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Dear Team True Grit: 1.8 FW Changes needed

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Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1548	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:20:00 - [1] - Quote So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster **** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it. 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution 3343	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:25:00 - [2] - Quote 1) Maybe players could choose what system they want to deploy into and whether it's an attack or a defense? Maybe players in EVE could start the battles for a faction, and then deploy mercs there? When I'm depressed, I cut myself......A BIG SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE! nú+
ZiwZih Seraphim Initiative.. 326	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:29:00 - [3] - Quote One hundred people coming together and failing at OP = failed FW system. Also: EHA DOES NOT EXIST! ZEN 514
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 598	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:31:00 - [4] - Quote I think you guys are both on target. Team deploy + ability to select location of attack or defense = actual merged EVE / Dust faction warfare.
Mortedeamor 1144	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:38:00 - [5] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: 1) Maybe players could choose what system they want to deploy into and whether it's an attack or a defense? Maybe players in EVE could start the battles for a faction, and then deploy mercs there? +1 why use suits when ccp gave us nice shiny op as hell tanks that cost next to nothing
Mortedeamor 1144	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:40:00 - [6] - Quote Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster **** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it. 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers +1 i would like to add eve pilots need to be able to give the targeting of they're orbitals to 1 person they choose why use suits when ccp gave us nice shiny op as hell tanks that cost next to nothing
richiesutie 2 The Rainbow Effect 580	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:41:00 - [7] - Quote +1 compilation of Patch/build notes Check it out! :)
Knight Soiaire BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 4049	Posted - 2013.12.28 23:44:00 - [8] - Quote Queueing into FW needs to be reworked. A player with high SP, and a lot of experience, should get priority over a newb fresh from the academy. It should go; Full Squad > High SP Player > Newb DUST is so broken, even my PS3 refuses to let me play it.
Zaria Min Deir Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 372	Posted - 2013.12.29 00:21:00 - [9] - Quote This experiment seriously highlighted how badly FW has been implemented. What purpose does the link between Eve and Dust serve any of us, if the battle locations we mercs deploy into are completely random? Seriously. Yay, we have Eve support... that's in the wrong effing region. Very useful. Have you considered installing the improved keyboard? "Go Go Power Rangers!"
Marston VC SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1392	Posted - 2013.12.29 00:24:00 - [10] - Quote Yeah the UI of the game just didn't allow us to function the way we wanted to. We kept getting fights on the same districts/systems over and over again for over two hours. The coms system is bugged so we couldn't mute/kick people who were being annoying, and we had to do massive Qsyncs just to make sure we had people on the same teams. what this game needs right now is Team Deploy and the ability to choose or "initiate" an attack on specific systems/planets/districts that way we can properly coordinate with the EVE side who, in case you guys didn't know, CAN choose where they want to attack. I was really hoping today would be the first big step in showing a meaningful link between Dust and EVE and instead it was just disappointing Marston VC, STB Director

Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2333	Posted - 2013.12.29 01:34:00 - [11] - Quote +1 to the OP There really needs to be something that allows the fights to be directed from Eve and those pilots need to at least have the option to chose who they have fight. The mic bugs in team chat need to be fixed as well. It makes organized ops like this even more difficult. While the geography in Dust may not seem important the tools need to be in place to allow the importance of the geography to emerge. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 713	Posted - 2013.12.29 01:43:00 - [12] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: 1) Maybe players could choose what system they want to deploy into and whether it's an attack or a defense? Maybe players in EVE could start the battles for a faction, and then deploy mercs there? Amen to the second one, brother, amen. EVE side battle control FTW. Munch Dedicated Sniper. Minmatar Patriot (5).
Maximus Stryker Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 755	Posted - 2013.12.29 05:09:00 - [13] - Quote Bumped for importance on the issue. *Faction Channels for FW Staging* PIE Ground Control \| Caldari Hierarchy \| Turalyon \| Chosen Matari
Brigitte Newt The Rainbow Effect 74	Posted - 2013.12.29 18:17:00 - [14] - Quote This issue should float on the first page; it is really important to large part of community CCP and Factional Warfare is great way for DUST and EVE to permeate meaningfully... If done right. Which is not the case at the moment. Factional Warfare should be the thing for now, before 0.0, total economy merge, etc. and should be done right. Especially with rather piteous Planetary Conquest system as a sort of "end game" mode we have now.
Malek McRoland DUST University Ivy League 153	Posted - 2013.12.29 18:28:00 - [15] - Quote Bump Loyal Amarr and Caldari supporter Don't even start with AV and how tanks are not OP.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 2073	Posted - 2013.12.29 18:37:00 - [16] - Quote Yea add the social skills from EVE Also add in the FW Tiering system which is in EVE so that if one side has T4 in EVE we get cheaper LP prices but if its T2 we get higher LP prices Intelligence is OP
ZiwZih Seraphim Initiative.. 331	Posted - 2013.12.29 19:37:00 - [17] - Quote Brigitte Newt wrote: This issue should float on the first page; it is really important to large part of community CCP and Factional Warfare is great way for DUST and EVE to permeate meaningfully... If done right. Which is not the case at the moment. Factional Warfare should be the thing for now, before 0.0, total economy merge, etc. and should be done right. Especially with rather piteous Planetary Conquest system as a sort of "end game" mode we have now. My girl, smart girl! ZEN 514
Argo Filch Cannonfodder PMC 67	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:03:00 - [18] - Quote Free Beers wrote: First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it. I'd go as far as saying these few FW changes we got in 1.7 (FF, LP Payouts/Store and changed Orbital Mechanics) didn't have a business being in 1.7 before the stuff Beers mentions was implemented. Right now it's a half assed system, which only purpose seems to be is to siphon isk from the player base. Tried to tell FoxFour, when he first came onto IRC a few months ago to ask about feedback regarding FW changes, that having LP only payouts without a market is stoopid. What these stoopid LP only payouts did to my small corp is to fracture the few members into factions for which they will or absolutely will not play... Great work. This turned most of us off from playing dust at all, because who wants to play only pub matches. In 1.8 there really needs to be some form of contracts from eve, team deploy and either a player market or isk payouts for FW games... because having to run SCHITTY pub matches to afford playing the game mode that's actually fun SUCKS! So this is one of the rare moments i'm agreeing with Beers here.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 11478	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:16:00 - [19] - Quote +1 to OP CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Rail Turret =// Unlocked
Ensar Cael The Unit 514 74	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:33:00 - [20] - Quote BUMPED WITH EXTREME PREJUDICE....

G Torq ALTA B2O 335	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:34:00 - [21] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: Yea add the social skills from EVE Also add in the FW Tiering system which is in EVE so that if one side has T4 in EVE we get cheaper LP prices but if its T2 we get higher LP prices This sounds like pure gibberish.... Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
Malek McRoland DUST University Ivy League 157	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:37:00 - [22] - Quote Ensar Cael wrote: BUMPED WITH EXTREME PREJUDICE.... Extreme Prejudice is also the title of a movie.....an old one but good. And another BUMP because I would really like to have at least a CHANCE of winning in FW Caldari and Amarr battles, along with having a reason to buy the LP Market stuff other than to burn ISK and LP just to wear AUR equivalent gear. Loyal Amarr and Caldari supporter Don't even start with AV and how tanks are not OP.
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1920	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:45:00 - [23] - Quote +1 seriously... Team Deploy = you don't need to return Corp Contracts... A-Teams win Battles B-Teams win Campaigns C-Teams win Wars
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2469	Posted - 2013.12.29 20:56:00 - [24] - Quote Agree with the OP. But they knew it was incomplete but wanted to release content. Hopefully it gets work quicker than PC. There is so much potential in FW. Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 610	Posted - 2013.12.29 21:23:00 - [25] - Quote I agree that ether 1.7 FW systems is very incomplete, however, it did lay the paving stones for what could literally be a game changing event if they make a few key updates. - team deploy - eve side battle control...putting out contracts in general or to specific corps to battle for a given system. Let them provide the ISK pool that we are missing from FW. They put a 5 mil ISK contract out for Old Man Star offer it to a Dust corp...if your team wins the match you split up the 5mil if you lose you only get 2mil.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2539	Posted - 2013.12.29 21:30:00 - [26] - Quote spot on comments from all. however we still need to keep in mind that even implementing these 2 things, which overall will be an improvement, does not improve the actual gameplay of it. Memory leaks and our ever impressive new map that is a loss of framerate guarantee for all... makes it difficult to even get too hyped about such positive changes and tweaks that the community have provided. some sort of system to prevent the winning team from conquering a district, and then defending it the next 4 straight matches.. over and over. Dust players don't see the effect of system control. we see an info screen that shows us a % and that has excited many players in and of itself... a few weeks in, we all notice these numbers rarely, if ever, change. even when winning over 100 straight matches... no difference made. the isk sink is a major issue for many as seen here. The hourglass is getting low on sand... Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
KA24DERT TeamPlayers Negative-Feedback 349	Posted - 2013.12.29 21:39:00 - [27] - Quote Yeah... FW is one of the best things this game has going for it right now. Unless you guys got something major up your sleeves (i'm not talking more suits or guns or maps...), you guys need hunker down and sprint on this for a few days to make FW a more fluid and meaningful experience than it is now.
Everything Dies Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 384	Posted - 2013.12.29 21:50:00 - [28] - Quote Free Beers wrote: 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. I thought about this yesterday, and came up with two possible solutions: 1. A slider that lets you determine the payout for the battle, consisting of three options--first, the current system of 100% reward going to LP. A second option would be a 50/50 split that pays out half of what you'd normally earn for each category and lastly, the option of taking a full 100% IKS payout for the battle. The player would be able to select whichever option they wanted either prior to or after the battle. 2. Have the losing side gain ISK while the winning side earns LP. This would (hopefully) encourage players to stick with a losing battle much more than a meager 75LP does. That said, the relative inexpensiveness of loyalty items does raise concerns (for me, at least) that these items should be restricted to FW only. It didn't take long to see Federation/Republic/etc. weapons start flooding pub matches, and I can now throw together a suit that is comparable to my best proto for a faction of the price, even including the cost of items that I can't purchase through my chosen loyalty stores. Heck, I'm only at level 3 in Gallente and 2 for Minmatar but I can still purchase dozens of proto weapons for less than the cost of one regular proto item. Life is killing me.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3499	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:15:00 - [29] - Quote Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1573	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:22:00 - [30] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks for responding Nullarbor. I do want to say that fw has been a blast and am pleased with it overall. Any comment on the isk part of the discussion or eve based contracts? I know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw. [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me

Epicsting pro FACTION WARFARE ARMY 324	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:27:00 - [31] - Quote +1 for dev post For the mother land.

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3500	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:28:00 - [32] - Quote Free Beers wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks for responding Nullarbor. I do want to say that fw has been a blast and am pleased with it overall. Any comment on the isk part of the discussion or eve based contracts? I know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw. We knew this would happen while there was no player market and expected players to have to play both pubs and fw for the time being. We may still need to balance the LP payouts and if it looks like the player market is going to take too long and we start seeing a decline in faction warfare participation then I could see us considering adding ISK back in to bridge the gap, but it wouldn't stay and was never the design to have ISK payouts. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Fire of Prometheus DUST University Ivy League 2447	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:30:00 - [33] - Quote Free Beers wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks for responding Nullarbor..... Any comment on the isk part of the discussion or eve based contracts? I know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw. ^this or how about buffing the commando? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1615413#post1615413 Proud member of the Commndo 6 <3 Commando AK.0
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2472	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:31:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Free Beers wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks for responding Nullarbor. I do want to say that fw has been a blast and am pleased with it overall. Any comment on the isk part of the discussion or eve based contracts? I know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw. We knew this would happen while there was no player market and expected players to have to play both pubs and fw for the time being. We may still need to balance the LP payouts and if it looks like the player market is going to take too long and we start seeing a decline in faction warfare participation then I could see us considering adding ISK back in to bridge the gap, but it wouldn't stay and was never the design to have ISK payouts. Good to hear Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1430	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:37:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Free Beers wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks for responding Nullarbor. I do want to say that fw has been a blast and am pleased with it overall. Any comment on the isk part of the discussion or eve based contracts? I know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw. We knew this would happen while there was no player market and expected players to have to play both pubs and fw for the time being. We may still need to balance the LP payouts and if it looks like the player market is going to take too long and we start seeing a decline in faction warfare participation then I could see us considering adding ISK back in to bridge the gap, but it wouldn't stay and was never the design to have ISK payouts. I would then, with absolutely minimal snarkiness, suggest that you do it. There have been so many things that have been bridges already that are less critical. All my likes to the OP and those that helped carry this out. FW has been hugely disappointing, perhaps no more so than to those of us who don't have the corporate resources to pull these kinds of operations off but nonetheless wanted to try to "make a difference" in FW. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 614	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:49:00 - [36] - Quote Fire of PrometheusI know many of us are getting light in the wallet and i fear that in time players will be forced to play pubs instead of fw.[/quote wrote: ^this or how about buffing the commando? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1615413#post1615413 Had to squeeze that one in, eh?
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 614	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:55:00 - [37] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks of the response, Nullabor. Curious as to your thoughts on how difficult it would be to have EVE side entities offer contracts for FW matches? Essentially use the EVE side to monetize FW for the dust teams. It strikes me that the more interdependent the two games are, particularly if Dust is seen as additive gameplay experience to EVE, this will help both products. More dust mercs will open EVE accounts to support their ops with orbitals or pay for FW contracts and more EVE side folks will dip into Dust and increase our player base. Thanks!
Aisha Ctarl 0uter.Heaven 2551	Posted - 2013.12.29 22:57:00 - [38] - Quote Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2472	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:03:00 - [39] - Quote Jaysyn Larrisen wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Thanks of the response, Nullabor. Curious as to your thoughts on how difficult it would be to have EVE side entities offer contracts for FW matches? Essentially use the EVE side to monetize FW for the dust teams. It strikes me that the more interdependent the two games are, particularly if Dust is seen as additive gameplay experience to EVE, this will help both products. More dust mercs will open EVE accounts to support their ops with orbitals or pay for FW contracts and more EVE side folks will dip into Dust and increase our player base. Thanks! This is where it's at. I hope the next expansion in Eve brings a new interface for fleets wanting to offer orbital support. For example them seeing a list of districts with timers to when support will be necessary. There is so much that can be done in FW. I think it could help make Eve FW more fun as well. Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 348	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:05:00 - [40] - Quote Knight Soiaire wrote: Queueing into FW needs to be reworked. A player with high SP, and a lot of experience, should get priority over a newb fresh from the academy. It should go; Full Squad > High SP Player > Newb No,that would leave them completely out in some cases They would keep getting put behind each coming person Squads makes since, it was made that way to make sure Scotty doesn't keep finding games with 2 open slots and leaving out squads "May God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ give you grace and peace" - Second Corinthians chapter one verse two.

Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2472	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:06:00 - [41] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. To be fair it was easy to see this early on. Even if Amarr were winning the flaws would be there, it would just be less of an impact on your wallet. For now it's a good way to try new stuff without spending AUR (if that stuff is Gallente or Minmitar). Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
pyramidhead 420 Carbon 7 CRONOS. 254	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:09:00 - [42] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. i told you bums, you'd be licking my boots come dec 10th (1.7 deployment date) , now with your 0% district owership, all you wanna do is cry how broken it is.
Aisha Ctarl 0uter.Heaven 2552	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:12:00 - [43] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. To be fair it was easy to see this early on. Even if Amarr were winning the flaws would be there, it would just be less of an impact on your wallet. For now it's a good way to try new stuff without spending AUR (if that stuff is Gallente or Minmitar). I saw it coming as well, but it's still kind of a surprising that Aero, the number one Amarr, the dude with the unflappable spirit has now at least imo has become a bitter vet that has pretty much had it with the game. I squaded up with him earlier and he did about a match and a half before he was fed up...I felt his pain, I wanted to cry for him. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
Aisha Ctarl 0uter.Heaven 2552	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:14:00 - [44] - Quote pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. i told you bums, you'd be licking my boots come dec 10th (1.7 deployment date) , now with your 0% district owership, all you wanna do is cry how broken it is. It's idiots like you that makes me want to beat you to death...CCP has stated that FW is not want they want it to be and admits it's flawed. Buy hey, congrats, you're kicking ass in a flawed system when the three of us even separate are better at this game than you can dream to be. Dumbass. "The Wrath of God is Immense. His Justice is Swift and Decisive. His Tolerance is Limited." -The Code of Demeanor
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2543	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:24:00 - [45] - Quote I still have a hard time grasping LP gear also costing isk, and each store is incomplete. obviously each faction has certain things, based on the factions (shields etc.) to make FW self sustaining all markets should have all items available, and the specialty ones perhaps cheaper for the faction of origin. the initial LP grind would be an isk sink or militia for some, but then they use LP to get LP and not involve isk in FW. Currently you have to fight for a particular faction to get the suits/mods/vehicles etc. Whether you want to fight for that faction or not or continue to sink isk 1 solution was already mentioned, having a contract system thru EvE. Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
knight of 6 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 925	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:26:00 - [46] - Quote glad to see these features are in the works! "God favors the side with the best artillery" ~ Napoleon Ko6, scout, tanker. CLOSED BETA VET
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 786	Posted - 2013.12.29 23:41:00 - [47] - Quote Glad to see someone else, the OP, agrees that PC is kinda pointless and should be ditched till Dust gets into null sec. A lot of the problems that it seems this operation hit were due to the poor UI. Again. Why wasn't team deploy in there from day one? Why are we still having even basic Comms problems? For FW to work within the existing Eve system these are the very basics that should be in place. What it boils down to is that I think PC should never have been brought in and then simply left us to fester in Molden Heath ever since. If it wasn't ready to be expanded beyond MH after a couple of months, then it should never have been brought in at all. All it is done is chuck in vast sums of ISK into an economy that wasn't there to begin with, causing later problems with the player market. It's been a waste of development time in terms of expanding the interest of the players and the lack of its expansion has just turned it in a Ponzi scheme for a select few. I'm willing to wager that the CCP economists were never brought in on it.... Now, I'm not saying that its a waste of development time if you learned something about how to do and not do things on the PS3 and Unreal engine but I was never a fan of the PC concept, even at Fanfest when it's explained to us. It also demonstrates something about the design thought process that was going into the game prior to that time. I see signs already that CCP Rouge is changing that design process, but up to Fanfest CCP were putting 'cool' things into the game with seemingly no thought whatsoever as to its long term effects on the game. FW is a cool idea and certainly a better way of engaging the more casual players than PC in its current form ever will. I'm just very concerned that CCP saw fit to put into the game when the game is lacking the most basic tools to implement it. In a game like this is going to be, a flawlessly working UI is going to be ESSENTIAL. Simply chucking it in as an afterthought is a recipe for disaster. Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1432	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:00:00 - [48] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. To be fair it was easy to see this early on. Even if Amarr were winning the flaws would be there, it would just be less of an impact on your wallet. For now it's a good way to try new stuff without spending AUR (if that stuff is Gallente or Minmitar). I saw it coming as well, but it's still kind of a surprising that Aero, the number one Amarr, the dude with the unflappable spirit has now at least imo has become a bitter vet that has pretty much had it with the game. I squaded up with him earlier and he did about a match and a half before he was fed up...I felt his pain, I wanted to cry for him. In a way, we should cry for all of us, because if even he can be broken by this game, we all can. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
Cpl Foster USMC The Defiants-Team 6 408	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:02:00 - [49] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... 250,000,000 isk....what's in your wallet...??
Kevall Longstride DUST University Ivy League 786	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:22:00 - [50] - Quote Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I sense that it might find its way onto a T-Shirt at Fanfest... "We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win.GÇ¥ JFK Mercenary Clone of Dennie Fleetfoot CEO of DUST University

Aeon Amadi Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4243	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:30:00 - [51] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Let's be realistic here, we've spoken at length about a lot of things and that goes for CCP, the CPM and the Community. I'm not trying to sound abrasive but expectations for these things to come out in the future, let alone the near future, aren't exactly high. If the time constraints are a primary choke point for rolling out needed features than perhaps it's time to take a step back from the monthly release cycles so that everyone can consolidate and formulate achievable goals instead of trying to tackle individual aspects one at a time with little to no preparation at all. forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m= (Frames)1544109 (Advertisement)1556863 (Packs)1570030 (Lag Hunt) 1570201
Ion Crush Altyr Initiative 150	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:47:00 - [52] - Quote I really like the idea of having eve pilots able to choose some Fw districts to attack. It makes sense to coordinate ground attacks and space operations.
Darius Ashran Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 35	Posted - 2013.12.30 00:59:00 - [53] - Quote Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it. 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers Holy ** Free beers you where actually articulate and constructive. And... do I detect a hint of sobriety in this post @_@ WTF IS THE WORLD COMING TO! Glad to see your still around man. I agree 100% +1 It might also be a consideration as per the eve side rewards. To grant say 50-100 LP per Target in dust. Or a flat number in the 400-650 range per strike that you address. I think that might be a solid incentive to offer eve players. Who knows maybe more. I would like to know what others think on this who are Dust/EVE Players as well. Separate but related not is we might want to consider having some form of advanced notice. I don't know if that's possible and certainly would like to hear dev response regarding it. But if eve players could query a menu for instance. And look at the up coming battles and districts for their faction. That would give them say a 20-30 minute lead time would normally be enough for eve pilots to organize and get on site.
Flint Beastgood III GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 421	Posted - 2013.12.30 01:03:00 - [54] - Quote Knight Soiaire wrote: Queueing into FW needs to be reworked. A player with high SP, and a lot of experience, should get priority over a newb fresh from the academy. It should go; Full Squad > High SP Player > Newb Yup, and we're back to the issue of "noobs shouldn't be allowed in FW". Who on earth would hire a merc with no experience? Gÿó +¦ +¦ Gÿó Trained Skills
ReGnYuM Imperfects 1635	Posted - 2013.12.30 01:09:00 - [55] - Quote +1 Overall good read Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset To the Matari, I am the equivalent to the Boogie Man
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 2006	Posted - 2013.12.30 01:20:00 - [56] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. The queing for a specific system was allready there before when we had normal FW matches with ISK payouts. You could go to the starmap and join a match from there. So my question is why did you removed this feature? The whole op coulda have beeing a success if we could simply select the districts from the starmap to get better coordination with eve players going. You had a feature and then removed it for unknown reasons. The simple way to fix this is to allow queing from the starmap. After all the FW fights are based on it if somebody is doing a plex in space or not. I shall show you a world, a world which you cant imagine, a world full off butthurt n00bs at the other end of my gun
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 598	Posted - 2013.12.30 01:28:00 - [57] - Quote Placate, Shadows , Mirrors. CCP, Crowd Control Production.
Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1921	Posted - 2013.12.30 02:13:00 - [58] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: I still have a hard time grasping LP gear also costing isk, and each store is incomplete. obviously each faction has certain things, based on the factions (shields etc.) to make FW self sustaining all markets should have all items available, and the specialty ones perhaps cheaper for the faction of origin. the initial LP grind would be an isk sink or militia for some, but then they use LP to get LP and not involve isk in FW. Currently you have to fight for a particular faction to get the suits/mods/vehicles etc. Whether you want to fight for that faction or not or continue to sink isk 1 solution was already mentioned, having a contract system thru EvE. Personally, I think this is b/c in EVE, ISK is easy to make I can with my cruiser just doing PvE make 30-40 mill in an hour if I push it but in Dust making ISK is difficult A-Teams win Battles B-Teams win Campaigns C-Teams win Wars
Malek McRoland DUST University Ivy League 160	Posted - 2013.12.30 02:34:00 - [59] - Quote BUMP-ITY Even an update every two months would be good by me. Cleaner content is better than fixing stuff month after month. Loyal Amarr and Caldari supporter Don't even start with AV and how tanks are not OP.
Slightly-Mental Planetary Research and Investments 24	Posted - 2013.12.30 02:39:00 - [60] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: 1) Maybe players could choose what system they want to deploy into and whether it's an attack or a defense? Maybe players in EVE could start the battles for a faction, and then deploy mercs there? +1

pyramidhead 420 Carbon 7 CRONOS. 254	Posted - 2013.12.30 03:34:00 - [61] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. i told you bums, you'd be licking my boots come dec 10th (1.7 deployment date) , now with your 0% district owership, all you wanna do is cry how broken it is. It's idiots like you that makes me want to beat you to death...CCP has stated that FW is not want they want it to be and admits it's flawed. Buy hey, congrats, you're kicking ass in a flawed system when the three of us even separate are better at this game than you can dream to be. Dumbass. got your skirt all ruffled up kid, dont get so mad about the ass kickings were handing you scrubs
Niuvo NECROM0NGERS Covert Intervention 954	Posted - 2013.12.30 04:26:00 - [62] - Quote Turn off PC lol, I would rather be fighting for the Federation. FW should be for high SP ppl, it's frustrating having muppets on your team. I want to fight for a cause. I want to feel that my participation in a battle matters. We help eve out by taking districts but how do they help us besides the obs? Let the campaigns begin!
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4305	Posted - 2013.12.30 04:39:00 - [63] - Quote Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it.** 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers I'm with you on everything but Number 3. I'd much rather they deploy all the rest of what you just said with a secondary player market, which really should have deployed with Faction Warfare in the first place. Let's get some commerce started at long last. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1594	Posted - 2013.12.30 04:47:00 - [64] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it.** 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers I'm with you on everything but Number 3. I'd much rather they deploy all the rest of what you just said with a secondary player market, which really should have deployed with Faction Warfare in the first place. Let's get some commerce started at long last. Per Nullarbor today they haven't done it yet because its a lot of effort. So we have to have isk rewards. You i assumed you would agree with 3 now [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 736	Posted - 2013.12.30 05:20:00 - [65] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: We knew this would happen while there was no player market and expected players to have to play both pubs and fw for the time being. So GÇª about the player market. When is that going to happen? Munch Dedicated Sniper. Minmatar Patriot (5).
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 736	Posted - 2013.12.30 05:28:00 - [66] - Quote Ion Crush wrote: I really like the idea of having eve pilots able to choose some Fw districts to attack. It makes sense to coordinate ground attacks and space operations. Yes. EVE side strategic management and orbital support would be hard-on inducing coolness. Getting DUST better integrated with EVE will save DUST. Munch Dedicated Sniper. Minmatar Patriot (5).

CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3528	Posted - 2013.12.30 07:03:00 - [67] - Quote Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I'm going to put on a project manager hat for a moment and hopefully explain that statement a little better, although feel free to keep your sound bite ;) Development of a feature takes a finite amount of time. When planning a release we are balancing what hits short term goals, what fits as part of the longer term plan, is there an order some things have to be done in and how long will it all take. Some things just physically take longer to do or cannot be done until certain other dependencies have been completed. It has nothing to do whether or not we think it might be "difficult", just a very pragmatic view on the hours available in a day to actually code and test it all. So for planning 1.7 for example, we put all the different features up on a board and prioritized / cost estimated each thing out. Team deploy just landed on the other side of the line as to what we could fit in the time we had available without significantly affecting the other things we could deliver for that release. Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit


CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3528	Posted - 2013.12.30 07:04:00 - [68] - Quote Malek McRoland wrote: BUMP-ITY Even an update every two months would be good by me. Cleaner content is better than fixing stuff month after month. Faction warfare was actually a 2 month development cycle, we held back for a release to get it done. Not every team releases every month. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Patrick57 Fatal Absolution 3383	Posted - 2013.12.30 07:22:00 - [69] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I'm going to put on a project manager hat for a moment and hopefully explain that statement a little better, although feel free to keep your sound bite ;) Development of a feature takes a finite amount of time. When planning a release we are balancing what hits short term goals, what fits as part of the longer term plan, is there an order some things have to be done in and how long will it all take. Some things just physically take longer to do or cannot be done until certain other dependencies have been completed. It has nothing to do whether or not we think it might be "difficult", just a very pragmatic view on the hours available in a day to actually code and test it all. So for planning 1.7 for example, we put all the different features up on a board and prioritized / cost estimated each thing out. Team deploy just landed on the other side of the line as to what we could fit in the time we had available without significantly affecting the other things we could deliver for that release. Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. +1 for a REAL and detailed response. :D When I'm depressed, I cut myself......A BIG SLICE OF CHOCOLATE CAKE! nú+
DeeJay One Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 161	Posted - 2013.12.30 08:23:00 - [70] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. Makes sense and always did for the most of us, only problem is only you (AKA CCP and probably a NDA-d CPM) know how it fits in the roadmap and what components are parts of the bigger scheme. If we'd have at least a list of feature which have to be done to have at least some features like team deploy or open market, even without specific dates it would be great. Maybe your buisness side at CCP thinks that it's better to announce features at Fanfest (like in 2.0 we will have X) without providing specifics, but fact is that affects your most loyal fanbase and Dust can use the same model as EVE does for features :/ Also we know how that ended up last time (MTACS or foilage anyone?) I for one really hope that the new universe data migration on Duality will help bring the market closer to release, but as we don't see the roadmap it's just a wish...

Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4308	Posted - 2013.12.30 08:29:00 - [71] - Quote Free Beers wrote: Mobius Wyvern wrote: Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it.** 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers I'm with you on everything but Number 3. I'd much rather they deploy all the rest of what you just said with a secondary player market, which really should have deployed with Faction Warfare in the first place. Let's get some commerce started at long last. Per Nullarbor today they haven't done it yet because its a lot of effort. So we have to have isk rewards. You i assumed you would agree with 3 now Well, judging by the post Nullarbor made a few posts after our own, I would expect that this would be something they are looking at working on even if it can't make it in by 1.8. I mean, I'd love to see FW fixed as quickly as possible, but imagine if we could get the other suits and the installations in for 1.8 if the FW changes and Market don't work out? Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
DeeJay One Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 161	Posted - 2013.12.30 08:32:00 - [72] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: I still have a hard time grasping LP gear also costing isk, and each store is incomplete. obviously each faction has certain things, based on the factions (shields etc.) to make FW self sustaining all markets should have all items available, and the specialty ones perhaps cheaper for the faction of origin. Well, that's just how loyalty points work both in FW and in "normal" EVE gameplay. That's the "loyalty" part in them and it wouldn't really work if you could spend Ammar LP in the Minmatar store. At least in Dust you have only 4 factions, in EVE every NPC corporation has it's own loyalty store - https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Loyalty_point
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1156	Posted - 2013.12.30 08:34:00 - [73] - Quote Move PC to nullsec and make it more EVE reliant. Fac war in 1.7 shows how the two games can work together, expand on it and you can make the hard sell to any gamer. The casual FPS player may not care atm, but I don't know anyone who doesn't think the two games concept is groundbreaking and awesome. Tarn chose peace. Tallen chose war. Where is my Gallente sidearm? SoonGäó514
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 574	Posted - 2013.12.30 09:17:00 - [74] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work And this is why all previous patches (and probably future ones) were worthless.
Niuvo NECROM0NGERS Covert Intervention 958	Posted - 2013.12.30 09:22:00 - [75] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I'm going to put on a project manager hat for a moment and hopefully explain that statement a little better, although feel free to keep your sound bite ;) Development of a feature takes a finite amount of time. When planning a release we are balancing what hits short term goals, what fits as part of the longer term plan, is there an order some things have to be done in and how long will it all take. Some things just physically take longer to do or cannot be done until certain other dependencies have been completed. It has nothing to do whether or not we think it might be "difficult", just a very pragmatic view on the hours available in a day to actually code and test it all. So for planning 1.7 for example, we put all the different features up on a board and prioritized / cost estimated each thing out. Team deploy just landed on the other side of the line as to what we could fit in the time we had available without significantly affecting the other things we could deliver for that release. Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. Take your time, do a great job. We'll thank you. Fan here.
Yagihige Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 508	Posted - 2013.12.30 09:23:00 - [76] - Quote I had an idea some time ago that would help with some of the complaints on this thread. Here em ta kool t'nod
DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 164	Posted - 2013.12.30 09:39:00 - [77] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: 1) Maybe players could choose what system they want to deploy into and whether it's an attack or a defense? Maybe players in EVE could start the battles for a faction, and then deploy mercs there? what never made sense to me, was how ccp made all those so called amazing improvments to the star map but wont let us use the damn thing to select battles lol. how can we defend a system if we cannot reliably get to it. its like trying to get home because youre family is in danger but the taxi drive keeps taking you to the wrong house.
DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 164	Posted - 2013.12.30 09:52:00 - [78] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. im sorry but you continue to give us icing without a cake to put it on. i dont care if its "a lot of work", get started on it and get it done. its your job. i dont complain and skip jobs at work because i feel its "a lot of work", i get it done. and if you had started on it along wong with the 1.7 fw changes and you couldnt finish it in time, you couldnt have come and and delayed 1.7 and said you wanted to release team deploy along with the fw changes because it made sense as a necessary design mechanic. failing that, which you did, it couldve been ready for 1.8. but instead, youre here telling us you dont wanna do it cause its hard lol. i just wanna wrap my hands around your neck and shake you! ps. yes im pissed at that comment. no i dont really want to hurt you, maybe jus a lil. its just frustrating to see you guys skip over stuff. if youre gonna gives us weapons, then give us all of them. or all the dropsuits, or all the vehicles, or pve, or cloaking devices and shield generators. stop skipping around all the time and just work on something until completion for once.
DeathwindRising ROGUE SPADES 165	Posted - 2013.12.30 10:19:00 - [79] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I'm going to put on a project manager hat for a moment and hopefully explain that statement a little better, although feel free to keep your sound bite ;) Development of a feature takes a finite amount of time. When planning a release we are balancing what hits short term goals, what fits as part of the longer term plan, is there an order some things have to be done in and how long will it all take. Some things just physically take longer to do or cannot be done until certain other dependencies have been completed. It has nothing to do whether or not we think it might be "difficult", just a very pragmatic view on the hours available in a day to actually code and test it all. So for planning 1.7 for example, we put all the different features up on a board and prioritized / cost estimated each thing out. Team deploy just landed on the other side of the line as to what we could fit in the time we had available without significantly affecting the other things we could deliver for that release. Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. who told you team deploy was something that should wait til post release? did the thought never occur to any of you back in beta that team deploy might actually be somewhat necessary? and here we are now 7 month after release which came almost year after the beta started and we still dont have it. so please tell us what are your priorities there, and which of themare going to be of any noticable value to your end users? as far as im concerned your greatest improvment to the game was getting rid of the UVT's which never made sense in the first place
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 574	Posted - 2013.12.30 10:49:00 - [80] - Quote Guys, don't believe the "LONG TERM PLAN" nonsense until they share it with us. It's the same as the SOON(TM), ROADMAP,... stuff. Maybe they should put on their communication-hat for once.

