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WTF Reduced kill points!!!???

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 13 post(s)
TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 4366	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:39:00 - [121] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: CCP Wolfman wrote: We've checked the data since it was released and have prepared an update which will be deployed in a hotfix soon. Thanks for being a smart, classy gentleman. Terrific decision. What decision was made? I see "incoming hotfix", not "revert back to old system" or "nerf WP gain even more". Never forget
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1156	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:52:00 - [122] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: calisk galern wrote: I'm actually a bit speechless been looking at this and trying to figure out how to respond.... everything from ruining orbitals, to hurting slayer WP gain ( in a shooter ) is just bad. if up-links were the issue all you needed to do was apply a cap gain per minute like you do with repairs. just a poor choice. Hey what about healer wp gain? killing is not the only part of this game dude. Why does every one only care about how many kills they get? healing wp's were already capped out in the same way uplink points should been capped. aside from that I don't see your point, logi's already make a ton more then slayers do and your comment didn't refute that. I acknowledge logi's make tons of points already, and you will still make tons of points.
dazlb72 HELGHAN EXILES 106	Posted - 2013.10.30 02:58:00 - [123] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Hello everyone, I see there is some confusion about this because it wasn't messaged properly. I'm rather confused how it was left out of the official messaging for the hotfix deployed on October 24. Regardless, this is the patch note for the hotfix: "Apply a limiter, capping the warpoint gained per minute of the players who are farming warpoints or cheating." This is to prevent people from setting up a scheme where a friend runs in and dies, then gets revived by a teammate, only to die again, and this happens over and over. We of course want your feedback about it on if the limiter is too strict. Thanks for keeping us informed. Great job. Also that's a great idea (can you get banned for sarcasm?) It begins
Sgt Kirk SyNergy Gaming EoN. 2427	Posted - 2013.10.30 03:04:00 - [124] - Quote This is the kind of **** that really makes me question CCPs competence. I may have deleted DUST but I still care deeply about this game.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 51	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:24:00 - [125] - Quote Hi everyone. So. Right at the end of July we were sent a video of a semi-optimised farming setup which was allowing players to grind up, in one example we saw, 60,116WP over the course of 69 minutes. This is behavior we want to strongly discourage for several reasons (listed in ascending order of significance, ie most important last): It makes a mess of our progression curves It's not fair on players who're earning their progress normally It pushes well outside the boundaries of what we consider "normal", which opens the door to all kinds of potential issues, such as farming for Precision Strikes and then dropping a dozen at once People hiding off in the corner of a map farming tend to ruin matches Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. In this case, the root problem is that we don't want people farming an excessive amount of WP, for any reason and using any trick. So, we started developing a design to limit WP gain directly. More specifically, we wanted to ensure that, at the end of a match, no player had scored more than a certain amount of WP per minute, as WP gain over time is the ultimate thing we want to target. The design we ended up with is fairly straightforward: We set two constants in our data: WP/minute ceiling and WP/minute limit Each player has a WP ceiling and a WP limit for each match These start at 0, and are incremented every second. This gives you two numbers that rise linearly over the course of the match If, any time you gain WP, your total WP score for the match would be above your current WP ceiling, we reduce the value of that WP payout proportional to how far between your current ceiling and your current limit it would take your score This has the following consequences: So long as your WP total stays below the WP ceiling, you will never see this system As your WP total moves above the ceiling, we trim your WP payout in a way that starts gentle but gets firmer as your WP/minute gets higher We can mathematically guarantee that you can never score more WP per minute than the limit value over the course of the match, so this system should be 100% exploit-proof and never need to be adjusted again Because we are tracking a moving ceiling over the course of the battle, rather than say tracking your income over the last minute or the last X WP scores or whatever, once you get past the first few minutes in-match your WP income can be very uneven and still not trigger the cap so long as your average over the course of the battle stays below the limit As a side-effect of the above, the system is more likely to start clipping scores if you score large amounts of WP in the first minute or two; this isn't optimal, but in the course of a normal battle (ie starting from the beginning rather than joining midway through) there's little opportunity to get big scores in your first minute or so, which should significantly reduce the impact of this factor. We're currently happy with the underlying design of this system: it's robust, it's failsafe, it's communicating its actions to players in a relatively clear way, and aside from first-minute concerns it has no inherent drawbacks that we've identified so far. However. The numbers are obviously wrong When we set this up, we did some data mining to determine what values we should use. We looked at some people who were obviously exploiting, and they were getting up into the 1000+WP/minute range. We also tried to determine what "normal" play looked like for high-scoring characters, and our research here fell short. We looked at a random sample of players, and we looked at the highest-scoring player on the server, and we were seeing that a little over 250 WP/minute was about the highest we were seeing. Obviously the ideal thing would be to calculate WP per minute per player per match for say a day, but the amount of data we'd need to crunch to do that was judged to be infeasible, and while all we really wanted to know was the top 10 WP/minute scores (which we would obviously validate against logs to check they weren't exploiting), we'd have to calculate the WP/minute for everyone to determine who those people were. We switched this feature on last week, with the values being 250 and 300 respectively. Pretty quickly we started seeing scattered feedback of players running into this "normally", so we started to dig into the metrics to try and see if we could tune this further. Thanks to some very astute data mining by one of our programmers, we managed to isolate the highest WP/minute scores by looking for incidences of players having their scores reduced by the cap, thus shortcutting the problem of having to analyze the entire playerbase to find these high-peaking players. What we're seeing in these data, somewhat unsurprisingly, is that it's possible to really spike your WP payouts and trip the cap in certain circumstances. For example, dropping a Precision Strike on a squad objective and killing what looks like five infantry and two full HAVs gets you a large number of points, which can swing you up considerably past 300/minute net if it happens relatively early in the battle, and the follow-up strikes you're getting from that flood of WP hardly help the matter over the course of the battle. Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing. I'm not sure yet exactly when this change will go out as I'm still tying off...

