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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 14 post(s)

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8397	Posted - 2014.07.12 14:47:00 - [1] - Quote So, it's that time again. I'll be looking at Nova Knives in Hotfix Charlie, and am hoping to make some improvements for them. Here's the pili First off, I'll be trialing an increase from 2m range to 2.5m. This one isn't going in 100%, I'm hopefully going to get some testing time stabbing people around the office next week to see how it feels, might give a smaller increase if it's too much. I'll also be testing aim adhesion next week to help with tracking targets at close range. I'll look at adding a fitting optimization skill. Like other fitting optimization skills, this will decrease Nova Knife PG requirements by 5% per level, and will be a 6x skill. It will require Nova Knife Proficiency 4 to train. The skillbook will cost 774,000ISK. Finally, I'll be decreasing charge time on standard knives to 1.2 seconds, and increasing their damage by 10 to 100 to bring them in line with the other knives. Just to cut any discussion off at the pass, charging knives while sprinting is off the table. It's not going to happen, so please don't If you see any issues with any of these changes, please discuss them in this thread. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Cavani1EE7 The Rainbow Effect Dark Taboo 137	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:00:00 - [2] - Quote Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. 1337
BLOOD Ruler The Lionheart Coalition 535	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:14:00 - [3] - Quote Nice to see the knives will be in charlie. Feel the pain of my knives and the piercing pain your skull has felt to my pistol.I am the Assassin.
hfderrtgvcd Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 108	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:17:00 - [4] - Quote Please don't overdue the adhesion. I think most of us would prefer for nova knives to remain a skill weapon.
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1284	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:25:00 - [5] - Quote Good call with the adhesion, its necessary for such CQC weapons "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Lynn Beck Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 2034	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:27:00 - [6] - Quote IMO, adhesion should be a 'if they're in your screen at time of slicing, and they move, it should attempt to chase them' Is it possible to make it such that another scout(even a 2x Cx Plate) isn't just instalocked, while any moderately tanked assault(2x enhanced plate GalAsault?) is almost impossible to miss? As for the range, i have no clue how this would work, at times i've been knif'd (literally) from across a hallway, but other times i can stand right in front of someone and miss. General John Ripper -BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse. This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation
pagl1u M Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 942	Posted - 2014.07.12 15:46:00 - [7] - Quote Better range and aim adesion are good and needed. I ve never been a fan of charge while sprinting but it is a sometime it is really hard to hit someone while he is sprinting, harder then it should be. NK already needs you to sneak and almost hug your enemy without him noticing you, it shouldnt be close to impossible to hit. I see 2 options to sole this: 1 Increase walking speed if you have nk equipped (or if it d be too strong, only increase it when you have them in your Hand.) 2 when you have your nk charged and you release R1,uf you are properly aiming at your target you make a little sprint forward to hit him, (2mtr of sprint for example) Hope you will take this in consideration, sorry for my english. Minmatar loyalist!
Grimmiers 626	Posted - 2014.07.12 16:07:00 - [8] - Quote I think the hit detection is fine for nova knives. You could try making R3 melee damage with a nova knife use the uncharged damage, or act as a myrofibril giving some boost only while equipped. Also the cloaking delay should be worked on some more to not just have an animation speed increase.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3282	Posted - 2014.07.12 16:36:00 - [9] - Quote Striking with the knives slows you down. It feels like you almost come to a complete stop when you slash. Can you get rid of that? Nova Knives (STD) are also a High Risk, Low Reward item. Knifing aficionados have explained that if you want to use nova knives get the operation skill to 5 as fast as you can, Because an Minmatar Scout Operations 1 with Ishukone Nova Knives is better than Minmatar scout Operations V with basic Nova Knives. Instead of changing Nova Knives from 90 to 100, I would like to see Nova Knives at 150, ZN-28 Nova Knives at 175, and Ishukone are in a good spot. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Empress of Alts
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 6116	Posted - 2014.07.12 17:37:00 - [10] - Quote Glad to see my request for an optimization skill is getting in. The small range increase will be nice and the aim adhesion will help alleviate the problem of our narrow FOV. STD knives will still be pretty meh but a small increase is better than no increase. Thanks for looking into them. o7 Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.

BlazeXYZ xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 39	Posted - 2014.07.12 17:42:00 - [11] - Quote what race is the nova knifes and is it good on shield or armor. Just asking this cause nova knifes is the only weapon i never used in the game. It's nova knife time The Blazing Intellect Machine
Spademan The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 2148	Posted - 2014.07.12 17:45:00 - [12] - Quote BlazeXYZ wrote: what race is the nova knifes and is it good on shield or armor. Just asking this cause nova knifes is the only weapon i never used in the game. It's nova knife time It's got a unique damage profile. 100% vs either. As far as I know. I am part shovel, part man, full scout, and a little bit special. Official Time Lord of the Scout Community
RECON BY FIRE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 403	Posted - 2014.07.12 18:21:00 - [13] - Quote I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far is a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Stuff....?
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 37	Posted - 2014.07.12 18:58:00 - [14] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'll also be testing aim adhesion next week to help with tracking targets at close range. What do you mean by " aim adhesion " ? Is it an aim assist ? RECON BY FIRE wrote: I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far are a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Think the same, here is a short answer. * Knife is a fun weapon to run because it require user skill and experience. The aim bot should not implement to draw QQ later. * Would you considering increase walking speed when hold knife in hand? It is more useful in combat than AA. * 10 damage increase for Std does not change any thing, 150 is the minimum damage for single stab to be valid.
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3519	Posted - 2014.07.12 19:07:00 - [15] - Quote RedPencil wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'll also be testing aim adhesion next week to help with tracking targets at close range. What do you mean by " aim adhesion " ? Is it an aim assist ? RECON BY FIRE wrote: I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far are a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Think the same, here is a short answer. * Knife is a fun weapon to run because it require user skill and experience. The aim bot should not implement to draw QQ later. * Would you considering increase walking speed when hold knife in hand? It is more useful in combat than AA. * 10 damage increase for Std does not change any thing, 150 is the minimum damage for single stab to be valid. Your vision sticks on the guy that closes to you while using the knifes. And then you can start stabbing people like a madman.
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 37	Posted - 2014.07.12 19:29:00 - [16] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Your vision sticks on the guy that closes to you while using the knifes. And then you can start stabbing people like a madman. Yes, I'm a madman on my alt, I run min scout with knife, no rifle and flank people A_SS. Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
Not Iggy Nos Nothi 178	Posted - 2014.07.12 19:35:00 - [17] - Quote Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please people being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. IgniteableAura
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 38	Posted - 2014.07.12 20:28:00 - [18] - Quote Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. Edit: I assume you are shotguner not a knifer. We are balance knife please do not drag other weapon benefit here. * What I said is walking speed increase only "knife in your hand" hopefully, you don't have a problem with knifer dancing in front of your barrel. They can't trow knife at you right? * Reduce Backpedal will have effect other weapon and they don't want to change it. This is what Logibro said in old thread. FYI: Make the adjustment that affect only knife but not affect other weapon is the point. * Again AA on knife is bad. We don't see people QQ on knife yet because it require user skill and they admire their defeat. Shot gun already broke enough. Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3291	Posted - 2014.07.12 20:40:00 - [19] - Quote RedPencil wrote: Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. Edit: I assume you are shotguner not a knifer. We are balance knife please do not drag other weapon benefit here. * What I said is walking speed increase only "knife in your hand" hopefully, you don't have a problem with knifer dancing in front of your barrel. They can't trow knife at you right? * Reduce Backpedal will have effect other weapon and they don't want to change it. This is what Logibro said in old thread. FYI: Make the adjustment that affect only knife but not affect other weapon is the point. * Again AA on knife is bad. We don't see people QQ on knife yet because it require user skill and they admire their defeat. Shot gun already broke enough. Yes, reducing backwards movement is bad. It would fall under improving core game play mechanics. We can't be allowed to fix underlying problem, me must turn this system into a giant kluge until everything is broken or just becomes EVE-Online style of combat where there exist very little player-involvement in combat and let algorithms for aiming and damage do the job. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Empress of Alts
Lynn Beck Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 2035	Posted - 2014.07.12 21:05:00 - [20] - Quote Making knives increase speed in ANY way will simply resupt in Sentinels, brickscouts, and Amarrs just slapping them on for the CQC strafing, or for running away. Currently strafe speed is like, 90%? Make backpedal 90%, or 95%, but it needs to be less than full forward. General John Ripper -BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse. This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation

RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 39	Posted - 2014.07.12 21:22:00 - [21] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Making knives increase speed in ANY way will simply resupt in Sentinels, brickscouts, and Amarrs just slapping them on for the CQC strafing, or for running away. Currently strafe speed is like, 90%? Make backpedal 90%, or 95%, but it needs to be less than full forward. Is that "Not Iggy" is your alt? you 2 said the something without read other comment. Go back and read several comment above before you post please. I don't get why people have a problem with Sentinels hold knife while dancing. Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 137	Posted - 2014.07.12 21:26:00 - [22] - Quote id happly be knifed in the back.. im already sick of shotgunners Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone? No Mic and no time for "Squeekers" Nerf scout cloak+shotgun
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 137	Posted - 2014.07.12 21:29:00 - [23] - Quote RedPencil wrote: Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. Edit: I assume you are shotguner not a knifer. We are balance knife please do not drag other weapon benefit here. * What I said is walking speed increase only "knife in your hand" hopefully, you don't have a problem with knifer dancing in front of your barrel. They can't trow knife at you right? * Reduce Backpedal will have effect other weapon and they don't want to change it. This is what Logibro said in old thread. FYI: Make the adjustment that affect only knife but not affect other weapon is the point. * Again AA on knife is bad. We don't see people QQ on knife yet because it require user skill and they admire their defeat. Shot gun already broke enough. if you increase movement speed while holding novaknives that would make me nostalgic about the good old days of counterstrike :P and could herald something good.. like assaults having main+side+knife as weapons! Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone? No Mic and no time for "Squeekers" Nerf scout cloak+shotgun
Syeven Reed G0DS AM0NG MEN 758	Posted - 2014.07.12 22:16:00 - [24] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'll also be testing aim adhesion next week to help with tracking targets at close range. I understand your going to do a good amount of testing on this, but I can see it being cumbersome when knifing two targets hugging each other (if I understand what you're doing). Could we possibly have an option to disable it? In fact having another train of thought.... I guess the aim adhesion will be sticking to the target we have the crosshair over from the moment of starting the charge? So not much of a problem! Twitter MajLagSpike CPM Application
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1298	Posted - 2014.07.12 23:07:00 - [25] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: Making knives increase speed in ANY way will simply resupt in Sentinels, brickscouts, and Amarrs just slapping them on for the CQC strafing, or for running away. Currently strafe speed is like, 90%? Make backpedal 90%, or 95%, but it needs to be less than full forward. But if you have them on in CQC, its better to have your rifle/HMG in 90% of cases if you are a sentinel or slow moving assault/brickscount "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Not Iggy Nos Nothi 181	Posted - 2014.07.12 23:11:00 - [26] - Quote RedPencil wrote: Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. Edit: I assume you are shotguner not a knifer. We are balance knife please do not drag other weapon benefit here. * What I said is walking speed increase only "knife in your hand" hopefully, you don't have a problem with knifer dancing in front of your barrel. They can't trow knife at you right? * Reduce Backpedal will have effect other weapon and they don't want to change it. This is what Logibro said in old thread. FYI: Make the adjustment that affect only knife but not affect other weapon is the point. * Again AA on knife is bad. We don't see people QQ on knife yet because it require user skill and they admire their defeat. Shot gun already broke enough. I have been running NKs since 1.2. Allowing people to just equip something and get improved movement speed will allow people to exploit that. Its also likely incredibly difficult to code and changing values like backwards movement speed is much easier to code. Shotgun is incredibly broke, you are right, it is plagued with hit detection issues and terrible inconsistency. Backpedal speed being 100% of movement speed is really quite stupid. Most people HATE being killed with a NK (its a OHK on most targets, its also usually a "slap in the face"). I am the #1 target once I "slip" into the engagement. Its actually a lot more effective for me to "spook" people once they see me than going for the kill. You will never catch a backpeddler using knives in time for the kill. It will take a full 2 seconds even if you are 2m away. Those two seconds allows plenty of time for the DPS to be put down range. IgniteableAura
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3298	Posted - 2014.07.12 23:18:00 - [27] - Quote Oh! Oh! Oh! Can we get a buff to nova knives so they do damage to tanks again? Not Iggy wrote: You will never catch a backpeddler using knives in time for the kill. It will take a full 2 seconds even if you are 2m away. Those two seconds allows plenty of time for the DPS to be put down range. It doesn't matter if you're using a Shotgun or Nova Knives, backpeddling is just too effective at getting outside optimal ranges because the speed difference is not significant enough to matter in the time it takes to kill someone that is running knives Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Empress of Alts
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 42	Posted - 2014.07.13 00:11:00 - [28] - Quote @Not Iggy People alway exploit the game mechanic no meter what. This is why I do not support Backpedal speed reduce but prefer speed modify ONLY AND ONLY HOLD KNIFE IN HAND. Normally, only the real knifer will keep go on with knife if enemy suddenly turn back, other will just swap to a gun and start shoot. Speed increase only hold knife will give only benefit for the real knifer. I think modify code on walking speed only when holding knife would not be harder than Backpedal reduce speed. As I notice the speed difference when I hold equipment in hand compare to rifle or sidearm or walk slower when charging FG or SCR. I believe they already have some speed modify code under the hood for all module. Every people HATE being killed but the attitude toward their dead are difference depend on weapons. Even me HATE being killed by a NK but I alway admire that he is good. Pure skill + experience with out any AA could approach me close enough to hug me, he deserve the kill. I think most people also admire their dead toward knife as me. From my experience, I usually got gg mail or invite mail instate of hate mail or QQ over my kill. Also the current crop that I join was the people who I stab a knife in their butt before! Anyway both your and mind idea will never see the light. For your idea, Logibro already said that they DON'T want to change. For my idea, I bought it up quite sometime in many thread but CCP never say anything. Want to hear more from you is the idea of bring AA to knife. (I don't like it though ) Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2489	Posted - 2014.07.13 02:11:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Just to cut any discussion off at the pass, charging knives while sprinting is off the table. It's not going to happen, so please don't bring it up in this thread. This is how a minja feels
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2489	Posted - 2014.07.13 02:17:00 - [30] - Quote Also, back pedaling at near the same speed as walking forward is just a bad mechanic. This is how a minja feels

LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 2943	Posted - 2014.07.13 14:45:00 - [31] - Quote Can the melee animation for knives be a 2m sprinting lunge that stabs enemies with 50% of the damage of an uncharged swipe?
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 486	Posted - 2014.07.13 15:38:00 - [32] - Quote This is some really cool stuff. Looks like I'll be saving up SP for pg optimization on NK. =P "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do that.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 486	Posted - 2014.07.13 15:42:00 - [33] - Quote Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. I agree, nerfing back pedaling speed makes a lot more sense and would have an overall improvement rather than incremental ones for specific components in the game. I know for sure that back pedaling in MCC and waiting room is not 100%, but is it the same during battles? "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do that.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2494	Posted - 2014.07.13 17:59:00 - [34] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. I agree, nerfing back pedaling speed makes a lot more sense and would have an overall improvement rather than incremental ones for specific components in the game. I know for sure that back pedaling in MCC and waiting room is not 100%, but is it the same during battles? I haven't done any "scientific" tests, but just eye balling it, I can definitely tell the difference in speed on an MCC, but can't tell a bit of difference in game. This is how a minja feels
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 193	Posted - 2014.07.13 19:33:00 - [35] - Quote PG Optimization will be phenomenal, I've been saving up for it for a while. The range and adhesion fixes would be a godsend. Reducing backpedal speed would be icing on the cake. As is it's far too easy for someone to escape by backpedaling, although the range fix might help. I hope adhesion is more like the melee assist than aim assist, so it's not an aimbot. The main problem with knives currently is that because the FOV is so small, it's extremely easy to lose your target at close range. Hopefully adhesion mitigates that problem. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 5889	Posted - 2014.07.13 21:42:00 - [36] - Quote Thanking you for not throwing in Sprint Charging. I would abuse that to hell and get it nerfed in a week. So would several others. As for the other bonuses? Sounds good! How I Imagine I look when running Minmatar Scout PSN: EVL_Elgost105
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 5889	Posted - 2014.07.13 21:43:00 - [37] - Quote RedPencil wrote: Lynn Beck wrote: Making knives increase speed in ANY way will simply resupt in Sentinels, brickscouts, and Amarrs just slapping them on for the CQC strafing, or for running away. Currently strafe speed is like, 90%? Make backpedal 90%, or 95%, but it needs to be less than full forward. Is that "Not Iggy" is your alt? you 2 said the something without read other comment. Go back and read several comment above before you post please. I don't get why people have a problem with Sentinels hold knife while dancing. LOL Keep saying that and watch Iggy show up and thunderpunch you How I Imagine I look when running Minmatar Scout PSN: EVL_Elgost105
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2513	Posted - 2014.07.13 22:45:00 - [38] - Quote Ghost Kaisar wrote: RedPencil wrote: Lynn Beck wrote: Making knives increase speed in ANY way will simply resupt in Sentinels, brickscouts, and Amarrs just slapping them on for the CQC strafing, or for running away. Currently strafe speed is like, 90%? Make backpedal 90%, or 95%, but it needs to be less than full forward. Is that "Not Iggy" is your alt? you 2 said the something without read other comment. Go back and read several comment above before you post please. I don't get why people have a problem with Sentinels hold knife while dancing. LOL Keep saying that and watch Iggy show up and thunderpunch you You would think the Not Iggy name would give some sort of hint as to who that alt might belong too... This is how a minja feels
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1635	Posted - 2014.07.14 01:09:00 - [39] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: So, it's that time again. I'll be looking at Nova Knives in Hotfix Charlie, and am hoping to make some improvements for them. Here's the preliminary list of changes. First off, I'll be trialling an increase from 2m range to 2.5m. This one isn't going in 100%, I'm hopefully going to get some testing time stabbing people around the office next week to see how it feels, might give a smaller increase if it's too much. I'll also be testing aim adhesion next week to help with tracking targets at close range. I'll look at adding a fitting optimisation skill. Like other fitting optimisation skills, this will decrease Nova Knife PG requirements by 5% per level, and will be a 6x skill. It will require Nova Knife Proficiency 4 to train. The skillbook will cost 774,000ISK. Finally, I'll be decreasing charge time on standard knives to 1.2 seconds, and increasing their damage by 10 to 100 to bring them in line with the other knives. Just to cut any discussion off at the pass, charging knives while sprinting is off the table. It's not going to happen, so please don't bring it up in this thread. If you see any issues with any of these changes, please discuss them in this thread. Looks pretty good Logibro. As mentioned by a couple of others, a more significant increase for the standard knives would make them more useful, the 10 point increase ends up being 50 in total (for a charged double shot), which really isn't significant. 125 or (preferably) 150 (with the advanced knives going to 175) would be better. Regardless, still pretty happy with the changes. If aim adhesion is effective (along with the range increase) then I don't see any need to change movement (backpedal, etc). Knowledge is power
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1635	Posted - 2014.07.14 01:24:00 - [40] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Oh! Oh! Oh! Can we get a buff to nova knives so they do damage to tanks again? Actually, this is one thing I'd love to see. Pretty please Logibro? I'd love to knife a tank while riding it and actually do some damage. Instead of just for amusement, which is why I knife tanks while riding them currently. How about 50% damage on charge shots? Knowledge is power

mollerz 3828	Posted - 2014.07.14 01:34:00 - [41] - Quote Here's my take- and hope it's not too late. First, I'd like to just throw out a couple requests- The dot reticle you see when you have knives out- can you allow that to scan targets for intel like gun reticles do? For example, you point a gun at a vehicle, and you can see if it's enemy/friendly, it's shields/armor/etc and etc. Knives you have to run around blind in that regard. Is it possible to have an assault knife? A knife that is incapable of charging, but gets more damage for slashing? Backpedaling is a horrible crutch for bad tactics. In real life, if you backpedal, you won't be doing it anywhere near as fast as the forward movement you are capable of. That is because you are a bipedal. It is a bad mechanic that rewards bad tactics, and punishes good tactics. So in that sense, I am against knives increasing speed, and absolutely for decreasing backpedal speed significantly. To realistic levels of speed. Also, the sprint bug still persists. Is it possible to please finally fix that? I also just want it to be known, I do not think adhesion is a good thing to introduce. It is another bad mechanic that rewards low skill bad tactic play. To that end, I also don't think an increase in range is a good idea. and Appia's suggestions on the basic knives is way more in line than making basic knives useful. Your change makes them still useless with an ineffectual change. Using basic knives is just as off the table as sprint charging and will remain so. You guys did a great job with IshNoks. Please concentrate on fixing bugs and bad mechanics that rewards bad players and punishes good players. Edit: And absolutely- why can't we damage tanks at a penalty to damage? Doing zero damage is kind of silly and again, basically rewards unaware playstyles. EDIT 2- Eating and typing leads to poor grammar. FIXED. You're Welcome... see their you go, Appia!
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3334	Posted - 2014.07.14 01:38:00 - [42] - Quote Community Support! Step 1 in getting nova knife kills on tanks again acquired. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
mollerz 3828	Posted - 2014.07.14 01:42:00 - [43] - Quote The introduction of a nova knife fitting optimization is golden. Long time coming really. You're Welcome... see their you go, Appia!
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2678	Posted - 2014.07.14 02:38:00 - [44] - Quote RedPencil wrote: Is that "Not Iggy" is your alt? You have no idea. In this case, Iggy is likely correct; to disagree with him would jeopardize your otherwise generally on-point track record. Backpedal speed at 100% is a balance issue; the Devs would do well to address it. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 45	Posted - 2014.07.14 04:02:00 - [45] - Quote You make me really wanna know who's Not Iggy I'm not mind to jeopardize myself. Often in time, my thought was wrong too. Someone though me, if I wanna prove something, try to argue on it. People will help you prove if it valid. Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1640	Posted - 2014.07.14 04:10:00 - [46] - Quote RedPencil wrote: You make me really wanna know who's Not Iggy I'm not mind to jeopardize myself. Often in time, my thought was wrong too. Someone though me, if I wanna prove something, try to argue on it. People will help you prove if it valid. Many of us are not Iggy. As for Not Iggy...look at his signature Knowledge is power
Leeroy Gannarsein Legio DXIV 454	Posted - 2014.07.14 04:52:00 - [47] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Community Support! Step 1 in getting nova knife kills on tanks again acquired. I like the idea of NKs dealing damage to tanks, but I'm not sure what kind of output they should have. 50% efficiency seems like a good deal (can't Ishy NK deal like 1200 per charge for a .8s charge or something)? While I agree that if you manage to get on top of me and stay on top of me you should cut me out of the tank, it seems like it might be a more effective method than strapping REs or using an SL. I'm just spitballing here, and I'm no NKer. Please swear at me if I'm wrong. It would seem like wisdom, but for the warning in my heart... CCP BLOWOUT FOR CPM1
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 11826	Posted - 2014.07.14 04:54:00 - [48] - Quote Leeroy Gannarsein wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Community Support! Step 1 in getting nova knife kills on tanks again acquired. I like the idea of NKs dealing damage to tanks, but I'm not sure what kind of output they should have. 50% efficiency seems like a good deal (can't Ishy NK deal like 1200 per charge for a .8s charge or something)? While I agree that if you manage to get on top of me and stay on top of me you should cut me out of the tank, it seems like it might be a more effective method than strapping REs or using an SL. I'm just spitballing here, and I'm no NKer. Please swear at me if I'm wrong. I like the idea..... but someone please justify just what they are stabbing so I can sleep at night. "I guess this is goodbye for now Little One. This is how you will become one of us, one of the Amarr." - Kador Ouryon
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1641	Posted - 2014.07.14 05:02:00 - [49] - Quote Leeroy Gannarsein wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Community Support! Step 1 in getting nova knife kills on tanks again acquired. I like the idea of NKs dealing damage to tanks, but I'm not sure what kind of output they should have. 50% efficiency seems like a good deal (can't Ishy NK deal like 1200 per charge for a .8s charge or something)? While I agree that if you manage to get on top of me and stay on top of me you should cut me out of the tank, it seems like it might be a more effective method than strapping REs or using an SL. I'm just spitballing here, and I'm no NKer. Please swear at me if I'm wrong. Damage is closer to 1400 with full skills and the right fit...but you really do need max skills along with Minmatar Scout 5 to get to that. Otherwise it maxes out about 1200. So yes, 600-700 damage per charged shot. Substantially less than REs, but still pretty heavy damage. Combine it with a flux grenade and an RE and you'll have done close to 3k damage in a very short amount of time, so long as you're standing on a tank. Would take a lot of skill to pull off however. Doesn't hurt to ask, I'd love to see a squad of Minja scouts swarming a tank with knives...link ants pulling down a beetle. Knowledge is power
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1641	Posted - 2014.07.14 05:02:00 - [50] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Leeroy Gannarsein wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Community Support! Step 1 in getting nova knife kills on tanks again acquired. I like the idea of NKs dealing damage to tanks, but I'm not sure what kind of output they should have. 50% efficiency seems like a good deal (can't Ishy NK deal like 1200 per charge for a .8s charge or something)? While I agree that if you manage to get on top of me and stay on top of me you should cut me out of the tank, it seems like it might be a more effective method than strapping REs or using an SL. I'm just spitballing here, and I'm no NKer. Please swear at me if I'm wrong. I like the idea..... but someone please justify just what they are stabbing so I can sleep at night. Tank. They're stabbing tank... Knowledge is power

Fremder V1 Armed And Aimless 16	Posted - 2014.07.14 08:56:00 - [51] - Quote I'm sceptical about the benefits of a reduction in backpedaling speed. It would change the fluid feeling of movement for everyone, just to make the use of two weapons in certain situations a bit easier. That it would be more realistic isn't a good argument, since this is a game, not a simulation, and thus fun should always have a higher priority than realism. This comes from a long time minja. I'm playing since Beta, and it didn't took me long to start knifing. In that time i died a lot because people turned around at the wrong moment, shooting me effortlessly while walking backwards. I also survived a lot of those situations, because i knew my chance to get an easy kill was gone. Considering almost certain death awaits my opponents, if they don't notice me in time, it always seemed fair enough. Adipem Nothi wrote: * Change NK damage progression from 90-150-200 to 120-160-200. Second. 150/175/200 looks good right now, but since we probably get a couple of buffs at once, i would prefer small steps in this regard.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8417	Posted - 2014.07.14 12:59:00 - [52] - Quote I'll take further increasing standard/advanced damage under consideration, just want to spreadsheet a bit with them before I say yes. I am very apprehensive about changing backpedaling speed as this affects everything else in the game as well. It's kinda the nuclear option, and I would prefer not to mess with it at the moment. As for damage against tanks? Well, I'll think about it... CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2728	Posted - 2014.07.14 13:26:00 - [53] - Quote Fremder V1 wrote: I'm sceptical about the benefits of a reduction in backpedaling speed. It would change the fluid feeling of movement for everyone, just to make the use of two weapons in certain situations a bit easier. Regardless of what my flanker is running, he'll have lesser odds of getting directly behind me ... * ... if I stick with friendlies. * ... if I'm squadded with a recon specialist. * ... if I periodically check my flank. If I fail to perform the above, and the flanker manages to sneak within slapping distance of my arse ... * All I need is enough HP to tank his alpha strike. * My free-pass bunny hop will consistently break hit detection of any followup NK attack. * My free-pass bunny hop serves dual purpose in that it can also place me beyond the SG's 5m optimal range. * My free-pass insta-spin flips the scales in my favor. * My free-pass backpedal can keep me forever beyond my flanker's reach. * My free-pass, ultra-precise fine rifle hipfire can insta-gib my flanker with little-to-no effort. Balancing backpedal isn't about making the flank/backstab easier; its about addressing the pool of free passes which encourage above all else to run HP modules and a Fine Rifle. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2729	Posted - 2014.07.14 13:39:00 - [54] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I am very apprehensive about changing backpedaling speed as this affects everything else in the game as well. It's kinda the nuclear option, and I would prefer not to mess with it at the moment. Understood, and thank you for consideration. Pencil, myself and many others support an alternative to the nuclear option. Would it be technically possible to increase forward movement speed when knives are equipped? This would permit a knifer opportunity to catch up to and dispatch a backpedaler. Swing animation slows movement speed, such that a backpedaling target is always just out-of-reach when a strike would otherwise have landed. A tiny boost to forward movement speed combined your blade length improvement would remedy this issue (without drastically changing anything else). Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Not Iggy Nos Nothi 185	Posted - 2014.07.14 13:52:00 - [55] - Quote I don't understand how it will break the fluidity if backward movement speed wasn't 100%. Strafe speed is not 100% why would backward be any different? It would place it more inline with everything else. Besides if its that terrible fix it back in delta. I'll still take faster forward movement while knives are equipped. But you will get more people starting a match with uplinks stacked kincats and a basic knife to get faster movement speed. Not to mention people likely using it to improve movement speed in general when trying to flee. Also doesn't animation break once you hit above 11m/s. Which would mean a stacked proto minja will likely break those animations if knives are equipped. With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Knifers won't stand a chance. <3 IgniteableAura
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2730	Posted - 2014.07.14 14:03:00 - [56] - Quote Not Iggy wrote: 1. I don't understand how it will break the fluidity if backward movement speed wasn't 100%. Strafe speed is not 100% why would backward be any different? It would place it more inline with everything else. Besides if its that terrible fix it back in delta. 2. I'll still take faster forward movement while knives are equipped. But you will get more people starting a match with uplinks stacked kincats and a basic knife to get faster movement speed. Not to mention people likely using it to improve movement speed in general when trying to flee. 3. Also doesn't animation break once you hit above 11m/s. Which would mean a stacked proto minja will likely break those animations if knives are equipped. 4. With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Knifers won't stand a chance. <3 1. This certainly seems best; perhaps the Devs see something we don't. 2. While unlikely, I'm hoping its somehow feasible to tweak one metric without impacting the others. 3. Fairly certain that 11.11 m/s is attainable and not game-breaking; I suspect the breakpoint is higher. 4. Hadn't thought of that yet ... ouch! Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3384	Posted - 2014.07.14 14:33:00 - [57] - Quote Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 1070	Posted - 2014.07.14 15:40:00 - [58] - Quote Lynn Beck wrote: IMO, adhesion should be a 'if they're in your screen at time of slicing, and they move, it should attempt to chase them' Is it possible to make it such that another scout(even a 2x Cx Plate) isn't just instalocked, while any moderately tanked assault(2x enhanced plate GalAsault?) is almost impossible to miss? As for the range, i have no clue how this would work, at times i've been knif'd (literally) from across a hallway, but other times i can stand right in front of someone and miss. Never been knifed, or knifed halfway across a hall. But I can say, there are times when I look down at a drop uplink, and madly try to slash it to death, only to not be close enough. And it SEEMS like I am close enough, or what I feel is close enough. So a bit more range would def help. That or add it into a new skill, as knifes are kinda lacking in skills compared to the other weapons in kind. Tanks - Balancing Turrets
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6297	Posted - 2014.07.14 15:47:00 - [59] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I am very apprehensive about changing backpedaling speed as this affects everything else in the game as well. It's kinda the nuclear option, and I would prefer not to mess with it at the moment. Understood, and thank you for consideration. Pencil, myself and many others support an alternative to the nuclear option. Would it be technically possible to increase forward movement speed when knives are equipped? This would permit a knifer opportunity to catch up to and dispatch a backpedaler. Swing animation slows movement speed, such that a backpedaling target is always just out-of-reach when a strike would otherwise have landed. A tiny boost to forward movement speed combined your blade length improvement would remedy this issue (without drastically changing anything else). We'll call that the Counter Strike option. Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. Not sure what frame-rate and hit detection have to do with an assault speed buff being a bad thing, care to explain..? Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 10943	Posted - 2014.07.14 15:51:00 - [60] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. Who said as fast or faster? Rattati talked about a ~0.05 increase. If I can hit scouts just fine, then a small increase to assault speeds won't change anything Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC

Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3388	Posted - 2014.07.14 15:53:00 - [61] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I am very apprehensive about changing backpedaling speed as this affects everything else in the game as well. It's kinda the nuclear option, and I would prefer not to mess with it at the moment. Understood, and thank you for consideration. Pencil, myself and many others support an alternative to the nuclear option. Would it be technically possible to increase forward movement speed when knives are equipped? This would permit a knifer opportunity to catch up to and dispatch a backpedaler. Swing animation slows movement speed, such that a backpedaling target is always just out-of-reach when a strike would otherwise have landed. A tiny boost to forward movement speed combined your blade length improvement would remedy this issue (without drastically changing anything else). We'll call that the Counter Strike option. Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. Not sure what frame-rate and hit detection have to do with an assault speed buff being a bad thing, care to explain..? higher-strafe speed = better at dodging bullets when frame rate drops Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 6523	Posted - 2014.07.14 15:53:00 - [62] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. lol. You mean slaying? You mean being on the frontlines? You mean being able to take a hard punch and keep on walking? Yeah sorry to break it to you but those aren't scout roles. see you space cowboy...
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3388	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:04:00 - [63] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. lol. You mean slaying? You mean being on the frontlines? You mean being able to take a hard punch and keep on walking? Yeah sorry to break it to you but those aren't scout roles. Flanking is though. Running away is. With the strong dislike for lowing backpedaling speed, the assault becomes even better at keeping outside the nova knife range. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2528	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:15:00 - [64] - Quote @ Definitely not an alt of anyone that might be referred to as Iggy I am thinking that maybe its the way that changing back pedal speed would have to be done that could cause all the problems. Like when we wanted an increase in base movement speed for minja, but that would effect EVERYTHING so it was tossed. This is how a minja feels
Fremder V1 Armed And Aimless 17	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:22:00 - [65] - Quote Not Iggy wrote: I don't understand how it will break the fluidity if backward movement speed wasn't 100%. I didn't say it would break it, i said it would change it. For everybody. What would be the pros and cons for everyone directly affected? (Be it the flanker, or the one who gets flanked. ) What could be affected that isn't directly knife related? (Shotguns for example.) How would the majority of players who aren't knifers feel about such a change? (Maybe not as enthusiastic.) A one sided discussion isn't really one. The small field of view is a real problem with knifes, decreasing the speed of everybody because of it shouldn't be the solution though. I just don't see the need for such a drastic change, especially with the allready advertised buffs in mind.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 2192	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:31:00 - [66] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: ... Signature is many yes. He imposes order on the chaos of organic evolution...
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6299	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:32:00 - [67] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. lol. You mean slaying? You mean being on the frontlines? You mean being able to take a hard punch and keep on walking? Yeah sorry to break it to you but those aren't scout roles. Flanking is though. Running away is. With the strong dislike for lowing backpedaling speed, the assault becomes even better at keeping outside the nova knife range. I'm not sure that warrants a change to an entire class of dropsuits to accommodate for a single weapon, though. Strafe speed isn't unique to Scouts and likewise shouldn't be. They can be better at it, absolutely, but it shouldn't be exclusive. Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2530	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:35:00 - [68] - Quote Fremder V1 wrote: Not Iggy wrote: I don't understand how it will break the fluidity if backward movement speed wasn't 100%. I didn't say it would break it, i said it would change it. For everybody. I think he was referring to this. CCP Logibro wrote: I am very apprehensive about changing backpedaling speed as this affects everything else in the game as well. It's kinda the nuclear option, and I would prefer not to mess with it at the moment. I could be wrong though. This is how a minja feels
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2740	Posted - 2014.07.14 16:48:00 - [69] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: ... Signature is many yes. My Heroes * Calamity Jane * Annie Oakley * Morathi * Radar * Ripley Riley Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2740	Posted - 2014.07.14 17:09:00 - [70] - Quote Fremder V1 wrote: [ How would the majority of players who aren't knifers feel about such a change? (Maybe not as enthusiastic.) CCP: Hey pilots! Do you think we should dial back on the win-button because AV/HAV Balance? Pilots: stomping of feet CCP: Hey guys! Do you think we should dial back on the free-pass because CQC Balance? Guys: stroking of neckbeards Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley

Syeven Reed G0DS AM0NG MEN 759	Posted - 2014.07.14 17:32:00 - [71] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: As for damage against tanks? Well, I'll think about it... Twitter MajLagSpike CPM Application
Fremder V1 Armed And Aimless 17	Posted - 2014.07.14 17:42:00 - [72] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Regardless of what my flanker is running, he'll have lesser odds of getting directly behind me ... * ... if I stick with friendlies. * ... if I'm squadded with a recon specialist. * ... if I periodically check my flank. If I fail to perform the above, and my flanker manages to sneak into slapping distance of my arse ... * All I need is enough HP to tank his alpha strike. * My free-pass bunny hop will consistently break hit detection of any followup NK attack. * My free-pass bunny hop can also place me beyond the SG's 5m optimal range. * My free-pass insta-spin tilts the scale in my favor. * My free-pass backpedal speed keeps me forever beyond my flanker's reach. * My free-pass fine-rifle hipfire will insta-gib my low-HP flanker with little-to-no effort. .... CCP: Hey pilots! Do you think we should take away your win-button because AV/HAV Balance? Pilots: stomping of feet CCP: Hey guys! Do you think we should dial back on this free-pass because CQC Balance? Guys: stroking of neckbeards They can jump around, so can we. They can spin around, so can we. They can shoot with low health, so can we, if needed. They can backpedal, we can run. Just walking straight at them is neither our only, nor our best option. Regardless of a reduced backpedaling speed. You call it a free pass, i call it a chance. We are talking about close combat situations in which we have a faster suit and a weapon that often enough could insta kill them. Wouldn't it be so difficult to hit a dancing target with knifes, thanks to the small field of view, we allready would hold the better cards. The advertised range increase and maybe the added adhesion should help. Maybe it will be enough, maybe not. We shall see.
mollerz 3889	Posted - 2014.07.14 18:48:00 - [73] - Quote I guess bad mechanics are the default here. So I will just say this- A seriously smart person once told me- Do it right, or someone else will do it better. Have fun with this farce of improving the game. I can't even stand it, and honestly, Shotty is way better equipped and patient with this stuff. I default to his well respected grasp of the game and what would need to be done to make the game fair and fun for all. o7 You're Welcome... see their you go, Appia!
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 46	Posted - 2014.07.14 19:59:00 - [74] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: We'll call that the Counter Strike option. Bring Back the Good Old Days. That is the prove how "OLD" we are Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2757	Posted - 2014.07.14 20:06:00 - [75] - Quote Fremder V1 wrote: They can jump around, so can we. They can spin around, so can we. They can shoot with low health, so can we, if needed. They can backpedal, we can run. Just walking straight at them is neither our only, nor our best option. Regardless of a reduced backpedaling speed. You call it a free pass, i call it a chance. We are talking about close combat situations in which we have a faster suit and a weapon that often enough could insta kill them. Wouldn't it be so difficult to hit a dancing target with knifes, thanks to the small field of view, we allready would hold the better cards. The advertised range increase and maybe the added adhesion should help. Maybe it will be enough, maybe not. We shall see. Not sure what it is you're trying to say, but 100% backpedal speed is not an FPS standard. As such, it should be explained and justified by those who support it. If it cannot be explained or justified, it should be corrected. The only explanation offered by neckbeards to date: 100% backpedal speed gives me a good chance to kill CQC fighters when they sneak up behind me. ^ Surely the Devs would not recognize this as sound basis; there must be other factors at play. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Lightning35 Delta514 48TH SPECIAL OPERATIONS FORCE 47	Posted - 2014.07.14 20:23:00 - [76] - Quote no charged knives will sprinting?!?!?!?! :( one job that has been failed :( :( :( :( SPAWN.KILL.DIE.RESPAWN.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2561	Posted - 2014.07.14 20:52:00 - [77] - Quote Lightning35 Delta514 wrote: no charged knives will sprinting?!?!?!?! :( one job that has been failed :( :( :( :( It is for the best. This is how a minja feels
Temias Mercurial Knights Of Ender RISE of LEGION 114	Posted - 2014.07.14 22:35:00 - [78] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Not Iggy wrote: With the upcoming buff to assault movement speeds Was this confirmed? The charlie thread was just too long to follow. I can't express how terrible that would be when frame-rate is so low and we still have hit-detection issues to deal with. Yeah. And my Assault suits being as fast or faster than my Gal-Scout just seems like it'll make Assaults better at some of the scout's roles. Buff... not better... just a buff.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2783	Posted - 2014.07.14 23:58:00 - [79] - Quote :: beats dead horse :: - courtesy of Mollerz Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 191	Posted - 2014.07.15 03:18:00 - [80] - Quote Shotgun hit detection..... just saying "Anybody order chaos?"

Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3443	Posted - 2014.07.15 05:35:00 - [81] - Quote CCP Logibro, how exactly do you see "Aim adhesion" improving Nova Knives? It's true that DUST has a notoriously small Field of View (FOV), probably the smallest of any FPS ever, but how will aim adhesion help when people causally walk away faster than you can move forward. Charge sprinting: is this like, people asking for a lunge mechanic or the ability to hold a charge while sprinting? And if we can't hold the charge while sprinting, can we at least have the charge maintain 100% forward movement? I can walk backwards at 100% speed, but I can't walk forward at 100% speed. that's just ***** *****. So lets start this again, instead of asking for you to reduce backwards speed, why don't you try to justify the value of moving backwards faster* than you can move sideways. Maintaining the status quo for the sake of maintaining the status quo does not make the game better. I was under the impression that these hotfixes were to improve the game through balance and fixing mistakes that never should have been there. Warbarge and Merc Quarters have you move backwards slower than forwards, why is in combat OK for this to be and not the other mode? Why is it 100% in the first place? Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
safura trotsky Nyain Chan General Tso's Alliance 72	Posted - 2014.07.15 08:45:00 - [82] - Quote RECON BY FIRE wrote: I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far are a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Omg this...so much this Thanks for picking me up blueberry!...and again...and again...STAHP!!!
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2805	Posted - 2014.07.15 12:30:00 - [83] - Quote Tweedle Dum wrote: Tweedle Dee wrote: ... either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. Omg this...so much this Double-Barreled, Infinite-Ammo Breach Shotgun I'm a big fan of the risk and skill requirements involved in knifing. I'm a big fan of the damage output we're allowed because of these risk and skill requirements. Sprint/Charge would subtract risk and skill from knifing; there will be no way to justify NK damage output if it were implemented. Being able to walk at full speed while holding a charge (or slashing) would be reasonable and appropriate. Being able to sprint while holding a charge would be overpowered. Sprint/Charge is a bad idea, and LogiBro is wise to dismiss it. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2596	Posted - 2014.07.15 17:06:00 - [84] - Quote safura trotsky wrote: RECON BY FIRE wrote: I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far are a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Omg this...so much this This doesn't make sense. It is contradictory in a way I don't understand. I get why you would want sprint charge, but I disagree. I get why you would want no changes or next to no changes and keep them highly skilled and very difficult, and whole heartedly agree. I don't get why given the latter part you would ever be ok with sprint charge, but NOT with a minor tweak like adding 0.5 m to range or a (hopefully) very slight aim adhesion. This is how a minja feels
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2837	Posted - 2014.07.15 17:59:00 - [85] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: safura trotsky wrote: RECON BY FIRE wrote: I understand that charging while sprinting is off the table, but if you don't make that change then I feel you should just leave knives alone. Part of the fun of knives is the amount of skill it takes to sneak in close and get the kill. The changes you have proposed so far are a step towards taking skill out of knife gameplay and will lead to such shittery as people hanging around corners with charged knives and swiping "just close enough" to get the instakill on everybody. That isn't fun, really for either party, and it's a form of gameplay that has no place in Dust/Legion/wtfever. Buff STD knives and either put in charging while sprinting or leave them alone. And yes, I understand the reason we don't have charging while sprinting is likely that it would take recoding to make that change. Edit: Optimization skill change is good too. Omg this...so much this This doesn't make sense. It is contradictory in a way I don't understand. I get why you would want sprint charge, but I disagree. I get why you would want no changes or next to no changes and keep them highly skilled and very difficult, and whole heartedly agree. I don't get why given the latter part you would ever be ok with sprint charge, but NOT with a minor tweak like adding 0.5 m to range or a (hopefully) very slight aim adhesion. [85%] Recon By Fire does not grasp the implications of Sprint/Charge. [03%] Recon By Fire is seeking to make knives OP so they later get nerfed. [12%] Other (including, but not limited to, posting for the sake of posting). Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Temias Mercurial Knights Of Ender RISE of LEGION 115	Posted - 2014.07.15 18:39:00 - [86] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: CCP Logibro, how exactly do you see "Aim adhesion" improving Nova Knives? It's true that DUST has a notoriously small Field of View (FOV), probably the smallest of any FPS ever, but how will aim adhesion help when people causally walk away faster than you can move forward. Charge sprinting: is this like, people asking for a lunge mechanic or the ability to hold a charge while sprinting? And if we can't hold the charge while sprinting, can we at least have the charge maintain 100% forward movement? I can walk backwards at 100% speed, but I can't walk forward at 100% speed. that's just ***** *****. So lets start this again, instead of asking for you to reduce backwards speed, why don't you try to justify the value of moving backwards faster* than you can move sideways. Maintaining the status quo for the sake of maintaining the status quo does not make the game better. I was under the impression that these hotfixes were to improve the game through balance and fixing mistakes that never should have been there. Warbarge and Merc Quarters have you move backwards slower than forwards, why is in combat OK for this to be and not the other mode? Why is it 100% in the first place? On the subject of FoV, could we have a way of adjusting it? I hate a low FoV. I don't know if this is possible or the technical issues that may arise from it, but it would be nice to have...
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10517	Posted - 2014.07.15 22:20:00 - [87] - Quote On an unrelated note, am I the only one who prefers using my Assault suit for Knifing? The Snack That Smiles Back, Tankers! -HAND
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2641	Posted - 2014.07.15 23:24:00 - [88] - Quote Atiim wrote: On an unrelated note, am I the only one who prefers using my Assault suit for Knifing? No, but probably one of the few. I wish I had a video of the heavy knifer I had on my team the other day. It was quite amusing. This is how a minja feels
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3485	Posted - 2014.07.15 23:34:00 - [89] - Quote I just can't run knives without that damage bonus from Min-scout, even then I run sidearm damage mods with Ishukone Nova Knives. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8431	Posted - 2014.07.15 23:34:00 - [90] - Quote You are already moving at full speed while holding a charge with a Nova Knife. I will however do some testing to double check, but from what I can see you should be moving at the same speed while charging as walking normally. Aim adhesion will help with tracking a target at very close quarters. I'll be initially at least trialling it activating only at 1.5m and below. It's not meant to help with hitting someone back pedalling away. As far as reducing backwards moving speed, it's not "It's never going to happen". It's more "This is a massive change because it affects every suit, and if we're going to do it, we're going to cover our bases, check everything, and do it right". If I can fix Nova Knives in the interim without having to change it, then that's preferable as I have a number of other things I also want to fit into Charlie (HMG changes, Swarm Changes, maybe some others) CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)


Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2885	Posted - 2014.07.15 23:53:00 - [91] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: You are already moving at full speed while holding a charge with a Nova Knife. I will however do some testing to double check, but from what I can see you should be moving at the same speed while charging as walking normally. Was nearly certain that: * forward momentum slows during slash animation * walking while holding charge is slower than regular walking If I'm wrong on these points, then I apologize; it is not my intent to mislead. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1363	Posted - 2014.07.16 00:12:00 - [92] - Quote Every time you swipe you "slow down" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yscdf_-ztOU&list=UUPEDnyW3VLCVue8my3DxMkg#t=93 @1:37 1m away, swipe....miss. @ 3:08 backpedal is OP. That dude would have killed me had his mag not been empty. @4:29 backpedal wins. @5:31 backpedal wins. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
mollerz 3998	Posted - 2014.07.16 00:18:00 - [93] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: You are already moving at full speed while holding a charge with a Nova Knife. I will however do some testing to double check, but from what I can see you should be moving at the same speed while charging as walking normally. Was nearly certain that: * forward momentum slows during slash animation * walking while holding charge is slower than regular walking If I'm wrong on these points, then I apologize; it is not my intent to mislead. That is 100% fact. Also, the sprint bug persists, logibro. Turn on a cloak and try and sprint. You have to engage sprint a couple times before it happens. Same with knifing. You're Welcome... see their you go, Appia!
mollerz 4010	Posted - 2014.07.16 00:41:00 - [94] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: Every time you swipe you "slow down" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yscdf_-ztOU&list=UUPEDnyW3VLCVue8my3DxMkg#t=93 @1:37 1m away, swipe....miss. @ 3:08 backpedal is OP. That dude would have killed me had his mag not been empty. @4:29 backpedal wins, dude I was trying to nova knife was armor tanked and was still able to get out of my range while swiping. @5:31 backpedal wins. o7 dude you rock. You're Welcome... see their you go, Appia!
Archduke Ferd1nand Nos Nothi 9	Posted - 2014.07.16 00:48:00 - [95] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: Every time you swipe you "slow down" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yscdf_-ztOU&list=UUPEDnyW3VLCVue8my3DxMkg#t=93 @1:37 1m away, swipe....miss. @ 3:08 backpedal is OP. That dude would have killed me had his mag not been empty. @4:29 backpedal wins, dude I was trying to nova knife was armor tanked and was still able to get out of my range while swiping. @5:31 backpedal wins. The only way to fix that is to allow sprint charge for the first .X seconds from charging (i.e. sprinting, start charging, can continue sprinting for .X seconds while charging) ^^That would help knifers more than anything. Fixes backpedal too. Killed by Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p on June 28 1914. Last words: "Nova Knives and a Flaylock Pistol? I might just die laughing!"
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2889	Posted - 2014.07.16 01:29:00 - [96] - Quote Archduke Ferd1nand wrote: The only way to fix that is to allow sprint charge for the first .X seconds from charging (i.e. sprinting, start charging, can continue sprinting for .X seconds while charging) ^^That would help knifers more than anything. Fixes backpedal too. Provided .X is very brief, this might actually work. That said, permitting sprint/charge seems likely to be linked to a Boolean value; your suggestion would require additional parameters which may not exist client-side. Meaning, the coding which governs sprint/charge is likely "yes" or "no" and likely not able to handle conditionals like "yes for .05 seconds, but then no". Very clever though; way to think outside the box :-) Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Temias Mercurial Knights Of Ender RISE of LEGION 115	Posted - 2014.07.16 01:58:00 - [97] - Quote mollerz wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: You are already moving at full speed while holding a charge with a Nova Knife. I will however do some testing to double check, but from what I can see you should be moving at the same speed while charging as walking normally. Was nearly certain that: * forward momentum slows during slash animation * walking while holding charge is slower than regular walking If I'm wrong on these points, then I apologize; it is not my intent to mislead. That is 100% fact. Also, the sprint bug persists, logibro. Turn on a cloak and try and sprint. You have to engage sprint a couple times before it happens. Same with knifing. Edit- Logibro, is there a reason you aren't in game testing this for yourself? Or have you tried and can not replicate it? It is so persistent it happens exactly every time, so it isn't hard to replicate at all. It might help exponentially in fixing these issues if you just broke down and tried it out for yourself. Please, don't take our word for it. go experience it. The sprinting glitch arises immediately after firing a weapon, throwing a grenade (maybe...), using/placing equipments, and etc... then sprinting while doing so, which cancels/interrupts the previous action (there is no pause between the action and then sprinting). It is very easy to replicate...
mollerz 4015	Posted - 2014.07.16 02:41:00 - [98] - Quote Temias Mercurial wrote: The sprinting glitch arises immediately after firing a weapon, throwing a grenade (maybe...), using/placing equipments, and etc... then sprinting while doing so, which cancels/interrupts the previous action (there is no pause between the action and then sprinting). It is very easy to replicate... yep. it permeates every action you can take before trying to sprint. it's been afflicting us since what.. 1.2? I can't recall.. but it has been the suck. Next to glitchy terrain, it is the worst bug for knifers and exacerbates all the other issues. thanks for expounding upon the issue. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Temias Mercurial Knights Of Ender RISE of LEGION 116	Posted - 2014.07.16 04:10:00 - [99] - Quote mollerz wrote: Temias Mercurial wrote: The sprinting glitch arises immediately after firing a weapon, throwing a grenade (maybe...), using/placing equipments, and etc... then sprinting while doing so, which cancels/interrupts the previous action (there is no pause between the action and then sprinting). It is very easy to replicate... yep. it permeates every action you can take before trying to sprint. it's been afflicting us since what.. 1.2? I can't recall.. but it has been the suck. Next to glitchy terrain, it is the worst bug for knifers and exacerbates all the other issues. thanks for expounding upon the issue. I think it was around 1.4 or 1.5 actually... 1.2 was the introduction of the Commando (we only had the Amarr Heavy then though...), and I don't remember the glitch existing then. The other odd thing is that we use to have 'phantom revive markers', where the indicator was there, but no body. Ominously, in 1.8, they came back... strange.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 547	Posted - 2014.07.16 06:24:00 - [100] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: As far as reducing backwards moving speed, it's not "It's never going to happen". It's more "This is a massive change because it affects every suit, and if we're going to do it, we're going to cover our bases, check everything, and do it right". Wrote your patch notes for you :) Quote: - Changes to backwards suit speeds Instead of back-pedaling at 100% of forward movement speed, we've adjusted this value to x% of forward movement speed. This resolves some sorely unbalanced free pass death avoidance issues related to knives without the need for hacks (no pun intended). It also adds some tactical depth to pretty much everything anyone does related to movement. What this means for situationally unaware mercs confronted by a knife is that they should now turn tail and run if they happen to still be standing, and thank their lucky stars throwing knives isn't a thing. Ideally we wanted to add mechanics that meant you could move backwards at 100% speed but risk falling flat on your arse unless you also looked backwards at the same time, but this is outside of the scope of DUST. We will however be looking at a more polished mechanic in Legion. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz

IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 547	Posted - 2014.07.16 06:27:00 - [101] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Archduke Ferd1nand wrote: The only way to fix that is to allow sprint charge for the first .X seconds from charging (i.e. sprinting, start charging, can continue sprinting for .X seconds while charging) ^^That would help knifers more than anything. Fixes backpedal too. Provided .X is very brief, this might actually work well ... if it were possible. Permitting sprint/charge seems likely to be linked to a Boolean value; your suggestion would require additional parameters which may not exist client-side. Meaning, the coding which governs sprint/charge is likely looking for "yes" or "no" and likely not equipped to handle conditionals like "yes for 0.25 seconds, but then no". Very clever though; way to think outside the box :-) Sprint-charge with no You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
Fremder V1 Armed And Aimless 18	Posted - 2014.07.16 06:48:00 - [102] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Not sure what it is you're trying to say, but 100% backpedal speed is not an FPS standard. As such, it should be explained and justified by those who support it. I'm trying to say two things: 1) This change would come with a bunch off side effects. Like a significant buff to shotguns, harder to doge remotes and grenades, and because it would take longer to get back into cover, even a reduced overall TTK. None off that strikes me as positive. And those are just the things i can think off at the top of my head. All off it and more could be adjusted accordingly, just not as easy as some here seem to think. 2) The one theoretically positive effect, a better close quarter performance with knifes, i would prefer to get in another way. Like i said in my first post, backpedaling never really bothered me. If it's possible to overcome the problems of the small FOV otherwise, and maybe even fix those mentioned bugs, i'm happy if my opponent still has this good possibility to fight back, if i mess up my attack. I like the challenge, i like the dance!
Haerr Legio DXIV 1031	Posted - 2014.07.16 10:19:00 - [103] - Quote Haerr wrote: I've been trying out the Nova Knives for a bit now and while it is going a lot better than it did during the Shinobi event the sprint bugs are still there and very noticeably so. I keep running into it while I swipe and then try to either sprint or sprint jump to catch up with people back pedalling, often resulting in getting stuck in place and becoming an easy target. What do you guys do to avoid running into this? Edit: (:...[=\===> quoted from barbershop Will vote for: pÇîA·P·P·I·ApÇì & pÇîR·H·A·D·ApÇì despite them hating on Nordic food customs. ;)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2915	Posted - 2014.07.16 11:53:00 - [104] - Quote IAmDuncanIdaho II wrote: Ideally we wanted to add mechanics that meant you could move backwards at 100% speed but risk falling flat on your arse unless you also looked backwards at the same time, but this is outside of the scope of DUST. We will however be looking at a more polished mechanic in Legion. LMAO ... good stuff, Duncan! Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 501	Posted - 2014.07.16 16:54:00 - [105] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: CCP Logibro, how exactly do you see "Aim adhesion" improving Nova Knives? It's true that DUST has a notoriously small Field of View (FOV), probably the smallest of any FPS ever, but how will aim adhesion help when people causally walk away faster than you can move forward. Charge sprinting: is this like, people asking for a lunge mechanic or the ability to hold a charge while sprinting? And if we can't hold the charge while sprinting, can we at least have the charge maintain 100% forward movement? I can walk backwards at 100% speed, but I can't walk forward at 100% speed. that's just ***** *****. So lets start this again, instead of asking for you to reduce backwards speed, why don't you try to justify the value of moving backwards faster* than you can move sideways. Maintaining the status quo for the sake of maintaining the status quo does not make the game better. I was under the impression that these hotfixes were to improve the game through balance and fixing mistakes that never should have been there. Warbarge and Merc Quarters have you move backwards slower than forwards, why is in combat OK for this to be and not the other mode? Why is it 100% in the first place? ^This and sprinting glitch. Moving backwards should be slower than moving sideways technically, and definitely slower than moving forward 100%. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
mollerz 4070	Posted - 2014.07.16 17:45:00 - [106] - Quote Haerr wrote: Haerr wrote: I've been trying out the Nova Knives for a bit now and while it is going a lot better than it did during the Shinobi event the sprint bugs are still there and very noticeably so. I keep running into it while I swipe and then try to either sprint or sprint jump to catch up with people back pedalling, often resulting in getting stuck in place and becoming an easy target. What do you guys do to avoid running into this? Edit: (:...[=\===> quoted from barbershop Meant to respond. I will respond there! Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 504	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:03:00 - [107] - Quote mollerz wrote: Haerr wrote: Haerr wrote: I've been trying out the Nova Knives for a bit now and while it is going a lot better than it did during the Shinobi event the sprint bugs are still there and very noticeably so. I keep running into it while I swipe and then try to either sprint or sprint jump to catch up with people back pedalling, often resulting in getting stuck in place and becoming an easy target. What do you guys do to avoid running into this? Edit: (:...[=\===> quoted from barbershop Meant to respond. I will respond there! Has CCP even responded to that bug? "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2944	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:04:00 - [108] - Quote Bad News, Brothers! Walked between two fixed points ... time elapsed: 7 seconds. Walked between the same points holding a charge ... 7 seconds. Walked between the same points all the while slashing ... 7 seconds. We were wrong. This changes nothing! Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 507	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:31:00 - [109] - Quote BlazeXYZ wrote: what race is the nova knifes and is it good on shield or armor. Just asking this cause nova knifes is the only weapon i never used in the game. It's nova knife time Caldari. Both. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8443	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:32:00 - [110] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Bad News, Brothers! Following up on earlier claim: Walked between two fixed points ... time elapsed: 7 seconds. Walked between the same points holding a charge ... 7 seconds. Walked between the same points all the while slashing ... 7 seconds. We were wrong. This changes nothing! Yep, I tested the same. I have a feeling what's happening a lot is people moving in all sorts of directions in close combat, and that's where you lose space. The aim adhesion should directly address this. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)


Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2945	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:44:00 - [111] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: ... I have a feeling what's happening a lot is people moving in all sorts of directions in close combat, and that's where you lose space. The aim adhesion should directly address this. Makes sense. Looking forward trying it out :-) Thanks again for working on this for us. o7 Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1382	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:48:00 - [112] - Quote Can we make the knives "swing faster" aka apply their damage more quickly? Because while I think the increase in aim adhesion and range will improve a little bit in CQC, it will always remain impossible to knife someone while they are sprinting unless you do a "sprint, jump, charge, land, swipe". Currently you swipe when you think you will hit someone (1m), when you swipe while sprinting you slow down to walk speed, the person in front of you will in turn "gain enough ground" to get outside of the knife range. They will also hear the knife swipe, bunnyhop, twirl and backpedal so you cannot hit them. ---------> dead scout. ^thats the scenario that makes knives frustrating. Please explain how aim adhesion will allow us to hit a "gaining ground" target. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2945	Posted - 2014.07.16 19:00:00 - [113] - Quote @ Iggy Isn't the plan aim adhesion + range increase? Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
RedPencil Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 51	Posted - 2014.07.16 19:15:00 - [114] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Aim adhesion will help with tracking a target at very close quarters. I'll be initially at least trialling it activating only at 1.5m and below. It's not meant to help with hitting someone back pedalling away. As far as reducing backwards moving speed, it's not "It's never going to happen". It's more "This is a massive change because it affects every suit, and if we're going to do it, we're going to cover our bases, check everything, and do it right". If I can fix Nova Knives in the interim without having to change it, then that's preferable as I have a number of other things I also want to fit into Charlie (HMG changes, Swarm Changes, maybe some others) * What are input methods to gain Aim adhesion ability? Only dualshock3 or all input? * Do you have the new range and delay number between slash? * Thank you for say it out loud about backwards moving speed, so now we can move on. Beware paper cut M[;..;]M
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1387	Posted - 2014.07.16 19:56:00 - [115] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Iggy Isn't the plan aim adhesion + range increase? Thats what I understand, but how is aim adhesion going to keep the target from gaining ground as you swipe? The range can help, but I suppose time will tell, 0.5m wont help us much IMO. Aim adhesion will help you keep on target in CQC as they strafe, but it won't make you "faster" My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6326	Posted - 2014.07.16 20:23:00 - [116] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Bad News, Brothers! Following up on earlier claim: Walked between two fixed points ... time elapsed: 7 seconds. Walked between the same points holding a charge ... 7 seconds. Walked between the same points all the while slashing ... 7 seconds. We were wrong. This changes nothing! Yep, I tested the same. I have a feeling what's happening a lot is people moving in all sorts of directions in close combat, and that's where you lose space. The aim adhesion should directly address this. Wonder if the Sprint bug has anything to do with this. Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
mollerz 4109	Posted - 2014.07.16 21:12:00 - [117] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: mollerz wrote: Haerr wrote: Haerr wrote: I've been trying out the Nova Knives for a bit now and while it is going a lot better than it did during the Shinobi event the sprint bugs are still there and very noticeably so. I keep running into it while I swipe and then try to either sprint or sprint jump to catch up with people back pedalling, often resulting in getting stuck in place and becoming an easy target. What do you guys do to avoid running into this? Edit: (:...[=\===> quoted from barbershop Meant to respond. I will respond there! Has CCP even responded to that bug? Only that they can't replicate it. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
mollerz 4109	Posted - 2014.07.16 21:13:00 - [118] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Bad News, Brothers! Following up on earlier claim: Walked between two fixed points ... time elapsed: 7 seconds. Walked between the same points holding a charge ... 7 seconds. Walked between the same points all the while slashing ... 7 seconds. We were wrong. This changes nothing! Yep, I tested the same. I have a feeling what's happening a lot is people moving in all sorts of directions in close combat, and that's where you lose space. The aim adhesion should directly address this. Ok. Hmm.. well I am certainly curious to try it out! One thing tho- the sprint bug is a completely separate issue. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
mollerz 4114	Posted - 2014.07.16 21:20:00 - [119] - Quote I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2976	Posted - 2014.07.16 23:20:00 - [120] - Quote mollerz wrote: I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. If I can hear it, they can hear it, and I really don't need more Heavies pirouetting when I'm at 3m and closing :-) Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley

One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2702	Posted - 2014.07.16 23:29:00 - [121] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: mollerz wrote: I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. If I can hear it, they can hear it That will be the last thing they hear. This is how a minja feels
mollerz 4135	Posted - 2014.07.16 23:29:00 - [122] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: mollerz wrote: I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. If I can hear it, they can hear it It will assuredly be too late at that point. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2977	Posted - 2014.07.16 23:45:00 - [123] - Quote mollerz wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: mollerz wrote: I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. If I can hear it, they can hear it It will assuredly be too late at that point. Set backpedal and strafe speed to 80% of forward movement speed, and you've got yourself a deal. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8449	Posted - 2014.07.16 23:52:00 - [124] - Quote One other thing I can play with changing is making it so there is a smaller delay between releasing the trigger and you actually making each slash with the knives. For reference, the delay is 0.3 and 0.55 seconds for each knife hit from the moment you release the trigger. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 2980	Posted - 2014.07.17 00:08:00 - [125] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: One other thing I can play with changing is making it so there is a smaller delay between releasing the trigger and you actually making each slash with the knives. For reference, the delay is 0.3 and 0.55 seconds for each knife hit from the moment you release the trigger. So ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.30 sec Blade B swings at +0.55 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec That's a tough call. I'd hate for it to become detached from audio queues and animation. I'd also hate to land double swipes when my aim was off and I should've only landed one. If it were my experiment, I'd hold the Interval constant and reduce Blade A's delay to +0.15 seconds, such that Blade A swings almost immediately after release but the delay between A and B remains the same ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.15 sec Blade B swings at +0.40 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
mollerz 4137	Posted - 2014.07.17 00:26:00 - [126] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: mollerz wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: mollerz wrote: I remembered the other NK change I thought would help a lot. Can we have an auditory que when the knife is fully charged. It is really hard to tell when you are fully charged or not in fast moving conditions. And please- not like you guys wrecked the charged sniper rifle with it's hair dryer sound. maybe a slight beep or something. If I can hear it, they can hear it It will assuredly be too late at that point. Reduce backpedal speed, and you've got yourself a deal. I wish you were logibro's agent! Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
mollerz 4137	Posted - 2014.07.17 00:27:00 - [127] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: One other thing I can play with changing is making it so there is a smaller delay between releasing the trigger and you actually making each slash with the knives. For reference, the delay is 0.3 and 0.55 seconds for each knife hit from the moment you release the trigger. So ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.30 sec Blade B swings at +0.55 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec That's a tough call. I'd hate for it to become detached from audio queues and animation. I'd also hate to land double swipes when my aim was off and I should've only landed one. If it were my experiment, I'd hold the Interval constant and reduce Blade A's delay to +0.15 seconds, such that Blade A swings almost immediately after release but the delay between A and B remains the same ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.15 sec Blade B swings at +0.40 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec That sounds great. Bug concerns aside- this is better than adhesion imho. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1392	Posted - 2014.07.17 00:32:00 - [128] - Quote ^What they said, delay between releasing knives and actual damage would help a great deal. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8453	Posted - 2014.07.17 00:55:00 - [129] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: One other thing I can play with changing is making it so there is a smaller delay between releasing the trigger and you actually making each slash with the knives. For reference, the delay is 0.3 and 0.55 seconds for each knife hit from the moment you release the trigger. So ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.30 sec Blade B swings at +0.55 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec That's a tough call. I'd hate for it to become detached from audio queues and animation. I'd also hate to land double swipes when my aim was off and I should've only landed one. If it were my experiment, I'd hold the Interval constant and reduce Blade A's delay to +0.15 seconds, such that Blade A swings almost immediately after release but the delay between A and B remains the same ... Trigger released at 0.0 sec Blade A swings at +0.15 sec Blade B swings at +0.40 sec Interval between A and B is 0.25 sec Changing the delays should also change the animation and audio to match, but I haven't tried yet. I guess that's one to try out tomorrow. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

mollerz 4143	Posted - 2014.07.17 01:04:00 - [130] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Changing the delays should also change the animation and audio to match, but I haven't tried yet. I guess that's one to try out tomorrow. o7 Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1

Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3553	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:55:00 - [131] - Quote You know what change I think would really make the nova knives better? reduced lag and improved frame rate. WDIT: my bad. that would affect too many things at once. We can't have that, now can we? Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
mollerz 4148	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:00:00 - [132] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: You know what change I think would really make the nova knives better? reduced lag and improved frame rate. WDIT: my bad. that would affect too many things at once. We can't have that, now can we? I thought that was not even worth mentioning... given everything. But it is truth. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Haerr Legio DXIV 1079	Posted - 2014.07.17 11:36:00 - [133] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: You know what change I think would really make the nova knives better? reduced lag and improved frame rate. WDIT: my bad. that would affect too many things at once. We can't have that, now can we? This follows closely to how I think this game should be fixed: a) Remove support for the controller and focus all efforts on balancing this game using only Mouse and Keyboard. b) Reduce all graphics to meet the minimum requirement of 60fps @ 1920x1080 or you know we could balance weapons assuming that everyone is using "aim assistance", which ever you prefer... 10 / 10 would read again.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8457	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:42:00 - [134] - Quote Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3009	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:53:00 - [135] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Neat! If you don't mind our asking, what came of your experiments with Adhesion and Range Extension? Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8812	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:18:00 - [136] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Sounds like the rumored Amarr racial knives. Just a thought, could we perhaps get a nova knives variant that does 100% against vehicles in exchange for reduced efficiency on infantry? So perhaps your 100% infantry - 50% vehicle normal variant and a 50% infantry - 100% vehicle demolition variant? Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8466	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:24:00 - [137] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ CCP Logibro Neat! If you don't mind our asking, what came of your experiments with Adhesion and Range Extension? Those come later today as I need a willing victim to help me with that. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6332	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:27:00 - [138] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. LOL, AV Can Opener. Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1787	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:40:00 - [139] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Thank you Logibro. I'm never going to run any other type of AV again. Knowledge is power
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3009	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:48:00 - [140] - Quote ^ Very much like Aero's idea. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley

Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3565	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:51:00 - [141] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8816	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:54:00 - [142] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 This looks incredibly fun, and seems like something a Minmatar scout would actually do. Rag-tag demolition. I'd suggest perhaps dropping one of the hives for RE's for even more demolition nonsense (keeping in mind Minmatar scout is getting a PG buff). Amarr are the good guys Their way of the Commando seems right and noble
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3565	Posted - 2014.07.17 14:30:00 - [143] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 This looks incredibly fun, and seems like something a Minmatar scout would actually do. Rag-tag demolition. I'd suggest perhaps dropping one of the hives for RE's for even more demolition nonsense (keeping in mind Minmatar scout is getting a PG buff). I'm not very good at planting REs on HAVs, I always get gunned down or they notice me and run away before I can get down the 3rd one.. And we'll just have to wait and see for all the final changes before I switch anything up. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3013	Posted - 2014.07.17 14:48:00 - [144] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: I'm not very good at planting REs on HAVs, I always get gunned down or they notice me and run away before I can get down the 3rd one.. And we'll just have to wait and see for all the final changes before I switch anything up. The most I ever get on in one pass is two. Good tankers, only one. Its a 'bit like bullfighting ... Except you have to chase the bull around the pen :-) Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 6095	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:13:00 - [145] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ CCP Logibro Neat! If you don't mind our asking, what came of your experiments with Adhesion and Range Extension? Those come later today as I need a willing victim (likely CCP Rattati) to help me with that. There is quite a few scouts who would be willing victim. I'd do it just so that I get a chance to chat about knives with you How I Imagine I look when running Minmatar Scout PSN: EVL_Elgost105
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3895	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:18:00 - [146] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ CCP Logibro Neat! If you don't mind our asking, what came of your experiments with Adhesion and Range Extension? Those come later today as I need a willing victim (likely CCP Rattati) to help me with that. I am picturing Logibro in the lunch room challenging coworkers to a knife fight... Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3895	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:25:00 - [147] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: As far as reducing backwards moving speed, it's not "It's never going to happen". It's more "This is a massive change because it affects every suit, and if we're going to do it, we're going to cover our bases, check everything, and do it right". If I can fix Nova Knives in the interim without having to change it, then that's preferable as I have a number of other things I also want to fit into Charlie (HMG changes, Swarm Changes, maybe some others) This is an important point. As a Sentinel my standard procedure when I take too much damage in a fire fight is to back up and strafe left or right behind cover. Reducing my backup speed would make advancing even more dangerous as an HMG SentinelGÇÖs slow turn speed makes turning my back on the enemy and running back to cover take far too long, and having to interrupt my suppression fire to get to cover would make me an easy target. As far as a Sentinel fighting a Scout, if a Scout canGÇÖt advance as fast as a Sentinel is backing up, then that Scout is warring far too much Plate. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:03:00 - [148] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Bormir1r wrote: Not Iggy wrote: Removing backpedal speed is more important than any of these other changes. I appreciate the buff to PG. That will help a great deal. Improving walk speed while equipped would cause people to use them for a "strafe" improvement and reducing backpedal speed is much greater improvement as it will help the shotgun as well. Backpedal speed in the MCC before battle and merc quarters is not 100%, so it shouldn't be off the table for in the actual game. Strafe speed is also not 100%, so please nerf being able to walk backwards as fast as they can forward. I agree, nerfing back pedaling speed makes a lot more sense and would have an overall improvement rather than incremental ones for specific components in the game. I know for sure that back pedaling in MCC and waiting room is not 100%, but is it the same during battles? I haven't done any "scientific" tests, but just eye balling it, I can definitely tell the difference in speed on an MCC, but can't tell a bit of difference in game. It is much slower, I'd say at least 50%. Very obvious. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3015	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:24:00 - [149] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: This is an important point. As a Sentinel my standard procedure when I take too much damage in a fire fight is to back up and strafe left or right behind cover. Reducing my backup speed would make advancing even more dangerous as an HMG SentinelGÇÖs slow turn speed makes turning my back on the enemy and running back to cover take far too long, and having to interrupt my suppression fire to get to cover would make me an easy target. As far as a Sentinel fighting a Scout, if a Scout canGÇÖt advance as fast as a Sentinel is backing up, then that Scout is warring far too much Plate. 1) The Sentinel's turn speed is exactly the same as every other frame, with or without plates. Tested and confirmed, and reconfirmed by the Devs themselves. There is no such thing as "slow turn speed". 2) There is not a single Scout in here who runs plates while Knifing. 3) The Sentinel's backpedal speed is no less a problem for NK users than other frame's. If a charged backstab fails to kill you -- which is most common with Sentinels -- you can fully rotate well in advance of a second charged attack. The best a Scout can do in these cases is to swing uncharged, hoping he lands enough blows to finish you off. To keep you within melee distance as you walk backwards, the Scout has no choice but to walk straight at you, directly into your HMG fire. No doubt Heavies think #3 this funny, much like HAV pilots used to think that Swarms were funny. But like Swarms and HAVs, this imbalance will eventually need to be addressed. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
mollerz 4173	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:57:00 - [150] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Sounds like the rumored Amarr racial knives. Just a thought, could we perhaps get a nova knives variant that does 100% against vehicles in exchange for reduced efficiency on infantry? So perhaps your 100% infantry - 50% vehicle normal variant and a 50% infantry - 100% vehicle demolition variant? Interesting.. would make me carry two sets of knives Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3018	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:58:00 - [151] - Quote @ Fox In hindsight, I kinda went spider-monkey on you and perhaps was wrong to do so. I should take into account that your experiences and observations may differ from mine; I've no idea which loadouts you run as a Heavy. If you want to see what I'm QQing about firsthand ... Tank up a Gal Sentinel, crank your sensitivity settings then get a buddy to try to knife you in the back. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
mollerz 4173	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:01:00 - [152] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Well. that is certainly intersesting Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
mollerz 4173	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:09:00 - [153] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: As far as reducing backwards moving speed, it's not "It's never going to happen". It's more "This is a massive change because it affects every suit, and if we're going to do it, we're going to cover our bases, check everything, and do it right". If I can fix Nova Knives in the interim without having to change it, then that's preferable as I have a number of other things I also want to fit into Charlie (HMG changes, Swarm Changes, maybe some others) This is an important point. As a Sentinel my standard procedure when I take too much damage in a fire fight is to back up and strafe left or right behind cover. Reducing my backup speed would make advancing even more dangerous as an HMG SentinelGÇÖs slow turn speed makes turning my back on the enemy and running back to cover take far too long, and having to interrupt my suppression fire to get to cover would make me an easy target. As far as a Sentinel fighting a Scout, if a Scout canGÇÖt advance as fast as a Sentinel is backing up, then that Scout is warring far too much Plate. you should just jump back into your LAV and take off like every other heavy. Also, combat awareness is OP. If you are advancing too fast that is on you... I suggest playing a scout. Also, as a scout I never wear plate. I have to point out the fallacy in your belief that all scouts wear plate, and that it makes one bit of difference if you don't. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
voidfaction Void of Faction 336	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:29:00 - [154] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Oh! Oh! Oh! Can we get a buff to nova knives so they do damage to tanks again? Not Iggy wrote: You will never catch a backpeddler using knives in time for the kill. It will take a full 2 seconds even if you are 2m away. Those two seconds allows plenty of time for the DPS to be put down range. It doesn't matter if you're using a Shotgun or Nova Knives, backpeddling is just too effective at getting outside optimal ranges because the speed difference is not significant enough to matter in the time it takes to kill someone that is running knives By no means am I in any way supporting the 100% backpedal speed. I support backpedal speed reduction. Simple question anyway for those that don't only carry NK's and or Shotgun. What if the NK/Shotguner was to switch to a longer ranged weapon when target was to start backpedaling? I know I carry 2 weapons on my merc since i'm not a logi. I am also used to switching weapons when gunning down heavies using AR for shield and SMG for there armor. See no reason the same tactic wont work after first NK/Shotgun hit don't kill your target and they backpedal away. Not a fan of 100% backpedaling speed but there is a tactic to use vs a target that does the jump backpedaling maneuver. I understand you don't want to or think you should have to but the option is there all the same. I also somewhat see the tactic a counter maneuver. NK's/Shotguns do so much damage they are usually 1 hit kills and should the victim live through the first hit they have somewhat of a option/tactic to turn the tide in there favor. slim chance but a chance. just the same as the NK/shotguner has the option chance to counter the counter with a longer ranged 2nd weapon. Now to the shotgun NKers out there or logi that fit a shotgun or NK. Why would you put yourself at such a range disadvantage in the first place.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3571	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:33:00 - [155] - Quote mollerz wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Well. that is certainly intersesting Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8500	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:34:00 - [156] - Quote I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

JRleo jr Xer Cloud Consortium 59	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:40:00 - [157] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Mmmeeeeee? Max level brony. My special magic is trolling.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3896	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:40:00 - [158] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: 1) The Sentinel's turn speed is exactly the same as every other frame's (with or without plates). This fact has been tested, confirmed, reconfirmed and even defended by the Devs themselves. Slow turn speed ceased to exist in Uprising 1.4; the rate at which we spin is governed solely by our chosen sensitivity settings. If a Scout was holding an HMG the Scout would turn slowly too. But only the Sentinel has that pleasure. If I want to turn as fast as other suits I have to switch to my SMG. Adipem Nothi wrote: 2) There is not a single Scout in here who runs plates while Knifing. Then there should not be a single Scout who can't keep up with a backpedaling Sentinel. That was my point. Adipem Nothi wrote: 3) The Sentinel's backpedal speed is no less a problem for NK users than other frame's; in fact, it is likely more of a problem. If a charged backstab fails to kill you -- which is most common with Sentinels -- you can fully rotate well in advance of a second charged attack. The best a Scout can do in these cases is to stay close and swing uncharged, hoping he lands enough blows to finish you off before you pulse your HMG. To keep you within melee distance as you walk backwards, the Scout has no choice but to walk straight at you, directly into your HMG fire. A unarmored Scout's lifespan under HMG fire is best measured in tenths of a second. If the Sentinel rotates clockwise after the Charged backstab then you should be turning clockwise as well while strafing left to stay behind the Sentinel. If you get close enough to get a backstab in, and then you let the Sentinel get his HMG on you, then you messed up. Adipem Nothi wrote: No doubt many Heavies think that #3 is funny, much like many HAV pilots used to think that Swarms were funny. But like Swarms and HAVs, this imbalance will too eventually need to be addressed. Scouts are a SentinelGÇÖs hard counter. You may not have gotten the memo, but I have encountered a lot of Scouts who have. Fighting a Scout in CQC always scares the crap out of me, and if I survive the encounter it is always a relief. You need to stop playing like an Assault suit. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Appia Nappia 1031	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:41:00 - [159] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? It's nearly impossible to get unless you're going for a sniper that hasn't a clue you are there. Secretly Appia Vibbia If you can read my signature... I'm on the wrong alt.
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES RISE of LEGION 1344	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:42:00 - [160] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Oh wow this was real! Massive incentive to try out KN's! Anti Vehicle Melee! YEAAAA -=#[ Gastun's Forge ]#=- MY LIFE FOR AIUR! "I'm wasting away here" - "Get me back into zee fight!

Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3572	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:53:00 - [161] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? I think this would be a better question if you asked: Did you know Nova Knives have a headshot multiplier, and did you use Nova Knives before or after the knife event? Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3896	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:02:00 - [162] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Fox In hindsight, I kinda went spider-monkey on you and perhaps was wrong to do so. I should take into account that your experiences and observations may differ from my own. I've no idea which loadouts you run as a Heavy; as a point of reference, I knife using a GalScout w/a sidearm damage amp and prototype knives (proficiency 5). If you want to see what I'm QQing about firsthand ... Tank up a Proto Gal Sentinel with a decent HMG, crank your sensitivity settings, and find an experienced Knifer. Begin your "duel" with a perfectly placed NK backstab, then do what comes naturally (bunnyhop, pirouette, backpedal, spray, etc). I got interrupted while responding so it took 30 minutes or so between hitting Quote and actually posting, so I did not see this post before responding. I admit I donGÇÖt have much experience with Brick Tanked Sentinels. (I thought that stacking plats effected turn speed and backpedal speed, but I could be wrong about that.) I had a logi chew me out once for not equipping plates, and I had to sheepishly admit that I could only use Militia plates, despite having all proto modules in my normal fit. I can equip proto plates now, but I almost never run such fits. So in my experience, a good Nova Knifer can often kill me before I can turn around. It usually takes two hits. If I set the sensitivity high enough to turn quickly I would never be able to hit anything. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3896	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:05:00 - [163] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Nice fit. I like how you have the Compact Nanohive for repairing your armour. Why a normal Nano hive with it instead of two Compact Nanohives? Is that for WP farming or does the Compact Nanohive (even two of them) not give enough to keep the Plasma Cannon fed? Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3574	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:15:00 - [164] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Nice fit. I like how you have the Compact Nanohive for repairing your armour. Why a normal Nano hive with it instead of two Compact Nanohives? Is that for WP farming or does the Compact Nanohive (even two of them) not give enough to keep the Plasma Cannon fed? yeah, the compact is my go-to armor repairer on Minmatar and Caldari pub suits. Often times I run a dampener on my Assault C-I or M-I because Logistics keep scanning me But the basic nanohive instead of another compact is because (1) dual hives rep armor before resupplying and (2) I have two to deploy which will keep the PLC and grenades fed longer before I suicide or have to look for a Supply Depot as the battle moves throughout the map. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3023	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:23:00 - [165] - Quote @ Fox That makes more sense; low HP sentinels are not part of the problem. With respect, you would better understand the problem if you had experienced it firsthand. To assume that I or other scouts are "doing it wrong" would be incorrect, irresponsible and beneath your lofty station :-). Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3898	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:35:00 - [166] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Fox Gaden wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: New favorite fit: M/1-Series http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/161/5532 Nice fit. I like how you have the Compact Nanohive for repairing your armour. Why a normal Nano hive with it instead of two Compact Nanohives? Is that for WP farming or does the Compact Nanohive (even two of them) not give enough to keep the Plasma Cannon fed? yeah, the compact is my go-to armor repairer on Minmatar and Caldari pub suits. Often times I run a dampener on my Assault C-I or M-I because Logistics keep scanning me But the basic nanohive instead of another compact is because (1) dual hives rep armor before resupplying and (2) I have two to deploy which will keep the PLC and grenades fed longer before I suicide or have to look for a Supply Depot as the battle moves throughout the map. Ah, yes, the grenades. They would pop a Compact Nano Hive quickly even if you were not getting reps before resupply. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
I-Shayz-I I----------I 4139	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:38:00 - [167] - Quote LOGIBRO: If Nova Knives will do 50% efficiency to vehicles...please consider changing Mass Drivers, Flaylocks, and other explosive weapons to deal at least the same if not more efficiency... Cause having my grenade launcher do less damage to a tank than nova knives seems somewhat...off. Just saying. (for those that don't know, the mass driver does 40% efficiency to vehicles) 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3898	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:43:00 - [168] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Fox That makes more sense; low HP sentinels are not part of the problem. With respect, you would better understand the problem if you had experienced it firsthand. To assume that I or other scouts are "doing it wrong" would be incorrect, irresponsible and beneath your lofty station :-). Well, to be fair, some Scouts are doing it wrong, and I donGÇÖt recall having fought against you in particular, so I had no way to judge how you play. With regards to Brick Tanked Sentinels, I suspect that when they cut the movement penalty on Armour Plates back when Plates were considered inferior to Shields, that they may have went a little too far. Having that much Armour buffer should make a suit slow, which should effect backpedal speeds. Edit: I believe that a Brick Tanked Sentinel should have to switch to his SMG to kill Scouts (increased turn speed), or rely on his Logi to take them out. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Sole Fenychs Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 533	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:46:00 - [169] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). May I ask what the rationale behind weak points is, anyway? I always wondered, because it looks like a really random thing to have in this game. Are there any AV guys who even go for that weak point? Do you have stats on how often weak point hits actually made an impact on an engagement? Other than that, I love this change. It will make NK attractive to me and adds another AV melee weapon. ...It's also yet another Caldari AV weapon, which is kinda funny.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 3899	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:50:00 - [170] - Quote Sole Fenychs wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). May I ask what the rationale behind weak points is, anyway? I always wondered, because it looks like a really random thing to have in this game. Are there any AV guys who even go for that weak point? Do you have stats on how often weak point hits actually made an impact on an engagement? Other than that, I love this change. It will make NK attractive to me and adds another AV melee weapon. ...It's also yet another Caldari AV weapon, which is kinda funny. HAV: Weak points are the Engine (back canter), and the treads. Those are also the weak points IRL. LAV: Weak point again is the Engine, this time on the front. Dropship: Weak point is the external thrusters on sides neat the back. Every smart tanker will go for the weak points when fighting another HAV or shooting a DropShip. I always go for the engine when trying to take out a LAV with my HMG. It does not really help much with Swarm Launchers (totally luck) but it makes a big difference with a Forge Gun. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.

