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[Feedback] Time-To-Kill (TTK) is still much too short. Fix it.

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Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2796	Posted - 2013.10.18 17:26:00 - [61] - Quote Needed a bump...
Doshneil Antaro Dem Durrty Boyz Public Disorder. 131	Posted - 2013.10.18 19:35:00 - [62] - Quote Remov the 10% damage buff, make damage mods only one fitted per suit only, adjust aim assist to be more loose, and grenades supply Depot only restock. These changes would greatly improve TTK, but would leave armor suits at a disadvantage due to few mods that can actually be placed in the high slot that at are not shield related. To fix this issue, biotic should be able to be placed in either, but if you put one in a high slot, they should lock into high only. You shouldn't be able to have them in both at the same time. To move them to a low slot, unequivocally them from the high first, then stack away in the low. PG and CPU should work the same, or one is always high, one is always low would be acceptable. Dampener, precision enhancers, and range amplification should be in the same slots as the cpu upgrades, and code breakers the same as pg upgrades. These changes would not only improve TTK to an appropriate level, but also balance out the different mod usage, balance out shield vs armor, and reduce people's reliance of grenades doing all the work with no downside.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2798	Posted - 2013.10.19 05:30:00 - [63] - Quote BIotics in either, huh? Interesting.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 777	Posted - 2013.10.20 00:32:00 - [64] - Quote Zeylon Rho wrote: . . Aside from the fact that his aim was all over the place and he was barely hitting him, it's even quicker to kill people in Dust, a game where you can fit armor/shield modules and be customized after MONTHS of play. The fact you can drop people super-quick now isn't a newsflash; it's been all over the forums since 1.4 dropped. . . If after spending big time playing the game the difference between health would be also big, then this would be a bad game. One of the best things in Dust is that if you are using even a militia AR skillfully you can still kill veterans.
Cosgar ParagonX 6194	Posted - 2013.10.20 00:34:00 - [65] - Quote KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: Zeylon Rho wrote: . . Aside from the fact that his aim was all over the place and he was barely hitting him, it's even quicker to kill people in Dust, a game where you can fit armor/shield modules and be customized after MONTHS of play. The fact you can drop people super-quick now isn't a newsflash; it's been all over the forums since 1.4 dropped. . . If after spending big time playing the game the difference between health would be also big, then this would be a bad game. One of the best things in Dust is that if you are using even a militia AR skillfully you can still kill veterans. You're confusing core gameplay with balancing.
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1504	Posted - 2013.10.20 00:36:00 - [66] - Quote Signed
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 777	Posted - 2013.10.20 05:45:00 - [67] - Quote Cosgar wrote: KEROSIINI-TERO wrote: If after spending big time playing the game the difference between health would be also big, then this would be a bad game. One of the best things in Dust is that if you are using even a militia AR skillfully you can still kill veterans. You're confusing core gameplay with balancing. Even though I agree that 1.4 did decrease TTK by unnecessary amount, my point stands. The OP: Zeylon Rho wrote: . . You would think the fact that character advancement allows you to customize your suit would be a large factor, no? . . Aside from the fact that his aim was all over the place and he was barely hitting him, it's even quicker to kill people in Dust, a game where you can fit armor/shield modules and be customized after MONTHS of play. . . In addition on very spot on critique on 1.4 AA and hit detection, the OP clearly advocates for big playing history = big advantage. I still disagree on that.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2804	Posted - 2013.10.20 22:35:00 - [68] - Quote I'd focus more on the fact that fitting protective modules is an option in this game, and the options are largely irrelevant in the current state of affairs. As mentioned, heavies might be able to eek out a few more seconds, but they ultimately fall quickly like most players. I'm arguing that everyone should be alive longer. What degree of impact do you think something like a "Basic Shield Extender" (or MLT) has in the current game? Do you think those 22 hp make in any marked difference in how long someone stays alive? Do 33 hp? In either case, the hp from the module get wiped in in 1 AR "round", or which many many will fly in a single second. If you're concerned about new players, the extend to which a new player can choose to mitigate damage in a MLT/STD suit might be limited to two slots. So, a "new" player opting for survival-type "fittings" in an Amarr MLT suit would be able to sport TWO of those 22 hp non-factors (an Amarr MLT suit only has two high slots, no lows). So, as long as we have the damage situation as-is, new players are just as, if not more, screwed when outfitting their characters. That or we just say that modules of a certain type are just worthless. I don't think vets should be unkillable; a damage nerf across the board could give new players more time to evade death and make mistakes as well. As far as playing history making for an advantage, in a RPG where you can develop stats, skills, and assets - if history doesn't make a difference then we should all go back to playing Doom or some such. There's no point in persistence or RPG elements if they're cosmetic non-factors.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 805	Posted - 2013.10.21 00:04:00 - [69] - Quote Bump.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2809	Posted - 2013.10.21 17:16:00 - [70] - Quote TechMechMeds wrote: Bump. Thanks. Still an issue. I'm looking at not bothering capping out this week for the first time since April. I'm lacking faith that the blink-and-die timing will get changed, ever, with the lack of any real dev attention compared to their knee-jerk addition of the 10% dmg buff in less than a week.

