badgerr Rager
Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad.
794
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 23:46:00 -
[462] - Quote
CCP Rouge wrote:Hi everyone. Me again.
Why PC first? For a few different reasons... It's a scalable platform. We can go high spec for the most demanding players in terms of Gfx, but we can also scale down to low/mid spec to get critical mass. It's also a good platform for the early stage of a project like ours. You can test and balance the game and the economy quite easily with fast turn-arounds. We can set people up in testing environments easily (eg. ISD in EVE). If you've seen the "CCP Presents" presentation on Saturday at Fanfest, there was a talk about CCP refocusing on its core tech competency, which is PC. It allows in the future the creation of a "universe" of products on the same platform. Again, this doesn't mean that we're not going back to console at one point but we need to focus on one thing at a time and deliver an awesome game, then things get easier.
Now I'd like to address (or repeat) something important for me. I know that a lot of you have been really disappointed and wanted to see much more on the future of DUST 514 in its current form and I absolutely understand that feeling. But the reality is that, while it's a great shooter, I repeat that it's not the base that can give us another EVE Online with 10+ years of epic battles where players can have a great experience whether solo, as the head of the deadliest squad or largest corp in the game. Give people the right tools to manage/achieve all that. A much clearer user experience that opens up that huge universe, always discover new stuff to shoot, to loot, to sell... A social experience where corps can advertise/recruit easily, where you see the main chat going crazy with people asking for groups, selling stuff, talking ****. Some of the stuff that makes me feel like I am in an MMO. All of these aren't tweaks, they are features forming a new eco-system for the game, a foundation you can then build on. No doubt that DUST 514 is a large piece of that foundation. We've accomplished so much and I've had a ton of fun every day since beta but it is not there yet. It requires a lot of work of course but also a different approach in how we design and execute on that vision. I can go on and on about how I see this evolve but we'll cover in more depth as we start sharing ideas and designs through dev blogs and such.
A Big FUUUUCKK YOU and the rest of CCP. This doesn't ease my hate to you asssss hats.
I would like CCP to Biomass Legion.
You pieces of Sh*t
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Megan Steel
DUST BRASIL S.A Caps and Mercs
79
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Posted - 2014.05.07 00:11:00 -
[463] - Quote
CCP Rouge wrote:Hi everyone. Me again. ...
Understand Rouge aujourd'hui je etait seul... Ce jeux est une bonne id+¬e, mas mon cher ami no vont par jour avec moi... Je parle fran+ºais terriblement... pardon My whole corp is moving to Destiny, they aren't buying the new project idea... They are really afraid that CCP changes idea again... How can I know you guys are really keeping your world this time... Also... Specs ASAP, even if it's a basic idea...
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
2
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Posted - 2014.05.07 00:39:00 -
[464] - Quote
Quote:A decent PC capable of running BF4 will cost way more than a ps4. A decent PC capable of running BF4 will cost more than a PS4's initial purchase cost, but you can play BF4 on it whenever you want without having to keep paying a subscription fee every month. By the time you've been playing for a year, the cost is going to be close to even, if not unbalanced in favour of the PC being the cheaper option.[/quote]
You're jumping the gun here a bit on the issue of total cost. You're assuming Legion will be F2P, just like DUST514. How do you know it won't move to a subcription model like EVE instead?
I totally understand why all the console players are going apeshit over this. Yes, a PC can be very cheap to build, but that only applies to using it for email or to browse the web. If you want a good gaming rig, it will cost more than any console now or in the future. How many EVE players are still playing on the same PC they started EVE on? I'm willing to bet many have put in significant investments into their rigs and continue to do so as EVE has progressed in both game and graphical complexity.
