DUST Search - CEO roles

CCP Nullarbor wrote:

Forlorn Destrier wrote:

[CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid.

I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well.

However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us.

EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 12 post(s)
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2193	Posted - 2013.11.07 20:07:00 - [1] - Quote Scheherazade VII wrote: this ** does NOT belong in a first-person-shooter. 1. It needs to be fixed 2. This isn't just an FPS - it's an MMO where lying and trechery is common place and expected The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise? Join Legacy Rising**
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2195	Posted - 2013.11.07 21:59:00 - [2] - Quote Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Like any business, an Eve corporation has shares. These can be given out to players, and then there are mechanics in Eve that allow votes to happen. Those with shares are able to vote - one of the items that can be voted on is the election of a new CEO (among other things). Other things include a way to have profit sharing for your shareholders. But because of the danger of votes resulting in the removal of a CEO, 99% of all Eve corps do not give out shares thus keeping them "off the market". Dust players don't have this option. If one player has all the shares, the can force a vote where only he and the CEO can vote - when the CEO is in Dust, the CEO loses the ability to vote due to a lack of mechanics to do so, effectively meaning that the Eve player can take over the corporation legally - albeit as a hostile takeover. All the Eve player does is to take the shares out of the corp wallet and assign them to himself. He can then initiate a vote (that only he can vote on) and install himself as the new CEO - and the old one has no say whatsoever. Now, if the CEO had a way to protect himself, or I don't know be aware that giving control of the corp temporarily can result in losing the corp, perhaps then things would be acceptable because then the CEO is taking on the danger knowingly or at least with the ability to fight it. CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. If you have the tools to protect yourself but this still happens - well that is on the player. This however is on CCP and they need to make good on this and revert control to the correct people and implement as a band-aid a warning about giving up control. Long term, they need to implement shares into Dust, no matter the "development cost", as this particular thing can truly be game breaking for someone when they have no control over something that they should have control over. *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2199	Posted - 2013.11.08 14:57:00 - [3] - Quote Cenex Langly wrote: Mac Dac wrote: Im still kind of confused on the whole thing. What are these shares? What do they do? Does that EVE pilot have total control over the corp? And des said EVE pilot have control over the corp tax? from what i read, an EVE pilot can take over a dust corp effortlessly without does players able to do anything. Is this right? Honensty, i am worried about other EVE pilots finding out about this and using to "pimp" us mercs for the little ISK we have. I mean if they get complete access to the corp tax and corp wallet. Your corp wallets are safe as there is absolutely no way for an EVE player to take ISK from the dust wallet. They are separate from each other. Only until they make their Dust player a Director... *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising
Forlorn Destrier Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2199	Posted - 2013.11.08 15:17:00 - [4] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Forlorn Destrier wrote: [CCP's stance that this is not a critical item at this time is bull. I respect CCP Nullabar, but he is living in a cloud world on this issue. The players need a way to protect themselves; taking on risks without knowing is stupid. I absolutely agree with this statement and we will brainstorm some ways to fix the confusion, players should not have their corporation stolen without understanding why or the risks they are taking on. There may be some changes to the handling of shares that make this process safer for CEOs to manage, so I will have a conversation with the team about that as well. However the reality is that revamping the corporation system or integrating alliances into dust would be a fantastic but very expensive task. At this stage, we can provide so much more value into the game with that development time instead, which is why it is lower priority for us. EVE did not have alliances for a couple of years (2004 iirc), we will get there in the end it's just going to take a bit of time. Ty thoughts on this: 1. I respect where you are coming, however the analogy of alliances in Eve and Dust is a flawed analogy. The reason is that the alliance mechanics are impact Dust today due to the fact that corproations are mixed, and you have given limited mechanics in Dust that involve alliance functionality. When alliances were introduced into Eve, there was nothing like it prior - meaning this was a wholly new concept whereas in Dust it is not. 2. This statement is more comprehensive than your previous ones - part of what upset me and others is that you appeared to be getting defensive without actually explaining anything 3. CCP should revert ownership and shares of the OP's corp immediately. 4. CCP should introduce warning message at multiple levels (assigning roles; resigning CEO title, creating corporation, etc) to present all of the dangers herein until such time that CCP can devote development resources to introduce proper mechanics; this sould be done immediately as well. 5. As the executor of my alliance, things like this really irk me because it impacts my player base greatly. Personally, this does not impact me directly as I know the dangers as a long time Eve player (6 years and counting). That said, it does impact me indirectly in my ability to recruit new corps from Dust into my alliance, as well as the ability to protect my players from unseen threats, which is the responsibility of any corp or alliance CEO. Now comes the fun part - I normally don't play the "disgruntled customer" card, but the fact of the matter is I am a long term subscriber to Eve with 4 accounts (and as someone in Eve who rarely actually makes ISK because I don't enjoy that aspect, I am someone who pays real world money for 4 accounts every month) plus 2 in Dust. This issue impacts my ability to play Eve the way that I want - and so now what you have is a free to play game negatively impacting a paying customer in a different game. CCP's lack of forethought here is amazingly obvious to me. Were this only impactful to players who are not required to pay a subscription to play the game (i.e. Dust only players), the problems are lessened (albeit they are still significant). This, however, can potentially impact a lot of things in Eve - and I don't get the feeling that you realize this. 6. I hereby call for an official statement from CCP announcing the plans to implement the "bandaid" warnings in the game, and how soon we can expect them. I would also call on CCP to acknowledge that the OP's corp will be returned to him as a sign of good faith. I do so with the full understanding that CCP is not required to do so - though from a PR perspective this is a great opportunity that CCP would be foolish to ignore. 7. And finally, to the OP - my sympathies for you. If there is anything I can do to assist you (which, to be honest, I doubt there will be), please message me in game. If it is something that is in my power to do, and is reasonable, I will do what I can for you. Thanks for listening. *The time of your legacy is here. Will you rise?* Join Legacy Rising