Dehlia Metii not in a corporation 64	Posted - 2013.10.22 01:20:00 - [71] - Quote This is the sort of issue I think of when people refer to "core gameplay". If people die so quickly your fittings/weapons don't matter, then you invalidate the rest of the game design. Weapons and suits become like M&M colors; meaningless with respect to flavor with slightly different appearances.
Cosgar ParagonX 6340	Posted - 2013.10.22 19:19:00 - [72] - Quote Dehlia Metii wrote: This is the sort of issue I think of when people refer to "core gameplay". If people die so quickly your fittings/weapons don't matter, then you invalidate the rest of the game design. Weapons and suits become like M&M colors; meaningless with respect to flavor with slightly different appearances. That's exactly what it is, core gameplay. Aside from when I'm squading with people in my corp, I've just been running BPO fits and militia equipment on my logi suit. Fast deaths isn't good for logistics when you die before you can even drop a triage hive.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2825	Posted - 2013.10.23 09:28:00 - [73] - Quote This was in fact the first week I didn't cap since April. I think I'm going to give it a rest till you fix this. If I wanted to play a game with short TTK, no stats, twitch-style - I can find better. Though frankly I don't want to play that all. Maybe you'll make the leveling and equipment actually matter. It's utterly pointless as-is. For the longest time I saved up my SP for all the content that was "soon" after you gave "the last respec" back in May. I waited and waited... and NOTHING. So, I spent my SP. I was able to rationalize dying quickly despite fitting shield extenders, armor plates, etc. because I'd ran free fits for most of that time, and it makes sense that I'd die easily in a MLT suit, right? So, I got proto suits, shields, armor, weapons, fittings, etc. It didn't really make a difference. You still live a shorter life than someone playing a match of Halo or another game like that. Everyone dies like a grunt in a 90s shooter. The RPG elements are window-dressing that doesn't matter for now, and nothing we do matters in any way, ever. It's a persistent world we have no stake in. The proposed FW rewards are just fitting bonuses basically (at best), and that isn't interesting at all (we had those before, and they weren't that exciting then either). This whole game has been a slog since 1.4, that's enough of that. I hope you fix it at some point and move away from twitch shooter territory, because you're not going to beat Halo/CoD by being crappyHalo or crappyCoD.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 850	Posted - 2013.10.23 09:32:00 - [74] - Quote Bump
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 436	Posted - 2013.10.23 15:36:00 - [75] - Quote I want to see the removal of the 10% weapon buff too. We should re-evaluate after that. Fittings should play more of a role, and they don't right now.
Cosgar ParagonX 6364	Posted - 2013.10.23 15:44:00 - [76] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: I want to see the removal of the 10% weapon buff too. We should re-evaluate after that. Fittings should play more of a role, and they don't right now. Exactly. Start with the damage buff and other little hot fixes made between 1.0-1.4 and re-evaluate from there. Huge sweeping changes are what got us in this mess.
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 174	Posted - 2013.10.23 17:15:00 - [77] - Quote Removing auto-aim and dropping AR/SR damage by 10% is a good place to start. I think most other anti personnel weapons have fallen into a decent balance and there's no need to nerf them.
Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1272	Posted - 2013.10.23 17:41:00 - [78] - Quote This really needs to be addressed soon. The week before 1.4 deployed I did a purge of inactives from Subdreddit, which left us with 382 members who had logged in at least once during the previous month. After 1.4, people stopped logging in. Some people thought it was the Scotty errors that first few days that did it, but the numbers kept falling off a cliff long after those problems were fixed. From what I've heard in our IRC, people are frustrated as hell with the blink and you're dead mechanics. Especially the scouts. A large number of these people are ones who played through the darkest days of closed beta. They find the gameplay less interesting than when we only had a handful of weapons and no racial gear. I looked at our membership last login date, and about half of our members have not logged in at all during the last month. Of the rest, only a quarter have logged in during the last week. Dust is supposed to be a thinking shooter, and for a while it was. Now it's an entirely random battlefield where the only gear that matters is your weapon. We've been running FW battles since TEST joined the Caldari militia a week ago, and getting people to give Dust another chance has been like pulling teeth from a rooster. The longer this goes on the longer it will take to convince these people to come back, and we can't be the only corp facing this problem.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2831	Posted - 2013.10.23 23:53:00 - [79] - Quote This is the sort of thing that needed a hotfix shortly after 1.4 launched.
Cosgar ParagonX 6383	Posted - 2013.10.24 05:38:00 - [80] - Quote Had a friend jump on tonight after an extended break. His first reaction was "Why the hell do I have 20,000,000 SP into heavies and do just as good in starter fits?!" He called it CoD 514 and promptly uninstalled.

Borne Velvalor Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 800	Posted - 2013.10.24 06:18:00 - [81] - Quote PRO fittings compared to starter fits can substantially increase your life span. 60% more health and 30% more damage is a large advantage. This would actually be relevant if the average Duvolle user with mods didn't go from cutting you down in 1 second to 1.5 seconds before you can get a shot off to capitalize on the increased damage.