Also I tend to agree that the PS4 and XBOX ONE are closer to PCs in their current archeitecture than any previous generation consoles. They both use AMD CPUs and ATI graphics cores. Unreal4 has been ported to work on these consoles, so there is not a great technical limitation to getting Legion running on all these platforms - IF the proper planning was done ahead of time for this. The only real limitation is the limited memory available and that should only affect the graphical quality due to the necessity of using lower quality textures. |
ANON Cerberus
Tiny Toons
560
|
Posted - 2014.05.07 00:46:00 -
[465] - Quote
Void Echo wrote:Regardless of character and asset transfers, if your not going to bring Legion to the PS4 in the future (IDC when as long as it doesnt interfeer with my dust gameplay) then dont bother with trying to make it look nice for dust payers.
Dust 514 is strictly a CONSOLE GAME, NOT A PC GAME, and anything pertaining to a PC release and no word on whats happening to console releases is straight up microsoft style bullshit. I will NOT join Legion if it doesn't end up on PS4 and nether will ALOT of your dust playerbase.
I have no intention of becoming a PC FPS player for any reason. Making Legion look like a PC only game was one of the worst mistakes youv ever made as a company. Your alienating your console players by saying "If you want to stay, switch to PC".
Character transfers are the least of concerns for those of us who have no intention of going to PC. Either MAKE plans for PS4 version of Legion or your can say goodby to alot of dust players when this hits.
And EVE was strictly a PC game not a console game. Now you PS3 players know how us EVE players felt when we found out DUST was going to be a console game and not on CCP`s home turf = the PC.
I understand that for console players, this turn of events is shocking and surprising. Its surprising for me too considering I have been moaning for a PC version of dust for years. However Legion is going to be where it belongs, on PC along with EVE. I see that as truly the best way to guarantee the games can have interconnected meaningful gameplay experiences.
I always had doubts about console to pc interaction.
Markdown:
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
2
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Posted - 2014.05.07 01:23:00 -
[466] - Quote
Ghural wrote:So if we don't actually get to keep all our stuff (CCP has told lies before), the community will ensure that Legion will be a failure.
You have been warned. Again.
What is it about CCP execs that they feel they don't need to listen to the playerbase/CPM?
The general term used to describe this is ARROGANCE (or stupidity take your pick).
But to be more specific, the bigger problem lies in the fact that the company as a whole spent too much time listening to EVE players and not enough time listening to the community that plays this game. Why? Probably because they make way more money with EVE than they did on DUST.
I'm not trying to dis on EVE players as I know there are quite a few that play DUST as well - but DUST514 had to stand on its own as a game with all the things promised by CCP, instead of it becoming whatever it was the EVE players wanted it to be. Frankly, many EVE players didn't support or understand consoles or the necessity of DUST514 on the PS3 in the first place. It's no wonder that CCP made a mess of DUST because they were listening to the wrong userbase.
I own consoles and a PC gaming rig both, but truthfully, I find myself using my consoles for gaming more than my PC. The reason is that I prefer to spend my money on games rather than the necessity of continuing to upgrade my PC for the next big thing that just pushed the hardware requirements that much higher. Great graphics doesn't make a good game. A good game is what makes a good game.
I read an argument somewhere on this forum that there are more FPSs being played on PCs than on consoles, therefore that is why Legion belongs on a PC. I call BS on that. All the heavy hitters are already on the PC. What makes CCP so sure they can win the battle for eyeballs in such a competitive landscape? EVE makes up a much smaller subset of the eyeballs that CCP would be competing for and that's CCP's most readily addressable market. Put another way, in warfare you hit the enemy where they are weakest, you don't rush headlong into their main strength to get decimated.
An MMO shooter with connection to a persistent universe, cross-platform continues to be unique in the console space. I believe the original strategic thinking by CCP on this was actually correct. The problem was that the PS3 lacked the power and was too difficult to develop on for a company with a strong PC development background. That changes with the next-gen consoles. Admittedly, development on consoles can be a bit limiting, even on the new, next-gen boxes; but there are advantages as well.