General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11331	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:30:00 - [126] - Quote approved Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 51	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:31:00 - [127] - Quote OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced"

Klash 816 Sanguis Defense Syndicate 61	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:40:00 - [128] - Quote Damn it I'm finally able to go 26-0 consistently and then you go and make changes like these. I don't use the AR, haven't I been nerfed enough? *~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~* With Blood and Iron We Klash-
Shattered Mirage D.A.R.K Academy D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 341	Posted - 2013.10.30 04:53:00 - [129] - Quote Lv2spd2 wrote: Hmm... nerfing WPs for kills? That is like the ONLY thing I haven't seen nerf calls for on the forum. Someone is trolling. CCP I salute you! This!
General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11332	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:01:00 - [130] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" I am not op enough Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos

Sleepy Zan 2653	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:03:00 - [131] - Quote HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA A good sniper doesn't provide battlefield intelligence, a good sniper leaves no intelligence left on the battlefield
Meeko Fent expert intervention Caldari State 1337	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:15:00 - [132] - Quote I can't see anything wrong with have a soft WP per minute cap. Helps prevent OB spam, helps make massacres a useless becoming, and it pisses off pub stompers. The three things that make a game mechanic good in my book. Meeko's Novelty Shop Opening Soon! We (will)sell all the novelty items you desire! Really!
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:17:00 - [133] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" so what if he was in top 5 , its not fair to cap someones points if they are just haveing a good run. thats just bullshit!!! i hit this capping thing about 5 times last weekend, and i didnt know whats going on, i just thought it was glitching out. all i was doing was play the game and i get slapped in the face, GREAT STUFF CCP, LOVE GETTING PUNISHED FOR PLAY GOOD, THANKS not cool at all
DeathwindRising Rogue Spades EoN. 113	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:18:00 - [134] - Quote Soldiersaint wrote: Great now we wont make any profit as a logi. first you cap our rep tool and now you make it that we get less points over time. Real logis are getting punished because of worthless stat padders.....again your rep tools will be getting a buff in 1.6
ratamaq doc 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 119	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:43:00 - [135] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away.
crazy space 1 Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic 1944	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:59:00 - [136] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: OwnD07 wrote: Feedback time! ... The cap is currently way too strict. I hit it multiple times per night of playing. At least one game per night my kills don't even score me points. I understand wanting to keep people from exploiting the game, but come on. I'm hitting this cap /hard/ under normal gameplay circumstances. If it makes you feel any better, I can tell you that you were in the top five characters for "number of minutes in which WP scores were reduced" Hey can you at least reduce the sp and isk gain over time in battle by 50% and double the sp we get from Warpoints? Quote: Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. wait... so... you don't mind if I go look it up and use it? sweet free sp here I come, thanks CCP, great mindset
