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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
Zaria Min Deir 0uter.Heaven 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 08:11:00 - [61] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what if proto is "only" 7 high/lows Why? Honest to god, the only reasoning I see for this is the calculations popping up in other threads on how the Caldari Logi specifically would become too good again in comparison to the Cal Assault... Which I personally see as an issue with the Cal Logi and Cal Assault suits, NOT the whole Logi class. And I thought you proclaimed your lack of fear of killer bees? You've already stated you're planning on making fitting Logi suits more... difficult is not the right word, necessary, but more equipment focused ( as they should be) and as a result, less versatile in other areas (not necessarily entirely a good thing). The thing with reducing module fitting capacity is that... brick tank is actually easier to fit in many cases than most of the utility modules. Which is not a purely Logistics related issue, but should actually be looked at as a whole to encourage people away from bricking any and all suits anyway... But I digress. As you're already partially walking back the speed canges to Logi (I am referring to sprint speed remaining the same as now) AND also removing a module slot on top of that, we're maybe even looking at a net nerf to Logis O.o Why do you think it would be necessary? Have you considered installing the improved keyboard? "Go Go Power Rangers!"
The Eristic Art.of.Death 995	Posted - 2015.05.28 08:20:00 - [62] - Quote 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 23	Posted - 2015.05.28 08:40:00 - [63] - Quote Zaria Min Deir wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what if proto is "only" 7 high/lows Why? Honest to god, the only reasoning I see for this is the calculations popping up in other threads on how the Caldari Logi specifically would become too good again in comparison to the Cal Assault... Which I personally see as an issue with the Cal Logi and Cal Assault suits, NOT the whole Logi class. And I thought you proclaimed your lack of fear of killer bees? You've already stated you're planning on making fitting Logi suits more... difficult is not the right word, necessary, but more equipment focused ( as they should be) and as a result, less versatile in other areas (not necessarily entirely a good thing). The thing with reducing module fitting capacity is that... brick tank is actually easier to fit in many cases than most of the utility modules. Which is not a purely Logistics related issue, but should actually be looked at as a whole to encourage people away from bricking any and all suits anyway... But I digress. As you're already partially walking back the speed canges to Logi (I am referring to sprint speed remaining the same as now) AND also removing a module slot on top of that, we're maybe even looking at a net nerf to Logis O.o Why do you think it would be necessary? I don't, it was just a question. It also relates to normalized fitting, but just thought I would throw it out there. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 23	Posted - 2015.05.28 08:41:00 - [64] - Quote The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

The Eristic Art.of.Death 995	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:02:00 - [65] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... This is just me speaking for myself, but I run all four logis on my chars, and I find the sidearm of the Amarr enormously more useful for defending myself and my links than grenades. It would eliminate the much more troublesome issue of H/L slot inconsistency vs equip sacrifice (which should not be an option if we want logis to be logis). Grenades are generally more offensive than defensive in this game, so let the Assaults and Sentinels throw the 'nades, let the logis keep them supplied? Also, it would also preclude the imminent Callogi killerbees buzzing about their endless Core Locus hives. Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:28:00 - [66] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... I enjoy using flux grenades on all of my logi's, but I think there's some potential balance issues in regards to callogi & core locus grenades (54-81 grenades per spawn depending on what proto nanohive you have). Honestly, I think logi's should be 8-9 slots, grenade, no sidearm, 4 equipment. I run a lot of ewar fit logi's (4 accounts) that use 2-3 complex precision amps and sometimes 2 complex range amps (on callogi) depending on the slot layout I'm given, just because I find that it provides more constant 'use' to my team with the logistics scanning ranges & precision. I also get incredibly frustrated with the callogi because carrying a nanohive often precludes me from using more useful equipment at times (like a drop uplink or a repair tool), I would kill for a 4th equipment on it and happily give up a lowslot for it. At Proto: Caldari: 5high, 3low, Weapon, Grenade, 4 equipment Minmatar: 4high, 4low, Weapon, Grenade, 4 equipment. Gallente: 3High, 5low, Weapon, Grenade, 4 equipment. Amarr: 3high, (4?) 5low, Weapon, Sidearm, Grenade, (3?) 4equipment. (This is really up to the amarr if they want to trade an equipment or a lowslot for a sidearm or if they want to lose the sidearm and gain an equipment/lowslot). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 19	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:42:00 - [67] - Quote Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. CPM 1, Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= ADV HAVs =// Unlocked