Hawkings Greenback Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 87	Posted - 2013.12.30 10:58:00 - [81] - Quote +1 OP & bumping the idea of more control over where & what to fight over. Just get some meaningful connection to EVE that isn't a damn lottery CCP. The sandox is short of sand & the box leaks Logi For Life-Mini Logi suit wearer & proud Forum Lurker-level unknown Do clones dream of Dolly the sheep
fragmentedhackslash FREE AGENTS LP 77	Posted - 2013.12.30 11:07:00 - [82] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=132085 Pain is just weakness leaving your body. Every day is a holiday. Every meal is a feast.
King Kobrah SyNergy Gaming EoN. 1404	Posted - 2013.12.30 11:09:00 - [83] - Quote pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. i told you bums, you'd be licking my boots come dec 10th (1.7 deployment date) , now with your 0% district owership, all you wanna do is cry how broken it is. It's idiots like you that makes me want to beat you to death...CCP has stated that FW is not want they want it to be and admits it's flawed. Buy hey, congrats, you're kicking ass in a flawed system when the three of us even separate are better at this game than you can dream to be. Dumbass. got your skirt all ruffled up kid, dont get so mad about the ass kickings were handing you scrubs I have personally demolished your qsynced corp multiple times, dont get cocky kid
Aeon Amadi Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4247	Posted - 2013.12.30 13:09:00 - [84] - Quote RKKR wrote: Guys, don't believe the "LONG TERM PLAN" nonsense until they share it with us. It's the same as the SOON(TM), ROADMAP,... stuff. Maybe they should put on their communication-hat for once. Jesus, RKKR, sometimes you sound like a spoiled brat forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m= (Frames)1544109 (Advertisement)1556863 (Packs)1570030 (Lag Hunt) 1570201
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1436	Posted - 2013.12.30 13:12:00 - [85] - Quote pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Buy hey, congrats, you're kicking ass in a flawed system when the three of us even separate are better at this game than you can dream to be. Dumbass. got your skirt all ruffled up kid, dont get so mad about the ass kickings were handing you scrubs Lol.... plays with marked cards .... claims to be worlds greatest poker player "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 1852	Posted - 2013.12.30 13:34:00 - [86] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Make it so we can pick from available contracts rather than the ability to start them as we are mercs then I'll agree to specific system deployment. We will have been stripped of almost all mercenary elements the moment we can. Claim sovereignty Start contracts Level 1 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 1852	Posted - 2013.12.30 14:57:00 - [87] - Quote Totally agreed on removing pc completely and over hauling it. Its nowhere near anything great I thought it would be and is completely off the merc path I'd hoped for, view shared by hundreds but most likely thousands. It needs things like - Eve corp interaction/ownership of some kind Ability for us dust mercs to gain standings with eve corps District bonuses etc Can't think of much at the mo sadly lol but if we had eve running the show we could remove the magic timers because we wouldn't be launching magical clone attacks with set times, the transports would ship clones in real time in eve but for this to work we'd need more territory I believe. We also need to build it around dust and eve in mind but I'd say eve takes precedence because so much can be done in eve, try squezzing dust in with eve and not the other way round concerning pc because the bottom line is that we go into a match a kill each other, sit in the mq or stand in the warbarge pretending to bum each other. I have a lot of ideas but can't think at the mo so I'll just say that pc, although theres some great technical achievements there for you ccp, its just not fun, its completely off the mark concerning being a merc beyond circle jerking in the war room and bragging. Its just completely off the mark totally and I'm hoping now after a few months more people are realising this, it needs a massive change. Anything you implement on what we have just polishes the turd a bit, its still just going to be a turd. Sorry I CBA to expand much at the mo and it is pretty vague. Level 1 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 1852	Posted - 2013.12.30 15:11:00 - [88] - Quote I'd also like to add that if we could gain standings with eve corps, you wouldn't lose any fighting against a corp you have good standings with as you are a merc but of course the eve corp could deny you future contracts? Etc You could also apply for something like citizenship with an eve corp you have Max standings with, again it would be up to their CEO to accept or deny this (trollish opportunities for you scum at the back) which would grant you isk bonuses and maybe certain levels of standings give you access to said eve corps hangar? Free access before mission to std, ADV and proto gear? Obviously the corp would need to manufacture or buy the items. Random ideas. Level 1 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.
Heavenly Daughter the Aurum Grinder and Company 259	Posted - 2013.12.30 15:45:00 - [89] - Quote Free Beers wrote: First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it. 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers On point 1, If caldari and armarr have no districts, there should be no battles PERIOD. ! Instead they CCP really ought to look at suits and weapon balancing owned by race to even the odds so that there is NEVER the situation that caldari or armarr have no districts. Good game mechanics would implement a balancing system even to the point of forcing players on a race to even the odds by overall KDR 50/50 or in that ball park. Don't really care if I attack or defend on FW as longs as i get LP for playing which I do :) so I get my suits either way lol. Agreed on contract, to see those up would be nice along with those big payouts too. TURN OFF PC, NO FKIN WAY. I think it's a great way to help mix up the players a little, FORCE players to play PC to fund the FW gear. Variety and all that. :) That also answers the need for ISK in FW, NOT required , if you need isk go play PC and MAYBE, just MAYBE the amarrians will have a chance to get a win or two, but then again lol.... Team deploy / Qsync definitely needs some TLC . __ `/.)\ Nade \| Scan Attempt Prevented \| 33 mill SP \__/ 514 \| NFP Prime League Winner\| Longest Kill 588 Mtr`
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2549	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:04:00 - [90] - Quote DeeJay One wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: I still have a hard time grasping LP gear also costing isk, and each store is incomplete. obviously each faction has certain things, based on the factions (shields etc.) to make FW self sustaining all markets should have all items available, and the specialty ones perhaps cheaper for the faction of origin. Well, that's just how loyalty points work both in FW and in "normal" EVE gameplay. That's the "loyalty" part in them and it wouldn't really work if you could spend Ammar LP in the Minmatar store. At least in Dust you have only 4 factions, in EVE every NPC corporation has it's own loyalty store - https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Loyalty_point Thats not what im saying at all. What im saying is each person has a faction they fight for. All the basic suits and mods should available in all stores, with discounts for factional specific weapons and suits. Even a discount for faction-specific mods. i nor most cannot run their prefeered setup using only LP playing for their desired faction. Its a logistical issue. I cant run amarr and have shiled extenders, codebreakers etc. i can run caldari and get shiled extenders, spend more wasted time fighting for rebel scum to get my hmg, then amarr for the suit... just poor logistics imo. And deters from potential progress for any 1 faction Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.

Dr Accipitradea Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 27	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:05:00 - [91] - Quote +1 for Team "TEAM DEPLOY"
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2344	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:09:00 - [92] - Quote A lot of really good thoughts and feedback. I couldn't have asked for more to come out of this, so a huge thanks to the client that sponsored the operation. Also big thanks to everyone who participated and helped me pull it together. I just wish the outcome could have been more "look at what can be done!" than "look at all the gaps still in the system." Unfortunately , until there are changes made, these kind of organized operations fail the return on investment test from both an Eve standpoint and Dust standpoint. The time and resources required to execute things like this doesn't come anywhere near the beneficial results. The key thing is that players DO want to organize and the DO want to see the results of their efforts. Changes and iterations have to come sooner rather than later as well. I have to agree with some of the earlier statements that ISK needs to be put back in the FW matches until the player market comes. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 576	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:10:00 - [93] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: RKKR wrote: Guys, don't believe the "LONG TERM PLAN" nonsense until they share it with us. It's the same as the SOON(TM), ROADMAP,... stuff. Maybe they should put on their communication-hat for once. Jesus, RKKR, sometimes you sound like a spoiled brat No I'm not because then I would post an unrelated 'haters gonna hate movieclip' as a response. I'm more like those crazy guys announcing the end of the world. Feel free to point us to the communication from CCP about the future of this game.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2550	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:11:00 - [94] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Cpl Foster USMC wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work I'm saving this for future threads... I'm going to put on a project manager hat for a moment and hopefully explain that statement a little better, although feel free to keep your sound bite ;) Development of a feature takes a finite amount of time. When planning a release we are balancing what hits short term goals, what fits as part of the longer term plan, is there an order some things have to be done in and how long will it all take. Some things just physically take longer to do or cannot be done until certain other dependencies have been completed. It has nothing to do whether or not we think it might be "difficult", just a very pragmatic view on the hours available in a day to actually code and test it all. So for planning 1.7 for example, we put all the different features up on a board and prioritized / cost estimated each thing out. Team deploy just landed on the other side of the line as to what we could fit in the time we had available without significantly affecting the other things we could deliver for that release. Make sense? I think it's actually all pretty straight forward and boring however I don't expect players to necessarily care. I understand the frustration that good ideas aren't delivered intermediately. The teams have the same passion for getting it all done. All of us here and commenting and providing feedback on how to make this all work, we all fully understand it takes time to implement things. we are saying the game is well beyond the point that these are the items that need to be the highest priority. Releasing content in a half-assed fashion which is the norm on this game simply has to stop. Releasing new content, while important, does nothing long germ when the current state of the game is, to be simple, broken. im just begging for the day we stop hearing excuses and see things actually getting done Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation 44	Posted - 2013.12.30 16:21:00 - [95] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Well, how will team deploy be implemented? If there's team deploy without matchmaking against other teams, 16 organized players showing up against randoms, or even squads of 6 means the battle is lost before it started. In that sense why even bother allowing players from any other corp in FW besides the big ones? Hopefully Scotty will pit teams against each other. I understand the idea of choosing selecting which contracts to take, but OP tends to have forgotten that contracts in its current form in gallente caldari war for example are also generated by Gallente capsuleers. There shouldn't be an isk payout, the loyalty store already makes items cheap. If they can't spalsh out 8K isk for a proto suit, well that's their own problem. FW could use some work, but don't just hand the games in it over to the who's who of pubstompers just because their favored race as a whole are getting their butts kicked. Do you remember all those modded controllers and the tactical duvolles? Do you think those guys went away? snakevenom
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2347	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:04:00 - [96] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Well, how will team deploy be implemented? If there's team deploy without matchmaking against other teams, 16 organized players showing up against randoms, or even squads of 6 means the battle is lost before it started. In that sense why even bother allowing players from any other corp in FW besides the big ones? Hopefully Scotty will pit teams against each other. I understand the idea of choosing selecting which contracts to take, but OP tends to have forgotten that contracts in its current form in gallente caldari war for example are also generated by Gallente capsuleers. There shouldn't be an isk payout, the loyalty store already makes items cheap. If they can't spalsh out 8K isk for a proto suit, well that's their own problem. FW could use some work, but don't just hand the games in it over to the who's who of pubstompers just because their favored race as a whole are getting their butts kicked. We already queue up to two teams of players every night for the "crappy Amarr" in hopes that there will be a good fight on the other side. Sometimes we end up against organized teams and it's a blast and other times we end up against randoms which isn't quite as fun but has it's own entertainment value. A team deploy system would have to allow each faction at least the chance of fielding an organized team to combat another The OP didn't forget at all that plexing does have an impact on where battles spawn, but it's hardly reliable. Outside of RP and the meta I could could care less who is winning or loosing. What matters is whether or not the system works and it is currently far from being where it needs to be. As for people not having the ISK to throw as this suit or that you really have to look at the current economic dynamics. The people in the best position right now to play FW are those that were successful when the golden age of PC hit or closed beta players that had huge stacks of loot converted into ISK. Right now the system punishes those that aren't farming passive ISK in PC and forces them to fight for this faction or that in order to chase gear. Even then the payouts for FW are so anemic that all but the most efficient players are left with nothing but FW being a bad investment. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Requin Toblat Glitched Connection 10	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:13:00 - [97] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Well, how will team deploy be implemented? If there's team deploy without matchmaking against other teams, 16 organized players showing up against randoms, or even squads of 6 means the battle is lost before it started. In that sense why even bother allowing players from any other corp in FW besides the big ones? Hopefully Scotty will pit teams against each other. I understand the idea of choosing selecting which contracts to take, but OP tends to have forgotten that contracts in its current form in gallente caldari war for example are also generated by Gallente capsuleers. There shouldn't be an isk payout, the loyalty store already makes items cheap. If they can't spalsh out 8K isk for a proto suit, well that's their own problem. FW could use some work, but don't just hand the games in it over to the who's who of pubstompers just because their favored race as a whole are getting their butts kicked. Glad you picked up on this Tesfa as I was going to say something on this topic too! As much as I agree with most of the OP's comments, as well as many of the other views and ideas put forward in this thread (I would also like to see team Deploy btw), I am a little concerned with the idea of this feature with the current matchmaking. As I understand it squads are already prioritised for FW, so I take it that if Team Deploy is activated that it would trump squads, which leads on to other issues. Many of the large corps that have been involved with PC and their players have made a lot of isk, rightly so, they've made the effort to take districts. But there are many small corps out there that have never and would never stand a chance at PC, there is now quite a large isk gap between these large corps and the small ones in the game. FW was a little bit of haven for a squad or two from small or medium size corps to run together, with a few other random squads on their team and couple of blueberries thrown in to fill up the team. Something a little more than standard pub matches. As Tesfa says these teams of mixed squads would be no match for A Team Deploy team either in communication or Isk reserves, the battle would be lost before it had even started (This is of course happening now for other reasons see Gal/Min Vs Cal/Amr) TL;DR I can see that with PC being as broken as it is atm, that many of the corps in PC will turn to FW as an alternative, which with current matchmaking , their isk reserves and a proposed Team Deploy will lead to massive pub stomps Edit: Spelling/typo's
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 1860	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:20:00 - [98] - Quote Requin Toblat wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Well, how will team deploy be implemented? If there's team deploy without matchmaking against other teams, 16 organized players showing up against randoms, or even squads of 6 means the battle is lost before it started. In that sense why even bother allowing players from any other corp in FW besides the big ones? Hopefully Scotty will pit teams against each other. I understand the idea of choosing selecting which contracts to take, but OP tends to have forgotten that contracts in its current form in gallente caldari war for example are also generated by Gallente capsuleers. There shouldn't be an isk payout, the loyalty store already makes items cheap. If they can't spalsh out 8K isk for a proto suit, well that's their own problem. FW could use some work, but don't just hand the games in it over to the who's who of pubstompers just because their favored race as a whole are getting their butts kicked. Glad you picked up on this Tesfa as I was going to say something on this topic too! As much as I agree with most of the OP's comments, as well as many of the other views and ideas put forward in this thread (I would also like to see team Deploy btw), I am a little concerned with the idea of this feature with the current matchmaking. As I understand it squads are already prioritised for FW, so I take it that if Team Deploy is activated that it would trump squads, which leads on to other issues. Many of the large corps that have been involved with PC and their players have made a lot of isk, rightly so, they've made the effort to take districts. But there are many small corps out there that have never and would never stand a chance at PC, there is now quite a large isk gap between these large corps and the small ones in the game. FW was a little bit of haven for a squad or two from small or medium size corps to run together, with a few other random squads on their team and couple of blueberries thrown in to fill up the team. Something a little more than standard pub matches. As Tesfa says these teams of mixed squads would be no match for A Team Deploy team either in communication or Isk reserves, the battle would be lost before it had even started (This is of course happening now for other reasons see Gal/Min Vs Cal/Amr) TL;DR I can see that with PC being as broken as it is atm, that many of the corps in PC will turn to FW as an alternative, which with current matchmaking , their iso reserves and a proposed Team Deploy will lead to massive pub stomps If eve ran the show like it should be then they'd buy the clones and transport us, they'd effectively be buying our consciousness temporarily and it would be peanuts for them. They could set the contract rewards, again peanuts to them is insurmountable amounts to us, any corp could then do it but it needs to all be worth it for eve pilots. So many problems with pc would be eradicated if eve capsuleers ran the show, giving us this much control over it is the problem because we can't actually do much on this platform. Level 1 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.
Requin Toblat Glitched Connection 10	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:27:00 - [99] - Quote Agreed TechMechMeds, just wanted to get the point across that a Team Deploy mechanic better be thoroughly tested before being released into the wild, otherwise we just end up with another broken mechanic that need fixing.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc. 1860	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:32:00 - [100] - Quote Requin Toblat wrote: Agreed TechMechMeds, just wanted to get the point across that a Team Deploy mechanic better be thoroughly tested before being released into the wild, otherwise we just end up with another broken mechanic that need fixing. It was mentioned that teams would only be able to fight teams, not team vs randoms, im not sure if that's official but it'd best be or I'll die laughing. I feel very strongly about the core issue about pc, the whole thing is just backwards lol, capsuleers take a back seat while we have a miniature dirt war lol. Pc is off the rails mate Lol. Level 1 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.


CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3554	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:33:00 - [101] - Quote Requin Toblat wrote: Tesfa Alem wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Well, how will team deploy be implemented? If there's team deploy without matchmaking against other teams, 16 organized players showing up against randoms, or even squads of 6 means the battle is lost before it started. In that sense why even bother allowing players from any other corp in FW besides the big ones? Hopefully Scotty will pit teams against each other. I understand the idea of choosing selecting which contracts to take, but OP tends to have forgotten that contracts in its current form in gallente caldari war for example are also generated by Gallente capsuleers. There shouldn't be an isk payout, the loyalty store already makes items cheap. If they can't spalsh out 8K isk for a proto suit, well that's their own problem. FW could use some work, but don't just hand the games in it over to the who's who of pubstompers just because their favored race as a whole are getting their butts kicked. Glad you picked up on this Tesfa as I was going to say something on this topic too! As much as I agree with most of the OP's comments, as well as many of the other views and ideas put forward in this thread (I would also like to see team Deploy btw), I am a little concerned with the idea of this feature with the current matchmaking. As I understand it squads are already prioritised for FW, so I take it that if Team Deploy is activated that it would trump squads, which leads on to other issues. Many of the large corps that have been involved with PC and their players have made a lot of isk, rightly so, they've made the effort to take districts. But there are many small corps out there that have never and would never stand a chance at PC, there is now quite a large isk gap between these large corps and the small ones in the game. FW was a little bit of haven for a squad or two from small or medium size corps to run together, with a few other random squads on their team and couple of blueberries thrown in to fill up the team. Something a little more than standard pub matches. As Tesfa says these teams of mixed squads would be no match for A Team Deploy team either in communication or Isk reserves, the battle would be lost before it had even started (This is of course happening now for other reasons see Gal/Min Vs Cal/Amr) TL;DR I can see that with PC being as broken as it is atm, that many of the corps in PC will turn to FW as an alternative, which with current matchmaking , their isk reserves and a proposed Team Deploy will lead to massive pub stomps. Team Deploy will need serious testing before being released into the wild, otherwise we just end up with another broken mechanic that needs to be fixed. Edit: Spelling/typo's This is part of the reason why team deploy will take a bit of time to get right. We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2349	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:34:00 - [102] - Quote Good teams smashing randoms is already something that takes place in FW and likely will never go away. Team deploy wouldn't be something to replace how FW currently plays out (the pubs of FW if you will) but be something that supplements it and focuses the organized groups into another layer of FW that has a deeper connection and working with the Eve side. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1608	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:39:00 - [103] - Quote Nullarbor one of my concerns with team deploy is there needs to be a real and rewarding purpose to do it. If you added in team deploy today you would have more 1 sided battles and not much else. There needs to be a fully thought out design behind it. By this I mean a way for dust/eve players to choose where to fight, a way for eve pilots to contract dust mercs, private contracts, and further rewards for eve. Yes I am looking at the bigger picture but (puts project manager hat on) you have to manage expectations here. Team deploy alone does nothing for us So can we have isk until you get the market up? [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Requin Toblat Glitched Connection 12	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:39:00 - [104] - Quote TechMechMeds wrote: Requin Toblat wrote: Agreed TechMechMeds, just wanted to get the point across that a Team Deploy mechanic better be thoroughly tested before being released into the wild, otherwise we just end up with another broken mechanic that need fixing. It was mentioned that teams would only be able to fight teams, not team vs randoms, im not sure if that's official but it'd best be or I'll die laughing. I feel very strongly about the core issue about pc, the whole thing is just backwards lol, capsuleers take a back seat while we have a miniature dirt war lol. Pc is off the rails mate Lol. Wow and waiting times have increased recently with more people playing FW, how long will a TEAM have to wait until another team shows up! Think fixing PC has just become as important as fixing FW
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2350	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:40:00 - [105] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: This is part of the reason why team deploy will take a bit of time to get right. We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. For me this is one of the reasons a formal team deploy would have to be contract based with the contracts made Eve side. A milita uses LP/ISK to set a contract for a system that can be set to private or public and then the opposing faction gets the option to respond by contracting out to a specific group or have it become a public contract if they don't feel the need to hire someone to counter the other team. As Beers put it team deploy has to be part of a system and can't just get thrown into FW with no substance behind it. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1608	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:42:00 - [106] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: This is part of the reason why team deploy will take a bit of time to get right. We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. For me this is one of the reasons a formal team deploy would have to be contract based with the contracts made Eve side. A milita uses LP/ISK to set a contract for a system that can be set to private or public and then the opposing faction gets the option to respond by contracting out to a specific group or have it become a public contract if they don't feel the need to hire someone to counter the other team. Kane i think dust players should be able to choose systems to fight on with out eve nerds. However there need to be a way for public and private contracts for eve piilots to choose a system. We should be able to see the highlighted system on the star map and if we choose to fight or defend the rewards should be greater There needs to be choice in the system but greater rewards for WORKING WITH eve nerds [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Ansiiis The Trustworthy Ahrendee Mercenaries 599	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:44:00 - [107] - Quote I want to see Arkenai tell us that we lose in FW because we don't squad... Sworn Shield of Cat Merc.
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4315	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:45:00 - [108] - Quote Free Beers wrote: Kain Spero wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: This is part of the reason why team deploy will take a bit of time to get right. We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. For me this is one of the reasons a formal team deploy would have to be contract based with the contracts made Eve side. A milita uses LP/ISK to set a contract for a system that can be set to private or public and then the opposing faction gets the option to respond by contracting out to a specific group or have it become a public contract if they don't feel the need to hire someone to counter the other team. Kane i think dust players should be able to choose systems to fight on with out eve nerds. However there need to be a way for public and private contracts for eve piilots to choose a system. We should be able to see the highlighted system on the star map and if we choose to fight or defend the rewards should be greater There needs to be choice in the system but greater rewards for WORKING WITH eve nerds I see you've kept that lovely "term of endearment" for all of us that fly ships. In any case, I'm all over the idea of a contract system that would allow Dust players to shop around contracts set up by EVE players and jump into a battle as a team. We're supposed to be mercenaries, right? So let us be mercenaries in as many ways and situations as possible. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1608	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:48:00 - [109] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: Free Beers wrote: Kain Spero wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: This is part of the reason why team deploy will take a bit of time to get right. We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. For me this is one of the reasons a formal team deploy would have to be contract based with the contracts made Eve side. A milita uses LP/ISK to set a contract for a system that can be set to private or public and then the opposing faction gets the option to respond by contracting out to a specific group or have it become a public contract if they don't feel the need to hire someone to counter the other team. Kane i think dust players should be able to choose systems to fight on with out eve nerds. However there need to be a way for public and private contracts for eve piilots to choose a system. We should be able to see the highlighted system on the star map and if we choose to fight or defend the rewards should be greater There needs to be choice in the system but greater rewards for WORKING WITH eve nerds I see you've kept that lovely "term of endearment" for all of us that fly ships. In any case, I'm all over the idea of a contract system that would allow Dust players to shop around contracts set up by EVE players and jump into a battle as a team. We're supposed to be mercenaries, right? So let us be mercenaries in as many ways and situations as possible. You forget I am an eve nerd and a dust nerd. I am glad you remember back that we WERE suppose to be mercs not farmers. To many crying dust bunnies in closed beta wanted to be land owners and look what it got us [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2353	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:49:00 - [110] - Quote Free Beers wrote: Kane i think dust players should be able to choose systems to fight on with out eve nerds. However there need to be a way for public and private contracts for eve piilots to choose a system. We should be able to see the highlighted system on the star map and if we choose to fight or defend the rewards should be greater There needs to be choice in the system but greater rewards for WORKING WITH eve nerds Yeah, I agree that a hybrid system is generally the best way to go. I just don't want the problems of PC to come to roost in FW and have all of the logistics and the headaches that go with it, and then have no way for the logistical burden to be offloaded at least between the two player bases. I think you right though that it all has to be reinforced via rewards. To me the biggest problem isn't scrubs fighting against a full team, but players pulling a Shad and lining up to intentionally loose matches to get the desired outcome. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news


CCP Nullarbor C C P C C P Alliance 3558	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:51:00 - [111] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Free Beers wrote: Kane i think dust players should be able to choose systems to fight on with out eve nerds. However there need to be a way for public and private contracts for eve piilots to choose a system. We should be able to see the highlighted system on the star map and if we choose to fight or defend the rewards should be greater There needs to be choice in the system but greater rewards for WORKING WITH eve nerds Yeah, I agree that a hybrid system is generally the best way to go. I just don't want the problems of PC to come to roost in FW and have all of the logistics and the headaches that go with it, and then have no way for the logistical burden to be offloaded at least between the two player bases. I think you right though that it all has to be reinforced via rewards. To me this biggest problem isn't scrubs fighting against a full team, but players pulling a Shad and lining up to intentionally loose matches to get the desired outcome. Yep, this is why the old corp contracts had to go. CCP Nullarbor // Exotic Dancer // Team True Grit

RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 577	Posted - 2013.12.30 17:58:00 - [112] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: We first need to be able to build the team, but then matching that team into a battle that is fun and balanced without waiting an eternity and still allowing factions to push is trickier than it sounds. Translation: This game in it's currently form is a big fail because 99% of the games are no fun (eg redline matches,...) and unbalanced. Nothing new really, so what are you guys planning to do to make the game balanced, fun,...?
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1614	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:03:00 - [113] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Yep, this is why the old corp contracts had to go. It's the new eden way "When you cant win, loose" For ever to be known as "pulling a shad" Yea I am still pissed that you turned mercs into farmers nullarbor because a few kids cried to be land owners. [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 553	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:11:00 - [114] - Quote Free Beers wrote: I am glad you remember back that we WERE suppose to be mercs not farmers. To many crying dust bunnies in closed beta wanted to be land owners and look what it got us I never wanted to own land or farm. In fact I always thought that I would be getting payed to attack and defend other peoples lands. Now all I feel I do is grind and farm for SP's and get a little ISK to go with it, and FW is just Meh thanks but no thanks not worth the time and effort. FW rewards TBH are just LOL. Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2354	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:15:00 - [115] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Yep, this is why the old corp contracts had to go. Still wish the system could have been iterated on rather than scrapped. I do think that in the meantime though putting ISK back in the FW system should be a good step in the right direction. This is especially true with team deploy being something that would potentially take a lot of bandwidth and need to be done well and have all the bases covered. The same goes for a player market as well. A lot of the issues in Dust seem to come down to all the parts of a system not being in place when a feature is launched. No where is the curse of dependencies more apparent than in PC though. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 578	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:15:00 - [116] - Quote Free Beers wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Yep, this is why the old corp contracts had to go. It's the new eden way "When you cant win, loose" For ever to be known as "pulling a shad" Yea I am still pissed that you turned mercs into farmers nullarbor because a few kids cried to be land owners. That's because CCP had a LONG TERM plan for DUST514, look at how quickly they changed that LONG TERM plan .
BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 553	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:33:00 - [117] - Quote We have a squad finder mechanic already right? Why not have a Team Deploy mechanic in place for the randoms that do not want to get proto stomped in FW? Any random can then jump into a team that has spots open. Just a thought. Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Brush Master HavoK Core RISE of LEGION 1013	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:37:00 - [118] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Yep, this is why the old corp contracts had to go. Still wish the system could have been iterated on rather than scrapped. I do think that in the meantime though putting ISK back in the FW system should be a good step in the right direction. This is especially true with team deploy being something that would potentially take a lot of bandwidth and need to be done well and have all the bases covered. The same goes for a player market as well. A lot of the issues in Dust seem to come down to all the parts of a system not being in place when a feature is launched. No where is the curse of dependencies more apparent than in PC though. Old contracts allowed the players to choose who to fight with with little or no delay which was fun to have friendly matches or training with another corp. Iteration would have been nice. As far as team deploy, groups are already doing it so I'm not sure how much more this would unbalance things. If FW team deploy was like the old contracts, that might be interesting. 514th Wing // Team Fairy DUST // Havok Core [email protected]
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 578	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:38:00 - [119] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: We have a squad finder mechanic already right? Why not have a Team Deploy mechanic in place for the randoms that do not want to get proto stomped in FW? Any random can then jump into a team that has spots open. Just a thought. Because 90% of the randoms have no idea what they are doing or did you never wondered why they all like to hack red LAVS to drive around with (LAVs must be so exotic to them as they haven't found the right-Pad-arrow yet) and just look at that red letter 'A' doing nothing?
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2358	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:50:00 - [120] - Quote RKKR wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: We have a squad finder mechanic already right? Why not have a Team Deploy mechanic in place for the randoms that do not want to get proto stomped in FW? Any random can then jump into a team that has spots open. Just a thought. Because 90% of the randoms have no idea what they are doing or did you never wondered why they all like to hack red LAVS to drive around with (LAVs must be so exotic to them as they haven't found the right-Pad-arrow yet) and just look at that red letter 'A' doing nothing? Some days I feel like implementing a "Not Green Shoot It" policy for the FW matches I'm in. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news

BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 554	Posted - 2013.12.30 18:52:00 - [121] - Quote RKKR wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: We have a squad finder mechanic already right? Why not have a Team Deploy mechanic in place for the randoms that do not want to get proto stomped in FW? Any random can then jump into a team that has spots open. Just a thought. Because 90% of the randoms have no idea what they are doing or did you never wondered why they all like to hack red LAVS to drive around with (LAVs must be so exotic to them as they haven't found the right-Pad-arrow yet) and just look at that red letter 'A' doing nothing? Then why have we given them squad finder? I figure that at least if they have the drive enough to look for a team to deploy with that they might have some wits about them. But hey whatever man you can stick with the current system because that is working out great right? Or how bout if they jump into your team and maybe, just maybe you being an all high and mighty DUST player you can teach them something. I know if I had two squads or even one and a half squads that where able to deploy together and then we had to fill in randoms to finish the team it would be a whole lot better than not being able to have the choice of team deploy at all. Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2358	Posted - 2013.12.30 19:32:00 - [122] - Quote The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 554	Posted - 2013.12.30 19:43:00 - [123] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. If this is the reason why team deploy is being held up then I find that sad. Give us team deploy and allow us to team up with our own corp and then fix the where and why. Give us a team finder like we have a squad finder so that if we do not have a team we can at least try and find one. I understand the end game of the where and why and that is the one reason why I have played this game this long. I have been waiting for the where and the why, but if the where and the why is holding up team deploy then that is just bad. Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2358	Posted - 2013.12.30 19:52:00 - [124] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: Kain Spero wrote: The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. If this is the reason why team deploy is being held up then I find that sad. Give us team deploy and allow us to team up with our own corp and then fix the where and why. Give us a team finder like we have a squad finder so that if we do not have a team we can at least try and find one. I understand the end game of the where and why and that is the one reason why I have played this game this long. I have been waiting for the where and the why, but if the where and the why is holding up team deploy then that is just bad. If all you want is to fight with 16 people in your own corp on one side in a FW match you can do that already. If that is all you think team deploy is then the feature for you is live already. Log in, organize your coms, and enjoy. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
RKKR The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 582	Posted - 2013.12.30 19:59:00 - [125] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: Then why have we given them squad finder? I figure that at least if they have the drive enough to look for a team to deploy with that they might have some wits about them. What makes you think they will find the squad finder if they have no clue how to play the game? Quote: But hey whatever man you can stick with the current system because that is working out great right? Excuse me, but who says I want to stick with the current system? Don't take my post personal, I was just pointing something out. Quote: Or how bout if they jump into your team and maybe, just maybe you being an all high and mighty DUST player you can teach them something. 99% has no idea to put voice chat on (and those that do have no clue that there is a voice chat bug) and teaching them through chat is impractical (most don't have a mic to answer), I know I tried, ByeBye lousy argument. They won't learn by just watching us play either and most also don't read the team chat at the start of the battle. Quote: I know if I had two squads or even one and a half squads that where able to deploy together and then we had to fill in randoms to finish the team it would be a whole lot better than not being able to have the choice of team deploy at all. Two squads deploying together sounds a lot like team deployment, something that is too much work for CCP to pull of. The rest isn't much different than what goes on now.
Smooth Assassin Stardust incorporation 617	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:01:00 - [126] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Wow! so you attempt to help caldari and amarr out? we galantes and minmatars lost the last FW event why not give us the bonuses? F*ing racist literally! Assassination is my thing.**
Spectre-M The Generals General Tso's Alliance 155	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:09:00 - [127] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: +1 to the OP There really needs to be something that allows the fights to be directed from Eve and those pilots need to at least have the option to chose who they have fight. The mic bugs in team chat need to be fixed as well. It makes organized ops like this even more difficult. While the geography in Dust may not seem important the tools need to be in place to allow the importance of the geography to emerge. Totally agree. With 66,000 planets, the geography must be made accessible. It will make dust feel a lot more sandbox than it currently is. It will also give pilots more incentive to hire mercs and provide more ways to procure isk dust side, besides grinding pubs. Amarr Factional Warfare Loyalist Minnmatar in Amarr Armor I am a Wolf in Sheeps Clothing
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1623	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:10:00 - [128] - Quote Smooth Assassin wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. Wow! so you attempt to help caldari and amarr out? we galantes and minmatars lost the last FW event why not give us the bonuses? F***ing racist literally! Its about a broken system. Please go wash your vag i think you have some sand in it [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1938	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:33:00 - [129] - Quote What about using something like this Low Cost Mercenary Assault Unit (MAU) and variations of it to generate contracts from Eve into Dust. 1) Go to Mercenary Contracting Depot Station/System and purchase one of these. They could have a variety of costs, some could be manufactured, others just bought from NPCs. Some could have more clones than others and pay base rates (isk per minutes in game). These could also just be blueprints bought from the FW store with a few different options for each militia (low/medium/high-120/150/175 clones) 2) Store Mercenary Assault Unit in cargo bay or put in launcher?. 3) Fly above district you wish to assault (must be owned by enemy). 4) Approach district and launch MAU. 5) Your assault contract then enters a queue. You can see the status of your MAU in your journal. 6) The mercenary Contracting Depots will show the status of all current contracts throughout the region. 7) Mercs in Dust can also interface with these contracts and select for themselves which ones they would like to support. All defensive contracts are auto-generated to complement the assault and funded at the default clone rate of 150 clones per battle. 8) Owners of the MAU may set the conditions of their contract as soon as the MAU is launched (corp invite only/Public/ standing level). All defensive contracts are public.
NextDark Knight Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 117	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:44:00 - [130] - Quote I would like to see Eve Side open up the Isk to be dumped into fleet war payouts.. or some kind of payment system to make Other contracts for Fleet war systems that need the battles. You DEVs have to much on your plates... It would be cool to see eve buying clones to use in Fleet war and highering mercs on the ground. *** Special note : Who said it would be a good idea to nerf the splash damage on the forge gun.. real statistics or some one with special interest in medium suites? Forge Changes needed Officer Splash 3.0, Proto 2.7 Advanced 2.5 Standard 2.1.**

BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 555	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:51:00 - [131] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: Kain Spero wrote: The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. If this is the reason why team deploy is being held up then I find that sad. Give us team deploy and allow us to team up with our own corp and then fix the where and why. Give us a team finder like we have a squad finder so that if we do not have a team we can at least try and find one. I understand the end game of the where and why and that is the one reason why I have played this game this long. I have been waiting for the where and the why, but if the where and the why is holding up team deploy then that is just bad. If all you want is to fight with 16 people in your own corp on one side in a FW match you can do that already. If that is all you think team deploy is then the feature for you is live already. Log in, organize your coms, and enjoy. No it is not, that is Q syncing. I want Team/Clan Deploy, which allows a team/clan to enter a queue as one group. Not this Q sync BS. Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1938	Posted - 2013.12.30 20:55:00 - [132] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: Kain Spero wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: Kain Spero wrote: The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. If this is the reason why team deploy is being held up then I find that sad. Give us team deploy and allow us to team up with our own corp and then fix the where and why. Give us a team finder like we have a squad finder so that if we do not have a team we can at least try and find one. I understand the end game of the where and why and that is the one reason why I have played this game this long. I have been waiting for the where and the why, but if the where and the why is holding up team deploy then that is just bad. If all you want is to fight with 16 people in your own corp on one side in a FW match you can do that already. If that is all you think team deploy is then the feature for you is live already. Log in, organize your coms, and enjoy. No it is not, that is Q syncing. I want Team/Clan Deploy, which allows a team/clan to enter a queue as one group. Not this Q sync BS. I think a fairly simple approach would be something like a contract that is temporarily locked for your squad/corp, but then turns public eventually?
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2359	Posted - 2013.12.30 21:19:00 - [133] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: No it is not, that is Q syncing. I want Team/Clan Deploy, which allows a team/clan to enter a queue as one group. Not this Q sync BS. You are right that it does take some effort to sync, but since we have some semblance of team deploy I would say the most pressing need is to first add ISK to the current LP payouts. If FW withers and dies in terms of it's PCU then that doesn't really help anyone. Second is the balance of defense and attacking because right now it's just plain screwed up and that effects everyone whether you are solo or synching. Third, their needs to be a sensible way for Dusters to choose where they fight. Fourth, Eve needs to be able to choose which systems to fight in (I would make the third and forth happen at the same time). Last in this progression of awesomeness would be Eve being able to make contracts to Dust that are both public and private. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2552	Posted - 2013.12.30 21:35:00 - [134] - Quote Qsyncing works. Quite reliably even. Team deploy, while will be a nice addition, is far from 'necessary' compared to the other items mentioned above. i mean seriously i can teach a 4 year old narcoleptic midget ginger to qsync... prioritize the things that need addressed and work on team deploy in your spare time. team deploy should be rolled out when contracts become available. Both of Which im sure are items that will require some time to complete Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
pseudosnipre 424	Posted - 2013.12.30 21:44:00 - [135] - Quote Give me a 2 hr schedule of upcoming FW matches so I know for which ones I want to wait/queue. Better yet, let me see who's also queuing for both teams so we know where to hunt/assassinate elite players! Today is the sort of day where the sun only comes up to humiliate you.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2476	Posted - 2013.12.30 21:56:00 - [136] - Quote I'm not sure why there needs to be so much thought put into Team Deploy. Nobody builds my squad for me. Teams can be put together from FW channels or in corps. Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
Absolute Idiom II SyNergy Gaming EoN. 922	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:05:00 - [137] - Quote All this focus on specific ideas (team deploy, choosing where to attack, etc) and how exactly to implement them is pointless. Where is the vision from the relevant CCP staff about injecting the MMO into the lobby FPS that we currently have? Nullabor, FoxFour, Rouge... I'm looking at you and hearing a gulf of silence. What is the vision and what are the [boardstroke] elements that you plan to develop and how will they deliver your vision? Fanfest 2012 - Winning Team + MVP - £1100 in prizes Fanfest 2013 - Winning Team - £500 in prizes Fanfest 2014 - ???
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1624	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:19:00 - [138] - Quote Absolute Idiom II wrote: All this focus on specific ideas (team deploy, choosing where to attack, etc) and how exactly to implement them is pointless. Where is the vision from the relevant CCP staff about injecting the MMO into the lobby FPS that we currently have? Nullabor, FoxFour, Rouge... I'm looking at you and hearing a gulf of silence. What is the vision and what are the [boardstroke] elements that you plan to develop and how will they deliver your vision? Well between now and 2015 when ccp's new grand plan comes about for dust i would hope that ccp is responsive to its player base it has NOW in attempt to improve the player experience for players that play NOW. [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Regis Blackbird DUST University Ivy League 57	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:26:00 - [139] - Quote This is my two ISK on the topic. We have a wonderful star map, so let's use it. What about the following: EVE can set up attack or defense contracts based on region (or perhaps constellations) - The ISK put into these contracts is put into a pool which will be distributed with a fixed amount per successful battle in this region until the pool is depleted. - The ISK will be paid out to the team IF the contract is fulfilled (attack or defense achieved) and is distributed based on war-points (as pub games). - It is not possible for a faction to have both attack and defense contracts active for the same region. 2) misc - The squad structure (and squad finder) is expanded to handle 16 players, let's call it a "platoon" - In the battle finder screen for FW, there is a button to open the star map. 3) In the star map, any possible districts to attack show up on as a crossed sword (similar to today's ongoing battles), and can be based on today's eve plexing or some other mechanic. - Districts which have a EVE (attack) contract attached to it will be indicated a different color, or have a small icon next to it to indicate there are additional benefits attacking this particular district. - Attack contracts issued from eve can only be accepted by full platoons. - When a attack contract is accepted, there is a 5 minute period where a new defense icon (shield) is highlighted, and a countdown is visible on the star map for the district. - IF there is a eve defense contract applied to the district, this can only be accepted by full platoons for the first 4 minutes. After this point the matchmaker kicks in to try and fill the match, with squads as a priority. The result of all this is: - For organized platoons, there is a window of opportunity to get a 1:1 match though the star map. - You can select which district to attack or defend (IF you use the star map) - Fighting will be concentrated to regions where EVE place contracts, as this will be the only way to receive ISK in FW. - Selecting a faction in the battle finder (without using the star map), will put you in a "random" defense or attack fight (as today). The downside is of course: - When no full platoon have accepted the defense contract in 4min, the resulting battle will probably be very one sided (1 full platoon vs random squads or in worst case blueberries). The thing is though, if EVE is not ready to put down the ISK for a defense contract, or if no organized platoons are ready to accept in time, why should it be a even match? The goal of FW is to take supremacy of the region(s), the who and why is only a byproduct. Thoughts?
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1624	Posted - 2013.12.30 22:41:00 - [140] - Quote Regis Blackbird wrote: This is my two ISK on the topic. We have a wonderful star map, so let's use it. What about the following: EVE can set up attack or defense contracts based on region (or perhaps constellations) - The ISK put into these contracts is put into a pool which will be distributed with a fixed amount per successful battle in this region until the pool is depleted. - The ISK will be paid out to the team IF the contract is fulfilled (attack or defense achieved) and is distributed based on war-points (as pub games). - It is not possible for a faction to have both attack and defense contracts active for the same region. 2) misc - The squad structure (and squad finder) is expanded to handle 16 players, let's call it a "platoon" - In the battle finder screen for FW, there is a button to open the star map. 3) In the star map, any possible districts to attack show up on as a crossed sword (similar to today's ongoing battles), and can be based on today's eve plexing or some other mechanic. - Districts which have a EVE (attack) contract attached to it will be indicated a different color, or have a small icon next to it to indicate there are additional benefits attacking this particular district. - Attack contracts issued from eve can only be accepted by full platoons. - When a attack contract is accepted, there is a 5 minute period where a new defense icon (shield) is highlighted, and a countdown is visible on the star map for the district. - IF there is a eve defense contract applied to the district, this can only be accepted by full platoons for the first 4 minutes. After this point the matchmaker kicks in to try and fill the match, with squads as a priority. The result of all this is: - For organized platoons, there is a window of opportunity to get a 1:1 match though the star map. - You can select which district to attack or defend (IF you use the star map) - Fighting will be concentrated to regions where EVE place contracts, as this will be the only way to receive ISK in FW. - Selecting a faction in the battle finder (without using the star map), will put you in a "random" defense or attack fight (as today). The downside is of course: - When no full platoon have accepted the defense contract in 4min, the resulting battle will probably be very one sided (1 full platoon vs random squads or in worst case blueberries). The thing is though, if EVE is not ready to put down the ISK for a defense contract, or if no organized platoons are ready to accept in time, why should it be a even match? The goal of FW is to take supremacy of the region(s), the who and why is only a byproduct. Thoughts? Good stuff 1. star map yes please i mean more people care about fac war then farming in the first place. 2. squads need to be left alone but i would build team or platoon on top of it aka create team invite squad leaders to it. Also matching making can pair squads vs teams here. there needs to be rewards to motivate players to run in squads. We should also expect a much longer que time for team deploy since we do have a small player base. Lastly, no team deploy in pubs, we have support ALL types of a players and not force them into one way (like ccp seems to want to) 3. thats a lot of stuff i'm going to have to think about it and respond [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me

iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 1	Posted - 2013.12.31 07:24:00 - [141] - Quote FW has an easy temporary fix that could be implemented by the end of February. (or sooner ) 1) Make it so that losing a battle means that one loses standing with the faction for which one is fighting. Exp. I'm fighting for Caldari, I lose, so I lose let's say 15 standing points (%20 of what I would gain if I had won). 2) Allow Eve pilots to pay isk on locations they desire so that only specific level mercs can fight there. That is, if there is a desired district, an Eve pilot may pay so thay between 1 and 16 players are of a certain level. For example, an Eve pilot can request that 2 mercs be level 10 (for 2mil isk each dust side) two mercs be level 5 (for 250k isk each dust side), and the rest have no level requirement. (The cost on Eve's side for how much each level must be determined by CCP.) 3) Allow people of certain level standings to accept FW contracts for that level or lower. Exp. If I am level 7, I can accept a contract for level 3 but not one for level 9. 4) Keep it so that no standings means no isk. I think personally that the base reward should only be loyalty. You should only get paid if you prove both your loyalty and also your skill (the latter would be made evident by one's standing. For, given the first change, only the best players would ever get to level 10 in an any Faction.) These changes should make it so that the best FW players end up in the same matches: higher level mercs (presumably the better players, who are capable of squading with similar levelled players) won't want to play random fw matches - - since they could lose and therefore lose part of their standing. Also, for Eve pilots, it would make it so that they're not simply throwing money into the wind. If they have the isk and want a planet, they can pay for it. Of course, it would mean that 16 level 10s could squad up against 16 level 1s. But that's just the nature of war sometimes...
Luther Mandrix WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 154	Posted - 2013.12.31 12:59:00 - [142] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Good teams smashing randoms is already something that takes place in FW and likely will never go away. Team deploy wouldn't be something to replace how FW currently plays out (the pubs of FW if you will) but be something that supplements it and focuses the organized groups into another layer of FW that has a deeper connection and working with the Eve side. So what if we had a submenu of Fw were team only would deploy against team only.The old system could be left in place so we. Don't have to throw out what has been built but add another (MODE)were team only deploy.Remember mag Deploy were you could see the enemy teams filling up so you just held on alittle longer to deploy.
BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 557	Posted - 2013.12.31 14:21:00 - [143] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: No it is not, that is Q syncing. I want Team/Clan Deploy, which allows a team/clan to enter a queue as one group. Not this Q sync BS. You are right that it does take some effort to sync, but since we have some semblance of team deploy I would say the most pressing need is to first add ISK to the current LP payouts. If FW withers and dies in terms of it's PCU then that doesn't really help anyone. Second is the balance of defense and attacking because right now it's just plain screwed up and that effects everyone whether you are solo or synching. Third, their needs to be a sensible way for Dusters to choose where they fight. Fourth, Eve needs to be able to choose which systems to fight in (I would make the third and forth happen at the same time). Last in this progression of awesomeness would be Eve being able to make contracts to Dust that are both public and private. So yeah okay when you put it like that sure I agree. But how long will we get all of the above? SoonGäó? It still would be nice to have a team deploy option now though . Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Severus Smith Caldari State 488	Posted - 2013.12.31 14:30:00 - [144] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: The deal is the current system does allow you to reliably deploy up 16 people to faction warfare. The problem is that the where and enabling the system to easily allow fights against other full teams for a larger purpose just isn't quite there. Just having team deploy without any deeper doesn't really do anything. FW needs contract levels (1 to 4) and mercs need to be able to choose a contract themselves (or select random if they wish). The more desirable the district the higher the contract level. So System A (that no one is really fighting for) would have mainly level 1 contracts while System B (that is a huge front line and has been contested for weeks) would have mainly level 4 contracts. Level 1 would primarily be the disorganized pub matches we have today, with low payout and a minute standings drop if lost. Level 2 would be a step above the pub matches, more organized, with a better payout and a small standings drop if lost. Level 3 would be squads only (maybe 4x 4 man squads = 16). Good payout with a moderate standings drop if lost. Level 4 would be team deploy only with high payouts but a big standings drop if lost. This makes it so that as you get higher standings you become more useful towards your faction taking space. It also means that as you gain standings you rise above the chaos, TKing, pubbies, and whatever in the lower level contracts. Finally, it helps deter players from sabotaging their own faction in a highly contested system. To do this in vital matches requires the saboteur to work to get high standings (to get into level 4 contracts) and thus risk losing those standings by sabotaging. Still a tactic, but much more effort is required. Also, we need rankings / medals or something for FW. So that people who are dedicated to their factions get something to show off. I would love to be able to get an medal with the Caldari logo on it atop my avatar to show that I have won 1000x battles for the Caldari. Or an Inquisitors medal for the Amarr for winning 1000x battles with them.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2366	Posted - 2013.12.31 14:45:00 - [145] - Quote BMSTUBBY wrote: Kain Spero wrote: BMSTUBBY wrote: No it is not, that is Q syncing. I want Team/Clan Deploy, which allows a team/clan to enter a queue as one group. Not this Q sync BS. You are right that it does take some effort to sync, but since we have some semblance of team deploy I would say the most pressing need is to first add ISK to the current LP payouts. If FW withers and dies in terms of it's PCU then that doesn't really help anyone. Second is the balance of defense and attacking because right now it's just plain screwed up and that effects everyone whether you are solo or synching. Third, their needs to be a sensible way for Dusters to choose where they fight. Fourth, Eve needs to be able to choose which systems to fight in (I would make the third and forth happen at the same time). Last in this progression of awesomeness would be Eve being able to make contracts to Dust that are both public and private. So yeah okay when you put it like that sure I agree. But how long will we get all of the above? SoonGäó? It still would be nice to have a team deploy option now though . Team deploy would be nice, but unfortunately it wouldn't be a magic bullet and would leave many broken aspects of FW in place. In terms of the when for the above, I think the community is going to have to keep pushing the issue until it is addressed by CCP. It is great that CCP acknowledges the problem, but until it is actually something that is in the pipe and set to be released then there really is no guarantee. Of these 5 things the first two need to be implemented ASAP. The other parts of this are going to have to be vetted thoroughly and implemented in a COMPLETE fashion. The time for half features really needs to end. In all honestly FW is much more fertile ground for getting players the team fights we all strive for than PC ever could in it's current half-finished form. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Charlotte O'Dell Fatal Absolution 1346	Posted - 2013.12.31 15:54:00 - [146] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. hurrrrrrry Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 275	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:20:00 - [147] - Quote CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. How about letting EVE pilots bombard for their boys on the ground regardless of FW enlistment (or let randoms do it and this might lead to them joining militias)? I'm going to beat this horse to death and keep on beating: If you want EVE players to accept Dust players in their universe, allow them to do so through the most meaningful connection: murder from the sky. Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW, let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1631	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:26:00 - [148] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. How about letting EVE pilots bombard for their boys on the ground regardless of FW enlistment (or let randoms do it and this might lead to them joining militias)? I'm going to beat this horse to death and keep on beating: If you want EVE players to accept Dust players in their universe, allow them to do so through the most meaningful connection: murder from the sky. Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW, let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. No. You have such bad ideas please refrain from posting in my threads. [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 276	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:31:00 - [149] - Quote Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. How about letting EVE pilots bombard for their boys on the ground regardless of FW enlistment (or let randoms do it and this might lead to them joining militias)? I'm going to beat this horse to death and keep on beating: If you want EVE players to accept Dust players in their universe, allow them to do so through the most meaningful connection: murder from the sky. Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW, let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. No. You have such bad ideas please refrain from posting in my threads. Most of my EVE guys would prefer Dust to be segmented into its own game and die as well, you would get along. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 276	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:33:00 - [150] - Quote Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. How about letting EVE pilots bombard for their boys on the ground regardless of FW enlistment (or let randoms do it and this might lead to them joining militias)? I'm going to beat this horse to death and keep on beating: If you want EVE players to accept Dust players in their universe, allow them to do so through the most meaningful connection: murder from the sky. Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW, let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. No. You have such bad ideas please refrain from posting in my threads. Edit: As someone who plays FW for all 4 factions all the time i will tell you there is almost zero OB support so why in the hell would you want to reduce the pool of potential OB pilots. I can't comprehend this level of stupidity I'm saying to expand it. Allow MORE potential bombardiers. From Alliance mates of guys in the match to brand new EVE players looking to see what its like. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar

Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1631	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:40:00 - [151] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: *Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW,* let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. So you want to remove the only reward a player gets it will reduce players trying. I have fac war eve toons and the rewards aren't enough to really risk it so players do it out of their own want to. plexing is still more profitable and much safer then being bait waiting for OBs [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1944	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:47:00 - [152] - Quote Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: *Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW,* let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. So you want to remove the only reward a player gets it will reduce players trying. I have fac war eve toons and the rewards aren't enough to really risk it so players do it out of their own want to. plexing is still more profitable and much safer then being bait waiting for OBs If what you want, Burseg, is pirates/non militia corps interested in causing havoc in dust, I think the best bet would be contracts to attack/capture POCOs or districts under their control. To spend time developing what would amount to a rarely used trolling mechanic in the FW warzone would be a waste.
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 276	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:50:00 - [153] - Quote Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: *Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW,* let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. So you want to remove the only reward a player gets it will reduce players trying. I have fac war eve toons and the rewards aren't enough to really risk it so players do it out of their own want to. plexing is still more profitable and much safer then being bait waiting for OBs All my EVE guys do it for the kill mails. If a fight breaks out in system to kill even more stuff in space, they like that, too, more mails for the killboard. KM's are the best motivator CCP has made to get my guys interested in bombardments since the mechanic was introduced a year ago. Giving the LP payouts only to FW gives and incentive for players to join a FW corp to receiving payment for helping strangers on the ground. This could motivate a brand new player to join FW right out of the noob school and get into "PVP" (or at least orbiting a beacon in a cloaking, stabbed Kestrel), but such motivation isn't required for the guys who just want to rain on people's parade or help their corp mates. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1631	Posted - 2013.12.31 18:54:00 - [154] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: *Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW,* let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. So you want to remove the only reward a player gets it will reduce players trying. I have fac war eve toons and the rewards aren't enough to really risk it so players do it out of their own want to. plexing is still more profitable and much safer then being bait waiting for OBs All my EVE guys do it for the kill mails. If a fight breaks out in system to kill even more stuff in space, they like that, too, more mails for the killboard. KM's are the best motivator CCP has made to get my guys interested in bombardments since the mechanic was introduced a year ago. Giving the LP payouts only to FW gives and incentive for players to join a FW corp to receiving payment for helping strangers on the ground. This could motivate a brand new player to join FW right out of the noob school and get into "PVP" (or at least orbiting a beacon in a cloaking, stabbed Kestrel), but such motivation isn't required for the guys who just want to rain on people's parade or help their corp mates. Okay I will conceed the point about bringing in more pilots that just want to do it for fun. The only issue now that i have is that when you are on a beacon how do you know which side they are gonig to OB for. I know you said they would be flagged which is fine but you could pick and chose and i dont think other eve pilots would know to kill you or protect you when you are at the beacon. Also i competed in 2011 hulkageddon and one of my toons was a top 30 killer but no where near the top. So much fun back then [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 276	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:01:00 - [155] - Quote Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: *Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW,* let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. So you want to remove the only reward a player gets it will reduce players trying. I have fac war eve toons and the rewards aren't enough to really risk it so players do it out of their own want to. plexing is still more profitable and much safer then being bait waiting for OBs All my EVE guys do it for the kill mails. If a fight breaks out in system to kill even more stuff in space, they like that, too, more mails for the killboard. KM's are the best motivator CCP has made to get my guys interested in bombardments since the mechanic was introduced a year ago. Giving the LP payouts only to FW gives and incentive for players to join a FW corp to receiving payment for helping strangers on the ground. This could motivate a brand new player to join FW right out of the noob school and get into "PVP" (or at least orbiting a beacon in a cloaking, stabbed Kestrel), but such motivation isn't required for the guys who just want to rain on people's parade or help their corp mates. Okay I will conceed the point about bringing in more pilots that just want to do it for fun. The only issue now that i have is that when you are on a beacon how do you know which side they are gonig to OB for. I know you said they would be flagged which is fine but you could pick and chose and i dont think other eve pilots would know to kill you or protect you when you are at the beacon. Also i competed in 2011 hulkageddon and one of my toons was a top 30 killer but no where near the top. So much fun back then Hell yea!! I made Hulkageddon a competition within my corp (as well as being against the other groups, to encourage maximum participation) where we split into to "teams" (Teams Jacob and Edward, naturally) and duked it out with each other to collect the most tears. I honestly would just shoot anyone not in my fleet that was on the beacon regardless of who they were bombarding for, so my bombardment guys would have less competition as they go to pull the trigger. I don't really fight for a faction in Dust out of loyalty to a side, I do it for my me/my corp, as would the pilots in space. The only reason I do Gal FW is b/c my throw-away bombardment alt was docked in Villore when 1.7 came out, so I enlisted him there. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1631	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:15:00 - [156] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: I honestly would just shoot anyone not in my fleet that was on the beacon regardless of who they were bombarding for, so my bombardment guys would have less competition as they go to pull the trigger. I don't really fight for a faction in Dust out of loyalty to a side, I do it for my me/my corp, as would the pilots in space. The only reason I do Gal FW is b/c my throw-away bombardment alt was docked in Villore when 1.7 came out, so I enlisted him there. See i think would cause more harm then good in the FW world. I dully admit OB support is terrible but do appreciate the eve pilots that do participate. I think the solution more of the side to make eve fw milita to care and be rewarded for OB and owning districts. So my solution and tell me what you think here. I have always been a fan of creating a command group which includes eve pilots and dust mercs. This way you dont have to be tied to anything. One day you could be working with gallente to take a planet and next work for caldari to get it back. I also see this working much better in nullsec. [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 1	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:22:00 - [157] - Quote Let me reiterate. The solution to Team Deploy (i.e., the problem of teams of slayers stomping random noobs) is to add levels to FW contracts. This can be done if and only if one loses levels by losing battles. Such losses would distinguish those players who (a) can gather a team to play with (a team, obviously, is more likely to win than a group of randoms) (b) those players who are simply better than others and by how much. The incentive is like real life - - being a better merc meas one gets payed more. Moreover, once players level up, they will not want to play FW for free. So newbies to a faction can enter into entry-level battles without worries. This is such a simple fix and so easy to implement that it could be done as a minor patch rather than a major update. 1) Move the coding for playing with opposing factions to the factions themselves so that when one loses a battle one also loses standing with the faction for which one is playing. 2) Make it so that some FW have a level requirement (just as mercs need roles to join a PC). 3) Allow Eve pilots to bid on FW matches to guarantee that some or all of the mercs playing on one side are of a certain level. 4) Add the team play. Steps 1, 2, 3 will eliminate any of the complaints that people have with regard to being pub stomped by teams. Better mercs will want to be paid. And the best mercs will want to get paid the most. So good mercs will likely not join entry-level contracts (1-3) and the best will likely not join mid-level contracts (4-7). But like all games sometimes people just play to play and this means that sometimes one will have to face a team of slayers in a pub match. But that's life. And at least with these changes, those being stomped will know that the other players are not being rewarded.
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 278	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:32:00 - [158] - Quote Free Beers wrote: See i think would cause more harm then good in the FW world. I dully admit OB support is terrible but do appreciate the eve pilots that do participate. I think the solution more of the side to make eve fw milita to care and be rewarded for OB and owning districts. So my solution and tell me what you think here. I have always been a fan of creating a command group which includes eve pilots and dust mercs. This way you dont have to be tied to anything. One day you could be working with gallente to take a planet and next work for caldari to get it back. I also see this working much better in nullsec. Yea, I think it could get dangerous to the point where larger entities are the only ones doing bombardments, squeezing FW members to the sidelines, but as you were saying, the FW guys aren't really helping as is. In the past few weeks, my disposable alt (Blutarch Mann in Fed Def, for those that want to personally ruin my day) has been largely uncontested on beacons, and he's really just my personal OB cannon. Hell, sometimes I run FW matches in a squad of 1 just to use it. The only time I see someone else bombarding its because of two reason: 1) Its a Dust alt. 2) Its a FW guy that happened to see a Dust alt on the beacon already and is either killing it b/c they are hostile or joins in for 1/2 the LP. By command group do you mean a hybrid Alliance of Dust and EVE players? If so, that's pretty much what I'm trying to advocate for as far as bombardments go. At least allowing me to bombard for my own guys in FW is a baby step in the right direction. Its very difficult for an Alliance in EVE to jump between factions due to standings penalties you incur when fighting the opposing faction. It can quickly get to the point where you'll never be able to switch sides without months of grinding missions or whatnot. Allowing Dust to launch attacks ground side or EVE FW corps to create contracts against specific districts in the FW zone would go a long way to getting pilots involved since they would know (with lead time) where fights will be going down. That way the FW-enrolled corps will be able to muster a fleet, blockade a system, camp the beacon, and if any non-affiliated groups (like my Alliance) try to show up last minute to help their guys on the ground, the FW guys will already have the home field advantage. CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1631	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:33:00 - [159] - Quote iliel wrote: Let me reiterate. The solution to Team Deploy (i.e., the problem of teams of slayers stomping random noobs) is to add levels to FW contracts. This can be done if and only if one loses levels by losing battles. Such losses would distinguish those players who (a) can gather a team to play with (a team, obviously, is more likely to win than a group of randoms) (b) those players who are simply better than others and by how much. The incentive is like real life - - being a better merc meas one gets payed more. Moreover, once players level up, they will not want to play FW for free. So newbies to a faction can enter into entry-level battles without worries. This is such a simple fix and so easy to implement that it could be done as a minor patch rather than a major update. 1) Move the coding for playing with opposing factions to the factions themselves so that when one loses a battle one also loses standing with the faction for which one is playing. 2) Make it so that some FW have a level requirement (just as mercs need roles to join a PC). 3) Allow Eve pilots to bid on FW matches to guarantee that some or all of the mercs playing on one side are of a certain level. 4) Add the team play. Steps 1, 2, 3 will eliminate any of the complaints that people have with regard to being pub stomped by teams. Better mercs will want to be paid. And the best mercs will want to get paid the most. So good mercs will likely not join entry-level contracts (1-3) and the best will likely not join mid-level contracts (4-7). But like all games sometimes people just play to play and this means that sometimes one will have to face a team of slayers in a pub match. But that's life. And at least with these changes, those being stomped will know that the other players are not being rewarded. This has motivated me to do a thread on team deploy. You bring up some of my similar concerns as I want team deploy but for specific purpose not more lopsided protostomping matching [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm[CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit[CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1944	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:39:00 - [160] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: ...All my EVE guys do it for the kill mails. If a fight breaks out in system to kill even more stuff in space, they like that, too, more mails for the killboard. KM's are the best motivator CCP has made to get my guys interested in bombardments since the mechanic was introduced a year ago... ...I honestly would just shoot anyone not in my fleet that was on the beacon regardless of who they were bombarding for, so my bombardment guys would have less competition as they go to pull the trigger. Once 'blowing stuff up' becomes the end in and of itself, this game will be over. Destruction should be a part of the narrative of Dust, but it won't propel the game to be great. I would hope that we could ascend a little bit above designing a system that is just a Pavlovian slobber machine.

iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 1	Posted - 2013.12.31 19:43:00 - [161] - Quote Free Beers wrote: iliel wrote: Let me reiterate. The solution to Team Deploy (i.e., the problem of teams of slayers stomping random noobs) is to add levels to FW contracts. This can be done if and only if one loses levels by losing battles. Such losses would distinguish those players who (a) can gather a team to play with (a team, obviously, is more likely to win than a group of randoms) (b) those players who are simply better than others and by how much. The incentive is like real life - - being a better merc meas one gets payed more. Moreover, once players level up, they will not want to play FW for free. So newbies to a faction can enter into entry-level battles without worries. This is such a simple fix and so easy to implement that it could be done as a minor patch rather than a major update. 1) Move the coding for playing with opposing factions to the factions themselves so that when one loses a battle one also loses standing with the faction for which one is playing. 2) Make it so that some FW have a level requirement (just as mercs need roles to join a PC). 3) Allow Eve pilots to bid on FW matches to guarantee that some or all of the mercs playing on one side are of a certain level. 4) Add the team play. Steps 1, 2, 3 will eliminate any of the complaints that people have with regard to being pub stomped by teams. Better mercs will want to be paid. And the best mercs will want to get paid the most. So good mercs will likely not join entry-level contracts (1-3) and the best will likely not join mid-level contracts (4-7). But like all games sometimes people just play to play and this means that sometimes one will have to face a team of slayers in a pub match. But that's life. And at least with these changes, those being stomped will know that the other players are not being rewarded. This has motivated me to do a thread on team deploy. You bring up some of my similar concerns as I want team deploy but for specific purpose not more lopsided protostomping matching Note my edit too - - I'd be interested in feedback on that from as many Dust players as possible. I want CCP to do this, so if money is the issue, my edit could solve that, especially if enough players like the idea.
BursegSardaukar Sardaukar Merc Guild General Tso's Alliance 278	Posted - 2013.12.31 20:15:00 - [162] - Quote Beren Hurin wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: ...All my EVE guys do it for the kill mails. If a fight breaks out in system to kill even more stuff in space, they like that, too, more mails for the killboard. KM's are the best motivator CCP has made to get my guys interested in bombardments since the mechanic was introduced a year ago... ...I honestly would just shoot anyone not in my fleet that was on the beacon regardless of who they were bombarding for, so my bombardment guys would have less competition as they go to pull the trigger. Once 'blowing stuff up' becomes the end in and of itself, this game will be over. Destruction should be a part of the narrative of Dust, but it won't propel the game to be great. I would hope that we could ascend a little bit above designing a system that is just a Pavlovian slobber machine. You are playing a murder simulator, dude. But all douche-baggery aside, when there is more to the EVE-Dust connection besides dropping OBs, I will be as happy as you that the games have "ascended" above mindlessly blowing stuff up. But that time isn't here just yet, so I'm content with my kill mails (and loss mails.) CEO of General Tso's Alliance. Winner of Hulkageddon IV. Contact me on my EVE character: Burseg Sardaukar
ReGnYuM Imperfects 1651	Posted - 2013.12.31 23:43:00 - [163] - Quote We need faction ranks assigned with standing... enough said Official Imperfect Title: Supreme Leader of the Endless Sunset To the Matari, I am the equivalent to the Boogie Man
Evicer THE HECATONCHIRES 121	Posted - 2014.01.01 08:59:00 - [164] - Quote Id also like to add that the EVE player be able to decide which squad lead he/she does the OB FOR if ti has not been already mentioned in the thread.Why this isnt implemented is beyond me. Seeing team squad leads call in OB"s to no effect either from lack of skill,lack of scan , on purpose , or because they suffer from premature ejaculation.Is idiotic... Some of us Dust players have made friends with EVE pilots that will do these OB"S for us.Those of us have had to make connections, create channels, build relations with these individuals.Not only that the EVE player has to get to the battle in time may be snuck up on while doing the OB and could loose there ship .Risking there ship all so a some 35 wp,16th place, negative KDR, redline sniper can call in the OB to nowhere. Fail mechanic = fail Closed Beta Tester since Crater Lake My motto regarding haters http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8gAb3uc6fk
Priss N6FAA2813 Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.01 09:09:00 - [165] - Quote Evicer wrote: Id also like to add that the EVE player be able to decide which squad lead he/she does the OB FOR if ti has not been already mentioned in the thread.Why this isnt implemented is beyond me. Seeing team squad leads call in OB"s to no effect either from lack of skill,lack of scan , on purpose , or because they suffer from premature ejaculation.Is idiotic... Some of us Dust players have made friends with EVE pilots that will do these OB"S for us.Those of us have had to make connections, create channels, build relations with these individuals.Not only that the EVE player has to get to the battle in time may be snuck up on while doing the OB and could loose there ship .Risking there ship all so a some 35 wp,16th place, negative KDR, redline sniper can call in the OB to nowhere. Fail mechanic = fail +1
SickJ sephiroth clones D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 120	Posted - 2014.01.02 07:13:00 - [166] - Quote Severus Smith wrote: FW needs contract levels (1 to 4) and mercs need to be able to choose a contract themselves (or select random if they wish). The more desirable the district the higher the contract level. So System A (that no one is really fighting for) would have mainly level 1 contracts while System B (that is a huge front line and has been contested for weeks) would have mainly level 4 contracts. Level 1 would primarily be the disorganized pub matches we have today, with low payout and a minute standings drop if lost. Level 2 would be a step above the pub matches, more organized, with a better payout and a small standings drop if lost. Level 3 would be squads only (maybe 4x 4 man squads = 16). Good payout with a moderate standings drop if lost. Level 4 would be team deploy only with high payouts but a big standings drop if lost. This makes it so that as you get higher standings you become more useful towards your faction taking space. It also means that as you gain standings you rise above the chaos, TKing, pubbies, and whatever in the lower level contracts. +1 Quote: Also, we need rankings / medals or something for FW. So that people who are dedicated to their factions get something to show off. I would love to be able to get an medal with the Caldari logo on it atop my avatar to show that I have won 1000x battles for the Caldari. Or an Inquisitors medal for the Amarr for winning 1000x battles with them. 100x Level 1 wins - 'Thank you for your service, please accept this stack of free faction gear' 100x Level 2 wins - You get a medal that also gets you a discount on faction gear. 100x Level 3 wins - Your Corp gets a discount on faction gear.
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1655	Posted - 2014.01.02 08:07:00 - [167] - Quote SickJ wrote: Severus Smith wrote: FW needs contract levels (1 to 4) and mercs need to be able to choose a contract themselves (or select random if they wish). The more desirable the district the higher the contract level. So System A (that no one is really fighting for) would have mainly level 1 contracts while System B (that is a huge front line and has been contested for weeks) would have mainly level 4 contracts. Level 1 would primarily be the disorganized pub matches we have today, with low payout and a minute standings drop if lost. Level 2 would be a step above the pub matches, more organized, with a better payout and a small standings drop if lost. Level 3 would be squads only (maybe 4x 4 man squads = 16). Good payout with a moderate standings drop if lost. Level 4 would be team deploy only with high payouts but a big standings drop if lost. This makes it so that as you get higher standings you become more useful towards your faction taking space. It also means that as you gain standings you rise above the chaos, TKing, pubbies, and whatever in the lower level contracts. +1 Quote: Also, we need rankings / medals or something for FW. So that people who are dedicated to their factions get something to show off. I would love to be able to get an medal with the Caldari logo on it atop my avatar to show that I have won 1000x battles for the Caldari. Or an Inquisitors medal for the Amarr for winning 1000x battles with them. 100x Level 1 wins - 'Thank you for your service, please accept this stack of free faction gear' 100x Level 2 wins - You get a medal that also gets you a discount on faction gear. 100x Level 3 wins - Your Corp gets a discount on faction gear. We dont have the player base to actually divide it any further. I am not against this idea but its just not realistic now [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm [CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit [CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
SirManBoy Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 385	Posted - 2014.01.02 08:10:00 - [168] - Quote So many of you guys are making the perfect the enemy of the good. Team deploy is good for corps, period. Even if its first iteration allowed nothing more than deployments into pubs and a totally unchanged FW, it would still be a HUGE WIN! MAG had a simple team deploy system and it was incredible. Sure, some matches were stomps, but who cares? No one is entitled to an easy game. If anything, it would encourage more players to join corps, more corps to join alliances, and so on. Make the team deploy system exactly like the current squad finder system and I promise you that it becomes a huge hit with the community.
BMSTUBBY KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 570	Posted - 2014.01.02 12:54:00 - [169] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: So many of you guys are making the perfect the enemy of the good. Team deploy is good for corps, period. Even if its first iteration allowed nothing more than deployments into pubs and a totally unchanged FW, it would still be a HUGE WIN! MAG had a simple team deploy system and it was incredible. Sure, some matches were stomps, but who cares? No one is entitled to an easy game. If anything, it would encourage more players to join corps, more corps to join alliances, and so on. Make the team deploy system exactly like the current squad finder system and I promise you that it becomes a huge hit with the community. QFT Meh, F2P Lobby Shooter BattleDuty 514 Working as intended.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 358	Posted - 2014.01.02 13:30:00 - [170] - Quote Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it.** 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers I love droppin OBs. Haven't seen my OBs from the ground view, but everyone tells me they are amazing. I think the biggest problem is just not knowing in advance when and where battles are going to take place. In EVE, my buds would que for battle, then link me the area. Typically it would be too far away to reach in time. But I still move in that direction, then, once they are out, I move to the next one. After that I keep hoping to the mid point between the 2 battles that we found. Seemed to work out much better this way. Having battles pop like a PC with a 5 minute timer or something would make a HUGE difference. Oh and caldari, boo. That is the enemy! Nuff Said

CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES 531	Posted - 2014.01.02 14:39:00 - [171] - Quote Free Beers wrote: So today we attempted to Q sync to fight for the caldari faction. Armed with eve pilots plexing and providing orbital support we made all haste to take the Eha system for them. For many of us vets that have been around since replication itGÇÖs been a long time coming. We had been testing what we can and can not do in fw since 1.7 was released and found a way to use the system to get it to do what we wanted(or at least we had hoped). We had almost 10 full squads of players (and more still looking for squad) from Imps, TP, AE, FA, Rainbow effect, STB, OH, Nyain San, Hellstorm, EON, WTF, SI, etc and I probably missed a few. A channel full of frenemies if you would, and I couldnGÇÖt have been happier to see you all /me hugs dust nerds. (Shout out to the Caldari eve pilots who I will keep nameless and those willing to pay for dust mercs services) This is where all the good news ends. It turned out to be a complete cluster ** and not for our lack of trying. Even with eve pilots in system it was almost impossible to get a eha battle and when we did caldari was defending districts they didnGÇÖt own it seemed. IGÇÖll spare you all the pleasant holiday well wishes the that was spoke about ccp in our fw channel. So now that we have had time with 1.7 and know what we can and cant do and what needs to be done I have volunteered to bring the info to you. First I will say you donGÇÖt have a choice these changes need to be in 1.8 and there doesnGÇÖt need to be a 1.8 till these changes are in it.** 1.If caldari or amarr have no districts they should be attacking not defending donGÇÖt you think? So how to solve this at this point in time I am open to solutions. In discussions with other fw players here are a few of their ideas. a.If your faction owns under 20% system district you always attack. b.Scale attack defend ratio based upon system control aka you own 20% you attack 80% c.If you win a defense match you get to attack next match 2.Private contracts. Simple eve players/corps/milita can award private contract to dust corps/alliance. Roles should piggy back dust side like in PC. Players get paid not corps. Should also have defensive contract for that can be assigned private or if no one dust they become public (anyone can join). Rewards should be more 3.Rewards. At the moment FW needs isk, I understand you have a long term play with player market and trading but FW needs isk pay outs now. 4.Make more rewards for Eve FW militas (donGÇÖt care how at this point but OB support is amazing) 5.TEAM DEPLOY ( edit: this is for private contracts only, pub fw matches can be q sync'd ) 6.TEAM DEPLOY 7.TEAM DEPLOY (like in PC) 8.TEAM DEPLOY (glares at CCP Nullarbor while hearing telc yell about team deploy in his head) So I tried to keep it simple and not offer a laundry list of things. So other players feel free to add or discuss ideas above. So what I am about to say may get me stoned out of the dust nerd club but here it goes. Turn off PC. FW is about mercs working for the factions and eve pilots. Focus efforts there please. PC 2.0 in nullsec is a different story. I know have never been a fan of PC in its current state to you can take my idea with a grain of salt. Remember with the lp system isk is less of a factor if you are limited by standing and the amount of lp you have. Dust #1 fanboi Free Beers Even though I know supporting this will end up with your mob ruining my nice relaxing solo time................... +1 Well said good sir!
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2557	Posted - 2014.01.02 14:43:00 - [172] - Quote BursegSardaukar wrote: Free Beers wrote: BursegSardaukar wrote: CCP Nullarbor wrote: Great thread, and really interesting to see the results of this. I agree 100% we need to do 2 big things to give this the flexibility it deserves. 1. Team Deploy, we've always wanted it, we havn't done it yet because it's a lot of work but it needs to happen. 2. Queuing for a specific system to allow DUST to dictate where they want to fight. This makes the most sense to do in combination with team deploy. We have spoken at length about both of these with the CPM including during the design of Uprising 1.7. They are both on the plan but simply got cut due to time constraints. I can't speak to whether they will be in 1.8 mind you, plans are afoot. How about letting EVE pilots bombard for their boys on the ground regardless of FW enlistment (or let randoms do it and this might lead to them joining militias)? I'm going to beat this horse to death and keep on beating: If you want EVE players to accept Dust players in their universe, allow them to do so through the most meaningful connection: murder from the sky. Remove LP payouts if the player/corp/alliance isn't a member of FW, let them choose a side when they connect to the district, then flag them as suspect for as long as they are connected. It solves all problems. No. You have such bad ideas please refrain from posting in my threads. Edit: As someone who plays FW for all 4 factions all the time i will tell you there is almost zero OB support so why in the hell would you want to reduce the pool of potential OB pilots. I can't comprehend this level of stupidity I'm saying to expand it. Allow MORE potential bombardiers. From Alliance mates of guys in the match to brand new EVE players looking to see what its like. Expanding it would create lots of issues. it would allow teamkilling bums like you to have ob support for just that. gtfo Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2557	Posted - 2014.01.02 14:46:00 - [173] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: So many of you guys are making the perfect the enemy of the good. Team deploy is good for corps, period. Even if its first iteration allowed nothing more than deployments into pubs and a totally unchanged FW, it would still be a HUGE WIN! MAG had a simple team deploy system and it was incredible. Sure, some matches were stomps, but who cares? No one is entitled to an easy game. If anything, it would encourage more players to join corps, more corps to join alliances, and so on. Make the team deploy system exactly like the current squad finder system and I promise you that it becomes a huge hit with the community. Couldnt be further from the truth. Team is anyone in your squad, or team. It aint rocket science. Qsync is a reliable 'team' deploy as is. u want to queue 16, easy, just takes longer to get a match cause u have a full side and its waiting for the next district to pop. Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2480	Posted - 2014.01.02 14:59:00 - [174] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: SirManBoy wrote: So many of you guys are making the perfect the enemy of the good. Team deploy is good for corps, period. Even if its first iteration allowed nothing more than deployments into pubs and a totally unchanged FW, it would still be a HUGE WIN! MAG had a simple team deploy system and it was incredible. Sure, some matches were stomps, but who cares? No one is entitled to an easy game. If anything, it would encourage more players to join corps, more corps to join alliances, and so on. Make the team deploy system exactly like the current squad finder system and I promise you that it becomes a huge hit with the community. Couldnt be further from the truth. Team is anyone in your squad, or team. It aint rocket science. Qsync is a reliable 'team' deploy as is. u want to queue 16, easy, just takes longer to get a match cause u have a full side and its waiting for the next district to pop. I don't agree. Qsyncing is a beatdown to do more than 3 or 4 times. CCP has to do something to entice the hordes of players that don't even take the time to squad up to play as a team. I'd say less than 5% of Dust has any idea how to play as a team. I'd say easily 50% of Dust doesn't care to learn (FW is causing some interest) because pubs payout when losing and less effort is more when it comes to profit. Grinding matches to cap out is also something that causes people to avoid squading up (takes too much time between matches when people drop or switch characters, etc). Anyway there are lots of factors in the erosion of team play in Dust, but how on earth could introducing team deploy not help bring it back? ML Director Eve Toon - Raylan Scott
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2557	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:08:00 - [175] - Quote Im not saying team deploy isnt long overdue. What I AM saying is that capability is already present, and devoting precious time to implementing a formal team deploy at this time. With the plethora of other issues that are far more pressing, is where i disagree with pushing for that right now. dust is 16v16. Before anyone ever deploys into a battle they should at the very least be aware that squads and teams are far superior than randoms. Its not like dust is groundbreaking in the fact that large numbers mean team-based gameplay. sorry if 70% of this community has no idea how to play such a game. Perhaps tutorials (lol) or a better system to allow randoms to learn the ways of the jedi... lets see, in a single cycle (maybe even 2) do u want team deploy.....OR the FW system addressed, memory leaks decreased, overall game latency to improve and the rebels finally having to fess up to the truth that only because of a broken system do they hold all of their area of space? we are in agreement on what needs to be done, i think its more the prioritizing of those things Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
SirManBoy Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 388	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:09:00 - [176] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: SirManBoy wrote: So many of you guys are making the perfect the enemy of the good. Team deploy is good for corps, period. Even if its first iteration allowed nothing more than deployments into pubs and a totally unchanged FW, it would still be a HUGE WIN! MAG had a simple team deploy system and it was incredible. Sure, some matches were stomps, but who cares? No one is entitled to an easy game. If anything, it would encourage more players to join corps, more corps to join alliances, and so on. Make the team deploy system exactly like the current squad finder system and I promise you that it becomes a huge hit with the community. Couldnt be further from the truth. Team is anyone in your squad, or team. It aint rocket science. Qsync is a reliable 'team' deploy as is. u want to queue 16, easy, just takes longer to get a match cause u have a full side and its waiting for the next district to pop. Sorry, but we have very different opinions about its reliability. I played MAG for years and I demand a mechanic that works as flawlessly as MAG's clan deploy system. It needs to be something that integrates with the current squad finder system and allows deploys into whatever game mode the team leader chooses. No tricks, no Qsyncs.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2374	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:15:00 - [177] - Quote Evicer wrote: Id also like to add that the EVE player be able to decide which squad lead he/she does the OB FOR if ti has not been already mentioned in the thread.Why this isnt implemented is beyond me. Seeing team squad leads call in OB"s to no effect either from lack of skill,lack of scan , on purpose , or because they suffer from premature ejaculation.Is idiotic... Some of us Dust players have made friends with EVE pilots that will do these OB"S for us.Those of us have had to make connections, create channels, build relations with these individuals.Not only that the EVE player has to get to the battle in time may be snuck up on while doing the OB and could loose there ship .Risking there ship all so a some 35 wp,16th place, negative KDR, redline sniper can call in the OB to nowhere. Fail mechanic = fail This is already in the game. When an OB request goes in the Eve pilot sees the name of the squad leader. The eve player then decides which name to choose if there are multiple requests. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2559	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:16:00 - [178] - Quote Sorry to break it to you, but this isnt MAG. Different company and by FAR a different size playerbase... gotta stay somewhat grounded in reality to prioritize whats needed now vs what should all already be in the game Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2374	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:21:00 - [179] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Sorry, but we have very different opinions about its reliability. I played MAG for years and I demand a mechanic that works as flawlessly as MAG's clan deploy system. It needs to be something that integrates with the current squad finder system and allows deploys into whatever game mode the team leader chooses. No tricks, no Qsyncs. Team deploy has absolutely no place outside of Faction Warfare and Planetary Conquest. Putting Team Deploy in high sec pubs would probably be one of the absolute worst things you could possibly do. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 1342	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:26:00 - [180] - Quote Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten Executing Amarr Trash since Closed Beta

