DUST Search - WTF Reduced kill points!!!???

All Channels

General Discussions

WTF Reduced kill points!!!???

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 :: [one page]

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 13 post(s)
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2194	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:44:00 - [1] - Quote So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this?
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 150	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:46:00 - [2] - Quote uh oh. Have you had this happen more than once or was it an isolated match?
Scoota Eu GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 15	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:47:00 - [3] - Quote Happened to me in a tank and I just stopped getting WPs all together. Just said kill and no points. It happened I think in ambush when me and my squaddies were raping. Could be you were kicking too much but for the system to handle?
Alldin Kan MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 715	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:50:00 - [4] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this? I GO ABSENT IN DUST THIS WEEK DUE TO PS3 BREAKDOWN AND NOW THIS HAPPENS???
Cyrius Li-Moody The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR. 1521	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:53:00 - [5] - Quote Marauder's been nerfed.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2195	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:03:00 - [6] - Quote It seemed it happened within a span of time between each kill if you kill to fast For example X amount of kills within x time of each other after x amount of kills reduces wp by %
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2195	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:07:00 - [7] - Quote Ok so I just played another ambush and I didn't get this. However i also didn't get that many kills in such a short time like the first time. I will continue testing.
Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 1213	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:19:00 - [8] - Quote Interesting, keep us posted :)
Kalante Schiffer Ancient Exiles 452	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:24:00 - [9] - Quote this happened to me too. sometimes it would even say "Kill" but no war point number.
m twiggz Eternal Beings 108	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:26:00 - [10] - Quote I'm not sure what is happening, but reduced war points seems to be it. Just played quite a few domination matches, after a few minutes in battle it seems all WP gaining was lowered. I was getting anywhere from +4-+25 for team spawns, +2-+50 for kills, etc. At one point I dropped an orbital and killed 8 people, gaining just 8 WP for each kill. Ended up going 52-9-8 in a match with just 4449 WP. Has the nerf hammer finally hit WPs?

Disturbingly Bored The Strontium Asylum 845	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:29:00 - [11] - Quote It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2196	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:30:00 - [12] - Quote Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol
Heimdallr69 Imperfect Bastards 1084	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:34:00 - [13] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this? I killed a friendly with an ob in a pub and gave our entire squad a KE we were the only people in game to
Protocake JR Ancient Exiles 816	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:39:00 - [14] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol W...T...F.... Where your blueberries taking a nap?
Heimdallr69 Imperfect Bastards 1084	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:45:00 - [15] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol Yeah right dude...keep running that scout....not even cool
Lv2spd2 Slow And Old 33	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:46:00 - [16] - Quote Hmm... nerfing WPs for kills? That is like the ONLY thing I haven't seen nerf calls for on the forum. Someone is trolling. CCP I salute you!
KING CHECKMATE AMARR IMPERIAL CRUSADERS 2034	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:49:00 - [17] - Quote yup, to control stat padders in ambush.... Reduced WP per kill in limited time. Nice.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2198	Posted - 2013.10.24 21:52:00 - [18] - Quote It is true. My squad leader dropped an OB killing 8 guys in ambush. He started getting 12 pts per kill after the first 4 or so.
N1GHTMAR3S of Terror TRE GAFFEL 0	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:00:00 - [19] - Quote Protocake JR wrote: DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol W...T...F.... Where your blueberries taking a nap? Bad matchmaking - 2 vs 4 specifically - contributed to one of those games.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2198	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:02:00 - [20] - Quote Yup. Definitely not a bug. It's happening consistently. So instead of implementing a matchmaking system... They said "**** it lets just lower the WP of killing too fast!"

ThePrinceOfNigeria Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 149	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:06:00 - [21] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this? MOAR BUGS!!! Looks like CCP forgot to feed the hampsters that QA their code.
Lv2spd2 Slow And Old 33	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:13:00 - [22] - Quote Quick, someone test to see if the guardian points for repping during kills ALSO drops. Bacause, if not, that raises this troll to a WHOLE other level.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2199	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:34:00 - [23] - Quote C'mon I want a blue tag :(
Llast 326 An Arkhos 265	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:43:00 - [24] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Ok so I just played another ambush and I didn't get this. However i also didn't get that many kills in such a short time like the first time. I will continue testing. Not sure if i should be afraid or impressed of you for being able to call rapid elimination of the opposition as testing Maybe a mixture of both
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2199	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:56:00 - [25] - Quote Llast 326 wrote: DJINN Marauder wrote: Ok so I just played another ambush and I didn't get this. However i also didn't get that many kills in such a short time like the first time. I will continue testing. Not sure if i should be afraid or impressed of you for being able to call rapid elimination of the opposition as testing Maybe a mixture of both lol
843 Epidemic Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 346	Posted - 2013.10.24 22:58:00 - [26] - Quote Yep, happened to me too. I was on a streak and I started getting 31, 45, 44, 41 WP for my kills. I called in an OB and all that popped up was 'kill' and nothing else. Not sure if I even got anything from that.
calvin b Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 752	Posted - 2013.10.24 23:02:00 - [27] - Quote I have had this problem too. I shoot down one DS and I get my 75 WP. Drop the second no points, tanks I get 150 WP for the first two and then I get nothing, and also I do not get points for assist or kill when I clearly was the player who shot and killed the other player. I have been seeing this for a while, some days you get your points, others you maybe shorted by a lot.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 1556	Posted - 2013.10.24 23:02:00 - [28] - Quote Probably trying to figure out a method to stop people gaining 300-500WP per orbital which cuts down the cost for the next, leading to a chain of them, decimating the other team mercilessly. I actually would be happy if they just removed WP from orbitals entirely, instead of doing this and causing people who gain legitimate kills to suffer. Orbitals already give you a huge advantage just by using it, I really find it distasteful that we are given WP for it.
8213 Grade No.2 501	Posted - 2013.10.24 23:11:00 - [29] - Quote I noticed it in a few sessions. First I was solo shooting someone to 3 armor, then my bluberry would finally realize what I was doing and finish them off, I'd get no assist. Then I would get the word "assist", but no WP (Not even in my final score) I would kill someone and get the word "kill" and get like 18WP, or 12WP... or nothing. I would finish a game with 10 kills, 4 assists, and only have 342 WP... That was another reason I quit the game, I didn't bring it up either because I've come to the point that I see no point in bringing up stuff like that. 1. People call you a liar, and say I must be reading something wrong 2. People claim that its never happened to them, so it must never happen to anyone in the game. I'm just a bad and dumb player... 3. CCP doesn't respond to it, or fix it ever... because they only respond to things they know how to fix, so they look like heros "Hey, this is LogiBro, thanks bringing up the issue, we have a fix in the works..." But when the same problems go unanswered, then eventually they come up with "We can only put things in patches as we devolp them. There is no order to it. Certian issues just can't be fixed right now..." But funny thing is, the Flaylock got fixed the same month people started b*tching about it... Unless this is a system where you get credit for kill based on the other person's gear? Kill a Proto, get 50... kill a starter get 12? But that doesn't make sense, because the type of gear doesn't always reflect how good a player actually is. And I'm assuming the gear you are wearing would also have to factor into it.. Or, perhaps in karma for your Scout walking through my HMG ????? lulz
8213 Grade No.2 501	Posted - 2013.10.24 23:14:00 - [30] - Quote Vyzion Eyri wrote: Probably trying to figure out a method to stop people gaining 300-500WP per orbital which cuts down the cost for the next, leading to a chain of them, decimating the other team mercilessly. I actually would be happy if they just removed WP from orbitals entirely, instead of doing this and causing people who gain legitimate kills to suffer. Orbitals already give you a huge advantage just by using it, I really find it distasteful that we are given WP for it. I think they should cut the WP you get from it. Kind of like using a killstreak in Black Ops 2, you still get points, but it cuts it so you can't just sit there and let the streaks do all the work... Like sitting in a corner and allowing Attack Dogs and a Swarm to get you another set of Attack Dogs and Swarm in a never ending cycle. So an Orbital should get 15WP maybe?

gbghg L.O.T.I.S. Public Disorder. 3749	Posted - 2013.10.24 23:34:00 - [31] - Quote Vyzion Eyri wrote: Probably trying to figure out a method to stop people gaining 300-500WP per orbital which cuts down the cost for the next, leading to a chain of them, decimating the other team mercilessly. I actually would be happy if they just removed WP from orbitals entirely, instead of doing this and causing people who gain legitimate kills to suffer. Orbitals already give you a huge advantage just by using it, I really find it distasteful that we are given WP for it. I like scanning the red blog right before the orbital drops, then harvesting all those intel assists, i wonder how much WP could be gained if a full squad did this.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2201	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:15:00 - [32] - Quote I want dat blue tag :P
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 1266	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:21:00 - [33] - Quote Haha suck it good players! Now ambush belongs to me and my sloppy playing! Muahahahha!
ReGnYuM MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 1185	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:24:00 - [34] - Quote Confirmed been having this issue all day
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 219	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:26:00 - [35] - Quote gbghg wrote: Vyzion Eyri wrote: Probably trying to figure out a method to stop people gaining 300-500WP per orbital which cuts down the cost for the next, leading to a chain of them, decimating the other team mercilessly. I actually would be happy if they just removed WP from orbitals entirely, instead of doing this and causing people who gain legitimate kills to suffer. Orbitals already give you a huge advantage just by using it, I really find it distasteful that we are given WP for it. I like scanning the red blog right before the orbital drops, then harvesting all those intel assists, i wonder how much WP could be gained if a full squad did this. Less than a full squad repping the squad leader. Dem Guardian points.
m twiggz Eternal Beings 108	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:26:00 - [36] - Quote All WP have been diminished. Its not just kill WP, its for just about everything. Reps, revives, resupply, kills, team spawns, intel and even assists. Hey CCP you going to ignore this or will we actually be getting a blue tag on this to clear it up? I'd be more than happy to open hundreds of threads until someone responds.
Rowdy Railgunner TRUE TEA BAGGERS EoN. 91	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:29:00 - [37] - Quote CCP Ninja is in full effect it seams.
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 219	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:32:00 - [38] - Quote Rowdy Railgunner wrote: CCP Ninja is in full effect it seams. Somewhere, sometime they buffed infantry shield rechargers. Arguably okay instead of terrible. CCP Nijna is the most effective thing at CCP Shanghai.
fawkuima juggalo Hollowed Kings 87	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:04:00 - [39] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this? bug forum....
Patrick57 GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 890	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:08:00 - [40] - Quote I hate everyone in this thread that is good enough to have this happen.

Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 1231	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:09:00 - [41] - Quote Perhaps they are testing some sort of new mechanic that reduces orbital farming......not to sure.....we need a dev to confirm this though
Patrick57 GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 891	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:12:00 - [42] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Perhaps they are testing some sort of new mechanic that reduces orbital farming......not to sure.....we need a dev to confirm this though Lol then everyone would just hack the objectives over and over again.....wait......they are implementing TEAMWORK into the game! Well played CCP, well played.....but we will soon turn this game back into COD!

ChribbaX Otherworld Enterprises Dust Control Otherworld Empire Productions 817	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:39:00 - [43] - Quote Nerf to boosting?

CeeCeePee King-Alldin Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 4	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:54:00 - [44] - Quote I had nothing to do with this, I swear.
Patrick57 GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 892	Posted - 2013.10.25 02:55:00 - [45] - Quote CeeCeePee King-Alldin wrote: We did this to nerf assaults guise it's true
dustwaffle The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 612	Posted - 2013.10.25 03:05:00 - [46] - Quote Submit bug report/ticket and see what CCP says
Sgt Kirk SyNergy Gaming EoN. 2378	Posted - 2013.10.25 03:13:00 - [47] - Quote Lv2spd2 wrote: Hmm... nerfing WPs for kills? That is like the ONLY thing I haven't seen nerf calls for on the forum. Someone is trolling. CCP I salute you! CCP Troll wrote: I try my best
The Eristic Sad Panda Solutions 50	Posted - 2013.10.25 11:23:00 - [48] - Quote Encountered three occurrences of too-little-to-no WP tonight within 2-3 hours. One squadmate received incorrect WP for repping, another received 0 for revives throughout an entire match, and I myself received 0 WP and no kill feed entries for 4 players I watched die to my orbital in my next-to-last game of the night. Weirdness abounds.
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 1076	Posted - 2013.10.25 11:35:00 - [49] - Quote This, instead of raising the WP needed for an OB to a reasonable number like 5,000? Or, is this just to make us play slower so that the Devs actually go positive in a pub? (This long without a blue tag usually means that it was intentional.)
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 1992	Posted - 2013.10.25 12:31:00 - [50] - Quote A hotfix did go in to address some exploits. That's pretty much all I can say because ;NDA; However, CCP seems to have come up short. When we talked about this in a meeting we were assured it shouldn't affect anyone other than those who were farming, when we brought up the issue of legit players being affected. I've thrown up some red flags in the appropriate channels to see what's going on and such.

DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2207	Posted - 2013.10.25 16:52:00 - [51] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: A hotfix did go in to address some exploits. That's pretty much all I can say because ;NDA; However, CCP seems to have come up short. When we talked about this in a meeting we were assured it shouldn't affect anyone other than those who were farming, when we brought up the issue of legit players being affected. I've thrown up some red flags in the appropriate channels to see what's going on and such. Say more :(
Protocake JR Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 825	Posted - 2013.10.25 17:04:00 - [52] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Lv2spd2 wrote: Hmm... nerfing WPs for kills? That is like the ONLY thing I haven't seen nerf calls for on the forum. Someone is trolling. CCP I salute you! CCP Troll wrote: I try my best Love these posts. Keep them coming +1
Nirwanda Vaughns Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 132	Posted - 2013.10.25 17:29:00 - [53] - Quote I had it happen to me last night. also i was going AV in a match, took out a couple tanks and lavs with the drivers (about 5 kills) get to end of game and non of the kills registered
Gunmouse 0uter.Heaven 88	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:03:00 - [54] - Quote Protocake JR wrote: DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol W...T...F.... Where your blueberries taking a nap? That's it, set this up, bring full team into a game and see if Marauder can wipe out all 50 clones...... 1 v 16. That would make a good youtube video.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2209	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:08:00 - [55] - Quote Gunmouse wrote: Protocake JR wrote: DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol W...T...F.... Where your blueberries taking a nap? That's it, set this up, bring full team into a game and see if Marauder can wipe out all 50 clones...... 1 v 16. That would make a good youtube video. Actually I got 10 free kills thanks to a logi on their team picking up 2 dudes 5 times each while I was behind them on a rock lol.
MadMatt Four20 Ancient Exiles 3	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:14:00 - [56] - Quote Yup this happened to me in a DOM. Tankin half way through the game and started getting like 15 WP's per kill and 30 WP's per tank kill. :) WTF ... although i did go 35-0 with 3,700 WP's
Thumb Green Novashift 486	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:18:00 - [57] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: A hotfix did go in to address some exploits. That's pretty much all I can say because ;NDA; However, CCP seems to have come up short. When we talked about this in a meeting we were assured it shouldn't affect anyone other than those who were farming, when we brought up the issue of legit players being affected. I've thrown up some red flags in the appropriate channels to see what's going on and such. Leave it to CCP to think of the most asinine way of fixing something; almost as if it were intentional.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2347	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:19:00 - [58] - Quote I wonder if this is why I didn't get intel kill assists for scanning right before an OB and my squad leader complained that he got only two kills. What does the screen show when you get an OB kill but no points for it?
MadMatt Four20 Ancient Exiles 3	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:19:00 - [59] - Quote Master Jaraiya Ultramarine Corp Likes received: 1,218 #1Posted: 2013.10.25 16:05 \| Report \| Edited by: Master Jaraiya Like 5 Was just in a match with a good tank driver. This guy went 35/0 in a Madrugar Blaster HAV despite being under fire from 4 - 5 AV players the entire match, including myself. I went 9/13. 10 of those deaths were the HAV driver 3 were from a Proto MinLogi with MLT shotgun popping me as I was trying to take out the HAV. Several times, after 2 - 3 volleys of swarms and a couple direct hits from my Adv. Assault FG with Prof. 3 and 2 Comp. Damage mods, we managed only to push the tank back. He retreated to an objective held by his team and fully repped and was back pwning face of our team within 45 seconds. Anybody who thinks HAVs are underpowered or cannot handle AV sucks at driving HAVs period! This is not a QQ thread or a buff AV thread. I'm simply calling how it is! Tanks are in absolutely no way underpowered. CCP, nerfing AV as you are intending will completely and utterly tip the balance of Vehicle/AV all the way toward favoring vehicles. WOW now they got a thread up about me.
Thumb Green Novashift 486	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:25:00 - [60] - Quote Wrong thread MadMatt. Also you can click the quote button instead of highlighting everything when you're going to respond to a post.