Zaria Min Deir 0uter.Heaven 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:47:00 - [68] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Zaria Min Deir wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what if proto is "only" 7 high/lows Why? Honest to god, the only reasoning I see for this is the calculations popping up in other threads on how the Caldari Logi specifically would become too good again in comparison to the Cal Assault... Which I personally see as an issue with the Cal Logi and Cal Assault suits, NOT the whole Logi class. And I thought you proclaimed your lack of fear of killer bees? You've already stated you're planning on making fitting Logi suits more... difficult is not the right word, necessary, but more equipment focused ( as they should be) and as a result, less versatile in other areas (not necessarily entirely a good thing). The thing with reducing module fitting capacity is that... brick tank is actually easier to fit in many cases than most of the utility modules. Which is not a purely Logistics related issue, but should actually be looked at as a whole to encourage people away from bricking any and all suits anyway... But I digress. As you're already partially walking back the speed canges to Logi (I am referring to sprint speed remaining the same as now) AND also removing a module slot on top of that, we're maybe even looking at a net nerf to Logis O.o Why do you think it would be necessary? I don't, it was just a question. It also relates to normalized fitting, but just thought I would throw it out there. My apologies if my response came across as an overreaction... Sometimes you scare me a bit with the way you "throw something out there" Have you considered installing the improved keyboard? "Go Go Power Rangers!"
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:51:00 - [69] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. Logi's already have a disadvantage vs assaults though - HP & Regen. Flux grenades are way too useful, especially when dealing with glitchy equipment. I'm not sure if it's even possible but what would limiting logi's to flux grenades be like? What if we actually implemented grenade 'sizes', with heavies getting the 'large' grenade slots (special contact grenades/very nasty heavy av grenades), assaults getting the mediums (the current run of grenades), and logi's getting 'light' grenades (same radius but half damage?). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Zaria Min Deir 0uter.Heaven 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:51:00 - [70] - Quote The Eristic wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... This is just me speaking for myself, but I run all four logis on my chars, and I find the sidearm of the Amarr enormously more useful for defending myself and my links than grenades. It would eliminate the much more troublesome issue of H/L slot inconsistency vs equip sacrifice (which should not be an option if we want logis to be logis). Grenades are generally more offensive than defensive in this game, so let the Assaults and Sentinels throw the 'nades, let the logis keep them supplied? Also, it would also preclude the imminent Callogi killerbees buzzing about their endless Core Locus hives. But but but my flux nades... But seriously, once again... if Cal Logis with Core nades are a problem, does that really warrant removing the nade slot on all Logis? Or maybe it might be a time to take a look at locus nades and how they interact with the Cal Logi (and it's bonus to hives) specifically... Just a thought. MINA Longstrike wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. But flux grenades too useful, especially when dealing with glitchy equipment. I'm not sure if it's even possible but what would limiting logi's to flux grenades be like? What if we actually implemented grenade 'sizes', with heavies getting the 'large' grenade slots (special contact grenades/very nasty heavy av grenades), assaults getting the mediums (the current run of grenades), and logi's getting 'light' grenades (same radius but half damage?) Something along these lines would be vastly preferrable and more interesting than just plain removing the Logi's ability to support the team by, for instance, dealing with enemy equipment efficiently. Have you considered installing the improved keyboard? "Go Go Power Rangers!"

Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 19	Posted - 2015.05.28 09:57:00 - [71] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. Logi's already have a disadvantage vs assaults though - HP & Regen. Flux grenades are way too useful, especially when dealing with glitchy equipment. I'm not sure if it's even possible but what would limiting logi's to flux grenades be like? What if we actually implemented grenade 'sizes', with heavies getting the 'large' grenade slots (special contact grenades/very nasty heavy av grenades), assaults getting the mediums (the current run of grenades), and logi's getting 'light' grenades (same radius but half damage?). I am fearful that having grenade sizes would be a complexity for complexity's sake and will serve no real function. CPM 1, Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= ADV HAVs =// Unlocked
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.05.28 10:02:00 - [72] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: MINA Longstrike wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. Logi's already have a disadvantage vs assaults though - HP & Regen. Flux grenades are way too useful, especially when dealing with glitchy equipment. I'm not sure if it's even possible but what would limiting logi's to flux grenades be like? What if we actually implemented grenade 'sizes', with heavies getting the 'large' grenade slots (special contact grenades/very nasty heavy av grenades), assaults getting the mediums (the current run of grenades), and logi's getting 'light' grenades (same radius but half damage?). I am fearful that having grenade sizes would be a complexity for complexity's sake and will serve no real function. Possibly. I think there are some balance upsides to it though. It would allow logi's to keep grenades without core locus idiocy being present everywhere or allowing them to 'overperform' against suits that they probably shouldnt (lol allotek flux & combat rifle vs cal/minsent). It also potentially gives heavies a unique and limited but nasty grenade option. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 10:25:00 - [73] - Quote Just throwing this out there Amarr logi is 3 HS / 1 L / 1 S /1G /3 EQ /4 LS Instead of removing a low slot or the side arm, i propose trading the high slot 2 HS / 1 L / 1 S / 1 G / 4 EQ / 4 LS Unless anybody can tell me what the third high can be used for on an armor suit, i think thats the best trade. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me. "I sometimes wonder why I share stuff "- CCP Rattati
Varoth Drac Dead Man's Game 904	Posted - 2015.05.28 10:39:00 - [74] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Just throwing this out there Amarr logi is 3 HS / 1 L / 1 S /1G /3 EQ /4 LS Instead of removing a low slot or the side arm, i propose trading the high slot 2 HS / 1 L / 1 S / 1 G / 4 EQ / 4 LS Unless anybody can tell me what the third high can be used for on an armor suit, i think thats the best trade. Actually, it should be 2 HS / 1 L / 1 S / 1 G / 4 EQ / 5 LS , or maybe 3H, 4L or if equipment trade is chosen: 3 HS / 1 L / 1 S / 1 G / 3 EQ / 5 LS Either way it should be 8 mods + 4 equipment + sidearm - 1 equipment or module. It's possible that swapping a high slot for a sidearm would be overpowered though.
Kain Spero Negative-Feedback 5	Posted - 2015.05.28 10:44:00 - [75] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... The grenade is far to vital to clearing enemy equipment IMO (flux nades) to have it removed. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and Legion news
Haerr The Rainbow Effect Negative-Feedback 2	Posted - 2015.05.28 11:37:00 - [76] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... The grenade is far to vital to clearing enemy equipment IMO (flux nades) to have it removed. Agreed. As long as the Logis get to have 4EQ slots, a Light weapon, and Grenades I really couldn't care less about how many High/Low slots are deemed appropriate. (Nor Sidearm slot)
Talos Vagheitan Ancient Exiles. 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 12:11:00 - [77] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what if proto is "only" 7 high/lows I was actually thinking this too. What if a Logi takes the assault fitting, and simply drags the sidearm, and two more slots into EQ. Carries more equipment - is less combat effective. Working as intended !--CCP, let's push for the license of Dust on both current Gen consoles--!
