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Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3036	Posted - 2014.10.02 19:12:00 - [1] - Quote Input and feedback is being sought regarding the state of Commandos within Dust, and how to polish the experience. When responding to this thread please note your primary role / primary context for use of each item being commented on so that proper context can be applied. Cheers, Cross PS ~ Commandos are something I know comparatively little about, so please do your best to be detailed and constructive so that I am able to provide the very best feedback and ideas to CCP. Thanks See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Spademan Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 3913	Posted - 2014.10.02 19:33:00 - [2] - Quote Okay, so I'm specced into the Minmatar Commando and use the CR and MD on it. I remember I think either Adamance or Yassavi saying something along the lines of making them suppression units. I think the gist was to pump up the amount of ammo they can carry and the reload speed. A sort of "never stop shooting" kind of deal. I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special. Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
Cass Caul 1186	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:14:00 - [3] - Quote Primary role: gal scout/logi/assault, caldari Scout/logi/commando, Amarr Scout/logi/assault/sentinel, Minmatar Scout. Honestly couldn't tell you which i use the most often, just that i use those more than the rest because they are my proto suits Caldari commando: skilled it to 5 on day 1. Purpose was 95% because it's the only viable sniper suit. 5% because trail rifle was OP (now it's just really strong). Caldari commando: it needs a fifth module slot. there's a gigantic disparity in high slot vs low slot value. No suit in the game should only have 1 low slot. Amarr commando. Lvl 3, use LP proto suits. Have it because i have a **** ton of SP. Amarr commando: 10% damage is less useful that 25% great build up reduction. HP difference between assault and commando is too close Galmando: lvl 3, because Gallente fangirl. Galmando: short range on AR and slow make you an easy target. Shotgun without movement speed can be used for WTF moments but pretty useless. also as an alpha damage weapon 10% isn't significant. PLC, same problem as shotgun. Minmatar: lvl 3 because i can Minmatar.: good, only because CR is still OP Like the idea of added total ammo. Really think they need the same number of high/low slots as sentinel equivalents On Hiatus.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 367	Posted - 2014.10.02 20:39:00 - [4] - Quote If we gave them the old assault suit slot layouts would that make them OP? Gal commando has the high slot crutch currently. Only one high slot at advanced and proto?! 3 high 2 low or 2 and 2 would be better, and I don't think it makes the suit OP. I could be wrong though. "Anybody order chaos?"
hfderrtgvcd 606	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:21:00 - [5] - Quote All they need is a grenade slot. You can't fight in here! This is the war room.
Dremel wp Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 37	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:40:00 - [6] - Quote I'm thinking they need a third bonus, 20% max ammo/level to come out as a suppression fighter. They are usually at a disadvantage due to E-war and mobility. I think this would be step towards them being able to fight their way out of situations.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 563	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:55:00 - [7] - Quote Im lvl 5 in gallente commando and caldari commando i like a shotgun/AR combo with proxy scanner on the gallente and a rail rifle/sniper combo or rail rifle/ swarm launcher combo on the caldari commando The shield stats on the caldari commando were intentionally desgined to nerf the suit. if you look at the shield stats of other commandos, theyre actually improved or equal to their racial assault suit. but the caldari commando is the only one thats made to be worse. id like to see the commando damage bonus increased to 15% or extend the current damage and reload bonuses to racial sidearms i know some people want more ammo or bigger clip sizes for a more suppressive role, but commanods have neither the HP to provided extended fire support while under fire, or good enough regen to get back into the fight. the tight fitting requirements and limited module slot layout means each module slot must be maximized in terms of slot efficiency. we cant afford stacking penalties from multiple modules
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1862	Posted - 2014.10.02 21:57:00 - [8] - Quote Specced I to Cal, Gal, and Min commandos. First, we need to establish what commandos should do. Are they heavy assault? AV platforms? Until we give them a clear role, balancing them is moot. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2209	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:31:00 - [9] - Quote Remove swarm damage bonus from Minmatar and give it to Caldari (just to troll Atiim). Dust was real! I was there! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
Bahirae Serugiusu Vendetta Reactionary Force 160	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:51:00 - [10] - Quote Oh I see how it is the suit that can carry two light weapons and get a damage bonus gets the attention but Assault dropsuits get no attention

Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game RUST415 487	Posted - 2014.10.02 22:58:00 - [11] - Quote I use Commando suits, Gallent mostly now but Caldari (I think) before because I wanted to try out shields when all the new commando's were released. Tac AR + Breach shotgun, 1 damage mod and an assortment of armour/reps depending on how I'm feeling. The shotgun is mostly for killing scouts or HMG's that get too close, but I have also pulled off some crazy scout-like jumps from high places to headshot people when feeling bored. Have fun with both, come out with positive kdr using both... I think most of the complaints come from people who don't use commando because they like having their high speed suits, which can now have more hp anyway. This leaves me confused though as although other suits do the job better, I'm still getting the kind of scores that caused ADS's to get nerfed. So even though it could use an increase to either hp or movespeed (to keep up with numbers on the assaults) or a grenade slot, I can't understand the thought process to what gets buffed/nerfed. Perhaps the better idea would be to nerf (I know people hate nerf, but love buff, even though it does the same thing) the assault suit, drop the equipment slot so it doesn't do everything a commando does... PS the scout suit should also lose an equip slot to stop it doing the logi's job also.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3211	Posted - 2014.10.02 23:09:00 - [12] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Specced I to Cal, Gal, and Min commandos. First, we need to establish what commandos should do. Are they heavy assault? AV platforms? Until we give them a clear role, balancing them is moot. (I've played around with all Commandos, heavy focus on Gallente with moderate on Minmatar. I'll avoid writing a multi-paragraph segment bragging about how many things I have trained.) I fully agree that the Commando and Assault are largely redundant, and honestly in Legion they could combine most the bonuses/abilities into one suit and it would make a really solid role. But alas our bastard child that is the Commando exists, so we need to make due. I think it's fine that the Commando and Assault fill very similar roles, the important part is making each one fulfill a different facet of that role. I think first we need to determine what the role of the Assault is under existing mechanics. Once we've determined that, we can see what other facets of the role the Commando could fulfill, without overly compartmentalizing the Assault role. Assaults Moderate-High Mobility: Well suited for closing distances and moderate flanking. Weapon Support Bonuses: Offsets the weakness of Racial Weapons with Bonuses Moderate Base HP-High Slot Count: Flexible yet capable of Moderate-High HP when fitted. Medium Hitbox: Capable of relying on speed/hitbox to mitigate some incoming DPS Weapon Fitting Bonus: Able to fit Higher tiered Light Weapons and Grenades with less cost. So basically you have a role which is very mobile, and while not as quick as the scout, can still make use of less direct methods of getting from A to B. That is to say they are direct combat oriented, but not necessarily completely frontal assault. They are not necessarily maximum damage dealers, as they don't actually boost the damage output of the weapon. Instead, bonuses offset negative attributes of their racial weapons, which in turn makes each weapon more flexible and viable in suboptimal situations. In short, the Assault personifies direct but non-frontal combat, with a primary focus of flexibility and adaptability in the slaying role. Assaults are capable of putting focused DPS where it needs to go at the right time in order to get the job done cleanly. So now what we've defined what the Assault does, let's look at some things that it doesn't do and discuss how we can tie those concepts into defining what the Commando should do. Concepts to Consider and Discuss: Direct Frontal Attacking (Higher Defense - Lower Mobility) Maximum Damage Output (Bonuses to Damage) Sustained Damage Output (Bonuses to Reload) Quantity Over Quality (Suppression Abilities) Less Flexible - More Focused Role (Buff Strengths of Weapons) Additional Points of Contention: Little Incentive to use Prototype (Only 2 additional slots) and extremely Low Slot Count in general (2/3/4) when other suits have upwards of (4/6/8). Just as a starting measure the Commando should have the same slot layout as the Sentinels. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3211	Posted - 2014.10.02 23:10:00 - [13] - Quote Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: Oh I see how it is the suit that can carry two light weapons and get a damage bonus gets the attention but Assault dropsuits get no attention blinks You don't really pay much attention to the hotfixes do you? Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Chief-Shotty WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 283	Posted - 2014.10.02 23:47:00 - [14] - Quote I like to think commandos as a beefier or harder hitting assault..like a heavy infantry role. Not as a point defense or guard like a sentinel suit. Just an alternate form of an assault. You can carry 2 light weapons for max flexibility and I prefer to use the 2 slots as one for infantry and the other for vehicle/long range support. For example I routinely have an assault-support oriented fit CR with an Anti-Vehicle support -SWARM CR with a long range support- Mass Driver The fast reload and higher damage offsets that im not really all that vulnerable if a i have to reload mid-combat and the higher damage offsets the needs for a secondary firearm or provide massive suppression ability against targets (Suppression is my focus). Unless you want to be flexible for attacking shield and armor tanked suits. The problems i seem to have is for the role of heavier assault -its a bit slow and doesn't really pack the health for its size -The lack of customization really hurts because you have disadvantages in the suit but you can't offset it with modules much. (biotics,health etc) -too slow to be a frontline pusher (CQC) -not EHP sufficient to be a sentinel (Guard or point holder) I prefer to orient the commando towards assault, with that said. -Same H/L slot count of sentinels -Slight increase to movement/sprint speeds -maybe a grenade slot The only thing i would be afraid of is highslot stacking (I know someone will stack damage mods to make them OP) So perhaps more low sots then usual....maybe this might fix your biotics modules being unused. I would love to put kin-cats/cardio enhancers on it. While still having the capacity to put internal reps. Although most will just stack more armor health because of the general brick-tank meta. At least that will stop the complaints that other suits can out tank a heavy suit. I also think its is worst of when it comes to ewar. Its slow like a heavy but don't pack the health, the damage of an HMG, or the evasion movement to offset being surprised by a scout. 8-Time New Eden Mass Driver Champion Min Commando Combat Rifle and Mass Driver = FUN and Tears OMG the Tears!! :)
Magnus Amadeuss Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1118	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:00:00 - [15] - Quote So I have pretty much always used amarr weapons as much as I possibly can. I have all amarr suits at proto and have had them like that since the amarr scout was released, and I only run amarr suits (well on occasion I guess I run my covenant C-1. Believe me when I say the overheat from amarr weapons just kills using those weapons on any non-assault suit. Honestly, there is no other group of weapons in this game that are just completely hobbled outside of just one suit, except for amarrian weapons. To this point, yeah one of the amarrian commandos bonuses goes mostly unused. Maybe for the lead charged shot with a scrambler but after that I HAVE to switch or I will overheat. Fixing swarms
TH1EFOFSOuLS Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 38	Posted - 2014.10.03 00:20:00 - [16] - Quote I am a caldari mando and a minmatar commando. CALDARI CAMMANDO My caldari commando I do not use for open combat even though it gets a a sick 10% bonus to my rail rifles which are at max prof and sniper rifles which are also at max prof. For the simple fact 3 low slots and 1 low is terrible on that suit. Should I put a shield regulator or an armor rep rate? I don't want a reactive plate. (more armor and a rep ****) because its simple to slow for all that even though its based as shields I cannot afford an penalty's on it. So then what should I do with a complex REG on? Well I cant put a damage mod on it because we all know a caldri with no damage mods is the only real way to caldari, so I put on shields. 2 complex shield extenders puts me a little over 600 shield and a complex shield energizer puts shield regen a little over 35.00 so there goes all my high slots. I can forget fitting two proto guns let alone one without max skills MINMATAR CAMMANDO As for this thing it is fine. FIIIIIIINE. Max prof swarms max prof mass drivers prof 4 combat rifles wth sharpshooter 4. Is awesome As for tanking mods well a enh armor plate (or complex) with a ehn armor rep and high slots your going to want 1 complex damage mod and some kind of shield ext add a basic nano hive to and your set I cant tell you about the ammar and gal cammandos but if I had a alt fall in my hands with at least 8mil SP I would definitely spec into gal commando I love AR and I know they are beast (at least I can make them beast) All and all if any commando will get buffed/changed it needs to be cal or people will just only use it for sniper and camping like I do.
bogeyman m Minmatar Republic 420	Posted - 2014.10.03 03:27:00 - [17] - Quote As someone earlier said, Commandos should be thought of as a 'heavy Assault' suit. As such, I think they (generally) only need a few tweaks: 1. Make the speed and movement for each race half way between their respective Sentinel and Assault. 2. Make the inherent EWAR stats (profile, range & precision) the same as the Assault suits. 3. Add a grenade slot. I'll leave any interracial balancing for those with more experience with multiple suits as I have only spec'd into Minmatar. Duct tape 2.0 ... Have WD-40; will travel.
The Master Race Immortal Guides 57	Posted - 2014.10.03 05:51:00 - [18] - Quote It would be nice if they had grenades with increased supply and throw distance. I don't know if you guys would be able to do it, but if so this https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=176744&find=unread would be amazing. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Mossellia Delt Militaires Sans Jeux 1652	Posted - 2014.10.03 06:03:00 - [19] - Quote I run them as mobile defence. I have the min commando. I find the speed easier for city map defence then the the heavies speed. Also the MD being great at area denial is good for coving points being hacked. Delt for CPM2 CPM1 MISSION : FAILED Moss-delt on skype
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 564	Posted - 2014.10.03 06:41:00 - [20] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Specced I to Cal, Gal, and Min commandos. First, we need to establish what commandos should do. Are they heavy assault? AV platforms? Until we give them a clear role, balancing them is moot. (I've played around with all Commandos, heavy focus on Gallente with moderate on Minmatar. I'll avoid writing a multi-paragraph segment bragging about how many things I have trained.) I fully agree that the Commando and Assault are largely redundant, and honestly in Legion they could combine most the bonuses/abilities into one suit and it would make a really solid role. But alas our bastard child that is the Commando exists, so we need to make due. I think it's fine that the Commando and Assault fill very similar roles, the important part is making each one fulfill a different facet of that role. I think first we need to determine what the role of the Assault is under existing mechanics. Once we've determined that, we can see what other facets of the role the Commando could fulfill, without overly compartmentalizing the Assault role. Assaults Moderate-High Mobility: Well suited for closing distances and moderate flanking. Weapon Support Bonuses: Offsets the weakness of Racial Weapons with Bonuses Moderate Base HP-High Slot Count: Flexible yet capable of Moderate-High HP when fitted. Medium Hitbox: Capable of relying on speed/hitbox to mitigate some incoming DPS Weapon Fitting Bonus: Able to fit Higher tiered Light Weapons and Grenades with less cost. So basically you have a role which is very mobile, and while not as quick as the scout, can still make use of less direct methods of getting from A to B. That is to say they are direct combat oriented, but not necessarily completely frontal assault. They are not necessarily maximum damage dealers, as they don't actually boost the damage output of the weapon. Instead, bonuses offset negative attributes of their racial weapons, which in turn makes each weapon more flexible and viable in suboptimal situations. In short, the Assault personifies direct but non-frontal combat, with a primary focus of flexibility and adaptability in the slaying role. Assaults are capable of putting focused DPS where it needs to go at the right time in order to get the job done cleanly. So now what we've defined what the Assault does, let's look at some things that it doesn't do and discuss how we can tie those concepts into defining what the Commando should do. Concepts to Consider and Discuss: Direct Frontal Attacking (Higher Defense - Lower Mobility) Maximum Damage Output (Bonuses to Damage) Sustained Damage Output (Bonuses to Reload) Quantity Over Quality (Suppression Abilities) Less Flexible - More Focused Role (Buff Strengths of Weapons) Additional Points of Contention: Little Incentive to use Prototype (Only 2 additional slots) and extremely Low Slot Count in general (2/3/4) when other suits have upwards of (4/6/8). Just as a starting measure the Commando should have the same slot layout as the Sentinels. i'd like to see these added: module efficacy bonuses tailored to each suit( minimal slots is fine if we get bonuses to the modules we use) increased damage bonus to 15% better and more of a focus on regen tanking

