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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 12 post(s)
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 8	Posted - 2013.11.07 15:42:00 - [1] - Quote OK what the heck before shutdown today i was given a message that said a eve player in my corp was running for CEO of my corp and that my CEO roles where removed till the vote was final and in truth i have been shut out and whats worst this eve pilot is not a director he doesn't have a singe role and also apparent only eve pilots are allowed to make these votes so it seems there is nothing i can do about it and in fact i think he already has control of the corp with his vote of 1!!! I Don't know how this happened and it is completely unfair and wrong that EVE is allowed to do this some how and no one i have talked to even knows how he can do it with out any roles. I have submitted a ticket and emailed customer support but by the time i get a reply this pilot will have probably deleted all the members and again there is nothing i can do...... so yeah what the heck!!!!!
Viktor Hadah Jr Negative-Impact Cult of War 908	Posted - 2013.11.07 15:44:00 - [2] - Quote You got Corp jacked b*tech, welcome to New Eden For the Empire! Member of ASS: Amarr Secret Service.
prime cat DUST CORE Zero-Day 0	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:04:00 - [3] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: You got Corp jacked b*tech, welcome to New Eden Inorder for this to have happen the pilot must.have had ether accountant roles or director roles. He than takes all your corporation shares and starts a vote to overthrow the CEO then the share holders vote. The pilot is the only one with shares so he will become the CEO If he was able to get a hold of your shares ether someone gave him roles or another one of your pilots with director roles transferred him the shares. yes i know that and that's the thing i never gave him shares you cant even see shares on dust and he is not a director or accountant or any other role for that matter and the only other pilot that is on and is a director is my husband who was in a dead sleep in the other room when this happened 15min before server shut down

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2956	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:05:00 - [4] - Quote The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Viktor Hadah Jr Negative-Impact Cult of War 909	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:12:00 - [5] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? For the Empire! Member of ASS: Amarr Secret Service.
Vin Mora Sanguis Defense Syndicate 230	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:16:00 - [6] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. It may be better to remove that function when in relation to Dust Created Corps. If you aren't going to have it for both sides, then neither side should be able to make use of it. Sanguis Defense Syndicate: Recruitment now open for players of all skill levels
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 8	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:17:00 - [7] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2958	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:23:00 - [8] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? When a DUST character creates a corporation we assign all of the shares to them, so no, an EVE director cannot take any of the shares. This was done to prevent the exact scenario you described. This case of corp theft by shares only applies if the corp was originally created by an EVE character or if the DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit


CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2958	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:25:00 - [9] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 1735	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:30:00 - [10] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). How can a strictly DUST player understand corporation mechanics that are not present in the DUST client? AKA: Rees Noturana https://twitter.com/reesnoturana

Vin Mora Sanguis Defense Syndicate 231	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:31:00 - [11] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). Dust CEOs have to give up their rank to an Eve player to create alliances, see how this could be a problem? Sanguis Defense Syndicate: Recruitment now open for players of all skill levels
Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 210	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:32:00 - [12] - Quote Alright, good to know. Never let an Eve guy touch my CEO title. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]
Viktor Hadah Jr Negative-Impact Cult of War 910	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:35:00 - [13] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? When a DUST character creates a corporation we assign all of the shares to them, so no, an EVE director cannot take any of the shares. This was done to prevent the exact scenario you described. This case of corp theft by shares only applies if the corp was originally created by an EVE character or if the DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. Okay that clears up a lot, thank you. For the Empire! Member of ASS: Amarr Secret Service.
Gorra Snell The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 210	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:35:00 - [14] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: How can a strictly DUST player understand corporation mechanics that are not present in the DUST client? This. I think you guys should seriously reconsider including this mechanic in Dust. It's crazy-sauce to have a major shared mechanic, like corporations, between the games and only partially implement it in one.
Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 210	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:35:00 - [15] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: How can a strictly DUST player understand corporation mechanics that are not present in the DUST client? That's incredibly problematic CCP. This point needs to be highly visible and throughly detailed to people Dust side, and not bookended into a backpage tutorial system. I had no idea there was even a share system involved with my own Dust character. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2963	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:39:00 - [16] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). How can a strictly DUST player understand corporation mechanics that are not present in the DUST client? We will add a warning message about this specifically, we have no plans to implement shares in DUST but at the same time we cannot remove them from EVE. Educating people about their actions is the best way forward I think and we can do a better job of this. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 210	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:39:00 - [17] - Quote From a Corp created in Dust standpoint, I simply want to confirm that making an Eve pilot a director, even if I had never granted him a CEO position would not jeopardize my ability to retain control of the Dust Corporation as CEO through the shares system. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2963	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:44:00 - [18] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: From a Corp created in Dust standpoint, I simply want to confirm that making an Eve pilot a director, even if I had never granted him a CEO position would not jeopardize my ability to retain control of the Dust Corporation as CEO through the shares system. I can confirm this. A corporation created in DUST cannot have shares reassigned so long as the CEO remains a DUST character. Giving an EVE character director role is safe in this regard (they can still kick all of the other members etc). CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 210	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:47:00 - [19] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Jadek Menaheim wrote: From a Corp created in Dust standpoint, I simply want to confirm that making an Eve pilot a director, even if I had never granted him a CEO position would not jeopardize my ability to retain control of the Dust Corporation as CEO through the shares system. I can confirm this. A corporation created in DUST cannot have shares reassigned so long as the CEO remains a DUST character. Giving an EVE character director role is safe in this regard (they can still kick all of the other members etc). Thank you for the reply CCP Nullarbor. That should be fine as all members in our corp are directors. Controlled Chaos makes for a fun experiment. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]
steadyhand amarr TeamPlayers EoN. 1810	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:53:00 - [20] - Quote At what point null is a dust or eve player Ever ment to find out about that I'm for awoxing but u got to give dust players a chance. I'm getting real sick of the double standarders between the two games "my faith is my shield, the empress's light my guide and my fury my sword" winner of EU squad cup GOGO power rangers

Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 741	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:54:00 - [21] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Jadek Menaheim wrote: From a Corp created in Dust standpoint, I simply want to confirm that making an Eve pilot a director, even if I had never granted him a CEO position would not jeopardize my ability to retain control of the Dust Corporation as CEO through the shares system. I can confirm this. A corporation created in DUST cannot have shares reassigned so long as the CEO remains a DUST character. Giving an EVE character director role is safe in this regard (they can still kick all of the other members etc). However, you should clarify that if the corp has EVER had an EVE player as CEO, those shares are released, and the risk is there. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 897	Posted - 2013.11.07 16:57:00 - [22] - Quote This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. "Just another piece of duct tape" Equality Event
Commissioner G0RD0N 25	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:06:00 - [23] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... DJINN Rampage; textbook definition of a coprophageous monkey trained to use a keyboard Wanted 4 impersonating a Templar

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2965	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:06:00 - [24] - Quote shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 1228	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:07:00 - [25] - Quote This is what you get for working alongside Capsuleers. Never trust an amateur statistician with a pirate fantasy. Cheeseburgers.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2967	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:11:00 - [26] - Quote Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 1653	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:14:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. So, what can be done for corps that have joined alliances? Now all their shares are floating in a wallet waiting to be taken unless they have active EVE players managing these roles. Plex an eve character specifically to lock them up? Check out & sub my youtube. Yay!

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2967	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:19:00 - [28] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. So, what can be done for corps that have joined alliances? Now all their shares are floating in a wallet waiting to be taken unless they have active EVE players managing these roles. Plex an eve character specifically to lock them up? edit: nevermind. Apparently going to be plexing an eve character to sort this out. All you need is an EVE director to remove all the shares from the corporation wallet yes. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 741	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:22:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. It sounds to me like you have a disconnect with reality on what's important to your game. Alliances continue to be a hugely important content driver for PC, and the DUST team's failure to implement them properly time and time again is embarrassing. The biggest conflict drivers in this game are things like EoN (an alliance), and then people rising up against EoN. Or Public Disorder (an alliance), and people trying to push them around. Alliances are the number one most important thing for your dev team to be doing. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2968	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:29:00 - [30] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. It sounds to me like you have a disconnect with reality on what's important to your game. Alliances continue to be a hugely important content driver for PC, and the DUST team's failure to implement them properly time and time again is embarrassing. The biggest conflict drivers in this game are things like EoN (an alliance), and then people rising up against EoN. Or Public Disorder (an alliance), and people trying to push them around. Alliances are the number one most important thing for your dev team to be doing. Of course they are important, but adding official support for them vs say expanding planetary conquest itself I think is a no brainer. The tools to build alliances exist and you guys have proven that its possible provided you work around the sharp edges. It would be a great quality of life addition to have proper support for them but the cost of doing all that right now is not worth doing today (the cost is much higher than I think people realize). As I said though, we will add it in time but realistically it affects just a handful of people who have to click the relevant buttons, they can deal with managing this from EVE for now. I am 100% on board with helping explain it all better though, we will add some tasks on our todo list for this. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit


Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:40:00 - [31] - Quote A corp feels big and important so wants to join an alliance and doesn't know enough to not trust the CEO title to a random capsuleer? HA HA HA This is so funny. Also; never trust anyone and one month's subscription to EVE for the transfer is cheap.
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 741	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:40:00 - [32] - Quote With alliance names not even appearing in-game, DUST players have to rely on third party EVE tools to see what's what. That affects every player in Planetary Conquest. As someone with an active EVE account, I'm constantly solicited to bridge the gap by looking up employment histories, alliance membership, corp sizes, etc. It's crippling to the MMO nature of the game for this information to be totally unavailable to DUST players. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:43:00 - [33] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: With alliance names not even appearing in-game, DUST players have to rely on third party EVE tools to see what's what. That affects every player in Planetary Conquest. As someone with an active EVE account, I'm constantly solicited to bridge the gap by looking up employment histories, alliance membership, corp sizes, etc. It's crippling to the MMO nature of the game for this information to be totally unavailable to DUST players. http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/GoonSwarm
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 741	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:48:00 - [34] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: With alliance names not even appearing in-game, DUST players have to rely on third party EVE tools to see what's what. That affects every player in Planetary Conquest. As someone with an active EVE account, I'm constantly solicited to bridge the gap by looking up employment histories, alliance membership, corp sizes, etc. It's crippling to the MMO nature of the game for this information to be totally unavailable to DUST players. http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/GoonSwarm I bolded the part you obviously didn't read or comprehend. A lot of players can't readily look up stuff on a PC while playing DUST, by the way. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1512	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:49:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? When a DUST character creates a corporation we assign all of the shares to them, so no, an EVE director cannot take any of the shares. This was done to prevent the exact scenario you described. This case of corp theft by shares only applies if the corp was originally created by an EVE character or if the DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. Good to know. My Corp was created in EVE. I might just put an EVE alt in my Corp and transfer all the shares to that alt. If I decide to pass CEO in the future this will give me a way to take my Corp back if the new CEO does something stupid. ____________________________________________________________________________ Immortal Guides, supporting knowledge dissemination in New Eden since August 31, 2013.
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3665	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:53:00 - [36] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: With alliance names not even appearing in-game, DUST players have to rely on third party EVE tools to see what's what. That affects every player in Planetary Conquest. As someone with an active EVE account, I'm constantly solicited to bridge the gap by looking up employment histories, alliance membership, corp sizes, etc. It's crippling to the MMO nature of the game for this information to be totally unavailable to DUST players. http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/GoonSwarm I bolded the part you obviously didn't read or comprehend. A lot of players can't readily look up stuff on a PC while playing DUST, by the way. On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. It's much easier to tell the players to be patient and be cautious about who you give power to (something they should be doing -anyway-) and work out the irritating bits later on when we have bigger problems like Dropsuit Skill blanket bonuses that affect -everyone-. It's a hard lesson to learn but they were going to learn it one day anyway, hence why the general response is 'Welcome to New Eden'. ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3665	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:54:00 - [37] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? When a DUST character creates a corporation we assign all of the shares to them, so no, an EVE director cannot take any of the shares. This was done to prevent the exact scenario you described. This case of corp theft by shares only applies if the corp was originally created by an EVE character or if the DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. Good to know. My Corp was created in EVE. I might just put an EVE alt in my Corp and transfer all the shares to that alt. If I decide to pass CEO in the future this will give me a way to take my Corp back if the new CEO does something stupid. ____________________________________________________________________________ Immortal Guides, supporting knowledge dissemination in New Eden since August 31, 2013. Alternatively you could just give your alt CEO ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1512	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:57:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. EVE Players in the same Alliance can provide Orbital Support in a Planetary Conquest battle.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2970	Posted - 2013.11.07 17:59:00 - [39] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. EVE Players in the same Alliance can provide Orbital Support in a Planetary Conquest battle. Good example, however I would much rather spend time on allowing people outside of your alliance to provide OBs as well. More bang for our development buck. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 1635	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:09:00 - [40] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Fox Gaden wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. EVE Players in the same Alliance can provide Orbital Support in a Planetary Conquest battle. Good example, however I would much rather spend time on allowing people outside of your alliance to provide OBs as well. More bang for our development buck. This i like Currently Alliances in DUST are in FW My EVE toon doesnt want to do FW, just relax and muck about but i cant provide OB unless im in the allinace which means im in FW But what is to stop any EVE player from turning up and bombing the **** out of 1 side or another whenever a SL calls in a strike? Or is that whole point of allowing EVE players to not be in the same alliance, so they can turn up at random and just sell services maybe or just grief

Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1512	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:11:00 - [41] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Good example, however I would much rather spend time on allowing people outside of your alliance to provide OBs as well. More bang for our development buck. Good point. If a DUST Corp could create a contract for EVE mercenary pilots to do OB, that would definitely be superior. It would provide a whole new area of job possibilities for EVE pilots, and ones that you can get into in a Destroyer, so very new pilot friendly. You get a like for just suggesting it.
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1512	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:15:00 - [42] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Good example, however I would much rather spend time on allowing people outside of your alliance to provide OBs as well. More bang for our development buck. This i like Currently Alliances in DUST are in FW My EVE toon doesnt want to do FW, just relax and muck about but i cant provide OB unless im in the allinace which means im in FW But what is to stop any EVE player from turning up and bombing the **** out of 1 side or another whenever a SL calls in a strike? Or is that whole point of allowing EVE players to not be in the same alliance, so they can turn up at random and just sell services maybe or just grief I assume that a DUST Director would create a contract that EVE pilots could accept which would all the EVE pilot to perform OBGÇÖs in support of the DUST Corp.
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 744	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:41:00 - [43] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. For an MMO, player-based organizations is kinda core. They're wasting their time on balancing, because they keep breaking balancing anyhow. They balanced everything around bad hit detection, and then fixed hit detection, and now balancing is completely wrong again. They'll fix that, then another bug, that'll break balance again. It's never going to be perfect, and they're wasting time with it. We need real content that encourages gameplay. And EVE has proven, time and time again, alliances, rivalries, wars. That creates gameplay. That creates content. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
Aisha Ctarl PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1675	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:44:00 - [44] - Quote I've been waiting for an opportune time to say this: "Welcome to New Eden." Go forth, conquer in my Name, and reclaim that which I have given." - The Scriptures, Book of Reclaiming
ResistanceGTA Valor Tactical Operations Immortal Coalition of New-Eden 45	Posted - 2013.11.07 18:45:00 - [45] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. For an MMO, player-based organizations is kinda core. They're wasting their time on balancing, because they keep breaking balancing anyhow. They balanced everything around bad hit detection, and then fixed hit detection, and now balancing is completely wrong again. They'll fix that, then another bug, that'll break balance again. It's never going to be perfect, and they're wasting time with it. We need real content that encourages gameplay. And EVE has proven, time and time again, alliances, rivalries, wars. That creates gameplay. That creates content. Balancing and hit detection? Slow down. That sounds a lot like having your cake and eating it too. One or the other is all we get, or at least that's what I've gathered from the blue tags in this topic. Now we need to decidd which means more to us.
G Torq ALTA B2O 262	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:16:00 - [46] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose You should probably go talk to the guy who implemented the Squad Finder and the option to look for squads inside your Alliance. That dude seems to think that Alliances can/should server a very Dust-specific purpose. Why are you even reading this?
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 745	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:20:00 - [47] - Quote Most of the top corps in the game are in some form of alliance. And it has an extremely strong effect on how PC battles are carried out. Failing to see the importance of it being represented in game is a rookie mistake. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
Dachande Anasazi K-A-O-S theory 86	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:22:00 - [48] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. If we have mix corps it is safe right? As long as a EVE player is never given roles? Or any eve player who joins can just be like houdini?
Scheherazade VII 87	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:24:00 - [49] - Quote this **** does NOT belong in a first-person-shooter. GêÜGëêDUST VIDEOSGëêGêÜ
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 745	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:24:00 - [50] - Quote Dachande Anasazi wrote: If we have mix corps it is safe right? As long as a EVE player is never given roles? Or any eve player who joins can just be like houdini? You are completely safe if an EVE character has never ever held CEO of that corp. Otherwise, you are potentially not safe. Scheherazade VII wrote: this ** does NOT belong in a first-person-shooter. This isn't your run-of-the-mill first-person shooter. This is New Eden. Top Men.** - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!