The biggest is that you have an unchanging target platform. With enough QA testing *COUGH COUGH*, you can be assured that the code will run correctly on the vast majority of the target platforms. The PC space is difficult specifically because no two PCs are alike. Problems with a game not working can stem from pretty much anything from outdated drivers to port blocking by your favorite antivirus/firewall software.
Did I mention that there is less competition for CCP in the console space?
The addressable market on the PS3 is over 80m units worldwide. I suspect that over time, the PS4 will equal or surpass those numbers. You can double that if you want to add in the XBOX ONE as well since both boxes are more alike than different. I suspect Microsoft may be a bit more open this time around to CCP putting DUST 2.0 on their Live service due to their own marketing issues with the XBOX ONE. In the next decade I would hazard a guess of a total addressable market between PS4 and XBOX ONE of at least 160m units. The key difference is that there would be relatively fewer competitors in that space for CCP than if they were to try and slug it out on the PC side.
You grow your business by bringing completely new players into the fold, not by trying to re-address your already existing userbase. That is the truest argument I can make to this whole issue.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
2
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Posted - 2014.05.07 01:48:00 -
[467] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:[quote=Kev Crow][quote=Garrett Blacknova] It isn't release-ready, and I've gone on record MANY times saying as much.
It's not finished, the code is nowhere near what it needs in the way of optimisation for the PS3.
There are multiplayer games on PS3 running in the same game engine CCP used which have (or had in the defunct cases) smooth gameplay, wider FOV, better graphics and still don't cause overheating problems for the console.
The problems with DUST aren't inherently because the PS3 can't handle what CCP wanted to make. The problem is that CCP's programmers haven't been able to do what other developers can with the same system.
I tend to agree with this. CCP must have done some viability studies to ensure that what they envisioned for DUST514 would be possible to do on the PS3 platform and on PSN. No one walks blindly into failure, unless they're completely incompetent or stupid or both.
From the development side, CCP has two problems. The first is that they just don't have enough people. The second, is that they don't have enough people with experience progamming the PS3. I've seen some incredibly complex open world games and shooters done on the PS3: Red Dead Redemption, GTA V, Borderlands 2, Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc. The only real limitation is the quality of the graphics, not in what you can or can't do with the game code.
I believe that what CCP originally envisioned for the game is possible on the PS3, they just couldn't get it done. I believe that the game can run better but CCP just didn't know how to optimize for the PS3. In that respect, CCP has let us all down. They over-promised and under-delivered and in the process created a vicious cycle of declining revenues/player base that didn't warrant further development efforts. |
xxwhitedevilxx M
Maphia Clan Unit Unicorn
2814
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Posted - 2014.05.07 01:59:00 -
[468] - Quote
So, CCP Rouge,
Let's pretend we're in a perfect world where nobody's got any problem in swapping platform. You said you'll eventually move on next-gen console later. But, seriously, who wants to play on console against PCs? ( Linky)
I would assume that it's just damage control. My opinion is still the same, anyway. PC is not the right place for a competitive MMOFPS that influence another game like Eve, and for obvious reasons.
Now, let's get back to reality: the community clearly wants Legion. Everyone loves the initial idea brought on next gen. The problem here is the platform, and if you can't see such a problem either you're blind or you're definitely just ignoring your community (the one you love so much ;) ).