Draco Cerberus Hell's Gate Inc 429	Posted - 2013.10.24 13:13:00 - [82] - Quote If the 10% buff to weapon were to be removed it should be removed across the board, no favoritism. I'm tired of being taken down within 1.5 seconds of concentrated fire (not spray and pray although that sucks worse).
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 176	Posted - 2013.10.24 16:35:00 - [83] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: If the 10% buff to weapon were to be removed it should be removed across the board, no favoritism. I'm tired of being taken down within 1.5 seconds of concentrated fire (not spray and pray although that sucks worse). Spray and Prayer's prayers have been answered, it's called auto aim, and the amount of praying needed to land a shot now is very, very low. I wish people would realize how much AA has affected the TTK in this game, but it's like asking people to un-bribe themselves.
Cosgar ParagonX 6418	Posted - 2013.10.24 18:07:00 - [84] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: Draco Cerberus wrote: If the 10% buff to weapon were to be removed it should be removed across the board, no favoritism. I'm tired of being taken down within 1.5 seconds of concentrated fire (not spray and pray although that sucks worse). Spray and Prayer's prayers have been answered, it's called auto aim, and the amount of praying needed to land a shot now is very, very low. I wish people would realize how much AA has affected the TTK in this game, but it's like asking people to un-bribe themselves. With the core mechanics taking such a casual turn, Dust 514 might as well be turn based.
Vell0cet Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 437	Posted - 2013.10.24 19:25:00 - [85] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: If the 10% buff to weapon were to be removed it should be removed across the board, no favoritism. I'm tired of being taken down within 1.5 seconds of concentrated fire (not spray and pray although that sucks worse). I agree, it should be across the board, although some weapons may need to be buffed back after re-evaluating.
Zeylon Rho Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2837	Posted - 2013.10.24 19:47:00 - [86] - Quote I'd be more concerned about 10% being "enough" rather than too much. The state of affairs with AA and hit-detection as-is might be a bit too much for the 10% damage revert to fix. 10% is a reasonable start though. Let's not forget, people will immediately ***** about people taking longer to kill than: before, than in CoD, than it takes before they get killed. That won't necessarily mean the game is balanced or fixed, it's just what you'd expect if they altered damage by some factor. If TTK goes from 1-3 seconds to 2-5 seconds, then I'm not sure if we can necessarily say things are fixed - just marginally better. The idea is to work ourselves towards something that functions well. The longer you stay in the current system, the more that people that still play get acclimated to the idea that people in Dust should die quickly like some other shooter. People will continue to work towards earning skills that don't really make a difference in the same way that people might work towards Farmville goals. There's a psychological appeal there. The idea is to give the game actual depth before all the players that are left are people that just want some low-rate version of space CoD. More MMO-RPG-FPS, less lobby shooter.
KA24DERT Pure Innocence. EoN. 177	Posted - 2013.10.24 20:36:00 - [87] - Quote Vell0cet wrote: Draco Cerberus wrote: If the 10% buff to weapon were to be removed it should be removed across the board, no favoritism. I'm tired of being taken down within 1.5 seconds of concentrated fire (not spray and pray although that sucks worse). I agree, it should be across the board, although some weapons may need to be buffed back after re-evaluating. There's some weapons that already have a huge TTK that don't need to be nerfed. If the Mass Driver took a 10% damage hit you would have to reload before being able to drop a heavy or a high hp assault. Really the biggest problem on the field right now is ARs and Scramblers combined with Auto Aim. That combination is the elephant in the room. It's a serious problem when an AR user can drop me in the time it takes my projectile to travel to them.
RedBleach LeSanglant Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 441	Posted - 2013.10.25 00:11:00 - [88] - Quote I don't have the solution but I do agree that the TTK is too short. When a logibro like me is getting this many kills with militia weaponry... i just cant be this good. - dont get me wrong I was happy with the distances in Chrome but with that taken out I have to get in the battle more than I like, and I can hold my own - well remain positive most of the time. But if there were greater efficacy in tanking I would appreciate it.
Cosgar ParagonX 6437	Posted - 2013.10.25 03:41:00 - [89] - Quote Since I still have a healthy supply of shield regulators, energizers, and rechargers left over, I tried out some more suit fittings in an attempt to get my recharge delay/rate to competitive levels. I'll spare you painful experience word for word and just say that if we're going to have these short lifespans, the above modules are going to need a significant buff. Armor repair as well.
INFINITE DIVERSITY IDIC Intara Direct Action Caldari State 90	Posted - 2013.10.25 04:22:00 - [90] - Quote Xaviah Reaper wrote: I think all except HMG should lose the 10% buff. those guys need a break. getting out gunned vs a basic AR when you have full hp and an mh82 point blank, isn't logical Thats funny cause I seen machete lopez in a logi lav rocking the hmg and he never died, killed about 20 people, guess he was just lucky.....



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