He mentioned how the HMG, a Heavy Weapon, is encroaching on the Blaster Rifles, a light weapon, Turf as being a concern. So this my be a ploy to get Sentinels to switch to Blaster Rifles. I've seen though his plot, nope, combat rilfe all day.

He mentioned how the HMG, a Heavy Weapon, is encroaching on the Blaster Rifles, a light weapon, Turf as being a concern. So this my be a ploy to get Sentinels to switch to Blaster Rifles. I've seen though his plot, nope, combat rilfe all day.

Oh you big bad expert, you.

I run sentinel without a logi leash crutch constantly. It is not necessary.

Further, Sentinels were never defined as a CQC role. That was assumed because the HMG was CQC.

What the hell were you gonna do if a heavy laser comes out with 200m optimal?

It'll work on infantry too. Ya gonna beat the "heavies are for CQC only drum hard then too?

There has never been a developer statement that sentinels are CQC. The HMG on the other hand... but things can change and designs can be rebuilt to fit the balance needs of the game.

Not some random player vision of how they think it should be.

Heavies are only CQC so long as the weapons dictate such.

There is no other heavy weapons, taking away their only weapon now, or forcing it into a "suppression" Role as in reducing its killing power to that of an Rifle will just mean a hot swap to Combat Rifles, again as in what happened at the start of Upraising.

Also, How you solo play your heavy in PUBs don't matter, a majority of Heavies when defending those clustered City points don't have "logi leashes" unless they are pushing or actively defending, they do however have support from those logis in the form of Hives, Scans, and spot heals.

"Not some random player vision of how they think it should be."
Funny how this applies to you more so than me.

Words and ego

No point in arguing with you, You've made it clear you want the Heavy to be "Area Denial without actual area denying weapons" and AV.

To address anti-shield concerns, after we add HAV progression, we will add anti-shield swarm launchers, and homing av-flux grenades, probably reduce lock on range on normal swarm launchers and add an anti-air version, most likely a single long range swarm missile to hopefully improve the rendering of incoming threats to dropships.

Well then I hope you buff the Python then. Swarms already 3-shot even the best fits, and they do -20% damageGǪ

To address anti-shield concerns, after we add HAV progression, we will add anti-shield swarm launchers, and homing av-flux grenades, probably reduce lock on range on normal swarm launchers and add an anti-air version, most likely a single long range swarm missile to hopefully improve the rendering of incoming threats to dropships.

I think the idea is to separate anti-air and antitank swarms from each other.

Also, I don't see why you'd need to buff swarms

Going to stop you right there.

No.

this thought is bad.

swarms need ZERO buffing.

it is not at any point being suggested.

Sorry I meant Pythons.
If they make the current swarms anti tank and slower with the already mentioned idea for Anti air missiles is there a need to buff the python right off the bat?

That's reminiscent of old CCP tactics of vehicle balance of changing too many things at once and that never went over well.

IMHO, I think the focus on the HMG rebalance needs to be its range. I think any PC player (or any seasoned vet) understands that if you run at a heavy full-frontal, you will lose. However, on numerous occasions I have have placed myself at reasonable distance and still I have been shredded down. The HMG's reach is just too much for the sockets we're playing in.

As for the Heavy's role, I am pretty sure it has been established that they're PD (Point Defense).

yes,

not sure, or hybrid, laser profile is very un-lorey

The fact that the HMG tears apart an entire racial weapon line In that entire racial weapon line's optimal range. With no recourse. This is an imbalance. Saying that only maps are a factor when the HMG rendering gallente CQC killers pointless there is a problem.

The gun performs universally well on all heavy suits. Light infantry weapons cannot say the same.

In CQC there are no drawbacks to deploying an HMG sentinel. It is always the optimal choice. This is TEXTBOOK imbalance.

This meta needs to be killed with fire.

The HMG is THE ONLY CHOICE, for every Sentinel that wants to do CQC, what they are meant for. You cannot nerf the HMGs CQC, nothing will ever stop it from being used up close, you nerf the Basic and people will just use the SKB, which even now is just as good as the others.

You reduce its range and damage too much and, like at the start of upraising, Heavies will just switch to Rifles, Combat Rifles to be exact.

I forgot, you want the Heavy "out of CQC" and forced into some arbitrary role. Agaan, what is going to stop Heavies from having logis glued to them a pushing points?

The balance has always been the Heavies lack of Speed, lack of passive scans, lack of slot variety, lack of equipment, and the need of Logistical support to be effective.