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.05.28 12:18:00 - [78] - Quote Talos Vagheitan wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what if proto is "only" 7 high/lows I was actually thinking this too. What if a Logi takes the assault fitting, and simply drags the sidearm, and two more slots into EQ. Carries more equipment - is less combat effective. Working as intended Seven slots is ~~prettymuch~~ a unilateral nerf. Logi's are already lacking in hp and regen values compared to assaults - yes they get marginally higher inherent armor rep, at the cost of much worse shield recharge and longer delays. 8 high/low slots is fine, it allows for some flexability and utility oriented fittings without completely giving up HP. I'll still be able to create a cal ewar logi for example with 2precision in highs and 2 range in lows - the one I currently run can die to a single shotgun shot if I'm not incredibly careful and that's with one more low Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Balistyc Farshot OUTCAST MERCS General Tso's Alliance 192	Posted - 2015.05.28 13:32:00 - [79] - Quote I wonder if the grenade versus side arm discussion could perhaps make the logi focused on being the king of explosives. In the real battlefield, the engineers plant the explosives. What if one of the logi suits was made specifically to be the grenadier class style suit. I would recommend the Gal logi and remove the scanner bonus (I like the bonus but EWAR is an issue in this game, period) for adding x % to explosive weapon splash dmg range. Then give it 2 grenade slots, no sidearm, 1 light, 3 equipment slots. 3 equipment for 1 nanohive, 1-2 sets of REs, and potentially a third piece of equipment. Then this suit becomes a suit that runs with the assaults with a purpose besides standing back behind a wall and scanning every 2 minutes. This could be one of the other logis as well, but not the min, they have a lot of bonuses to be assault logis already. I know, I do that now. With the team chat gone, we need to really start leveraging the squad finder!
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 692	Posted - 2015.05.28 14:29:00 - [80] - Quote A past point was about how the different Logis use different types of equipment. Amarr and Caldari set them down, Gallente and Minmatar use their equipment actively. Maybe the former should get sidearms to have more to do? Personally, I kind of dislike how every Logi only gets one type of equipment bonus. It pigeonholds them too much. I do like the idea of demolition Logis. Grenades, REs, etc. for some fun indirect fire support. Hell, a demo Logi could even lay traps and then lure enemies into them with suppressive fire from team mates.

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 9	Posted - 2015.05.28 14:37:00 - [81] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: The Eristic wrote: 8 slots + 4 equip + Light + Sidearm on all four in exchange for the grenade slot? Or sidearm on just Amarr/Cal for the grenade? hmmm, that's certainly an option. I think the grenade fits the amarr combat logi idea though, so... If I may weigh in here sir, Grenades are traditionally a frontline attack mode issued to personnel involved in breaching, patrolling and active defense. They are not normally issued among combat engineers, medics and logistics crews under most circumstances. Battle rifles and sidearms are more common for personal defense when tasked to frontline units. To be honest grenades are more useful to assaults and scouts than to logis and sentinels. Machinegun teams tend to be more focused on feeding the bullet devourer. But they still get issued them. WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
Al the destroyer 0uter.Heaven 378	Posted - 2015.05.28 15:15:00 - [82] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. ^^^^ this is NOT a good idea at all. A logi needs a grenade for tank spam and eguipment clearing!! I have said before as a logi I would be totally ok with sidearm only but if that's the case I believe we should get a speed AND an ehp buff. No one will want to be a slayer logi with a sidearm. If need be make it where a logi cannot carry locust grenades this would take care of lolcorespam Most all dedicated logis would be ok with sidearm only.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4	Posted - 2015.05.28 16:13:00 - [83] - Quote So in light of these two aspect from the other thread. CCP Rattati wrote: The designs need to make sense, intuitively. In order of priority, imagine a pyramid Slot progression needs to make sense, within roles and between roles PG/CPU capacity as they relate to slots and their layout HP and Speed are inverse, that's just physics and again intuitive These 3 principles form the foundation for Dropsuits. While they don't make sense, all the small things on top don't really matter. That's why I am not tackling role bonuses, because the foundation is cracked and not worth building on. CCP Rattati wrote: The rules of thumb as applied to the Medium class now: Mobility (stamina pool and recovery) CA/GA = normal Amarr= 5% lower Minmatar = 5% higher Sprint Basic = normal = 1.4x Logistics = normal-0.1 = 1.3x Assault = normal+0.1 = 1.5x eHP Basic = normal Logistics = lower Assault = higher Speed Basic = normal Logistics = higher Assault = lower I'm wondering what Stamina numbers and HP numbers we're looking at for the new base logi profiles to keep them in line with the stated 'Speed higher, eHP lower' method outlined above (a method I'm heartily in support of btw), in light of the assault having a higher sprint speed. I must say I am really excited to see all roles game wide adhere to a consistent logical method determining how they are iterated to give equal and balanced survivability while maintaining diversity of function (I'm also looking forward to later once survival of all roles is balance, giving the assault some love via their bonuses as has long been requested, but that obviously is a project of it's own o7 ) CPM 1 mail me your feedback and remember to have fun!