Guinea Dust Bunnies are watching you, CCP Rouge.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
2
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Posted - 2014.05.07 02:24:00 -
[469] - Quote
Meric Voyer wrote:Pliny Eldritch wrote:This... This is just stupid. It's not like this is the first time a change in course from CCP has caused rage and drama, and it sure as &$^% won't be the last. What's sad is that it could have been different this time. As a community, we're all on the same page with CCP about what Dust is lacking. Many of us also agree that the PS3 has started it's long slow slide to oblivion, and that investing massive resources into it is a waste. You could also probably get most of us to admit that the current Dust player base isn't big enough to justify serious ongoing investment. Where things have gone wrong is CCP falling for one of the oldest logical fallacies in Software Engineering. When dealing with a large project that is not working, with no obvious or easy fixes, the answer that always feels easiest is to tear it down and start over. It's also almost always the wrong answer. Dust is broken. But it's still making money. People are playing it, and they're still paying to play it. CCP should take a page from Square Enix's successful reboot of FFXIV. For those unfamiliar, there are some real parallels between the first FFXIV's failure and Dust's current situation. Instead of trying to keep Dust limping along on PS3 while trying to develop an entirely new game on PC, CCP should strongly consider putting Dust on life support now. Keep a couple of devs for critical balance and bug fixes, and give the community some tasty discounts to keep them paying and playing. Use the freed-up devs to expedite a port of the then feature-frozen Dust from Unreal Engine 3 to Unreal Engine 4. Build for both PC and PS4 (as well as the XBone if MS is willing to play ball) simultaneously. It will take longer on the QA end, but if Epic has done their job properly with UE 4, the same code should run on both platforms. Doing both at once makes the Console/PC decision much less expensive in both money and time than porting later. Resist the temptation to do anything but get Dust running on the new systems. Once Dust is playable on PS4 and PC, give PS3 Dust a Matrix Online style send-off. Instead of making people worry about their investments of time and Aurum and how they might transfer into a new game, make the PC and PS4 ports use the same character data. Then start refactoring in all the Project Legion goodness, respeccing and resetting as needed - just like EVE's evolution. ^ Sensible solution. CCP has no sense though, so yeah....
Someone at CCP should hire this guy to be the Game Director for DUST/Legion.
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INeXusI
Synthetic Clones
0
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:04:00 -
[470] - Quote
Project Legion will and shall fail. First they alienated the Eve community when Dust first launched and now there totally giving the boot to the PSN Community. Instead of knocking down the tower why don't they build it more, move Dust to the Ps4 and so on. It's already a Psn exclusive they have the ability to move it to the next gen console. So many people like myself have spent effort, time, money, and etc into Dust 514 just to see it go. One things for sure, the PSN Community will not make the chance to PC and that's a fact.
We Stand Together, We Fight Together, We Die Together, We Do Not Surrender.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
3
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:29:00 -
[471] - Quote
Joey - Drien wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:IN CAPS SO THIS IS UNDERSTOOD.....
MOST OF US DON'T GIVE A **** ABOUT LEGION. WE ARE CONSOLE PLAYERS NOT PC PLAYERS.
If Legion becomes a reality, we won't be transitioning to pc for it. Now, you may not care because there are some eve players that will play it and a few others. But you will definitely lose the core group of guys who have been spending hundreds of dollars on dust and helping you guys with the fps design learning curve. Now, you may say, "fugg the console players, there are plenty of pc players that we can tap into"....but then be honest about it. You console players have to understand, that adding bigger stuff into dust would cause the console to explode, they are already struggling with the performance as it is. Dust is by far the maximum what can console handle in mmo, it would perform better in singleplayer. Consoles are made for fast, easy and fun games ...
Where do you get your information from? According to you only games like Angry Birds would exist on consoles. Are you forgetting games like GTA V on PS3 offered a large virtual sandbox to play in? Have you seen GTA V for the PC yet? I haven't.
Are you forgetting the fact that Battlefield 4 is drawing higher quality graphics on PS3 with larger FOV and longer drawing distances than DUST and still averages a much better framerate?
The problem isn't the capability of the consoles, my friend. It's the capability of the developer. |
INeXusI
Synthetic Clones
0
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:33:00 -
[472] - Quote
They used the PSN Community as Beta testers this whole time. In my eyes and thousands more this was a quick scam for money on a game they developed that they new was going to fail but yet they betrayed lied and forgot about us in the ******* rain
We Stand Together, We Fight Together, We Die Together, We Do Not Surrender.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
3
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:36:00 -
[473] - Quote
tastzlike chicken wrote:Quote:When it comes to DUST development I can tell you that we are currently looking at changes to Planetary Conquest, further iterating on item balance after Uprising 1.8 and some matchmaking improvements With only half of the hamsters than were previously assigned to Dust "development' (fixes and balancing); is it safe to assume that the speed and responsiveness we've come to expect from the DUST Dev team will suffer?
