DUST Search - CCP, the silence is doing harm.

Vargralor wrote:

Timothy Reaper wrote:

The thing is CCP did make that promise, and those features people were 'daydreaming' about were things CCP again promised were coming to the game.

Very true. But when they looked in detail at those things they saw that it would require a fundamental rewrite of the underlying structure and motivations of the game. People throw around terms like Player Market and Player Driven Economy without understanding how they are fundamentally different. A Player Market is little more that a frontend to allow players to trade items they already have and at least one Dev post since Fanfest has mentioned that they still plan to deliver this for Dust. A Player Driven Economy is not something you can simply patch into what is essentially a Lobby Shooter. You need to have an underlying mechanism for harvesting and/or manufacturing along with sufficient motivation to do so. Engaging in PVE as a valid and rewarding alternative to PVP needs again a sufficient reason to do so alogn with balanced risks and rewards.

Whilst you could tack these things onto the current gamemodes of Dust it could never be properly integrated with the sandbox style economy of EVE which was the overall goal. The Dust economy needed the underlying sandbox structure along the ability for PVP focused individuals to come along and ruin your day. Otherwise it would create an imbalance in the EVE economy due to the risk/reward imbalance which must be viewed on a significant scale to understand the effects across such a large game structure. Turning a lobby shooter like Dust into a sandbox style interaction environment means essentially starting again. Given that, CCP made the right call and said "OK. Instead of continuing bandaid fixes that we know won't work, let's start again from the ground up.".