Doc DDD TeamPlayers Negative-Feedback 475	Posted - 2015.05.28 17:48:00 - [84] - Quote a faster cal logi is still going to suck more than cal assault due to low shield regen and high delay.. 3 more equipment slots wont' make it any more of a slayer.. brick tank and stand on triage hives, might as well do the same with cal assault since it has much faster shield regen. faster min logi breaks hit detection.. another fotm, start skilling today. faster gal logi improves upon gal assault builds.. probably reason for buff, more fun for armor users, more triage hives, scans and nade spam. faster amar logi is good for getting those links down.. fine by me I really see no reason to buff logi speed.... there are much greater issues with the game that should be dealt with rather than how fast a logi runs and whether amar should lose it's sidearm. Caldari will still be worst logi regardless of changes.
XxGhazbaranxX Eternal Beings 1	Posted - 2015.05.28 17:50:00 - [85] - Quote I was getting kind of annoyed at gallogi only having 2 low slots and nothing else at standard level while minny had 2high and 2 low. Never inderstood this have ask for a change before and it was never answered Plasma Cannon Advocate
Dergle Negative-Feedback. 87	Posted - 2015.05.28 18:09:00 - [86] - Quote Please please don't get rid of my grenade slot the mk.0 logi !! I need them fluxes :/ Ignore your instincts at your peril.
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 928	Posted - 2015.05.28 18:10:00 - [87] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. I would agree. Don't know about the grenade slot, but giving all Logis Sidearms only seems like a smart move. Then at least we finally can put to rest all these killer Logis threads and discussions... I would go as far as giving Amaar 2 Sidearm slots in exchange for the equipment slots, making them "Commandos" Light.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 19	Posted - 2015.05.28 18:21:00 - [88] - Quote Al the destroyer wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. ^^^^ this is NOT a good idea at all. A logi needs a grenade for tank spam and eguipment clearing!! I have said before as a logi I would be totally ok with sidearm only but if that's the case I believe we should get a speed AND an ehp buff. No one will want to be a slayer logi with a sidearm. If need be make it where a logi cannot carry locust grenades this would take care of lolcorespam Most all dedicated logis would be ok with sidearm only. Why not? Tanks can't do everything, LAVs cant do inverything, Sentinels can't do everything, why should logistics be able to do everything? CPM 1, Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= ADV HAVs =// Unlocked
Al the destroyer 0uter.Heaven 381	Posted - 2015.05.28 18:41:00 - [89] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Al the destroyer wrote: Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Nade lost on logis and giving them all side arms instead would make them distinctively disadvantaged vs an assault. ^^^^ this is NOT a good idea at all. A logi needs a grenade for tank spam and eguipment clearing!! I have said before as a logi I would be totally ok with sidearm only but if that's the case I believe we should get a speed AND an ehp buff. No one will want to be a slayer logi with a sidearm. If need be make it where a logi cannot carry locust grenades this would take care of lolcorespam Most all dedicated logis would be ok with sidearm only. Why not? Tanks can't do everything, LAVs cant do inverything, Sentinels can't do everything, why should logistics be able to do everything? Your talking about taking 2 things away BIG DIFFERENCE! As I said I wouldn't mind if you made logis sidearm only wouldn't change my play style at all. But trying to Nerf logis because you aren't one or you don't see their worth makes no sense to me. Why do you hate logis so much? So if a logi had a sidearm and a grenade not even a locust he could do everything!?!?! Ridiculous Edit get some sleep, take a breath, or take a walk and think about what you are saying your a CPM FFS!
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3	Posted - 2015.05.28 18:44:00 - [90] - Quote It's at times like this when I read through threads such as this one that I find myself with my face in my palm, shaking my head. There are a few good ideas being talked about but I see so many ideas that make me think, "Have some of you ever even been a logi before!?" I don't mean just chubby chasing or camping at Alpha on Impact Ridge with a heavy and a rep tool. There is a lot more to being a good logi than that. I await with anticipation the outcome of this discussion. "Madness how we turned our common-ground into a battle-ground.." - Essa



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