The Eristic Sad Panda Solutions 50	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:39:00 - [61] - Quote Skihids wrote: I wonder if this is why I didn't get intel kill assists for scanning right before an OB and my squad leader complained that he got only two kills. What does the screen show when you get an OB kill but no points for it? I watched them get blown up and got the hit markers for each of them, but no "KILL +50" or "The Eristic (Precision Strike) XYZ" for any of them. I didn't even have that much WP at that point, either, maybe 1k, so it wasn't like I'd already ground out tons and tons of kills.
Gunmouse 0uter.Heaven 92	Posted - 2013.10.25 20:44:00 - [62] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Gunmouse wrote: Protocake JR wrote: DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol W...T...F.... Where your blueberries taking a nap? That's it, set this up, bring full team into a game and see if Marauder can wipe out all 50 clones...... 1 v 16. That would make a good youtube video. Actually I got 10 free kills thanks to a logi on their team picking up 2 dudes 5 times each while I was behind them on a rock lol. Don't you love it when that happens. I remember back in Chrome I killed someone and a logi ran up, didn't see me and rez'd him, i down the guy again, but left the logi. He picked him up again, i downed him again, then the log looked up at me, i looked at him, and he looked back down and rez'd him again, and we repeated this id say 10-12 times until a blueberrry killed that logi. Was one of the funniest things I can remember about this game in my experience. The mutual understanding we had was the best!

CCP Eterne C C P C C P Alliance 2866	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:08:00 - [63] - Quote Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. EVE Online/DUST 514 Community Representative GÇ+ EVE Illuminati GÇ+ Fiction Adept @CCPEterne GÇ+ @EVELiveEvents

Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 224	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:13:00 - [64] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are genuinely the best on the battlefield." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a terribad runs in and dies, then gets revived by more terribads, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Fixed that for you. Something witty here. How about? #DELAY 514 ... been waiting for a rail rifle longer than SoTa's been trolling.
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 7323	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:15:00 - [65] - Quote Soldner VonKuechle wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are genuinely the best on the battlefield." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a terribad runs in and dies, then gets revived by more terribads, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Fixed that for you. It fixes more than it hurts, a few wicked good players being butt hurt over a few WP is much less of a concern than a few talentless chumps abusing the WP system for OBs YouTube / Twitch Feed me ISK
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 202	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:18:00 - [66] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. lol missed the point of needle love'n entirely somewhere a goon just gained its wings.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. Top Men. 1662	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:20:00 - [67] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. There must be a better fix for this instead of just applying a flat limiter? This stops people from getting awesome OBs and genuine kill streaks. Why not just allow one kill reward and one revive reward per clone? Or how about toning down the 1 minute time limit to much less, like 30 seconds? Or an even better fix - once revived, stay down until X is pressed? Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1574	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:25:00 - [68] - Quote pull it out at least off of kills especially off of kills, slayers already can barely keep up with the WP/min that a Logi can have... CEO of The Corporate Raiders, We're still recruiting... Level 1 Forum Warrior
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 85	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:28:00 - [69] - Quote God forbid putting this nerf on the actual equipment piece you are saying people abuse. Let's do the usual and do a blanket nerfbat on wp's as a quick and dirty fix, let's screw over hmg's, shotguns, remote explosives Uplinks, Orbitals...... Probably more (snipers???) Nanite injectors I Would off thought would be used less per minute than the items above, so they are being hit even harder than the intended equipment fix
Soldiersaint Deepspace Digital 501	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:29:00 - [70] - Quote Great now we wont make any profit as a logi. first you cap our rep tool and now you make it that we get less points over time. Real logis are getting punished because of worthless stat padders.....again

Gorra Snell The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 197	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:35:00 - [71] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. Why not just restrict the WP reduction to killing the same person repeatedly? Would fix this exploit, and have the bonus of making noobs less tempting targets.
Eltra Ardell Goonfeet Top Men. 183	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:38:00 - [72] - Quote IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY wrote: lol missed the point of needle love'n entirely somewhere a goon just gained its wings. Sammus reports that the new wings "feel good" and he will be giving them a good test run later this week.
M McManus Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 187	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:39:00 - [73] - Quote Typical CCP we don't know how to stop the abuse so lets nerf everyone. ..
Nightbird Aeon Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 349	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:40:00 - [74] - Quote I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay?
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1155	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:43:00 - [75] - Quote I'm actually a bit speechless been looking at this and trying to figure out how to respond.... everything from ruining orbitals, to hurting slayer WP gain ( in a shooter ) is just bad. if up-links were the issue all you needed to do was apply a cap gain per minute like you do with repairs. just a poor choice.
DaddyKillsEmAll United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 124	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:44:00 - [76] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." Really? I thought its a bug....But yeah, keep nerfing the guys who know how to play... lulz...
Earl Crushinator Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 166	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:44:00 - [77] - Quote CCP Eterne - Can you tell us, quantitatively if possible, how many Warpoint people have gained via the abuse method you are describing per game - and at what amount will the WP limit per minute be set to to combat this? Numbers are king.
I-Shayz-I 1182	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:45:00 - [78] - Quote I honestly don't mind this. People who are running around getting tons of kills in a small amount of time are being balanced with the people who aren't super hardcore. This also prevents players from earning tons of points from orbitals in order to earn more orbitals. But if there's a different way to fix this (such as the way people have suggested above me), I'd rather it be solved that way. List of Most Important Threads I make logistics videos! (Insert future link here)
Oswald Rehnquist Abandoned Privilege General Tso's Alliance 358	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:48:00 - [79] - Quote I agree with the others, the caps should be placed on the equipment themselves, whether as a collective or as individual pieces, that is still to be determined Below db 28
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1155	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:50:00 - [80] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: I honestly don't mind this. People who are running around getting tons of kills in a small amount of time are being balanced with the people who aren't super hardcore. This also prevents players from earning tons of points from orbitals in order to earn more orbitals. But if there's a different way to fix this (such as the way people have suggested above me), I'd rather it be solved that way. it's not balanced, the players killing them will still be killing them and murdering them. logi's will still be gaining more wp then slayers, and slayers will just be held back more. no part of this balances anything aside from slowing down a form of abuse that could of been handled directly rather then indirectly, and also something I've never really seen myself outside of pubs, and not directly in the players control.

Eltra Ardell Goonfeet Top Men. 184	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:50:00 - [81] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: I honestly don't mind this. People who are running around getting tons of kills in a small amount of time are being balanced with the people who aren't super hardcore. This also prevents players from earning tons of points from orbitals in order to earn more orbitals. But if there's a different way to fix this (such as the way people have suggested above me), I'd rather it be solved that way. People should never be punished for being good at the game. People should never be rewarded for being bad at the game.
Soldiersaint Deepspace Digital 502	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:52:00 - [82] - Quote calisk galern wrote: I'm actually a bit speechless been looking at this and trying to figure out how to respond.... everything from ruining orbitals, to hurting slayer WP gain ( in a shooter ) is just bad. if up-links were the issue all you needed to do was apply a cap gain per minute like you do with repairs. just a poor choice. Hey what about healer wp gain? killing is not the only part of this game dude. Why does every one only care about how many kills they get?
Orca Amsel Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 550	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:53:00 - [83] - Quote Oswald Rehnquist wrote: I agree with the others, the caps should be placed on the equipment themselves, whether as a collective or as individual pieces, that is still to be determined I disagree with this. Having a cap on WP discourages a logi from doing their job. What you are paid at the end of a match is determined by the number of WP you get during the match so limiting the WP earned from doing logi things while having no limit on the WP you get from killing tells me that I should not be doing my job. If CCP really has a problem with this maybe they need to reduce WP given by everything and remove the limit.
OwnD07 DUST CORE DARKSTAR ARMY 34	Posted - 2013.10.29 19:55:00 - [84] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. Gÿ¦GÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÿ¦
pseudosnipre DUST University Ivy League 310	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:00:00 - [85] - Quote Anticipate my helpdesk tickets after every round for my legitimate, missing WPs... Helping the new player experience should not be achieved by driving all legitimate competitors away.
pseudosnipre DUST University Ivy League 310	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:01:00 - [86] - Quote OwnD07 wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. Talent, now an SP sink.
Ser Tarlon United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 53	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:03:00 - [87] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. This is stupid. People who earn their warpoints the honest way are being punished by some stupid guys. change that, it's not worth the sh!tstorm you're getting
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3527	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:07:00 - [88] - Quote Another instance in which CCP should have gotten feedback before making the change. ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
HyperionsThunder Ghost Wolf Industries Alpha Wolf Pack 94	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:09:00 - [89] - Quote While I understand the merits of enacting a system to discourage WP farming and cheating, capping the WP earned per minute significantly alters the flow and fun of fast paced battles, and is especially frustrating when dealing with orbital strikes and other AOE attacks. As many people above have stated, it also dramatically decreased the reason for logibros to do their job (well really it discourages everyone from doing their jobs). I also don't agree with putting a cap on the number of WPs earned for killing or reviving or repairing individual clones. This is a complicated issue with a complicated answer. Common sense will prevail. Adapt or die.
pseudosnipre DUST University Ivy League 310	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:14:00 - [90] - Quote HyperionsThunder wrote: While I understand the merits of enacting a system to discourage WP farming and cheating, capping the WP earned per minute significantly alters the flow and fun of fast paced battles, and is especially frustrating when dealing with orbital strikes and other AOE attacks. As many people above have stated, it also dramatically decreased the reason for logibros to do their job (well really it discourages everyone from doing their jobs). I also don't agree with putting a cap on the number of WPs earned for killing or reviving or repairing individual clones. This is a complicated issue with a complicated answer. your signature is ironic

Flint Beastgood III GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 277	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:44:00 - [91] - Quote Gorra Snell wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. Why not just restrict the WP reduction to killing the same person repeatedly? Would fix this exploit, and have the bonus of making noobs less tempting targets. ^This.
fawkuima juggalo Eternal Beings 90	Posted - 2013.10.29 20:50:00 - [92] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. NO WAY! this is for real then i guess...... this needs to be trashed RIGHT NOW, for obvious reasons i.e. the whole point of this game is to be good and get points how the hell are you gonna limit us for that. the only people this effects are good players and farmers. when you could simply limit the amount of needles used per life, or just punish them, limit there wp per minute. IF I EXPERIENCE THIS THE NEXT TIME I LOG ON I'LL FILE A TICKET. im so pissed. FIGHT FOR A CAUSE, EVEN IF IT'S NEXT TO YOU.
GerAseR United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 12	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:03:00 - [93] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Feedback is: Team/Squad Players get nerfed, you should think about that again after the Squad Cup. Take these numbers from the cup and start working on a new/better solution ^^@upsGerAseR <-> facebook^^
m twiggz Eternal Beings 115	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:12:00 - [94] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Limiter is too strict. Greatly reduces the WP gained by a good logi. Matches where I would be getting 3500-4000 WP I'm now receiving 2500-3000 WP. I can deal with this reduction just fine, I just don't see the absolute need for a limiter in the first place. Let the kids who want to farm WP do it, they're still just as bad. I very rarely see people "farming" war points, or "cheating" for that matter. Yet again another CCP fix that hurts players who actually enjoy the game.
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 207	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:31:00 - [95] - Quote Just to state the obvious did anyone consider the motivation behind this kind of stuff has nothing to do with WP or farming it for OB's or ISK (this game is designed for retards you don't even have to log in, fire a gun or do anything more than show up and you still get rewarded) and that these solutions will do nothing to counter it if WP is not the motivation? In essence this will do nothing to discourage the "problem". BTW this "problem" is so insignificant it shouldn't be given this much attention considering all the other issues, and in conclusion if FF has been in this game from the beginning none of this would be an issue at all as the players have fun ways of dealing with griefers then.
Sinboto Simmons SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1692	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:33:00 - [96] - Quote kdr means little to many, wp and isk along with the w/l are everything to anyone without a meaningless superiority complex, please rethink this it's punishing many who don't do direct combat like scouts and (real) logis. Sinboto - The True Blood Minja.
Egypt Musk A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 48	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:37:00 - [97] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Another brainless fix from our clueless dev's T Rex of Adetide-Anon's Official pirate radio talk show host & Realtor
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 791	Posted - 2013.10.29 21:57:00 - [98] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. it is a little too strict. it's happened to me a couple of times and I don't even play as a squad leader.
Happy Violentime OMFGZOMBIESRUN 132	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:00:00 - [99] - Quote DaddyKillsEmAll wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." Really? I thought its a bug....But yeah, keep nerfing the guys who know how to play... lulz... Has anyone complained about people farming warpoints or 'cheating' - LOL so much broken in this game and you apply a 'fix' for this. Are you only just catching up with the OB farming petitions from 3/4/5??? Builds ago, wake up its 2013 now!!!
Paran Tadec Ancient Exiles 1513	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:02:00 - [100] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. LAME!!! Bittervet Proficiency V CSM 1 me maybe?