low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 843	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:39:00 - [51] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Can not directors also take shares from the Corp? my EVE account has director roles and I can see the shares will I not be able to take them if I tried? When a DUST character creates a corporation we assign all of the shares to them, so no, an EVE director cannot take any of the shares. This was done to prevent the exact scenario you described. This case of corp theft by shares only applies if the corp was originally created by an EVE character or if the DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. getting owned by the devs... lol
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 1656	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:40:00 - [52] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: this **** does NOT belong in a first-person-shooter. You're playing the wrong FPS then. Check out & sub my youtube. Yay!
shaman oga Nexus Balusa Horizon 904	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:41:00 - [53] - Quote The problem is that 99% of DUST population don't know about this thing of shares, alliances are important and most of the corps want to be in one of them. We don't have the instruments to join or create alliances and that can be ok for the moment, but we have to be sure that we can join an alliance, without losing control over our corp. I can suggest to create a specific role, to allow an EVE player to join your corp, without giving him permission to operate with corp shares, but the ability to join your corp to an alliance. You can call it DIPLOMATIC or whatever you want. Putting a simple warning message do not solve the problem, even if you know things you are not able to join an alliance without any risk. "Just another piece of duct tape" Equality Event
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 704	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:47:00 - [54] - Quote So basically If I want my corp in an Alliance, I either have to pay up for EVE or pray that I don't get stabbed in the back? Thanks CCP! It's nice to know that a DUST only corp must either throw cash at you or play the lottery game if they want in on an alliance There there Mr. Scout and Ms. Heavy, don't cry You'll still be useful in my eyes
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 108	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:48:00 - [55] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. You guys need to fix this. Since there is no choice BUT to assign an EVE pilot CEO to join an Alliance, something you do fully support, you need to prevent EVE pilots from taking CEO's shares. Novel thought, how about you assign all the shares to the creator of the corp instead of leaving them for any EVE pilot to snatch up. Until you allow a way for a DUST character to assign these shares your basically setting up lots of individuals for grief with no way for them to fully prevent it unless they make an EVE account.
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 108	Posted - 2013.11.07 19:54:00 - [56] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. Your attitude here is extremely disappointing. A warning message as you mentioned is useless. You have an alliance channel in dust that allows much better interactions among corporations. You have only one way to access it and instead of promoting it and preventing unstoppable issues from the DUST side of things you shrug your shoulders. You sir are my least favorite DEV, and that's saying something :)
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2193	Posted - 2013.11.07 20:07:00 - [57] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: this ** does NOT belong in a first-person-shooter. 1. It needs to be fixed 2. This isn't just an FPS - it's an MMO where lying and trechery is common place and expected The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise? Join Legacy Rising**
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 635	Posted - 2013.11.07 20:58:00 - [58] - Quote This was always going to happen at some point, I'm just surprised it took this long. I know I'm getting the reputation as the 'Dust Corp UI' advocate but all this does is strengthen the long held argument by many in Eve that the entire Corp UI in Eve needs completley overhauling. And now with the addition of Dust into the mix it really should be becoming a higher priority in both games as the time of full integration gets closer. Now as it happens, DUST University was created in the Eve client, pretty much the day Dust 514 was announced. This enabled a couple of things straight of the bat that some may not know is possible in Dust. First of all, the Corp was created by an alt that Kelduum Revaan, the CEO at the time of EVE University set up for that purpose. When Dust was about to enter closed Beta, he made another alt he had, CEO of D-UNI. This alt had all the corporation managment skills in Eve maxed out and applying that alt's skill on the the corp means that D-UNI can have 6500 members. But here's the beauty part of it. Because of the way the corp mechanics work in Eve, ANY Eve (or Dust) character can be made CEO with just the Corp Management Skill trained to level one and the corp can still have the maximum number of members an Eve corp can have. If a Dust Merc made a corp in Dust and maxed the Corporation Skills in Dust, the corp could get no bigger than 1350 members. Not exactly equal footing is it? It also meant that D-UNI was part of IVY League right away and as long as I pay the Alliance fee Eve side it remains so. Ready made corp creation is a lucrative career in Eve by the way... Kelduum then made me CEO (after I spent 16 minutes training Corp Management to level I) and transfered the shares to me in Eve. Dennie is the CEO, Kevall is my merc clone, its in the sig. The fact is that the corp UI in both games is a mess but Dust's is limited in what can be done to improve it by the fact that at some point in the future it will have to work with the Eve one in such a way as to prevent this sort of thing happening. I know that CCP are itching to do it as it gives them an excuse to replace a legacy system in Eve. And there are plenty of CEO's in both games that hope they do it sooner rather than later. Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3667	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:02:00 - [59] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. For an MMO, player-based organizations is kinda core. They're wasting their time on balancing, because they keep breaking balancing anyhow. They balanced everything around bad hit detection, and then fixed hit detection, and now balancing is completely wrong again. They'll fix that, then another bug, that'll break balance again. It's never going to be perfect, and they're wasting time with it. We need real content that encourages gameplay. And EVE has proven, time and time again, alliances, rivalries, wars. That creates gameplay. That creates content. Curious.... What weapons have they balanced ever since hit detection/aim assist were fixed/implemented..? Further more, how is balancing wrong again? They've made some pretty great strides since Uprising first released - Armor Tanking is viable, Heavies got some love, Laser Rifle got some love, Logistics got a slight tweak to ease their Master Race issues, Repair Tools are now viable... Just saying, they've had their teeter totter moments but they've done a pretty damn good job. It's gotten nothing but better, in my opinion. ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 219	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:02:00 - [60] - Quote Kevall Longstride wrote: snip. Mind blown! Thank you for throwing some knowledge at us. Very much appreciated. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]

Moorian Flav Ectype Inc. 89	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:13:00 - [61] - Quote Quote: DUST CEO reassigned the corp to an EVE character at any stage, in which case the shares stay in the corporation wallet. In short, any DUST corp that is actually a part of an alliance could run into this as an EVE character had to be made CEO at one point in time to enable the corp to join the alliance as alliance UI does not exist on the DUST side. Yes, I know this is all very stupid. Please refer back to CCP; I'm just the messenger.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 2308	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:27:00 - [62] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Or you know, just let Dust players form alliances without having to involve EVE players since its a huge gaping flaw in the system Im not drunk, the planet just happens to be especially wobbly today.
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 320	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:30:00 - [63] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. If you can't see the shares from the Dust side of things, isn't that kind of.... to put it gently... incredibly stupid? Something that essential to the survival of your Corp and you can't see who is doing what with it? If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Mac Dac Wraith Shadow Guards 268	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:30:00 - [64] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay I knew we were 2nd class citizens for a while now, but people keep wanting more ways for EVE pilots to screw us. "We should take care not to make intellect our god; it has, of course, strong muscles, but no personality" Albert Einste
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 636	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:31:00 - [65] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: Kevall Longstride wrote: snip. Mind blown! Thank you for throwing some knowledge at us. Very much appreciated. No problem. Here to help. Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 320	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:35:00 - [66] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: I've been waiting for an opportune time to say this: "Welcome to New Eden." Except this isn't an internalized scam, this is a programming flaw by CPP that disallows tracking of personal assets. So, you just sound like an idiot here. A SERIOUS idiot. This wasn't anything like an actual Eden heist where everyone can equally secure assets, this was a one-sided computerized flaw, that has been exploited because the programmers didn't use their brains when making it. If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 320	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:43:00 - [67] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control over shares and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. Let's make this even then. How about we force EvE Corps that want to join an EvE Alliance to hand over their CEO role and 100% of their Corporation shares to said individual. Only then would this be fair. Oh wait, an EvE corp can pull their own shares out Before handing CEO status over to someone else. See how this is broken? You're not applying the same rules to both sides. Either make them the SAME or remove the SHARES. Edit: Double post is my computer messing up. If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Mac Dac Wraith Shadow Guards 268	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:49:00 - [68] - Quote Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. "We should take care not to make intellect our god; it has, of course, strong muscles, but no personality" Albert Einste
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2195	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:59:00 - [69] - Quote Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Like any business, an Eve corporation has shares. These can be given out to players, and then there are mechanics in Eve that allow votes to happen. Those with shares are able to vote - one of the items that can be voted on is the election of a new CEO (among other things). Other things include a way to have profit sharing for your shareholders. But because of the danger of votes resulting in the removal of a CEO, 99% of all Eve corps do not give out shares thus keeping them "off the market". Dust players don't have this option. If one player has all the shares, the can force a vote where only he and the CEO can vote - when the CEO is in Dust, the CEO loses the ability to vote due to a lack of mechanics to do so, effectively meaning that the Eve player can take over the corporation legally - albeit as a hostile takeover. All the Eve player does is to take the shares out of the corp wallet and assign them to himself. He can then initiate a vote (that only he can vote on) and install himself as the new CEO - and the old one has no say whatsoever. Now, if the CEO had a way to protect himself, or I don't know be aware that giving control of the corp temporarily can result in losing the corp, perhaps then things would be acceptable because then the CEO is taking on the danger knowingly or at least with the ability to fight it. CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. If you have the tools to protect yourself but this still happens - well that is on the player. This however is on CCP and they need to make good on this and revert control to the correct people and implement as a band-aid a warning about giving up control. Long term, they need to implement shares into Dust, no matter the "development cost", as this particular thing can truly be game breaking for someone when they have no control over something that they should have control over. *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising
Cenex Langly D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 354	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:03:00 - [70] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. With this said, I find it appropriate to announce that I can and will provide this function for anyone who needs someone to be their CEO to get into any alliance. I've provided this function for 90% of the corps in my own alliance. And those in other alliances as well. They will testify that I'm trustworthy and discrete. If you need more information please feel free to contact me in game. My price is 5mil in Dust, or 25mil in EVE. Director (Management) D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E

Cenex Langly D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 354	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:05:00 - [71] - Quote Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. Director (Management) D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
Mac Dac Wraith Shadow Guards 268	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:23:00 - [72] - Quote Forlorn Destrier wrote: Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Like any business, an Eve corporation has shares. These can be given out to players, and then there are mechanics in Eve that allow votes to happen. Those with shares are able to vote - one of the items that can be voted on is the election of a new CEO (among other things). Other things include a way to have profit sharing for your shareholders. But because of the danger of votes resulting in the removal of a CEO, 99% of all Eve corps do not give out shares thus keeping them "off the market". Dust players don't have this option. If one player has all the shares, the can force a vote where only he and the CEO can vote - when the CEO is in Dust, the CEO loses the ability to vote due to a lack of mechanics to do so, effectively meaning that the Eve player can take over the corporation legally - albeit as a hostile takeover. All the Eve player does is to take the shares out of the corp wallet and assign them to himself. He can then initiate a vote (that only he can vote on) and install himself as the new CEO - and the old one has no say whatsoever. Now, if the CEO had a way to protect himself, or I don't know be aware that giving control of the corp temporarily can result in losing the corp, perhaps then things would be acceptable because then the CEO is taking on the danger knowingly or at least with the ability to fight it. CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. If you have the tools to protect yourself but this still happens - well that is on the player. This however is on CCP and they need to make good on this and revert control to the correct people and implement as a band-aid a warning about giving up control. Long term, they need to implement shares into Dust, no matter the "development cost", as this particular thing can truly be game breaking for someone when they have no control over something that they should have control over. Alright, Thanks. I understand now. "We should take care not to make intellect our god; it has, of course, strong muscles, but no personality" Albert Einste
Mac Dac Wraith Shadow Guards 268	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:25:00 - [73] - Quote Cenex Langly wrote: Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. glad to hear that! I was worried about being pimped. "We should take care not to make intellect our god; it has, of course, strong muscles, but no personality" Albert Einste
Soraya Xel Violent Intervention Top Men. 750	Posted - 2013.11.07 22:47:00 - [74] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. For an MMO, player-based organizations is kinda core. They're wasting their time on balancing, because they keep breaking balancing anyhow. They balanced everything around bad hit detection, and then fixed hit detection, and now balancing is completely wrong again. They'll fix that, then another bug, that'll break balance again. It's never going to be perfect, and they're wasting time with it. We need real content that encourages gameplay. And EVE has proven, time and time again, alliances, rivalries, wars. That creates gameplay. That creates content. Curious.... What weapons have they balanced ever since hit detection/aim assist were fixed/implemented..? Further more, how is balancing wrong again? They've made some pretty great strides since Uprising first released - Armor Tanking is viable, Heavies got some love, Laser Rifle got some love, Logistics got a slight tweak to ease their Master Race issues, Repair Tools are now viable... Just saying, they've had their teeter totter moments but they've done a pretty damn good job. It's gotten nothing but better, in my opinion. Um... no they haven't. It's now a twitch shooter. Whoever fires first wins, in less than a second. Little to no skill is left. Gear does not matter. Top Men. - The DUST Arm of the CFC www.dust-gents.com Recruiting corporations and players now!
SILENTSAM 69 SONS of LEGION RISE of LEGION 588	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:05:00 - [75] - Quote I think this is a great example of why we need to take the kid gloves off of DUST and include more of the complexities of EVE including things like Shares. It is wrong to judge console gamers just on the games that came before them.. We have been craving this level of complexity, yet I feel that no one is trusting that the console players really want this. We need the feature of EVE included in DUST. It is not as if every grunts life will be more complex, only the officers, who are the people who want these tools.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2986	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:06:00 - [76] - Quote Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that, as you say, revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for several years in to the game, we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 61	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:16:00 - [77] - Quote Good thing I was always.... stingy with my CEO & Director role's after-all... I have noticed & mentioned before Corporation issues such as the need for a Corporation invite option in Dust 514 & a Corporation alliance option in Dust 514 among a few other things. But that aside I assume CCP will fix it (preferably soon) us having to transfer our CEO to a EVE player just to alliance is rather insane & having a alliance leads to many benefits & stratgic advantage's leading to imporatant gameplay in PC, match sycning, meeting up, discussing matters, squading up & much more. But I digress, in this situation I have only a few suggestions till CCP fixes this but they might be able to help. I suggest the CEO, &/or Directors make a EVE character (if you already have EVE players in the corporation call upon them) join the corporation & have them become a part of this & vote against it. You do get 14 days free in EVE that's more then enough quite possibly in time to counter this perhaps. In the future the best I have to offer in tip's for scenario's such as this are when you enter alliance possibly create & use a EVE player for it that way you know that it's you, the true CEO with the CEO role. If that can't be worked out I'd remove & give all the Corporation ISK to the CEO to hold till the alliance is made & the role returned. If things don't work-out well in the end Vala our Corporation will aid you & Dust Core as best we can, you need but only ask of us till then we'll be on stand-by for you.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 61	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:21:00 - [78] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. Also we should raise this issue & push on about it but people look a DEV is already on it & that's the first step, it's also 1 of the best things we could hope for so far at this time. Being hard on him like that is a bit much in my opinion, we need only keep the topic alive & raised till it's fixed they are already on it. - To DEV, Thank You but know that we are counting on you guys....
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 61	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:23:00 - [79] - Quote Cenex Langly wrote: Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. Not for long....
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 61	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:25:00 - [80] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Or you know, just let Dust players form alliances without having to involve EVE players since its a huge gaping flaw in the system Like, Like & Like.... Oh wait, you can only like 1 comment once....