BlazeXYZ xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 45	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:52:00 - [171] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: LOGIBRO: If Nova Knives will do 50% efficiency to vehicles...please consider changing Mass Drivers, Flaylocks, and other explosive weapons to deal at least the same if not more efficiency... Cause having my grenade launcher do less damage to a tank than nova knives seems somewhat...off. Just saying. (for those that don't know, the mass driver does 40% efficiency to vehicles) I would love to have 50% efficiency on the flaylock. Lav destroyed by a flaylock lol. The Blazing Intellect Machine
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2760	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:41:00 - [172] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Heh Hahahahahaha This is how a minja feels
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2760	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:42:00 - [173] - Quote Sole Fenychs wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). May I ask what the rationale behind weak points is, anyway? I always wondered, because it looks like a really random thing to have in this game. Are there any AV guys who even go for that weak point? Do you have stats on how often weak point hits actually made an impact on an engagement? Other than that, I love this change. It will make NK attractive to me and adds another AV melee weapon. ...It's also yet another Caldari AV weapon, which is kinda funny. It is not any different than having a head shot bonus. This is how a minja feels
Crimson ShieId Psygod9 668	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:52:00 - [174] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. I... I think I'm in love~ <3 Nova Knives are best sidearm.
DarthMcFizzle MOOSE-KNUCKLEz CLAN 39	Posted - 2014.07.17 21:44:00 - [175] - Quote 2.5 meters?? Those are some pretty long arms (unless the blades are getting bigger) ;) All kidding aside though these seem like good changes as i hardly seem to be killed by these things, but i would like to know the price of a Proto set of knives (might change my opinion)
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3586	Posted - 2014.07.17 21:55:00 - [176] - Quote DarthMcFizzle wrote: 2.5 meters?? Those are some pretty long arms (unless the blades are getting bigger) ;) All kidding aside though these seem like good changes as i hardly seem to be killed by these things, but i would like to know the price of a Proto set of knives (might change my opinion) 12,750 ISK Appia Vibbia for CPM1 Personal Theme Song
Syeven Reed G0DS AM0NG MEN 769	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:00:00 - [177] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Hmm, I have wondered how I'm able to one swipe some gal heavys. Thought they may have just been under tanked - guess not! Twitter MajLagSpike CPM Application
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1397	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:10:00 - [178] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? You could look at changing that to a "Backstab" bonus and it would be more appropriate. <3 My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2794	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:40:00 - [179] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? I had heard something about it, but was never sure if it was a real thing, or just a rumor. I might have to try to knife more heavies in the head now. This is how a minja feels
J4yne C0bb Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 482	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:48:00 - [180] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. LOL, AV Can Opener. I am sooooo looking forward to the first vid of a all-Minja squad knifing a tank to death. Min Logi \| aka Punch R0ckgroin, fatman

Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1807	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:54:00 - [181] - Quote J4yne C0bb wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. LOL, AV Can Opener. I am sooooo looking forward to the first vid of a all-Minja squad knifing a tank to death. Keep an eye out for the channel "Army Ants" when the changes come through... Knowledge is power
Assault Swarm Launcher Caldari State 206	Posted - 2014.07.18 02:41:00 - [182] - Quote Brokerib wrote: I'm never going to run any other type of AV again. "Chances are I'm going to kill you or replace you with something new..." -CCP Logibro
THUNDERGROOVE Fatal Absolution 1049	Posted - 2014.07.18 02:53:00 - [183] - Quote Appia Nappia wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? It's nearly impossible to get unless you're going for a sniper that hasn't a clue you are there. I kinda disagree. I don't knife very often, but there are many times where I only get the OHK because I got the headshot with them. I don't usually try that hard to get them, but it's nice when you do. Amarrica! Destiny Beta SoonGäó
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2168	Posted - 2014.07.18 03:07:00 - [184] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. LOL, AV Can Opener. It's been a long time, but i remember stopping and staring in admiration, back in Beta, as a knifer got on top of a damaged tank and hacked it to death. This is a reason for my minja to finally fit myofibs PSN: RationalSpark
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 322	Posted - 2014.07.18 08:04:00 - [185] - Quote omg... i might skill into Minjas after all! bravo, er... i mean charlie... i mean good stuff Logibro mainly I like the fitting optimization as I have only barely tried out knifing and don't know much about it DUST 514 Forums. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villa- er, I mean panty weights and neckbeards.
mollerz 4212	Posted - 2014.07.18 11:02:00 - [186] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Appia Nappia wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? It's nearly impossible to get unless you're going for a sniper that hasn't a clue you are there. I kinda disagree. I don't knife very often, but there are many times where I only get the OHK because I got the headshot with them. I don't usually try that hard to get them, but it's nice when you do. lolz. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1810	Posted - 2014.07.18 12:03:00 - [187] - Quote Assault Swarm Launcher wrote: Brokerib wrote: I'm never going to run any other type of AV again. There there Swarm, I never ran you anyways... Knowledge is power
Ramux PATAPON LORD-BRITISH 30	Posted - 2014.07.18 15:19:00 - [188] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? I know. And many of Japanese people know because of this movie http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm22848585 Translating DUST News into Japanese.. so quickly like Scout suits.. @FPSholicsDiary
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 537	Posted - 2014.07.18 16:32:00 - [189] - Quote Will the Ishukone NK get the black and red prototype color scheme? "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Greiv Rabbah KiLo. 11	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:01:00 - [190] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? just enough to know not to tell anybody who doesnt use targeting on their stabs

Greiv Rabbah KiLo. 11	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:05:00 - [191] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: LOGIBRO: If Nova Knives will do 50% efficiency to vehicles...please consider changing Mass Drivers, Flaylocks, and other explosive weapons to deal at least the same if not more efficiency... Cause having my grenade launcher do less damage to a tank than nova knives seems somewhat...off. Just saying. (for those that don't know, the mass driver does 40% efficiency to vehicles) mass drivers and laser rifles are supposed to be light AV... can this get fixed? infantry weapon efficiancy vs light vehicles on a light AV weapon is stupid broken
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2251	Posted - 2014.07.19 01:56:00 - [192] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. Cool. But now that tanks have been limited to their infantry killing power... But still retain the Health and indirect health buffs. Limiting Tank on tank TTK.. And making them near obsolete in competitive play. Give the "Tank" back to the tank.
Cyrus Grevare WarRavens Final Resolution. 234	Posted - 2014.07.19 18:22:00 - [193] - Quote Created the Nova Knives Fitting Optimization skill for Hotfix Charlie for theorycrafting in protofits. Regards. www.protofits.com - a Dust 514 fitting tool
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 2719	Posted - 2014.07.20 15:28:00 - [194] - Quote Finally! Fitting optimization! Anyways, as someone brought up hit detection, the second slash almost always gets blue shields if the first slash doesn't connect, even if the second one does. The extra range and adhesion is meh. Don't know how those will end up until I actualy feel the change.
OZAROW Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 1458	Posted - 2014.07.20 22:47:00 - [195] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Glad to see my request for an optimization skill is getting in. The small range increase will be nice and the aim adhesion will help alleviate the problem of our narrow FOV. STD knives will still be pretty meh but a small increase is better than no increase. Thanks for looking into them. o7 Your request for optimization? Taking credit for that eh? Kinda like the guy that took my idea for ninja knifers and calling it scouts united, ok Bruv SUPER NOVA KNIFE SAIYAN 4
Phoever Asian Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 1	Posted - 2014.07.21 01:20:00 - [196] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? I know, Lv5 Min Scout Lv3 NK Proficiency I only carry Nova Knives, no 2nd weapon. You'd know me from kill feed. ;) Isn't it 135% for a head?
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1841	Posted - 2014.07.21 04:29:00 - [197] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Just curious Logibro, do you know what the multiplier is for headshots? Doing some theorycrafing on max damage output. Also, is there a reason the Nova Knife doesn't produce the noise or bonus WP for a headshot kill? Knowledge is power
Phoever Asian Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 2	Posted - 2014.07.21 06:09:00 - [198] - Quote I'm pretty sure a headshot meaning "shot to the head", and that nova knives is something the doesn't consume any ammo.
Haerr Legio DXIV 1121	Posted - 2014.07.21 12:07:00 - [199] - Quote Even if you do not give us 60 WPs for a headshot kill with the Nova Knives can you at least change it to say (confirm) that we killed the guy with a headshot? Like this -"You stabbed that guy in the head, good on you. +50 WP" Even just giving us the "headshot sound" would be great. 10 / 10 would read again.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8649	Posted - 2014.07.21 12:48:00 - [200] - Quote Brokerib wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Just curious Logibro, do you know what the multiplier is for headshots? Doing some theorycrafing on max damage output. Also, is there a reason the Nova Knife doesn't produce the noise or bonus WP for a headshot kill? 150% damage. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)


Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2014.07.21 18:04:00 - [201] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Brokerib wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Just curious Logibro, do you know what the multiplier is for headshots? Doing some theorycrafing on max damage output. Also, is there a reason the Nova Knife doesn't produce the noise or bonus WP for a headshot kill? 150% damage. So prototype (black and red) color scheme too? Would be really nice lol. =P "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 2720	Posted - 2014.07.22 01:40:00 - [202] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Brokerib wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? Just curious Logibro, do you know what the multiplier is for headshots? Doing some theorycrafing on max damage output. Also, is there a reason the Nova Knife doesn't produce the noise or bonus WP for a headshot kill? 150% damage. So prototype (black and red) color scheme too? Would be really nice lol. =P Yes! Please! Jesus!
iKILLu osborne WarRavens Final Resolution. 105	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:53:00 - [203] - Quote 3 years after legion drops a old vet says "come gather around children and hear the tale that made duna qq on the dust 514 forums" "uh guys" "i got to go back to the mcc those 10 ads's made me crap my dropsuit"
I-Shayz-I I----------I 4201	Posted - 2014.07.22 07:18:00 - [204] - Quote Any reply about Nova knives getting MORE efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers? Cause honestly if it happens that would just be extremely silly. 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8891	Posted - 2014.07.22 07:43:00 - [205] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Just to cut any discussion off at the pass, charging knives while sprinting is off the table. It's not going to happen, so please don't bring it up in this thread. Well, just as long as you're fixing other aspects of the nova knives I would care less about the sprint-charge idea. I know I kept bringing it up a lot in the past but that was because of how knives were in the past and how much help they needed. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 8892	Posted - 2014.07.22 07:51:00 - [206] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: I'm also curious about another thing: how many of you know that a headshot with Nova Knives does extra damage? I was under the impression that there wasn't extra damage for headshots with knives. In my entire 2 years of playing Dust I never noticed it and never got a WP bonus for it either so I assumed there was none. That was in the day prior to Fanfest 2014 though before I put my character into cold storage so I don't know what's changed for the knives. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 619	Posted - 2014.07.22 13:02:00 - [207] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. LOL, AV Can Opener. It's been a long time, but i remember stopping and staring in admiration, back in Beta, as a knifer got on top of a damaged tank and hacked it to death. This is a reason for my minja to finally fit myofibs Myofibs don't add to knife damage, only melee. Don't waste your SP :) You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1420	Posted - 2014.07.22 13:32:00 - [208] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: Any reply about Nova knives getting MORE efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers? Cause honestly if it happens that would just be extremely silly. There hasn't been a response because this is a "nova knife" feedback thread. If there is anything we have learned, its that the Devs prefer to only have feedback on the topic at hand and not some wild squirrel chase. The NK has to be within 1m of that tank to apply its damage, the mass driver doesn't have that restriction. Therefore no, the mass driver should not have 50% efficacy. 40% efficacy vs 50% is going to be <20 more damage even with the MD. It would be a giant waste of dev time for them to go and change all the weapon efficacy values for such a "pointless" change. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 555	Posted - 2014.07.22 13:56:00 - [209] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: Any reply about Nova knives getting MORE efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers? Cause honestly if it happens that would just be extremely silly. There hasn't been a response because this is a "nova knife" feedback thread. If there is anything we have learned, its that the Devs prefer to only have feedback on the topic at hand and not some wild squirrel chase. The NK has to be within 1m of that tank to apply its damage, the mass driver doesn't have that restriction. Therefore no, the mass driver should not have 50% efficacy. 40% efficacy vs 50% is going to be <20 more damage even with the MD. It would be a giant waste of dev time for them to go and change all the weapon efficacy values for such a "pointless" change. There's even the possibility of getting run over when you get that close to a tank, all they have to do is move back in the direction you are and you're "road kill." "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 620	Posted - 2014.07.22 19:58:00 - [210] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: IgniteableAura wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: Any reply about Nova knives getting MORE efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers? Cause honestly if it happens that would just be extremely silly. There hasn't been a response because this is a "nova knife" feedback thread. If there is anything we have learned, its that the Devs prefer to only have feedback on the topic at hand and not some wild squirrel chase. The NK has to be within 1m of that tank to apply its damage, the mass driver doesn't have that restriction. Therefore no, the mass driver should not have 50% efficacy. 40% efficacy vs 50% is going to be <20 more damage even with the MD. It would be a giant waste of dev time for them to go and change all the weapon efficacy values for such a "pointless" change. There's even the possibility of getting run over when you get that close to a tank, all they have to do is move back in the direction you are and you're "road kill." I've noticed also some annoying glitch when attempting to plant REs on the back - it's like it bumps you about - tank's not even moving as far as I know. Now I think about the change a while ago now to sticky REs, perhaps I can just throw the things from a couple metres away lol. But I like to place them precisely in a neat line along the back of the tank...coz OCD or something. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz

Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2014.07.22 20:17:00 - [211] - Quote IAmDuncanIdaho II wrote: Bormir1r wrote: IgniteableAura wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: Any reply about Nova knives getting MORE efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers? Cause honestly if it happens that would just be extremely silly. There hasn't been a response because this is a "nova knife" feedback thread. If there is anything we have learned, its that the Devs prefer to only have feedback on the topic at hand and not some wild squirrel chase. The NK has to be within 1m of that tank to apply its damage, the mass driver doesn't have that restriction. Therefore no, the mass driver should not have 50% efficacy. 40% efficacy vs 50% is going to be <20 more damage even with the MD. It would be a giant waste of dev time for them to go and change all the weapon efficacy values for such a "pointless" change. There's even the possibility of getting run over when you get that close to a tank, all they have to do is move back in the direction you are and you're "road kill." I've noticed also some annoying glitch when attempting to plant REs on the back - it's like it bumps you about - tank's not even moving as far as I know. Now I think about the change a while ago now to sticky REs, perhaps I can just throw the things from a couple metres away lol. But I like to place them precisely in a neat line along the back of the tank...coz OCD or something. Lol that works too, as long as they're stuck on to it. There's also that other bug where the REs somehow are stuck in midair after you place them on the tank, when they in fact are on the tank, and after a couple of seconds seem to follow the tank while hovering in midair. Weird stuff my friend, good thing my NK will replace my REs next Hotfix. #Flux&Knife "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.
I-Shayz-I I----------I 4248	Posted - 2014.07.22 22:51:00 - [212] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: It would be a giant waste of dev time for them to go and change all the weapon efficacy values for such a "pointless" change. Mass Drivers should do explosive damage to vehicles at the same efficiency as swarms. That wouldn't be a "pointless" change. I never said "Please buff Mass Drivers from 40% to 50% efficiency" anywhere in my posts...I wanted to know why the hell Nova knives will be buffed to do more damage efficiency against tanks than a LAUNCHER does. Pretty sure Mass Driver rounds even fly through the air FASTER than swarms do, meaning that there's no reason for the Mass Driver to do such little damage to vehicles. Besides, Swarms deal an average of 100% damage, the PLC does an average of 100% damage, both which have huge range advantages over the nova knives. It's not like swarms get a 20% efficiency because you can be so far away from the target when firing them...your reasoning for nova knives against vehicles being "risk vs reward" is silly. The PLC also does a decent job against infantry, so you can't argue that the Mass Driver shouldn't get it because it's not an "AV" weapon. Heck if you were to say that, then the Nova knives shouldn't be doing 50% damage to vehicles in the first place because they really aren't anything close to an "AV" weapon. _______________________________________________________________________ I get that they want feedback for Nova Knives in this thread, but my feedback was essentially: Nova knives should not be buffed to do more efficiency to vehicles than Mass Drivers, because why should a knife be able to do more damage than an explosive weapon? If you buff the nova knives against vehicles, you buff the Mass Driver against vehicles. 7162 wp with a Repair Tool! List of Legion Feedback Threads!