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:00:00 - [137] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. how i miss that! i aim to get 2500wp a game, if i get under 2000wp i feel i failed, in a good game i will get enywhere from 1500wp-- 4000wp straight up i am only like 490 in the WP leaderboard, there is alot of better players out there than me i know that coz i still get stomped sometimes i got 5100wp in a game once, it was legitimate az to, no farming just playing
Parson Atreides Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 840	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:07:00 - [138] - Quote It's too easy to jump in a tank with two other squad mates, then have the squad leader (who isn't in the tank) throw the defend order on it. Just one tank kill would net you: 50 (kill) + 10 (defend order) + 10 (kill commission) 35 (vehicle kill assist - Player 1) + 7 (defend order) + 7 (vehicle kill assist commission - Player 1) 35 (vehicle kill assist - Player 2) + 7 (defend order) + 7 (vehicle kill assist - Player 2) That's 168 WP for one kill where only one person is really doing anything. The above example doesn't even count times where a gunner actually hits the target first and gets an addition 25 (regular kill assist) + 5 (defend order) + 5 (squad commission), bringing the total to 203 (why they get a kill assist and a vehicle assist is beyond me). Over 200 WP for one kill. Then add into the mix the fact that you can call down a strike and immediately hop into a tank, netting all the kills, plus the vehicle kill assists for everyone in the tank itself. The numbers quickly add up to ridiculous amounts for the amount of work actually being done. It would be nice if you guys could look at these numbers when rebalancing vehicles. The most blatant error is the one where you get 35 points for a vehicle assist without ever having to fire a shot yet only 25 for actually hitting the person and then you get awarded both sets of WP. How does that work? The unexamined life is not worth living. RNDclan.com

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 53	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:07:00 - [139] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers.

Rusty Shallows Black Jackals 444	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:08:00 - [140] - Quote Eltra Ardell wrote: I-Shayz-I wrote: I honestly don't mind this. People who are running around getting tons of kills in a small amount of time are being balanced with the people who aren't super hardcore. This also prevents players from earning tons of points from orbitals in order to earn more orbitals. But if there's a different way to fix this (such as the way people have suggested above me), I'd rather it be solved that way. People should never be punished for being good at the game. People should never be rewarded for being bad at the game. They aren't. Unless you count everyone who quits the game as "bad" since they are offered AUR suits to lure them back. It's no secret that the entire War Point system has problems. The only elements that work well is its use for bonus reward SP and capped SP. "She may not be Miss Right but she'll do right now," Thank you SR-71


CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 54	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:10:00 - [141] - Quote crazy space 1 wrote: Quote: Based on extensive experience with exploits in EVE, we considered and rejected trying to just patch out the particular behavior that was being used in this case. Why? Because players are smart and, typically, will find another way of accomplishing the same goal very quickly. Often the new exploit will be something that was only made possible by the fix for the last one; go research the history of the Lofty scam in EVE for a good example of this sort of thing. The bottom line is that trying to band-aid specific exploitative behaviors is a bad approach to this kind of problem. Instead we determined to do the smart long-term thing, and attack the root problem rather than the symptoms. wait... so... you don't mind if I go look it up and use it? sweet free sp here I come, thanks CCP, great mindset The Lofty scam? Sure, you can try I'm pretty sure I fixed it for good in 2008, though, so let me know if you manage to get it to work!