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 61	Posted - 2013.11.07 23:28:00 - [81] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Most of the top corps in the game are in some form of alliance. And it has an extremely strong effect on how PC battles are carried out. Failing to see the importance of it being represented in game is a rookie mistake. Like >.>
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 637	Posted - 2013.11.08 00:14:00 - [82] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. I can tell you all that from chatting/badgering him constantly at Fanfest and by twitter that CCP Nullabor is nuts for better Corp UI but like he says a complete revamp of the Eve/Dust corp UI will be a BIG project (like crimewatch big for those who play Eve). I want more corp stuff than anyone else in the game but I know the difficulties in doing it. But this is going to be a continuing problem so if a band aid is needed to give a temporary fix before a reworking of the UI from the ground up can be done, then I'm happy about that. Still going pester the crap out of you Nullabor for my Corp Fittings and hangers still.... Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 2995	Posted - 2013.11.08 00:52:00 - [83] - Quote Kevall Longstride wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. I can tell you all that from chatting/badgering him constantly at Fanfest and by twitter that CCP Nullabor is nuts for better Corp UI but like he says a complete revamp of the Eve/Dust corp UI will be a BIG project (like crimewatch big for those who play Eve). I want more corp stuff than anyone else in the game but I know the difficulties in doing it. But this is going to be a continuing problem so if a band aid is needed to give a temporary fix before a reworking of the UI from the ground up can be done, then I'm happy about that. Still going pester the crap out of you Nullabor for my Corp Fittings and hangers still.... Please do, because it is important. I look forward to chatting more about this at Fanfest next year too (you are coming right?). CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 64	Posted - 2013.11.08 03:11:00 - [84] - Quote Bump
snakevenom369 Fenrir's Wolves Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.08 03:24:00 - [85] - Quote Ares 514 wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Commissioner G0RD0N wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. how about simply removing the ability for an EVE player to have such power over a DUST corp?? nothing in DUST allows these 'shares' so why would it even be in the game? once again the interface between the 2 games causing issues that simply shouldn't be... The important part of your question here is "DUST Corp". The moment the CEO was assigned to an EVE player it became a mixed corp and so now you are playing with the expanded rules. I get that players want to form alliances but you can't have your cake and eat it too. Your attitude here is extremely disappointing. A warning message as you mentioned is useless. You have an alliance channel in dust that allows much better interactions among corporations. You have only one way to access it and instead of promoting it and preventing unstoppable issues from the DUST side of things you shrug your shoulders. You sir are my least favorite DEV, and that's saying something :) now i wouldn't go as far to say least favorite this methodology seems somewhat ill thought out, i know that having both the eve and dust sides interacting are tricky at best but this entire process has been badly execute yes i can understand making this a conjoined corp of both sides but aren't there easier ways of making this a more versatile use where the ex CEO holds a 50 % share and the rest would be passed to the eve player or the corp that way the original CEO would still be able to retain some control over the corporation with the use of the voting to change CEO from the eve side this would seem like a logical solution to suit both parties
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 64	Posted - 2013.11.08 03:28:00 - [86] - Quote Curious though, how did this happen & who's the EVE player responsible so we can get out the pitch forks & torches.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 321	Posted - 2013.11.08 03:58:00 - [87] - Quote Welcome to new Eden. Now you know, lesson learned, don't do it again. Do research next time you hand over your corp to someone you don't know. Life will only get more difficult as "real" assets come into the game. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
Sirpidey Adtur Aloren Foundations 97	Posted - 2013.11.08 05:07:00 - [88] - Quote Cenex Langly wrote: Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. While there is no way for an EVE player to take dust isk and put it in an EVE player's wallet directly, it is possible for them to put it in a dust merc's wallet. And there are people who buy dust ISK for EVE ISK. So, gain control of a corp, make a merc, put the merc in the corp, promote merc to director, have merc take all of the money. (and optionally launder the money to make it untracable). Then using one of the isk conversion services that players run, convert it to EVE isk. And that's how you profit. It's a bit roundabout, but it's doable. IgniteableAura wrote: Welcome to new Eden. Now you know, lesson learned, don't do it again. Do research next time you hand over your corp to someone you don't know. Life will only get more difficult as "real" assets come into the game. Problem is, with our half-assed corp implementation, we can't do **** about it. Let's see what someone could do about this in EVE. Capsuleer1 creates EVECORP. Capsuleer1 for some reason wants to temporarially transfer CEOship to Capsuleer2, who is not fully trusted. Capsuleer1 dumps all EVECORP shares from the corp wallet to his personal wallet. DUST PLAYERS CANNOT PERFORM THIS STEP. Capsuleer1 accepts Capsuleer2's application, and then promotes Capsuleer2 to the CEO position. Capsuleer2 tries to transfer shares from EVECORP's wallet to his personal wallet, but they aren't there, so he can't. At this point, one of two things can happen. Capsuleer2 is nice and returns the corp to Capsuleer1, after doing whatever it was that was needed. (or not doing what is needed, doesn't really matter for this example) Or two... Capsuleer2 is a jerk, and keeps his CEOship. Capsuleer1 can then hold a vote, and vote himself CEO of EVECORP, since Capsuleer1 has all of the shares in his personal wallet. Dust players CANNOT protect themselves like this, and that is dumb.
snakevenom369 Fenrir's Wolves Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.08 05:18:00 - [89] - Quote hence why i stated above implementing a method in which a dust created corp original CEO could hold 50% of the shares would be held by that person no matter what the case this would seem like a simple yet useful method in which to protect a dust corporation from something like this happening again within the game itself
Needless Sacermendor Red Fox Brigade 568	Posted - 2013.11.08 05:41:00 - [90] - Quote snakevenom369 wrote: hence why i stated above implementing a method in which a dust created corp original CEO could hold 50% of the shares would be held by that person no matter what the case this would seem like a simple yet useful method in which to protect a dust corporation from something like this happening again within the game itself It would need to be 100% Quote: A shareholder inside a corporation that holds more than 5% of the shares, can force a vote to take over CEOship of the corporation. Source Also ... Quote: As a CEO, you should take all Shares from your corporation wallet and place them into your personal wallet, so that any corporation members issued director rights can't take the shares out of the wallet and usurp you as CEO. From the same page

snakevenom369 Fenrir's Wolves Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.08 05:51:00 - [91] - Quote i'm just basing this on a dust CEO's perspective where the 50% constant hold for that dust player would instill the stalemate situation there in for the vote to change CEO across
Bethhy Ancient Exiles 289	Posted - 2013.11.08 06:34:00 - [92] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. The problem lay's when Mercenaries in DUST are making their own alliances and or joining them... Sometimes players with out even the basic tutorial of EVE online are in the leadership position's of the DUST corporations. They then rely on someone that has extensive EVE side knowledge and active accounts to use the alliance mechanics of New Eden. Sadly because of the meta gaming nature of EVE online players will naturally take the shares when given the chance... There is even professionally edited CCP video's promoting the activity. Not Guilty and several well known corporations suffered from this problem.. Until alliance and all corporation U.I. functions from EVE are working in DUST 514, meta gaming will forte any limited instructional warning you guys may implement.
G Torq ALTA B2O 262	Posted - 2013.11.08 07:21:00 - [93] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. Observation: You might be better off implementing some of corporation and alliance tools outside of Dust and EVE, eg. via a webpage. ...or, CREST :) Why are you even reading this?
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 638	Posted - 2013.11.08 08:50:00 - [94] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Kevall Longstride wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. I can tell you all that from chatting/badgering him constantly at Fanfest and by twitter that CCP Nullabor is nuts for better Corp UI but like he says a complete revamp of the Eve/Dust corp UI will be a BIG project (like crimewatch big for those who play Eve). I want more corp stuff than anyone else in the game but I know the difficulties in doing it. But this is going to be a continuing problem so if a band aid is needed to give a temporary fix before a reworking of the UI from the ground up can be done, then I'm happy about that. Still going pester the crap out of you Nullabor for my Corp Fittings and hangers still.... Please do, because it is important. I look forward to chatting more about this at Fanfest next year too (you are coming right?). Hell yeah. Flight was booked 2 months ago. Just waiting for the tickets and hotel deals to be released. Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University
GRIM GEAR Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 31	Posted - 2013.11.08 08:52:00 - [95] - Quote Damn that sucks a big banana, those eve pilots sure know how to turn a profit morale of the story is never ever trust a space head eve pilot unless they have ghost chips.
Victor889 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 44	Posted - 2013.11.08 09:29:00 - [96] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: OK what the heck before shutdown today i was given a message that said a eve player in my corp was running for CEO of my corp and that my CEO roles where removed till the vote was final and in truth i have been shut out and whats worst this eve pilot is not a director he doesn't have a singe role and also apparent only eve pilots are allowed to make these votes so it seems there is nothing i can do about it and in fact i think he already has control of the corp with his vote of 1!!! I Don't know how this happened and it is completely unfair and wrong that EVE is allowed to do this some how and no one i have talked to even knows how he can do it with out any roles. I have submitted a ticket and emailed customer support but by the time i get a reply this pilot will have probably deleted all the members and again there is nothing i can do...... so yeah what the heck!!!!! I think this is the first time I've ever seen you use anything close to actual grammar. I can haz all your Officer Heavy weapons?
Leither Yiltron KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 779	Posted - 2013.11.08 11:57:00 - [97] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: On the other hand, there are those of us that can. CCP made it very clear that they wanted to work on the core aspects of the game first and afterward work on the rest of the fluff - this falls into that category as it's not used by the vast majority of players as opposed to something like weapon/dropsuit/vehicle balancing, which everyone does use. For an MMO, player-based organizations is kinda core. They're wasting their time on balancing, because they keep breaking balancing anyhow. They balanced everything around bad hit detection, and then fixed hit detection, and now balancing is completely wrong again. They'll fix that, then another bug, that'll break balance again. It's never going to be perfect, and they're wasting time with it. We need real content that encourages gameplay. And EVE has proven, time and time again, alliances, rivalries, wars. That creates gameplay. That creates content. Alliances have been campaigning for even basic support for ages, and what we've managed to drag out are alliance mail and alliance chat. By all means, alliance chat seemingly worked as soon as corps did, for the record, but it took another several months for CCP to "add" alliance chat. It's okay, Soraya. When all but the clinically insane have abandoned coordinating given the horrible toolset and support CCP might finally think about adding maybe a create alliance button in Dust. Just the button, and probably still for 1B ISK. By all means they really don't care about alliances as far as Dust goes. Just look at the implementation of PC. They intentionally gimped alliances when doing that. After hundreds of man-hours working around those design decisions it almost feels like it was out of spite. PC Coordinator for RISE of LEGION Have a pony
Zero Notion Wraith Company 258	Posted - 2013.11.08 12:33:00 - [98] - Quote I'm so baffled by the DEV response to this - it borders on an asinine scolding with a smirking, "It's the New Eden Meta Game!" but it's not like Dust is a F2P game advertised on the PS3 network which is a console, not a PC, where a great deal of players are not going to be from Eve or even know very little of Eve or know why they should potentially know about Eve (because of something like this). This is seriously a critical oversight and what is even more shocking is the, "This is your fault because you want to have access to content that you should already have!" I don't really understand why alliances are not in the game; if it took Eve two years to develop and yet CCP has ALL that time to recognize how important alliances are and how much player-driver content opportunities alliances offer (which is so, so badly needed right now in Dust), why wasn't it one of the first mechanics available? Even in a FPS player crave some level of sociability, yeesh.
Alabastor 'TheBlaster' Alcar Silver Bullet Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 277	Posted - 2013.11.08 12:47:00 - [99] - Quote so directors can transfer shares? or only the CEO? which is it, cause vala never made that guy CEO? directors shouldnt be able to move shares
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.08 12:53:00 - [100] - Quote Zero Notion wrote: I'm so baffled by the DEV response to this - it borders on an asinine scolding with a smirking, "It's the New Eden Meta Game!" but it's not like Dust is a F2P game advertised on the PS3 network which is a console, not a PC, where a great deal of players are not going to be from Eve or even know very little of Eve or know why they should potentially know about Eve (because of something like this). This is seriously a critical oversight and what is even more shocking is the, "This is your fault because you want to have access to content that you should already have!" EVE is full of people who just downloaded and play the game they've heard of from somewhere, amass lots of ISK through mission running and then get scammed. They are as clueless as the OP and deserve a good smirking at.

Hecarim Van Hohen Unkn0wn Killers 213	Posted - 2013.11.08 12:57:00 - [101] - Quote Alabastor 'TheBlaster' Alcar wrote: so directors can transfer shares? or only the CEO? which is it, cause vala never made that guy CEO? directors shouldnt be able to move shares CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. If this is not the case then there is this: CCP Nullarbor wrote: You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). I'd try petitioning this and hope for a good outcome. D-í¦¦¦¦i-ó¦¦¦+¦¿¦ºv-ë-£i-ë¦ó¦¦d¦ò-Ç¦íe¦¦-ë-í¦ò-ó ¦ò¦+-üw¦¿¦¦e-ü -ë¦òs¦¢¦+t-Å¦+-£a¦¢-án-¥¦¢-ƒ¦¢d-ü-í-ó¦ó-ó ¦¦u-ÿ-ó¦¦¦+n-ÿ-í¦¦-ü-ëi¦ó-ó-Pt-Å-Åe¦º-Å-Çd-Å-ó -ü-ÿ-ü-íw¦¿-¥-£¦í-ëe¦¦-ÿ-ü -í-ü¦óf-ía¦¢¦+-P¦í-ól-ƒ¦ó
Zero Notion Wraith Company 259	Posted - 2013.11.08 13:00:00 - [102] - Quote What I find most amusing out of this is that it correlates to something CCP Rogue pushed in a Polygon article - http://www.polygon.com/2013/10/17/4849166/dust-514s-new-producer-on-why-you-dont-stop-movies-or-games-to He discusses how important the experience is for players - this, to me, is a pretty great example of poor user experience because of Dev oversight and the way the DEV has currently addressed the issue is very, very poor.
The Robot Devil Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 1177	Posted - 2013.11.08 13:42:00 - [103] - Quote just wanted to view to make it spell 1337 Dr. Gonzo: I hate to say this, but this place is getting to me. I think I'm getting the Fear.
TrueXer0z DUST University Ivy League 229	Posted - 2013.11.08 13:48:00 - [104] - Quote lol, this is funny. This just goes to show that we need more focus on the dust side corp ui. From what I understand is that a person does not need to have any roles in order to start a vote. If the corp shares are all belong to the corp itself any person can start a vote to take ceo. This is confirmed. You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. Military Director, Dust University "I am a product of my own perception, I only exist because I allow myself to."
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2199	Posted - 2013.11.08 14:57:00 - [105] - Quote Cenex Langly wrote: Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. Only until they make their Dust player a Director... *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.08 15:07:00 - [106] - Quote TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone.
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2199	Posted - 2013.11.08 15:17:00 - [107] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. Ty thoughts on this: 1. I respect where you are coming, however the analogy of alliances in Eve and Dust is a flawed analogy. The reason is that the alliance mechanics are impact Dust today due to the fact that corproations are mixed, and you have given limited mechanics in Dust that involve alliance functionality. When alliances were introduced into Eve, there was nothing like it prior - meaning this was a wholly new concept whereas in Dust it is not. 2. This statement is more comprehensive than your previous ones - part of what upset me and others is that you appeared to be getting defensive without actually explaining anything 3. CCP should revert ownership and shares of the OP's corp immediately. 4. CCP should introduce warning message at multiple levels (assigning roles; resigning CEO title, creating corporation, etc) to present all of the dangers herein until such time that CCP can devote development resources to introduce proper mechanics; this sould be done immediately as well. 5. As the executor of my alliance, things like this really irk me because it impacts my player base greatly. Personally, this does not impact me directly as I know the dangers as a long time Eve player (6 years and counting). That said, it does impact me indirectly in my ability to recruit new corps from Dust into my alliance, as well as the ability to protect my players from unseen threats, which is the responsibility of any corp or alliance CEO. Now comes the fun part - I normally don't play the "disgruntled customer" card, but the fact of the matter is I am a long term subscriber to Eve with 4 accounts (and as someone in Eve who rarely actually makes ISK because I don't enjoy that aspect, I am someone who pays real world money for 4 accounts every month) plus 2 in Dust. This issue impacts my ability to play Eve the way that I want - and so now what you have is a free to play game negatively impacting a paying customer in a different game. CCP's lack of forethought here is amazingly obvious to me. Were this only impactful to players who are not required to pay a subscription to play the game (i.e. Dust only players), the problems are lessened (albeit they are still significant). This, however, can potentially impact a lot of things in Eve - and I don't get the feeling that you realize this. 6. I hereby call for an official statement from CCP announcing the plans to implement the "bandaid" warnings in the game, and how soon we can expect them. I would also call on CCP to acknowledge that the OP's corp will be returned to him as a sign of good faith. I do so with the full understanding that CCP is not required to do so - though from a PR perspective this is a great opportunity that CCP would be foolish to ignore. 7. And finally, to the OP - my sympathies for you. If there is anything I can do to assist you (which, to be honest, I doubt there will be), please message me in game. If it is something that is in my power to do, and is reasonable, I will do what I can for you. Thanks for listening. *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 1760	Posted - 2013.11.08 15:23:00 - [108] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. I call BS on this. I'm a 6 year veteran of EVE and I put little thought into shares as they play such a minuscule role in most activities. If a DUST player can create and manage a corporation but be bitten by a rarely used element of its sister game then there is a problem. The first step is to educate the DUST player. The second is to fix it. CCP can at least make an official and prominently posted warning of the dangers of transferring the CEO title to a pilot for any length of time. AKA: Rees Noturana https://twitter.com/reesnoturana
NanoCleric The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 91	Posted - 2013.11.08 15:56:00 - [109] - Quote Just adding my 2cents to this as i'm involved in this ordeal. Vala Prime is the CEO of DUST CORE, and they came to join our alliance 'DARKSTAR ARMY'. As many others have done... We inform everyone trying to join us that they would need an eve pilot to become ceo and then to make the applications, in the case of those who don't know any eve pilots they can trust or can't create one themselves... Myself and our CEO had alts which we had unaligned for this purpose so we could help them join. In this case, it was my alt which was used. Personally i've never been aware of the shares, and have never run a corp or alliance and was simply assisting our CEO Josh in helping dust corps apply to us. The procedure was explained to me and it seemed simple enough. I sent this as part of a mail to corps who were interested with the procedure: 3) The eve char with CEO needs to do the following: - Select Corporation - Select the Alliances tab - Select the Rankings sub-tab - Find 'DARKSTAR ARMY' - Right click our alliance and then click the apply to alliance button (cant remember exact text) - Send the application - Have the CEO resign to return powers back to yourself. - Ensure the eve char finds themselves in the members list and right clicks themselves then selects 'remove all roles' So these were the steps i took after Vala had passed me CEO. .. Also before anyone suggests there was any malpractise.. i would also advise them to take all corp funds and put it in their personal wallet if they were to go down the route of trusting us to do it.. just for their peace of mind. So that's all that was done.. then CEO was returned to vala and i was still ignorant about any of this Share stuff.. i didn't even know a CEO could be voted out until Vala came to me upset and lost for what to do so i ended up googling it and found out the details. So.. Vala came to me to let me know this had happened and sure enough i read that only directors or CEO's can do this, and then only if they have 5% shares. Now as far as i'm aware, Vala never gave CEO to anyone else, however she had previously made this other character a director, but then revoked the director from them. I asked Vala if this vote happened before she removed the Director roles and she said that she'd removed his Director roles a long time ago. So i have no idea how this guy managed to initiate a vote if he was a standard member, even if he somehow grabbed all the shares when he was a director. So i have no explanation for it all other than there is a loophole between Dust and Eve in the coding of it. The players name as i found out from Vala is: Jihad Destroyer 011011 If it had have been me... well i don't think i could have trusted a name like that as director, but we all have different opinions on things like that. As for Vala herself.. she is not an Eve player, and she first came to New Eden as a Dust player. So she has no understanding of the eve side of things and she does not have a functional PC either.. she had to rely on friends to help get her messages out, so she most likely won't see the aftermath of this thread either. I told her she should get hold of CCP and let them know about it and hopefully they would help. So Nullarbor... this is the situation as it occured for as much as i'm aware. So all i could say is could you help them out in this instance.. and if you need to contact vala, can you do so via in-game contacts as i doubt she'll hop back on a PC. Asking her to put a petition in.. she probabely won't end up doing it, she's not very computer-savy and needs assistance with it. I know that CCP may not see this as a priority, but it's a major loophole which can be exploited by eve players since many dust created corps are very unaware of this concept, even i as an eve player was totally unaware. So something does need to be done and it does need to be more than a warning, else expect a lot more damage control to come your way.. as there's plenty of corps i went through this process with who will be vulnerable too... There will no doubt be many i'm unaware of also. So unless something is done to protect those who have already passed the threshold of the warning... then they are going to end up getting screwed. Sure enough noone wants extra pressure on them when they are trying to release more content.. but surely neither can you alienate those who trust in you already, that would only serve to turn their backs to your game. If you want to keep people's trust, i think you need to do all you can to jump on this a.s.a.p. before it gets worse. Sure people will be peeved if that means a delay of new content etc... but when it comes to priorities... surely security has to come before shiney new toys. As a final note, to any other corps who i helped join the alliance, i am very sorry if this has made your corps vulnerable, i would advise that you have your most trusted eve pilot manage your shares correctly to avoid this happening to you, or ensure you don't give director roles to any eve pilots as a rule... Sorry and best of luck.
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.08 16:59:00 - [110] - Quote NanoCleric wrote: The players name as i found out from Vala is: Jihad Destroyer 011011 If he was a capsuleer then yes, he could have taken the shares. If a merc, no. Also an excellent post in long form; would make any corp infiltrator proud. Reav Hannari wrote: I call BS on this. I'm a 6 year veteran of EVE and I put little thought into shares as they play such a minuscule role in most activities. If a DUST player can create and manage a corporation but be bitten by a rarely used element of its sister game then there is a problem. The first step is to educate the DUST player. The second is to fix it. CCP can at least make an official and prominently posted warning of the dangers of transferring the CEO title to a pilot for any length of time. I knew enough about shares and corp roles 2 years in to know you don't trust anyone with anything unless you've not only read everything out there but also tested things out on SiSi. Rarely used is often bitten, suck it up. And while the warning is a good improvement, joining an alliance isn't a "newbie activity" and as such a basic understanding of the mechanisms can be assumed.