You're trying to be funny right? Tell me this comment was a joke. |
Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
3
|
Posted - 2014.05.07 03:41:00 -
[474] - Quote
sammus420 wrote:And how about the 5 year future that CCP was 'confident' about for dust, and all the stuff they talked about in this article? http://www.destructoid.com/ccp-confident-about-dust-514-s-five-year-future-255455.phtmlQuote:In its current iteration, Dust 514 is a competitive, player-vs.-player, deathmatch-based affair. However, CCP Shanghai are working on cooperative, player-vs.-environment modes that they hope will encourage corporation-level play: "Survival" is a wave-based Horde mode, and "Infestation" will involve scouring any enemies trying to establish a toehold in corporation-controlled districts.
In both modes, groups of players will fight against drones, the so-called "rats" or "mobs" of Dust 514, to gather money and other resources. The idea is that these PvE modes will give players and corps new entry points into the robust in-game economy that ties Dust 514 and EVE Online together. Eventually, CCP plans to implement space elevators to carry those resources from the planetary surfaces of Dust to the orbiting fleets of EVE, linking the two games physically as well as thematically, economically, and structurally. Other upcoming modes include GÇ£Penetration,GÇ¥ which will allow Dust mercenaries to raid and board EVEGÇÖs Titan-class warships, and GÇ£Gladiator,GÇ¥ a set of organized tournaments that will include in-game betting and streaming. Quote:GÇ£GÇÿUprisingGÇÖ is not the end of the major, free updates. WeGÇÖve got quite a few more planned for the rest of 2013 and then out for two years, out for five years, out for ten years, just like EVE.GÇ¥ Oh and here's a GREAT quote, what happened to this? Quote:GÇ£This is the way that CCP does a game,GÇ¥ says Laurino. GÇ£WeGÇÖll never make a Dust 514-2, right?"
Nice one.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
3
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:47:00 -
[475] - Quote
Hey, thanks for the questions and for pointing that stuff out. As part of my responsibilities beyond the email newsletters and trolling the CPM, I also am now looking after all the content on the website. Seems we have some edits to make, obviously, as a result of all that has been going down recently.
One of which you have highlighted here - some of that information is out of date in that we won't be making a PS Vita companion app for DUST 514. I'm going to get the website to reflect the current state of affairs with as much as we know for certain for now.[/quote]
How can you guys be so out of date with your own information that the public knows about it before you do? And really, do you think we REALLY care about the status of a VITA app considering what has been going down the past few days? |
INeXusI
Synthetic Clones
0
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Posted - 2014.05.07 03:49:00 -
[476] - Quote
ANON Cerberus wrote:Void Echo wrote:Regardless of character and asset transfers, if your not going to bring Legion to the PS4 in the future (IDC when as long as it doesnt interfeer with my dust gameplay) then dont bother with trying to make it look nice for dust payers.
Dust 514 is strictly a CONSOLE GAME, NOT A PC GAME, and anything pertaining to a PC release and no word on whats happening to console releases is straight up microsoft style bullshit. I will NOT join Legion if it doesn't end up on PS4 and nether will ALOT of your dust playerbase.
I have no intention of becoming a PC FPS player for any reason. Making Legion look like a PC only game was one of the worst mistakes youv ever made as a company. Your alienating your console players by saying "If you want to stay, switch to PC".