Tectonic Fusion The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 438	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:03:00 - [101] - Quote Django Quik wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. There must be a better fix for this instead of just applying a flat limiter? This stops people from getting awesome OBs and genuine kill streaks. Why not just allow one kill reward and one revive reward per clone? Or how about toning down the 1 minute time limit to much less, like 30 seconds? Or an even better fix - once revived, stay down until X is pressed? I hate being revived if I don't press X.
Aqua-Regia 484	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:04:00 - [102] - Quote F* Oceania Server Cheating Scrub. GòöGòºGòºGòºGòºGòºGòºGòùGöÉGòôBPO / BPC Collector Gòû Gòó SoonGäó** GòáGò¬Gò¬GòºGòñGòñGò¬GòñGòºGòºGòñGòªGò¬GòñGò¬GòªGòºGò¼GòíNewbieGòPGûá GòÜGòñGòñGòñGòñGòñGòñGò¥Dust 514 GòPGò¢§GòÆGòúRNDGòáGòòGòÜGòíMHPDGòPGò¢
IMMORTAL WAR HERO BAD SANTA'S SCHOOL 4 SCOUNDRELS 68	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:12:00 - [103] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: It seems CCP determined your shotgunfu was too good, and decided to nerf you. No one is allowed to kill that well with a broken weapon. I was using the scrambler rifle. I went 40-2 in a 50 clone game lol my best game ever was 47 killstreak in ambush with shield soma 3 kills not mine this was around the time i had a 18.5 kd MASTER OF CAPITAL LETTERS: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP
Bethhy Ancient Exiles 237	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:17:00 - [104] - Quote WTF????? Another lazy over complicated fix for a very small issue... Everyday I loose faith in the actual ability to fix real problems... Why did this issue ever warrant this kind of attention other then a VERY small amount of annoyance a personal player has with being picked up endlessly. We have real issues in this game... How about the billion invisible walls and map glitches before something so infant as needle farming. sick to my stomach.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Public Disorder. 183	Posted - 2013.10.29 22:24:00 - [105] - Quote Why did CCP not just limit the worth of killing a revived player??
Absolute Idiom II SyNergy Gaming EoN. 823	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:02:00 - [106] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Why don't you just cap the reward from that particular activity only? Fanfest 2012 - Winning Team + MVP - £1100 in prizes Fanfest 2013 - Winning Team - £500 in prizes Fanfest 2014 - ???
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 325	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:05:00 - [107] - Quote This is ridiculous. Return the WP situation back to its previous state, CCP. People who earn their WP in a legitimate fashion shouldn't be punished in the name of curtailing stat padders.
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 1298	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:08:00 - [108] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. Shouldn't you just put a cap on how many revives per minute you receive WP for? This is like using a shotgun on a fly instead of a fly swatter, too much collateral damage. Reading the forums detracts from overall enjoyment of the game
Maximus Stryker Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 665	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:15:00 - [109] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. I think you are hurting the overall game because of the actions of a small percentage of players. Maybe the nanite injector needs a cool down time like the scanner. We Have Signatures Now...!!!
IMMORTAL WAR HERO BAD SANTA'S SCHOOL 4 SCOUNDRELS 68	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:17:00 - [110] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: So I just played an ambush and I got 5 kills at 50wp then I started getting like 40 pts then it dropped down to as low as 7 pts! Wtf Is this? ....... ive never seen this..... only hit detction issues i make war points fine example my last game yesterday i played like garbage went 16 kills 18 deaths...........but i still got 1700 wp....... sometimes i wonder if lag is done on purpose.....as i rarly MASTER OF CAPITAL LETTERS: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP

DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 7342	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:19:00 - [111] - Quote To everyone saying just cap needle WP, did you ever stop to think that maybe they've been taking future equipment and WP rewards into account as well? This change only effects the very top players in most instances, and if they seriously need to QQ that they aren't earning enough WP cuz they're proto farming militia pub matches....well...I don't really know what to tell you. YouTube / Twitch Feed me ISK
Super Meeper Red Star. EoN. 3	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:56:00 - [112] - Quote That explains why my warpoints slowed down a lot when trying to logi a really bad team. In some cases I was seeing message but getting no points what so ever.
Arirana Ancient Exiles 209	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:59:00 - [113] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Thats a very flawed fix, I'm not surprised at all that it wasn't mentioned in the official messaging, as it sounds like it was a last minute idea that wasn't thought out all that well and rushed. So not only is CCP failing to put out much in their updates, but some of what they do put out is harming the game more than helping. That "fix" also prevents legit killstreaks from yielding the deserved amount of WP, which in turn discourages people from going for killstreaks and rather pace their kills so they may get as many wp as possible. You could have limited the amount of WP per consecutive revive specifically, or even limited per clone to only 1-2 revives and the next time they die their clone is terminated regardless. Not limit all forms of wp gain in a short amount of time. On a side note, I made a post about this 3 days ago
Jack Kittinger DUST University Ivy League 55	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:13:00 - [114] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." you're drunk ccp go home! Please don't drink and code...
MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 62	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:22:00 - [115] - Quote Severely throttled my legitimate gameplay. Figure out a way to deal with cheaters that doesn't impede on players.
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 228	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:28:00 - [116] - Quote How about this for a solution to boosting. -Hire "floating" dev. -open mystical "giant DUST statistics" folder - run a script for total wp earned per match (ex. 4000) per 24 hour span. - observe repeat offenders in the script result list (ignore rygynum and mauradar) -check if repeat offender in x amount of days strectch -if threshold criteria met, issue 7 day account lock elapsed time 35 minutes. Idk color dropsuits the rest of the day. It's not that hard@!!!! Stop doing dumb things about a tiny problem! ! Something witty here. How about? #DELAY 514 ... been waiting for a rail rifle longer than SoTa's been trolling.
Uravm0d groundforce Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 25	Posted - 2013.10.30 00:59:00 - [117] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Wow so if your a good player getting lots of kills your cheating/If your playing the game well your cheating? As far as i know picking up the same player you get max 72pts on 1st pick up then nothing afterwards. If there is a way you could get another 72pts on 3rd pickup there is a far more obvious fix then a limiter to all the players playing well.
Lorhak Gannarsein The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 495	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:13:00 - [118] - Quote My WP gain as a tanker is cut dramatically; it's irritating when killing a half-full dropship nullifies your WP gains. Makes it even harder to run a profit. GG, CCP.

CCP Wolfman C C P C C P Alliance 2746	Posted - 2013.10.30 01:51:00 - [119] - Quote We've checked the data since it was released and have prepared an update which will be deployed in a hotfix soon.

SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 326	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:11:00 - [120] - Quote CCP Wolfman wrote: We've checked the data since it was released and have prepared an update which will be deployed in a hotfix soon. Thanks for being a smart, classy gentleman. Terrific decision.

TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 4366	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:39:00 - [121] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: We've checked the data since it was released and have prepared an update which will be deployed in a hotfix soon. Thanks for being a smart, classy gentleman. Terrific decision. What decision was made? I see "incoming hotfix", not "revert back to old system" or "nerf WP gain even more". Never forget
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1156	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:52:00 - [122] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: calisk galern wrote: I'm actually a bit speechless been looking at this and trying to figure out how to respond.... everything from ruining orbitals, to hurting slayer WP gain ( in a shooter ) is just bad. if up-links were the issue all you needed to do was apply a cap gain per minute like you do with repairs. just a poor choice. Hey what about healer wp gain? killing is not the only part of this game dude. Why does every one only care about how many kills they get? healing wp's were already capped out in the same way uplink points should been capped. aside from that I don't see your point, logi's already make a ton more then slayers do and your comment didn't refute that. I acknowledge logi's make tons of points already, and you will still make tons of points.
dazlb72 HELGHAN EXILES 106	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:58:00 - [123] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Thanks for keeping us informed. Great job. Also that's a great idea (can you get banned for sarcasm?) It begins
Sgt Kirk SyNergy Gaming EoN. 2427	Posted - 2013.10.30 03:04:00 - [124] - Quote This is the kind of **** that really makes me question CCPs competence. I may have deleted DUST but I still care deeply about this game.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 51	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:24:00 - [125] - Quote Hi everyone. So. Right at the end of July we were sent a video of a semi-optimised farming setup which was allowing players to grind up, in one example we saw, 60,116WP over the course of 69 minutes. This is behavior we want to strongly discourage for several reasons (listed in ascending order of significance, ie most important last): It makes a mess of our progression curves It's not fair on players who're earning their progress normally It pushes well outside the boundaries of what we consider "normal", which opens the door to all kinds of potential issues, such as farming for Precision Strikes and then dropping a dozen at once People hiding off in the corner of a map farming tend to ruin matches Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. In this case, the root problem is that we don't want people farming an excessive amount of WP, for any reason and using any trick. So, we started developing a design to limit WP gain directly. More specifically, we wanted to ensure that, at the end of a match, no player had scored more than a certain amount of WP per minute, as WP gain over time is the ultimate thing we want to target. The design we ended up with is fairly straightforward: We set two constants in our data: WP/minute ceiling and WP/minute limit Each player has a WP ceiling and a WP limit for each match These start at 0, and are incremented every second. This gives you two numbers that rise linearly over the course of the match If, any time you gain WP, your total WP score for the match would be above your current WP ceiling, we reduce the value of that WP payout proportional to how far between your current ceiling and your current limit it would take your score This has the following consequences: So long as your WP total stays below the WP ceiling, you will never see this system As your WP total moves above the ceiling, we trim your WP payout in a way that starts gentle but gets firmer as your WP/minute gets higher We can mathematically guarantee that you can never score more WP per minute than the limit value over the course of the match, so this system should be 100% exploit-proof and never need to be adjusted again Because we are tracking a moving ceiling over the course of the battle, rather than say tracking your income over the last minute or the last X WP scores or whatever, once you get past the first few minutes in-match your WP income can be very uneven and still not trigger the cap so long as your average over the course of the battle stays below the limit As a side-effect of the above, the system is more likely to start clipping scores if you score large amounts of WP in the first minute or two; this isn't optimal, but in the course of a normal battle (ie starting from the beginning rather than joining midway through) there's little opportunity to get big scores in your first minute or so, which should significantly reduce the impact of this factor. We're currently happy with the underlying design of this system: it's robust, it's failsafe, it's communicating its actions to players in a relatively clear way, and aside from first-minute concerns it has no inherent drawbacks that we've identified so far. However. The numbers are obviously wrong When we set this up, we did some data mining to determine what values we should use. We looked at some people who were obviously exploiting, and they were getting up into the 1000+WP/minute range. We also tried to determine what "normal" play looked like for high-scoring characters, and our research here fell short. We looked at a random sample of players, and we looked at the highest-scoring player on the server, and we were seeing that a little over 250 WP/minute was about the highest we were seeing. Obviously the ideal thing would be to calculate WP per minute per player per match for say a day, but the amount of data we'd need to crunch to do that was judged to be infeasible, and while all we really wanted to know was the top 10 WP/minute scores (which we would obviously validate against logs to check they weren't exploiting), we'd have to calculate the WP/minute for everyone to determine who those people were. We switched this feature on last week, with the values being 250 and 300 respectively. Pretty quickly we started seeing scattered feedback of players running into this "normally", so we started to dig into the metrics to try and see if we could tune this further. Thanks to some very astute data mining by one of our programmers, we managed to isolate the highest WP/minute scores by looking for incidences of players having their scores reduced by the cap, thus shortcutting the problem of having to analyze the entire playerbase to find these high-peaking players. What we're seeing in these data, somewhat unsurprisingly, is that it's possible to really spike your WP payouts and trip the cap in certain circumstances. For example, dropping a Precision Strike on a squad objective and killing what looks like five infantry and two full HAVs gets you a large number of points, which can swing you up considerably past 300/minute net if it happens relatively early in the battle, and the follow-up strikes you're getting from that flood of WP hardly help the matter over the course of the battle. Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing. I'm not sure yet exactly when this change will go out as I'm still tying off...

General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11331	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:30:00 - [126] - Quote approved Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 51	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:31:00 - [127] - Quote OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced"

Klash 816 Sanguis Defense Syndicate 61	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:40:00 - [128] - Quote Damn it I'm finally able to go 26-0 consistently and then you go and make changes like these. I don't use the AR, haven't I been nerfed enough? *~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~* With Blood and Iron We Klash-
Shattered Mirage D.A.R.K Academy D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 341	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:53:00 - [129] - Quote Lv2spd2 wrote: Hmm... nerfing WPs for kills? That is like the ONLY thing I haven't seen nerf calls for on the forum. Someone is trolling. CCP I salute you! This!
General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11332	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:01:00 - [130] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" I am not op enough Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos

Sleepy Zan 2653	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:03:00 - [131] - Quote HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA A good sniper doesn't provide battlefield intelligence, a good sniper leaves no intelligence left on the battlefield
Meeko Fent expert intervention Caldari State 1337	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:15:00 - [132] - Quote I can't see anything wrong with have a soft WP per minute cap. Helps prevent OB spam, helps make massacres a useless becoming, and it pisses off pub stompers. The three things that make a game mechanic good in my book. Meeko's Novelty Shop Opening Soon! We (will)sell all the novelty items you desire! Really!
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:17:00 - [133] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" so what if he was in top 5 , its not fair to cap someones points if they are just haveing a good run. thats just bullshit!!! i hit this capping thing about 5 times last weekend, and i didnt know whats going on, i just thought it was glitching out. all i was doing was play the game and i get slapped in the face, GREAT STUFF CCP, LOVE GETTING PUNISHED FOR PLAY GOOD, THANKS not cool at all
DeathwindRising Rogue Spades EoN. 113	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:18:00 - [134] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: Great now we wont make any profit as a logi. first you cap our rep tool and now you make it that we get less points over time. Real logis are getting punished because of worthless stat padders.....again your rep tools will be getting a buff in 1.6
ratamaq doc 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 119	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:43:00 - [135] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away.
crazy space 1 Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic 1944	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:59:00 - [136] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" Hey can you at least reduce the sp and isk gain over time in battle by 50% and double the sp we get from Warpoints? Quote: Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. wait... so... you don't mind if I go look it up and use it? sweet free sp here I come, thanks CCP, great mindset
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:00:00 - [137] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. how i miss that! i aim to get 2500wp a game, if i get under 2000wp i feel i failed, in a good game i will get enywhere from 1500wp-- 4000wp straight up i am only like 490 in the WP leaderboard, there is alot of better players out there than me i know that coz i still get stomped sometimes i got 5100wp in a game once, it was legitimate az to, no farming just playing
Parson Atreides Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 840	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:07:00 - [138] - Quote It's too easy to jump in a tank with two other squad mates, then have the squad leader (who isn't in the tank) throw the defend order on it. Just one tank kill would net you: 50 (kill) + 10 (defend order) + 10 (kill commission) 35 (vehicle kill assist - Player 1) + 7 (defend order) + 7 (vehicle kill assist commission - Player 1) 35 (vehicle kill assist - Player 2) + 7 (defend order) + 7 (vehicle kill assist - Player 2) That's 168 WP for one kill where only one person is really doing anything. The above example doesn't even count times where a gunner actually hits the target first and gets an addition 25 (regular kill assist) + 5 (defend order) + 5 (squad commission), bringing the total to 203 (why they get a kill assist and a vehicle assist is beyond me). Over 200 WP for one kill. Then add into the mix the fact that you can call down a strike and immediately hop into a tank, netting all the kills, plus the vehicle kill assists for everyone in the tank itself. The numbers quickly add up to ridiculous amounts for the amount of work actually being done. It would be nice if you guys could look at these numbers when rebalancing vehicles. The most blatant error is the one where you get 35 points for a vehicle assist without ever having to fire a shot yet only 25 for actually hitting the person and then you get awarded both sets of WP. How does that work? The unexamined life is not worth living. RNDclan.com

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 53	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:07:00 - [139] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers.

Rusty Shallows Black Jackals 444	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:08:00 - [140] - Quote Eltra Ardell wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: I honestly don't mind this. People who are running around getting tons of kills in a small amount of time are being balanced with the people who aren't super hardcore. This also prevents players from earning tons of points from orbitals in order to earn more orbitals. But if there's a different way to fix this (such as the way people have suggested above me), I'd rather it be solved that way. People should never be punished for being good at the game. People should never be rewarded for being bad at the game. They aren't. Unless you count everyone who quits the game as "bad" since they are offered AUR suits to lure them back. It's no secret that the entire War Point system has problems. The only elements that work well is its use for bonus reward SP and capped SP. "She may not be Miss Right but she'll do right now," Thank you SR-71


CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 54	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:10:00 - [141] - Quote crazy space 1 wrote: Quote: Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. wait... so... you don't mind if I go look it up and use it? sweet free sp here I come, thanks CCP, great mindset The Lofty scam? Sure, you can try I'm pretty sure I fixed it for good in 2008, though, so let me know if you manage to get it to work!

General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11337	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:23:00 - [142] - Quote I got it to work. Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos
ratamaq doc 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 119	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:29:00 - [143] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers. Yea,, oops, I should've done some math before I jumped to conclusions. 400 wp per minute i've never come close to hitting in a 12 minute game
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:51:00 - [144] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: [quote=ratamaq doc][quote=CCP Greyscale] Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers. still mite hit it, whats the point of playing skirmish and domination if you are capping WP WarPoints is the thing that makes players put in work on the battlefield WarPoints are the driveing thing in this game
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 876	Posted - 2013.10.30 07:29:00 - [145] - Quote Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 59	Posted - 2013.10.30 07:32:00 - [146] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally.

DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2342	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:05:00 - [147] - Quote I've never had a post with this much dev responses :D I wish you guys did this every time :P GûêGûêGûôGûÆGûæGûæGôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢GûæGûæGûÆGûôGûêGûêGûê ¸¸.GÇó¨GÇóGÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà¸¸.GÇó¨GÇó Gùó GùúForum Warrior LV. 2GùÑ Gùñ
General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11377	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:21:00 - [148] - Quote Dust 514's #1 Forum Warrior Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 327	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:46:00 - [149] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 60	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:54:00 - [150] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ.


Calroon DeVil Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 148	Posted - 2013.10.30 10:18:00 - [151] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: SirManBoy wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ. Amazing how stupid your bandaid fixes keep coming along. Maybe, just maybe - you should take a look at the equipment instead.
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 88	Posted - 2013.10.30 10:30:00 - [152] - Quote Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match.
Mregomies The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 93	Posted - 2013.10.30 10:50:00 - [153] - Quote Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. I deleted my spam fits also and use now only scanner/hive/DL or scanner/hive/rep fits. Spamming is fast way to gain WP but boring and game start to lag... Now I have more fun running around with my squad and do (real)logi stuff and still I get 1500-2500 WP. And if solo... MLT scout + DL in ambush = profit
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 88	Posted - 2013.10.30 11:08:00 - [154] - Quote DeathwindRising wrote: Soldiersaint wrote: Great now we wont make any profit as a logi. first you cap our rep tool and now you make it that we get less points over time. Real logis are getting punished because of worthless stat padders.....again your rep tools will be getting a buff in 1.6 Yes but we can't see who to use them on, so it was pointless to do this buff first rather than fix the view of player names and health bars
Mortedeamor WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL The Ascendancy 554	Posted - 2013.10.30 11:31:00 - [155] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. yeah well its effecting loading of other stuff...why couldnt u just hot fix the press o button to respawn to down and out you...make people who want to be revived wait in the call for help screen...yall take a small issue and slap some absurd fix thats ruining the only enjoyable aspects of dust common.... WE GAVE YOU SIMPLE FIXES IN FEEDBACK TO THIS PROBLEM and again ccp shows that they do not listen and try and fix it on their own only to the dismay of the entire community thanks again...if a drop ship is stupid enough to call and load up right next to me and i kill it with av nades..and its fully loaded..i should ******* get my wp
Vin Mora Sanguis Defense Syndicate 169	Posted - 2013.10.30 12:11:00 - [156] - Quote Calroon DeVil wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: SirManBoy wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ. Amazing how stupid your bandaid fixes keep coming along. Maybe, just maybe - you should take a look at the equipment instead. So the DEV is stupid for outright telling you that we are very unlikely to legitimately hit the soft cap? I just had a game last night where my three man squad earned 3 OBs; and I, the squad leader and logi, earned 4200+ points across the entire match, and I never once hit the soft cap. Those 3 OBs netted me 25 kills and an unknown amount of equipment destruction points. Just because you might hit the cap doesn't mean that you will. Sanguis Defense Syndicate: Recruitment now open for players of all skill levels
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 876	Posted - 2013.10.30 12:30:00 - [157] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. Sounds like logi warpoint rewards is broken then...
ColdBlooded Max Dem Durrty Boyz Public Disorder. 18	Posted - 2013.10.30 12:31:00 - [158] - Quote This is making me hate being a logi i hate reping ppl and not getting pts to mini ppl spawning on my uplinks at the same time or to mini ppl on my hives i can get alot of kills but i can keep my team going and i don't just spam all this in one spot like a lot of ppl do i try to put my stuff all over the map
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL The Ascendancy 303	Posted - 2013.10.30 12:55:00 - [159] - Quote Thanks Greyscale, for explaining the rationale and math behind the warpoint limiter. The only thing I don't like is that the ceiling is scaled per minute from the very beginning of the match. In ambushes specifically, sometimes you spawn in within 50 meters of the reds, so you might end up scoring kills that are subsequently penalized within less than a minute of the start of the battle. Maybe you should build incrementally from another fixed WP value other than zero - say 500 WP limit right at the beginning, then 400 WP per minute after that?
Shotty GoBang Pro Hic Immortalis 1848	Posted - 2013.10.30 12:56:00 - [160] - Quote Sana Rayya wrote: Thanks Greyscale, for explaining the rationale and math behind the warpoint limiter. The only thing I don't like is that the ceiling is scaled per minute from the very beginning of the match. In ambushes specifically, sometimes you spawn in within 50 meters of the reds, so you might end up scoring kills that are subsequently penalized within less than a minute of the start of the battle. Maybe you should build incrementally from another fixed WP value other than zero - say 500 WP limit right at the beginning, then 400 WP per minute after that? Perhaps we'd be better served by tweaking the initial spawn system in Ambush. Then again, it is called "Ambush" ... so maybe its intentional ... lol

Kigurosaka Laaksonen DUST University Ivy League 31	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:00:00 - [161] - Quote Maybe the WP system is flawed to begin with. ISK is king in Eve and Dust, and SP takes a more important role in Dust than Eve because of the active SP gain component. The whole system of WP gain dictating ISK and SP gain should be reworked.
Sana Rayya WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL The Ascendancy 303	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:02:00 - [162] - Quote Shotty GoBang wrote: Perhaps we'd be better served by tweaking the initial spawn system in Ambush. Then again, it is called "Ambush" ... so maybe its intentional ... lol I'd settle for that too :) But they fixed it slightly; usually you don't get spawned alone within a mass of reds anymore; your mass of blues just gets spawned adjacent to a mass of reds, making for some fun times. Regardless, there are ways of earning WP outside of kills right at the beginning of a match (i.e. if your entire team coordinates to spawn on your DU instead of random spawning) so my point still stands.
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 329	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:08:00 - [163] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: SirManBoy wrote: Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. Sounds like logi warpoint rewards is broken then... You are out of your mind. My uplinks and hives win matches, playa'. Logis deserve every single WP that we receive because we elevate our entire team. You might be a killer but I am a war machine--the very infrastructure that leads a team to victory.
iTbagyou Red Star. EoN. 92	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:09:00 - [164] - Quote I dont get capping equipment either. If im in a dom and am the only one running links. Ob kills half my team, im being punished for dropping a spawn point.
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 876	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:12:00 - [165] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: You are out of your mind. My uplinks and hives win matches, playa'. Logis deserve every single WP that we receive because we elevate our entire team. You might be a killer but I am a war machine--the very infrastructure that leads a team to victory. "Deserves" Kinda like how CEO's deserve so much more money because they are the ones running the company? That sounds like an excellent way to balance playstyles.
Vin Mora Sanguis Defense Syndicate 170	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:14:00 - [166] - Quote iTbagyou wrote: I dont get capping equipment either. If im in a dom and am the only one running links. Ob kills half my team, im being punished for dropping a spawn point. As long as you are getting some points you aren't being punished. Sanguis Defense Syndicate: Recruitment now open for players of all skill levels
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 329	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:14:00 - [167] - Quote Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. CCP Logibro made a retraction because much of the logi community went bonkers in response to his bug report. Mass deployment of uplinks and hives is not an exploit, it's legit logi play. Players wouldn't keep sucking up ammo, receiving triage, and spawning from uplinks if it weren't a legit support capability.
Brush Master HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 941	Posted - 2013.10.30 13:42:00 - [168] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" I am fine as long as this does not effect normal gameplay but when you say it clear that it is happening, are you giving the player any feedback when it is happening? This goes back to the reduced WP gain on rep tools. It looks like a bug because no feedback is given, just reduced number. How about some red letters or something beside the WP to let them know that WP is reduced that way we know that is not a bug or can clearly see this is happening. Also, as others have said, this is the wrong way to implement something, you just did it and then asked for feedback, this is backwards and now we wait 1-2 weeks for a fix. These kinds of code pushes are what cause your player base to get mad and leave. GÇá Havok Core - Closed Beta Corp - Accepting Applications Here GÇá CEO // [email protected]
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 90	Posted - 2013.10.30 14:00:00 - [169] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. CCP Logibro made a retraction because much of the logi community went bonkers in response to his bug report. Mass deployment of uplinks and hives is not an exploit, it's legit logi play. Players wouldn't keep sucking up ammo, receiving triage, and spawning from uplinks if it weren't a legit support capability. Just caught up on that post, wow loads of pages, just skimread it tbh I now completely understand why you have written what you have In that post you openly admit to dropping 13 uplinks and then switching to drop 13 nanohives There wasn't a full official retraction by logibro and yes they have been working on ways to stop players such as yourself in abusing this poorly designed system. I am very aware you dont agree that you are abusing it. But thanks to you and the players like you, I reckon thats why this blanket system is in place and sod it, i NOW agree with it. I do not agree that you should spam uplinks / hives there should be a reasonable limit, you do not need to be a rocket scientist to see that it's not right. Here's hoping it hits you and the other what 4-5 people in that thread max, really hard and you start playing the game where the suit has what you want and need on it as opposed to specifically designing setups that just drop crap on the floor, to eventually change to a reasonably fitted suit edit: and i believe that they will further standardise to the norm, equipment. Oh yeh sorry you will call that nerfing if you cant get points from 26 pieces of equipment on the field
Nightbird Aeon Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 351	Posted - 2013.10.30 14:14:00 - [170] - Quote Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. Whoa there.... easy with the accusations. I have one Uplink logi suit, with two proto uplinks (3 active simultaneously on each) and a X3 nanohive. I have one Nano logi suit... with a Proto Triage, a Proto Ammo, and a K2 Nanohive. So, at most, I can put down 6 uplinks and 9 nanohives (if my math is correct)..... I do not swap suits for a suit with the same modules and drop multiple of the same item type (which I believe is the exploit to which you are referring). Please get your facts straight before making accusations.

Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3556	Posted - 2013.10.30 14:16:00 - [171] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: As a side-effect of the above, the system is more likely to start clipping scores if you score large amounts of WP in the first minute or two; this isn't optimal, but in the course of a normal battle (ie starting from the beginning rather than joining midway through) there's little opportunity to get big scores in your first minute or so, which should significantly reduce the impact of this factor. [/list] I can see this affecting PC in a big way as one of the primary concerns at the start of the match, apart from capturing objectives, is the removal of unnecessary (all) installations. That's usually accomplished by a single tanker on each side and being as the reward for doing so is 100 WP, you can imagine how quickly that task is accomplished. It's also kinda easy to accomplish for a Dropship pilot transporting an entire squad to a certain location and getting up there in Transport Assists. But, I understand why it's necessary and it's not that big of a deal, really. Just felt it needed mentioning. CCP Greyscale wrote: Thanks to some very astute data mining by one of our programmers, we managed to isolate the highest WP/minute scores by looking for incidences of players having their scores reduced by the cap, thus shortcutting the problem of having to analyze the entire playerbase to find these high-peaking players. Cool if we get their dev name so we show our gratitude? Or at the very least, pass it on for us? CCP Greyscale wrote: What we're seeing in these data, somewhat unsurprisingly, is that it's possible to really spike your WP payouts and trip the cap in certain circumstances. For example, dropping a Precision Strike on a squad objective and killing what looks like five infantry and two full HAVs gets you a large number of points, which can swing you up considerably past 300/minute net if it happens relatively early in the battle, and the follow-up strikes you're getting from that flood of WP hardly help the matter over the course of the battle. Best way that we've found to accomplish a high WP spike from a Precision/Tactical Strike is to set a defend order on a tank, have it full up with gunners and the like. The driver gets in just after dropping the orbital and everyone benefits. The final key point to this is having someone on the ground use an active scanner. - Squad Lead gets kills - Gunners get assists - Gunners get 'defend' order bonus - Squadie nearby uses an Active Scanner, getting intel assists at an increased rate from being nearby. - Squad Lead gets commission from all of the above. That'll send your WP through the roof. Another alternative is, if a tank isn't available and you're pressed for time, the application of a Repair Tool generates Guardian Points which also work off of the 'defend order' synergy mentioned before, so the Player gets higher points and as a direct result the Squad Lead gets more commission points. I've strongly encouraged -not- using this among my guys because it kinda seems like cheating the system to me but it's so circumstantial it's hard to manage a lot of time, so it doesn't bother me that much. ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Aeon Amadi A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. 3556	Posted - 2013.10.30 14:18:00 - [172] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Flashbacks of dealing with Crimewatch, Greyscale? ANON Diplomat // 3rd Place Winner of the Eight Thousand Suns Fiction Contest
Orclev Nori RisingSuns Public Disorder. 0	Posted - 2013.10.30 14:47:00 - [173] - Quote Nightbird Aeon wrote: Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. Whoa there.... easy with the accusations. I have one Uplink logi suit, with two proto uplinks (3 active simultaneously on each) and a X3 nanohive. I have one Nano logi suit... with a Proto Triage, a Proto Ammo, and a K2 Nanohive. So, at most, I can put down 6 uplinks and 9 nanohives (if my math is correct)..... I do not swap suits for a suit with the same modules and drop multiple of the same item type (which I believe is the exploit to which you are referring). Please get your facts straight before making accusations. Not to mention that this only works really well if all of the other blueberries are running around with free militia fits. Uplink spam doesn't as pay well if two or three other people are uplinking too. More uplinks = more options = more WP distribution. It's not that logibro's make mad points because they are breaking the game, they just have an unintentional monopoly because nobody else can be bothered to do it.
Dust Junky 4Life Shitstorm Inc 107	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:00:00 - [174] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. WTF is wrong with you people? Now you want to CHEAT ME out of my hard earned points? Your no better then the cheaters. This is UNACCEPTABLE. You could have given revived mercs a 3 second window to run to safety. I don't even kill people and I get nerfed. Then you wonder why so many are leaving? It's all good though. Destiny will be out soon. Hover bikes and fighter jets. CCP is just like a women. Flashes the goods but NEVER puts out. I'm tired of waiting. A shitstorm is coming.......
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 329	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:06:00 - [175] - Quote Mirataf wrote: SirManBoy wrote: Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. CCP Logibro made a retraction because much of the logi community went bonkers in response to his bug report. Mass deployment of uplinks and hives is not an exploit, it's legit logi play. Players wouldn't keep sucking up ammo, receiving triage, and spawning from uplinks if it weren't a legit support capability. Just caught up on that post, wow loads of pages, just skimread it tbh I now completely understand why you have written what you have In that post you openly admit to dropping 13 uplinks and then switching to drop 13 nanohives There wasn't a full official retraction by logibro and yes they have been working on ways to stop players such as yourself in abusing this poorly designed system. I am very aware you dont agree that you are abusing it. But thanks to you and the players like you, I reckon thats why this blanket system is in place and sod it, i NOW agree with it. I do not agree that you should spam uplinks / hives there should be a reasonable limit, you do not need to be a rocket scientist to see that it's not right. Here's hoping it hits you and the other what 4-5 people in that thread max, really hard and you start playing the game where the suit has what you want and need on it as opposed to specifically designing setups that just drop crap on the floor, to eventually change to a reasonably fitted suit edit: and i believe that they will further standardise to the norm, equipment. Oh yeh sorry you will call that nerfing if you cant get points from 26 pieces of equipment on the field So I guess you're the play style police then, ah? I'm sorry that your vanilla style of play doesn't help your team like mine does, bro. Most of all, I'm sorry that you're the type of person who lacks creativity and wants it removed from the game. Dust 514 should remain a sandbox that encourages players to determine for themselves how they can help their team win. It's one of the things that makes it a beautifully unique gaming experience.
JerechD Diaboli Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 29	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:09:00 - [176] - Quote Got interested in this and went for a quick round of Skirmish. First half only fooling around and getting a kill here and there. No changes to kill WP. Then the rest of the round tried to actually kill people. At the end of the 11 killstreak there were no changes to kill WP. So I gues you really have to farm-proto-stomp-OB-spam to get the reduction. TL;DR Killing machines are punished, casuals (like me) are unaffected. Edit: here's the match stats. http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h310/AdvocatDiaboli/TriplePonies003.jpg
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 90	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:10:00 - [177] - Quote Nightbird Aeon wrote: Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. Whoa there.... easy with the accusations. I have one Uplink logi suit, with two proto uplinks (3 active simultaneously on each) and a X3 nanohive. I have one Nano logi suit... with a Proto Triage, a Proto Ammo, and a K2 Nanohive. So, at most, I can put down 6 uplinks and 9 nanohives (if my math is correct)..... I do not swap suits for a suit with the same modules and drop multiple of the same item type (which I believe is the exploit to which you are referring). Please get your facts straight before making accusations. Heya,i was going to apologise but then you did confirm my fears. Thank you for confirming that you are farming from 15 pieces of equipment on the field simultaneously before swapping out to a suit you are actually going to use.
Sigberct Amni Goonfeet Top Men. 162	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:41:00 - [178] - Quote Hahaha, oh wow. This really happened because of "stat padding"? Hahahahahhaahahaha! Where's a good :ccp: emoticon when you need it? I guess preventing point farming will matter when this game matters to eve in December '16. ~MEANWHILE~ Has trapping someone in an endless cycle of needle revives/deaths causing them to restart their PS3 to escape been fixed? No? Brilliant! :ccp:
Dust Junky 4Life Shitstorm Inc 107	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:43:00 - [179] - Quote Whats REALLY funny is most of you are to stupid to understand simple math. STAY IN SCHOOL! +25 wp for each spawn X 100 spawns is 2500wp Now, do you REALLY think one merc can get 100 spawns on all of his/her links? Not even close. 50 spawns is a reasonable # on 5 second links. There are several logis in every match. We all compete against each other for the WP. Some links are in better locations then others. There are battles I dont get any spawns due to bad match making. Just because I have 0 kills with 40000 wp at the end of the match does not mean it all came from drop uplinks. Im the fker blowing up tanks,ships,lavs,turrets, equipment ect. A shitstorm is coming.......
Dust Junky 4Life Shitstorm Inc 107	Posted - 2013.10.30 15:45:00 - [180] - Quote Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: Mirataf wrote: Nightbird Aeon wrote: I was wondering about this: So I am running a Domination.... the one where "A" is in the city/complex, where there is a supply depot underground in a room just down a short hallway from A. So I am running logi, and drop multiple uplinks in the room with supply depot, and two uplinks in the silo where the "A"objective is. I then go swap out to my Nanohive logi suit, and drop some nanohives, both the ammo ones and the triage ones, at varous stations near to where the combat is going to be. I then swap out to my combat suit with hand-scanner and start shooting people in the face. I appear to be the only one with uplinks out, as I am getting a spawn WP notification ever few seconds. I also am getting ammo notifications, along with triage (25 and 50 point) notifications, and I'm also getting the odd kill. But I notice that some of my spawns generate 22 WP instead of 25.... that my rep notifications give me 8 WP instead of 10... and then I just killed a person for 47 WP. Now I get that we need to avoid exploits where people are farming WP.... but my understanding is that by deploying uplinks, nanohives and then scanning/shooting people, I am playing the game as intended. Is there a way to limit the ability to cheat and exploit the WP system without reducing the legitimate WP gained through as-designed gameplay? Lol, had to stop reading and comment. The irony is strong. Yes what you are doing is designed gameplay, but it is a known exploit and confirmed by CCP logibro if memory serves. You are not supposed to be able to have a spam uplink suit, spam nano suit. You are spamming and farming wp. There is no skill attributed to farming in this manner, all you contribute is lag They are going to sort out the multiple variant same module suit spammage, probably 2 years from now granted. Untill then why don't you grow a pair and be a proper logibro, delete those suits or use them in PC only ( tbh it's unfortunately expected) or will we get the usual " but mum they did it" mentality I would sign a position to remove wp entirely from 3rd active equipment of same type. Oh and BTW I do logi and practice what i preach. You never have and never will see me doing what you and your respective monkeys do. You are nothing but a piece of macro code in the beginning of the match. Whoa there.... easy with the accusations. I have one Uplink logi suit, with two proto uplinks (3 active simultaneously on each) and a X3 nanohive. I have one Nano logi suit... with a Proto Triage, a Proto Ammo, and a K2 Nanohive. So, at most, I can put down 6 uplinks and 9 nanohives (if my math is correct)..... I do not swap suits for a suit with the same modules and drop multiple of the same item type (which I believe is the exploit to which you are referring). Please get your facts straight before making accusations. Heya,i was going to apologise but then you did confirm my fears. Thank you for confirming that you are farming from 15 pieces of equipment on the field simultaneously before swapping out to a suit you are actually going to use. Swap? FK that, it takes to long. I just suicide out. Time is money you know. A shitstorm is coming.......