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3356	Posted - 2014.10.03 07:47:00 - [21] - Quote Commandos lack a predefined role. Before any balance can be achieved a role MUST be defined. Suppression is bullsh*t because suppression is deterring enemis from acting. Unfortunately it requires range. Its why the HMG is not a suppression weapon. The ranges it operates at are so short that "advance and kill" is always the most efficient answer. I use the commando as a substitute for bothering skilling into assault suits, because I have heavy frames already. Overall assaults work better because as "heavy attack" the commandos do not actually have any advantage over, say a gallente or amarr dropsuit. The damage outputs are similar even with stacking penalties because commando suits have less slots. Adding a grenade is a bandaid. Adding another slot is a bandaid. It's not a bandaid when the commando role is defined and the suits reworked for that purpose. Right now they function as assaults except slower, easier to hit, with crappier scanning and the tightest pg/cpu in the game that I have seen. It's in many ways more generic than the assault. It matches assaults for HP with no fittings, but usually fitting for tank on a commando is not an awesome idea. Now the +damage feature of the commando is kinda neat, but in the case of the amarr commando the DPS output is anemic compared to the amarr assault because of overheat mechanics. The AK.0 COMMANDO TRADES 25% MORE FIRE TIME, or potentially 25% more rounds on target for 10% damage. The outputs of both laser weapons is terrible by comparison. My pre-buff A/1 assault suit was a better killer than my commando A/1 currently because of laser overheat. Honestly I think commandos could make excellent door kickers and heavy attack if they had more slots, were bonused for biotics and sensors and could be spiked for "crash & smash" style play. But to be a shocktrooper they need to be able to compensate for slow speed, huge hitbox and anemic damage output on the amarr suits. Now if we want to make commandos into suppression/support they need tank and they need RANGE. To be suppression units we would need to bonus them for range instead of damage, set them up for fast regen and shower them with ammo capacity and minimize the reload downtime. Or we can make them infiltration and destruction, bonusing them for cloaks and demolitions gear. But we need to pick a role. Nothing can be done except bandaid fixes until a role is chosen.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1860	Posted - 2014.10.03 08:17:00 - [22] - Quote They are too slow and too blind. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1866	Posted - 2014.10.03 09:56:00 - [23] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Commandos lack a predefined role. Before any balance can be achieved a role MUST be defined. Suppression is bullsh*t because suppression is deterring enemis from acting. Unfortunately it requires range. Its why the HMG is not a suppression weapon. The ranges it operates at are so short that "advance and kill" is always the most efficient answer. I use the commando as a substitute for bothering skilling into assault suits, because I have heavy frames already. Overall assaults work better because as "heavy attack" the commandos do not actually have any advantage over, say a gallente or amarr dropsuit. The damage outputs are similar even with stacking penalties because commando suits have less slots. Adding a grenade is a bandaid. Adding another slot is a bandaid. It's not a bandaid when the commando role is defined and the suits reworked for that purpose. Right now they function as assaults except slower, easier to hit, with crappier scanning and the tightest pg/cpu in the game that I have seen. It's in many ways more generic than the assault. It matches assaults for HP with no fittings, but usually fitting for tank on a commando is not an awesome idea. Now the +damage feature of the commando is kinda neat, but in the case of the amarr commando the DPS output is anemic compared to the amarr assault because of overheat mechanics. The AK.0 COMMANDO TRADES 25% MORE FIRE TIME, or potentially 25% more rounds on target for 10% damage. The outputs of both laser weapons is terrible by comparison. My pre-buff A/1 assault suit was a better killer than my commando A/1 currently because of laser overheat. Honestly I think commandos could make excellent door kickers and heavy attack if they had more slots, were bonused for biotics and sensors and could be spiked for "crash & smash" style play. But to be a shocktrooper they need to be able to compensate for slow speed, huge hitbox and anemic damage output on the amarr suits. Now if we want to make commandos into suppression/support they need tank and they need RANGE. To be suppression units we would need to bonus them for range instead of damage, set them up for fast regen and shower them with ammo capacity and minimize the reload downtime. Or we can make them infiltration and destruction, bonusing them for cloaks and demolitions gear. But we need to pick a role. Nothing can be done except bandaid fixes until a role is chosen. This. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 2894	Posted - 2014.10.03 11:10:00 - [24] - Quote In different charachters, i use all commando suits except the amarr. I always fit racial weapons to use my bonus (it's the only thing that really help commando) Minmando: AV (with a LAV for better mobility) or MD+CR combo when i'm in a better position than my enemies. Galmando: I use PLC+AR combo or double AR (2 different variants), this is more general purpose than the other commando i have. Calmando: I use it to snipe, stop. This is my stance on commando. CPU/PG buff This is almost a must, with such low slot count in every slot you need to fit the better module you have. If not enough: +1 slot count This would help to fit commando and gain a edge in HP over assaults If still not enough: Nade slot This would be the non plus ultra and definitely would help commando to be a complete class which would handle different situation. All this stuff will help commando to play its role which is the same of the assault but with less mobility. PSN: ogamega "Dust is full of communists who despise people with enough isk to buy expensive items" LOCK REGIONS
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3360	Posted - 2014.10.03 11:40:00 - [25] - Quote shaman oga wrote: All this stuff will help commando to play its role which is the same of the assault but with less mobility. herein lies the problem. There is no clearly defined role. It appears to be "assault with more drawbacks" at the moment. There is no differentiation between the purpose of the assault and commando armor.
Kierkegaard Soren THE HANDS OF DEATH 528	Posted - 2014.10.03 12:46:00 - [26] - Quote Hello. Just thought I'd add my input, thanks to the CPM for the chance to do so. As my sig implies, I've been a commando since the suit was first introduced all the way back in early Uprising, back when the STD variant had no slots save for its weapons and equipment. As a pauper player, that suit was my bread and butter. It was how I learned to play the game, and die in it. On special occasions I would crack open the ADV and get giddy over the idea of armour repairing during the fight. Also, it was back when the suit bonus "enhanced" (that term being used with some strong irony there) any defensive modules that you did equip, if you could. It was widely derided, not least because, as noted above, the basic variant could not make use of it. Still, the actual idea of increasing module efficiency was a sound one, and when the balance pass was made on tcommandos that turned the suit into the creature it is today, I was a little sad that the original bonus was removed in favour of racial damage bonuses. It made sense of course, but I think we were onto something. You seem the fear back then was that increasing the slot count of a suit that could hold two light weapons would make assaults redundant and turn the commando into an unstoppable slayer of both clones and vehicles alike, and that is technically true; give it too many slots and the capability to hold grenades and suddenly the larger bit box and slow movement, long seen as a balance/crippling blow to the strength of the suit becomes distinctly less problematic. You can solve the deficiencies with modules should you choose to do so. But it is also still true that the commando has no defined role, and no real strength or viability in the meta of the game. So, my proposal would be two-fold: 1) Solidify the concept held by many of us in the community that the commando should be a suppression fighter that can put out more rounds down range than any other class in the game, giving his team mates the opportunity to press forward knowing that the commando has their back covered: 8% INCREASE TO RACIAL WEAPON MAGAZINE SIZE PER RANK. 2) To give the commando staying power without increasing the slot layout which would, in my view, make a specialised class too capable of flexability in its fitting,give it 8% INCREASE TO EFFICIACY OF DEFENSIVE MODULES PER RANK. Keep the slot layout the same for the suits, change nothing else. Thanks for reading. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." -Paul Atreides.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3363	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:08:00 - [27] - Quote Suppression without range is worthless. As I said before, at the ranges all weapons operate suppressive fire is meaningless. Advance and kill will always be the more meaningful choice. The only suppression weapon in the game that deserves the name is the laser rifle. And your solution does not address the comparative worthlessness of the amarr commando compared to the amarr assault. The overheat will always mean thatt ammandos will always be less efficient combatants than amarr assault. Making commandos into suppressors without giving them a range advantage will always be another bloody bandaid fix.
Booby Tuesdays Tuesdays With Boobies 869	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:35:00 - [28] - Quote I only have Min Commando, but it too is PG starved like the rest of the Commandos. I primarily use it for AV and point defense. I can usually hold the fort solo long enough for reinforcements to arrive, and fend off dropships from reaching the high ground. This is the best use of the suit I have found so far. If anything, I would give all Commandos a bonus to AV, and give them a grenade slot for AV grenades. PC, SL, and AV nades would all get a bonus, something like 2 or 3% per level. This would then mean vehicles should get a *SMALL* buff to compensate for a dedicated pilot popper suit. Day One Proto Minmatar Commando. A Mass Driver IS My Sidearm.
CamClarke 0uter.Heaven 154	Posted - 2014.10.03 13:41:00 - [29] - Quote In their current state, Commandos are best used as an overwatch+AV suit parked on highground while sitting on the hives they equipped. It's very boring but helpful in the right position. If that's their intended role, then they do a fine job at it because there's no other suit that can do both at once. That's also why the two considered the best are Caldari for the bonus to longest ranged rifle and Minmatar for the bonus to the best light AV. They just cannot perform the same on the ground because there are too many anti-Medium predators (and really, a Commando is just a slower Assault with both a Swarm and a rifle). Sure, in skilled hands they'll do okay, but the ground pounding is simply done better by the more durable Sentinels and the speedier and stealthier Scouts. If they're supposed to do something else than camp highground, then tweaks should be applied accordingly. Everyone needs to be on the same page regarding what that role is first, though. General purpose ground combat? Assaults have that covered. In fact, if it weren't for the Swarms on the Commando, they'd be the ones in the Commando's place on highground. Heavy breaching actions? Sentinels got that. AV? Sentinels got that too if they have good aim. Anything speed/stealth related? Not a chance in hell. Logistical work? No. Just no. Simply adding slots willy-nilly is a band-aid fix that won't really change anything. Look at Assaults. They had that exact thing happen to them not very long ago, and did that put them on level playing ground with Sentinels and Scouts? No, although it did reduce the gap a tad. The problem is much more deep-seated than that, however, as PC is still dominated by Sentinels, Scouts, and a couple Logistics keeping the Sentinels alive, and maybe a Commando or two doing the overwatch thing. Though I would like to see them get a tad more CPU/PG at least, their fitting is damn tight. For the record, I have Caldari Commando 5 and only one real fit for it. Specialist Swarms, Specialist Rail Rifle, 2 Damage Mods, Shield Recharger, Armor Plate, Rep Hives. Pub fit downgrades to Ammo Hives, Reactive Plate, isk proto Swarms/RR.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3367	Posted - 2014.10.03 14:13:00 - [30] - Quote Honestly I'd make the commando into a shocktrooper. Screw suppression, give it bonusing for biotics for fast, sustained attack for the amarr and gallente while making the caldari aspected for better detection as a countersniper and long range hunter. Take the minmatar and give it a bit of HP module bonus because it's already faster. Offensively just give them a 5% per level reload speed bonus. Offensive power? Caldari: reduce dispersion. Amarr: reduce heat buildup Gallente: more magazine capacity (assault rifle with more ammo. Hold down that trigger and go nuts) Minmatar: reduce recoil. Or something. Let commando suits be SHOCK troops. Hit fast, hit hard, high casualty expectation. You throw commandos when taking the objective is more important than survival and ISK efficiency. Lets the assaults enjoy cautious advance, let commandos be havoc balls that expect to just disrupt the enemy.

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3215	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:00:00 - [31] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Let commando suits be SHOCK troops. Hit fast, hit hard, high casualty expectation. You throw commandos when taking the objective is more important than survival and ISK efficiency. I kinda have an issue with designing a suit around the concept that they're supposed to die more often other suits. Plus the bonuses you listed are too similar to what the Assaults have/should have. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3377	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:28:00 - [32] - Quote There is no getting around the simple fact that the amarr heat bonus is the single most usefyl bonus in the game. And the ammando loses more damage potential to overheat than anything else. The 10% damage bonus does not at any point translate to even approaching that level of useful. No other suit can use amarr weaponry effectively. Just the amarr assault.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3215	Posted - 2014.10.03 16:43:00 - [33] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: There is no getting around the simple fact that the amarr heat bonus is the single most usefyl bonus in the game. And the ammando loses more damage potential to overheat than anything else. The 10% damage bonus does not at any point translate to even approaching that level of useful. No other suit can use amarr weaponry effectively. Just the amarr assault. Then perhaps we should decrease the natural heat buildup of Amarr weapons and decrease the Amarr bonus so the end result is the same, but Non-Assault use is still viable? Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7760	Posted - 2014.10.03 17:02:00 - [34] - Quote Commando Suppression weapons in my ideal world: Amarr: Laser Rifle with the Heat Reduction bonus Caldari: More ammo, slightly more range bonus ideal with Rail Rifle. Gallente: More range, slightly more ammo, ideal with Vanilla PR (Plasma Rifle actually overheats past 72 ish rounds) Minmatar: Mass Driver is a pretty good suppression weapon in itself with the bonus. I just really like the idea of Commando being a suppressive role but that's just a personal preference. See you space cowboy...
Mad Syringe ReDust Inc. 301	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:05:00 - [35] - Quote I play the Commando since the Minmando was introduced. I like the area supression or second heavy line (linebacker) role. I usually play as a Mass-/Swarmhole or CR/MD combo in cqc situations. The only thing I would like to improve is recovery or flanking defense. If it's possible to give the commando Hitbox a better resistance to shots in the back, that would be awsome. I don't mind the lack of passive scan, but a slightly better resistance to shotguns to the back would be much appreciated. Faster passive HP regain would help a lot too. I like the high alfa approach with double damage mod and dual reps for maximum armor recovery. Cheers Dedicated Minmando Masshole with love for Swarmholing...
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3071	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:08:00 - [36] - Quote Keep it coming mercs, the more feedback the better. o7 Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3382	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:14:00 - [37] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Keep it coming mercs, the more feedback the better. o7 Cross We could provide better feedback if there was a clear statement of intent on what CCP intends the commando to be. If they intended it to be a suppressor they will need to bonus it for +range or significantly overhaul the ranges and expand the map sizes back out. If they want a shocktrooper we can do that. We need a statement of intent or we're just plinking away at "this sounds cool" and "oops, another bandaid fix."
Kaeru Nayiri Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 74	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:43:00 - [38] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Keep it coming mercs, the more feedback the better. o7 Cross We could provide better feedback if there was a clear statement of intent on what CCP intends the commando to be. If they intended it to be a suppressor they will need to bonus it for +range or significantly overhaul the ranges and expand the map sizes back out. If they want a shocktrooper we can do that. We need a statement of intent or we're just plinking away at "this sounds cool" and "oops, another bandaid fix." For the sake of argument, let's assume CCP wants to hear suggestions for roles we would like to see the Commando fill. Just for argument's sake. I always felt that the damage buff was better suited to Assaults. Assaults need to be the bread and butter of Dust, they need much more popularity. Damage buff on a medium frame would be the perfect go-to for any new player not sure what they want to specialize in yet, allowing them to experience the perfect middle ground with a lean on offensive power. I realize this thread is about Commandos and not Assaults, but I believe the two are tied together. Assaults should have the damage buffs and reload speeds for their racial weapons, Commandos should have the extra ammo, extra regen/repair, extra range and bigger effective HP. Assaults burn twice as bright, half as long, while Commandos would be in it for the long haul. The perfect halfway point between a sentinel and an assault. This idea already lends itself perfectly to the fact that the Commando is a heavy frame. With the "time to kill" what it is in Dust at the moment, I do not believe in suppression.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3075	Posted - 2014.10.03 20:57:00 - [39] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Keep it coming mercs, the more feedback the better. o7 Cross We could provide better feedback if there was a clear statement of intent on what CCP intends the commando to be. If they intended it to be a suppressor they will need to bonus it for +range or significantly overhaul the ranges and expand the map sizes back out. If they want a shocktrooper we can do that. We need a statement of intent or we're just plinking away at "this sounds cool" and "oops, another bandaid fix." For the sake of argument, let's assume CCP wants to hear suggestions for roles we would like to see the Commando fill. Just for argument's sake. Yes let's do exactly that. I'll level with y'all I am doing these threads on my own initiative and then putting in the man hours to build spreadsheets/proposals from the feedback I've gathered. The Dust Dev team is comparatively small and they work hard so are very busy most of the time which means that the more we can do community crowdsourcing the more changes can be iterated on in a given time frame. TL;DR - Knowing the role is vital, but for now I would like the community to state their vision of the role *and why* then work outward from there. Community feedback is a part of the process, so we might as well go for it rather than wait Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Kaeru Nayiri Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 75	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:15:00 - [40] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Honestly I'd make the commando into a shocktrooper. Screw suppression, give it bonusing for biotics for fast, sustained attack for the amarr and gallente while making the caldari aspected for better detection as a countersniper and long range hunter. Take the minmatar and give it a bit of HP module bonus because it's already faster. Very sorry for the double post, but re-reading this made me think we could also take a wildly different direction that would be quite interesting. What if each races commando had a special bonus to it, like scouts do? Instead of making commandos a middleground between assault and sentinel, they could be a new specialization. You mentioned Caldari being geared for detection and countersniping? Natural bonuses to sniper rifles to be used on the fly like reduced sway. I would also give this commando some cool enhancements with remote mines to be a saboteur. 20% more active remote and proximity mines per level ? You mentioned biotics, I love this idea, minmatar commando that is actually based on melee combat, for real. Any weapon they wield is deadly on it's own and doubles as a melee weapon that can seriously hurt. Amar commando, the total zealot, perhaps doing more damage as his own armor goes down? Something off the wall crazy that borders on fanaticism. The reduced heat damage to the user has a great place here, even though currently it's on the assault. More ideas needed. Gallente commando, how about a commando that is the hard counter to ewar? This commando, when maxed and fitted correctly can see most scouts cloaked or not to share on his tacnet with his squad. Caldari and Gallente roles could be reversed I suppose? It's hard to tell and it's been a long time since I played Eve.

Mad Syringe ReDust Inc. 302	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:16:00 - [41] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: I always felt that the damage buff was better suited to Assaults. Assaults need to be the bread and butter of Dust, they need much more popularity. Damage buff on a medium frame would be the perfect go-to for any new player not sure what they want to specialize in yet, allowing them to experience the perfect middle ground with a lean on offensive power. I realize this thread is about Commandos and not Assaults, but I believe the two are tied together. Assaults should have the damage buffs and reload speeds for their racial weapons, Commandos should have the extra ammo, extra regen/repair, extra range and bigger effective HP. Assaults burn twice as bright, half as long, while Commandos would be in it for the long haul. The perfect halfway point between a sentinel and an assault. This idea already lends itself perfectly to the fact that the Commando is a heavy frame. To sum it up in a single word, I would say the Commando should be about survival, with many small benefits that lead to higher survivability rate. The keyword for Assault should definitely be offense in the purest form. They move fast they kill hard and they are ready to go down if it means taking half the other team with them. With the "time to kill" what it is in Dust at the moment, I do not believe in suppression. I strongly disagree -1 If you take the damage off the commandos you would need to give them the slot layout of the assaults, to compensate. It would kill the commando. I would rather see the Assaults be about sustained combat. So give the assaults higher ammo+grenade count (only + 1 at all levels). They have only 1 equipment, and most bring friggin' hives wich should be brought by the logis. If you give assaults a bigger ammo pool, they could bring uplinks more often, or an injector. And be actually team players with their equipment... A racial sidearm damage buff would be the other thing I would contemplate for the assaults. Dedicated Minmando Masshole with love for Swarmholing...
Apocalyptic Destroyer KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 154	Posted - 2014.10.03 21:37:00 - [42] - Quote My Galmando Needs help ! Pain is weakness leaving the body.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3216	Posted - 2014.10.03 22:26:00 - [43] - Quote Kaeru Nayiri wrote: Gallente commando, how about a commando that is the hard counter to ewar? This commando, when maxed and fitted correctly can see most scouts cloaked or not to share on his tacnet with his squad. Is this not supposed to be the role of the Gallente Logistics? Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 372	Posted - 2014.10.03 22:54:00 - [44] - Quote To be honest the one thing they lack is the HP regen. After a frontal assault on enemys it takes way too long to get your HP back. In my opinion the shield recharge rate on caldari+minmatarr suits needs to be upped to match the standard of their regular heavy variants (cal sentinel has 30HP/s, commando has only 20). Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 564	Posted - 2014.10.03 23:02:00 - [45] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Suppression without range is worthless. As I said before, at the ranges all weapons operate suppressive fire is meaningless. Advance and kill will always be the more meaningful choice. The only suppression weapon in the game that deserves the name is the laser rifle. And your solution does not address the comparative worthlessness of the amarr commando compared to the amarr assault. The overheat will always mean thatt ammandos will always be less efficient combatants than amarr assault. Making commandos into suppressors without giving them a range advantage will always be another bloody bandaid fix. this is not true. amarr commando is the most efficient because it takes less rounds to kill with its scrambler rifle. i agree with you though that the suppression role without a range bonus is flawed
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1870	Posted - 2014.10.04 02:39:00 - [46] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Suppression without range is worthless. As I said before, at the ranges all weapons operate suppressive fire is meaningless. Advance and kill will always be the more meaningful choice. The only suppression weapon in the game that deserves the name is the laser rifle. And your solution does not address the comparative worthlessness of the amarr commando compared to the amarr assault. The overheat will always mean thatt ammandos will always be less efficient combatants than amarr assault. Making commandos into suppressors without giving them a range advantage will always be another bloody bandaid fix. this is not true. amarr commando is the most efficient because it takes less rounds to kill with its scrambler rifle. i agree with you though that the suppression role without a range bonus is flawed But then, we get the calmanndo being the new redline sniper suit, because any percentage bonus to range we give to make it worth the effort makes redline snipers able to snipe that much deeper in the redline. Range aside, suppression does not work without volume of fire. You cannot suppress if your having to reload or running out of ammo mid firefight. Instead of, or perhaps in addition to range, we should give them a magazine and max ammo bonus. 20% magazine and max ammo per level, for double the magazine and reserves at level 5. This allows it to suppress without needing the instant resupply of nanohivea. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3387	Posted - 2014.10.04 07:16:00 - [47] - Quote Let's go with the shocktrooper with a side of sustained "workhorse" support. If we change the layout to 3/2 for min and cal, and put 2/3 for amarr and gallente we can make them a bit more balanced and keep them from locking in sentinel level HP. Change the universal role bonus to 3% damage to racial weapon type per level. Galmando: built for sustained combat and "shock" +5% per level to base and sprint speed (offensive bonus) +5% per level to armor repair modules. (Defensive bonus) Ammando: optimized for shock and fire support. -10% per level from speed penalty from reactive and standard plates.(defensive Bonus) -3% per level reduction to heat buildup on laser weapons (offensive bonus), to keep amarr assaults as the bsst laser platform. Minmando: built for shock, and skirmish combat. +10% per level to efficacy of biotics. (Defensive bonus) +3% increase to ammo capacity and magazine capacity. (Offensive bonus) Calmando: built for long range suppression and counter sniper. +5% per level to shield rechargers and energizer efficacy. (Defensive bonus) -5% to recoil per level (offensive bonus) Build them to be able to either hammer the crap out of things by mobility and give them the recovery to sustain the combat. Do NOT give them more EHP.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 564	Posted - 2014.10.04 08:20:00 - [48] - Quote all the commandos really needs are their module efficacy bonus back, which should be in addition to their current bonuses. doing this will give us slightly more eHP than we have now and will widen the gap between assault suits with out stepping into sentinel eHP levels and if we can fix the shields on caldari and minmatar the suits will be fine
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1871	Posted - 2014.10.04 15:51:00 - [49] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Let's go with the shocktrooper with a side of sustained "workhorse" support. If we change the layout to 3/2 for min and cal, and put 2/3 for amarr and gallente we can make them a bit more balanced and keep them from locking in sentinel level HP. Change the universal role bonus to 3% damage to racial weapon type per level. Galmando: built for sustained combat and "shock" +5% per level to base and sprint speed (offensive bonus) +5% per level to armor repair modules. (Defensive bonus) Ammando: optimized for shock and fire support. -10% per level from speed penalty from reactive and standard plates.(defensive Bonus) -3% per level reduction to heat buildup on laser weapons (offensive bonus), to keep amarr assaults as the bsst laser platform. Minmando: built for shock, and skirmish combat. +10% per level to efficacy of biotics. (Defensive bonus) +3% increase to ammo capacity and magazine capacity. (Offensive bonus) Calmando: built for long range suppression and counter sniper. +5% per level to shield rechargers and energizer efficacy. (Defensive bonus) -5% to recoil per level (offensive bonus) Build them to be able to either hammer the crap out of things by mobility and give them the recovery to sustain the combat. Do NOT give them more EHP. I like it. I like it a lot. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3390	Posted - 2014.10.04 18:00:00 - [50] - Quote I'm bluntly neutral on the whole grenade issue. i don't care if commandos never get 'em. I never use them on my sentinels, because heavy weapons. I use sentinels so often that it never occurs to me to use the nades on lighter suits. And if we're rigging the Commandos for shocktrooper and sustainment "workhorse" combat, then I'd leave nades to the assaults, who are really the breach specialists. If you need nades use a mass driver or a plasma cannon. they're a bit more efficient. And nades have been nerfed into uselessness because people screamed like little girls who's brothers mutilated their barbie dolls because grenades used to be lethal and of course, anyone who uses a weapon that is EFFECTIVE at killing people is a cheap scrub, amirite? /sarcasm off. But grenades won't make much difference in the performance of the commandos, and my proposal is intended to be rather tight. if you add nades, then I'd say keep them to four slots rather than matching the sentinel 5. They need to sacrifice something for their versatility. And i don't want assaults pushed further from their core niche.