Character transfers are the least of concerns for those of us who have no intention of going to PC. Either MAKE plans for PS4 version of Legion or your can say goodby to alot of dust players when this hits. And EVE was strictly a PC game not a console game. Now you PS3 players know how us EVE players felt when we found out DUST was going to be a console game and not on CCP`s home turf = the PC. I understand that for console players, this turn of events is shocking and surprising. Its surprising for me too considering I have been moaning for a PC version of dust for years. However Legion is going to be where it belongs, on PC along with EVE. I see that as truly the best way to guarantee the games can have interconnected meaningful gameplay experiences. I always had doubts about console to pc interaction. EDIT - TO THE POSTER ABOVE ME - A reasonable gaming PC can be built or bought for a similar price to the PS4 or Xbox 1. There are many people on the forums as well as many many good websites that demonstrate this. Sure you can spend way more on a PC if you want everything, all the peripherals, top of the range GPU and CPU but by then its big money but you will get extreme performance too. You dont need to spend loads, a decent enough PC can be built for the same money as a PS4. . WELL OBVIOUSLY YOU DONT REALIZE THAT FPS ARE A CONSOLE FAN FAVORITE. I WENT AND BOUGHT A PS3EXCLUSIVELY FOR DUST
We Stand Together, We Fight Together, We Die Together, We Do Not Surrender.
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Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
3
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Posted - 2014.05.07 04:05:00 -
[477] - Quote
Vrain Matari wrote:CCP Rouge wrote:Hi everyone. Me again.
... My own reaction to our current situation is much the same as Reav's. The move to development on PC is a logical imperative, there is nothing to argue with there. What is infuriating and distasteful is the way CCP has chosen to deceive and mistreat players. These are people who have invested heavily in a deeply flawed and poorly reviewed product for the sake of contributing in whatever ways they could to the development process and doing their part to help achieve the original vision for DUST 514. There are no excuses here, only choices and consequences. The developers are all adults and know how to treat people right. The behavior of CCP in this instance is nonsensical since their entire business is based around building long-term relationships with players. At any rate i'm retiring from New Eden, DUST and EVE both, and will find other ways to get my VR kick than Valkyrie. Legion will be my reentry to New Eden, if and only if CCP demonstrates a newfound respect for the people who invest in their products, elevates open communication on these forums to EVE standards, and makes redress for their cynical mistreatment of their DUST playerbase.
Well said! |
Nemesis 888
Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION
4
|
Posted - 2014.05.07 04:10:00 -
[478] - Quote
ANON Cerberus wrote:Void Echo wrote:Regardless of character and asset transfers, if your not going to bring Legion to the PS4 in the future (IDC when as long as it doesnt interfeer with my dust gameplay) then dont bother with trying to make it look nice for dust payers.
Dust 514 is strictly a CONSOLE GAME, NOT A PC GAME, and anything pertaining to a PC release and no word on whats happening to console releases is straight up microsoft style bullshit. I will NOT join Legion if it doesn't end up on PS4 and nether will ALOT of your dust playerbase.
I have no intention of becoming a PC FPS player for any reason. Making Legion look like a PC only game was one of the worst mistakes youv ever made as a company. Your alienating your console players by saying "If you want to stay, switch to PC".
Character transfers are the least of concerns for those of us who have no intention of going to PC. Either MAKE plans for PS4 version of Legion or your can say goodby to alot of dust players when this hits. And EVE was strictly a PC game not a console game. Now you PS3 players know how us EVE players felt when we found out DUST was going to be a console game and not on CCP`s home turf = the PC. I understand that for console players, this turn of events is shocking and surprising. Its surprising for me too considering I have been moaning for a PC version of dust for years. However Legion is going to be where it belongs, on PC along with EVE. I see that as truly the best way to guarantee the games can have interconnected meaningful gameplay experiences. I always had doubts about console to pc interaction. EDIT - TO THE POSTER ABOVE ME - A reasonable gaming PC can be built or bought for a similar price to the PS4 or Xbox 1. There are many people on the forums as well as many many good websites that demonstrate this. Sure you can spend way more on a PC if you want everything, all the peripherals, top of the range GPU and CPU but by then its big money but you will get extreme performance too. You dont need to spend loads, a decent enough PC can be built for the same money as a PS4.