Severus Smith Caldari State 399	Posted - 2013.10.30 16:04:00 - [181] - Quote Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: Maybe the WP system is flawed to begin with. ISK is king in Eve and Dust, and SP takes a more important role in Dust than Eve because of the active SP gain component. The whole system of WP gain dictating ISK and SP gain should be reworked. I agree wholeheartedly. WP are way too important. More important than ISK (which shouldn't be the case). I wish we could get rid of WP. They just make people do stupid things like red line snipe, equipment spam, exploit, etc to farm WP. Decouple WP from SP / ISK / Orbitals and make ISK / SP based on Victory / Defeat and ISK destroyed. Then people would work together to win matches and take out opponents, rather than sit outside the match exploiting to gain WP. War Points just make no sense to me; especially in FW / PC. Why would the Amarr care how many people you killed, or how many times someone used your uplink, if you lost them the District? They have killed decorated Admirals who won their battles for less! All war points do is cripple strategy. Because no one is going to do something strategic and helpful if it nets them no WP. Make ISK important again and neuter WP.
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 7362	Posted - 2013.10.30 16:16:00 - [182] - Quote Greyscale and others, I just want to thank you for a potentially brilliant solution to not just one, but many current and future problems. Once the numbers are hammered out, the % of players being adversely effected by this will be nothing compared to the % of players that will be deterred from doing stupid shenanigans in our matches. Excellent change, keep up the good work and the great feedback. YouTube / Twitch (pâÄa¦át¢èa¦á)pâÄs+íGö+GöüGö+
ratamaq doc 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 119	Posted - 2013.10.30 19:37:00 - [183] - Quote Severus Smith wrote: Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: Maybe the WP system is flawed to begin with. ISK is king in Eve and Dust, and SP takes a more important role in Dust than Eve because of the active SP gain component. The whole system of WP gain dictating ISK and SP gain should be reworked. I agree wholeheartedly. WP are way too important. More important than ISK (which shouldn't be the case). I wish we could get rid of WP. They just make people do stupid things like red line snipe, equipment spam, exploit, etc to farm WP. Decouple WP from SP / ISK / Orbitals and make ISK / SP based on Victory / Defeat and ISK destroyed. Then people would work together to win matches and take out opponents, rather than sit outside the match exploiting to gain WP. War Points just make no sense to me; especially in FW / PC. Why would the Amarr care how many people you killed, or how many times someone used your uplink, if you lost them the District? They have killed decorated Admirals who won their battles for less! All war points do is cripple strategy. Because no one is going to do something strategic and helpful if it nets them no WP. Make ISK important again and neuter WP. So in your scenario, how do you reward support players who do not kill?
Reign Omega 843 Boot Camp 48	Posted - 2013.10.30 20:14:00 - [184] - Quote Stopped reading about page 6 or 7 so I don't know if this attempt at a fix has been suggested, last night was my first night back after awhile and I did notice the WP changes. This character has 12.2 mil SP and I am Omni across the board. Core skills at 5, AR, SR and Swarm at 5 with pretty much everything else at 3 give or take. I noticed the WP hit a few times myself but I thought I may have been tripping, or just NOT doing what I thought I was doing. I went Omni because I tend to get bored easily and like to be effective in as many scenarios as possible. So when I'm not playing pug in pubs and am actually trying to play..I do quite a bit of different things during a match. From Logi duties, and switching back to assault or AV as need be. If the main problem is revive farming, perhaps a cap on how many times a player can receive points for reviving the same player in a set period of time would be a better short term solution? However, I also agree that OB WP farming can be a hassle with the right squad doing the right thing at the right time during an OB they can well be on their way to another OB shortly...even though thats honestly just a reward for good teamwork. Summary: I don't play often, but when I do play I play many roles. I am a casual player, and even I noticed the cap, so what does that mean for hardcore players? Perhaps a better solution is to limit how many times 1 player can gain WP from the same teammate in a set period of time.
Lycuo Ancient Exiles 185	Posted - 2013.10.30 21:19:00 - [185] - Quote This is stupid... plain and simple because the game cant distinguish between a great spree of kills and someone setting up a couple kills in a row... So why do those players who get these amazing spree of kills get penalized because the game cant distinguish between the two and therefor i and many others get fewer warpoints and therefor less orbitals... and skillpoints... and isk payout... STUPID
Luk Manag of Terror TRE GAFFEL 142	Posted - 2013.10.30 22:03:00 - [186] - Quote You could make an exception flag for specific types of non-exploitable death dealing - like vehicle, remote explosive, or precision strike related multi-kills.
Celus Ivara DUST University Ivy League 122	Posted - 2013.10.30 22:49:00 - [187] - Quote Note: Relevant parts Bolded and Underlined. CCP Greyscale wrote: The design we ended up with is fairly straightforward: We set two constants in our data: WP/minute ceiling and WP/minute limit Each player has a WP ceiling and a WP limit for each match These start at 0, and are incremented every second. This gives you two numbers that rise linearly over the course of the match If, any time you gain WP, your total WP score for the match would be above your current WP ceiling, we reduce the value of that WP payout proportional to how far between your current ceiling and your current limit it would take your score This has the following consequences: So long as your WP total stays below the WP ceiling, you will never see this system As your WP total moves above the ceiling, we trim your WP payout in a way that starts gentle but gets firmer as your WP/minute gets higher We can mathematically guarantee that you can never score more WP per minute than the limit value over the course of the match, so this system should be 100% exploit-proof and never need to be adjusted again Because we are tracking a moving ceiling over the course of the battle, rather than say tracking your income over the last minute or the last X WP scores or whatever, once you get past the first few minutes in-match your WP income can be very uneven and still not trigger the cap so long as your average over the course of the battle stays below the limit As a side-effect of the above, the system is more likely to start clipping scores if you score large amounts of WP in the first minute or two; this isn't optimal, but in the course of a normal battle (ie starting from the beginning rather than joining midway through) there's little opportunity to get big scores in your first minute or so, which should significantly reduce the impact of this factor. CCP Greyscale wrote: ratamaq doc wrote: Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers. CCP Greyscale wrote: SirManBoy wrote: Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ. Yo, one programmer to another, instead of starting at 0 and incrementing from there, why don't you start from some buffer number, say 750, and add on from there? That should ease the issue with clipping legit early match WP spikes.
Telleth Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 167	Posted - 2013.10.30 23:03:00 - [188] - Quote So, like others, I had to stop after the first 6 pages of very similar responses, so sorry if I'm repeating something. What does it mean when the devs go "anyone making more WP per minute than this must be cheating" and then a lot of the players hit that cap fairly often. I think that this relates to the 'time-to-kill' (TTK) issue that some (me included) believe there is. I think CCP may not realize just how nasty the armor mods, complex dmg mods, duvolle, and prof 5 is at melting suits. It may seem rediculous, but it happened to CCP Iceland with EVE in its early days, m0o was able to tank concord and gate turrets using the then hardly used shield/armor hardeners, if you build it, someone somewhere will use it in some unanticipated way to break it. I don't think the internal testing matches a standard pub match or a laggy PC battle. I think a combination of SMALL tweaks of increasing EHP, reducing overall damage, and upping the WP limit will fix this particular incident as well as a few other odds and ends, but long term, CCP may want to look at improving their internal testing and how they estimate the effects of a patch.
CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP 117	Posted - 2013.10.30 23:42:00 - [189] - Quote Severus Smith wrote: Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote: Maybe the WP system is flawed to begin with. ISK is king in Eve and Dust, and SP takes a more important role in Dust than Eve because of the active SP gain component. The whole system of WP gain dictating ISK and SP gain should be reworked. I agree wholeheartedly. WP are way too important. More important than ISK (which shouldn't be the case). I wish we could get rid of WP. They just make people do stupid things like red line snipe, equipment spam, exploit, etc to farm WP. Decouple WP from SP / ISK / Orbitals and make ISK / SP based on Victory / Defeat and ISK destroyed. Then people would work together to win matches and take out opponents, rather than sit outside the match exploiting to gain WP. War Points just make no sense to me; especially in FW / PC. Why would the Amarr care how many people you killed, or how many times someone used your uplink, if you lost them the District? They have killed decorated Admirals who won their battles for less! All war points do is cripple strategy. Because no one is going to do something strategic and helpful if it nets them no WP. Make ISK important again and neuter WP. Yeah but FPS and COD kids. No insta prize = no one will play DUST514 Love The Dream Hate The Product (>GÇ+Gùá)G£î
CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP 117	Posted - 2013.10.31 00:01:00 - [190] - Quote I can understand that you (CCP) want to fix and prevent exploits but why must the good guys suffer? You want to fix cheating and exploiting, how bout you delete and ban the cheaters and exploiters. You said that you can tell who is cheating and exploiting so how bout delete ban them? DUST514 Love The Dream Hate The Product (>GÇ+Gùá)G£î

Bethhy Ancient Exiles 246	Posted - 2013.10.31 00:41:00 - [191] - Quote Wow this is still going on? looks like another day I won't waste logging onto DUST to promote active numbers on where they actively screw me over for playing to good. This sort of thing really make us utterly frustrated... It's more of the same... All we get is the same ****** effort to fix very real problems... This was the LAST thing that should of got this sort of attention.. Seriously do you guys just buy drug's with the Aurum purchases we make? then get high all day? because this is on a whole nother level of lazy. Why don't you just use the Aurum we buy to fly to each one of our houses and kick us square between the leg's... Pretty much same effect.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 78	Posted - 2013.10.31 02:43:00 - [192] - Quote Sana Rayya wrote: Thanks Greyscale, for explaining the rationale and math behind the warpoint limiter. The only thing I don't like is that the ceiling is scaled per minute from the very beginning of the match. In ambushes specifically, sometimes you spawn in within 50 meters of the reds, so you might end up scoring kills that are subsequently penalized within less than a minute of the start of the battle. Maybe you should build incrementally from another fixed WP value other than zero - say 500 WP limit right at the beginning, then 400 WP per minute after that? Yeah, this is probably the next tweak in the line if we find it's still an issue after we raise the cap. Brush Master wrote: I am fine as long as this does not effect normal gameplay but when you say it clear that it is happening, are you giving the player any feedback when it is happening? This goes back to the reduced WP gain on rep tools. It looks like a bug because no feedback is given, just reduced number. How about some red letters or something beside the WP to let them know that WP is reduced that way we know that is not a bug or can clearly see this is happening. Also, as others have said, this is the wrong way to implement something, you just did it and then asked for feedback, this is backwards and now we wait 1-2 weeks for a fix. These kinds of code pushes are what cause your player base to get mad and leave. Clear as in we're actually showing you the reduced payout numbers, rather than doing something behind the scenes and not telling you at all. I agree that it could be clearer still, but if this is tuned properly (#1 priority right now) the only people seeing it should be people deliberately farming, and a) they should be able to put 2 and 2 together themselves and b) we don't want to spend any significant amount of effort making a better UI just for them Aeon Amadi wrote: Flashbacks of dealing with Crimewatch, Greyscale? I'd characterise it as "lessons learned" rather than "flashbacks" but yeah, that's informing this decision-making