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 19 post(s)
John Surratt Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 53	Posted - 2014.05.05 06:24:00 - [241] - Quote Lightning xVx wrote: Now, I'm going to ask you guys this in a very respectful manner, even though I am VERY disappointed by your business practices. You may win some but NOT ALL, of us back. 2.) Why even have it on PS3 in the first place, if majority of your playerbase stem from PC? 3.) Why even put EVE: Valkyrie on PS4 if it's (again) aimed towards your PC crowd? 4.) Why did you unveil EVE: Legion at FANFEST when you knew fully well this would have this big of an impact? Throwing a guess out on some points. 2) CCP decided that they wanted a console game early on for whatever reason. I think it stems for the old "EVE Everywhere" idea that they had. EVE was going to be on consoles, phones, PC's, tablets. . .DUStT was announced circa 2009, and that was right about the time they went batshit crazy, lost touch with reality, which culminated in the Incarna Debacle of 2011. This has since changed and CCP has decided to focus on thier own IP and try to be everywhere "In EVE" instead of ahving EVE everywhere, if you get my drift. Pulling this from some of Hilmar's remarks and past CCP history 3) CCP is a very bet hedging company. They are not going to bet on VR solely on the Facebook Occulus. Sony has the Morpheus thing going and they want to have as much presence in VR as possible, especially since Valkyrie seems to be the only purely VR app with any traction at this time. It could be to VR what Super Mario was to the NES. Total guess work below, but some of it might be even somewhat true. . . 4) Rouge took over about six months ago and probably got a handle on things a couple months back. The Shanghai office and DUST did not have an executive producer from July-ish to October-ish, after CCP Jian got canned/quit/asked to quit. Figure on three months of lost productivity with no one at the helm. So, CCP Rouge got hired to unf__k Shanghai. Basically, after figuring out what the status was on the game (the whole "boots on ground" thing) he seems to ahve come the conclusion that, after inheriting the mess he was given, the only way to deliver what Hilmar et al want is to take all the good stuff from DUST but leave all the bad crap behind. A big part of that is the exclusivity to a now badly aging console, core elements of game design that are proving to be bad decisions, and a f__ked development process that does not now suit CCP's PC-centric agile development methods. (The players had to drag CCP into agile development and they are only now, after 10 years moving to push content faster) CCP dragged it's feet, and were probably wrapped up in sh_t canning World of Darkness as well. CCP has always had a habit of making decisions slowly. They like to hedge their bets. Their dithering around the last couple months is what caused this debacle. Go look up how long it took to get the whole "SOMERblink/EVE Vegas issue fixed, or the Incarna Debacle, or the T20 scandal. . . CCP has a bad habit of making hard decisions slowly. The reality of the situation is that Rouge likely feels there is no where to go on PS3 that will deliver what the true idea of what DUST was supposed to be. eE was hired to do the job of fixing DUST, and this is the conclusion he seems to have come to. I am guessing they said, "OK, show us how you would do it" and he brought out Legion. CCP Rouge started off working for the French Ministry of Finance. Just a sa guess, he is more comfortable developing things for computers than consoles. He's also repeatedly used the description of (to paraphrase) "having to choose to change the engine on the plane in flight or grounding the flight and fixing the engine." Luckily for him he's working for a PC based game company. His past gaming experience has been heavily PC based as well as a heavy amount of FTP games. Which would be worse? Taking DUST down to the bones completely to keep it on an aging console that is daily growing more and more dubious in it's utility, or putting a "new" game on a platform that, runs on their personally owned server cluster and does not have to touch Sony's network, can never be obsolete, and that the developer has a decade of experience working on? From a business stand point, and assuming you want a game that will really last 10 years, I am betting on the latter rather than the former. I will admit, I thought back in Beta that the PS3 had more life left in it, but I think now with this game we have now (DUST) we are seeing the network limitations of the PS3 network and it's limited ability to interface with TQ.
DUST Fiend The Wings of Legion 14028	Posted - 2014.05.05 06:26:00 - [242] - Quote Phoenix 85 wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: Whaaa? Just convert all skills to SP, and then move them over. That would be a good way to do it, as long as SP is maintained at a 1:1 ratio (or some equivalent, I'm not a game designer :) Whatever happens, we will do what we can to make that transition transparent and fair. I dont understand why that wouldnt be the default way of doing it? Just respec everything again. THANK YOU FOR REVIVING THE SIG!
John Surratt Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 54	Posted - 2014.05.05 06:34:00 - [243] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: We understand, and we always expected many players to be upset and even angry with what we said, primarily dedicated console players. I will admit that there have been issues in messaging, and we're going to be clearing up as many facts and answering as many questions as we can over the next few days. As far as PS4 vs PC, we went with PC because that's what we've worked more with in the past. There are also fewer hoops to jump through when developing for PC compared to a console. I'll be honest, Sony has done amazing stuff and removed a lot of red tape for us with DUST, but it's still not a simple process. Just remember, the door isn't closed for PS4 (or beyond as may be the case). It's just a door we're not looking for right now. Hah, didn't even see this post when I posted my above wall of text. . . am I close on any of my other guessings Logibro?