General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11337	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:23:00 - [142] - Quote I got it to work. Level 5 Forum Warrior Prof 5 Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos
ratamaq doc 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 119	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:29:00 - [143] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: ratamaq doc wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: ...Anyway, long story short, I spent most of yesterday looking at logs, and I'm in the process of preparing a hotfix to raise the values from 250 and 300 to 400 and 500. The highest legit net WP/minute I could find yesterday was 468, with a total pre-cap WP of 2142; under the current numbers on TQ this is cut down to around 1446 after the cap is applied, while with 400/500 it's only reduced to 2031. It's still not optimal that players are hitting the cap at all, but we're reluctant to push it too high as we need to keep it sufficiently close to "normal" play that people considering exploiting don't find it worth doing... Wait, so are you saying that 2142 or 2031 wp for a game is what you are seeing the top players earning? This cannot be the case. I assure I don't farm, and I'm no where near the top 10 in this game, but I break that somewhat regularly. This is a video of the end game stats of one of my all around best games to date. According to the timestamp of the recording, I did this on 04SEP2013 at 0116 -5 GMT if you want to check the logs. This was a skirmish I ran solo In a 'Sever' with an 'Exile'. I never once swapped my suite. So two links (templar) and two basic nano hives worth of equipment wp max, 22 kills, Scanner in the third slot and A LOT of hacks turning objectives. All legitimate activities. This was before we got WP for scanning. If I pulled 2600+ WP in that setup, I have to imagine that the 500 some odd players above me on all the leader boards are doing this regularly. A solo orbital is one of the things people work for in this game. It's easy to pull as a squad leader, but alone it's hard a fun challenge. Please tell me you are not taking this away. Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers. Yea,, oops, I should've done some math before I jumped to conclusions. 400 wp per minute i've never come close to hitting in a 12 minute game
sssbassil WarRavens League of Infamy 10	Posted - 2013.10.30 06:51:00 - [144] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: [quote=ratamaq doc][quote=CCP Greyscale] Sorry yeah, I should've said, that 2k WP was scored in six minutes If you're scoring 2k WP over 10 or 15 minutes you're unlikely to run into the cap unless you score a large number very early on. 2k evenly spread over 10 minutes is only 200 WP/minute, which isn't a problem even with current cap numbers. still mite hit it, whats the point of playing skirmish and domination if you are capping WP WarPoints is the thing that makes players put in work on the battlefield WarPoints are the driveing thing in this game
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 876	Posted - 2013.10.30 07:29:00 - [145] - Quote Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 59	Posted - 2013.10.30 07:32:00 - [146] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally.

DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles 2342	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:05:00 - [147] - Quote I've never had a post with this much dev responses :D I wish you guys did this every time :P GûêGûêGûôGûÆGûæGûæGôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢GûæGûæGûÆGûôGûêGûêGûê ¸¸.GÇó¨GÇóGÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà¸¸.GÇó¨GÇó Gùó GùúForum Warrior LV. 2GùÑ Gùñ
General John Ripper MoIden Heath PoIice Department EoN. 11377	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:21:00 - [148] - Quote Dust 514's #1 Forum Warrior Founder of the Forum Warrior Club King of Tacos
SirManBoy Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 327	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:46:00 - [149] - Quote CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it.

CCP Greyscale C C P C C P Alliance 60	Posted - 2013.10.30 09:54:00 - [150] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: CCP Greyscale wrote: Rasatsu wrote: Why isn't orbital strike events used as an input to the WP capping algorithm, raising the ceiling for that player? This seems a much better solution than increasing the cap so much as to make it profitable to do a bit of exploitation near the end of matches. The more complexity and special-casing you add into the system, the more loopholes you end up with, so we really want to avoid adding any additional rules like this if we can possibly avoid it. The overall goal of the cap is for it to be just low enough that players actively farming WP find that it's not worth the boredom of doing it when they could be making nearly as much and having more fun playing normally. Have you seen the kind of WP logis gain when their teams get struck by an orbital and now 8+ people spawn immediately from uplinks? Add this to the fact that in some matches the ebb and flow is such that logis continue to accrue all match long via a constant flow of uplink spawns, resupply points through hives, triage, and so on. As someone who routinely scores 3000-4000 WP a game (much of it coming in large spurts), performing legitimate support activities that help my team, I worry that I'm going to be affected here. I like my play style the way it is and I don't want to be punished for it. If your 4000 point game is taking longer than nine minutes, and you're not scoring more than 1000 points in the first two minutes or so of the battle, you'll not be affected by this feature once we get the new numbers onto TQ.




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