Draco Cerberus Hell's Gate Inc 474	Posted - 2013.11.08 17:19:00 - [111] - Quote A quick check on the attributes of Dust Core from Eve side indicates that at one point in time someone added shares to the corporation. Current number of shares is 1001, which is 1 more share than what a new corporation starts with. I would guess that when a director he added one share and transferred it to himself to allow himself a foothold if it was ever needed. *One Universe...*
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 880	Posted - 2013.11.08 17:34:00 - [112] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: A quick check on the attributes of Dust Core from Eve side indicates that at one point in time someone added shares to the corporation. Current number of shares is 1001, which is 1 more share than what a new corporation starts with. I would guess that when a director he added one share and transferred it to himself to allow himself a foothold if it was ever needed. That is not 5% of total shares.
TrueXer0z DUST University Ivy League 231	Posted - 2013.11.08 20:30:00 - [113] - Quote Some posts were TLDR, but in all honesty, If a dust player is allowed to start and maintain a corp/alliance, that dust player should have the same access to all the different tools an eve player should. This just gives an unfair advantage to someone with an eve account. I am all for someone underhandedly stealing a corp, or doing something to dismantle a corp..it is part of the game we play. But, if a Dust merc is not given the ability to defend his corp on the same level of a eve player, then we are looking at an unbalanced playing field via Meta game. This also includes the inability to admin dust made chat channels. Which is something I have be advocating since the beginning. Military Director, Dust University "I am a product of my own perception, I only exist because I allow myself to."
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 70	Posted - 2013.11.08 20:43:00 - [114] - Quote Forlorn Destrier wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. Ty thoughts on this: 1. I respect where you are coming, however the analogy of alliances in Eve and Dust is a flawed analogy. The reason is that the alliance mechanics are impact Dust today due to the fact that corproations are mixed, and you have given limited mechanics in Dust that involve alliance functionality. When alliances were introduced into Eve, there was nothing like it prior - meaning this was a wholly new concept whereas in Dust it is not. 2. This statement is more comprehensive than your previous ones - part of what upset me and others is that you appeared to be getting defensive without actually explaining anything 3. CCP should revert ownership and shares of the OP's corp immediately. 4. CCP should introduce warning message at multiple levels (assigning roles; resigning CEO title, creating corporation, etc) to present all of the dangers herein until such time that CCP can devote development resources to introduce proper mechanics; this sould be done immediately as well. 5. As the executor of my alliance, things like this really irk me because it impacts my player base greatly. Personally, this does not impact me directly as I know the dangers as a long time Eve player (6 years and counting). That said, it does impact me indirectly in my ability to recruit new corps from Dust into my alliance, as well as the ability to protect my players from unseen threats, which is the responsibility of any corp or alliance CEO. Now comes the fun part - I normally don't play the "disgruntled customer" card, but the fact of the matter is I am a long term subscriber to Eve with 4 accounts (and as someone in Eve who rarely actually makes ISK because I don't enjoy that aspect, I am someone who pays real world money for 4 accounts every month) plus 2 in Dust. This issue impacts my ability to play Eve the way that I want - and so now what you have is a free to play game negatively impacting a paying customer in a different game. CCP's lack of forethought here is amazingly obvious to me. Were this only impactful to players who are not required to pay a subscription to play the game (i.e. Dust only players), the problems are lessened (albeit they are still significant). This, however, can potentially impact a lot of things in Eve - and I don't get the feeling that you realize this. 6. I hereby call for an official statement from CCP announcing the plans to implement the "bandaid" warnings in the game, and how soon we can expect them. I would also call on CCP to acknowledge that the OP's corp will be returned to him as a sign of good faith. I do so with the full understanding that CCP is not required to do so - though from a PR perspective this is a great opportunity that CCP would be foolish to ignore. 7. And finally, to the OP - my sympathies for you. If there is anything I can do to assist you (which, to be honest, I doubt there will be), please message me in game. If it is something that is in my power to do, and is reasonable, I will do what I can for you. Thanks for listening. I agree this all is valid reasoning. Not much to say beyond that lol
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 70	Posted - 2013.11.08 20:59:00 - [115] - Quote We need tools more then a warning but a deep informational warning should be eventually put in. I think this is a neccesity in Dust 514 before it gets worse Dust 514 CEO's need a alliance option themselves & more ways to guard themselves. This is argueably more urgent then certain upcoming content as it is a deep & near game breaking issue. I also agree, you as well as many others shouldn't have to be hurt gameplay wise because you wanted to do a neccesity that is supposed to be in the game alliances are very much needed in New Eden. Now that this is more known people will hear of it so this is a extreme example. Top Corporations such as SVER, Red Star, DUST CORE, Dust University, MHPD, OH (too I think), PX1 & MANY MANY more are in alliances like Public Disorder, DARKSTAR ARMY, & EoN. are ALL at risk. A war breaks out (like the recent 1 with SVER, TP, OH, PX1 & OH) instead of it happening like it did in Molden Heath they decide to war with share's - imagine the destruction, every corporation in top alliances suddenly get attacked through share's is put simply a nightmare. The possiblity is their.... 1 corporation purposely designed for this type of warfare style could near single handedly destroy all corporations in every top alliance financially with share's leaving many in ruin & perhaps thousands of players in shock. That is a worse case scenario unlikely to ever happen but the mere possiblity it can be allowed to be done is insane by itself, which is the point I'm making.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 70	Posted - 2013.11.08 21:05:00 - [116] - Quote TrueXer0z wrote: Some posts were TLDR, but in all honesty, If a dust player is allowed to start and maintain a corp/alliance, that dust player should have the same access to all the different tools an eve player should. This just gives an unfair advantage to someone with an eve account. I am all for someone underhandedly stealing a corp, or doing something to dismantle a corp..it is part of the game we play. But, if a Dust merc is not given the ability to defend his corp on the same level of a eve player, then we are looking at an unbalanced playing field via Meta game. This also includes the inability to admin dust made chat channels. Which is something I have be advocating since the beginning. A very valid point.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 323	Posted - 2013.11.08 21:11:00 - [117] - Quote Sirpidey Adtur wrote: IgniteableAura wrote: Welcome to new Eden. Now you know, lesson learned, don't do it again. Do research next time you hand over your corp to someone you don't know. Life will only get more difficult as "real" assets come into the game. Problem is, with our half-assed corp implementation, we can't do **** about it. Let's see what someone could do about this in EVE. Capsuleer1 creates EVECORP. Capsuleer1 for some reason wants to temporarially transfer CEOship to Capsuleer2, who is not fully trusted. Capsuleer1 dumps all EVECORP shares from the corp wallet to his personal wallet. DUST PLAYERS CANNOT PERFORM THIS STEP. Capsuleer1 accepts Capsuleer2's application, and then promotes Capsuleer2 to the CEO position. Capsuleer2 tries to transfer shares from EVECORP's wallet to his personal wallet, but they aren't there, so he can't. At this point, one of two things can happen. Capsuleer2 is nice and returns the corp to Capsuleer1, after doing whatever it was that was needed. (or not doing what is needed, doesn't really matter for this example) Or two... Capsuleer2 is a jerk, and keeps his CEOship. Capsuleer1 can then hold a vote, and vote himself CEO of EVECORP, since Capsuleer1 has all of the shares in his personal wallet. Dust players CANNOT protect themselves like this, and that is dumb. Yes but you shouldn't be giving someone CEO you don't trust in the first place. Regardless of shares by the time you initiate a vote and get the vote cast (several days), your corp would be destroyed if rouge CEO wanted it done. The second you gave your corp to someone you didn't know you failed. You don't really protect yourself with shares....that's not the point of them. Its to make a "democracy" style system for a group of leaders to initiate a vote to replace a CEO if necessary. Otherwise they really serve no purpose. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 328	Posted - 2013.11.09 00:58:00 - [118] - Quote IgniteableAura wrote: Welcome to new Eden. Now you know, lesson learned, don't do it again. Do research next time you hand over your corp to someone you don't know. Life will only get more difficult as "real" assets come into the game. Another idiot with his head in the "Welcome to new Eden" fishbowl. Bug-eyed and refusing to look around. Sorry kid, this ain't New Eden, this is programming flaws. If you can read this, it means you are reading.
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 22	Posted - 2013.11.09 09:24:00 - [119] - Quote Im losing my corp right now and dont think its fair. I cant remove Jihad destroyer 011011 from my corp and cant vote against him. He want give back the shares he blocked me from accepting any apps into the corp. He is not director but got all my shares is now trying get rid of me. I hate that Im lossing my corp right . We on dust need to see the shares on here and control them. no one know this can happen on dust side could happen and did . I just want my shares back and him gone from this corp. He kicked people from my corp . This is not right my corp been around sent close beta . Next time lets us have rights to fix this problem and not be screwed im so screwed. Im not eve player didnt know about shares and he not director. By the way Jihad destroyer 011011 is saying he didnt do this when i have the notification that says what happen.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles 294	Posted - 2013.11.09 16:48:00 - [120] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. Your funny, I've been playing EVE online since closed beta... the shares functions within corporations are one of the oldest systems in EVE associated with corporations.. a majority of pilot's in new Eden don;t even know how the system works. And they have a game where an in game browser is located on a tool bar and all they have to do is google the information. No mercenary in dust should have to go through the extensive learning curve of EVE and know all the finer functions to create a social group within dust known as a corporation. If most players in EVE don't fully understand how shares work how can you expect a DUST player too? Shares implemented well are almost more viable in DUST for use.... If we could buy out shares from our corporations as mercenaries and then have a share holders say within the corporations.. and got payed out dividends from corporation profit's.. would make a lot of sense in how the whole Mercenary structure goes. Shares and share holder functions within DUST will also allow DUST mercenary cores to be built within EVE based corporations but still have a "Say" within the corporation as the DUST mercenaries are share holders within the corporation. You guys have one of the best U.I. examples in gaming... EVE online's U.I. is second to none. The version of UI. we got in DUST, is almost a preschool's version.. the Problem is not that they made it more simplistic, It's that it's missing key element's that merge it properly with EVE online and essentially handicap us.. and further hurt the legitimacy of DUST mercenaries in the New Eden galaxy.

low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 846	Posted - 2013.11.09 17:11:00 - [121] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: Alright, good to know. Never let an Eve guy touch my CEO title. sound advice. but you can give them the ceo title. you just need to take 501 shares out of the corp wallet before you do.
Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 243	Posted - 2013.11.09 17:13:00 - [122] - Quote Jadek Menaheim wrote: Alright, good to know. Never let an Eve guy touch my CEO title. Woah, perspective changes fast when temped by the ability to increase the corp to over 5000 new slots. Edit: This Eve pilot seems to have a lot of fun dropping clone packs on districts. It's a win-win scenario. [sig=hex.dec]4d7920313333372048617830727a2078706c6f747a20522058706f7364206259206c766c2035204330646562386b727a[/sig]
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 846	Posted - 2013.11.09 17:19:00 - [123] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. exactly. which part of "the most back-stabbing cutthroat videogame in the world" was misleading?
SgtDoughnut Red Star Jr. EoN. 363	Posted - 2013.11.09 22:47:00 - [124] - Quote He may have had roles from a previous corp that allowed him to access shares and start the vote, its a bug they never really fixed in EvE and thats the reason any new good corp you join requires you to drop roles first (takes 24 hours) then join them.
GHOSTLY ANNIHILATOR The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 1044	Posted - 2013.11.10 07:03:00 - [125] - Quote Damn thats some fked up *** even more fked that CCP wont do nothing to that guy ... I hope ccp could make it better for dusties in the future ,but sorry that happened to u VALA my best regards go to u and ur corp let it live . My PS3 is dusty ._. Level 1 Forum Warrior*
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 22	Posted - 2013.11.10 14:06:00 - [126] - Quote As of today i lost my corp to the eve player . I got voted out and no one else could vote against him he has all the shares and dust players dont vote. I dont know how he got them would have like this problem fixed i dont think its fair for this to happen and nothing i can do. So to everyone in dust dust core is control by a trader he cant help the corp and the name is corrupt now. I wish ccp will disbanded the corp. Im not happy that this happen all the hard i have done in this corp taken away in 2 days by something I couldnt stop or didnt know about. Jihad destroyer 011011 said he only wanted the corp name thats f up i helped made this corp and in 2 days it was taken away its a sad day in dust .
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 22	Posted - 2013.11.10 14:51:00 - [127] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: As of today i lost my corp to the eve player after ccp told me they took steps to prevent this from happening and so i guess ccp lied to me and my corp and allowed this to happen. I got voted out and no one else could vote against him he has all the shares and dust players dont vote. I dont know how he got them would have like this problem fixed i dont think its fair for this to happen and nothing i can do. So to everyone in dust dust core is control by a trader he cant help the corp and the name is corrupt now. I wish ccp will disbanded the corp. Im not happy that this happen all the hard i have done in this corp taken away in 2 days by something I couldnt stop or didnt know about. Jihad destroyer 011011 said he only wanted the corp name thats f up i helped made this corp and in 2 days it was taken away its a sad day in dust . Hello, Thanks for your email and please accept your most sincere apologies for the delay in replying to you. After thoroughly investigating the issue in question we have now cancelled the vote triggered by the mentioned EVE Online pilot and your CEO role should have been restored. In order for us to do please be aware one of our Game Master (GM Grave) temporary joined your Corporation and modified the number of corporation shares available. This will not in any way affect the Corporation and was only required in order for us to intervene. Additionally to the above we have also taken extra steps to avoid similar issues occurring again with the parties involved. We would also like to bring to your attention to take extra care when appointing directors, especially if the player is an EVE Pilot. Corporation Management, EVE side, is much more elaborated than in DUST 514 and Directors, as well as CEO do have a lot more features available to them, some of which can be used in some ways to take over corporations. Please be on the lookout for further communications on this matter as we will make a public announcement on this issue in the coming days via our official forums in order to clarify the mechanics, policies and our stance on this matter. If you have any further issue please let us know. Warm regards, GM Unicorn CCP Customer Support \| EVE Online \| DUST 514
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1549	Posted - 2013.11.10 15:33:00 - [128] - Quote While EVE (and now DUST) is all about the scamming and the cheating, it is just as much about smart play to protect yourself from the scamming an the cheating. CCP cares just as much about balancing this as they care about balancing weapons. This incident, as with the AWOXing incidents, shows that CCP does not accept scamming and cheating that does not have a counter. I am glad that CCP chose to step in and correct this situation. It did not meet the standards of Meta Game balance that we come to expect from CCP. Sort of an oops moment for them I expect. DonGÇÖt expect petitioning to work after they get proper messaging and counter measures in though.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles 296	Posted - 2013.11.10 15:47:00 - [129] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: Vala Prime wrote: As of today i lost my corp to the eve player after ccp told me they took steps to prevent this from happening and so i guess ccp lied to me and my corp and allowed this to happen. I got voted out and no one else could vote against him he has all the shares and dust players dont vote. I dont know how he got them would have like this problem fixed i dont think its fair for this to happen and nothing i can do. So to everyone in dust dust core is control by a trader he cant help the corp and the name is corrupt now. I wish ccp will disbanded the corp. Im not happy that this happen all the hard i have done in this corp taken away in 2 days by something I couldnt stop or didnt know about. Jihad destroyer 011011 said he only wanted the corp name thats f up i helped made this corp and in 2 days it was taken away its a sad day in dust . Hello, Thanks for your email and please accept your most sincere apologies for the delay in replying to you. After thoroughly investigating the issue in question we have now cancelled the vote triggered by the mentioned EVE Online pilot and your CEO role should have been restored. In order for us to do please be aware one of our Game Master (GM Grave) temporary joined your Corporation and modified the number of corporation shares available. This will not in any way affect the Corporation and was only required in order for us to intervene. Additionally to the above we have also taken extra steps to avoid similar issues occurring again with the parties involved. We would also like to bring to your attention to take extra care when appointing directors, especially if the player is an EVE Pilot. Corporation Management, EVE side, is much more elaborated than in DUST 514 and Directors, as well as CEO do have a lot more features available to them, some of which can be used in some ways to take over corporations. Please be on the lookout for further communications on this matter as we will make a public announcement on this issue in the coming days via our official forums in order to clarify the mechanics, policies and our stance on this matter. If you have any further issue please let us know. Warm regards, GM Unicorn CCP Customer Support \| EVE Online \| DUST 514 Good Job CCP. Salute.
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 23	Posted - 2013.11.10 15:48:00 - [130] - Quote Fox Gaden wrote: While EVE (and now DUST) is all about the scamming and the cheating, it is just as much about smart play to protect yourself from the scamming an the cheating. CCP cares just as much about balancing this as they care about balancing weapons. This incident, as with the AWOXing incidents, shows that CCP does not accept scamming and cheating that does not have a counter. I am glad that CCP chose to step in and correct this situation. It did not meet the standards of Meta Game balance that we come to expect from CCP. Sort of an oops moment for them I expect. DonGÇÖt expect petitioning to work after they get proper messaging and counter measures in though. no you missed it they said they fixed and didnt i just lost the corp to the same guy after they stated they took steps to prevent that

IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 324	Posted - 2013.11.10 15:57:00 - [131] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: Vala Prime wrote: As of today i lost my corp to the eve player after ccp told me they took steps to prevent this from happening and so i guess ccp lied to me and my corp and allowed this to happen. I got voted out and no one else could vote against him he has all the shares and dust players dont vote. I dont know how he got them would have like this problem fixed i dont think its fair for this to happen and nothing i can do. So to everyone in dust dust core is control by a trader he cant help the corp and the name is corrupt now. I wish ccp will disbanded the corp. Im not happy that this happen all the hard i have done in this corp taken away in 2 days by something I couldnt stop or didnt know about. Jihad destroyer 011011 said he only wanted the corp name thats f up i helped made this corp and in 2 days it was taken away its a sad day in dust . Hello, Thanks for your email and please accept your most sincere apologies for the delay in replying to you. After thoroughly investigating the issue in question we have now cancelled the vote triggered by the mentioned EVE Online pilot and your CEO role should have been restored. In order for us to do please be aware one of our Game Master (GM Grave) temporary joined your Corporation and modified the number of corporation shares available. This will not in any way affect the Corporation and was only required in order for us to intervene. Additionally to the above we have also taken extra steps to avoid similar issues occurring again with the parties involved. We would also like to bring to your attention to take extra care when appointing directors, especially if the player is an EVE Pilot. Corporation Management, EVE side, is much more elaborated than in DUST 514 and Directors, as well as CEO do have a lot more features available to them, some of which can be used in some ways to take over corporations. Please be on the lookout for further communications on this matter as we will make a public announcement on this issue in the coming days via our official forums in order to clarify the mechanics, policies and our stance on this matter. If you have any further issue please let us know. Warm regards, GM Unicorn CCP Customer Support \| EVE Online \| DUST 514 Facepalm...you really are bad at this. You can get perma banned for quoting GMs from petitions. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.10 15:59:00 - [132] - Quote Soraya Xel wrote: Most of the top corps in the game are in some form of alliance. And it has an extremely strong effect on how PC battles are carried out. Failing to see the importance of it being represented in game is a rookie mistake. This is exactly correct. The ability for groups to organize, and work together is what makes this game different. (well and hopefully a market economy coming soon). Stop doing it wrong. Merge the DUST and EVE forums together, give parity to the leaders on both platforms to have access and hold corp shares. Give parity to leaders on both platforms to set roles for both EVE and DUST specific roles as well. An EVE player cannot set Terrestrial manager roles for his own corp. WHY? This should have been part of the design process from the outset. Any further development on the Corp/Alliance side of EVE and DUST514 should be built to make sure leaders on both sides have parity.
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.10 16:05:00 - [133] - Quote low genius wrote: Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. exactly. which part of "the most back-stabbing cutthroat videogame in the world" was misleading? Makes me wonder why GMs got involved at all... and why they assumed it was an exploit when clearly it is not.
Vala Prime DUST CORE Zero-Day 23	Posted - 2013.11.10 16:18:00 - [134] - Quote RAider Vherikor wrote: low genius wrote: Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. exactly. which part of "the most back-stabbing cutthroat videogame in the world" was misleading? Makes me wonder why GMs got involved at all... and why they assumed it was an exploit when clearly it is not. it is an exploit because they took advantage of a serious flaw in the lack of programing in the dust 514 mechanics
Karl Koekwaus 198	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:10:00 - [135] - Quote The simple way to fix this is to give all Dust corps the same stuff as EvE Corps, roles, skills, everything. This way you don't hide options for CEO's that might be detrimental later down the road, like what happened here with the Shares. I'm amazed actually CCP didn't emplement corps this way and instead gave dust some watered down version which has half the Corp options hidden. CCP tells players they're in the same Universe, but it seems more and more Dust players are throdding around in some Kindergarten playground with all this interference. Micheal Jackson died for my sins
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE Zero-Day 4	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:10:00 - [136] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: RAider Vherikor wrote: low genius wrote: Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. exactly. which part of "the most back-stabbing cutthroat videogame in the world" was misleading? Makes me wonder why GMs got involved at all... and why they assumed it was an exploit when clearly it is not. it is an exploit because they took advantage of a serious flaw in the lack of programing in the dust 514 mechanics As I recall correctly you had numerous EVE players which you bragged had YEARS of experience in EVE. All of which fully explained to you what was going on as it happened. This means you and your corp had full access to the critical information the whole time and could have taken measures to mitigate it. You even have an EVE alt as well which you didn't use. The shares were there long before the thief got in there because you decided to make others CEO earlier. Ignorance is no excuse. In New Eden it is all about learning the mechanics of the game.
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE Zero-Day 4	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:16:00 - [137] - Quote Karl Koekwaus wrote: The simple way to fix this is to give all Dust corps the same stuff as EvE Corps, roles, skills, everything. This way you don't hide options for CEO's that might be detrimental later down the road, like what happened here with the Shares. I'm amazed actually CCP didn't emplement corps this way and instead gave dust some watered down version which has half the Corp options hidden. Apparently the guy who did this agrees with you. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3856505#post3856505 I liked his post so much I posted a similar one as well. There should be equality for leadership in both games for managing their corps. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=120543&find=unread
Karl Koekwaus 198	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:20:00 - [138] - Quote I'm just amazed CCP didn't see this coming and is now band-aiding in a terrible way that is detrimental to the sanbox. Instead of practising what they preach, 'Dust and EVE are in the same Universe and abide by the same harsh ruleset' Micheal Jackson died for my sins
IMMORTAL WAR HERO BAD SANTA'S SCHOOL 4 SCOUNDRELS 72	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:24:00 - [139] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: OK what the heck before shutdown today i was given a message that said a eve player in my corp was running for CEO of my corp and that my CEO roles where removed till the vote was final and in truth i have been shut out and whats worst this eve pilot is not a director he doesn't have a singe role and also apparent only eve pilots are allowed to make these votes so it seems there is nothing i can do about it and in fact i think he already has control of the corp with his vote of 1!!! I Don't know how this happened and it is completely unfair and wrong that EVE is allowed to do this some how and no one i have talked to even knows how he can do it with out any roles. I have submitted a ticket and emailed customer support but by the time i get a reply this pilot will have probably deleted all the members and again there is nothing i can do...... so yeah what the heck!!!!! go to dust website not forums make a help ticket to see whathappened or make 1 to force close corp......... NEEW OMENS is recruiting if you wan..... you a player iv seen around lots your welcome any time are you the original person who made corp??? Frowned upon by amateurs: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP
IMMORTAL WAR HERO BAD SANTA'S SCHOOL 4 SCOUNDRELS 72	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:29:00 - [140] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: OK what the heck before shutdown today i was given a message that said a eve player in my corp was running for CEO of my corp and that my CEO roles where removed till the vote was final and in truth i have been shut out and whats worst this eve pilot is not a director he doesn't have a singe role and also apparent only eve pilots are allowed to make these votes so it seems there is nothing i can do about it and in fact i think he already has control of the corp with his vote of 1!!! I Don't know how this happened and it is completely unfair and wrong that EVE is allowed to do this some how and no one i have talked to even knows how he can do it with out any roles. I have submitted a ticket and emailed customer support but by the time i get a reply this pilot will have probably deleted all the members and again there is nothing i can do...... so yeah what the heck!!!!! i seen this happen to mike ceo of paradox Frowned upon by amateurs: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP

Bethhy Ancient Exiles 302	Posted - 2013.11.10 17:47:00 - [141] - Quote RAider Vherikor wrote: Karl Koekwaus wrote: The simple way to fix this is to give all Dust corps the same stuff as EvE Corps, roles, skills, everything. This way you don't hide options for CEO's that might be detrimental later down the road, like what happened here with the Shares. I'm amazed actually CCP didn't emplement corps this way and instead gave dust some watered down version which has half the Corp options hidden. Apparently the guy who did this agrees with you. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3856505#post3856505 I liked his post so much I posted a similar one as well. There should be equality for leadership in both games for managing their corps. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=120543&find=unread All the players involved in this are right... There really is no wrong side... all the blame Lie's with CCP. And I'm sure someone is getting an ear full and fingers are pointing the blame away.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 325	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:04:00 - [142] - Quote Next up. Ccp allows dust to participate in RMT to help bolster dust player base. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:20:00 - [143] - Quote low genius wrote: Rasatsu wrote: TrueXer0z wrote: You got ****ed out of your corp due to the inability to assign shares from the dust client. Good luck man. I hope you get your corp back. This is not your fault either. The fault relies in a broken system between the eve and dust corp UIs. The fault lays with the OP, not the system. If they had done the obvious thing and read up some more on corp safety it clearly says on pretty much every guide to secure the shares. They didn't even seem to know about shares, yet entrusted their corp CEO role to someone. exactly. which part of "the most back-stabbing cutthroat videogame in the world" was misleading? Not exactly this clearly over-rules the game, no guard against it & you can't really repay the guy with a well layed plan to take your revenge. It's flawed in far too many area's on this 1
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:23:00 - [144] - Quote SgtDoughnut wrote: He may have had roles from a previous corp that allowed him to access shares and start the vote, its a bug they never really fixed in EvE and thats the reason any new good corp you join requires you to drop roles first (takes 24 hours) then join them. wow it's more broke then we thought then....
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:26:00 - [145] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: A quick check on the attributes of Dust Core from Eve side indicates that at one point in time someone added shares to the corporation. Current number of shares is 1001, which is 1 more share than what a new corporation starts with. I would guess that when a director he added one share and transferred it to himself to allow himself a foothold if it was ever needed. just wow.... this seriously needs fixed because this can destroy way too much & I can practically gurantee people will rage quit if they're corporation gets destroyed, loose they're people to a split, all the ISK, friendships get shook & loose all they're districts.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:37:00 - [146] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: Im losing my corp right now and dont think its fair. I cant remove Jihad destroyer 011011 from my corp and cant vote against him. He want give back the shares he blocked me from accepting any apps into the corp. He is not director but got all my shares is now trying get rid of me. I hate that Im lossing my corp right . We on dust need to see the shares on here and control them. no one know this can happen on dust side could happen and did . I just want my shares back and him gone from this corp. He kicked people from my corp . This is not right my corp been around sent close beta . Next time lets us have rights to fix this problem and not be screwed im so screwed. Im not eve player didnt know about shares and he not director. By the way Jihad destroyer 011011 is saying he didnt do this when i have the notification that says what happen. Take a picture of the msg that told you Vala & DL it onto your PS3 if you can then if need be you can show it to ppl if they need proof, that was absolutely insane I'm considering calling upon people to raise ISK & get a EVE player (or 5 of them) to hunt & destroy this Jihad guy nonestop & they'll need proof they killed him, shouldn't be hard to locate him through his friends or someone can befriend him enough to get him somewhere might be fun to repay him for his wrong doing. Maybe have a Titan waiting for him to destroy him with some other players. the guy has it coming at this point. btw If Jihad didn't do it as he says why did he not make you CEO or offered to aid you with the shares, the vote & etc. - boom, flaw in his arguement just saying. Still VERY glad CCP helped you though Vala. +1 for CCP & they're awesome ways
NanoCleric The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 94	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:54:00 - [147] - Quote Just a quick update all... I logged on tonight to check if Vala had the corp back and she hasn't. I have no idea what CCP did to help, but it's not succeeded. When Vala logged on today at the end of the vote timer with the hope she could have her CEO powers unblocked due to the vote ending.. she found that Jihad had control of the corp, which resulted in him kicking the players who have been supporting her. Now Jihad has transferred CEO to RAider Vherikor and Vala has no control over the corp anymore. By his own admission on the EVE forums, Jihad has posted announcing the exploit he found and used against DUST CORE, and mentions he has hit multiple corps via this 'bug/exploit' between the games. CCP This is your own fault for bad coding, and this coming from someone who works in the game industry himself. You have proivided players with no way to defend themselves from espionage in this instance. If they could defend themselves and lost it, then fair enough.. that's the world of New Eden, but due to bad choices, you have given players the ability to ruin someone's hard work without being challenged. This should be put to rights to undo your mistake, to reinstate control of the corps to their owners. As mentioned.. i would support the espionage if it was fair and Dust CEO's had mechanics to defend themselves. Since there are no mechanics to do such, then you should put these to rights, and put in defenses against it. Any other course of action imho is down to negligence. So sorry.. despite CCP claiming they have helped, The theft was successful.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 19:55:00 - [148] - Quote NanoCleric wrote: Just a quick update all... I logged on tonight to check if Vala had the corp back and she hasn't. I have no idea what CCP did to help, but it's not succeeded. When Vala logged on today at the end of the vote timer with the hope she could have her CEO powers unblocked due to the vote ending.. she found that Jihad had control of the corp, which resulted in him kicking the players who have been supporting her. Now Jihad has transferred CEO to RAider Vherikor and Vala has no control over the corp anymore. By his own admission on the EVE forums, Jihad has posted announcing the exploit he found and used against DUST CORE, and mentions he has hit multiple corps via this 'bug/exploit' between the games. CCP This is your own fault for bad coding, and this coming from someone who works in the game industry himself. You have proivided players with no way to defend themselves from espionage in this instance. If they could defend themselves and lost it, then fair enough.. that's the world of New Eden, but due to bad choices, you have given players the ability to ruin someone's hard work without being challenged. This should be put to rights to undo your mistake, to reinstate control of the corps to their owners. As mentioned.. i would support the espionage if it was fair and Dust CEO's had mechanics to defend themselves. Since there are no mechanics to do such, then you should put these to rights, and put in defenses against it. Any other course of action imho is down to negligence. So sorry.. despite CCP claiming they have helped, The theft was successful. Exactly what I mean lol
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 20:05:00 - [149] - Quote Jihad Destroyer 011011 wrote ALL of the following below on the EVE Forums #1Posted: 2013.11.10 16:27 \| Edited by: Jihad Destroyer 011011 DUST514 Corp Leaders are getting favoritism over EVE Corp Leaders. Recently several of us have been doing very bad things to corps from within. Corp Espionage has been and should always be considered normal to meta game play in New Eden. it is part of what makes what we do special. We started our plans over 7 months ago and started pulling the triggers on multiple corps in the last few days... In a true sandbox game if you don't do your homework you will get burned HARD. These corps were aligning against some equities we support and decided now was the time. Recently in several espionage operations GMs have been stepping in to stop or delay corps with DUST members from being taken over rightfully by our team of crack black box operators using normal and well documented espionage methods which I will not go into here. This is an unfair protection of corps with DUST members. I will not post the GMs comments but suffice to say they are hand holding the corps with DUST members and intervening on their behalf to save them unfairly. Failure of the Build Clearly all Corps and their leaders SHOULD definitely have access to their shares in EVE and DUST514. Majority DUST514 Corps should not have to have an EVE alt join them to become part of an alliance. Those however are not exploits they are failures of the game build at this time and much higher priority should be placed on getting the code written to allow corps to manage their corps on an equal basis with EVE corp leaders. Additionally EVE leaders should have the same parity to issue DUST specific roles which were recently introduced. Definitely not an Exploit At no point were any of the conspiring alts made CEO to cause the shares to be created in the first place, and in a true sandbox game if you do not do your homework and learn you will get burned. Let them burn. I was the second one in for every case, they all had EVE members besides me with experience and therefore we were operating clearly within the mechanics of the game. GMs jumping in the way they did shows favoritism for DUST514 members which paying EVE players NEVER get. Examples: While not related to me it is a good example: A corp believes there is a bug and towards the end it comes out the espionage agent was really good at covering his tracks and the CEO/Director is unable to understand what is happening to him. How is this the espionage operators fault? It isn't. The purpose of Espionage involves sewing deception and confusion into their ranks to further cause issues. (as a side note I spoke with the agent that did this, In their corp channel the corp members began threatening the espionage agents real life afterwards. Not the kind of people we want talking to kids who may be playing the game if you ask me. ) https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=119273&find=unread In this next case the CEO is reasonably expected to be upset, they just had their corp stolen, however they went and begged for help and were given an unfair protection from GMs because they "dont know the rules". If I did this in EVE I would have gotten a "Too bad man, HTFU." This espionage is clearly not an exploit as they had admitted to having a great deal of very experienced members in EVE in their corp the whole time, and the leaders were not very smart about their choices. (Also this was legendary in the rage posting from their whole alliance in their EVEmails to me for the last two days. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=119973 Opportunity for Course Correction So we ask for parity... Corps with DUST leadership should not get special treatment and protections and CCP should really consider putting a priority on ensuring equality and access to roles for EVE and DUST514 leaders managing a corp. Also please consider merging the DUST514 forums into the EVE forums so the DUST players can learn and not suffer in isolation any longer. Link to it: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3856933#post3856933
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 20:07:00 - [150] - Quote That ^ makes me near sick to read & practically slaps Vala, Dust 514, CCP & everyone here in the face