meri jin Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 958	Posted - 2014.05.05 06:44:00 - [244] - Quote @John Surratt I like the wall of text you put together. I honestly think that if CCP would come on stage and admit that they are starting to work ob PS4 due to request and willingness to keep the console players, a lot of people (me included) would be tamed a lot more. Working on the PS4 and PC at the same time would even have some benefits. One could be the avoidance of a head-start of the PC. The following console guys would have a extremely hard time to pick up the progress. The second thing is that they could figure out a way for the controls. A game pad will always loose to a raw M/KB input, there is nothing to sugarcoat. And now try to catch up with the head-start of the PC players. Saying this I still believe that having one pool would be the best option, do not split console and PC people. But I can't tell HOW to find a path where a controller can last against a M/KB. May be a stronger aim assist, by only suggesting this I can already hear the "PC-Masterrace" idiots cry out. R.I.P. Dust514 02 May 2014 EVE United
Timothy Reaper WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 897	Posted - 2014.05.05 06:59:00 - [245] - Quote Vargralor wrote: Timothy Reaper wrote: The thing is CCP did make that promise, and those features people were 'daydreaming' about were things CCP again promised were coming to the game. Very true. But when they looked in detail at those things they saw that it would require a fundamental rewrite of the underlying structure and motivations of the game. People throw around terms like Player Market and Player Driven Economy without understanding how they are fundamentally different. A Player Market is little more that a frontend to allow players to trade items they already have and at least one Dev post since Fanfest has mentioned that they still plan to deliver this for Dust. A Player Driven Economy is not something you can simply patch into what is essentially a Lobby Shooter. You need to have an underlying mechanism for harvesting and/or manufacturing along with sufficient motivation to do so. Engaging in PVE as a valid and rewarding alternative to PVP needs again a sufficient reason to do so alogn with balanced risks and rewards. Whilst you could tack these things onto the current gamemodes of Dust it could never be properly integrated with the sandbox style economy of EVE which was the overall goal. The Dust economy needed the underlying sandbox structure along the ability for PVP focused individuals to come along and ruin your day. Otherwise it would create an imbalance in the EVE economy due to the risk/reward imbalance which must be viewed on a significant scale to understand the effects across such a large game structure. Turning a lobby shooter like Dust into a sandbox style interaction environment means essentially starting again. Given that, CCP made the right call and said "OK. Instead of continuing bandaid fixes that we know won't work, let's start again from the ground up.". The problem isn't that they couldn't make good on their promises (we've all had big plans fall to the ground), it's that they encouraged people to spend money on a project that's endgame had changed months ago without telling their customers.
Meknow Intaki 279	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:31:00 - [246] - Quote Why do we care about any think CCP says?! Dirty liars =ƒÿÆ
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2322	Posted - 2014.05.05 07:57:00 - [247] - Quote In the blog/article/whatever it was about the cancelation of the WoD game, it said that 50 some people on that project were canned. Is that seriously all that was working on an entire MMO? Do you really think that a handful of people can maintain a game while devoloping a new one at the same time? How are we going to be reassured that this move isn't just going to **** over both DUST and Legion because neither will have the dedicated staff to complete anything? Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
George Moros Balkan Express Squad 343	Posted - 2014.05.05 08:13:00 - [248] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: In the blog/article/whatever it was about the cancelation of the WoD game, it said that 50 some people on that project were canned. Is that seriously all that was working on an entire MMO? Do you really think that a handful of people can maintain a game while devoloping a new one at the same time? How are we going to be reassured that this move isn't just going to **** over both DUST and Legion because neither will have the dedicated staff to complete anything? WoD development was already being run by a skeleton crew, prior to decision to cancel it. I suppose some of those people were transferred to DUST/Legion development, but it's just my guess. Pulvereus ergo queritor.
John Surratt Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 55	Posted - 2014.05.05 08:53:00 - [249] - Quote meri jin wrote: @John Surratt I like the wall of text you put together. I honestly think that if CCP would come on stage and admit that they are starting to work ob PS4 due to request and willingness to keep the console players, a lot of people (me included) would be tamed a lot more. Working on the PS4 and PC at the same time would even have some benefits. One could be the avoidance of a head-start of the PC. The following console guys would have a extremely hard time to pick up the progress. The second thing is that they could figure out a way for the controls. A game pad will always loose to a raw M/KB input, there is nothing to sugarcoat. And now try to catch up with the head-start of the PC players. Saying this I still believe that having one pool would be the best option, do not split console and PC people. But I can't tell HOW to find a path where a controller can last against a M/KB. May be a stronger aim assist, by only suggesting this I can already hear the "PC-Masterrace" idiots cry out. Not sure if being trolled by a Goon on my posting or not. . . I'd seriously doubt that PS4 work will start until there is a viable PC version. That being said, it's a short jump to PS4 from PC. I'd expect a port after there is a working and viable PC version, if only because CCP Rouge is at heart a PC developer. If Valkyrie is a success with Project Morpheus, it may come quicker as well since they will be back to working with Sony to push updates. Control issues are moot in Valk. Hell, easiest way to fix that issue is make KB/M mandatory on a PS4 version. HTFU and use a real control device. I used paragraphs so by default, my badpost is not a wall of text.
Khan Hun Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 133	Posted - 2014.05.05 08:58:00 - [250] - Quote For a year now console-traditionalists have been saying 'dust is console, remove KB/M' 'Having both will never be balanced' etc Now Legion is PC and suddenly the console traditionalists are saying 'Make a PS4 port, balance it so I can use a controller' I really feel for those of you who are console only, but after the amount of grief and issues trying to work a controller and a KB/M into dust, ending with the nearly unusable KB/M we have now... why make that mistake again?