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3397	Posted - 2014.10.05 16:17:00 - [51] - Quote Oops, accidentally bumped into this thread again. Any input from you, Cross?
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3104	Posted - 2014.10.05 17:54:00 - [52] - Quote Fittings improvements seem like the key area that needs to be looked at from what I am 'hearing' so far. The how of that is a bit in dispute but most seem to agree that something needs done with it. There also seems to be a trend towards some addition too/touch up on the bonuses but 'what' and 'how much' is in much greater dispute and often predicated upon the type and degree of fittings buff. As to role, the overall sense I have at this point is that aiming the commando at a space 'between' the Assault and the Sentinel is likely the best bet for carving out a unique specialization while maintaining balance. This is, to an extent, where they are already situated but steps can be taken to emphasize this niche and endeavor to craft a more robust and rewarding specialist role out of it. Lastly, I realize these are fairly general statements but I am working top down on this because my on the field experience with the commando is rather limited. My goal at this point is to have a rough draft proposal linked in the OP before the end of the month (I'll get it in sooner if at all possible but even IRL aside I have a lot of draws in my time within Dust/CPM stuff right now). Once that 1st draft goes up I will be relying heavily upon another round of input from the community to really iterate on it prior to pushing it out to CCP. Until then continued discussion is good, the more constructive feedback, or unified perspective is present in this thread when I do my next read through prior to hammering out that draft, the readily we'll be able to reach a proposal which can be forwarded to CCP. Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1881	Posted - 2014.10.06 01:17:00 - [53] - Quote I feel like break in has the perfect idea for commandos. The only thing I would change is to give caldari commandos a +5% to regulators and rrechargers as a bonus, as energizers count as rechargers for the purposes of calculating bonuses to those modules. Other than that, keep it exactly the same. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
TH1EFOFSOuLS Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 51	Posted - 2014.10.06 01:22:00 - [54] - Quote x
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 564	Posted - 2014.10.06 01:52:00 - [55] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I feel like break in has the perfect idea for commandos. The only thing I would change is to give caldari commandos a +5% to regulators and rrechargers as a bonus, as energizers count as rechargers for the purposes of calculating bonuses to those modules. Other than that, keep it exactly the same. why not shield modules in general?
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1882	Posted - 2014.10.06 01:58:00 - [56] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I feel like break in has the perfect idea for commandos. The only thing I would change is to give caldari commandos a +5% to regulators and rrechargers as a bonus, as energizers count as rechargers for the purposes of calculating bonuses to those modules. Other than that, keep it exactly the same. why not shield modules in general? Then we would easily reach shield levels rivaling or surpassing sentinels and we want to avoid that. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Vesta Opalus Kang Lo Holding 44	Posted - 2014.10.06 03:48:00 - [57] - Quote Someone mentioned it as kind of a joke, but the swarm launchers really do need to have a bonus on the caldari suit instead of the minmatar, swarm launchers are caldari tech. Also increase shield regen times across the board for commando l;
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 564	Posted - 2014.10.06 04:41:00 - [58] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I feel like break in has the perfect idea for commandos. The only thing I would change is to give caldari commandos a +5% to regulators and rrechargers as a bonus, as energizers count as rechargers for the purposes of calculating bonuses to those modules. Other than that, keep it exactly the same. why not shield modules in general? Then we would easily reach shield levels rivaling or surpassing sentinels and we want to avoid that. not 3% per level like they had before. if we keep the same slot layouts we'd be fine
Varoth Drac Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 248	Posted - 2014.10.06 14:13:00 - [59] - Quote They should all have an AV bonus. Give Caldari a swarm bonus (like min) and Amarr a plasma cannon bonus (like Gal). There we go, a defined AV role. Keep the current bonuses aswell so that AV isn't thier only role. I like the idea of an ammo bonus to promote a suppression role aswell.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3415	Posted - 2014.10.06 14:20:00 - [60] - Quote Varoth Drac wrote: They should all have an AV bonus. Give Caldari a swarm bonus (like min) and Amarr a plasma cannon bonus (like Gal). There we go, a defined AV role. Keep the current bonuses aswell so that AV isn't thier only role. I like the idea of an ammo bonus to promote a suppression role aswell. Again, this is a bandaid fix. Base your ideas around a role. My favorite roles to fit for: Shocktrooper (gallente does this best so far) Supporting fire (minmatar with mass driver is a great way to make enemies get out of the way of inbound assaults) Countersniper (amarr and caldari excel here) Saboteur (RE and prox mines) Wishlist: Detection bonusing. Logi hunter (spotting/clearing equipment)

Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc General Tso's Alliance 498	Posted - 2014.10.06 14:37:00 - [61] - Quote Ok, Here's my take on it. if you think of the commandos as a "commando" then they are basically tactical specialists. they should be able to specialise in whatever area they are used for. so my suggestion is based around the post level 5 skill coming soon, they should be faster and more easily modified for each player than heavies are. they absolutely need grenades possibly more equipment slots i'd look at something along the lines of all slots available but with nowhere near enough cpu/pg to fill them all. in other words the player gets to outfit a commando any way they like but it would only make sense to specialise and point those mods towards something. otherwise they would use a proto suit for militia gear.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3221	Posted - 2014.10.06 16:58:00 - [62] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Fittings improvements seem like the key area that needs to be looked at from what I am 'hearing' so far. The how of that is a bit in dispute but most seem to agree that something needs done with it. I like the concept of standardized slot counts that Rattati put out a few months back, which in turn drove much of the Assault overhaul project. I think in general suits of the same frame should have the same slot layouts, more or less. Balancing against lack of slot just leads to boring fitting, which in turn leads to boring gameplay. Commandos have a lot of elements against them compared to Assaults...a lack of fitting options is not a disadvantage they need. As for defenses in general, one thing about Dust that I've always wanted but have never gotten is a suit specifically designed around 'active' tanking, in that you're encouraged to fit the suit to be more focused around HP regen rather than brick tanking. The Sentinel is obviously all about boosting its HP higher with HP modules and making use of its damage resistance bonuses. What if we took it the other direction with Commandos, giving them bonuses to HP regeneration instead of simply boosting HP? Its been mentioned in this thread already, but essentially something like... Caldari: +% to Rechargers/Energizers Minmatar: +% to Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: +% to Reactive Plating or +% Reduction to Speed Penalty for Armor Plates It's very similar to a concept I proposed for Assaults a while back, but as we've already determined, Assaults and Commandos are shards of the same role, so I think it would also apply well in this case. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5547	Posted - 2014.10.07 16:11:00 - [63] - Quote @ Cross To what extent do performance statistics suggest that Commandos are hurting? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3444	Posted - 2014.10.07 16:14:00 - [64] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Cross To what extent do performance statistics suggest that Commandos are hurting? I'm willing to guess they're about where I'm guessing. Not horrendously underused but really not used as much as more specialized suits.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5547	Posted - 2014.10.07 16:22:00 - [65] - Quote oops Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3154	Posted - 2014.10.07 17:14:00 - [66] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Cross 1. To what extent do performance statistics suggest that Commandos are hurting/underperforming? 2. Is the goal here to buff Commando performance or to more clearly define its battlefield role (or both)? In essence to accomplish #1 via #2. Breakin Stuff wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Cross To what extent do performance statistics suggest that Commandos are hurting? I'm willing to guess they're about where I'm guessing. Not horrendously underused but really not used as much as more specialized suits. That seems more or less accurate. Full disclosure: This is another 'on my own recognizance" thread meaning at least as yet I do not have CCPs use metrics in hand I am going based off of my own assessments and overall community commentary. The current Dust dev team is quite busy, so I find that more gets done if I am proactive and let CCP make the final call about what gets in/is altered based on the feedback I've gathered (which of course they do, I am not a Dev) than if I am passive and only do what I am specifically asked to do. Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3457	Posted - 2014.10.07 17:52:00 - [67] - Quote I would suggest that the slot layout be normalized to sentinel. Trading the grenade slot for the equipment slot seems ok, and honestly grenades are gimped anyway. The PG/CPU might need to be a bit looser because there is no 25% fitting reduction for weapons on the commando. Universal role bonus: +Damage to racial weapons. I'd go with 3% per level as 10% is more or less negligible as far as output goes. Defensive bonus: Significant bonuses for recovery following racial themes. Gallente: Armor rep mods, Amarr: Plate speed penalty reduction, Minmatar: regulator bonus or on-board ammo nano-regeneration systems (slower than hives/supply depots, but perhaps 1 bullet per second per level, mass driver shells at a rate of 1 every 6 seconds minus 1 per level, same for swarms), Caldari: boost to recharger/energizer/regulator efficacy. Offensive bonus: a unique attack bonus that will allow the suits to be used in sustained attacks This is where i think we should dip OUTSIDE normal racial thematics. EG gallente might get a flat bonus to speed by incorporating minmatar movement tech. Amarr might gain a bit of range by incorporating Caldari tech into their laser optics and targeting systems. (think long range suppression and counter-sniper) Minmatar might gain a bonus to biotics and become even MORE obnoxiously fast attack to complement the gallente allies. Caldari might seek to emulate amarr laser utility by deploying smaller, higher density ammunition allowing longer sustained fire and better battlefield longevity by carrying more rail ammunition.
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 417	Posted - 2014.10.07 18:20:00 - [68] - Quote All proto Caldari suits here. First off the 1 low slot on the Commando makes it worse than the assault is. I can get almost the same shield numbers on my assault with lower delay, twice the rep rate, same reload speed and much better movement speed. The only reason to bring my commando out is when av-ing so I can defend myself against infrantry too. Other than that my assault just craps on my commando. Btw, Why does my commando have exactly the same bonus as my assault. Change the damn Cal assault bonus already it's sharing the bonus with ALL commando's. back on topic: Like i've stated before The Caldari heavy suits are the only heavy suits that you can not make faster without severly gimping them because of the 1 low slot. IMHO the Calmando needs: - Either extra high slot (increase rep rate) or low slot (increase speed), if not increase movement speed to increase survivability - Assault EWAR stats because not seeing sentinels behind you is a joke I think this will be a good start.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 567	Posted - 2014.10.08 11:09:00 - [69] - Quote what if we gave commandos passive scans? not as good as scout scans and cant be shared? buff scan range and precision base stats?
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 567	Posted - 2014.10.08 11:17:00 - [70] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: I would suggest that the slot layout be normalized to sentinel. Trading the grenade slot for the equipment slot seems ok, and honestly grenades are gimped anyway. The PG/CPU might need to be a bit looser because there is no 25% fitting reduction for weapons on the commando. Universal role bonus: +Damage to racial weapons. I'd go with 3% per level as 10% is more or less negligible as far as output goes. Defensive bonus: Significant bonuses for recovery following racial themes. Gallente: Armor rep mods, Amarr: Plate speed penalty reduction, Minmatar: regulator bonus or on-board ammo nano-regeneration systems (slower than hives/supply depots, but perhaps 1 bullet per second per level, mass driver shells at a rate of 1 every 6 seconds minus 1 per level, same for swarms), Caldari: boost to recharger/energizer/regulator efficacy. Offensive bonus: a unique attack bonus that will allow the suits to be used in sustained attacks This is where i think we should dip OUTSIDE normal racial thematics. EG gallente might get a flat bonus to speed by incorporating minmatar movement tech. Amarr might gain a bit of range by incorporating Caldari tech into their laser optics and targeting systems. (think long range suppression and counter-sniper) Minmatar might gain a bonus to biotics and become even MORE obnoxiously fast attack to complement the gallente allies. Caldari might seek to emulate amarr laser utility by deploying smaller, higher density ammunition allowing longer sustained fire and better battlefield longevity by carrying more rail ammunition. i like that damage buff at least. but i dont need weird gimmics thrown on for the sake of being different. the suit needs to be functional. and it is already when played as offensive support. the suit stats demand the player have high skills invested to make the best use of it. which is why the suit used to provide module efficacy bonuses. the suit used to take whatever you invested into and multiply it. so you would run the best you could to make the most out of it. this is why a simple module efficacy bonus should be added, while tweaking base stats a bit. commandos dont need to be flashy, they just need to get the job done, while rewarding player skill investment

Atiim 12832	Posted - 2014.10.08 13:05:00 - [71] - Quote CCP Rattati was talking about making Post Level 5 content, so I think we should have a variant of the Commandos which specialize in range over DPS. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
ReGnYuM YOU GOT OWNED BY A CHRONIC FAPPER 3294	Posted - 2014.10.08 16:33:00 - [72] - Quote Would the idea of enabling commandos with passive scan be out of the question Selling ISK for $$$. Message me for details
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 245	Posted - 2014.10.09 02:48:00 - [73] - Quote Edit note: The first (short) paragraph may be a bit abrasive. I ask you read the whole thing and take it as a whole. The commando role makes no sense. CCP hasn't said specifically what purpose they see the commando filling. They have only made the advertisement wonder buzzword class description most people usually do when they want to avoid setting limitations or expectations (fair enough though--freedom is good.) On to the rationale. We can only infer what role the commando has on the battlefield. We can do this by its defining feature -- the two light weapons. What does having two light weapons, or another way to phrase it -- more engagement flexibility, imply? Skirmisher class? Pop out, put on some damage, and hide back behind cover while your shields and health refills. That makes sense for two weapons. The commando doesn't seem to fit this role as they have the largest hit boxes in the game (up there with Sentinels) thereby taking the most damage AND the slowest shield armor recovery in the game. Flanker class? Tactical positioning with a variety of engagement options at various ranges due to their two weapons? Makes sense. The commando doesn't seem to fit this role either as they are some of the slowest suits in the game with the second worst strafe speed (coupled with large hitboxes) and arguably the worst sprint speed (fewer slots/pg/cpu for sprint or stamina mods) so they can't actually get into position anywhere before the battle line has changed. Their complete lack of ewar prevents them from sneaking anywhere. Fire support class? A variety of weapons allow them to engage multiple types of targets (AV/AP) as well as a variety of ranges. Resonable -- however, their low fitting resources (PG/CPU) and few slots make them too SOFT to stand near the assaults/Logis as they get shot/sniped down quite easily. Their slow speeds prevent them from even keeping up with a frontline that is dynamic and mobile. They themselves are easily flanked. Omni class? Having two light weapons and an equipment slot being able to have a wide variety of fittings to fill in as the second best in a large number of roles on the battlefield makes sense. Again -- the low number of slots prevent them from being able to fit the mods necessary to be second best at anything. Even third best is a stretch. Heavy Assault class? Two light weapons and lots of damage with higher than normal base health at the expense of speed for a slower moving but harder punching frontline offensive. Also reasonable. However, as with other things, their lack of slots preventing them from having high hp or support mods coupled their large hitboxes/low strafe speeds ensuring that they take more damage from incoming fire makes them too squishy for the frontline All these inferences on our part and implications on the suit's design part leaves the commando in a position where its role on the battlefield is both unclear and not terribly suited to any given task. Some people have made them work reasonably well and I will admit having two weapons is fun! But, in any role dedicated Commado players use them for those same players could be more effective with a different suit. The two uses I have seen commando most effective in are 1.) Open map point defense with a swarm+long range weapon and 2.)sniping. I think some of the core design of the suit needs to change for them to be a truly useful suit. Suggestions: 1.) Slightly increase PG/CPU to garauntee two weapons can properly be fitted. Do not change size speed or number of slots. Greatly increase inherent Armor and Shield regen rates. Up to being the suits with the highest Shield and Armor recovery in the game. Essentially skirmisher suits. Popping in and out of battle using terrain to inflict damage while passively (without the aid of modules) recovering damage. The low number of slots will prevent them from having an HP buffer so any Commando caught without cover will die -- but commandos with cover will be very very hard to kill if they can keep popping back down to regen. Makes them a somewhat good counter to defender fits but somewhat weaker to flanking fits. 2.) Greatly increase the number of slots on the suits. Do NOT increase PG/CPU. Instead (and this may not be possible) create a same mod type bonus/penalty system. Basically the afore mentioned Omni suit concept. Good at everything but not great at anything. The second best on the battlefield for full flexibility. Basically you have too many slots and not enough PG CPU. Mods of the same role and type provide fitting bonuses to eachother. Mods of different role/type provide fitting penalties. So want to be a skirmisher? Equip Armor and Shield regen mods. The more mods that fit that role you put on the cheaper each one becomes resource wise. Add a different type of mod that doesn't fit in that role -- it and each other mod gets more expensive. Want to Buffer tank? Shield and Armor hp mods. If you throw in damage mods or speed mods you break the mod synergy and fitting costs increase. Want to ewar? Tons of ewar mods. Throw on HP modules and it you lose fitting bonuses for said ewar tech everything getting more expensive. This way to fully outfit a suit you have to build it around a role. Otherwise you won't have the PG CPU to mod each slot. 3.) Increase speed to scout levels. Flanker fits essentially. The lack of slots prevents brick tanking. The large hitboxes ensures that taken damage from incoming fire is high. Complete lack of ewar. You can't miss em coming and they can't find you easily so they will be hitting the sides of the battle line in any engagement. But they are fast on the attack, have lots of offensive options, and can retreat and reengage elsewhere quickly. Depends on what CCP (or maybe the commando users) want out of the suit really.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3494	Posted - 2014.10.09 07:48:00 - [74] - Quote The post above is not bad. It also fits in the traditional vein of a "commando" being a specialist who can be expected to not only adapt to any odd situation, but overcome it. However, the soldiers we think of as "commando" in modern parlance such as SEALs and Marine Force Recon (thank you hollywood you bastards) actually fall short when placed on a main line in open ground warfare. In that situation they are no better or worse than a regular line soldier. But that is more the nature of war than a measure of their competence.
La Lore Sleipnier THE PR0T0TYPE 126	Posted - 2014.10.09 09:42:00 - [75] - Quote More slots, high slots, low slots and gear slots, thats all. And if the should have another passive I think that could be their racial skill: shields regrneration for calmando, speed for mimando, amor repair for galmando and more armor for amando Soy una hoja al viento a merced de los elementos... https://dust514.com/recruit/MfQjol/
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1907	Posted - 2014.10.10 03:41:00 - [76] - Quote Not gonna lie, I think they should be light suits. Commandos like SEALs are about getting behind enemy lines and doing recon/Sabotaging key elements in order to allow easier assault by the main body. Having them as heavies makes them more of a shocktrooper role, which they do poorly I think. Suppose we made them light frames? No cloak bonus and no dampening bonus, but they can infiltrate behind a group of tanks and start causing havoc. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 568	Posted - 2014.10.10 05:25:00 - [77] - Quote give them high scan range and precision, so the commandos can see everything on a battlefield. dont make their passive scan shared. and give them terrible scan profiles so they cant hide. this lets the class react to threats as they emerge, but its balanced by their inability to to use cloaks, dampen effectively, and their lack of mobility.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3539	Posted - 2014.10.10 06:37:00 - [78] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: give them high scan range and precision, so the commandos can see everything on a battlefield. dont make their passive scan shared. and give them terrible scan profiles so they cant hide. this lets the class react to threats as they emerge, but its balanced by their inability to to use cloaks, dampen effectively, and their lack of mobility. This would also be an acceptable option over putzing with fitting. It would also give me a.reason to max out my EWAR skills.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1361	Posted - 2014.10.10 07:21:00 - [79] - Quote I have proto commando on two accounts and I regularly play with other people who have proto commandos (of various races) and the thing that always comes across when using them more than anything is that they are 'specialist' suits. They're not quite as good at up front fights as assaults are, but when fitted out properly they can fill a wide variety of battlefield roles and purposes. The two main issues that come across with them though are 1) Assaults can get more damage, and have a boatload more viable fittings and 2) Aside from hitpoints (which even now isn't really as good as before) Commando's have awful base stats that are really hard to augment due to incredibly low slot totals & pg / cpu issues. Amarr and Gallente commando's really need another high slot and could use some love in their base statistics (gallente commando has awful awful stamina / stamina regen) Min and Cal commando's could use another slot and some fixing of their shield recharge / delay values. Aside from that commando's can be incredibly limited by ammo which makes it practically a necessity to pack around nanohives... If at all possible I'd be very interested in seeing a role bonus oriented towards something like +50% maximum ammunition carried (mass driver using minmatar commando's would seriously drool over this, PLC using galmandos would be in love, sniper using calmando's would be squealing like little girls behind their faceplates and the amarr commando might be a bit happier about using something like an A.ScR). Or failing that, maybe play around with a slow ammo regeneration ability (3-5% ammo every 15-20 seconds?) built into the suit? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Spectral Clone Dust2Dust. 2899	Posted - 2014.10.10 07:29:00 - [80] - Quote Proto gallente commando on my alt with shotty and AR. Recapping my feedback from a previous thread, made many moons ago: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2168721#post2168721 Spectral Clone wrote: I wanted to comment on why I find commandos sub par. I believe that the main problem is the "negative speed/easier to hit feedback-loop" that is caused by high rate of fire weapons slow down effect and commandos big hitbox. Let me illustrate: You get hit -> Move slower -> Easier to hit (big hitbox)/apply damage to/slow down even more-> Repeat geting hit. I actually die quicker on my untanked gallente commando than on my tanked gallente scout (not fully brick tanked, 1 complex plate usually). Dont know if this is intentional or not. Heavy/sentinels offset this issue with higher shield/armor, resistances and naturally slower movement speed (Im guessing slow down effect is a scale factor rather than a subtracted value). The solution to this problem is to either remove the slow down effect or tone it down on heavier frames with the motivation that heavy objects moving in a certain direction with a velocity is not affected as much as light objects by small arms gunfire. I would not be surprised if this was not considered when designing the commando role/introducing the on hit slow down effect since it seems like an impact that is very hard to predict. Nor would I be surprised if removing the slow down effect would actually solve many other issues and improve QoL for those who play. Then I wanted to add that there is no logic behind Sentinels and basic heavy frames having a similar slot layout and CPU/PG layout, while the commando does not have equal amount of slots (pehaps in a different configuration?). How to design a good commando role: - Normalize CPU/PG on all heavy class suits. - Normalize number of slots on all heavy class suits. - Come up with interesting/different slot layouts for commandos. - AV bonuses on each suit (Amarr get Swarm OR PLC bonus). - Commando should trade off grenade for equipment. - Commando trade heavy + sidearm with light + light. DONE. "The DUST 514 Dev Team is not reduced or affected by the restructuring at CCP."