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 71	Posted - 2013.11.10 20:27:00 - [151] - Quote Here's some more if you all aren't displeased enough already #16Posted: 2013.11.10 18:50 \| Edited by: Jihad Destroyer 011011 TigerXtrm wrote: stoicfaux wrote: Interesting reads. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1473172#post1473172 CCPNullarbor wrote: The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. On one hand we have the "spirit of EVE". On the other we have DUST. Is it really a good idea to hotdrop the Dusties (aka a FPS console game) with full blown EVE mechanics (i.e. villainy) and excessive complexity? I can see arguments for both sides; integrating with EVE means working in a cold dark untrusting universe, however, it's a damn FPS console game with a different audience, different attention span, limited user interface, etc.. Does CCP want DUST to be as cold and harsh as EVE (i.e. have the same audience, potentially a small niche) or do they want to expand their audience with DUST? If it's the latter, then CCP will need to make DUST less vulnerable (or more buffered/firewalled) to the harshness of EVE. This pretty much. Different audience requires a different approach. The average F2P FPS player isn't going to expect, let alone be part of, the EVE meta game of espionage etc. If you start allowing that stuff it's a powder keg of bad publicity waiting to happen for Dust. The 'simple' FPS players who just want to shoot stuff for half an hour will start complaining about how Dust is an unfair game how they got scammed out of their corp. Perfectly legit as it may be, a casual FPS gamer will never ever understand it. So no, bad idea. Dust is NOT EVE. Dust is connected to EVE and nothing more. I clearly see CCP's reasoning in protecting Dust corps on this matter. Edit: Oh and... Quote: GMs jumping in the way they did shows favoritism for DUST514 members which paying EVE players NEVER get. When did all this 'all should be equal and fair' crap become a theme? It's starting to get annoying. if they want to just play then there are many other FPS out there. There is a reason EVE is not a larger player base- it is harsh and cold place. DUST514 getting different treatment is ripe for a different kind of exploit later where DUST514 members are able to meta game but are put in a protected status. The point of my post is GIVE leaders in both corps equal footing for shares and roles selections to manage their teams. DUST corp leaders have already robbed each other before and it was allowed. This is just a different flavor of the same thing.
AccursedZero New Eden Blades Of The Azure 2	Posted - 2013.11.10 20:48:00 - [152] - Quote Bump, Might as well while on my secondary character checking it. lol
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE 7	Posted - 2013.11.10 21:15:00 - [153] - Quote Zero Notion wrote: I'm so baffled by the DEV response to this - it borders on an asinine scolding with a smirking, "It's the New Eden Meta Game!" but it's not like Dust is a F2P game advertised on the PS3 network which is a console, not a PC, where a great deal of players are not going to be from Eve or even know very little of Eve or know why they should potentially know about Eve (because of something like this). This is seriously a critical oversight and what is even more shocking is the, "This is your fault because you want to have access to content that you should already have!" I don't really understand why alliances are not in the game; if it took Eve two years to develop and yet CCP has ALL that time to recognize how important alliances are and how much player-driver content opportunities alliances offer (which is so, so badly needed right now in Dust), why wasn't it one of the first mechanics available? Even in a FPS player crave some level of sociability, yeesh. I agree, there needs to be a better tutorial explaining to the PS3 gamer how they impact the universe of New Eden, and more about EVE side as well. EVE players likewise would benefit from understanding how DUST impacts them as well. To be honest most EVE players have no idea what their risks are in EVE either. For the most part it is a "leaders beware" mentality, so if they missed learning how to run a corp they get a big "tough" from CCP when they lose it. DUST Corps should be no different, and they have the same tools as long as they have an EVE capsuleer working with them.
RAider Vherikor DUST CORE 8	Posted - 2013.11.10 21:27:00 - [154] - Quote NanoCleric wrote: Just a quick update all... I logged on tonight to check if Vala had the corp back and she hasn't. I have no idea what CCP did to help, but it's not succeeded. When Vala logged on today at the end of the vote timer with the hope she could have her CEO powers unblocked due to the vote ending.. she found that Jihad had control of the corp, which resulted in him kicking the players who have been supporting her. Now Jihad has transferred CEO to RAider Vherikor and Vala has no control over the corp anymore. By his own admission on the EVE forums, Jihad has posted announcing the exploit he found and used against DUST CORE, and mentions he has hit multiple corps via this 'bug/exploit' between the games. CCP This is your own fault for bad coding, and this coming from someone who works in the game industry himself. You have proivided players with no way to defend themselves from espionage in this instance. If they could defend themselves and lost it, then fair enough.. that's the world of New Eden, but due to bad choices, you have given players the ability to ruin someone's hard work without being challenged. This should be put to rights to undo your mistake, to reinstate control of the corps to their owners. As mentioned.. i would support the espionage if it was fair and Dust CEO's had mechanics to defend themselves. Since there are no mechanics to do such, then you should put these to rights, and put in defenses against it. Any other course of action imho is down to negligence. So sorry.. despite CCP claiming they have helped, The theft was successful. I am one of the flag wavers for equal capability for leaders on both platforms. While I agree there are definitely some room for improvement here, some of what you write is incorrect and I suspect this is because of where the information you are getting is coming from. This was not a bug or exploit it is normal and well documented and encouraged part of meta game play. The same techniques were used to take down large alliances and corps time and time again. To say it was a special case here would also be wrong. This corp had many experienced EVE players (including the EVE alt the CEO had but chose not to use to hold the shares which were made before Jihad or I were on the scene). This corp also had several EVE directors in its time, and if anything was a functioning hybrid corp, which recruited in both EVE and DUST514. To ask for special treatment at this stage would have very grave consequences to the interpretation of the EULA and the future of DUST514-EVE integration.
Leither Yiltron KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 784	Posted - 2013.11.11 01:19:00 - [155] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Not alot of EVE players even know of this & no Dust 514 players know of it (till now) as we weren't told & if you haven't heard of shares how can you look into it? I'm certainly not defending CCP's horrid lack of corporation and alliance management UI in Dust, but this kind of statement is simply incorrect. Most of the large Dust alliances are acutely aware of all the mechanics that underlie corporations, including the Eve mechanics. Your best resource is ALWAYS EVELOPEDIA; for instance: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Corporation_management_guide Yes, the UI needs to be integrated into Dust. But frankly you should always, always, ALWAYS read up on any mechanics you plan to interact with. Because CCP are slow to the ball, the underlying Eve mechanics are usually more complex. Check Evelopedia, and don't trust anyone you haven't known for a good long span of time or who is otherwise trustworthy with being CEO of your corporation. If your corp is big enough to need to be in an alliance and you don't have a truly trustworthy player to put in the application, you should be responsible enough to suck it up and pay the $15 necessary to sub an Eve account for a month and do it yourself. CCP are really money-grubbers in this situation, though. They really just want to force anyone who wants true control of their corporation to pay an Eve sub, which has always been a joke. All of their rhetoric about "simplifying" corps for Dust players is a product of this implicit aim. If they really wanted to simplify the interface in Dust they could put in a "use simplified corp UI" toggle in the menus. PC Coordinator for RISE of LEGION Have a pony
Vala Prime DUST CORE 27	Posted - 2013.11.11 13:09:00 - [156] - Quote here's why this is unfair and an exploit you can go on blah blah blahing trying to defend why you (jihad) and raider are not class a ho bags going on about how we had other eve pilots who is and yada yada yada when nano cleric who has years of eve experience didn't know what happened because as CCP null arbor stated the dust CEO has control over the shares in their corp till an eve pilot is CEO even for a brief period those shares become public and there is no way that any one would know this this doesn't eve happen in eve once someone has control of share they have those share in eve there is no poor programing that is so obscure that just takes already allocated shares away so that the next ho bag can take them and that's why ccp has been intervening
Vala Prime DUST CORE 27	Posted - 2013.11.11 13:11:00 - [157] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: here's why this is unfair and an exploit you can go on blah blah blahing trying to defend why you (jihad) and raider are not class a ho bags going on about how we had other eve pilots who is and yada yada yada when nano cleric who has years of eve experience didn't know what happened because as CCP null arbor stated the dust CEO has control over the shares in their corp till an eve pilot is CEO even for a brief period those shares become public and there is no way that any one would know this this doesn't happen in eve once someone has control of share they have those share in eve there is no poor programing that is so obscure that just takes already allocated shares away so that the next ho bag can take them and that's why ccp has been intervening
Aeladon Leiko KNIGHTZ OF THE ROUND 3	Posted - 2013.11.11 13:28:00 - [158] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. i hate to say this without testing it now but unless a change has been made in the last 3 months with regards to the way shares function you are 100% wrong. and i know it for a fact. all you need to take shares is be made a director. the director can then assign shares out of the wallet to him self. their is NOTHING dust side that can be done about this. its always worked like this. you need to check this out Null.
Vala Prime DUST CORE 27	Posted - 2013.11.11 13:40:00 - [159] - Quote Aeladon Leiko wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. i hate to say this without testing it now but unless a change has been made in the last 3 months with regards to the way shares function you are 100% wrong. and i know it for a fact. all you need to take shares is be made a director. the director can then assign shares out of the wallet to him self. their is NOTHING dust side that can be done about this. its always worked like this. you need to check this out Null. and you are also right when an eve corp is made the share are public and can be taken by anyone that is ceo director or an accountant but once those share are allocated they can not be taken away unlees that share holder gives away his shares or all other share holders vote majority to remove those share. how ever in a dust made corp accoring to ccp nullarbor all shares are pre allocated to the ceo so that even a eve director can not touch them (its in his post) unless a eve pilot is made ceo such as to enter an alliance at such time the share are stripe from the dust player and made public for any eve pilot to get with out dust players able to do anything they can not even allocate the shares to someone else prior to switching with a eve pilot to prevent this from happening as well
Coyle Secundus Death by Disassociation Zero-Day 3	Posted - 2013.11.11 14:31:00 - [160] - Quote Vala Prime wrote: Aeladon Leiko wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. i hate to say this without testing it now but unless a change has been made in the last 3 months with regards to the way shares function you are 100% wrong. and i know it for a fact. all you need to take shares is be made a director. the director can then assign shares out of the wallet to him self. their is NOTHING dust side that can be done about this. its always worked like this. you need to check this out Null. and you are also right when an eve corp is made the share are public and can be taken by anyone that is ceo director or an accountant but once those share are allocated they can not be taken away unlees that share holder gives away his shares or all other share holders vote majority to remove those share. how ever in a dust made corp accoring to ccp nullarbor all shares are pre allocated to the ceo so that even a eve director can not touch them (its in his post) unless a eve pilot is made ceo such as to enter an alliance at such time the share are stripe from the dust player and made public for any eve pilot to get with out dust players able to do anything they can not even allocate the shares to someone else prior to switching with a eve pilot to prevent this from happening as well so in other words is in order to safely join an alliance in dust you have to get a computer pay ccp that monthly fee and make your own pilot the ceo