meri jin Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 960	Posted - 2014.05.05 09:01:00 - [251] - Quote Khan Hun wrote: For a year now console-traditionalists have been saying 'dust is console, remove KB/M' 'Having both will never be balanced' etc Now Legion is PC and suddenly the console traditionalists are saying 'Make a PS4 port, balance it so I can use a controller' I really feel for those of you who are console only, but after the amount of grief and issues trying to work a controller and a KB/M into dust, ending with the nearly unusable KB/M we have now... why make that mistake again? Unusable KB/M? Just because it is not a raw Input it's not automatically broken. R.I.P. Dust514 02 May 2014 EVE United
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 403	Posted - 2014.05.05 09:23:00 - [252] - Quote Hecarim Van Hohen wrote: low genius wrote: i'm doubtful you'll get much support for legion. My thread is showing opposite but to be fair some people quit or biomassed that will not be tracked alongside those who never visit the forums There's 50,000 EVE players who are the potential next ~~DUST 2.0~~ Legion player base. Coz PC / New Eden. Patrick57 wrote: Nice to see some responses from the devs. I have a question; IF you ever do plan on releasing Legion for the PS4, will DUST players still be able to transfer the same things that players migrating from DUST to Eve on the PC will be? (I apologize if the wording here is confusing .-.) With any luck, all DUST chars will be moved over to a new centralised account server. Just like with EVE now, your char can just sit there inactive until you choose to come back and play. I would hope that one day the console-only guys get the option of playing DUST 3.0 on PS4. Or DUST 2.0 on PC if you made that move. DUST Fiend wrote: You feel that somehow moving from PS3 to PS4 will be easier. I feel that moving to PC then to PS4 will be easier (as does CCP) Going to PC, then to PS4, is going to yield you higher quality, faster results, then attempting to go from PS3, to PS4 I don't know enough about this to have an informed view, but my gut instinct is, either way, there is already a massive CCP player base on PC already, some of whom have been playing 10 years. This instant mercs-on-tap aspect would factor very highly into my decision were it mine. Maken Tosch wrote: Unfortunately, considering that Legion is only a project at a moment that hasn't even received a green light right now, not even CCP knows what the specs will be once Alpha/Closed-Beta testing arrives. I would err on the side of caution and expect mid-range system requirements at the very least. I think, due to what I said above, that you can take the system specs. required to run EVE, and state that as a Legion requirement. Mid-range and up I would agree Maken. The DUST community we are part of today, even smaller than before due to the incredible events of the weekend, is going to be a small piece of the Legion community. I for one won't biomass until I've decided whether I want to be there - and if I do, I look forward to see any of you lot there too. For now, I may be in and out of DUST - see you on the ground. Lightning xVx - tell the guys not to biomass - just walk away with options :) You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 1673	Posted - 2014.05.05 09:41:00 - [253] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: Ducttape Tinker wrote: And that question is DID CCP USED COMMUNITY MONEY and OUR IDEAS ON DUST2.0 aka LEGION?! I understand where your concern is coming from here, but this is a question that we cannot answer in any form. CCP Does not disclose it's financials. So that's a yes then .... you lot at CCP deliberately led us on with ideas like a player markets and a full integration with eve along with lots of other features that were planed for dust solly to obtain cash out of our pockets. This said cash has obviously been used to fund legion . This is fraud and a scam at best CCP YOU HAVE LET ALLOW OF PEOPLE DOWN AND SHOULDBE ASHAMED OF YOURSELVES. Proud Gunlogi pilot and forge gunner since August 2012. I fought and bled for the State on Caldari prime.
Rami Hamilo Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 79	Posted - 2014.05.05 09:51:00 - [254] - Quote John Surratt wrote: Ducttape Tinker wrote: snip And that question is DID CCP USED COMMUNITY MONEY and OUR IDEAS ON DUST2.0 aka LEGION?! Of course they did, because Legion is going to be everything DUST is not and never can be due to hardware obsolescence, architecture limitations, and early bad decisions in game design. That's bullshit. Look at FFXIV:ARR. That game, on PS3, only had to limit character models to 150 or so. yet, when it went to the PS4, they pretty much removed the character model limitation and now PS4 players are pretty much on par with the PC players. CCP used a ****** excuse to screw over the console players and go to PC so that all the EVE players will shut up about wanting Dust 514 on the PC. ALL of their facebook posts were inundated with 'BRING DUST TO PC' and what not.