el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:14:00 - [81] - Quote Logi primary, I've had a small stable of Minmatar Commando fits for a couple months which I regularly use in pubs and have used in PC as needed. I generally weaponize with CR, MD, SG and PLC. Some combo of those. I generally equip with either a scanner or with a repping hive or repper. I generally mod for regen or speed. Now, my combat behaviour habits are probably far more conservative than most since I'm a logi primary and conditioned for combat from cover, running open spaces in zigzags, looking backwards from a squad/bluegroup I'm moving with etc. but all in all the MinCommando is a really good suit. I use it when combat becomes too heavy for my Logi fits to survive, my group needs the extra firepower, or in CQC. For me this suit works well. I think ImpSmash's proposal for Commando roles/use most closely describes the where and when of Commando utility and the suggestions to tailor strengths in that direction are good. Breakin's "Shocktrooper" is encompassed in that. When I consider the Tactical Commando of historical reference, while in or on a frontline capacity they're more even with rank and file soldiers, generally they're combat force multipliers or task specialists. If anything, Assaults are the "Omni-jack-of-all-Masters-of-Nothing-bagfodder" troops sent to push regardless of cost. Commandos increase that Assault combat capability so either 1)fewer troops are lost by virtue of more powerful offense or 2) fewer troops are used by virtue of more powerful offense being possible with a smaller group, which also mitigates loss risk. Commandos, IMO, should be force-multipliers like Logis. The difference would be that while Logis' multiplicative effect stems primarily from equipment supply/support Commandos' multiplier lies in pure force. More damage, faster and for longer periods while also being able to sustain more damage than Lights or Assaults (generally speaking). That being said, and again I'm a Logi primary and only Minmanndo when I -mando, The extra firepower element and versatility of 2 light weapons with the existing bonuses does very good. Fitting is always a bi+ch so the CPU/PG suggestions are spot on IMO, if theres to be a slot parity aspect I'd think that slotting them in-line with their respective racial Assaults versus their racial Heavies would be better. Grenades would be nice BUT me personally I'd rather have the second equipment slot from Scouts over the nades. Commandos DON'T and CAN'T have the speed or profile advantages Scouts do so the 2nd equipment ability being moved to this group would very much help them fulfill whatever specialized niche the fit is crafted for (AV, reinforcement, location offense or defense etc) without it being the same imbalance just on a different frame. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5680	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:38:00 - [82] - Quote Cross Atu: What's a good way to buff the Logi? El Operator: Nerf Scouts. Cross Atu: What's a good way to buff the Commando? El Operator: Nerf Scouts. Scouts have jobs too, cupcake. Cloak was intended to help us do those jobs. It was not intended to replace those jobs. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:45:00 - [83] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Cross Atu: What's a good way to buff the Logi? El Operator: Nerf Scouts. Cross Atu: What's a good way to buff the Commando? El Operator: Nerf Scouts. Scouts have jobs too, cupcake. Cloak was intended to help us do those jobs. It was not intended to replace those jobs. Don't be mad, sweetie. I'm just pointing out the obvious. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5680	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:50:00 - [84] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: I'm just pointing out the obvious. And what might that be? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:53:00 - [85] - Quote Besides, most anyone who isn't drunk on whatever they serve in the barbershop can see that the fastest, lowest profile suit class with some of the best regen stats and the ability to tote a light weapon, grenades, a sidearm AND 2 equipment sets just on paper is imbalanced, let alone the gameplay that actually stems from it. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:54:00 - [86] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: I'm just pointing out the obvious. And what might that be? See post #85. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 21:57:00 - [87] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Grenades would be nice BUT me personally I'd rather have the second equipment slot from Scouts over the nades. Commandos DON'T and CAN'T have the speed or profile advantages Scouts do so the 2nd equipment ability being moved to this group would very much help them fulfill whatever specialized niche the fit is crafted for (AV, reinforcement, location offense or defense etc) without it being the same imbalance just on a different frame. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 362	Posted - 2014.10.10 22:22:00 - [88] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Grenades would be nice BUT me personally I'd rather have the second equipment slot from Scouts over the nades. Commandos DON'T and CAN'T have the speed or profile advantages Scouts do so the 2nd equipment ability being moved to this group would very much help them fulfill whatever specialized niche the fit is crafted for (AV, reinforcement, location offense or defense etc) without it being the same imbalance just on a different frame. You know you like this post. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5694	Posted - 2014.10.10 23:45:00 - [89] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: You know you like this post. If you believe that Scouts having 2 EQ is bad for business, why not elaborate as to why? Or is your basis buried in Meee One's whimpers and Apothekary Zaki's whines? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 363	Posted - 2014.10.10 23:59:00 - [90] - Quote Sure. Here: el OPERATOR wrote: Besides, most anyone who isn't drunk on whatever they serve in the barbershop can see that the fastest, lowest profile suit class with some of the best regen stats and the ability to tote a light weapon, grenades, a sidearm AND 2 equipment sets just on paper is imbalanced, let alone the gameplay that actually stems from it. Does that work for you or should I rewrite it so that its easier to comprehend when read? Should we ask Rattati about demographic figures for Scout frame use now? Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.

el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 363	Posted - 2014.10.11 00:02:00 - [91] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: You know you like this post. If you believe that Scouts having 2 EQ is bad for business, why not elaborate as to why? Or is your basis buried in Meee One's biased whimpers and Apothekary Zaki's baseless whines? I recognize your condescension for that pair. While we may perhaps share some opinions across topics you will find I am from a much different perspective than biased whimpering or baseless whines. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5695	Posted - 2014.10.11 00:07:00 - [92] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Sure. Here: el OPERATOR wrote: Besides, most anyone who isn't drunk on whatever they serve in the barbershop can see that the fastest, lowest profile suit class with some of the best regen stats and the ability to tote a light weapon, grenades, a sidearm AND 2 equipment sets just on paper is imbalanced, let alone the gameplay that actually stems from it. Does that work for you or should I rewrite it so that its easier to comprehend when read? Should we ask Rattati about demographic figures for Scout frame use now? Imbalance? Let's take a stroll over to weekly killboard, and have a look at all those famous top slayers. Name for me the dedicated Scouts you see. While we're here studying thing these top slayers, let's now focus our attention on the "uber slayers" like Kaizuki Sniper and the notorious Duna. Those exceptionally efficient killers with KDRs over 10.0. How many of these "uber slayers" are Scouts? Can you find one? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 363	Posted - 2014.10.11 04:23:00 - [93] - Quote I genuinely hope you didn't burn your popcorn waiting for me Adipem Nothi wrote: Imbalance? Let's take a stroll over to weekly killboard and have a look together at all those famous top slayers. Let's start at the top, and as we scroll along, name for me the dedicated Scouts you see. While we're here studying these top slayers, let's keep an eye out for "uber slayers" with KDRs over 10.0. This way we can know the most deadly of mercs and perhaps identify a statistical anomaly or two. Like Kaizuki Sniper (CA Assault) or the notorious Duna (obvious pilot is obvious). How many here among these "uber slayers" are Scouts? Can you find one? PS: I'm not claiming that Scouts are perfect, nor am I suggesting that their balance can't be improved upon. But I certainly don't think that removal of an EQ slot can be justified on the grounds "imbalance". There is no indication of imbalance sufficient to warrant such a radical, game-changing measure. TL;DR: Finetune Scouts? Absolutely. But put down the nerf bat; it is not needed. The nerfbat isn't being suggested here, the nerf tuning fork is. For ScoutNerfPinata threads those are the stuff usually of GD, a couple tabs above Features and Ideas. Imbalance, yes. In case you missed it, Scout frames by design move the fastest both in sprinting and regular walking/turning, have the lowest profiles making them very difficult to detect outside of the Light class, have amazingly fast regens spread amongst variants, are able to equip both light weappns, sidearms and grenades AND mix-and-match equipment. My suggestion is yes, pull an equipment slot off the frame and whatever cpu/pg allocated for it although I'd be okay with the cpu and pg staying after the slot removal. I know they're tight for resources (as we all are and probably should be). I realize you've been trying to focus this suggestion as an anti-cloaking perogative, harping about the cloak and all, but thats not my point. The point is you are the fastest, lowest profile, best armed and best equipped platform in the game. You are the Rock to every other scissor, the Paper to every other rock and the Scissor to every other paper in the game right out of the box. THAT is imbalance. Maybe not Scout imbalance, but most definitely Game imbalance. Imbalance felt all day everyday by players in and out of the class, In by those laughing with glee at their "skills" and Out by those wondering why the ** is this ** like this still allowed to continue. Now a trip to the leaderboards would reveal one, no two things. One, that since the leaderboards provide 0 data regarding what outfitting was used by the player listed they have all of 0 relevance as a datapool for this context (I hope you aren't really using them this way, if so...XD) and Two, that suggesting we go there and use that info to buttress your position (since, y'know, Duna or whoever else always uses the same fits all the time and everybody's listed in a registry for cross referencing) is a nice distraction. Now, the proposal to transfer equipment mix-and-matching ability to Commandos does two things: It empowers a class that is generally agreed (based on this thread and others) to need something allowing more specialization from what should be a specialization class AND it does it in a way that doesn't create some new imbalance issue since the Commando frames are particularly inferior relative to other suits in several ways and having extra equipment won't allow the frame to magically not be. Unlike Scout frames, which are largely superior relative to all other suits with the ability to carry and field multiple equipment types (the ol' mix-n-match) being one of those superiority points. You'll still be able to carry equipment. 1 type at a time. Which, since it was the going standard for Scouts for a very long time, shouldn't be that big of a deal for "dedicated Scouts". Scouting remains the same, general role and use stays the same, the ill-effects of invis-re's, dual-clacks, deployables spam, etc. are eliminated. " Nerfbat"? Really? Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5709	Posted - 2014.10.11 05:37:00 - [94] - Quote With respect, if Scouts were truly the end-all-be-all, they'd be all we see. Kinda like in 1.8. But that's not the case anymore. There's a healthy mix of suits on the field now, and that mix is getting healthier each hotfix. We can bring the Logi and Commando up-to-speed without kicking Scouts in the balls. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 366	Posted - 2014.10.11 07:00:00 - [95] - Quote And with respect to you as well, your leaderboard exercise is an exercise of nothing but futility in this here since, again, the data is irrelevant. It is a list of names and kd/r's, that is all, neither of which matters here. Scouts have been given a boon, pinnacle performance within the oft-quoted realms of Tank, Gank and Speed. You are in sole possession of the only functional use capability for cloaking. And you feel you're entitled to carry more equipment than the larger, heavier, medium Assault frame? Entitled to carry more than the larger, heavier Commando frame? All while keeping significantly faster movement speeds, significantly lower profile db, AND identical weapon carrying capabilities?? Riddle me this: If Scouts are still enabled to carry and use all the equipment they can fit in one slot AND keep ALL the other stats (perks) they possess, which specific elements of Forward Recon and Combat Flanking would be so drastically impacted that it would be considered "gamebreaking"? What, since 1.8, has the Scout role developed into that removal of one of the two newly available equipment slots would render Scouts useless and cause mass exodus from the class? Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Magnus Amadeuss Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1140	Posted - 2014.10.11 07:38:00 - [96] - Quote You want to know what OP? Go find out what Nyan San battle doctorine is, there ya go. This is one truth that has been constant since I started playing last year. When logi were OP, nyan san were all about the logis When grenades were spammable, nyan spammed the hell out of them When vehicles destroyed everything, nyan was there When Rail rifles came out, Nyan was there. When scouts got the huge buff in 1.8 nyan was there... and still are. Seriously this game has a built in litmus test for what is OP and that is nyan san squads. Once you see those diversify, you will know you have got balance. Look at the forums, every day there is a brand new forum go'er complaining about scouts... There are posts talking about how scouts aren't OP (classic sign of something being OP) Nothing much has changed since 1.8 as far as scout go. Cal/Gal are still the best scouts, and beyond that scouts are everywhere cloaky-shotgunning people. Unless of course you are talking about balancing around PC battles.... you know, what 95%+ of the players in this game will never play... lol If we were balancing around PC, should all mods/guns basically cost 10 times what they do? You know, given the hundreds of billions(trillions) of isk that were farmed and all. Fixing EWAR
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3558	Posted - 2014.10.11 07:50:00 - [97] - Quote Take the scout argument to another thread you dipwads. This is a discussion of commandos. Take the scout idiocy elsewhere. It is not relevant to topic.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 368	Posted - 2014.10.11 07:56:00 - [98] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Grenades would be nice BUT me personally I'd rather have the second equipment slot from Scouts over the nades. Commandos DON'T and CAN'T have the speed or profile advantages Scouts do so the 2nd equipment ability being moved to this group would very much help them fulfill whatever specialized niche the fit is crafted for (AV, reinforcement, location offense or defense etc) without it being the same imbalance just on a different frame. You know you like this post. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Magnus Amadeuss Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1140	Posted - 2014.10.11 08:42:00 - [99] - Quote Commando wide I am not sure what to do... Larger stamina would be nice: Keep them slow like they are, just let them run longer. Nothing drastic, like +10%. Maybe a little bit better jumping but I think that is tied to speed and that should definitely not increase. If commandos are meant to be autonomous suits though, a small built in armor rep/sec would be great. On the second equipment slot: I am not sure exactly what the reason would be for it. I use commandos a TON. The way I see it, it is nice to always be prepared for the odd vehicle... or if in tight spaces MD/PLC is great for clearing areas out. I have never really found much of a use for the second slot, but I can tell you that it would most likely be a needle. Slot I have no is always just a nanohive. I am not sure how I feel about that though. Having more than one equipment slot just seems to lessen the need for the already scarce logistics players. Logistics now just seem to find a heavy and latch on, where as I always thought the role could be so much more cool than that. Speaking specifically about the Amarr commando: I can't fit any amarr weapon except for the assault scrambler on them. Everything just overheats in a blink of an eye making me think I should have just put a cringe* rail rifle there. I stick with the assault SCR because of the +10% damage. Makes the Empress sad to see amarr suits best work with other races weapons. Fixing EWAR
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 370	Posted - 2014.10.11 15:45:00 - [100] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Commandos, IMO, should be force-multipliers like Logis. The difference would be that while Logis' multiplicative effect stems primarily from equipment supply/support Commandos' multiplier lies in pure force. More damage, faster and for longer periods while also being able to sustain more damage than Lights or Assaults (generally speaking). That being said, and again I'm a Logi primary and only Minmanndo when I -mando, The extra firepower element and versatility of 2 light weapons with the existing bonuses does very good. Fitting is always a bi+ch so the CPU/PG suggestions are spot on IMO, if theres to be a slot parity aspect I'd think that slotting them in-line with their respective racial Assaults versus their racial Heavies would be better. Grenades would be nice BUT me personally I'd rather have the second equipment slot from Scouts over the nades. Commandos DON'T and CAN'T have the speed or profile advantages Scouts do so the 2nd equipment ability being moved to this group would very much help them fulfill whatever specialized niche the fit is crafted for (AV, reinforcement, location offense or defense etc) without it being the same imbalance just on a different frame. You know you like this post. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.

Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3235	Posted - 2014.10.11 15:54:00 - [101] - Quote Gentlemen, focus please. The thread topic is about defining a role, and properly supporting said role specialization for the Commandos. While I freely acknowledge that other classes are relevant to balance we will not likely find a robust role for one class by focusing on alterations to another. Do such alterations have merit, or possibly even need, on occasion? Sure. Is that the only, or even the first, step we need to establish a role for any given class, in this case the Commando? I do not believe it is. So, let us refocus on the Commando. What is it, what does it do, why does it do it? With those questions addressed the mechanical question of How does it do it can be addressed more clearly. Now, I don't expect anyone to simply define what will be, I know I certainly will not be able to myself, but that is what discussion is for. The question is not simply "how can we buff commandos", rather it is "what are commandos lacking to define a specialized role on the field. Alright, now that we've had the chance to clear that up, let's get back at it o7 Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1395	Posted - 2014.10.11 16:03:00 - [102] - Quote Commando's are much like in real life - specialists, they hit the hardest, they carry the specialised weapons (like plasma cannons / mass drivers / swarms / snipers). They're somewhat limited on slots (for increased base hp) and they have in general worse stats. Amarr probably get the least useful bonus as their racial assault is outright better at using their weapons. They're excellent at fighting prettymuch anything and 'blitzing' rooms, but their poor regenerative stats (shield recharge / low slots for armor repair) means that assaults and heavies with logistics support are much better for sustained fighting. My suggestion for 'defining' the role a bit better would be drastic increases to the amount of ammo carried, or potentially a small amount of regenerating ammo. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 370	Posted - 2014.10.11 16:48:00 - [103] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: The question is not simply "how can we buff commandos", rather it is "what are commandos lacking to define a specialized role on the field. I think, in my already admitted limited experience, the Commando lacks very little in defining their specialized role. Their role is be able to be specialized ie. quickly custom tailored to address any of a variety specific battlefield circumstances. Having trouble clearing a room? Get the Commandos to pull dual shotguns. Vehicles being pests? Have a Commando pull those swarm launchers. Console to hot for a MinScout to hack? Up shield and codebreaker stack a Commando and send it in. Versatility in Specialization is what I'm getting at here. In a very real way the Commando could be the most complete answer to the original promise of DUST, that unlike other shooters where once you take a role you are limited to it, whereas here you can customize to better suit your needs. And the best part about it is that even tho you could create an awesome purpose-built suit, the base stats keep the suit from being just an I-Win suit every engagement. It is neither Rock, Paper nor Scissors. It can be any of those, as needed, but it is never all of them simultaneously. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3590	Posted - 2014.10.11 17:55:00 - [104] - Quote Role suggestions along similar thematics: Commandos should be able to fall into one of the four following depending on fit. 1: Shocktrooper. Mission is to locate, close with and destroy enemy hardpoints. This should include things such as breaking into areas heavily defended and being able to occupy sentinels while the assaults do the actual work. 2: Fire Support/Suppression: We all know how this works. Lob mass driver shells, laser rifles, PLC shells at enemy positions, etc. This includes counter-snipers. This is the AV blanket role. 3: assassin hunter: finding poorly damped single enemies who specialize in ambushes/knifing and killing them. 4: Saboteur: delivery of mines and remote explosives to enemy targets. Honestly I think commandos are best rigged for raw damage, recovery and detection instead of raw HP. The one thing I'm not wanting at all is more HP creep.
The Master Race Immortal Guides 104	Posted - 2014.10.11 18:07:00 - [105] - Quote You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 106	Posted - 2014.10.11 18:07:00 - [106] - Quote You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 372	Posted - 2014.10.11 19:11:00 - [107] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1945	Posted - 2014.10.11 19:47:00 - [108] - Quote I like many of the suggestions here about how to help commando's be more effective. Breakin Stuffs Shocktrooper class being perhaps my favorite so far since it seems to adress most of my current issues with the commando. I would like to bring back up the issue of the swarm launcher and the commando. Currently the Min commando gets a bonus to using it which doesn't particularly make sense since it is a Caldari tech weapon. Shouldn't that bonus instead go to the Cal commondo? I realize that this does not particularly help the overall balance of the role but it would certainly make more sense. Now with more evil.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5745	Posted - 2014.10.11 20:03:00 - [109] - Quote Suggestion * Scan Range: +3m Logi, +5m Assault, +5m Commando * Scan Profile: -5 dB Assault * Scan Precision: -5 dB Commando (equal to Assault) * CA Commando: +1 Low Slot, +PG/CPU * MN Commando: +1 Low Slot, +PG/CPU * GA Commando: +1 High Slot, +PG/CPU * AM Commando: +1 High Slot, +PG/CPU Concept * Permits the Commando flexibility in choosing which role to fill. * Permits the Commando option to rival new Assault HP levels. * Permits the Commando opportunity to engage more meaningfully in EWAR. Thoughts? Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3595	Posted - 2014.10.11 20:06:00 - [110] - Quote there is absolutely no point in giving commandos a scan range/precision bonus if fully range modded they can only detect just outside the tiny inner ring, and they cannot fit enough precision to catch an undamped scout. that radar has a 120m range. the three rings correspond to 40 meter increments, the tiny ring is "under 20"

Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1910	Posted - 2014.10.11 20:59:00 - [111] - Quote Commandos as heavy suits should not give a rat's ass about EWAR. They should be shock troopers, dealing massive amounts of damage then recovering quickly. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 570	Posted - 2014.10.11 23:36:00 - [112] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Role suggestions along similar thematics: Commandos should be able to fall into one of the four following depending on fit. 1: Shocktrooper. Mission is to locate, close with and destroy enemy hardpoints. This should include things such as breaking into areas heavily defended and being able to occupy sentinels while the assaults do the actual work. 2: Fire Support/Suppression: We all know how this works. Lob mass driver shells, laser rifles, PLC shells at enemy positions, etc. This includes counter-snipers. This is the AV blanket role. 3: assassin hunter: finding poorly damped single enemies who specialize in ambushes/knifing and killing them. 4: Saboteur: delivery of mines and remote explosives to enemy targets. Honestly I think commandos are best rigged for raw damage, recovery and detection instead of raw HP. The one thing I'm not wanting at all is more HP creep. better ewar. vastly increase scan range and precision would make up for their lower HP and mobility. and those scans would allow for effective use of indirect fire support. mass drivers, plasma cannons, and better cqc using shotguns and passive scans. detecting flanking troops. i think everyone here can agree that being able have passive scan is more valuable than another slot or increased HP. you simply become more effective at everything
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1912	Posted - 2014.10.12 01:26:00 - [113] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Role suggestions along similar thematics: Commandos should be able to fall into one of the four following depending on fit. 1: Shocktrooper. Mission is to locate, close with and destroy enemy hardpoints. This should include things such as breaking into areas heavily defended and being able to occupy sentinels while the assaults do the actual work. 2: Fire Support/Suppression: We all know how this works. Lob mass driver shells, laser rifles, PLC shells at enemy positions, etc. This includes counter-snipers. This is the AV blanket role. 3: assassin hunter: finding poorly damped single enemies who specialize in ambushes/knifing and killing them. 4: Saboteur: delivery of mines and remote explosives to enemy targets. Honestly I think commandos are best rigged for raw damage, recovery and detection instead of raw HP. The one thing I'm not wanting at all is more HP creep. better ewar. vastly increase scan range and precision would make up for their lower HP and mobility. and those scans would allow for effective use of indirect fire support. mass drivers, plasma cannons, and better cqc using shotguns and passive scans. detecting flanking troops. i think everyone here can agree that being able have passive scan is more valuable than another slot or increased HP. you simply become more effective at everything and actually meets conditions of each role youve mentioned i would go for eithe the same base scans as scouts, or better because commandos dont have scout mobility. so id honestly would like to see commando base scan range at 50m and precision at 28dB Then they would creep on the Amarr and Caldari scout roles. Shocktrooper shouldn't be hunting. The scout should locate, and the assault should close with and destroy the enemy. Commandos should ensure that the enemy is unable toaneuver and keep the enemy pinned while the assaults close with and destroy. I would see their regen buffed exceedingly, an increase to their extra damage, and an extra slot with pg/CPU to match. They should hit hard, but move slow. They are better for standing in one area and shooting the enemy and keeping them pinned, while the assaults flank for the kill. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 571	Posted - 2014.10.12 02:04:00 - [114] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Role suggestions along similar thematics: Commandos should be able to fall into one of the four following depending on fit. 1: Shocktrooper. Mission is to locate, close with and destroy enemy hardpoints. This should include things such as breaking into areas heavily defended and being able to occupy sentinels while the assaults do the actual work. 2: Fire Support/Suppression: We all know how this works. Lob mass driver shells, laser rifles, PLC shells at enemy positions, etc. This includes counter-snipers. This is the AV blanket role. 3: assassin hunter: finding poorly damped single enemies who specialize in ambushes/knifing and killing them. 4: Saboteur: delivery of mines and remote explosives to enemy targets. Honestly I think commandos are best rigged for raw damage, recovery and detection instead of raw HP. The one thing I'm not wanting at all is more HP creep. better ewar. vastly increase scan range and precision would make up for their lower HP and mobility. and those scans would allow for effective use of indirect fire support. mass drivers, plasma cannons, and better cqc using shotguns and passive scans. detecting flanking troops. i think everyone here can agree that being able have passive scan is more valuable than another slot or increased HP. you simply become more effective at everything and actually meets conditions of each role youve mentioned i would go for eithe the same base scans as scouts, or better because commandos dont have scout mobility. so id honestly would like to see commando base scan range at 50m and precision at 28dB Then they would creep on the Amarr and Caldari scout roles. Shocktrooper shouldn't be hunting. The scout should locate, and the assault should close with and destroy the enemy. Commandos should ensure that the enemy is unable toaneuver and keep the enemy pinned while the assaults close with and destroy. I would see their regen buffed exceedingly, an increase to their extra damage, and an extra slot with pg/CPU to match. They should hit hard, but move slow. They are better for standing in one area and shooting the enemy and keeping them pinned, while the assaults flank for the kill. how? im pretty sure scouts are for infiltration, which they ALL excel at due to their scan profiles and cloaks. giving commandos better scan range and precision doesnt make them better than scouts at infiltration, especially since they dont have scout speed and mobility. also, commando passive scan should not be squad shared. it meant for letting the commando see approaching enemies so he can react to them, by switching weapons or moving to a more tactical position. in order to be hunters, you need to also be fast, which not what these slow as snails commandos are. when i run my gal commando, i run it with a shotgun and ar. my biggest issue with it is that i cant see enemies coming around corners or flanking me, where id want to switch and use my shotgun when i use my caldari commando ill run a RR/swarm or RR/sniper fit. same thing here, i wish i had passive scan good enough to detect dudes running up to me when im giving my squad sniper cover. passive scan arent just helpful offensively, theyre just as useful defensively. Breakin Stuff wrote: there is absolutely no point in giving commandos a scan range/precision bonus if fully range modded they can only detect just outside the tiny inner ring, and they cannot fit enough precision to catch an undamped scout. that radar has a 120m range. the three rings correspond to 40 meter increments, the tiny ring is "under 20" Everyone who is not a calscout is pretty much limited to halfway between the tiny ring and the next ring at best. wouldnt buffing the base scan range and precision to fix this? 15m is nothing , but 50m is most certainly viable along with precision strong enough to detect at least medium suits and possibly undampened scouts
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 5802	Posted - 2014.10.12 02:53:00 - [115] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: \ also, commando passive scan should not be squad shared. Just a quick point: All passive scans are shared with squad. At the moment, it doesn't appear that anything can be done to change this mechanic; for better or worse, it seems we're stuck with what we've got. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley
CeeJ Mantis Mantodea MC 47	Posted - 2014.10.12 04:00:00 - [116] - Quote I run a LvL 5 Gallente commando and my friends run all of the other racial commandos. I think the main problems with the commando are low stamina, EWAR, and long shield recharge delays. It takes the commando out of the fight for a long time, the low stamina makes it hard to utilize their melee skills, and most importantly, it makes it hard for them to get anywhere since they can only sprint for 12 seconds, and it takes a long time for it to come back. You gain a lot of the detriments of the heavy suit, but you miss out on the slots and HP. And extra slot could help with the issue of optimum loadouts being the only viable ones. Only 1 low slot is almost always occupied with an armor rep, and 1 high slot is almost always a damage mod. The MIN can make some fun fits with speed and melee, but in the end your slots are mostly decided when you try to make a viable fit. Still, I find the commando to be very effective. Tac AR and PLC is a potent combo. Sniper/rail is also good. There are many versitile combos available with the suit. Swarms, Mass drivers, PLC, sniper in particular are great suits for commandos if for nothing else than the ability to carry a weapon other than a sidearm instead. Rather than try to find the place they SHOULD fit on the battlefield, their current roll of capable, semi-tanky, damage machines with versatile weapon loadouts. That sounds satisfactory to me, and I can't see what could be done that would be a defining characteristic, rather than just a useful mechanic. Longest plasma cannon kill: 236.45m
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 108	Posted - 2014.10.12 07:33:00 - [117] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. If the a damage buff to remote explosives large enough to kill tanks would be considered to op they could also increase radius increasing the risk; Proximity explosives could be an issue. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 382	Posted - 2014.10.13 01:14:00 - [118] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. If the a damage buff to remote explosives large enough to kill tanks would be considered to op they could also increase radius increasing the risk; Proximity explosives could be an issue. I am pretty sure it would go something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx-obtKU1jM I think that to be successful at AV which focuses on the planting of RE's Commandos would need a pretty healthy speed buff. The sort of buff that would make them viable for AV bomb planting but absolute terrors in infantry combat, especially in urbanized areas. Buffing like that would just lead to subsequent nerfing. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3242	Posted - 2014.10.13 22:42:00 - [119] - Quote Am not a fan of the EWAR Commando concept, feels like it's getting a little too weird. Last thing we need to do is throw more Commando-sized wrenches into the mess that is EWAR. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3626	Posted - 2014.10.13 22:54:00 - [120] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Am not a fan of the EWAR Commando concept, feels like it's getting a little too weird. Last thing we need to do is throw more Commando-sized wrenches into the mess that is EWAR. EWAR needs to be killed with fire, seared to ash and used to plant the new field. My wishlist for a client update (Rouge throw us a bone here) is as follows: 1: add inertia to dropsuits. 2: rebuild EWAR. That is all

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3242	Posted - 2014.10.13 22:59:00 - [121] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Am not a fan of the EWAR Commando concept, feels like it's getting a little too weird. Last thing we need to do is throw more Commando-sized wrenches into the mess that is EWAR. EWAR needs to be killed with fire, seared to ash and used to plant the new field. My wishlist for a client update (Rouge throw us a bone here) is as follows: 1: add inertia to dropsuits. 2: rebuild EWAR. That is all Binary EWAR was a horrible idea from the start. It was passable until they made an entire role built around it, and then it was just a total shitstorm. No amount of tweaking will make EWAR acceptable in its current form. Whole damn concept needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. Hotfix Delta Sentinel eHP Calcs
XxGhazbaranxX Eternal Beings Dark Taboo 1751	Posted - 2014.10.13 23:31:00 - [122] - Quote Pro gall commando. Perma dual plasma cannon and i think this suit is pretty balanced. I like the extra damage for the role. I dont really see a need for a change. The relaod and damage bonus give it some very good damage output increase over other suits. I like the as they are but i could just be biased Plasma Cannon Advocate Dust 514 Survivor
Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1084	Posted - 2014.10.14 00:31:00 - [123] - Quote Ammando is useless due to Assault being better with the LR, the Scr nerf and the ACSR being sh*t Pokemon master and Tekken Lord Gk0 Scout yay :) Pls fix SCR CCP
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13518	Posted - 2014.10.14 00:51:00 - [124] - Quote Zindorak wrote: Ammando is useless due to Assault being better with the LR, the Scr nerf and the ACSR being sht **** please..... Amarr Commando is the best damn suit in the game. You obviously never saw Aero or Fire of Prometheus at work then.....the original Commando's. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 112	Posted - 2014.10.14 10:12:00 - [125] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. If the a damage buff to remote explosives large enough to kill tanks would be considered to op they could also increase radius increasing the risk; Proximity explosives could be an issue. I am pretty sure it would go something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx-obtKU1jM I think that to be successful at AV which focuses on the planting of RE's Commandos would need a pretty healthy speed buff. The sort of buff that would make them viable for AV bomb planting but absolute terrors in infantry combat, especially in urbanized areas. Buffing like that would just lead to subsequent nerfing. Nah m8 thats the point they don't need speed if they only need one remote explosive to do the job. Unless they are sneaky they will die and even once they get it planted they will probably be killed. I don't know how the ewar of it works out but heavies have a large profile. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
The Master Race Immortal Guides 121	Posted - 2014.10.14 10:12:00 - [126] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. If the a damage buff to remote explosives large enough to kill tanks would be considered to op they could also increase radius increasing the risk; Proximity explosives could be an issue. I am pretty sure it would go something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx-obtKU1jM I think that to be successful at AV which focuses on the planting of RE's Commandos would need a pretty healthy speed buff. The sort of buff that would make them viable for AV bomb planting but absolute terrors in infantry combat, especially in urbanized areas. Buffing like that would just lead to subsequent nerfing. Not a problem! Thats the point they don't need speed if they only need one remote explosive to do the job. Unless they are sneaky the commando will die and even once they get it planted they will probably be killed.With my scout I can sneak up and drop 1 remote explosive before I am noticed so this would really only screw with tunnel visioned tankers or tankers sticking to close to cover. I have seen videos of commandos with cloak though what fun that would be. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Aeon Amadi Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 6679	Posted - 2014.10.14 11:58:00 - [127] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2257038#post2257038 { \| bittervetmode = 1 I } == Description == This player has reached their breaking point [[Category: Angry]]
Malleus Malificorum Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 111	Posted - 2014.10.14 12:31:00 - [128] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Zindorak wrote: Ammando is useless due to Assault being better with the LR, the Scr nerf and the ACSR being sht **** please..... Amarr Commando is the best damn suit in the game. You obviously never saw Aero or Fire of Prometheus at work then.....the original Commando's. Honestly, it's really a tossup, it does more damage in the same number of shots than an assault - but the extra shots of the assault account for a lot more damage. When focused on killing exactly one target the amarr commando performs better, when focused on killing multiple targets the assault is wildly better. That's if we're not accounting for damage mods, with damage mods factored in the damage difference between assault and commando is very very small (iirc it's about 1-2%?) before the assaults extra shots are accounted for. On general principle the amarr assault is better than the commando, however the commando does gain the option to do stuff like ScR & Swarm launcher, which really opens up is engagement options. As far as assault vs commando comparisons? The amarr commando is easily one of the worst, and despite its bad slots the minmatar commando is easily one of the best. Weep not poor children, For life is this way, Murdering beauty and passion.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 385	Posted - 2014.10.14 21:44:00 - [129] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: You guys remember commandos on the game Command and Conquer? How about a crazy epic remote explosive buff they are slow with big hit boxes, but if they make it up to your tank with some explosives your done. I've got a present for you! 8D http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdDy05ug3VM "That was left-handed!" XD In Red Alert I loved sending the dogs ahead of the Allied Commando, it cleared her fog of war and just let her pile those dead bots up. CnC or TC EndWar is exactly how one of the pillars of this game's design/balance should be. Those should really be the RTS part of the MMORPGRTSFPS DUST aspires to be. And, to CCP's credit (all dev teams thus far), damn if it isn't close. If the a damage buff to remote explosives large enough to kill tanks would be considered to op they could also increase radius increasing the risk; Proximity explosives could be an issue. I am pretty sure it would go something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx-obtKU1jM I think that to be successful at AV which focuses on the planting of RE's Commandos would need a pretty healthy speed buff. The sort of buff that would make them viable for AV bomb planting but absolute terrors in infantry combat, especially in urbanized areas. Buffing like that would just lead to subsequent nerfing. Not a problem! Thats the point they don't need speed if they only need one remote explosive to do the job. Unless they are sneaky the commando will die and even once they get it planted they will probably be killed.With my scout I can sneak up and drop 1 remote explosive before I am noticed so this would really only screw with tunnel visioned tankers or tankers sticking to close to cover. I have seen videos of commandos with cloak though what fun that would be. Its a problem if the unit doesn't have the speed to deliver the package. Your scoutsuit is much, much faster than a Commando. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1925	Posted - 2014.10.14 21:50:00 - [130] - Quote I think commandos either need to become light suits and be about disrupting the enemy behind their lines, similar to how this remote explosive discussion is; or have them remain heavy suits, and emphasize shocktroopers, and deal massive damage with light weapons and regen quickly. A heavy trying to place RE on a tank is ludicrous and not what the suit was made to do. For the State.

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13542	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:00:00 - [131] - Quote As I see it. Commando have and always were been the Shocktroopers of Dust. Designed to spit lead down range and be the Ultimate Suppression Fighters CCP intended them to be. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 114	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:01:00 - [132] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Its a problem if the unit doesn't have the speed to deliver the package. Your scoutsuit is much, much faster than a Commando. I am well aware of the speed difference, my scout also can't one or two shot a tank with a REs. There are of course other methods you could use like dropping one from a drop ship on top of a tank or trying to make it to the tank with a lav. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of2HU3LGdbo New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
The Master Race Immortal Guides 121	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:01:00 - [133] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Its a problem if the unit doesn't have the speed to deliver the package. Your scoutsuit is much, much faster than a Commando. I am well aware of the speed difference, my scout also can't one or two shot a tank with a REs. There are of course other methods you could use like dropping one from a drop ship on top of a tank or trying to make it to the tank with a lav. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of2HU3LGdbo New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1926	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:33:00 - [134] - Quote True Adamance wrote: As I see it. Commando have and always were been the Shocktroopers of Dust. Designed to spit lead down range and be the Ultimate Suppression Fighters CCP intended them to be. So you've taken to using Minmatar tech then, have you? True Adamance wrote: As I see it. Commando have and always were been the Shocktroopers of Dust. Designed to spit laz0rs down range and be the Ultimate Suppression Fighters CCP intended them to be. FTFY For the State.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 385	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:45:00 - [135] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Its a problem if the unit doesn't have the speed to deliver the package. Your scoutsuit is much, much faster than a Commando. I am well aware of the speed difference, my scout also can't one or two shot a tank with a REs. There are of course other methods you could use like dropping one from a drop ship on top of a tank or trying to make it to the tank with a lav. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Of2HU3LGdbo Another heavy in an LAV? And vehicle surfing only works in pubs. And since both of those are compensating for the lack of speed that a heavy would need if they are to be buffed to fulfill a role then they should receive all pertinent buffs needed to fulfill that role, not be given a new role but only half the tools to execute it with. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Atiim 12944	Posted - 2014.10.14 22:54:00 - [136] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Zindorak wrote: Ammando is useless due to Assault being better with the LR, the Scr nerf and the ACSR being sht **** please..... Amarr Commando is the best damn suit in the game. You obviously never saw Aero or Fire of Prometheus at work then.....the original Commando's. Also known as... The Commando Six The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 385	Posted - 2014.10.14 23:00:00 - [137] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think commandos either need to become light suits and be about disrupting the enemy behind their lines, similar to how this remote explosive discussion is; or have them remain heavy suits, and emphasize shocktroopers, and deal massive damage with light weapons and regen quickly. A heavy trying to place RE on a tank is ludicrous and not what the suit was made to do. I think actually that the Commando as a role is already in the hands of the light suits which is a condition that needs to be corrected. Nerf scouts. All stats. At all levels. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13542	Posted - 2014.10.14 23:26:00 - [138] - Quote Atiim wrote: True Adamance wrote: Zindorak wrote: Ammando is useless due to Assault being better with the LR, the Scr nerf and the ACSR being sht **** please..... Amarr Commando is the best damn suit in the game. You obviously never saw Aero or Fire of Prometheus at work then.....the original Commando's. Also known as... The Commando Six Indeed. Fire of Promethius Aero Yassavi Grandmaster Kubo Mauren NOON Thanjac Wurm FOOD The original Commando's who built the Ultimate Suppression Fighter. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Banjo Robertson Evzones Public.Disorder. 280	Posted - 2014.10.15 03:11:00 - [139] - Quote I have only level 1 gallente commando so my experience is very limited. I see the role of commando as something like this: Commandos as compared to the Assault give up: movement speed, slot layouts, scan profile Commandos as compared to the Assault gain: extra light weapon, extra base eHP, longer scanning range, better scanning precision Situational weapon use and situational awareness are what I see commando having as its advantage/role, being able to use two light weapons means you can prepare for more situations than other suits, either two types of AV, two types of AI, or one AV and one AI weapon could be fitted at a time. Not only does the bulkier suit allow for higher base eHP, but it allows for better battlefield sensors to be installed as well. I see commandos having a scan radius of maybe 50-60 meters base, scan precision of around 35db base, this gives them awareness of a good area to allow them to act as needed, it also provides a good tertiary eWar role without taking away from scanning logis.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 115	Posted - 2014.10.15 07:59:00 - [140] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Another heavy in an LAV? And vehicle surfing only works in pubs. And since both of those are compensating for the lack of speed that a heavy would need if they are to be buffed to fulfill a role then they should receive all pertinent buffs needed to fulfill that role, not be given a new role but only half the tools to execute it with. Well put someone on the forums once had written that pc was 1% of the games pop now I do not know if this is true, but even if it is not I would say the viability of said actions on any plain is situational and therefore debatable. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.