Jack Kittinger DUST University Ivy League 56	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:24:00 - [193] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Brush Master wrote: this is backwards and now we wait 1-2 weeks for a fix. These kinds of code pushes are what cause your player base to get mad and leave. the only people seeing it should be people deliberately farming, and a) they should be able to put 2 and 2 together themselves... [edit] we don't discuss exploit fixes until we've shipped them...announced this early enough to get feedback, it'd have acted as an incentive for the farmers to knuckle down and get in a good few weeks of farming before we ship it. So OP and people who first posted complaining should now be regarded as farmers... This is backwards and stating so with a straight face doesn't make it right nor a good idea a few weeks? ppl have been doing so since chrome, why should a few weeks matter?? CCP, what do you think you're doing??
TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 4374	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:29:00 - [194] - Quote Jack Kittinger wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Brush Master wrote: this is backwards and now we wait 1-2 weeks for a fix. These kinds of code pushes are what cause your player base to get mad and leave. the only people seeing it should be people deliberately farming, and a) they should be able to put 2 and 2 together themselves... [edit] we don't discuss exploit fixes until we've shipped them...announced this early enough to get feedback, it'd have acted as an incentive for the farmers to knuckle down and get in a good few weeks of farming before we ship it. So OP and people who first posted complaining should now be regarded as farmers... This is backwards and stating so with a straight face doesn't make it right nor a good idea a few weeks? ppl have been doing so since chrome, why should a few weeks matter?? CCP, what do you think you're doing?? I like how this guy ignores everything stated in this thread and blames Oba- CCP for everything. They said that this is an initial fix. They then proceeded to say that they're going to be working on numbers so that the vast majority of players won't even know there's a cap. Relax, take a deep breath, and don't be so quick to whine. Never forget King of airborne swine.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 4824	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:33:00 - [195] - Quote Django Quik wrote: There must be a better fix for this instead of just applying a flat limiter? This stops people from getting awesome OBs and genuine kill streaks. It's not like we'll be needing the WPs for orbitals in the future anyways. Besides, Eve players will be the ones generating them for Dust players once FW and PC are revamped. CCP, please fix the Nova Knives. Thank you.
CharCharOdell 1420	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:47:00 - [196] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. I want you to know that this is absolutely pointless and it makes the game less fun. If you would rather have us camp in the MCC instead of play, we can go back to that, as now we would get the same amount of WP, anyhow. Gùñ-é-º+¼+ò+¦GÖÑ+ú+ú+¡ GÖÑ'Ðe+ü+üGùÑ Gùú -ä>-üð+++Ç++§<-¡<-¡ Gùó Speaker of the Mangrove / King of QQ / Co-Founder of the Learning Coalition
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 4824	Posted - 2013.10.31 03:54:00 - [197] - Quote CharCharOdell wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. I want you to know that this is absolutely pointless and it makes the game less fun. If you would rather have us camp in the MCC instead of play, we can go back to that, as now we would get the same amount of WP, anyhow. Did you bother reading the details he posted after that? It makes a lot of sense when you read more. CCP, please fix the Nova Knives. Thank you.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles 251	Posted - 2013.10.31 04:29:00 - [198] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: but if this is tuned properly (#1 priority right now) the only people seeing it should be people deliberately farming, and a) they should be able to put 2 and 2 together themselves and b) we don't want to spend any significant amount of effort making a better UI just for them just............. uh.............. ............. so drugs...
IMPAIRS YOUR ABILITY Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 225	Posted - 2013.10.31 05:48:00 - [199] - Quote With limits on weekly sp what does farming do other than effect kdr and wp stats? AFK or barely playing can generate isk like a faucet so what are you actually preventing ? Why is friendly fire not looked as a way to allow us to self regulate these issues?
m twiggz Eternal Beings 124	Posted - 2013.10.31 05:51:00 - [200] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: SirManBoy wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ. When will these new numbers come into effect? Will we be informed this time?

OwnD07 DUST CORE DARKSTAR ARMY 35	Posted - 2013.10.31 06:22:00 - [201] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" That's... okay yeah, that makes me feel a bit better. Hehe. Glad to hear that you're tweaking the values. And thanks for the quick feedback. Gÿ¦GÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÇéGÿ¦
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 2028	Posted - 2013.10.31 06:35:00 - [202] - Quote For the record, I feel like I should say that the CPM was told of this quite some time before deployment. We strongly cautioned them that it should never affect legit players, and there were a couple of us (Not all agreed) that this is not a good way to go about it. Not only did we get what felt like a patronizing pat on the head saying "Trust us, it will only affect the bad guys" but we tried to offer possible alternatives which were shrugged off. While yes, this was the most efficient -stopgap- solution until a more robust one can be implemented, it is not ideal. The ideal solution(s) once time allow are as follows : (1) Absolute limit on points for a single action. IE: If you have five guys in a squad scanning and one guy kills a scanned victim, only one scan assist is given to the squad leader and the scan points are divided among those who earned them, with a bonus to the base value to the total points to keep them from earning +1's. There is no endless stream of +X's with this method, as multiple people trying to 'get in on the action' becomes moot and more time actually playing is the incentive. To this end, having multiple logi repping the same dude in order to farm guardian points would be moot, but multiple logi repping multiple different dudes would still get them all points. It encourages people to spread the love and work more as a team, rather than just everyone rallying around the 1-2 guys they know will crush everything. (2) Re-assessment of squad bonus mechanics. (Will go into this later) (3) When it comes to revives, the entire system needs to be revamped. I'll write a bigger post on how this should work, but essentially there should be persistent "overkill" HP. For example, A person is "Incapacitated" after being brought to 0 armor. if someone has 100 overkill HP, you would have to do more than 100 damage past their armor to "Kill" them, and they would not be able to be revived. If killed and dealt 48 of that overkill HP, they could be revived and survive another 52 overkill damage before being fully "dead". Players' not "dead" and incapacitated should be clearly visible as such and easily finished off. Revives should only be happening if a teammate saves someone just after they go down by killing their killer or forcing them to flee. No one should be getting "Kill" or "Death" stats unless the victim is down for good. (4) Uplinks and Nanohives : Point accrual from these is mostly fine. The problem is people bypassing the "Max active" limit by using the same type of equipment but a different variant. This is unintended, and the only fix needed to stop "spam" is to fix this loophole.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 86	Posted - 2013.10.31 07:53:00 - [203] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: For the record, I feel like I should say that the CPM was told of this quite some time before deployment. We strongly cautioned them that it should never affect legit players, and there were a couple of us (Not all agreed) that this is not a good way to go about it. Not only did we get what felt like a patronizing pat on the head saying "Trust us, it will only affect the bad guys" but we tried to offer possible alternatives which were shrugged off. While yes, this was the most efficient -stopgap- solution until a more robust one can be implemented, it is not ideal. The ideal solution(s) once time allow are as follows : (1) Absolute limit on points for a single action. IE: If you have five guys in a squad scanning and one guy kills a scanned victim, only one scan assist is given to the squad leader and the scan points are divided among those who earned them, with a bonus to the base value to the total points to keep them from earning +1's. There is no endless stream of +X's with this method, as multiple people trying to 'get in on the action' becomes moot and more time actually playing is the incentive. To this end, having multiple logi repping the same dude in order to farm guardian points would be moot, but multiple logi repping multiple different dudes would still get them all points. It encourages people to spread the love and work more as a team, rather than just everyone rallying around the 1-2 guys they know will crush everything. (2) Re-assessment of squad bonus mechanics. (Will go into this later) (3) When it comes to revives, the entire system needs to be revamped. I'll write a bigger post on how this should work, but essentially there should be persistent "overkill" HP. For example, A person is "Incapacitated" after being brought to 0 armor. if someone has 100 overkill HP, you would have to do more than 100 damage past their armor to "Kill" them, and they would not be able to be revived. If killed and dealt 48 of that overkill HP, they could be revived and survive another 52 overkill damage before being fully "dead". Players' not "dead" and incapacitated should be clearly visible as such and easily finished off. Revives should only be happening if a teammate saves someone just after they go down by killing their killer or forcing them to flee. No one should be getting "Kill" or "Death" stats unless the victim is down for good. (4) Uplinks and Nanohives : Point accrual from these is mostly fine. The problem is people bypassing the "Max active" limit by using the same type of equipment but a different variant. This is unintended, and the only fix needed to stop "spam" is to fix this loophole. The general approach you're advocating here - addressing specific issues on a case-by-case basis - is, in my experience, not an efficient or effective way of dealing with exploits. If we identify specific cases where, in the course of normal play, we're handing out too many WP, we should and will alter the way payouts are awarded, as and when doing so becomes a priority, so that they're paying in a more balanced manner. This is a balancing concern, though. As far as exploits, farming and the like go, you attack the root not the leaves.

Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 3468	Posted - 2013.10.31 08:00:00 - [204] - Quote Considering how few of your active skill points come from warpoints (the vast majority come from simply participating), and also considering that in FW (and supposedly PC) you are only going to be able to call in a strike through EVE and these will not depend on warpoints, this situation hasn't really bothered me. Yeah it's not ideal, but not exactly what I'd call a priority issue either. Amarr faithful, join PIE Inc, the oldest EVE/Dust Amarr loyal corporation! Amarr Victor!
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 329	Posted - 2013.10.31 09:56:00 - [205] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: For the record, I feel like I should say that the CPM was told of this quite some time before deployment. We strongly cautioned them that it should never affect legit players, and there were a couple of us (Not all agreed) that this is not a good way to go about it. Not only did we get what felt like a patronizing pat on the head saying "Trust us, it will only affect the bad guys" but we tried to offer possible alternatives which were shrugged off. While yes, this was the most efficient -stopgap- solution until a more robust one can be implemented, it is not ideal. The ideal solution(s) once time allow are as follows : (1) Absolute limit on points for a single action. IE: If you have five guys in a squad scanning and one guy kills a scanned victim, only one scan assist is given to the squad leader and the scan points are divided among those who earned them, with a bonus to the base value to the total points to keep them from earning +1's. There is no endless stream of +X's with this method, as multiple people trying to 'get in on the action' becomes moot and more time actually playing is the incentive. To this end, having multiple logi repping the same dude in order to farm guardian points would be moot, but multiple logi repping multiple different dudes would still get them all points. It encourages people to spread the love and work more as a team, rather than just everyone rallying around the 1-2 guys they know will crush everything. ... (4) Uplinks and Nanohives : Point accrual from these is mostly fine. The problem is people bypassing the "Max active" limit by using the same type of equipment but a different variant. This is unintended, and the only fix needed to stop "spam" is to fix this loophole. No and no. Your fourth point is especially troubling because it's as if you aren't aware of the fact that the marketplace carries these variants for us to buy and use. Some of these variants are diverse (only ammo, only triage, a combo thereof) and some are statistically indistinguishable from one another (ie. multiple proto uplinks with exactly the same stats--spawn speed, number of spawns, etc.) and are only different in name. Why, then, would I purchase these variants, if I were capped on how many I could use overall? The max carry and deploy stat has clearly always been associated with each individual piece of equipment, not the equipment class. Your position is based on your own bias against aggressive logistics play and does not represent the reality associated how the equipment was designed and the many variants within a type that were designed. The current system encourages me to purchase and consume a variety of items because I benefit by doing so. You would have it so my demand for all these items would decrease as I'd now be choosing several variants only based on which brand name I prefer. It would no longer benefit me to purchase and consume a wide variety of equipment variants because you would limit my ability to utilize those variants at the same time. Lame. Please stop trying to be the playstyle police.
Nova Knife Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 2030	Posted - 2013.10.31 10:20:00 - [206] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: No and no. Your fourth point is especially troubling because it's as if you aren't aware of the fact that the marketplace carries these variants for us to buy and use. Some of these variants are diverse (only ammo, only triage, a combo thereof) and some are statistically indistinguishable from one another (ie. multiple proto uplinks with exactly the same stats--spawn speed, number of spawns, etc.) and are only different in name. Why, then, would I purchase these variants, if I were capped on how many I could use overall? The max carry and deploy stat has clearly always been associated with each individual piece of equipment, not the equipment class. Your position is based on your own bias against aggressive logistics play and does not represent the reality associated how the equipment was designed and the many variants within a type that were designed. The current system encourages me to purchase and consume a variety of items because I benefit by doing so. You would have it so my demand for all these items would decrease as I'd now be choosing several variants only based on which brand name I prefer. It would no longer benefit me to purchase and consume a wide variety of equipment variants because you would limit my ability to utilize those variants at the same time. Lame. Please stop trying to be the playstyle police. The purpose of the variants is to create flavor among players, to suit their needs and preferences. Not to cause an unholy amount of equipment spam. I spent a few minutes trying to track down a picture I've seen where someone took a screenshot of literally an entire objective's surrounding area was surrounded by friendly uplinks. Several dozen, all by different people using "Uplink suits". That is entirely unintended, and CCP has said as much. Equipment is supposed to be valuable, and carefully placed to help your team. Not simply be placed /everywhere/ by spam suits and then have the person swap to a 'slayer suit' when the spam is done. I'm not trying to be the playstyle police by any means. But I do take issue with people using mechanical loopholes that -do- result in framerate and performance issues. (Personally I don't mind the spam all that much from a gameplay standpoint because they feed me sweet delicious points when I blow all the equipment up, but there is no denying that it's just plain silly)
Funkmaster Whale Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1035	Posted - 2013.10.31 10:20:00 - [207] - Quote I've hit this so called "warpoint" limit so many times it's ridiculous. I'll usually scatter uplinks/hives around the map then go around killing, and SO MANY of my kills end up being "+0" after a while its ridiculous. Was this really the best solution you could come up with? You're saying you are attacking the root of the problem, but it seems like you decided to use a nuclear bomb instead of a chisel to get to that root. Seriously, you completely shafted the legitimate players just as much for implementing this nonsense. Just another reason to leave this crap game I guess.. Let me play you the song of my people!
Zatara Rought MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 1456	Posted - 2013.10.31 10:22:00 - [208] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: I've hit this so called "warpoint" limit so many times it's ridiculous. I'll usually scatter uplinks/hives around the map then go around killing, and SO MANY of my kills end up being "+0" after a while its ridiculous. Was this really the best solution you could come up with? You're saying you are attacking the root of the problem, but it seems like you decided to use a nuclear bomb instead of a chisel to get to that root. Seriously, you completely shafted the legitimate players just as much for implementing this nonsense. Just another reason to leave this crap game I guess.. WTF...funk not in OH!? CCP has 2 sides of the brain. Problem is there's nothing right in the left brain and nothing left in the right brain.
Funkmaster Whale Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1035	Posted - 2013.10.31 11:01:00 - [209] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Funkmaster Whale wrote: I've hit this so called "warpoint" limit so many times it's ridiculous. I'll usually scatter uplinks/hives around the map then go around killing, and SO MANY of my kills end up being "+0" after a while its ridiculous. Was this really the best solution you could come up with? You're saying you are attacking the root of the problem, but it seems like you decided to use a nuclear bomb instead of a chisel to get to that root. Seriously, you completely shafted the legitimate players just as much for implementing this nonsense. Just another reason to leave this crap game I guess.. WTF...funk not in OH!? Nope. Let me play you the song of my people!
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 1754	Posted - 2013.10.31 11:35:00 - [210] - Quote I truly don't understand. I used to think that whomever came up with incentives must have gone to North Korea Business School, but let's not further push people to NOT participate in combat in this FPS. The pubs are already boring beyond comprehension in most matches. You don't get pad to fight, you turn profit by not fighting. Now you want to nerf the stats accumulated when fighting. I think there needs to be another meeting on this issue. FFS can we get a person in the meeting that can push for incentivizing fun competitive play in these matches?

CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP 118	Posted - 2013.10.31 11:56:00 - [211] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: The general approach you're advocating here - addressing specific issues on a case-by-case basis - is, in my experience, not an efficient or effective way of dealing with exploits. . Again, so why not just ban delete the persons exploiting? People will start to get the hint. Meh, why am I even trying CCP does not even listen to the CPM. Good form Greyscale, hurt the legit players for a few rotten apples, good form. DUST514 Love The Dream Hate The Product (>GÇ+Gùá)G£î
Drapedup Drippedout G.U.T.Z 66	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:22:00 - [212] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. You guys are ***** morons. You can't fix a specific scenario, so you just decide a blanket nerf is the best option? How about you put a spawn timer on a newly revived clone for 3-5 secs that if revived and killed in that time frame, they are worth 0 WP? Why not put a cap that no more than 2 of the same nanohive or uplink can be active at once? Instead just a blanket nerf to all WP production? Is this a round about way to try to nerf the uplink/nanohive madness? If so, terrible idea. Again, because you're limiting everyone. All vehicle specialists get is a tank to kill and destroy, you've effectively crippled their WP gain in a minute because you're trying to stop a nanite injector issue? Get real, you're lazy and looking for a quick fix-all. "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." Find a way to satisfy the second part of your statement. Stick to limiting farmers and cheaters not EVERYONE. Instead you just limited anyone else who may be playing a legitimate game and simply dominating the battlefield. Everything in this game is centered around WP; orbs, match SP bonus, and ISK and you've just nerfed it for those who may go on a 'hot' streak? ***** geniuses.
NAV HIV The Generals EoN. 489	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:29:00 - [213] - Quote Of all the things we witnessed in this game. . . One more "Brilliant" move to make the game better. FML. It's a FPS. Point>Aim>Shoot>Kill = Rewards+Points+Gloating rights Not Point>Aim>Shoot>kill>take a vacation and repeat again
Mirataf WARRIORS 1NC 93	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:30:00 - [214] - Quote Nova Knife wrote: SirManBoy wrote: No and no. Your fourth point is especially troubling because it's as if you aren't aware of the fact that the marketplace carries these variants for us to buy and use. Some of these variants are diverse (only ammo, only triage, a combo thereof) and some are statistically indistinguishable from one another (ie. multiple proto uplinks with exactly the same stats--spawn speed, number of spawns, etc.) and are only different in name. Why, then, would I purchase these variants, if I were capped on how many I could use overall? The max carry and deploy stat has clearly always been associated with each individual piece of equipment, not the equipment class. Your position is based on your own bias against aggressive logistics play and does not represent the reality associated how the equipment was designed and the many variants within a type that were designed. The current system encourages me to purchase and consume a variety of items because I benefit by doing so. You would have it so my demand for all these items would decrease as I'd now be choosing several variants only based on which brand name I prefer. It would no longer benefit me to purchase and consume a wide variety of equipment variants because you would limit my ability to utilize those variants at the same time. Lame. Please stop trying to be the playstyle police. The purpose of the variants is to create flavor among players, to suit their needs and preferences. Not to cause an unholy amount of equipment spam. I spent a few minutes trying to track down a picture I've seen where someone took a screenshot of literally an entire objective's surrounding area was surrounded by friendly uplinks. Several dozen, all by different people using "Uplink suits". That is entirely unintended, and CCP has said as much. Equipment is supposed to be valuable, and carefully placed to help your team. Not simply be placed /everywhere/ by spam suits and then have the person swap to a 'slayer suit' when the spam is done. I'm not trying to be the playstyle police by any means. But I do take issue with people using mechanical loopholes that -do- result in framerate and performance issues. (Personally I don't mind the spam all that much from a gameplay standpoint because they feed me sweet delicious points when I blow all the equipment up, but there is no denying that it's just plain silly) Nova, if you haven't already read from page 9. SirManBoy will defend this till his dying days, he genuinely believes that there is nothing wrong with dropping 26 pieces of equipment to farm and obviously the scalability of this and with the sandbox nature of the game and intended. I'm sorry but if you have the normal what 3 logistics players per side with 78 pieces of equipment dropped per side 156 pieces of equipment in total, bloody ridiculous Can you give a blue tag a poke and get an answer
daishi mk03 Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 282	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:41:00 - [215] - Quote Let logis only deploy 1! single piece of equipment all the time. Be it a nanohive, a dropup or a remote. If he deploys another, the first one gets destroyed. Problem solved. Now you can only get massive WP through skill.
Drapedup Drippedout G.U.T.Z 66	Posted - 2013.10.31 12:44:00 - [216] - Quote [/quote] No and no. Your fourth point is especially troubling because it's as if you aren't aware of the fact that the marketplace carries these variants for us to buy and use. Some of these variants are diverse (only ammo, only triage, a combo thereof) and some are statistically indistinguishable from one another (ie. multiple proto uplinks with exactly the same stats--spawn speed, number of spawns, etc.) and are only different in name. Why, then, would I purchase these variants, if I were capped on how many I could use overall? The max carry and deploy stat has clearly always been associated with each individual piece of equipment, not the equipment class. Your position is based on your own bias against aggressive logistics play and does not represent the reality associated how the equipment was designed and the many variants within a type that were designed. The current system encourages me to purchase and consume a variety of items because I benefit by doing so. You would have it so my demand for all these items would decrease as I'd now be choosing several variants only based on which brand name I prefer. It would no longer benefit me to purchase and consume a wide variety of equipment variants because you would limit my ability to utilize those variants at the same time. Lame. Please stop trying to be the playstyle police. [/quote] Correct me if wrong, but I thought those variants were there for Aurum use. Which would allow someone with nano's or uplinks at lvl 4 to run the lvl 5 prototype variant. What I believe Nova Knife is saying is that the aurum variants are not intended(I believe he cited, "CCP has said as much" as well) for you to purchase and run alongside the non-aurum variant. He's not the playstyle police, if CCP said it, then you my man are using an exploit as a playstyle. Enjoy it, apparently it won't be around much longer.
Funkmaster Whale Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 1037	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:02:00 - [217] - Quote It's pretty evident CCP decided to choose the "lazy" route and not the "effective" route. You guys have given a big "**** you" to players who manage to do well and get kill streaks. In fact, I'm pretty sure this is one of those cases where you hurt the legit players more than the players exploiting for warpoints. Seriously, you have one case of players exploiting for WPs via revives/kills and so you decide to do a blanket nerf to warpoint accrual. Some of the decision making at CCP just flabbergasts me. Let me play you the song of my people!
Brush Master HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 941	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:23:00 - [218] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Sana Rayya wrote: Thanks Greyscale, for explaining the rationale and math behind the warpoint limiter. The only thing I don't like is that the ceiling is scaled per minute from the very beginning of the match. In ambushes specifically, sometimes you spawn in within 50 meters of the reds, so you might end up scoring kills that are subsequently penalized within less than a minute of the start of the battle. Maybe you should build incrementally from another fixed WP value other than zero - say 500 WP limit right at the beginning, then 400 WP per minute after that? Yeah, this is probably the next tweak in the line if we find it's still an issue after we raise the cap. Brush Master wrote: I am fine as long as this does not effect normal gameplay but when you say it clear that it is happening, are you giving the player any feedback when it is happening? This goes back to the reduced WP gain on rep tools. It looks like a bug because no feedback is given, just reduced number. How about some red letters or something beside the WP to let them know that WP is reduced that way we know that is not a bug or can clearly see this is happening. Also, as others have said, this is the wrong way to implement something, you just did it and then asked for feedback, this is backwards and now we wait 1-2 weeks for a fix. These kinds of code pushes are what cause your player base to get mad and leave. Clear as in we're actually showing you the reduced payout numbers, rather than doing something behind the scenes and not telling you at all. I agree that it could be clearer still, but if this is tuned properly (#1 priority right now) the only people seeing it should be people deliberately farming, and a) they should be able to put 2 and 2 together themselves and b) we don't want to spend any significant amount of effort making a better UI just for them [edit] Oh, yeah, the other thing I was going to say here - we don't discuss exploit fixes until we've shipped them, which includes this change. If we'd announced this early enough to get feedback, it'd have acted as an incentive for the farmers to knuckle down and get in a good few weeks of concentrated farming before we ship it. Aeon Amadi wrote: Flashbacks of dealing with Crimewatch, Greyscale? I'd characterise it as "lessons learned" rather than "flashbacks" but yeah, that's informing this decision-making For the record, I suggested a point where logis consistently don't get feedback that they are not receiving WP aka repair tool cap and how this relates to this situation as well. As a logi, I know I am easily capping out and is very annoying to not have feedback that I'm at that cap, there is no feedback at all unless this system has changed? How will people know the are running into these caps thus letting you know they need adjusted? It is not as clear as it seems you think they are and as you have said you can't determine every situation so you need us to tell you. As far as not discussing them here, please, the players know about these weeks and months before you do, there are videos, players share with each other, look at the result of not talking. GÇá Havok Core - Closed Beta Corp - Accepting Applications Here GÇá CEO // [email protected]
IgniteableAura Pro Hic Immortalis 267	Posted - 2013.10.31 13:23:00 - [219] - Quote Getting more than 400wp a minute is hardly sustainable. Its unlikely that even 1% of players will ever hit this cap. If you do, congrats. You are the top 1% of the WP earners. This sort of thing fixes a myriad of issues rather than point issues and I appreciate that. If this is honestly going to "change the way you play" with equipment then I am looking forward to less spam on the battlefield, but I highly doubt that behavior will change with this mechanic. Stop making a mountain out of a molehill. PHI Recruitment or PHIsh Tank in game Twitch
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2370	Posted - 2013.10.31 14:40:00 - [220] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: The general approach you're advocating here - addressing specific issues on a case-by-case basis - is, in my experience, not an efficient or effective way of dealing with exploits. If we identify specific cases where, in the course of normal play, we're handing out too many WP, we should and will alter the way payouts are awarded, as and when doing so becomes a priority, so that they're paying in a more balanced manner. This is a balancing concern, though. As far as exploits, farming and the like go, you attack the root not the leaves. With the introduction of this general cap mechanism are you going to remove the specific triage tool cap mechanism?

SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 334	Posted - 2013.10.31 15:08:00 - [221] - Quote CCP Logibro wrote: Technically, this is functionally working as intended. However, this (and supply depot interaction in general) is something we would like to change (the exact details of what we will change it to are still being decided on). This mechanic is not a bug or exploit. You guys are just a bunch of boring assault players who lack the creativity to think outside the box. You call it spam and WP farming, but all of my uplinks and hives are a massive advantage for my team and therefore my playstyle is as viable and legitimate as any other. Additionally, I get my fair share of kills, revives, and triage points from my rep tool. I'm not sitting at the edge of the map doing nothing and helping no one. Hell, I would rather have my WP throttled before having my playstyle banned. That's how much I enjoy it.
MUDFLAPS McGILLICUTTY OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 66	Posted - 2013.10.31 16:17:00 - [222] - Quote This "fix" is shitting all over my legitimate gaming experience.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2370	Posted - 2013.10.31 16:43:00 - [223] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Technically, this is functionally working as intended. However, this (and supply depot interaction in general) is something we would like to change (the exact details of what we will change it to are still being decided on). This mechanic is not a bug or exploit. You guys are just a bunch of boring assault players who lack the creativity to think outside the box. You call it spam and WP farming, but all of my uplinks and hives are a massive advantage for my team and therefore my playstyle is as viable and legitimate as any other. Additionally, I get my fair share of kills, revives, and triage points from my rep tool. I'm not sitting at the edge of the map doing nothing and helping no one. Hell, I would rather have my WP throttled before having my playstyle banned. That's how much I enjoy it. Equipment WPs are naturally limited, you don't need an additional throttle (over the new general one anyway). Deployment earns zero WPs. Usage is what rewards the Logi, and usage is limited by need. You can't spawn more clones on uplinks than you start with in match. It matters not if you have one or thirteen active, the limit is clone death. Likewise nano-hives don't sit and generate WPs on their own. A team member has to be receiving ammo for the Logi to be rewarded. There's a slightly more elastic limit on this, but it's capped by need. If a match has a single Logi working his butt off deploying equipment where it will be used he can top the leader board and he deserves to. He just spent a large portion of he match making sure the slayers will have a good time, not spending a lot of time running to the front and back to a SD. He keeps the action intense and the match fun for everyone, and this is often at high ISK expense as proto equipment is quite expensive and the Logi is often on the front line making deployments that count. Multiple Logis can deploy more equipment, but they can't increase the need for it so they compete for the existing pool. In that case two Logis might do well, but each place below the player with the most kills. Think about it this way, if a match had a dozen support players and one slayer that sayer would clean up every match because he isn't sharing the available kills. Ridiculous? Well why is there a single Logi on your team? Is that play style so little fun for the majority of players that they avoid it? Why aren't you? Rather than nerf the rewards, maybe the job needs to be made more attractive so the task of supporting the entire team isn't borne by a single player.
CLONE117 Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore 438	Posted - 2013.10.31 18:13:00 - [224] - Quote i dont think the great good players would be so upset about this.. ______________________________________________________________________________________________ i have no interest in wp or kdr, my only sole interest is to make sure i give everyone on the enemy team a death. none shall escape my gift of death.
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 108	Posted - 2013.10.31 18:31:00 - [225] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. What an epic fail by CCP. Not only do you come up with a HORRIBLE way of fixing the problem but you somehow FORGET to tell us about it? Any plans on fixing this cluster ____?
Orclev Nori RisingSuns Public Disorder. 1	Posted - 2013.10.31 19:35:00 - [226] - Quote FYI this is probably what they are fixing. I don't think even master level WP spam can achieve this level of WP gain. THIS Via Dust 514 Reddit - 60000 WP in one match I think fixing that crap is perfectly reasonable. The cap will probably be just high enough that protostomp and aurstomp awesomesquads can run pub matches like normal and not feel the squeeze.
Earl Crushinator Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 167	Posted - 2013.10.31 21:58:00 - [227] - Quote played a match when this was announced. hit the cap. played yesterday didn't hit the cap. Did pretty well both times - feels good now.
Celus Ivara DUST University Ivy League 122	Posted - 2013.11.02 02:50:00 - [228] - Quote Skihids wrote: SirManBoy wrote: CCP Logibro wrote: Technically, this is functionally working as intended. However, this (and supply depot interaction in general) is something we would like to change (the exact details of what we will change it to are still being decided on). This mechanic is not a bug or exploit. You guys are just a bunch of boring assault players who lack the creativity to think outside the box. You call it spam and WP farming, but all of my uplinks and hives are a massive advantage for my team and therefore my playstyle is as viable and legitimate as any other. Additionally, I get my fair share of kills, revives, and triage points from my rep tool. I'm not sitting at the edge of the map doing nothing and helping no one. Hell, I would rather have my WP throttled before having my playstyle banned. That's how much I enjoy it. Equipment WPs are naturally limited, you don't need an additional throttle (over the new general one anyway). Deployment earns zero WPs. Usage is what rewards the Logi, and usage is limited by need. You can't spawn more clones on uplinks than you start with in match. It matters not if you have one or thirteen active, the limit is clone death. Likewise nano-hives don't sit and generate WPs on their own. A team member has to be receiving ammo for the Logi to be rewarded. There's a slightly more elastic limit on this, but it's capped by need. If a match has a single Logi working his butt off deploying equipment where it will be used he can top the leader board and he deserves to. He just spent a large portion of he match making sure the slayers will have a good time, not spending a lot of time running to the front and back to a SD. He keeps the action intense and the match fun for everyone, and this is often at high ISK expense as proto equipment is quite expensive and the Logi is often on the front line making deployments that count. Multiple Logis can deploy more equipment, but they can't increase the need for it so they compete for the existing pool. In that case two Logis might do well, but each place below the player with the most kills. Think about it this way, if a match had a dozen support players and one slayer that sayer would clean up every match because he isn't sharing the available kills. Ridiculous? Well why is there a single Logi on your team? Is that play style so little fun for the majority of players that they avoid it? Why aren't you? Rather than nerf the rewards, maybe the job needs to be made more attractive so the task of supporting the entire team isn't borne by a single player. ^This. Equipment only rewards WP when they are used, not when they are deployed. Thus, if a player is getting WP off their equipment, it's because they did something useful for the team. This is as true of the hard-working dedicated Logi as it is of the Supply Depot suit swapping spammer. Now there are closely related issues that are worth discussing: -Does rapid equipment spam near SDs make areas too defensible? -Does having a vast abundance of uplinks (either in a small area, or across the map in general) hinder (or aid?) the value of troop movement related tactics? These are discussions worth having. But, we must be careful to parse the situations we are seeing. Equipment spam occasionally generating mass WP spikes is not as destabilizing to the gameplay as many people are presupposing.
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2377	Posted - 2013.11.02 03:25:00 - [229] - Quote Celus Ivara wrote: Equipment only rewards WP when they are used, not when they are deployed. Thus, if a player is getting WP off their equipment, it's because they did something useful for the team. This is as true of the hard-working dedicated Logi as it is of the Supply Depot suit swapping spammer. Now there are closely related issues that are worth discussing: -Does rapid equipment spam near SDs make areas too defensible? -Does having a vast abundance of uplinks (either in a small area, or across the map in general) hinder (or aid?) the value of troop movement related tactics? These are discussions worth having. But, we must be careful to parse the situations we are seeing. Equipment spam occasionally generating mass WP spikes is not as destabilizing to the gameplay as many people are presupposing. Equipment in very close proximity is visually arresting, but it is functionally useless. You can only spawn in once or get so much ammo before you are topped off. The rest of the equipment just contributes to noise pollution, attracts enemy flux grenades, and generates points for the enemy team. There are only a few cases where multiple uplinks is a help and that's in places like the bridge in Domination where there are several obstacles that protect uplinks from view and the path to the objective is funneled through one narrow path. But even so I've deployed several on that map and had the enemy roll in and wipe it all out without an OB. A bridge full of uplinks won't save an outclassed team, and a good team can hold it with one. The amount of equipment doesn't alter the available points. The worst part of concentrated equipment is the deafening roar that prevents you from hearing an enemy approach. I believe the "equipment problem" is more visual and imagined than real and functional. Some folks think that more equipment means more WPs for Logis because they don't realize the real limitation is the competition for the points. A lone Logi can earn just as much from a few pieces as a dozen if he's the only one vying for the points. Those same folks don't stop to think that a few well placed uplinks keeps the match active and the battles contested. Without them it's a long slow slog to the objective and the attacking force is quickly cut down as it trickles in bit by bit. There would be many more boring matches without a good Logi creating molding the battle.
Eris Ernaga DUST University Ivy League 629	Posted - 2013.11.03 07:28:00 - [230] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Nova Knife wrote: For the record, I feel like I should say that the CPM was told of this quite some time before deployment. We strongly cautioned them that it should never affect legit players, and there were a couple of us (Not all agreed) that this is not a good way to go about it. Not only did we get what felt like a patronizing pat on the head saying "Trust us, it will only affect the bad guys" but we tried to offer possible alternatives which were shrugged off. While yes, this was the most efficient -stopgap- solution until a more robust one can be implemented, it is not ideal. The ideal solution(s) once time allow are as follows : (1) Absolute limit on points for a single action. IE: If you have five guys in a squad scanning and one guy kills a scanned victim, only one scan assist is given to the squad leader and the scan points are divided among those who earned them, with a bonus to the base value to the total points to keep them from earning +1's. There is no endless stream of +X's with this method, as multiple people trying to 'get in on the action' becomes moot and more time actually playing is the incentive. To this end, having multiple logi repping the same dude in order to farm guardian points would be moot, but multiple logi repping multiple different dudes would still get them all points. It encourages people to spread the love and work more as a team, rather than just everyone rallying around the 1-2 guys they know will crush everything. (2) Re-assessment of squad bonus mechanics. (Will go into this later) (3) When it comes to revives, the entire system needs to be revamped. I'll write a bigger post on how this should work, but essentially there should be persistent "overkill" HP. For example, A person is "Incapacitated" after being brought to 0 armor. if someone has 100 overkill HP, you would have to do more than 100 damage past their armor to "Kill" them, and they would not be able to be revived. If killed and dealt 48 of that overkill HP, they could be revived and survive another 52 overkill damage before being fully "dead". Players' not "dead" and incapacitated should be clearly visible as such and easily finished off. Revives should only be happening if a teammate saves someone just after they go down by killing their killer or forcing them to flee. No one should be getting "Kill" or "Death" stats unless the victim is down for good. (4) Uplinks and Nanohives : Point accrual from these is mostly fine. The problem is people bypassing the "Max active" limit by using the same type of equipment but a different variant. This is unintended, and the only fix needed to stop "spam" is to fix this loophole. The general approach you're advocating here - addressing specific issues on a case-by-case basis - is, in my experience, not an efficient or effective way of dealing with exploits. If we identify specific cases where, in the course of normal play, we're handing out too many WP, we should and will alter the way payouts are awarded, as and when doing so becomes a priority, so that they're paying in a more balanced manner. This is a balancing concern, though. As far as exploits, farming and the like go, you attack the root not the leaves. Odd I don't think anyone has ever earned over 5,000 war points in a skirmish match so what's the problem. If the idiot red dots are to dumb to switch their spawn or give up then they deserve to die as is the case a lot of the times. I mean I am in a firefight not exploiting anything and started getting my war point for kills lowered. Besides what does it fix that person is still getting killed and you are just lowering our sp and isk pay out it's already hard to make isk don't make it harder with this system. Ba bang baby

Eris Ernaga DUST University Ivy League 629	Posted - 2013.11.03 07:39:00 - [231] - Quote Penalized for playing good players who cheat ruin it for everyone. Ba bang baby
deezy dabest Warpoint Sharx 81	Posted - 2013.11.03 09:41:00 - [232] - Quote I really want to thank CCP Greyscale on this since no one else has said it. Your communication was awesome in this thread and honestly changed my opinion totally. As far as the changes go, once the numbers mentioned before are implemented there will probably be very few people legitimately hitting the cap. I have to agree with what (i think) Calus said where you should probably add a buffer at the start instead of basing it on zero. I have a decent amount of experience in fraud monitoring systems and can tell you that anytime you dont give a buffer from the start there will be false positives, also with a buffer you get a bit more forgiveness when you adjust your later filters.
Minako Nakajima Vortex State Empire Dark Taboo 26	Posted - 2013.11.03 09:51:00 - [233] - Quote Lol 3 OB just awhile ago in FW... "The world we've come to love can often seem to collapse around us." // Terminally Insane
843 Epidemic 377	Posted - 2013.11.03 11:30:00 - [234] - Quote The better you are the shitter it gets 843-BANE Director // Ranking Officer // BurgezzE.T.F Contact me here
Crash Monster Snipers Anonymous 1724	Posted - 2013.11.03 13:09:00 - [235] - Quote Random thoughts on the fixed fix... 1) Don't start at zero. You could start a bit higher and end at the same place. 2) Alternately, you could implement a small "overheat" style buffer which shrinks as you approach the total cap -- where going above the limit is absorbed to a small but tunable degree -- allowing you to slow down later and not violate the ultimate limit. Not as simple as #1 but could make the cap effect less visible. Additionally, this doesn't really seem to do anything to stop the exploits. People with an exploit will apparently be able to gain maximum WP while not fielding and risking expensive gear. This suggests you DO still need to find ways to discourage use of these exploits. It might also be possible to put in some per character WP limits. As exploits seem to involve complicit participants it would make it harder to take advantage of exploits without involving nearly everyone -- not that I wouldn't expect to see that happen also. The goal, make it easier to actually play the game to earn rewards instead of screwing the game to earn rewards. Putting such a blanket limit system in place appears to reduce the outsized rewards for screwing the game but not the relative ease and risk of doing so compared to playing.
CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP 130	Posted - 2013.11.03 14:19:00 - [236] - Quote LOL everyone does know that the Blue Tags stopped reading this after we started pointing out how crappy a group of Dev's they truly are, right? Anymore advice given in this threads is just falling on def ears. DUST514 Love The Dream Hate The Product Dusters - WhenGäó CCP - SoonGäó

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 100	Posted - 2013.11.04 02:33:00 - [237] - Quote Crash Monster wrote: 2) Alternately, you could implement a small "overheat" style buffer which shrinks as you approach the total cap -- where going above the limit is absorbed to a small but tunable degree -- allowing you to slow down later and not violate the ultimate limit. Not as simple as #1 but could make the cap effect less visible. Not totally sure what you're suggesting here, can you explain further?

DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2467	Posted - 2013.11.04 02:38:00 - [238] - Quote Hello. I am still seeing the reduced kill points every few matches. It dropped down to zero today in one match following squad leader dropping an OB and killing 6, all of which were 0 pts. GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢ Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà Forum Warrior LV. 2
Llast 326 An Arkhos 322	Posted - 2013.11.04 02:38:00 - [239] - Quote CHIPMINT BUTTERCUP wrote: LOL everyone does know that the Blue Tags stopped reading this after we started pointing out how crappy a group of Dev's they truly are, right? Anymore advice given in this threads is just falling on def ears. Apparently not
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.11.04 04:31:00 - [240] - Quote Quote: Odd I don't think anyone has ever earned over 5,000 war points in a skirmish match so what's the problem. If the idiot red dots are to dumb to switch their spawn or give up then they deserve to die as is the case a lot of the times. 5100wp one game bud this cap thing is pissing me off now, can u please fix this asap

Seeth Mensch highland marines 47	Posted - 2013.11.04 06:48:00 - [241] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Crash Monster wrote: 2) Alternately, you could implement a small "overheat" style buffer which shrinks as you approach the total cap -- where going above the limit is absorbed to a small but tunable degree -- allowing you to slow down later and not violate the ultimate limit. Not as simple as #1 but could make the cap effect less visible. Not totally sure what you're suggesting here, can you explain further? Thank you so much for posting right after Chipmint's little diatribe about how dev's don't pay attention! <3
DJINN Jecture Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 65	Posted - 2013.11.04 07:16:00 - [242] - Quote DJINN Marauder wrote: Hello. I am still seeing the reduced kill points every few matches. It dropped down to zero today in one match following squad leader dropping an OB and killing 6, all of which were 0 pts. I'm sorry to hear that, maybe if you stop shooting the guys in the militia suits with your proto weapons in pubs it may fix your problem. Your Zerg is strong Marauder.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 102	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:26:00 - [243] - Quote OK, cap ought to have been lifted from 250/300 to 450/500 today. If you're still running into it regularly after today's patch, please post here so I can look into what you're doing that's breaking our assumptions

Absolute Idiom II SyNergy Gaming EoN. 830	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:30:00 - [244] - Quote Is there a reason that you couldn't simply add a max(1000,[your formula]) statement to ensure that you don't start off the battle with a cap of 0, but with a reasonable cap of 1000? Then only after 2.x minutes would your cap begin to climb higher than 1000. Fanfest 2012 - Winning Team + MVP - £1100 in prizes Fanfest 2013 - Winning Team - £500 in prizes Fanfest 2014 - ???

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 102	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:40:00 - [245] - Quote Absolute Idiom II wrote: Is there a reason that you couldn't simply add a max(1000,[your formula]) statement to ensure that you don't start off the battle with a cap of 0, but with a reasonable cap of 1000? Then only after 2.x minutes would your cap begin to climb higher than 1000. It opens the door to yo-yoing in and out of battles to game the cap. We might do something along those lines if people are still having issues, but I'd much rather not and keep everything nice and tight. (Yes, you can then try and track battles and persist the cap per-user per-battle, but at that point it stops being a simple fix and you're heading down the complexity rabbithole again.)

Absolute Idiom II SyNergy Gaming EoN. 830	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:50:00 - [246] - Quote Thanks for the reply. I think in reality, the match exit and loading times would make that a suboptimal play anyway, but I appreciate the principle at work. Fanfest 2012 - Winning Team + MVP - £1100 in prizes Fanfest 2013 - Winning Team - £500 in prizes Fanfest 2014 - ???
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2613	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:50:00 - [247] - Quote DUST sacrificing gameplay for the bottom line and lazy solutions again. You might as well just start selling the SP bundles for a flat rate now and get it over with.
Absolute Idiom II SyNergy Gaming EoN. 830	Posted - 2013.11.05 11:54:00 - [248] - Quote ^^^Mate, your logical reasoning is so flawed you should petition to be renamed Noc Sequitur. Fanfest 2012 - Winning Team + MVP - £1100 in prizes Fanfest 2013 - Winning Team - £500 in prizes Fanfest 2014 - ???
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2613	Posted - 2013.11.05 12:03:00 - [249] - Quote Absolute Idiom II wrote: ^^^Mate, your logical reasoning is so flawed you should petition to be renamed Noc Sequitur. You don't remember, that is what skill spikes were supposed to be. SP for $$$ at a flat exchange rate. Let's even assume boosting is a large problem with this game. How much return on investment is there from limiting them? Does CCP make more money? The customer convert rate from free-booster to pay-to-grinder must be abysmally low. However it DOES limit the current customers. Forces them to play more matches to make their weekly SP or better yet earn less SP in general. If you want to tell jokes I've got one too: Rollover SP
Ansiiis The Trustworthy We Pay The Iron Price 377	Posted - 2013.11.05 12:13:00 - [250] - Quote I hate getting nerfed. If I play in a squad I almost always get capped.

Brush Master HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 952	Posted - 2013.11.05 13:27:00 - [251] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Absolute Idiom II wrote: Is there a reason that you couldn't simply add a max(1000,[your formula]) statement to ensure that you don't start off the battle with a cap of 0, but with a reasonable cap of 1000? Then only after 2.x minutes would your cap begin to climb higher than 1000. It opens the door to yo-yoing in and out of battles to game the cap. We might do something along those lines if people are still having issues, but I'd much rather not and keep everything nice and tight. (Yes, you can then try and track battles and persist the cap per-user per-battle, but at that point it stops being a simple fix and you're heading down the complexity rabbithole again.) Can we remove the logi repair tool cap since we have a global cap now. GÇá Havok Core - Closed Beta Corp - Accepting Applications Here GÇá CEO // [email protected]
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1499	Posted - 2013.11.05 13:34:00 - [252] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: Absolute Idiom II wrote: ^^^Mate, your logical reasoning is so flawed you should petition to be renamed Noc Sequitur. You don't remember, that is what skill spikes were supposed to be. SP for $$$ at a flat exchange rate. Let's even assume boosting is a large problem with this game. How much return on investment is there from limiting them? Does CCP make more money? The customer convert rate from free-booster to pay-to-grinder must be abysmally low. However it DOES limit the current customers. Forces them to play more matches to make their weekly SP or better yet earn less SP in general. If you want to tell jokes I've got one too: Rollover SP Are you drunk?
Jak'Saan 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 63	Posted - 2013.11.05 14:32:00 - [253] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. To me the fix to this setup is simple and does not hinder actual killers: Recently needled clone: any deaths should not merit wps x seconds after needle (prevents waiting for needle to kill someone) Needling a clone: should not merit any wps until victim survives x seconds after needle (prevents scenario mentioned above and needle farming in hostile environments)


Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.