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8686	Posted - 2014.07.23 12:06:00 - [213] - Quote For discussion on other weapons, please make new thread or use an existing thread. This thread is just for Nova Knives. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 565	Posted - 2014.07.23 17:32:00 - [214] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: For discussion on other weapons, please make new thread or use an existing thread. This thread is just for Nova Knives. Is there a google doc with all the NK changes? That would be nice. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8689	Posted - 2014.07.23 17:46:00 - [215] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: For discussion on other weapons, please make new thread or use an existing thread. This thread is just for Nova Knives. Is there a google doc with all the NK changes? That would be nice. No, but the first post in this thread should be updated with all the changes. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Devadander Woodgrain Atari 33	Posted - 2014.07.23 19:00:00 - [216] - Quote http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... "Tossin uplinks and runnin fer my life" ~ Gunny blownapart "Lets group up and push an objective" ~ No blueberry ever
J4yne C0bb Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 491	Posted - 2014.07.23 20:16:00 - [217] - Quote Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... I think the buff to the standard NK is good, which will make fits a bit easier, considering how difficult Min scout suits are to fit. I'm kinda meh about the aim adhesion, considering how long it took for me to the hang of it. I'd prefer if it remain somewhat difficult, as is. Keeps it skill based, and not something anybody can just pickup, like how forge sniping is now. Min Logi \| aka Punch R0ckgroin, fatman
Crimson ShieId Psygod9 680	Posted - 2014.07.23 21:15:00 - [218] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Bormir1r wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: For discussion on other weapons, please make new thread or use an existing thread. This thread is just for Nova Knives. Is there a google doc with all the NK changes? That would be nice. No, but the first post in this thread should be updated with all the changes. And a note for the aim adhesion: It's on now, but we haven't managed to get much out of it. At this stage we'll still deploy it on, but we may decide to roll out Charlie without the aim adhesion just to see how the other changes stand on their own. Lastly, there's a strong chance that we won't get the Fitting Optimization skill in. If that's the case, we'll just cut some base PG off the Nova Knife. I'd honestly like to see the aim adhesion left off, or like aim assist, the option to turn it off should be there if nothing else. As for everything else... Throws arms in the air Woohoo! Nova Knives are best sidearm.
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3211	Posted - 2014.07.23 22:39:00 - [219] - Quote If I'm reading Logibro correctly, he's saying the change to aim adhesion will have little, if any, effect. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1940	Posted - 2014.07.23 23:47:00 - [220] - Quote Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... Yes, they do. They cost too much to fit, are ineffective at the standard and advanced tier, and have issues with hit detection. You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. And yes, some of us use them as main weapons. There's even a couple who run Nova Knives as their only weapon. Knowledge is power

JRleo jr Xer Cloud Consortium 100	Posted - 2014.07.23 23:51:00 - [221] - Quote Brokerib wrote: Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... Yes, they do. They cost too much to fit, are ineffective at the standard and advanced tier, and have issues with hit detection. You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. And yes, some of us use them as main weapons. There's even a couple who run Nova Knives as their only weapon. 36/6 domination vs some proto, basic or std knives Pretty good, eh? Max level brony. Pink fluffy unicorns http://youtu.be/C34BzC7rnos Best song evar.
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1942	Posted - 2014.07.24 00:12:00 - [222] - Quote JRleo jr wrote: Brokerib wrote: Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... Yes, they do. They cost too much to fit, are ineffective at the standard and advanced tier, and have issues with hit detection. You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. And yes, some of us use them as main weapons. There's even a couple who run Nova Knives as their only weapon. 36/6 domination vs some proto, basic or std knives Pretty good, eh? Very good! My best with knives is 8 in a match, using ZNs. Also in domination I think. Amazing how little attention people pay to bodies dropping to the ground behind them. Knowledge is power
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3678	Posted - 2014.07.24 02:36:00 - [223] - Quote Brokerib wrote: Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... Yes, they do. They cost too much to fit, are ineffective at the standard and advanced tier, and have issues with hit detection. You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. And yes, some of us use them as main weapons. There's even a couple who run Nova Knives as their only weapon. I strongly disagree with you there. They cost the same as Viziam Scrambler Pistol. That's hardly anything at all. Personal Theme Song
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1954	Posted - 2014.07.24 02:42:00 - [224] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Brokerib wrote: Devadander wrote: http://youtu.be/_s76GK2vEig?list=UUlbc3XILbKpyQGjsH9pgOgw Logibroman, I need you to watch Moody's NK vids and tell me.... Do the knives really need a polish? Everyone else: Are you trying to use them as a main weapon?..... Yes, they do. They cost too much to fit, are ineffective at the standard and advanced tier, and have issues with hit detection. You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. And yes, some of us use them as main weapons. There's even a couple who run Nova Knives as their only weapon. I strongly disagree with you there. They cost the same as Viziam Scrambler Pistol. That's hardly anything at all. It is on a Minja... Knowledge is power
SponkSponkSponk The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 941	Posted - 2014.07.24 03:38:00 - [225] - Quote Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. Dust/Eve transfers
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1955	Posted - 2014.07.24 03:56:00 - [226] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. It was balanced around PC the game mode, not individual PC players. PC enforces meta play that highlights min/max and balance issues far more quickley than any other mode. PC players do not equal apex players. PC equals apex game mode. Balancing around the ability of individual players is pointless. It's like those posts where you see a known slayer start an alt, max out a single weapon, play three matches and then claim that it's OP because 'I went 60/0 with it'. They didn't go 60/0 because of the weapon, they went 60/0 because they're really good a killing people. Top tier knifers could go K/D positive with a soup spoon, because apex slayers are OP. Balancing soup spoons around their play will result in everyone wielding tea spoons, while they still go 60/0. Knowledge is power
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3226	Posted - 2014.07.24 04:05:00 - [227] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. Fair point, but I think you mistook his meaning. There's more to weapon balance than what you see in a Moody video. For every good NK montage out there, there's an equally good NK fail montage. Knives are consistently inconsistent; Moody himself has said that they generally aren't worth using in competitive play. These weapons are wielded by 300HP mercs who risk all on one shot against a 1,500HP opponents. Inconsistency is unacceptable. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3680	Posted - 2014.07.24 14:04:00 - [228] - Quote Brokerib wrote: Top tier knifers could go K/D positive with a soup spoon, because apex slayers are OP. Balancing soup spoons around their play will result in everyone wielding tea spoons, while they still go 60/0. It is true. I go KDR positive with a soup spoon, but, Without the IshNoKs I can't knife Sentinels and Commandos or Proto-Logistics, so I shy away from the (STD) Nova Knives these days. Personal Theme Song
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3680	Posted - 2014.07.24 14:28:00 - [229] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. Fair point, but I think you mistook his meaning. There's more to weapon balance than what you see in a Moody video. For every good NK montage out there, there's an equally good NK fail montage. Knives are consistently inconsistent; Moody himself has said that they're generally too unreliable to count on in competitive play. Nova Knives are wielded by 300HP mercs who risk all on one shot against 1000+HP opponents. Inconsistency is unacceptable. These guys don't get second chances; they deserve a reliable weapon. And this is why I can brazenly claim I average the most Nova Knife kills in PC per match. Because no one else runs them anymore and my average is like 2.3-2.8 kills per match Personal Theme Song
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1428	Posted - 2014.07.24 19:50:00 - [230] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: And a note for the aim adhesion: It's on now, but we haven't managed to get much out of it. At this stage we'll still deploy it on, but we may decide to roll out Charlie without the aim adhesion just to see how the other changes stand on their own. Lastly, there's a strong chance that we won't get the Fitting Optimization skill in. If that's the case, we'll just cut some base PG off the Nova Knife. So you are saying the aim adhesion is on the current build? Cause I spend a good deal of time knifing last night and I didn't notice any adhesion. I actually got really frustrating trying to knife a backpedaler only to get punched in the face......his punches were longer than my knives. Made me sad and excited for the range increase. Looking forward to PG reduction. I actually prefer it this way since I won't have to invest more SP. My Youtube Biomassed Podcast

Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 579	Posted - 2014.07.24 20:00:00 - [231] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: And a note for the aim adhesion: It's on now, but we haven't managed to get much out of it. At this stage we'll still deploy it on, but we may decide to roll out Charlie without the aim adhesion just to see how the other changes stand on their own. Lastly, there's a strong chance that we won't get the Fitting Optimization skill in. If that's the case, we'll just cut some base PG off the Nova Knife. So you are saying the aim adhesion is on the current build? Cause I spend a good deal of time knifing last night and I didn't notice any adhesion. I actually got really frustrating trying to knife a backpedaler only to get punched in the face......his punches were longer than my knives. Made me sad and excited for the range increase. Looking forward to PG reduction. I actually prefer it this way since I won't have to invest more SP. Lol....wait I just got lv. 4 proficiency to be ready for the optimization skill....fml "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8717	Posted - 2014.07.24 20:28:00 - [232] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: And a note for the aim adhesion: It's on now, but we haven't managed to get much out of it. At this stage we'll still deploy it on, but we may decide to roll out Charlie without the aim adhesion just to see how the other changes stand on their own. Lastly, there's a strong chance that we won't get the Fitting Optimization skill in. If that's the case, we'll just cut some base PG off the Nova Knife. So you are saying the aim adhesion is on the current build? Cause I spend a good deal of time knifing last night and I didn't notice any adhesion. I actually got really frustrating trying to knife a backpedaler only to get punched in the face......his punches were longer than my knives. Made me sad and excited for the range increase. Looking forward to PG reduction. I actually prefer it this way since I won't have to invest more SP. No sorry, it's on in my test build but when I've been knife fighting with the others we haven't noticed much difference. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)

Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 588	Posted - 2014.07.24 20:38:00 - [233] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. Fair point, but I think you mistook his meaning. There's more to weapon balance than what you see in a Moody video. For every good NK montage out there, there's an equally good NK fail montage. Knives are consistently inconsistent; Moody himself has said that they're generally too unreliable to count on in competitive play. Nova Knives are wielded by 300HP mercs who risk all on one shot against 1000+HP opponents. Inconsistency is unacceptable. These guys don't get second chances; they deserve a reliable weapon. And this is why I can brazenly claim I average the most Nova Knife kills in PC per match. Because no one else runs them anymore and my average is like 2.3-2.8 kills per match I'll beat you =) "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only Mk.0 Scouts will do that. NK are my Teeth, Kin Cats are my Legs.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 1436	Posted - 2014.07.25 04:57:00 - [234] - Quote Thanks for clarifying, are you planning on "turning it up" or just playing it out to see how it feels. Are you guys worried about unintended consequences if you aren't seeing anything in the test build? Any word on timeline? My Youtube Biomassed Podcast
Derpty Derp It's All Gone Derp 224	Posted - 2014.07.25 18:11:00 - [235] - Quote I think you should be allowed to throw your knives... But then you have to pick them up again before you can use them... But then I had fun playing a somewhat broken game called Haze, back in the day.
ladwar HEARTS OF PHOENIX 2016	Posted - 2014.07.26 14:28:00 - [236] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. um ok? whats the point in buffing NK damage % to vehicles. isn't that still below the the regen stop limit? Level 2 Forum Warrior, bitter vet. I shall smite Thy Trolls with numbers and truth doing reviews in free time, want 1?
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1696	Posted - 2014.07.26 22:21:00 - [237] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: SponkSponkSponk wrote: Brokerib wrote: You can't balance a weapon around apex players like Moody or Musturd, knives need to be balanced around normal users if we're ever going to have more than a couple of dozen regular users. We literally just rebalanced scouts around apex players (in PC), please be consistent. Fair point, but I think you mistook his meaning. There's more to weapon balance than what you see in a Moody video. For every good NK montage out there, there's an equally good NK fail montage. Knives are consistently inconsistent; Moody himself has said that they're generally too unreliable to count on in competitive play. Nova Knives are wielded by 300HP mercs who risk all on one shot against 1000+HP opponents. Inconsistency is unacceptable. These guys don't get second chances; they deserve a reliable weapon. And this is why I can brazenly claim I average the most Nova Knife kills in PC per match. Because no one else runs them anymore and my average is like 2.3-2.8 kills per match HEY!!! YOURE FORGETTING SOMEONE!!! "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Brokerib Lone Wolves Club 1983	Posted - 2014.07.27 00:57:00 - [238] - Quote ladwar wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Alright, so after a little testing I'm going to reduce the knife hit time from 0.3 and 0.55 to 0.2 and 0.45. The animation however is fixed, so it will seem a bit quicker, but the hit markers will indicate accurately when you hit. Secondly, Nova Knife damage is now being changed to 120/160/200. And lastly, Nova Knives will do 50% damage to vehicles. No bonuses to hitting weak points (not yet at least). They will still not do damage to installations. I may revisit that last point if we at least reduce WP for destroying neutral turrets. um ok? whats the point in buffing NK damage % to vehicles. isn't that still below the the regen stop limit? A charged shot shoud do 500+ damage. Thats enough to get the party started. Knowledge is power
Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 368	Posted - 2014.07.28 21:22:00 - [239] - Quote Can I ask why guns aren't getting a similar buff of sorts?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3346	Posted - 2014.07.29 02:31:00 - [240] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Can I ask why guns aren't getting a similar buff of sorts? Can you be more specific? Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley

emm kay New Age Empire. General Tso's Alliance 151	Posted - 2014.07.29 06:10:00 - [241] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Just to cut any discussion off at the pass, charging knives while sprinting is off the table. It's not going to happen, so please don't bring it up in this thread. If you see any issues with any of these changes, please discuss them in this thread. Please make sure to also read all my posts in thread before responding, as some things have been changed. You can easily skip forward to the next dev post by clicking the blue tag on my forum avatar. Can we atleast have kincats increase walking speed then? It's annoying to have novas charged and you're speedwalking behind a blueberry. -- You called, sir?
Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 370	Posted - 2014.07.29 06:55:00 - [242] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Can I ask why guns aren't getting a similar buff of sorts? Can you be more specific? Vehicle damage buff
mollerz 4481	Posted - 2014.07.30 04:48:00 - [243] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Can I ask why guns aren't getting a similar buff of sorts? Can you be more specific? Vehicle damage buff If you are talking flaylocks and mass drivers I'm with you. Dingle Dust Berry.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 8784	Posted - 2014.07.30 20:03:00 - [244] - Quote The discussion on Nova Knives has run it's course, and thanks to those giving feedback. Those asking about other damage from other weapons vs vehicles, I would ask you make new threads to discuss the topic. CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites (a¦á_a¦á)



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