The Master Race Immortal Guides 121	Posted - 2014.10.15 07:59:00 - [141] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Another heavy in an LAV? And vehicle surfing only works in pubs. And since both of those are compensating for the lack of speed that a heavy would need if they are to be buffed to fulfill a role then they should receive all pertinent buffs needed to fulfill that role, not be given a new role but only half the tools to execute it with. Well put someone on the forums once had written that pc was 1% of the games pop now I do not know if this is true, but even if it is not I would say the viability of said actions on any plain is situational and therefore debatable. New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3638	Posted - 2014.10.15 10:12:00 - [142] - Quote Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Another heavy in an LAV? And vehicle surfing only works in pubs. And since both of those are compensating for the lack of speed that a heavy would need if they are to be buffed to fulfill a role then they should receive all pertinent buffs needed to fulfill that role, not be given a new role but only half the tools to execute it with. Well put someone on the forums once had written that pc was 1% of the games pop now I do not know if this is true, but even if it is not I would say the viability of said actions on any plain is situational and therefore debatable. let's consider you can only have one match per district per day. The top PC corps aren't exactly the majority of players. Each corp has designated teams who do PC battles. PC corps are not the majority of the players. PC combatants do not make up the majority of PC corp players. so while I'll admit 1% is an exaggeration, realistically you have one in 20 working PC at the most.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3640	Posted - 2014.10.15 11:13:00 - [143] - Quote back to the topic at hand: No one really agrees what the commando should be because everyone USES them for different purposes. no two answers have been alike, which tells me that the construction of the commando line was TOO open and the bonusing too generic. I would like to propose we set the primary purpose of the commando is the sustained application of focused destruction, allowing it to operate in a shocktrooper/doorkicker role as well as a fire support platform to accomplish this I propose 5 slot layout, with a different layout than the sentinels so the commandos are less limited at either end of the fitting spectrum. Gallente/Amarr share 2H/3L Minmatar/Caldari share 3H/2L PG/CPU increase to account for new slots and roles Universal Role Bonus: 50% increase to shield recharger/energizer and armor repair efficacy. If Commandos are expected to perform in sustained engagements their recovery is going to be a lot more important than a Sentinel's ability to soak fire. This will allow "rep tanking" that doesn't involve a logi, and cannot be spiked above the incoming DPS of ANY weapon. It is intended to allow the dropsuits to fade behind cover and recover rapidly whetehr between engagements or to avoid fire by timid opponents who won't chase. Gallente: 3% bonus to plasma damage per level 3% bonus to suit base and sprint speed per level The gallente are CQC fighters, pure and simple. if they cannot get into contact range, they're useless. Amarr: 3% bonus to laser weaponry damage per level 3% bonus to stamina amount and regeneration per level Amarr run longer, stronger and are the slowboats of the dropsuits, they're also the hardest to out-endure. Caldari: 3% bonus to Rail weaponry damage per level 3% bonus to weapon charge speed per level (excluding Sniper Rifles) Caldari Commandos are the long-range fire-support platforms. Their purpose in life is to reach out and touch someone. What they do best is hit harder and fire faster than their brethren. Minmatar: 3% bonus to Explosive Weaponry per level 3% bonus to projectile weaponry per level Minmatar are defined by the fragility of their armor and shields, the speed of their dropsuits and their unnatural ability to hit harder than nearly any other racial equipment in existence. They're the race who tanks by ganking you before you can react.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 389	Posted - 2014.10.17 00:05:00 - [144] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Blueprint For Murder wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Another heavy in an LAV? And vehicle surfing only works in pubs. And since both of those are compensating for the lack of speed that a heavy would need if they are to be buffed to fulfill a role then they should receive all pertinent buffs needed to fulfill that role, not be given a new role but only half the tools to execute it with. Well put someone on the forums once had written that pc was 1% of the games pop now I do not know if this is true, but even if it is not I would say the viability of said actions on any plain is situational and therefore debatable. let's consider you can only have one match per district per day. The top PC corps aren't exactly the majority of players. Each corp has designated teams who do PC battles. PC corps are not the majority of the players. PC combatants do not make up the majority of PC corp players. so while I'll admit 1% is an exaggeration, realistically you have one in 20 working PC at the most. For you and Blueprint, the vehicle surfing in pubs vs PC/FW is that riding in a mode w/FF on, the surfer takes vehicle collision damage fast. Basically you get run over once the vehicle moves, or it throws you/you jump. I want Dropship bombers as much as anyone else, but it doesn't seem sensible to me to provide a bonus thats only useful during certain gamemodes. As part of a larger, more useful bonus portfolio, sure, why not. Did I mention Nerf scouts? Nerf them into material not even Michael Bay would make a sequel for. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 389	Posted - 2014.10.17 00:09:00 - [145] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: back to the topic at hand: No one really agrees what the commando should be because everyone USES them for different purposes. no two answers have been alike, which tells me that the construction of the commando line was TOO open and the bonusing too generic. I would like to propose we set the primary purpose of the commando is the sustained application of focused destruction, allowing it to operate in a shocktrooper/doorkicker role as well as a fire support platform to accomplish this I propose 5 slot layout, with a different layout than the sentinels so the commandos are less limited at either end of the fitting spectrum. Gallente/Amarr share 2H/3L Minmatar/Caldari share 3H/2L PG/CPU increase to account for new slots and roles Universal Role Bonus: 50% increase to shield recharger/energizer and armor repair efficacy. If Commandos are expected to perform in sustained engagements their recovery is going to be a lot more important than a Sentinel's ability to soak fire. This will allow "rep tanking" that doesn't involve a logi, and cannot be spiked above the incoming DPS of ANY weapon. It is intended to allow the dropsuits to fade behind cover and recover rapidly whetehr between engagements or to avoid fire by timid opponents who won't chase. Gallente: 3% bonus to plasma damage per level 3% bonus to suit base and sprint speed per level The gallente are CQC fighters, pure and simple. if they cannot get into contact range, they're useless. Amarr: 3% bonus to laser weaponry damage per level 3% bonus to stamina amount and regeneration per level Amarr run longer, stronger and are the slowboats of the dropsuits, they're also the hardest to out-endure. Caldari: 3% bonus to Rail weaponry damage per level 3% bonus to weapon charge speed per level (excluding Sniper Rifles) Caldari Commandos are the long-range fire-support platforms. Their purpose in life is to reach out and touch someone. What they do best is hit harder and fire faster than their brethren. Minmatar: 3% bonus to Explosive Weaponry per level 3% bonus to projectile weaponry per level Minmatar are defined by the fragility of their armor and shields, the speed of their dropsuits and their unnatural ability to hit harder than nearly any other racial equipment in existence. They're the race who tanks by ganking you before you can react. I like this too, although I'd like to see the reload bonus remain, even if it's spread as a class bonus for all. PLC-Mando reloading is a joyous experience I hate to lose. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Faquira Bleuetta Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 470	Posted - 2014.10.17 01:43:00 - [146] - Quote why just not a buff to 4% bonus to light damage per level = 20 % is way better than of ***** 10 %
Samuel Zelik D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 222	Posted - 2014.10.17 02:55:00 - [147] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Input and feedback is being sought regarding the state of Commandos within Dust, and how to polish the experience. When responding to this thread please note your primary role / primary context for use of each item being commented on so that proper context can be applied. Cheers, Cross PS ~ Commandos are something I know comparatively little about, so please do your best to be detailed and constructive so that I am able to provide the very best feedback and ideas to CCP. Thanks Primary Role: Proto Gallente Scout - Ewar Secondary: Advanced(3) Gallente Commando I run three different builds on my Gallente Commando. 1) Anti-Tank x1 Enhanced Shield Extender x1 KLA-90 Plasma Cannon x1 'Exile' Assault Rifle x1 F-45 Remote Explosives (might change to F/49 Proximity Explosives) x3 Enhanced Armor Plates Primary Context I tend to run this build if a) there's a vehicle(s) in the way, b) I need to lay down cover fire on a narrow choke point, and/or c) I'm taking on heavies in CQC. Most vehicles will retreat whenever I'm using this build (dropships, too- LAVs will drive away). I can kill vehicles if I detonate the remotes first and then finish them with a PLC shot; most of the time I'll fire with someone else to take out a vehicle. If there's a choke point, I'll most fire the PLC to take out as many strafing as I can, then I'll switch to AR and attempt to drive them back. Heavies are about 50/50- sometimes I miss, sometimes I win, sometime they'll tank my PLC shot, other times they'll get fried. I really like this build is able to fulfill the Commando's role of suppression; however, I find myself running out of ammo fairly often. 2) CQC x1 Enhanced Shield Extender x1 'Exile' Assault Rifle x1 CRG-3 Shotgun x1 R-9 Drop Uplink(s) x3 Enhanced Ferroscale Plates Primary Context I tend to run this build if a) the teams needs more Uplinks closer to the objective, b) enemies are grouped up in a small space, and/or c) Scouts. This suit is able to force itself into the front lines fairly well; however, my level 3 Assault suit still does better in that regard. If I want to run in and deal as much damage as possible, I'll use this suit; however, this build often does not have enough tank to support a rush for long (especially when I take damage before rushing). Sometimes I'll use this for point defense to force the enemy off, but I can't compete when a CR starts drilling me. If I know there are Scouts running around, I can sometimes counter them with my Shotgun blast because I can take one more hit than they can; however, more often than not I'll lose to their RoF from behind (get one-three shot). I like this build, but I can't survive very long and can easily be overwhelmed by Scouts and Sentinels (can out-maneuver Assaults & Logis). 3) Hybrid x1 Enhanced Shield Energizer x1 SB-39 Rail Rifle x1 'Exile' Assault Rifle x1 Compact Nanohive x3 Enhanced Reactive Plates Primary Context I tend to run this build if a) attacking/holding a spatially open objective, b) want to lay down suppressing fire, and/or c) I'll be traveling across an open space. If I'm attacking an objective, I'll push up as far as I can and only use my Nanohive if my teammates or myself really need it. If I'm defending, I'll set up my Nanohive on the side with the most forces approaching. In both instances, I'll use the RR to engage targets at range and use the AR on any enemies who manage to move up/flank. Whenever I need to cover teammates moving up or keep enemies occupied, set up my Nanohive and keep unloading clips. If I know I'll be moving out in the open and have a higher chance of getting picked at range, this suit's regen capabilities work wonders on my survival. I enjoy this build the best because the suit regens quickly, can lay down lots of suppressing fire, and is feels the most like the "Commando" role. All of these builds have been pretty successful, but if I had to put them in order of best to worst: Hybrid, Anti-Tank, CQC. I often find I'm consistently running out of ammo. I can go toe-to-toe with Sentinels, and if I lose, I still deal a good amount of damage. On my non-regen builds, I find I don't recover quickly enough to keep my suppression momentum going and am forced to fall back/tread carefully. On my regen build, I often can't sustain a CQC firefight long enough to hold out- the suit gets shredded fairly easily. Hope this helps! Lovin' daddy Rattati! CCP Ankou s+êTà+ bro!
JUDASisMYhomeboy xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 130	Posted - 2014.10.17 05:17:00 - [148] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: give them high scan range and precision, so the commandos can see everything on a battlefield. dont make their passive scan shared. and give them terrible scan profiles so they cant hide. this lets the class react to threats as they emerge, but its balanced by their inability to to use cloaks, dampen effectively, and their lack of mobility. I've been saying this forever. A passive scan buff and an extra hi or low and i would be stoked.
Leovarian L Lavitz NECROM0NGERS 1170	Posted - 2014.10.17 15:53:00 - [149] - Quote Give them built in cloaking devices or the same bonus as scouts. That would be fun as hell. Omni-Soldier Few are my equal in these specialties, none compare in all of them
Monty Mole Clone Ametat Security Amarr Empire 232	Posted - 2014.10.17 20:22:00 - [150] - Quote can the amarr commando reload bonus be changed to a heat build up bonus? if not i would like damage bonus changed to a heat build up bonus instead. quite frankly my dear i don't give a damn pew pew goes my scram rifle zap zap goes my scram pistol vizzzz goes my laser

Horizon Limit Nexus Balusa Horizon 59	Posted - 2014.10.20 19:20:00 - [151] - Quote So, what's the conclusion? Will we be buffed enough to be better than assaults in some situations? Will we have a nade slot? I'm tired of RE behind angles, no other class need to bring an AoE weapon to deal with them. Voice of oga....
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3376	Posted - 2014.10.20 19:26:00 - [152] - Quote I'll try to have a proposal linked in the main thread within the next couple of days. The feedback has been strong here, so my thanks to everyone who is keeping this thread useful and active. In the spirit of iterative balance I intend to do two things. First is to provide a proposal that makes a solid, if smaller initial step. Second is to keep this thread active for feedback and polish following that because alterations (and/or additions) may be called for. Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3766	Posted - 2014.10.20 20:56:00 - [153] - Quote looking forward to see what you cook up cross. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13684	Posted - 2014.10.20 21:02:00 - [154] - Quote I am prepared for the inevitable buff followed by the crippling nerf as a result of a breach of the "If it ain't broke don't fix it" rule. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3377	Posted - 2014.10.20 21:39:00 - [155] - Quote True Adamance wrote: I am prepared for the inevitable buff followed by the crippling nerf as a result of a breach of the "If it ain't broke don't fix it" rule. I think there's some grey area in there for ongoing polish. But said phenomenon is part of why keeping it to smaller changes seems advisable. Besides, anything I propose has to be cleared by CCP R who by and large has been doing a pretty solid job on that front See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3377	Posted - 2014.10.20 21:41:00 - [156] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: looking forward to see what you cook up cross. o7 Once iteration #1 goes up we can see what responses the merc here assembled can give, refine as needed See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3768	Posted - 2014.10.20 22:10:00 - [157] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: looking forward to see what you cook up cross. o7 Once iteration #1 goes up we can see what responses the merc here assembled can give, refine as needed Given that the discussion has remained civil and free of the usual freefire idiocy any chance of conning the devs into active discussion? Honestly I'd like to see their input as well as our weird agreeing in oddly different wasy discussion. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3383	Posted - 2014.10.21 03:56:00 - [158] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: looking forward to see what you cook up cross. o7 Once iteration #1 goes up we can see what responses the merc here assembled can give, refine as needed Given that the discussion has remained civil and free of the usual freefire idiocy any chance of conning the devs into active discussion? Honestly I'd like to see their input as well as our weird agreeing in oddly different wasy discussion. Once 1.9 drops? Quite possibly. Until then I'd expect them to remain mostly busy. Even if I can't however, I may at least be able to get a 'general impression/vision statement' thing regarding the commando role. I'm happy to give it a shot at least See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3783	Posted - 2014.10.21 07:57:00 - [159] - Quote If you can give us a vision statement we can give you more useful, systematic and targeted feedback. Right now our feedback is basically a shotgun when we need a tac rifle. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3384	Posted - 2014.10.21 16:04:00 - [160] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: If you can give us a vision statement we can give you more useful, systematic and targeted feedback. Right now our feedback is basically a shotgun when we need a tac rifle. Totally reasonable. On a somewhat related note, that proposal may be delayed a bit as there are some possible new developments incoming which, if they are finalized would alter the landscape here a bit. Sorry the above is so vague, I really will try to get you guys something more useful and actionable soon, there's just so much on the go right now I don't want to start building on a baseline that may no longer be there in a handful of weeks. I want to reiterate however that this thread is not over nor forgotten in the least, and I will make best efforts to have something more meaningful to report. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)

Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 3983	Posted - 2014.10.21 16:11:00 - [161] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: On a somewhat related note, that proposal may be delayed a bit as there are some possible new developments incoming which, if they are finalized would alter the landscape here a bit. [Crystal Balling intensifies] My advice to you, playa...
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3795	Posted - 2014.10.21 16:13:00 - [162] - Quote Oh if you could get CCP to loosen the death grip on information you'd be my hero. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3387	Posted - 2014.10.22 02:27:00 - [163] - Quote So, this may be a thing, take a look. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13730	Posted - 2014.10.22 03:15:00 - [164] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: So, this may be a thing, take a look. Why is it a thing. Why is armour magically repairing? "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1427	Posted - 2014.10.22 04:39:00 - [165] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Cross Atu wrote: So, this may be a thing, take a look. Why is it a thing. Why is armour magically repairing? because balance and quality of life. Shield tanks are designed to break in dust, unlike in eve where a properly fitted and functioning shield tank doesn't break - in fact there's weapons that break shields immediately in dust. Shield users aren't 'allowed' to use all their lowslots for shield tanking because they always need to throw something at armor or they succumb to attrition. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1977	Posted - 2014.10.22 06:58:00 - [166] - Quote So Cross, what's the status on some iterations for commandos? Mercs whine about the rail rifle but refuse to shield tank to counter it. But that's none of my business.
Spectral Clone Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 2924	Posted - 2014.10.22 07:12:00 - [167] - Quote When will the on hit snare effect be removed? Having a big hitbox is the main drawback of commando suits due to being easily slowed down by bullets. Fix mouse support in Dust 514! How to do it: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=965407#post965407
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3398	Posted - 2014.10.22 07:50:00 - [168] - Quote Spectral Clone wrote: When will the on hit snare effect be removed? Having a big hitbox is the main drawback of commando suits due to being easily slowed down by bullets. Should already be gone, if it isn't either I have hallucinated an entire change log, there is a bug that is making the game behave improperly, or peoples anecdotal impressions are giving them false positives. It has been quite awhile since I deployed in a commando, but I haven't encountered any notable bullet related slowdown of late during my own play (except, you know, the kind that leads to bleedout ) See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3398	Posted - 2014.10.22 07:53:00 - [169] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: So Cross, what's the status on some iterations for commandos? Pending, somewhat delayed in light of possible native regen changes as they would have some impact on the question. Primary outline at this point however is a focus on improved fitting ability as a first pass followed by a deeper look at the applied skill buffs if/as needed. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1978	Posted - 2014.10.22 07:58:00 - [170] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: So Cross, what's the status on some iterations for commandos? Pending, somewhat delayed in light of possible native regen changes as they would have some impact on the question. Primary outline at this point however is a focus on improved fitting ability as a first pass followed by a deeper look at the applied skill buffs if/as needed. As far as fitting goes, giving Cal an extra low and the rest an extra high with extra fitting would do wonders for making them more viable. But I definitely feel like, if we keep them as heavy suits, they need to be about regen, while sentinels need to be about raw hp. Mercs whine about the rail rifle but refuse to shield tank to counter it. But that's none of my business.

Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3398	Posted - 2014.10.22 08:18:00 - [171] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: So Cross, what's the status on some iterations for commandos? Pending, somewhat delayed in light of possible native regen changes as they would have some impact on the question. Primary outline at this point however is a focus on improved fitting ability as a first pass followed by a deeper look at the applied skill buffs if/as needed. As far as fitting goes, giving Cal an extra low and the rest an extra high with extra fitting would do wonders for making them more viable. But I definitely feel like, if we keep them as heavy suits, they need to be about regen, while sentinels need to be about raw hp. From the total feedback I have received keeping the Commando less tanked than the sentinel seems to be the trend. Thus as you say letting the Commando get their eHP via regen more than raw buffer, much as the Logistics frame would get its eHP via regen rather than the raw buffer of the Assault in the medium frame line. Keeping this arc allows more role uniqueness which also improves balance be removing or at least mitigating zero sum relationships between suits/roles. Making sure that this pardigm is present within both the Mando/Sent, and Logi/As line further promotes uniqueness by adding an element of contrast to the Assault Commando comparison. So yes, the intent is to keep the Commando as the heavy frame it is, but no "as heavy" as the Sentinel. Which is part of why iteration here is going to be effected by the results of this thread. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3833	Posted - 2014.10.22 09:10:00 - [172] - Quote It's a good start Cross. Please pass along my complements to theDev team. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
KA24DERT TeamPlayers Negative-Feedback 674	Posted - 2014.10.23 01:45:00 - [173] - Quote Minmando here, Mass Driver + Plasma Cannon. I don't think I've had more fun in Dust before speccing into Minmatar Commando. I love the existing bonuses as-is and wouldn't change those. I would like the suit to be a bit more tankable, the bigger hitbox makes the suit melt, but I worry that would further displace assaults. Or is the slowness of the commando enough of a drawback to merit a bonus to repping?
Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1133	Posted - 2014.10.23 01:52:00 - [174] - Quote I don't even use my Ammando. I feel that the assault is superior even with the mando having damage boost Pokemon master and Tekken Lord Gk0 Scout yay :) Pls fix SCR CCP
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 160	Posted - 2014.10.23 01:57:00 - [175] - Quote Yea every pretty much everything is better than the armando at using lazers cause of the slots, but i like haveing my shotty too the lazer is just the bate...mwaahhaahahaa MWHAHAHAHJAJAJ The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Im a wizard
The Master Race Immortal Guides 160	Posted - 2014.10.23 01:57:00 - [176] - Quote Yea every pretty much everything is better than the armando at using lazers cause of the slots, but i like haveing my shotty too the lazer is just the bate...mwaahhaahahaa MWHAHAHAHJAJAJ The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13760	Posted - 2014.10.23 02:15:00 - [177] - Quote SCREW YOU ALL AMMANDO IS NOT WHAT ITS CALLED. WERE NOT GODDAMN SCRUBBY SCOUT HIPSTERS IN HERE! MAN THE **** UP! "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3853	Posted - 2014.10.23 05:13:00 - [178] - Quote Amarr are all scrubby scout hipsters. Don't lie. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3447	Posted - 2014.10.23 10:55:00 - [179] - Quote New info to keep in mind for balance considerations moving forward. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Firbolg Barun Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 54	Posted - 2014.10.23 10:59:00 - [180] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: New info to keep in mind for balance considerations moving forward. Now, give gal commando 4 lows, and similar fitting capabilities as a heavy. Then we will have commandos being the best rep-tankers in Dust. Base: 3 hp/s Mods: 4x armor repairers = 37.5 hp/s Sum: 40.5 hp/s Is it cool? YEAH. Is this OP? No.

DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 5521	Posted - 2014.10.23 11:11:00 - [181] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: All they need is a grenade slot. Exactly. The AV creed, "We don't do it because it's easy; we do it because it's hard!"
Coleman Gray Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 1238	Posted - 2014.10.23 11:19:00 - [182] - Quote Well currently only got Lvl 5 in Gallente and Minmatar Commando's as well as lvl 3 in Caldari. Never felt like the suit wasn't viable since the racials was all added in, but with the recent assault HP buff, perhaps a similar buff for Commando's may bring them upto speed, or perhaps just a cpu/pgu increase as well as the extra mod slot to bring the Commando's fittings to their Sentinel Counter parts. Original Commando, before all you posers just saying
Spectral Clone Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 2927	Posted - 2014.10.23 12:14:00 - [183] - Quote Coleman Gray wrote: Well currently only got Lvl 5 in Gallente and Minmatar Commando's as well as lvl 3 in Caldari. Never felt like the suit wasn't viable since the racials was all added in, but with the recent assault HP buff, perhaps a similar buff for Commando's may bring them upto speed, or perhaps just a cpu/pgu increase as well as the extra mod slot to bring the Commando's fittings to their Sentinel Counter parts. Why commandos have less slots, less fittings rom and less hp does boggle my mind. Either it gets more slots (1 more moduler) compared to the sentinel and keep the current Hp, or it should get similar Base Hp as a sentinel, same amount of slots, but no resistance bonuses. Either was, it needs more Cpu/Pg if more slots are given. Fix mouse support in Dust 514! How to do it: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=965407#post965407
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 607	Posted - 2014.10.23 12:23:00 - [184] - Quote Any chance we can get the damage bonus increases to 3 or 4% per level?
Savage Mangler Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 175	Posted - 2014.10.23 20:03:00 - [185] - Quote Firbolg Barun wrote: Cross Atu wrote: New info to keep in mind for balance considerations moving forward. Now, give gal commando 4 lows, and similar fitting capabilities as a heavy. Then we will have commandos being the best rep-tankers in Dust. Base: 3 hp/s Mods: 4x armor repairers = 37.5 hp/s Sum: 40.5 hp/s Is it cool? YEAH. Is this OP? No. Pretty much how I run my Galmando. Plates are too cumbersome therefore reps is the only way to go. Fits the suppression role very, allowing you to pop out, spray some rounds and return to cover with very little problems. A proto galmando can rep the entirety of his armor back in 20 seconds or less with 3 complex reppers. -YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED- "Good, then they'll know who killed them." Salvation...through Annihilation
Vance Vyth G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 80	Posted - 2014.10.24 01:36:00 - [186] - Quote I run commando exclusively I feel as if they should have more of a suppression role; be more about survival. commando's should have a more "solo" persona in mind. (a¦ê+ä-£a¦ê) n++Gö¦pâçGòÉGÇö _ - (a¦Ñ_a¦Ñ) "+60"
Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1140	Posted - 2014.10.24 01:41:00 - [187] - Quote True Adamance wrote: SCREW YOU ALL AMMANDO IS NOT WHAT ITS CALLED. WERE NOT GODDAMN SCRUBBY SCOUT HIPSTERS IN HERE! MAN THE **** UP! lol ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando ammando Pokemon master and Tekken Lord Gk0 Scout yay :)
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 165	Posted - 2014.10.24 02:18:00 - [188] - Quote One ammando is miss spelled how long did it take you to find it? The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
The Master Race Immortal Guides 183	Posted - 2014.10.24 02:18:00 - [189] - Quote One ammando is miss spelled how long did it take you to find it? The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3455	Posted - 2014.10.24 03:31:00 - [190] - Quote Let's table the great nomenclature debate for the moment and refocus on the suit How significant in the scheme of things do you mercs feel the recent native rep changes are for the various racial commandos? See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13815	Posted - 2014.10.24 03:35:00 - [191] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Let's table the great nomenclature debate for the moment and refocus on the suit How significant in the scheme of things do you mercs feel the recent native rep changes are for the various racial commandos? Since I don't much are for native reps I'll let someone else field this one. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Gabriella Grey THE HANDS OF DEATH RUST415 199	Posted - 2014.10.24 05:13:00 - [192] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Input and feedback is being sought regarding the state of Commandos within Dust, and how to polish the experience. When responding to this thread please note your primary role / primary context for use of each item being commented on so that proper context can be applied. Cheers, Cross PS ~ Commandos are something I know comparatively little about, so please do your best to be detailed and constructive so that I am able to provide the very best feedback and ideas to CCP. Thanks Proto Amarr Commando! I bring the holy light to all of the non believers 7th Fleet style! Currently I like how the commando is. It is not really an all out offensive suit but it is also not all defense, rather something in between, depending on what is needed. For long range I like to anoint the enemy with my laser rifle, and for CQC (Thanks Stefan and King Checkmate), I will use the assault scrambler rifle. The only thing I think that could actually make commandos better is allowing them better sprint speed to keep up with assaults. I have always wanted them to have better armor repair since the slot layouts on them were always limited, but that is coming soon from what I have read. One thing that could really make it feel right at home would be since commandos are really a repurposed heavy suit, make it so that they have commando only hybrid modules. My example would be like a damage modifier/precision enhancer modifier. or an shield regulator/armor repair module. *Always Grey Skies* Leader of the Alpaca Commandos
Meee One Amakakeru-Ryu-no-Hirameki 1191	Posted - 2014.10.26 18:39:00 - [193] - Quote Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Official Blueberry of the Forums. Title given by my #1 fan Sgt Kirk.
danthrax martin Immortal Guides 165	Posted - 2014.10.26 22:54:00 - [194] - Quote I would like to see some kind of fitting cost reduction. Be it reps or equipment. I'm sooo close to my perfect fit. I run a swarm/br ar fit with range and reps in mind. Would love to fit my triage or allotek hive without as much sacrifice. Pro Galmando - Gal Sentinel Suicidal A/V Moron I shall overcome spellcheck
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1448	Posted - 2014.10.27 00:02:00 - [195] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Let's table the great nomenclature debate for the moment and refocus on the suit How significant in the scheme of things do you mercs feel the recent native rep changes are for the various racial commandos? It probably helps the minmatar commando the most and cal commando 2ndmost because they have very 'goofy' fittings thanks to slot layouts. Though I'm not quite certain that it shores up all of the Minmatar commando's problems, I firmly believe that in order for any suit to be 'competitive' it must have a minimum of 2 lows (preferably 3) offset by 3 highs (2 highs can get it done if there's 3 lows). Right now the damage race between commando's and assaults is very comparable however assaults bring a lot more to the table in terms of defensive/regenerative stats and commando's bring more in terms of 'utility' and weaponry. In the long run I don't think the native reps will change much if anything for commando's. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 178	Posted - 2014.10.27 00:40:00 - [196] - Quote Despite the many down sides to the commando the down time is by far the worse as someone said earlier I in the time it takes my my health to return can easily watch 3 team mates die and do. I still don't understand why we do not have grenades that extra half pound was just to much? Edit: LR/SG A-1 C The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
The Master Race Immortal Guides 183	Posted - 2014.10.27 00:40:00 - [197] - Quote Despite the many down sides to the commando the down time is by far the worse as someone said earlier I in the time it takes my my health to return can easily watch 3 team mates die and do. I still don't understand why we do not have grenades that extra half pound was just to much? Edit: LR/SG A-1 C Edit2: As a Laser rifle user a lot of bullets come my way and in a thick fire fight I have as much down time as I do up time if not more. The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4005	Posted - 2014.10.27 07:57:00 - [198] - Quote Native reps are going to have minimal net effect upon actual gameplay. Mostly my opinion is that commandos are basically bonused as assaults for fatties without giving them a separate role. It's like they were designed so that heavy suits could assault without having to drop points into assault. I know that's not the design intent but it's what the default uses of the suits seem to drop into. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 182	Posted - 2014.10.27 15:35:00 - [199] - Quote I created a thread side seat commando that would give the class its own area of game play for sure if it can be done. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2385448#post2385448 The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk
The Master Race Immortal Guides 183	Posted - 2014.10.27 15:35:00 - [200] - Quote I created a thread side seat commando that would give the class its own area of game play for sure if it can be done. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2385448#post2385448 The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk

Ku Shala The Generals 989	Posted - 2014.10.27 16:22:00 - [201] - Quote its a heavy suit let it carry a heavy weapon and a light weapon at the cost of hp *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (Caldari Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist *Assault -Logistics-Sentinal-Scout-Commando Allround CK-0
XxVEXESxX 34	Posted - 2014.10.27 17:53:00 - [202] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Let's table the great nomenclature debate for the moment and refocus on the suit How significant in the scheme of things do you mercs feel the recent native rep changes are for the various racial commandos? I think you will have to nerf me after the changes. Lol But I cant think of anything that could help the suit aside from either an extra equipment slot or slightly and I mean at most 1 sec better delays. Adding highs or lows would throw off ehp and damage numbers since the repair added tomorrow is pretty much a free module. Front line suppression support? PSN: XxVEXESxX Minmatar loyalist MK.0 A/C/L
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4021	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:01:00 - [203] - Quote Ku Shala wrote: its a heavy suit let it carry a heavy weapon and a light weapon at the cost of hp Because we all know NOTHING could possibly go wrong with this plan. Forge +swarms/PLC, here I come! EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Ku Shala The Generals 989	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:37:00 - [204] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Because we all know NOTHING could possibly go wrong with this plan. Forge +swarms/PLC, here I come! good luck killing a scout with swarms or a forge with no splash *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (Caldari Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist *Assault -Logistics-Sentinal-Scout-Commando Allround CK-0
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4022	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:43:00 - [205] - Quote Ku Shala wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Because we all know NOTHING could possibly go wrong with this plan. Forge +swarms/PLC, here I come! good luck killing a scout with your swarms or a forge with no splash or any other infantry for that matter. Yes because the sidearm is so very effective. I use an assault forge. It's easier to splash the scouts to death than try to kill them with a bolt pistol. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Ku Shala The Generals 989	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:47:00 - [206] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: [ Yes because the sidearm is so very effective. I use an assault forge. It's easier to splash the scouts to death than try to kill them with a bolt pistol. so you dont play this and/or haven't realized that the forge does not splash? direct hit only *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (Caldari Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist *Assault -Logistics-Sentinal-Scout-Commando Allround CK-0
Dremel wp Shadow Company HQ Lokun Listamenn 45	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:47:00 - [207] - Quote How about built in ammo regen? No grenade slot ,so no 'nade spam. Lets commando use their equipment slot for something other than nanohives. I'm thinking something slow like 1-2%/sec.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4022	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:48:00 - [208] - Quote Ku Shala wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: [ Yes because the sidearm is so very effective. I use an assault forge. It's easier to splash the scouts to death than try to kill them with a bolt pistol. so you dont play this and/or haven't realized that the forge does not splash? direct hit only for the last goddamn time, Assault forge Guns have retained the splash. Keep up and don't try to correct me on anything regarding how sentinels and heavy weapons work. You're going to wind up looking like an idiot. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Ku Shala The Generals 989	Posted - 2014.10.27 18:57:00 - [209] - Quote or you could explain why my Idea would be op instead of being a troll all the time.maybe learn how to aim instead of spam splashing infantry to death with an av weapon. *-¦a+ó a+ú-Æa+äla+ä (Caldari Specialist)* Caldari Loyalist *Assault -Logistics-Sentinal-Scout-Commando Allround CK-0
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 184	Posted - 2014.10.27 19:01:00 - [210] - Quote The assault forge serves to many purposes area denial/AV/sniper so with the light slot for assault there is no role you could not apply with one singular suit and fit. The miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.Wizard Talk

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4026	Posted - 2014.10.27 19:06:00 - [211] - Quote Ku Shala wrote: or you could explain why my Idea would be op instead of being a troll all the time.maybe learn how to aim instead of spam splashing infantry to death with an av weapon. Allow me to break this down to you shotgun style. I use an assault forge gun with a fire time of 2.25 seconds. I can take a python's shields out in 2 shots, and while he's starting evasive maneuvers I can put two swarm shots away instead of having to connect with a third. He will never get away. period. end. Same with a Madrugar. Swarms do more damage. i can hotrack 3 light damage mods and thump him twice with a forge then annihilate it by flashing swarms. And finally, I only splash 1/10 enemy dropsuits with any forge. Almost every kill I get is a single-hit bodyshot that not even a bricktanked gallente sentinel can survive. I figured out how to use an assault forge as a CQC breach tool back when goons did PC. I do it every so often to enrage people. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13851	Posted - 2014.10.27 20:04:00 - [212] - Quote Meee One wrote: Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Aero suggested this 5 months ago when created a number of posts trying to redefine the role of the Commando. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 2049	Posted - 2014.10.27 20:10:00 - [213] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Let's table the great nomenclature debate for the moment and refocus on the suit How significant in the scheme of things do you mercs feel the recent native rep changes are for the various racial commandos? Not very game changing. Sure, I don't need to fit a repper on my Calmanndo anymore, but other than the ability to fit a regulator instead of a reactive plate, not much really has changed. Don't give me wrong, it's a great convenience, but its not like it's going to catapult commandos to the forefront of the best suits in the game. I still think an extra slot with pg/cpu for it commandos will be in a good spot. Proof that Rattati/CCP do listen to the playerbase.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3521	Posted - 2014.10.27 20:10:00 - [214] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Meee One wrote: Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Aero suggested this 5 months ago when created a number of posts trying to redefine the role of the Commando. Any chance you have links on hand? I don't know that I saw those posts and I'd love to give them a look. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13851	Posted - 2014.10.27 20:14:00 - [215] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: True Adamance wrote: Meee One wrote: Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Aero suggested this 5 months ago when created a number of posts trying to redefine the role of the Commando. Any chance you have links on hand? I don't know that I saw those posts and I'd love to give them a look. This is one of several. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=163427 "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 520	Posted - 2014.10.27 20:30:00 - [216] - Quote Late to the party but I'd like to see a modifier on the commando frames that give better handling to kick then the other suits. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. No matter how hard CCP tries Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13859	Posted - 2014.10.27 21:27:00 - [217] - Quote NextDark Knight wrote: Late to the party but I'd like to see a modifier on the commando frames that give better handling to kick then the other suits. Dust 514 guns have next to no recoil any way...... It's not like a bonus like that is needed. "We were commanded to burn the system...We did. I mourn the loss of the innocents caught in our fires" -Kador Ouryon
jace silencerww Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 70	Posted - 2014.10.31 01:32:00 - [218] - Quote here are some thoughts. lets look at the commando vs sentinels. CPU/PG - cpu and pg are very close between them all no more than 4-8 pg and 5-10 cpu different. total ehp - the sentinals has 150- 500 ehp over the commandos heavies get in a lot of head to head fightings so ehp needed. speed - the commandos are faster but makes sense due to lower ehp and are more of a distance fighter. weapons- sentinels get hgm and forge guns but a sidearm while commando get 2 light weapons so like a fair trade. give up hmg for assault rifles but again commandos are distance fighters. grenade/eq - commandos give up a grenade for the equipment slot but again a fair trade. slots - the sentinels get ONE more high or low slot then the commandos. why? what do the commandos get for this lost of a slot...
Doshneil Antaro Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 288	Posted - 2014.10.31 07:42:00 - [219] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: True Adamance wrote: Meee One wrote: Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Aero suggested this 5 months ago when created a number of posts trying to redefine the role of the Commando. Any chance you have links on hand? I don't know that I saw those posts and I'd love to give them a look. Mee One suggestion about would work for the gallente and amar. but through brut power the cal sniper/ rail rifle already achieve this as well as the minni MD/swarm. MY main is medic minni but have/ had alts to in every suit every vehicle to test and understand the capabilities and understand the mindset of all opponents on the field. If Ionly played one toon I would have over 65 mill sp easily. Cal commando long range and damage can out perform any long distance shooter as anti infantry. Minnimando can perform vehicle and infantry area denial better than two suits. The other two just dont seem the have the right bonus to make their specialisation better than other suits. another issue all 4 have is slot count loss over the sentinels. This is perhaps the biggest drawback and hinders customization and leads to vanilla layouts with no room for uniqueness in loadouts. Those without max cpu, pg, and optimization (in both light weapons chosen to carry) will be stat wise outperfomed by the sentinel w/ 1 light weapon with sidarm and grenade. Grenade slot is excusable due to 2 light weapons, but 1 L/H slot is a huge hinderence . Sage /thread
jace silencerww Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 72	Posted - 2014.10.31 13:39:00 - [220] - Quote Doshneil Antaro wrote: Cross Atu wrote: True Adamance wrote: Meee One wrote: Be for warned,i don't use lolmandos but i just thought of this crazy idea. Everyone says commandos are suppression fighters,i think this is very vague. Snipers can suppress,scouts can suppress,assaults can suppress,etc. How about refining that definition? commandos could be bombardment suppression. Focused on getting as many rounds on the enemy as possible. sacrifice:damage increase. Gain:50-75% faster reload speed 100% ammunition capacity for racial weapons. The one thing everyone seems to forget is that commandos are heavies too,and they sacrifice armor not ammo. With this,commandos could launch seemingly endless rounds at enemies keeping them effectively suppressed through bombardment. 2 birds 1 stone. Aero suggested this 5 months ago when created a number of posts trying to redefine the role of the Commando. Any chance you have links on hand? I don't know that I saw those posts and I'd love to give them a look. Mee One suggestion about would work for the gallente and amar. but through brut power the cal sniper/ rail rifle already achieve this as well as the minni MD/swarm. MY main is medic minni but have/ had alts to in every suit every vehicle to test and understand the capabilities and understand the mindset of all opponents on the field. If Ionly played one toon I would have over 65 mill sp easily. Cal commando long range and damage can out perform any long distance shooter as anti infantry. Minnimando can perform vehicle and infantry area denial better than two suits. The other two just dont seem the have the right bonus to make their specialisation better than other suits. another issue all 4 have is slot count loss over the sentinels. This is perhaps the biggest drawback and hinders customization and leads to vanilla layouts with no room for uniqueness in loadouts. Those without max cpu, pg, and optimization (in both light weapons chosen to carry) will be stat wise outperfomed by the sentinel w/ 1 light weapon with sidarm and grenade. Grenade slot is excusable due to 2 light weapons, but 1 L/H slot is a huge hinderence . true but sentinels get the hmg and forge guns along with any light weapon/sidearm combo. easier if you read my post in ahead of yours.

Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3661	Posted - 2014.11.01 09:19:00 - [221] - Quote Proposal link added to the OP. In light of the recent changes to native reps, and in the interests of iterative balance, I have kept the proposed changes to a minimum at this time. It is my intent to revisit the status of the Commando, with a specific eye to any need for polishing racial/role skill buffs after we have had a chance to assess the effects of these proposed changes. With that in mind, I look forward to your input on the status of my proposed first step. Cheers, Cross See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4292	Posted - 2014.11.01 10:01:00 - [222] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Proposal link added to the OP. In light of the recent changes to native reps, and in the interests of iterative balance, I have kept the proposed changes to a minimum at this time. It is my intent to revisit the status of the Commando, with a specific eye to any need for polishing racial/role skill buffs after we have had a chance to assess the effects of these proposed changes. With that in mind, I look forward to your input on the status of my proposed first step. Cheers, Cross PG/CPU is too tight. Your proposal brings a net gain of zero. One of the problems endemic to commando is that CPU/PG is the tightest of any dropsuit due to two light weapons. Light weapons range up to 5x the fitting of a sidearm. In this case for most commandos the current fits wouldn't change usefully. Example: my amarr commando must completely forgo equipment. It is level 3. Advanced weapons + 4 advanced fittings eats every bit of available fitting. Granted I dont have the light weapon fitting optimization skills and the cpu reduction skill is at 3. Even at + your proposal doesn't allow enough leeway to fit for the fifth slots. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1499	Posted - 2014.11.01 10:10:00 - [223] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Proposal link added to the OP. In light of the recent changes to native reps, and in the interests of iterative balance, I have kept the proposed changes to a minimum at this time. It is my intent to revisit the status of the Commando, with a specific eye to any need for polishing racial/role skill buffs after we have had a chance to assess the effects of these proposed changes. With that in mind, I look forward to your input on the status of my proposed first step. Cheers, Cross Nothing wrong with your proposal, it seems okay but I'd much see the slots proposed later in this post, also slot changes obviously requires an increase to pg/cpu for the suits in question. I've also heard a lot of complaints from gallente and caldari commando's that they have absurdly low stamina (I'd like to see ewar/other stat changes discussed, but it's not a priority at the moment). Bracketed values are proposed changes from current. Basic Com C-I = 2H 1L (+1L) (this is incredibly important, even with native reps not having a low slot is very harmful to a suit) Basic Com G-I = 1H 2L (+1H) Basic Com M-I = 1H 2L (+1L) normally I'd propose an extra high, but I'm a bit concerned about the MinCom's damage potential with swarms Basic Com A-I = 1H 2L (+1L) Most of these are just QoL changes or reinforce racial tanking at lower sp levels, exception for the minmatar it's mostly a decision in regards to 2 lows being greatly superior to 2 highs in regards to suit survivability. Adv Com C/1 = 3H 1L (+1H) Adv Com G/1 = 1H 3L (+1L) Adv Com M/1 = 2H 2L (+1L) Adv Com A/1 = 1H 3L (+1L) Advanced aside from minmatar are flipped from the basics , simply to reinforce tanking types Pro Com Ck.0 = 3H 2L (+1L) helps make calcom overall more durable by allowing it to fit something like a shield reg to cope with pretty long delays) Pro Com Gk.0 = 2H 3L (+1H) should make the galcom a little punchier which might help even out the arms race between it and assault Pro Com Mk.0 = 3H 2L (+1H) Should reinforce some racial tanking, though I am worried about people slapping another damage mod on for swarms. Pro Com Ak.0 = 2H 3L (+1H) The high slot here is mostly to solidify the amarr commando as a hard hitter (much like gal) and allow it greater diversity when using non-racial AV weapons (AV seems to be a primary goal on most commanders) Overall I'd like to see proto commando's sport a very 'balanced' set of slots, even if it may not be the most racially accurate thing, because on the commandos with 1 high assaults actually beat them for damage with racial weapons (18.04% from 3 7% damage mods vs 17.7% on commando, a second damage mod would bring them up to 24.87% with racial weaponry). On the commando's with low lowslot values it drastically limits ones ability to be 'in the field' even with the native armor rep changes, adding lowslots allows for kincats or cardiac regs allowing them to be a bit more than just a one trick pony. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4292	Posted - 2014.11.01 10:14:00 - [224] - Quote Not changing PG/CPU to account for yhe new slots will exacerbate the problems with commandos. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3661	Posted - 2014.11.01 10:59:00 - [225] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Not changing PG/CPU to account for yhe new slots will exacerbate the problems with commandos. I've avoided altering PG/CPU values at this time due to the parity with Sentinel suits, since in some cases normalizing PG/CPU of Commandos to Sentinel levels would actually result in a reduction of the raw stats. I acknowledge that a fittings shift in PG/CPU has a significant likelihood of being called for but I would rather have game data to support that before recommending a change which would push Commando fittings levels beyond those of the - recently deemed to be too substantial and thus scaled down - values of the Sentinels who are sporting the same High/Low slot layouts. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 626	Posted - 2014.11.01 11:17:00 - [226] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Not changing PG/CPU to account for yhe new slots will exacerbate the problems with commandos. I've avoided altering PG/CPU values at this time due to the parity with Sentinel suits, since in some cases normalizing PG/CPU of Commandos to Sentinel levels would actually result in a reduction of the raw stats. I acknowledge that a fittings shift in PG/CPU has a significant likelihood of being called for but I would rather have game data to support that before recommending a change which would push Commando fittings levels beyond those of the - recently deemed to be too substantial and thus scaled down - values of the Sentinels who are sporting the same High/Low slot layouts. hey man, commando suits are tight on fittings already. i cant think of anything i could put in that extra slot without more cpu/pg
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3661	Posted - 2014.11.01 11:27:00 - [227] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Cross Atu wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Not changing PG/CPU to account for yhe new slots will exacerbate the problems with commandos. I've avoided altering PG/CPU values at this time due to the parity with Sentinel suits, since in some cases normalizing PG/CPU of Commandos to Sentinel levels would actually result in a reduction of the raw stats. I acknowledge that a fittings shift in PG/CPU has a significant likelihood of being called for but I would rather have game data to support that before recommending a change which would push Commando fittings levels beyond those of the - recently deemed to be too substantial and thus scaled down - values of the Sentinels who are sporting the same High/Low slot layouts. hey man, commando suits are tight on fittings already. i cant think of anything i could put in that extra slot without more cpu/pg As stated in my prior post, I am taking feedback for proposed cpu/pg value changes - both suggested numbers and the rational for same - and consider it likely a change there will be called for as well. It is, however, something that requires quite a bit more support and analysis to push the Commando above current Sent fittings values (especially when those values were recently deemed excessive and scaled down) than simply to recommend bringing the Commandos up to the same level as their heavy counterparts. CCP R appreciates numbers, spreadsheets, and data, if these can be provided and show such a larger alteration is needful then by all means provide them and I will be happy to present them. Lacking that however I must rely upon the in game data/metrics collected after a change is deployed to prove the need for further alterations. Sadly I lack sufficient first hand use of the Commando races at present to generate those proposed numbers myself, at least with any confidence, so I will need to lean on community work to supply those. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3662	Posted - 2014.11.01 11:30:00 - [228] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: this also doesnt make commandos better regen tankers in the case of the cal commando, since its regen abilities are tied to its god awful base shield recharge and shield delays. the delays need to be cut to 2 second shield delay and 3 second depleted shield delay with a base shield recharge of 40 hp/s to be better than cal assault or cal sentinels at regen tanking I'll do a side by side work up on comparative shield regen rates within the races, thank you for reminding me of that aspect, I apologize for the omission. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4295	Posted - 2014.11.01 11:44:00 - [229] - Quote Honestly the suits need a PG/CPU increase sufficient to fit the preferred racial regen unit in a low slot at the appropriate tier with average skills. Gallente/amarr an armor rep or another reactive. Cal/min either a regulator or recharger/energizer. I don't have the numbers in front of me. Push my agendas cross and I'll make you do less math! EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 626	Posted - 2014.11.01 12:45:00 - [230] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: this also doesnt make commandos better regen tankers in the case of the cal commando, since its regen abilities are tied to its god awful base shield recharge and shield delays. the delays need to be cut to 2 second shield delay and 3 second depleted shield delay with a base shield recharge of 40 hp/s to be better than cal assault or cal sentinels at regen tanking I'll do a side by side work up on comparative shield regen rates within the races, thank you for reminding me of that aspect, I apologize for the omission. already done good sir https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12sLzo5L0z0h4ZtzlchycjfoQj5PSinbFVWbLzdVfLQw/edit?usp=sharing

Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3666	Posted - 2014.11.01 17:11:00 - [231] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Cross Atu wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: this also doesnt make commandos better regen tankers in the case of the cal commando, since its regen abilities are tied to its god awful base shield recharge and shield delays. the delays need to be cut to 2 second shield delay and 3 second depleted shield delay with a base shield recharge of 40 hp/s to be better than cal assault or cal sentinels at regen tanking I'll do a side by side work up on comparative shield regen rates within the races, thank you for reminding me of that aspect, I apologize for the omission. already done good sir https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12sLzo5L0z0h4ZtzlchycjfoQj5PSinbFVWbLzdVfLQw/edit?usp=sharing Thank you very much, updating the primary sheet now o7 See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 2099	Posted - 2014.11.01 19:19:00 - [232] - Quote Cross, I made a sheet for use to make the iterations for commandos. It's basically your logistics iteration sheets with some changes to make it relevant to commandos. No change values are listed, this is just the base sheet with current values already in place. The sheet. Proof that Rattati/CCP do listen to the playerbase.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 633	Posted - 2014.11.03 06:04:00 - [233] - Quote here's a question, do we want commandos to be better regen tankers or the best regen tankers? if we make them better, then we can put them in between scouts, but i dont think thats where we going with this since gal commando has the nest native armor regen. so that said, are were going to change scouts at all, to make them less effective at regen tanking? cause then we can just switch the cal and min scout shield regen over the their respective commando suits. they would be the best shield regen suits, but not as mobile. this would be ok with me.
Cross Atu OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3724	Posted - 2014.11.05 10:15:00 - [234] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: here's a question, do we want commandos to be better regen tankers or the best regen tankers? if we make them better, then we can put them in between scouts, but i dont think thats where we going with this since gal commando has the nest native armor regen. so that said, are were going to change scouts at all, to make them less effective at regen tanking? cause then we can just switch the cal and min scout shield regen over the their respective commando suits. they would be the best shield regen suits, but not as mobile. this would be ok with me. My current impression (and this is of course open for feedback from the thread) is as follows. From the opening of the thread these changes are the most direct steps to improve Commando role and viability. 1. Make them better at regen (and the best heavy suit) 2. Make them better at fitting (normalize slots with sent, improve cpu/pg as needed) 3. Make them more mobile (like sta pool increase as a first element because it also enhances their 'fist of death' ) As things stand now 1. Native reps are a good move, finding a proper up tune for shields should be looked at 2. Slots seem like a given, cpu/pg seems like a high level probability with the question being more of one degree (roughly one mods worth more seems like a good starting point for discussion) 3. Bears further discussion, may or may not be needed, would like to keep the conversation open but may be held until a further iteration after we see the effects of other changes 4. Skill buffs - much more complex in assessment and/or alteration - unless there is a compelling reason otherwise this one I'd consider a 'don't touch it till later' aspect to be refined after sufficient data from the above changes has been gathered in game. Again I want to be completely clear that - current impression - isn't meant to mean "set is stone" and I welcome ongoing conversation. That being said I am heavily inclined to keep an iterative method as a focal point because we've all seen what a mess overly sweeping changes can cause. See a cool idea thread? Mail me the title and I'll take a look =)
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 639	Posted - 2014.11.08 11:23:00 - [235] - Quote native armor reps seem to be in a good place right now across commandos. they currently already have best native reps for their races. the new stats due for this tuesday will improve gallente native reps further. (5hp/s) shield regen needs work. (shield recharge, shield delay/depleted shield delay) caldari: 40hp/s, 4/5 minmatar: 30hp/s, 5/6 gallente: 25hp/s, 6/8 amarr: 25hp/s, 6/8 increased stamina pool would certainly help with mobility and melee. its a good idea that id like to see happen. when we do the ewar balancing, maybe we can get increased scan radius? it helps with being able to react to threats if we can get early warning of them. they dont need to be crazy, but maybe +5m would be ok?
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 639	Posted - 2014.11.08 11:27:00 - [236] - Quote apparently we can have more than two bonuses. so if and when we get to that, i think the best thing would to simply add a 3rd bonus to commandos instead of removing any current bonuses
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 4690	Posted - 2014.11.08 14:42:00 - [237] - Quote No Cross, the commando damage bonusing needs another pass. The DPS benefit over a similar assault is right around 2% given similar damage mods setups. The Amarr Commando is of particular note in that it cannot compete with the assault AT ALL due to tge assault heat reduction. People fixate on the commando damage bonus but all it does is allow offensive parity with assaults, not offensive superiority. You see the most egregious example of this when people talk about the minmatar commando utilizing swarms. A minmatar commando with two damage mods kills with explosives at the EXACT SAME number of shots as a triple modded assault suit. The damage bar seems to move faster, TTK does not change. The amarr commando is particularly obnoxious in that it gets only one damage mod slot where the assault gets 3. The assault also gets up to 25% heat reduction. This means the commando has lower potential DPS per shot as well as suffering lower sustained fire time. The damage bonus currently provides only a placebo effect, not an actual advantage. Until this is addressed in one form or another, or the commandos have a clear operational advantage that cannot be negated by a standard assault fit then the class will not be balanced. EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 639	Posted - 2014.11.08 17:54:00 - [238] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: No Cross, the commando damage bonusing needs another pass. The DPS benefit over a similar assault is right around 2% given similar damage mods setups. The Amarr Commando is of particular note in that it cannot compete with the assault AT ALL due to tge assault heat reduction. People fixate on the commando damage bonus but all it does is allow offensive parity with assaults, not offensive superiority. You see the most egregious example of this when people talk about the minmatar commando utilizing swarms. A minmatar commando with two damage mods kills with explosives at the EXACT SAME number of shots as a triple modded assault suit. The damage bar seems to move faster, TTK does not change. The amarr commando is particularly obnoxious in that it gets only one damage mod slot where the assault gets 3. The assault also gets up to 25% heat reduction. This means the commando has lower potential DPS per shot as well as suffering lower sustained fire time. The damage bonus currently provides only a placebo effect, not an actual advantage. Until this is addressed in one form or another, or the commandos have a clear operational advantage that cannot be negated by a standard assault fit then the class will not be balanced. give them an additional 1% per level to rate of fire edit: give amarr, 3% reduction to heat build up per level instead of an additional rof bonus
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 227	Posted - 2014.11.08 18:09:00 - [239] - Quote ak - minus overheat dmg ck - minus recoil gk - minus charge up time mk - minus trajectory ?? Check out the film Flame and Citron it is amazing! Wizard Talk
137H4RGIC Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 279	Posted - 2014.11.08 23:24:00 - [240] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: Input and feedback is being sought regarding the state of Commandos within Dust, and how to polish the experience. When responding to this thread please note your primary role / primary context for use of each item being commented on so that proper context can be applied. Cheers, Cross PS ~ Commandos are something I know comparatively little about, so please do your best to be detailed and constructive so that I am able to provide the very best feedback and ideas to CCP. Thanks Proposal Iteration #1 <--- Currently taking community feedback, shield regen numbers pending. Seeking suggested spreadsheet numbers and reasoning for cpu/pg changes if/as needed to compliment this proposal. Primary: Tl:Dr. Class is too slow for frontline combat. I have been trying to master the Minmitar Commando I always rock the Combat Rifle for general fire support. The commando isn't as agile as it needs to be for a gunfight and its hitboxes are high, to compensate I generally avoid Conventional combat unless I get the drop on the enemy. Even then with the limited magazine of a combat rifle, the battle is tricky. Secondary and Meta Slots: Tl:Dr. Equipping damage mods and AV is essential to be a successful commando that suits its versatility.. My secondary slot is also usually the Swarm Launchers since most people on my team don't carry sufficient AV to ward off enemy tanks or dropships and my missile launchers are pretty good at that when I have complex damage mods equipped with Minmitar Commando V. I am forced to equip armor mods for any chance of survival, and I can just forget about complex armor plates as it makes a gunfighting class (my intended role for it) too cumbersome to engage in these strafe fights which everyone relies on for survival. Nanohives are hands down a necessity. Application: The role is working as intended and going from a career sentinel to a much weaker, slightly faster, precision class has been something of an adjustment. I'm almost as slow as a heavy without the resistances, making me an easy target for anyone within 80 meters really. The only function that I've found successful at completing my role is to stay in the shadows and attack apart from the main group as I've said before, commandos go down easy and it isn't before long when someone else targets me. And I have to pull back. I'm either brick tanked, which isn't good, or I have armor reps which leaves me way too squishy. So what I use is a Reactive plate and a ferroscale plate to try and combat this issue. D.U.S.T. Don't Underestimate Stupid Tryhards...

Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 2119	Posted - 2014.11.09 01:43:00 - [241] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: No Cross, the commando damage bonusing needs another pass. The DPS benefit over a similar assault is right around 2% given similar damage mods setups. The Amarr Commando is of particular note in that it cannot compete with the assault AT ALL due to tge assault heat reduction. People fixate on the commando damage bonus but all it does is allow offensive parity with assaults, not offensive superiority. You see the most egregious example of this when people talk about the minmatar commando utilizing swarms. A minmatar commando with two damage mods kills with explosives at the EXACT SAME number of shots as a triple modded assault suit. The damage bar seems to move faster, TTK does not change. The amarr commando is particularly obnoxious in that it gets only one damage mod slot where the assault gets 3. The assault also gets up to 25% heat reduction. This means the commando has lower potential DPS per shot as well as suffering lower sustained fire time. The damage bonus currently provides only a placebo effect, not an actual advantage. Until this is addressed in one form or another, or the commandos have a clear operational advantage that cannot be negated by a standard assault fit then the class will not be balanced. Suppose it was bumped to 4% per level? Proof that Rattati/CCP do listen to the playerbase.
DeathwindRising ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 640	Posted - 2014.11.09 05:09:00 - [242] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: No Cross, the commando damage bonusing needs another pass. The DPS benefit over a similar assault is right around 2% given similar damage mods setups. The Amarr Commando is of particular note in that it cannot compete with the assault AT ALL due to tge assault heat reduction. People fixate on the commando damage bonus but all it does is allow offensive parity with assaults, not offensive superiority. You see the most egregious example of this when people talk about the minmatar commando utilizing swarms. A minmatar commando with two damage mods kills with explosives at the EXACT SAME number of shots as a triple modded assault suit. The damage bar seems to move faster, TTK does not change. The amarr commando is particularly obnoxious in that it gets only one damage mod slot where the assault gets 3. The assault also gets up to 25% heat reduction. This means the commando has lower potential DPS per shot as well as suffering lower sustained fire time. The damage bonus currently provides only a placebo effect, not an actual advantage. Until this is addressed in one form or another, or the commandos have a clear operational advantage that cannot be negated by a standard assault fit then the class will not be balanced. Suppose it was bumped to 4% per level? thats attractive and simple. i like it.


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