HMG dps and range will be toned down, burst hmg will keep current range, assault hmg will be a longer range autocannon with anti-vehicle capability.

why can't we have both, the lower dps, short range hmg and use the burst as the one you are describing, tighter, longer stream, and assault is what we have talked about?

I think the idea is to separate anti-air and antitank swarms from each other.

1. Hmmm. Sorry about that. Maybe specific numbers will help:

Prior to Falloff, an EWAR-maxed 250HP CA Scout provided passive recon at a fixed 20dB out to 91 meters.
Today, the same unit scans at 10dB out to 12m, 20dB out to 29m, 26dB out to 58m.

Prior to Falloff, an EWAR-maxed 288HP AM Scout provided passive recon at a fixed 18dB out to 86 meters.
Today, the same unit scans at 9dB out to 9m, 18dB out to 22m, 23dB out to 44m.

* Assumes units are decloaked (85% less range if cloaked).

To summarize, the "effective range" of passive scans has been more-or-less reduced by half. Meanwhile, a GalLogi with multiple 21dB, 200m, 90 degree scanners covers much more area at greater intensity (and his recon is shared team-wide, with directional arrows). A Field Commander who knows what he's doing will field a GalLogi for recon before he fields an AM or CA Scout.

---

2. High-intensity inner scan rings serve to provide early warning of incoming flank attack, and that's pretty much it. Beyond "I'm being attacked over here" inner scan rings are far too limited in range to provide meaningful recon / counter-infiltration functions; if you're 5-10 meters away from a unit, you are very likely exchanging bullets with that unit. In the absence of GalLogi perma-scan, you are absolutely correct about more EWAR interplay and counterplay among different unit types.

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3. That is correct. GalLogi scans are as strong as ever, which is why they replaced the weakened Recon Scout. As of December, passive recon is out, GalLogi active scans are in, and the highest tiers competitive play are perma-scanned at 21dB. Pretty much exactly like an Ambush match against Nyain San.

IMHO, I think the focus on the HMG rebalance needs to be its range. I think any PC player (or any seasoned vet) understands that if you run at a heavy full-frontal, you will lose. However, on numerous occasions I have have placed myself at reasonable distance and still I have been shredded down. The HMG's reach is just too much for the sockets we're playing in.

As for the Heavies role, I am pretty sure it has been established that they're PtD (Point Defence).

1. Hmmm. Sorry about that. Maybe specific numbers will help:

Prior to Falloff, an EWAR-maxed 250HP CA Scout provided passive recon at a fixed 20dB out to 91 meters.
Today, the same unit scans at 10dB out to 12m, 20dB out to 29m, 26dB out to 58m.

Prior to Falloff, an EWAR-maxed 288HP AM Scout provided passive recon at a fixed 18dB out to 86 meters.
Today, the same unit scans at 9dB out to 9m, 18dB out to 22m, 23dB out to 44m.

* Assumes units are decloaked (85% less range if cloaked).

To summarize, the "effective range" of passive scans has been more-or-less reduced by half. Meanwhile, a GalLogi with multiple 21dB, 200m, 90 degree scanners covers much more area at greater intensity (and his recon is shared team-wide, with directional arrows). A Field Commander who knows what he's doing will field a GalLogi for recon before he fields an AM or CA Scout.

---

2. High-intensity inner scan rings serve to provide early warning of incoming flank attack, and that's pretty much it. Beyond "I'm being attacked over here" inner scan rings are far too limited in range to provide meaningful recon / counter-infiltration functions; if you're 5-10 meters away from a unit, you are very likely exchanging bullets with that unit. In the absence of GalLogi perma-scan, you are absolutely correct about more EWAR interplay and counterplay among different unit types.

---

3. That is correct. GalLogi scans are as strong as ever, which is why they replaced the weakened Recon Scout. As of December, passive recon is out, GalLogi active scans are in, and the highest tiers competitive play are perma-scanned at 21dB. Pretty much exactly like an Ambush match against Nyain San.

By the way, some optional terminology changes on the HMG topic:
- Burst HMG receives a range and dispersion buff, becomes standard HMG.
(Short bursts, medium range - typically Minmatar)
- Standard HMG gets a range reduction, becomes assault HMG.
(Short range bullet hose - typically Gallente)
- Assault HMG becomes autocannon, becomes breach HMG.
(Low RoF, long range - typically Caldari)

Also, while we're discussion heavy weapons, may I plant the idea that we're missing a anti-infantry Forgegun variant?
Such as the Tactical Forgegun - 80 m optimal range, 130 m effective range, 1.3 s charge up before skills, can't hold charge, 8 shots per clip, 500 damage per shot at proto, barely any splash damage.