RAider Vherikor DUST CORE 20	Posted - 2013.11.11 15:22:00 - [161] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: How can a strictly DUST player understand corporation mechanics that are not present in the DUST client? I am a fan of reading. That always helps. In a galaxy where everyone is trying to kill everyone, just passively hanging out is probably not a good idea. To make it easier, several threads have mentioned merging the EVE and DUST514 forums to better the experience: 1. Creates stronger cross talk and social groups between both platforms 2. Collaborative idea sharing which prevents some of the good idea fairy crap we have seen from both forums when players who only play one game and do not understand the mechanics of the other chime in with a terrible idea. 3. Better access to the full range of information out there for all of New Eden - access to educational information is priceless
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 884	Posted - 2013.11.11 15:35:00 - [162] - Quote GM going full stupid by interfering in the use of known game mechanics? Now that is going to get escalated to Internal Affairs quite fast...
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 74	Posted - 2013.11.11 19:38:00 - [163] - Quote Leither Yiltron wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: Not alot of EVE players even know of this & no Dust 514 players know of it (till now) as we weren't told & if you haven't heard of shares how can you look into it? I'm certainly not defending CCP's horrid lack of corporation and alliance management UI in Dust, but this kind of statement is simply incorrect. Most of the large Dust alliances are acutely aware of all the mechanics that underlie corporations, including the Eve mechanics. Your best resource is ALWAYS EVELOPEDIA; for instance: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Corporation_management_guide Yes, the UI needs to be integrated into Dust. But frankly you should always, always, ALWAYS read up on any mechanics you plan to interact with. Because CCP are slow to the ball, the underlying Eve mechanics are usually more complex. Check Evelopedia, and don't trust anyone you haven't known for a good long span of time or who is otherwise trustworthy with being CEO of your corporation. If your corp is big enough to need to be in an alliance and you don't have a truly trustworthy player to put in the application, you should be responsible enough to suck it up and pay the $15 necessary to sub an Eve account for a month and do it yourself. CCP are really money-grubbers in this situation, though. They really just want to force anyone who wants true control of their corporation to pay an Eve sub, which has always been a joke. All of their rhetoric about "simplifying" corps for Dust players is a product of this implicit aim. If they really wanted to simplify the interface in Dust they could put in a "use simplified corp UI" toggle in the menus. It is wise to always look into everything but what I meant was share's is so little known alot of EVE players that have the system don't know of it & Dust doesn't have access to it unless through EVE. My point was due to it not being well known, not in Dust & no warning or explaination how do you know of share's to look into them. Their is no in-game explaination that even tells you to look into things on EVEopedia, most games aren't this deep that require members to go on the Forums/internet to look deep into all this & as such many new comer or starter corporations have no real idea the extent of what they are getting into, my point is their needs o be better explaination other then "don't trust anyone & this is a very vast deep world" that is way too vague & far too basic. The "Help" part in Dust is also horrible at explaining the deep intricate parts of Dust as well as EVE (example look at the in-game explaination of planetery conquest) it's very bad. Your basically telling us to look into it but we don't know what we're looking for, like saying look in a hay stack for something but not telling the something is a little tiny needle.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 74	Posted - 2013.11.11 19:53:00 - [164] - Quote Coyle Secundus wrote: Vala Prime wrote: Aeladon Leiko wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. i hate to say this without testing it now but unless a change has been made in the last 3 months with regards to the way shares function you are 100% wrong. and i know it for a fact. all you need to take shares is be made a director. the director can then assign shares out of the wallet to him self. their is NOTHING dust side that can be done about this. its always worked like this. you need to check this out Null. and you are also right when an eve corp is made the share are public and can be taken by anyone that is ceo director or an accountant but once those share are allocated they can not be taken away unlees that share holder gives away his shares or all other share holders vote majority to remove those share. how ever in a dust made corp accoring to ccp nullarbor all shares are pre allocated to the ceo so that even a eve director can not touch them (its in his post) unless a eve pilot is made ceo such as to enter an alliance at such time the share are stripe from the dust player and made public for any eve pilot to get with out dust players able to do anything they can not even allocate the shares to someone else prior to switching with a eve pilot to prevent this from happening as well so in other words is in order to safely join an alliance in dust you have to get a computer pay ccp that monthly fee and make your own pilot the ceo Which leads to why I call this a bug & exploit. If your in EVE/in a EVE corporation & you haven't heard of this, then it happens to you. You get a notice like Vala got a notice telling her & if your in EVE you have the ability to fight it so it's FAIR if you loose but you don't hear of this type of thing in EVE anyway because no 1 EVE player can use it against another EVE corporation easily & successfully. Now this is where it becomes a bug/exploit if your a Dust corporation you don't have any tools for share's or warning or explaination of them. So you go to enter a alliance which is a necceisty in Dust 514 for almost every succesful corporation, but you need a EVE player to do it which this is where EVE guy's like Jihad know you NEED them & they are counting on you to count on them (which is by itself, makes no sense you have to do all this to enter a alliance anyway.) So you make them CEO & they do this, then you have no way to fight it on the Dust side at all so they can overthrow a corporation of over 1000 Dust players with the mighty vote of 1? If that's not a exploit idk what is apparently.... The arguement it isn't a exploit is flawed.
JoshuaEvil666 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 69	Posted - 2013.11.12 05:05:00 - [165] - Quote people burn when I will it
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 884	Posted - 2013.11.12 05:18:00 - [166] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Coyle Secundus wrote: Vala Prime wrote: Aeladon Leiko wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. i hate to say this without testing it now but unless a change has been made in the last 3 months with regards to the way shares function you are 100% wrong. and i know it for a fact. all you need to take shares is be made a director. the director can then assign shares out of the wallet to him self. their is NOTHING dust side that can be done about this. its always worked like this. you need to check this out Null. and you are also right when an eve corp is made the share are public and can be taken by anyone that is ceo director or an accountant but once those share are allocated they can not be taken away unlees that share holder gives away his shares or all other share holders vote majority to remove those share. how ever in a dust made corp accoring to ccp nullarbor all shares are pre allocated to the ceo so that even a eve director can not touch them (its in his post) unless a eve pilot is made ceo such as to enter an alliance at such time the share are stripe from the dust player and made public for any eve pilot to get with out dust players able to do anything they can not even allocate the shares to someone else prior to switching with a eve pilot to prevent this from happening as well so in other words is in order to safely join an alliance in dust you have to get a computer pay ccp that monthly fee and make your own pilot the ceo péï Which leads to why I call this a bug & exploit. If your in EVE/in a EVE corporation & you haven't heard of this, then it happens to you. You get a notice like Vala got a notice telling her & if your in EVE you have the ability to fight it so it's FAIR if you loose but you don't hear of this type of thing in EVE anyway because no 1 EVE player can use it against another EVE corporation easily & successfully. Now this is where it becomes a bug/exploit if your a Dust corporation you don't have any tools for share's or warning or explaination of them. So you go to enter a alliance which is a necceisty in Dust 514 for almost every succesful corporation, but you need a EVE player to do it which this is where EVE guy's like Jihad know you NEED them & they are counting on you to count on them (which is by itself, makes no sense you have to do all this to enter a alliance anyway.) So you make them CEO & they do this, then you have no way to fight it on the Dust side at all so they can overthrow a corporation of over 1000 Dust players with the mighty vote of 1? If that's not a exploit idk what is apparently.... The arguement it isn't a exploit is flawed. Every single corp guide out there, even the eve wiki one, warns about this clear. The warnings are even highlighted in easy to spot sections just to make sure no one missesit. Fighting after the knife is already in your back makes no sense.
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 326	Posted - 2013.11.12 05:35:00 - [167] - Quote Can....not....face.....palm....hard.....enough. Your corp was stolen. You can either pick up your sticks and start a new one with the learning experience you just got....OR you can keep wallowing over it. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
NanoCleric The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 95	Posted - 2013.11.12 15:39:00 - [168] - Quote Stop being so naieve guys... (these eve pilots and people who know about new eden). Not everyone is in the same circumstances as you and I, where we can access a PC whenever we feel like it as we own one, nor does everyone have the time to look into things game related. To many people a game is a game and that's where it ends. I know that Vala has not had easy access to a PC, and is certainly not computer literate. She's had to ask for a lot of help just to come to this forum alone. Also there are plenty of console gamers out there who have no access to a PC, plenty of adults who have already gone through their schooling and uni.. or didn't have the oppertunity to, and are stuck in situations where money is a real problem.. so natrually won't head out to the nearest net cafe to read up on how alliances work or leading a corp works. There's many players out there who will have just browsed the PSN Store, seen a free shooter... downloaded it, then simply just enjoyed playing it and making friends, before then seeing you can make a corp in the UI and tried it without knowing 'anything' about it. Then naturally through chatter you hear about alliances forming so they think they aught to join one.. so ask for help as to how.. Naturally they don't have an eve account or know anything about eve so when an eve pilot offers to help then they have no idea what the consequences are.. or even have a clue that they aught to read up on the consequences... Afterall... to them, it's just a game. They have no idea how deep the world of New Eden actually is. Also, you guys keep banging on about experienced eve pilots, who are you point at exactly? I for one used an alt to help them join the alliance and have no experience with corp leading or what's involved, i've only ever been a mission runner really. I just used the procedure i previously outlined to join them in the alliance and was not told about any other consequences. Plus it was only a 5 minute thing then i left corp so i could be available 24hours later to help another corp join. I'm unaware of Vala making any other eve pilots director, i'm also unaware of their being any experienced eve pilots in her corp. As for you saying she had an alt eve pilot.. lol.. it was a trial account she made when she had chance to go on a pc.. and barely touched it and knew nothing about the world she was in. Everything she knows about the game she's had to ask other people about, so where are these experienced eve pilots who 'should have know better'? You have to realize guys that in the same way you are so naieve to realize that not everyone is as knowledgeable or have access to pc's.. others are very ignorant about the what it was they actually downloaded and the potential risks beyond just clicking a UI button for something with the mentality 'oo, i wonder what this does'. So i'm sorry guys, you did something clever and managed to steal corps, so your obviously not stupid people... but don't use naieve statements to back up your arguments. CCP dropped the ball on this one, you guys exposed it, and yes it is an exploit as it is 'exploiting a loophole in that build'. Simply due to CCP not taking into account that this could happen. That is what an exploit it.. to make use of a situation which can be considered to be unfair.
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 891	Posted - 2013.11.12 16:04:00 - [169] - Quote Joining alliances should never be allowed with CCP-supported training wheels on just because you don't do Reading and Thinking.
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 125	Posted - 2013.11.12 16:23:00 - [170] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Joining alliances should never be allowed with CCP-supported training wheels on just because you don't do Reading and Thinking. If it's not equal on both sides it's broken. IMO you EVE supporters and the Dust 514 sucks to be you concept is #$#*$. If we can do nothing with shares on this side then you should be able to do NOTHING with the shares of a corp CREATED on the dust side. Plain and simple. Edit: CCP should just allocate the shares of a corp created on the dust side to the dust character that created the corp. Then everything is good until they allow dust characters to manage the shares. At which point you EVE players can try to steal them.

Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 891	Posted - 2013.11.12 16:58:00 - [171] - Quote This character can't fly spaceships, why not?
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 76	Posted - 2013.11.12 22:44:00 - [172] - Quote NanoCleric wrote: Stop being so naieve guys... (these eve pilots and people who know about new eden). Not everyone is in the same circumstances as you and I, where we can access a PC whenever we feel like it as we own one, nor does everyone have the time to look into things game related. To many people a game is a game and that's where it ends. I know that Vala has not had easy access to a PC, and is certainly not computer literate. She's had to ask for a lot of help just to come to this forum alone. Also there are plenty of console gamers out there who have no access to a PC, plenty of adults who have already gone through their schooling and uni.. or didn't have the oppertunity to, and are stuck in situations where money is a real problem.. so natrually won't head out to the nearest net cafe to read up on how alliances work or leading a corp works. There's many players out there who will have just browsed the PSN Store, seen a free shooter... downloaded it, then simply just enjoyed playing it and making friends, before then seeing you can make a corp in the UI and tried it without knowing 'anything' about it. Then naturally through chatter you hear about alliances forming so they think they aught to join one.. so ask for help as to how.. Naturally they don't have an eve account or know anything about eve so when an eve pilot offers to help then they have no idea what the consequences are.. or even have a clue that they aught to read up on the consequences... Afterall... to them, it's just a game. They have no idea how deep the world of New Eden actually is. Also, you guys keep banging on about experienced eve pilots, who are you point at exactly? I for one used an alt to help them join the alliance and have no experience with corp leading or what's involved, i've only ever been a mission runner really. I just used the procedure i previously outlined to join them in the alliance and was not told about any other consequences. Plus it was only a 5 minute thing then i left corp so i could be available 24hours later to help another corp join. I'm unaware of Vala making any other eve pilots director, i'm also unaware of their being any experienced eve pilots in her corp. As for you saying she had an alt eve pilot.. lol.. it was a trial account she made when she had chance to go on a pc.. and barely touched it and knew nothing about the world she was in. Everything she knows about the game she's had to ask other people about, so where are these experienced eve pilots who 'should have know better'? You have to realize guys that in the same way you are so naieve to realize that not everyone is as knowledgeable or have access to pc's.. others are very ignorant about the what it was they actually downloaded and the potential risks beyond just clicking a UI button for something with the mentality 'oo, i wonder what this does'. So i'm sorry guys, you did something clever and managed to steal corps, so your obviously not stupid people... but don't use naieve statements to back up your arguments. CCP dropped the ball on this one, you guys exposed it, and yes it is an exploit as it is 'exploiting a loophole in that build'. Simply due to CCP not taking into account that this could happen. That is what an exploit it.. to make use of a situation which can be considered to be unfair. All very valid points, some of which myself & others have been making on this topic
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 76	Posted - 2013.11.12 22:46:00 - [173] - Quote @ Rasatsu - Link it
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 76	Posted - 2013.11.12 22:55:00 - [174] - Quote Speaking of which, did this happen to the original AE because their are 2 now & the original AE has a EVE player as CEO
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 77	Posted - 2013.11.13 19:41:00 - [175] - Quote Bump
RAider Vherikor Holy Dust Divers 35	Posted - 2013.11.14 04:03:00 - [176] - Quote snakevenom369 wrote: hence why i stated above implementing a method in which a dust created corp original CEO could hold 50% of the shares would be held by that person no matter what the case this would seem like a simple yet useful method in which to protect a dust corporation from something like this happening again within the game itself That stalemate only works if someone is there to actually counter the vote with their shares... all I have to do is wait for someone to go on vacation with my 5%... and I win your corp long enough to destroy it. giggity giggity.
RAider Vherikor Holy Dust Divers 35	Posted - 2013.11.14 04:06:00 - [177] - Quote Ares 514 wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Joining alliances should never be allowed with CCP-supported training wheels on just because you don't do Reading and Thinking. If it's not equal on both sides it's broken. IMO you EVE supporters and the Dust 514 sucks to be you concept is #$#*$. If we can do nothing with shares on this side then you should be able to do NOTHING with the shares of a corp CREATED on the dust side. Plain and simple. Edit: CCP should just allocate the shares of a corp created on the dust side to the dust character that created the corp. Then everything is good until they allow dust characters to manage the shares. At which point you EVE players can try to steal them. Who says it has to be just EVE players... a clone is a clone. It shouldnt matter what side. Bring parity to the game so I can steal shares from ALL the corps.
RAider Vherikor Holy Dust Divers 35	Posted - 2013.11.14 04:06:00 - [178] - Quote NanoCleric wrote: Stop being so naieve guys... (these eve pilots and people who know about new eden). Not everyone is in the same circumstances as you and I, where we can access a PC whenever we feel like it as we own one, nor does everyone have the time to look into things game related. To many people a game is a game and that's where it ends. I know that Vala has not had easy access to a PC, and is certainly not computer literate. She's had to ask for a lot of help just to come to this forum alone. Also there are plenty of console gamers out there who have no access to a PC, plenty of adults who have already gone through their schooling and uni.. or didn't have the oppertunity to, and are stuck in situations where money is a real problem.. so natrually won't head out to the nearest net cafe to read up on how alliances work or leading a corp works. There's many players out there who will have just browsed the PSN Store, seen a free shooter... downloaded it, then simply just enjoyed playing it and making friends, before then seeing you can make a corp in the UI and tried it without knowing 'anything' about it. Then naturally through chatter you hear about alliances forming so they think they aught to join one.. so ask for help as to how.. Naturally they don't have an eve account or know anything about eve so when an eve pilot offers to help then they have no idea what the consequences are.. or even have a clue that they aught to read up on the consequences... Afterall... to them, it's just a game. They have no idea how deep the world of New Eden actually is. Also, you guys keep banging on about experienced eve pilots, who are you point at exactly? I for one used an alt to help them join the alliance and have no experience with corp leading or what's involved, i've only ever been a mission runner really. I just used the procedure i previously outlined to join them in the alliance and was not told about any other consequences. Plus it was only a 5 minute thing then i left corp so i could be available 24hours later to help another corp join. I'm unaware of Vala making any other eve pilots director, i'm also unaware of their being any experienced eve pilots in her corp. As for you saying she had an alt eve pilot.. lol.. it was a trial account she made when she had chance to go on a pc.. and barely touched it and knew nothing about the world she was in. Everything she knows about the game she's had to ask other people about, so where are these experienced eve pilots who 'should have know better'? You have to realize guys that in the same way you are so naieve to realize that not everyone is as knowledgeable or have access to pc's.. others are very ignorant about the what it was they actually downloaded and the potential risks beyond just clicking a UI button for something with the mentality 'oo, i wonder what this does'. So i'm sorry guys, you did something clever and managed to steal corps, so your obviously not stupid people... but don't use naieve statements to back up your arguments. CCP dropped the ball on this one, you guys exposed it, and yes it is an exploit as it is 'exploiting a loophole in that build'. Simply due to CCP not taking into account that this could happen. That is what an exploit it.. to make use of a situation which can be considered to be unfair. CCP says it is not an exploit now. Cheers.
DaNizzle4shizle The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 54	Posted - 2013.11.14 04:11:00 - [179] - Quote i have always seen a problem because dust ceo's have no way to join an alliance without eve. i find it in not fair in this case. this is exactly what happened to kill orders and THE GOD'Z THEMSELVES i find it stupid. 2nd Commander of The dyst0pian Corporation. isk glitch> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-HUgzYPm9g
RAider Vherikor Holy Dust Divers 37	Posted - 2013.11.14 04:51:00 - [180] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Which leads to why I call this a bug & exploit. If your in EVE/in a EVE corporation & you haven't heard of this, then it happens to you. You get a notice like Vala got a notice telling her & if your in EVE you have the ability to fight it so it's FAIR if you loose but you don't hear of this type of thing in EVE anyway because no 1 EVE player can use it against another EVE corporation easily & successfully. You must not understand how this works because most of what you are writing is not actually factual at all. Stop posting silliness like this or you will just attract more bad guys like me to your corp because it shows you are ready for the same thing. Let me give you some clarity because you really need it. Once a bad guy has the shares... there is nothing ANYONE can do about when they place a vote. Only the shareholders can place the vote. EVE players can't fight back or do anything about it either. Its not fair because espionage/hostile take overs are not ever fair. Whomever has the shares controls the corp. What little rock are you hiding in? This kind of thing happens all the time in EVE... Even from the big corps which should know better. I would suggest you do a google search and expand your mind if your rock has internet access. Vinsarrow wrote: Now this is where it becomes a bug/exploit if your a Dust corporation you don't have any tools for share's or warning or explaination of them. So you go to enter a alliance which is a necceisty in Dust 514 for almost every succesful corporation, but you need a EVE player to do it which this is where EVE guy's like Jihad know you NEED them & they are counting on you to count on them (which is by itself, makes no sense you have to do all this to enter a alliance anyway.) So you make them CEO & they do this, then you have no way to fight it on the Dust side at all so they can overthrow a corporation of over 1000 Dust players with the mighty vote of 1? If that's not a exploit idk what is apparently.... The arguement it isn't a exploit is flawed. I will add in the case of DUST CORE they had made another alt CEO long before Jihad got there, Jihad just had the shares dropped in his lap when he joined up later. (He says "thanks" for that to the angel who did that for him). The CEO at the time also had an EVE character as well and even then they didnt know better. If a corp chooses a leader who is naive, ignorant or just plain dumb that is too bad. Most sharp people out there would recommend against joining corps which are run by them and are unable to have the strategic vision to understand the New Eden pitfalls.