CCP Logibro C C P C C P Alliance 7083	Posted - 2014.05.05 09:57:00 - [255] - Quote Alright guys, I'm back again. Talk to me. CCP Logibro // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics (a¦á_a¦á)

Jarod Garamonde Jr Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 70	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:01:00 - [256] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright guys, I'm back again. Talk to me. Does this mean I can stop frustrating myself by doing unpaid damage control? I'm exhausted and these kids aren't listening to reason. Resorting to anger doesn't work, either. I thought they'd get their own native tongue, but it seems all attempts at communicating with these strange lifeforms is for naught. I care about the community, but that is somehow mistaken for this odd ritual they refer to as "white knighting".... I shall ponder this between chapters of being emotionally damaged by George RR Martin's writing. Silly Infantrymen... CAS Requests are for Forward Observers...
Grimmiers 518	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:03:00 - [257] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright guys, I'm back again. Talk to me. I was wondering if you guys had footage of the dust graphics presentation and if it would be uploaded to youtube. )
DozersMouse XIII Inner.Hell 725	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:04:00 - [258] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright guys, I'm back again. Talk to me. I would like to see DUST live on for a couple more years do you feel this is possible? I know it's not gonna be linked to eve and all that but that doesn't really affect me (I was always in it for the fps aspect) so do you feel that CCP's work towards DUST in the future will create more of a "lobby shooter" do you feel DUST will see player trading, the 2 remaining racial HAV's, and heavy weapons? why pctards were mad at dust
Jastaddd Death seeker NegativeKDR 10	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:06:00 - [259] - Quote @CCP Logibro Let's do a recap, because from what i understand (and i may be wrong) the thing is: You have dropped assets from Dust in to Legion, slowing the patch to a released game. Legion is not a confirmed project yet, so if it don't get the "green light" it will never come to life. At fanjets during the DUST keynote you presented Legion, while is not confirmed yet, and tell the console player base to go **** itself. We are at a point that Legion may not even come to life, but Dust is now doomed..... I'm confused.
Alena Ventrallis PAND3M0N1UM Top Men. 1262	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:12:00 - [260] - Quote @ Logibro: What exactly is the gameplan for Dust now? Are we going to get new content, even f just to test it out for implementation into Legion? Are we just going to waiti until Legion is green-lit or not? What happens to us now? Also, if LEgion isn't green-lit, is there an idea of what will happen to Dust then? Or is there too many moving parts to tell? That's what you get!! - DA Rick