Really? I've been building PCs for years and I've never built a decent one for the price of what a PS4 goes for. Wouldn't I just end up with PS4 like performance? What's the point of that?
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Vargralor
Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic
42
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Posted - 2014.05.07 04:26:00 -
[479] - Quote
Nemesis 888 wrote:Meric Voyer wrote:Pliny Eldritch wrote:This... This is just stupid. It's not like this is the first time a change in course from CCP has caused rage and drama, and it sure as &$^% won't be the last. What's sad is that it could have been different this time. As a community, we're all on the same page with CCP about what Dust is lacking. Many of us also agree that the PS3 has started it's long slow slide to oblivion, and that investing massive resources into it is a waste. You could also probably get most of us to admit that the current Dust player base isn't big enough to justify serious ongoing investment. Where things have gone wrong is CCP falling for one of the oldest logical fallacies in Software Engineering. When dealing with a large project that is not working, with no obvious or easy fixes, the answer that always feels easiest is to tear it down and start over. It's also almost always the wrong answer. Dust is broken. But it's still making money. People are playing it, and they're still paying to play it. CCP should take a page from Square Enix's successful reboot of FFXIV. For those unfamiliar, there are some real parallels between the first FFXIV's failure and Dust's current situation. Instead of trying to keep Dust limping along on PS3 while trying to develop an entirely new game on PC, CCP should strongly consider putting Dust on life support now. Keep a couple of devs for critical balance and bug fixes, and give the community some tasty discounts to keep them paying and playing. Use the freed-up devs to expedite a port of the then feature-frozen Dust from Unreal Engine 3 to Unreal Engine 4. Build for both PC and PS4 (as well as the XBone if MS is willing to play ball) simultaneously. It will take longer on the QA end, but if Epic has done their job properly with UE 4, the same code should run on both platforms. Doing both at once makes the Console/PC decision much less expensive in both money and time than porting later. Resist the temptation to do anything but get Dust running on the new systems. Once Dust is playable on PS4 and PC, give PS3 Dust a Matrix Online style send-off. Instead of making people worry about their investments of time and Aurum and how they might transfer into a new game, make the PC and PS4 ports use the same character data. Then start refactoring in all the Project Legion goodness, respeccing and resetting as needed - just like EVE's evolution. ^ Sensible solution. CCP has no sense though, so yeah.... Someone at CCP should hire this guy to be the Game Director for DUST/Legion.
This would certainly be a good approach if Dust was a good starting point for developing Legion. Unfortunately, as pointed out in several of the Dev comments, changing Dust from what it is now (a lobby shooter) in to a sandbox environment integrated tightly with EVE (the stated eventual goal) is not simply a matter of patching in additional functionality. The entire underlying core of the game has to change. Once you start to look at it in that vein it does make more sense to start again and simply reuse components of Dust where possible. Let's look at battles for instance. Have a good think about what a sandbox playstyle really means. The current battle system would be an anomaly in the new world. The sort of thing used for tournaments and events. In a sandbox environment, two relatively balanced teams only match up against each other if someone f*cked up bigtime. |
tastzlike chicken
Rogue Spades
269
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Posted - 2014.05.07 04:37:00 -
[480] - Quote
Nemesis 888 wrote:tastzlike chicken wrote:Quote:When it comes to DUST development I can tell you that we are currently looking at changes to Planetary Conquest, further iterating on item balance after Uprising 1.8 and some matchmaking improvements With only half of the hamsters than were previously assigned to Dust "development' (fixes and balancing); is it safe to assume that the speed and responsiveness we've come to expect from the DUST Dev team will suffer? You're trying to be funny right? Tell me this comment was a joke.
most definitely sarcastic...
I support legion. - it's more of a theoretical support. Depending on the feedback I get, it may become actual support.
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