RAider Vherikor Holy Dust Divers 39	Posted - 2013.11.14 05:10:00 - [181] - Quote DaNizzle4shizle wrote: i have always seen a problem because dust ceo's have no way to join an alliance without eve. i find it in not fair in this case. this is exactly what happened to kill orders and THE GOD'Z THEMSELVES i find it stupid. Actually Your corp was destroyed because you were foolish... thanks again for the ISK. (twice). My Bank of Luminaire retirement slush fund account just hit Technicium level thanks to all the corps out there which were horribly mauled, destroyed, robbed or ransomed. (They gave me a great drone toaster and boosted my interest rate for opening the account I might add) Speaking of foolish, you do realize your new corp...dyst0pian is the very same one which put DUST CORE in this predicament in the first place? Their alliance is just as bad as evidenced by the alliance executors over confidence in who to trust. :) Based on what I know is coming... I would advise every corp to split from there and every member of your corp who can to leave while they still have ISK to do so. Why they hell they would make you their 2nd Commander is beyond me. I have seen jellyfish with more leadership brain power. I love the EVEmails threatening to come after me and my buddies in Caldari Faction Warfare. Harden up and join the Gallente side and come get me... I dare you to kill me repeatedly if you can even get to a match with me.
dustwaffle Xer Cloud Consortium 671	Posted - 2013.11.14 13:00:00 - [182] - Quote Bumping this to bring more spotlight to the OP's (and his/her supporters') foolishness. Blame the players and CCP for your own inability to READ and THINK. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 80	Posted - 2013.11.14 20:47:00 - [183] - Quote RAider Vherikor wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: Which leads to why I call this a bug & exploit. If your in EVE/in a EVE corporation & you haven't heard of this, then it happens to you. You get a notice like Vala got a notice telling her & if your in EVE you have the ability to fight it so it's FAIR if you loose but you don't hear of this type of thing in EVE anyway because no 1 EVE player can use it against another EVE corporation easily & successfully. You must not understand how this works because most of what you are writing is not actually factual at all. Stop posting silliness like this or you will just attract more bad guys like me to your corp because it shows you are ready for the same thing. Let me give you some clarity because you really need it. Once a bad guy has the shares... there is nothing ANYONE can do about when they place a vote. Only the shareholders can place the vote. EVE players can't fight back or do anything about it either. Its not fair because espionage/hostile take overs are not ever fair. Whomever has the shares controls the corp. What little rock are you hiding in? This kind of thing happens all the time in EVE... Even from the big corps which should know better. I would suggest you do a google search and expand your mind if your rock has internet access. Vinsarrow wrote: Now this is where it becomes a bug/exploit if your a Dust corporation you don't have any tools for share's or warning or explaination of them. So you go to enter a alliance which is a necceisty in Dust 514 for almost every succesful corporation, but you need a EVE player to do it which this is where EVE guy's like Jihad know you NEED them & they are counting on you to count on them (which is by itself, makes no sense you have to do all this to enter a alliance anyway.) So you make them CEO & they do this, then you have no way to fight it on the Dust side at all so they can overthrow a corporation of over 1000 Dust players with the mighty vote of 1? If that's not a exploit idk what is apparently.... The arguement it isn't a exploit is flawed. I will add in the case of DUST CORE they had made another alt CEO long before Jihad got there, Jihad just had the shares dropped in his lap when he joined up later. (He says "thanks" for that to the angel who did that for him). The CEO at the time also had an EVE character as well and even then they didnt know better. If a corp chooses a leader who is naive, ignorant or just plain dumb that is too bad. Most sharp people out there would recommend against joining corps which are run by them and are unable to have the strategic vision to understand the New Eden pitfalls. Please dolink where CCP says it isn't a exploit in a official anoucement. Also it is fair on the EVE side you forget about the share holders as well as the precautions a EVE player can do with the share's & corporation ISK, who have actual tools to prevent & fight it on a level. Furthermore you obviously failed to read the part that Vala made a trial EVE character when she had actual access to a PC, plus it was only temporary. She went through ALOT just to get up a simple forums post, also about Jihad you know very little about that situation, which will remain so. You also forget EVERY corporation gets automatic share's. Also your in a corporation yourself so don't get hypocritical.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 80	Posted - 2013.11.14 21:11:00 - [184] - Quote Now RAider, about your little.... "threat" to me I will now quote you "I love the EVEmails threatening to come after me and my buddies in Caldari Faction Warfare. Harden up and join the Gallente side and come get me... I dare you to kill me repeatedly if you can even get to a match with me." If you can EVEN find me please do try me & those in my squad & if I care enough I'd happily pay those in my squad if we crossed for every 5 times they kills you they get 1 million ISK & a additonal 450k if you were in proto gear.That's if I cared enough & if we actually crossed or if I even recall you by then. But anyway public & Factional's are far too big for us to easily cross & since we don't have a District you can't attack usdirectly just to summon me. Let me clarify to everyone about you though from what my sources have told me in less then 24 hours on you. You are apparently a troll & hard reject. You have 6 RAider alts if they aren't you then you've made quite a few "friends" in New Eden. Your first player-made coporation you were in was THE GOD'Z THEMSELVES after them you joined DUST CORE very odd this so far but let me go on, after DUST CORE you joined Death by Disassociation whom dy5t0pia (creater of the Zero-Day alliance you just bashed) was a former member of, after which you rejoined DUST CORE & now your in Holy Dust Divers. Am I sensing a link here? I think I am indeed.... but let me move on to Holy Dust Divers which currently has 24 members & is relatively new, who's 5 oldest members are tomtom, Git'rite, nate, Daj & MAUI not counting yourself RAider. Former members are Charlotte, Malice, Sebastian, & Thatguy I believe from according to my resources. I'm sure they'd tell me a little about HDD & You for a little.... financial aid making destroying you all MUCH easier if ever need be or perhaps just you RAider i'm sure someone can tell me your play style rather easily among other things. Oh & infiltrating us is your plan? Good Luck with that nothing to find or use in our corporation really also only very special people can touch our corporation ISK..... So I guess your threat is empty while my defense is not i'm sure also all the "friends" you made in New Eden would LOVE to "help" with you quite possibly free of charge too. But in all honesty I don't care for you just don't bring your New Eden personal problems & vendetta's my way. Thank You & Good Day. RAider....
DaNizzle4shizle The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 55	Posted - 2013.11.14 21:15:00 - [185] - Quote i stand by your side in this fight with raider bro. i shall be your friend vinsorrow 2nd Commander of The dyst0pian Corporation. knowledge is power. power is strength.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 80	Posted - 2013.11.14 21:22:00 - [186] - Quote Their you go RAider ^ theirs 1 of your "friends" now RAider see all the support rallying for you already. That's a alliance & full corporation just like that, need I go on? I would hope not for your.... "well being" RAider
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 80	Posted - 2013.11.14 21:31:00 - [187] - Quote But back on subject, CCP does need to fix this
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure 80	Posted - 2013.11.16 18:01:00 - [188] - Quote Bump
Thumb Green Novashift 508	Posted - 2013.11.16 18:24:00 - [189] - Quote Time & time again CCP demonstrates how asinine they can be and this thread is full of it. Never mind the president, let's overgrow the government.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 92	Posted - 2013.11.22 20:01:00 - [190] - Quote ^ True

Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2246	Posted - 2013.11.22 20:15:00 - [191] - Quote Reading through this thread I really think that until shares are implemented in Dust the shares of a Dust founded corp should be permanently assigned to the Dust CEO and Founder. At a later date if/when shares are implemented the Dust founder can then assign the shares as he pleases. The standard MO in Eve is to create a corporation and then assign all the shares to the CEO and Founder. When a Dust corp is created in Dust this automatically done. I think the problem lies in the fact that when an Eve CEO is appointed it is undone involuntarily. If there is no desire to create a shares system in Dust then have the Dust founder be assigned the shares until such time that a system is in place for the Dust character to change their location. The Dust character can then decide themselves what to do with the shares. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 140	Posted - 2013.11.22 20:23:00 - [192] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Reading through this thread I really think that until shares are implemented in Dust the shares of a Dust founded corp should be permanently assigned to the Dust CEO and Founder. At a later date if/when shares are implemented the Dust founder can then assign the shares as he pleases. The standard MO in Eve is to create a corporation and then assign all the shares to the CEO and Founder. When a Dust corp is created in Dust this automatically done. I think the problem lies in the fact that when an Eve CEO is appointed it is undone involuntarily. If there is no desire to create a shares system in Dust then have the Dust founder be assigned the shares until such time that a system is in place for the Dust character to change their location. The Dust character can then decide themselves what to do with the shares. Exactly what I have said.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 97	Posted - 2013.11.24 22:23:00 - [193] - Quote Ares 514 wrote: Kain Spero wrote: Reading through this thread I really think that until shares are implemented in Dust the shares of a Dust founded corp should be permanently assigned to the Dust CEO and Founder. At a later date if/when shares are implemented the Dust founder can then assign the shares as he pleases. The standard MO in Eve is to create a corporation and then assign all the shares to the CEO and Founder. When a Dust corp is created in Dust this automatically done. I think the problem lies in the fact that when an Eve CEO is appointed it is undone involuntarily. If there is no desire to create a shares system in Dust then have the Dust founder be assigned the shares until such time that a system is in place for the Dust character to change their location. The Dust character can then decide themselves what to do with the shares. Exactly what I have said. That is relatively agreeable
Cancer Magnus New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 0	Posted - 2013.11.25 09:25:00 - [194] - Quote What ever been said and whatever you make of it... the practice of 'corporate espionage', RAider Vherikor... is just a pretty name for a dirty game. Stealing a bike just because it is not locked still is stealing a bike, however you want to call it, or however you struggle to justify your actions. The fact that it could be done by a glitch, makes your actions even more repulsing, even if you deny the fact that you used the glitch repeatedly for personal gain. It's subjects like you who disrupt the system, not only in New Eden, but also irl.
Thurak1 Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 389	Posted - 2013.11.25 10:01:00 - [195] - Quote Vin Mora wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Vala Prime wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. ok so we are screwed thanks for clearing that up that all dust players are usless against anything eve side because we have no tools or notification of the lack of tools to do anything about everything that eve can do to dust players .... yay You can try petitioning it, but as I said, this can only occur if the corp came from EVE or you assigned it to EVE at some point. In which case we expect that you understand the corporation mechanics (as much as anyone could understand the EVE corporation mechanics anyway, I agree it is pretty confusing). Dust CEOs have to give up their rank to an Eve player to create alliances, see how this could be a problem? Yep i can see where this is a problem. You give ceo over to an eve player temporarily to make an alliance then they give ceo back, they would have abilit to take a share (if i understand correctly) and over on the dust side we would have no clue and no tools to see such a thing and then some time later on said player forces said vote and whala they hijack the corp. Being the corp is made up lets even say 100% dust players from 2 dust only corps that used this one guy from eve to form and alliance they have no idea whats going on and have no tools to stop it so this player is now able to hijack the corp uncontested. I think some more thought really should have been put into the corp mechanics here CCP.
Alabastor 'TheBlaster' Alcar Silver Bullet Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 279	Posted - 2013.11.25 10:38:00 - [196] - Quote cant get my shares
Alabastor 'TheBlaster' Alcar Silver Bullet Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 279	Posted - 2013.11.25 22:38:00 - [197] - Quote lol nice hijack attempt for an idot
GENERAL FCF Sentinels of New Eden 18	Posted - 2013.11.25 23:03:00 - [198] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. Then if this is going to be "increasingly a problem", why not incorporate it into Dust 514?! Who cares if it's "complicated"? If you have to HAVE a basic understanding of the political EVE roles ANYWAYS, why only give such power to PC players? Your going to put a "warning" so that's fine but your really shooting yourselves in the foot by saying: "we want to make the link between EVE and Dust514 in 2014 greater"! If anything it discourages Dust514 players to have anything to do with EVE players because of any underlying secrets the EVE players know but not the Dust player's! It creates a lop-sided economy where it handicaps the natural flow of the game. Either remove such EVE powers temporarily till it's ready to be implemented, or implement it.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 19:29:00 - [199] - Quote That is very true it would keep people from wanting to connect to EVE if they feel EVE is favored more by CCP then Dust 514 & that EVE players know secrets we don't & that we can't fight against. Speaking of which are their any other secrets we should know of that might jepordize Dust players while we're here?
AzureFlameGod New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 1	Posted - 2013.12.03 20:56:00 - [200] - Quote Bump

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 175	Posted - 2014.01.13 19:48:00 - [201] - Quote Since CPM's are running for campaign currently this be a good time to bump this & remind people of this issue.
Leonid Tybalt Dark Knightz Corp. 136	Posted - 2014.01.13 19:57:00 - [202] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: shaman oga wrote: This time CCP it's your fault, we don't have control overces and the only way to join an alliance in DUST is to trust an EVE player and give him the CEO role. Give back all the shares to that guy and his CEO role. Then add a way to join an alliance from DUST without the need of an EVE character. Alliances are cool and we will add them officially to DUST at some stage but for now they serve little game play purpose and remain an EVE feature just like shares. If you want an alliance you better understand the implications of doing so. Also, you do have control over shares if you assigned the corporation to an EVE character they can take the shares out of the corporation wallet for safe keeping before giving back the CEO to the DUST character. This all assumes you trust the EVE character though, which is a tough commodity to come by in this game. Seems to me that this situation proves that it DOES have a game play purpose: insuring that EVE characters don't automatically have the upper hand in relation to creating alliances. Either remove the option to make alliances with dust based corps entirely until the feature is ready to be fully implemented OR give dust corporations the same tools and opportunities as the Eve players have.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2605	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:05:00 - [203] - Quote I think the easiest solution seems to be to just have the shares auto-assigned to the Duster that founds the corp. They then stay in the Dusters possession until CCP gives Dusters the ability to use shares. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2643	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:08:00 - [204] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: The only way this happens is if you assign CEO of your corp to an EVE player. Even if they give the CEO title back they could have taken shares during their stay which gives them power to boot the current CEO using voting. It seems this is becoming increasingly common and confusing people so we will add a warning about it when you resign from CEO. The shares and voting system is complicated and we purposefully did not include any of this in DUST. However once you have a mixed corporation you need to understand the implications of having both games involved. or how bout just removing the shares from dust-made corps since other than random pilot BS it has no place in this game? this is far from the first time this has happened, and from the perspective of a dust merc, who never sees nor knows about these 'shares' it remains pretty silly that this even is possible... Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 175	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:08:00 - [205] - Quote Also for those reading this post for the first time please read as much of each page as possible.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2643	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:09:00 - [206] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: I think the easiest solution seems to be to just have the shares auto-assigned to the Duster that founds the corp. They then stay in the Dusters possession until CCP gives Dusters the ability to use shares. or that lol Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2643	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:10:00 - [207] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Also for those reading this post for the first time please read as much of each page as possible. 13 pages or whatever? na, a quick glance and post based on only partial information.. so much better that way Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1491	Posted - 2014.01.13 20:16:00 - [208] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: I think the easiest solution seems to be to just have the shares auto-assigned to the Duster that founds the corp. They then stay in the Dusters possession until CCP gives Dusters the ability to use shares. CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: or how bout just removing the shares from dust-made corps since other than random pilot BS it has no place in this game? this is far from the first time this has happened, and from the perspective of a dust merc, who never sees nor knows about these 'shares' it remains pretty silly that this even is possible... I can only agree with these guys... Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament. Go Go Power Rangers!
Vala Prime Death by Disassociation Legacy Rising 33	Posted - 2014.01.26 02:51:00 - [209] - Quote I remember all to well. I hope people read and learn from this
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3167	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:21:00 - [210] - Quote Can I create an alliance using my dust corp? Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?

Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 2120	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:25:00 - [211] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Can I create an alliance using my dust corp? No you may not create or join an alliance with a dust character need an EVE account to do it, but good luck with your corp. Selling Rare Templar BPO's 250Mil ISK
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3167	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:27:00 - [212] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: Fire of Prometheus wrote: Can I create an alliance using my dust corp? No you may not create or join an alliance with a dust character need an EVE account to do it, but good luck with your corp. Thank you :) And that's stupid how you need an eve toon :/ What if I got an eve toon to create the alliance, join it with my corp, than hand CEO back to my dust toon? Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 2121	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:29:00 - [213] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: Fire of Prometheus wrote: Can I create an alliance using my dust corp? No you may not create or join an alliance with a dust character need an EVE account to do it, but good luck with your corp. Thank you :) And that's stupid how you need an eve toon :/ What if I got an eve toon to create the alliance, join it with my corp, than hand CEO back to my dust toon? You can do that buy from what i remember you need 1Bil EVE ISK to make an alliance. Which is a little less then two plexes (35$) or going to give a rough estimate of 125Mil Dust ISK with standard exchange prices(have not checked them in a while but it can't be to far off) Selling Rare Templar BPO's 250Mil ISK
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3168	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:29:00 - [214] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: Fire of Prometheus wrote: Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: Fire of Prometheus wrote: Can I create an alliance using my dust corp? No you may not create or join an alliance with a dust character need an EVE account to do it, but good luck with your corp. Thank you :) And that's stupid how you need an eve toon :/ What if I got an eve toon to create the alliance, join it with my corp, than hand CEO back to my dust toon? You can do that buy from what i remember you need 1Bil EVE ISK to make an alliance. Now that may be an issue...... Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3168	Posted - 2014.01.26 03:44:00 - [215] - Quote And how do you create a forums for your corp? Is that included in the corp management skill? Or..... Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?
Viktor Hadah Jr Critical-Impact 2137	Posted - 2014.01.26 06:49:00 - [216] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: And how do you create a forums for your corp? Is that included in the corp management skill? Or..... I believe you need at least 10 Members in your corp before you are able to make one. Selling Rare Templar BPO's 250Mil ISK
Fire of Prometheus Alpha Response Command 3176	Posted - 2014.01.26 15:07:00 - [217] - Quote Viktor Hadah Jr wrote: Fire of Prometheus wrote: And how do you create a forums for your corp? Is that included in the corp management skill? Or..... I believe you need at least 10 Members in your corp before you are able to make one. Awesome, thanks for the help :) Commando 6 // A.R.C Commander // C.E.O of Alpha Response Command A Balac's and a Thale's.....What's on your commando?
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 258	Posted - 2014.04.22 19:26:00 - [218] - Quote Bumping this once more before FanFest as it is still a serious issue. Anyone just reading this now this post requires to be read over in key places.
Orin the Freak The Solecism of Limitation 804	Posted - 2014.04.22 19:48:00 - [219] - Quote OMG THIS WAS A NECROBUMP!!! I HATE YOU! Spent like 5 minutes writing out a well-thought out reply. scorn


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