meri jin Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 960	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:21:00 - [261] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Alright guys, I'm back again. Talk to me. CCP Logibro wrote: Guys, I must bow out as I have to be awake for tomorrow. I'll be back again in about 10 hours, give or take a few. If you are coming back to this, can you or one of your co-workers explain a little more about EVE united? Will we be able to fuse our mercs in to our EVE Online pilots? Are we going to the AUR on a monthly basis if we have a subscription active in eve? Valkyrie is coming to PS4 as well, how are accounts going to work together? Do you have any comments about this? Quote: If CCP would come on stage and admit that they are starting to work ob PS4 due to request and willingness to keep the console players, a lot of people (me included) would be tamed a lot more. Working on the PS4 and PC at the same time would even have some benefits. One could be the avoidance of a head-start of the PC. The following console guys would have a extremely hard time to pick up the progress. The second thing is that they could figure out a way for the controls. A game pad will always loose to a raw M/KB input, there is nothing to sugarcoat. And now try to catch up with the head-start of the PC players. Saying this I still believe that having one pool would be the best option, do not split console and PC people. But I can't tell HOW to find a path where a controller can last against a M/KB. May be a stronger aim assist, by only suggesting this I can already hear the "PC-Masterrace" idiots cry out. R.I.P. Dust514 02 May 2014 EVE United
Moonracer2000 Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 752	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:22:00 - [262] - Quote The one question I am most interested in seeing a decent answer to is "what can Dust players expect for the future of Dust as far as patches/content?" All information CCP has offered is funneled towards Legion, but this forum is dedicated to the game Dust 514. All of the members of the forum are here because we play, or are interested in Dust 514. Can we get some more information on the current status and future of Dust 514? As good or bad as that may be? Can we expect any more content for Dust or is it really just going to be minor balance tweaks from now on?
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 2082	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:24:00 - [263] - Quote @CCP Logibro If CCP decides to release a PS4 version of legion, maybe 3-4 or more years after the PC version, will my account be there? Let me say again that for me it's all a money issue, i still want to play the game and continue my story in this game, but i don't have the possibility to buy a gaming PC, while i would be able to buy a PS4 because it costs less. PSN: ogamega
KGB Sleep Inner.Hell 1070	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:29:00 - [264] - Quote @CCP Logibro Can you please ask the teams to integrate controller support for Legion? Specifically the configurations for the DS3/PS4 controllers so that they are the same as in Dust 514. Some people like to use the sticks. Thanks. Because beer, that's why.
Rami Hamilo Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 79	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:30:00 - [265] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: mollerz wrote: Even if you provide a 100% transfer an/or equivalent, realize a lot of us aren't about to buy a PC. We'll just know our toons are in cold storage until you guys get around to looking at the PS4 (or in my case OSX could work as well). Maybe one day we'll get to use them and that could be enough. even though you are effectively shutting out a chunk of your player base. I know and understand your frustration here...and I honestly do sympathize. I was always aware that this was going to be difficult for my dedicated console playing friends, and all that I can say is that I hope we get the chance to play against eachother in the near future. I highly doubt that. If you cared about the console players that much, you'd have announced Legion waaaaaaaaay before fanfest. 'Hey guys, we're going to stop developing for Dust soon and reallocate devs to this new game called Project Legion that is nothing like Dust 514'. Instead you were like 'BUY AUR GUYS! Also, we're stopping development of dust because of some bullshit lazy reason and going to PC for out PC fanboys'.
HowDidThatTaste Ancient Exiles. Dirt Nap Squad. 4808	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:35:00 - [266] - Quote I would like to hear about dusts future please. What is the new content coming to dust? How long will you provide new content to dust? Any news for dust?

CCP Saberwing C C P C C P Alliance 4062	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:40:00 - [267] - Quote KGB Sleep wrote: @CCP Logibro Can you please ask the teams to integrate controller support for Legion? Specifically the configurations for the DS3/PS4 controllers so that they are the same as in Dust 514. Some people like to use the sticks. Thanks. I will certainly bring up the matter of Controller Support to the Dev team in Shanghai. CCP Saberwing // DUST 514 Community Manager // @kanafchian

Scheherazade VII SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 452	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:41:00 - [268] - Quote they don't care, here, have a teletubby
Harold Junk SATAN'S SECRET SOLDIERS 19	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:41:00 - [269] - Quote HowDidThatTaste wrote: I would like to hear about dusts future please. What is the new content coming to dust? How long will you provide new content to dust? Any news for dust? They said no new content. So far just bug fixes have been announced, from a massively reduced team. So god knows how long they will support dust, but it isn't going to amount for much.
Scheherazade VII SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 452	Posted - 2014.05.05 10:43:00 - [270] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: we went with PC because that's what we've worked more with in the past. T that ship sailed a long time ago mate, right decision, wrong time, not when people have invested hundreds of dollars and have bought PS3s specifically for your game only to find out that things which were mentioned and vaguely commented on such as PvE and player market were all LIES because they will never be included! kept our hopes up though, kept the booster sales coming too.



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