SirManBoy Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 388	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:31:00 - [181] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: SirManBoy wrote: Sorry, but we have very different opinions about its reliability. I played MAG for years and I demand a mechanic that works as flawlessly as MAG's clan deploy system. It needs to be something that integrates with the current squad finder system and allows deploys into whatever game mode the team leader chooses. No tricks, no Qsyncs. Team deploy has absolutely no place outside of Faction Warfare and Planetary Conquest. Putting Team Deploy in high sec pubs would probably be one of the absolute worst things you could possibly do. I don't agree. My experience is that it works. MAG had it for its version of pubs and it didn't break the game. In fact, it made it much better.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2560	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:34:00 - [182] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. I dont think u realize the consequences that such a thing would impact. Most isk in PC is distributed to countless mercs. If that were all removed, u would lose more than a few players... the farmers, past and present, with exception of only a small handful, spend their isk and share it with their members. problem is the huge disparity between the 'farmers' and those that grind isk Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2481	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:34:00 - [183] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Im not saying team deploy isnt long overdue. What I AM saying is that capability is already present, and devoting precious time to implementing a formal team deploy at this time. With the plethora of other issues that are far more pressing, is where i disagree with pushing for that right now. dust is 16v16. Before anyone ever deploys into a battle they should at the very least be aware that squads and teams are far superior than randoms. Its not like dust is groundbreaking in the fact that large numbers mean team-based gameplay. sorry if 70% of this community has no idea how to play such a game. Perhaps tutorials (lol) or a better system to allow randoms to learn the ways of the jedi... lets see, in a single cycle (maybe even 2) do u want team deploy.....OR the FW system addressed, memory leaks decreased, overall game latency to improve and the rebels finally having to fess up to the truth that only because of a broken system do they hold all of their area of space? we are in agreement on what needs to be done, i think its more the prioritizing of those things No doubt, I firmly believe that it's the payout system in pubs that has slowly pulled people out of squads and into the redline. When you can profit more from hiding and going 0-0 with 0 WP and profit more than the dude at the top of the leaderboard you are going to have problems. Fixing that should be the number 1 priority. ML Director Eve Toon - Raylan Scott
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2561	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:39:00 - [184] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Kain Spero wrote: SirManBoy wrote: Sorry, but we have very different opinions about its reliability. I played MAG for years and I demand a mechanic that works as flawlessly as MAG's clan deploy system. It needs to be something that integrates with the current squad finder system and allows deploys into whatever game mode the team leader chooses. No tricks, no Qsyncs. Team deploy has absolutely no place outside of Faction Warfare and Planetary Conquest. Putting Team Deploy in high sec pubs would probably be one of the absolute worst things you could possibly do. I don't agree. My experience is that it works. MAG had it for its version of pubs and it didn't break the game. In fact, it made it much better. U need to understand there are what 3000 total mercs split between 3 different pub types and faction warfare, all taking time out to play pc here and there. at 32 in a match, thats less than 100 TOTAL matches going on in this game at any one time... now, 3 game modes are also separated by region. so lets say half the playerbase is doing fw, that leaves 50 total lobbies for 9 games (3 modes in 3 regions) so what 5 games going per mode at most in a region? And how often do you play pubs that are empty? it worked in mag cause everyone was on the dame 'server' playing the same games. A large pool to choose from when creating matches. we dont have that liberty here Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2561	Posted - 2014.01.02 15:45:00 - [185] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Im not saying team deploy isnt long overdue. What I AM saying is that capability is already present, and devoting precious time to implementing a formal team deploy at this time. With the plethora of other issues that are far more pressing, is where i disagree with pushing for that right now. dust is 16v16. Before anyone ever deploys into a battle they should at the very least be aware that squads and teams are far superior than randoms. Its not like dust is groundbreaking in the fact that large numbers mean team-based gameplay. sorry if 70% of this community has no idea how to play such a game. Perhaps tutorials (lol) or a better system to allow randoms to learn the ways of the jedi... lets see, in a single cycle (maybe even 2) do u want team deploy.....OR the FW system addressed, memory leaks decreased, overall game latency to improve and the rebels finally having to fess up to the truth that only because of a broken system do they hold all of their area of space? we are in agreement on what needs to be done, i think its more the prioritizing of those things No doubt, I firmly believe that it's the payout system in pubs that has slowly pulled people out of squads and into the redline. When you can profit more from hiding and going 0-0 with 0 WP and profit more than the dude at the top of the leaderboard you are going to have problems. Fixing that should be the number 1 priority. The inherent flaw of the entire system couldnt agree more +1 Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1457	Posted - 2014.01.02 16:15:00 - [186] - Quote Team deploy in regular pub matches worked in MAG, or should I say it worked in the Domination and possibly Acquisition modes of MAG, because it sure didn't work in Sabotage. The reason for this is that Sabotage was 32 player teams and the chance of running into other good squads/full team on the other team was fairly minimal. In Acquisition and especially Domination you were almost guaranteed to run into a group on the other team due to teams being 64 players in Aquisition and 128 in Domination, and even moreso when parties would always fill the last platoon first (so second platoon in Aqui and fourth platoon in Domi) ensuring that parties would always go against each other and randoms against each other. The only way you would run into problems with this system (for Aqui and Domi at least) would be if entire teams were queing up. There were rarely 32 player parties going, let alone bigger parties. What this means for Dust is that team deploy for pub matches should never be introduced as long as teams are only 16 players, as that would mean nearly every match would be over before it started. When/if Dust gets on the PS4 and we see teams of at least 64 players team deploy could maybe work, but that is still more than a long way off. Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament. Go Go Power Rangers!
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2374	Posted - 2014.01.02 16:49:00 - [187] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. The players who have participated in Planetary Conquest have done nothing wrong in doing so. They played the game and used the rules set up by CCP to put themselves in the best position possible. The footprints are in the sandbox already and the ISK is in the system. Even if PC were to be shut off the fairest course of action would be for CCP to sell off the clones at whatever the Genolution purchase price was at that time and refund the cost of any clone pack attacks in process. Back on topic though the fact that without a player market faction warfare will just wither on the vine and this is the primary issue that needs to be addressed. If the player market can't be implemented in a timely fashion then the stop-gap measure of putting ISK into FW in addition to LP needs to take place. Owner of Spero Escrow Services Follow @KainSpero for Dust and CPM news
iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Public Disorder. 1	Posted - 2014.01.02 17:10:00 - [188] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Im not saying team deploy isnt long overdue. What I AM saying is that capability is already present, and devoting precious time to implementing a formal team deploy at this time. With the plethora of other issues that are far more pressing, is where i disagree with pushing for that right now. dust is 16v16. Before anyone ever deploys into a battle they should at the very least be aware that squads and teams are far superior than randoms. Its not like dust is groundbreaking in the fact that large numbers mean team-based gameplay. sorry if 70% of this community has no idea how to play such a game. Perhaps tutorials (lol) or a better system to allow randoms to learn the ways of the jedi... lets see, in a single cycle (maybe even 2) do u want team deploy.....OR the FW system addressed, memory leaks decreased, overall game latency to improve and the rebels finally having to fess up to the truth that only because of a broken system do they hold all of their area of space? we are in agreement on what needs to be done, i think its more the prioritizing of those things No doubt, I firmly believe that it's the payout system in pubs that has slowly pulled people out of squads and into the redline. When you can profit more from hiding and going 0-0 with 0 WP and profit more than the dude at the top of the leaderboard you are going to have problems. Fixing that should be the number 1 priority. The inherent flaw of the entire system couldnt agree more +1 Yes! +1000. And Team Deploy as fast as possible. Remember that there was a time when there was no squad finder - - yet there were squads. So now have teams without team finder . . .
Ku Shala Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 739	Posted - 2014.01.02 17:49:00 - [189] - Quote Maybe a list of active battles be it attack or defence in the FW contracts so you could choose where you are going to deploy so there could be more stratagey to the FW. The player base could be more selective about defending or attacking and q-sync/ mass deploys would not be nessary because you could select the planet and district you are attacking. Base the available attacks to adjacent planets. make mercs select 1 faction at a time. Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Apply today! For the State Caldari Loyalist
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Public Disorder. 1420	Posted - 2014.01.02 17:50:00 - [190] - Quote iliel wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Im not saying team deploy isnt long overdue. What I AM saying is that capability is already present, and devoting precious time to implementing a formal team deploy at this time. With the plethora of other issues that are far more pressing, is where i disagree with pushing for that right now. dust is 16v16. Before anyone ever deploys into a battle they should at the very least be aware that squads and teams are far superior than randoms. Its not like dust is groundbreaking in the fact that large numbers mean team-based gameplay. sorry if 70% of this community has no idea how to play such a game. Perhaps tutorials (lol) or a better system to allow randoms to learn the ways of the jedi... lets see, in a single cycle (maybe even 2) do u want team deploy.....OR the FW system addressed, memory leaks decreased, overall game latency to improve and the rebels finally having to fess up to the truth that only because of a broken system do they hold all of their area of space? we are in agreement on what needs to be done, i think its more the prioritizing of those things No doubt, I firmly believe that it's the payout system in pubs that has slowly pulled people out of squads and into the redline. When you can profit more from hiding and going 0-0 with 0 WP and profit more than the dude at the top of the leaderboard you are going to have problems. Fixing that should be the number 1 priority. The inherent flaw of the entire system couldnt agree more +1 Yes! +1000. And Team Deploy as fast as possible. Remember that there was a time when there was no squad finder - - yet there were squads. So now have teams without team finder . . . Been saying this for a loooooooooooooong time, but the passive in-match skillpoints are a poison that are killing this game. The tragedy is that it's so easy to fix - the only thing standing in the way is CCP itself. I support SP rollover.

Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 1343	Posted - 2014.01.02 19:49:00 - [191] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. The players who have participated in Planetary Conquest have done nothing wrong in doing so. They played the game and used the rules set up by CCP to put themselves in the best position possible. The footprints are in the sandbox already and the ISK is in the system. Even if PC were to be shut off the fairest course of action would be for CCP to sell off the clones at whatever the Genolution purchase price was at that time and refund the cost of any clone pack attacks in process. Back on topic though the fact that without a player market faction warfare will just wither on the vine and this is the primary issue that needs to be addressed. If the player market can't be implemented in a timely fashion then the stop-gap measure of putting ISK into FW in addition to LP needs to take place. You bring up the player market and how without it, FW will just "wither on the vine". Once we get it, it will matter very little to anyone who wasn't a farmer if the ISK from PC is left alone. Would the loss of the ragequitting farmers be a good thing for Dust? It is arguable that it would be, though almost definitely wouldn't be viewed that way. CCP made a mistake similar to paying AFKers for going 0-0-0 with 0 WP in allowing the passive ISK faucet that PC started out as to run for as long as it did. Changing it did nothing to solve the issue of the Blueberry Muffin either, it simply made it even more difficult for newer/smaller corps to get involved in PC without fellating a member of the farmer circlejerk for help with ringing or rental agreements. Yes, in the shortterm, causing the loss of the farmers though the removal of the PC ISK would appear to be a fatal blow to Dust, though IMHO, it is necessary for the survival of Dust in the longterm. It would create an environment where there would actually be market competition rather than a market dictatorship led by a cabal of farmers turned merchants. Don't get me wrong, I am not disagreeing that the players who got rich on PC farming were only using the means given to them by CCP to be in the best position. I will however assert my opinion that CCP made a grave mistake in releasing PC as it was and allowing the tools to be so readily exploited. The mistake should be erased for the health and longterm benefit of this game we all love/hate. If people truly had the best intentions for this game and being able to play it for a long time to come, they'd suck it up and deal with returning the ISK. I mean, let's face it, who has truly been happy with the state of PC since its release? Which is more important to you? Being stupid rich in a game that has a bleak outlook and potential short forecast for lifespan or leveling the imbalanced playing field created by foolish choices made by CCP and potentially greatly extending the potential lifespan of this game we all play?? The answer is obvious if you're not an entitled selfish ****. Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten Executing Amarr Trash since Closed Beta
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1666	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:02:00 - [192] - Quote Alaika Arbosa wrote: Kain Spero wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. The players who have participated in Planetary Conquest have done nothing wrong in doing so. They played the game and used the rules set up by CCP to put themselves in the best position possible. The footprints are in the sandbox already and the ISK is in the system. Even if PC were to be shut off the fairest course of action would be for CCP to sell off the clones at whatever the Genolution purchase price was at that time and refund the cost of any clone pack attacks in process. Back on topic though the fact that without a player market faction warfare will just wither on the vine and this is the primary issue that needs to be addressed. If the player market can't be implemented in a timely fashion then the stop-gap measure of putting ISK into FW in addition to LP needs to take place. You bring up the player market and how without it, FW will just "wither on the vine". Once we get it, it will matter very little to anyone who wasn't a farmer if the ISK from PC is left alone. Would the loss of the ragequitting farmers be a good thing for Dust? It is arguable that it would be, though almost definitely wouldn't be viewed that way. CCP made a mistake similar to paying AFKers for going 0-0-0 with 0 WP in allowing the passive ISK faucet that PC started out as to run for as long as it did. Changing it did nothing to solve the issue of the Blueberry Muffin either, it simply made it even more difficult for newer/smaller corps to get involved in PC without fellating a member of the farmer circlejerk for help with ringing or rental agreements. Yes, in the shortterm, causing the loss of the farmers though the removal of the PC ISK would appear to be a fatal blow to Dust, though IMHO, it is necessary for the survival of Dust in the longterm. It would create an environment where there would actually be market competition rather than a market dictatorship led by a cabal of farmers turned merchants. Don't get me wrong, I am not disagreeing that the players who got rich on PC farming were only using the means given to them by CCP to be in the best position. I will however assert my opinion that CCP made a grave mistake in releasing PC as it was and allowing the tools to be so readily exploited. The mistake should be erased for the health and longterm benefit of this game we all love/hate. If people truly had the best intentions for this game and being able to play it for a long time to come, they'd suck it up and deal with returning the ISK. I mean, let's face it, who has truly been happy with the state of PC since its release? Which is more important to you? Being stupid rich in a game that has a bleak outlook and potential short forecast for lifespan or leveling the imbalanced playing field created by foolish choices made by CCP and potentially greatly extending the potential lifespan of this game we all play?? The answer is obvious if you're not an entitled selfish **. IF PC was turned off hardly any players would leave. CCP would just have to put isk in FW and be done with it. CCP says the next version of PC will be totally different so why the hell leave the ** farming on in its current state (disclamer my 5 accounts i am worth close to 1 bill dust isk so i am not being a hater) [CCP]FoxFour> STFU beers[CCP]FoxFour> Erm [CCP]FoxFour> I mean[CCP]FoxFour> shit [CCP]FoxFour> you were defending me
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1953	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:52:00 - [193] - Quote So this is more of a PC thing....stop reading if you don't care about it... I really think the next form on PC will involve some kind of active upkeep. Without the manual active upkeep of some kind, you won't be able to make your districts generate clones (or at least profitably). The upkeep could payoff in both better clone production (which will more likely just be fore battle) but also produce some other resources for Eve that are possibly exported. The cost of upkeep though will basically be the labor it takes to do it, therefore district ownership will scale directly with amount of land owned. You'd have to contract out the upkeep of your land to other people you trust or risk your clones becoming too low and vulnerable. If for example, it could be announced that districts would regularly have timers corresponding to 'planetary shipping' or something and that these time periods could be vulnerable to ambush 'cycle' style attacks. This could even be within a few hours or so of the normal reinforcement window. However they wouldn't be subject to districts being 'locked'. Each window would allow for an ambush or two each day which, if successful, could allow the pillaging of these desired goods that were being shipped away for export. It could be kind of like PI, where you could have your production facility making a shipment sent to your warehouse every 12 hours, and this production rate would net the fastest rate of total production. However, it would be subject to attack every 12 hours too (or whatever the cycle length). Instead, you could settle for a slower rate of production and shipping every 48 hours only having to defend 1/4th the amount. Some infrastructure could allow for better production rates, others could be more defensive, ensuring that raids take a smaller portion of stored/shipped assets. The more districts, the more cycles, the more production, the more defending, etc. If you had 5 districts you could have as little as 17 times potentially each weak, or as many as 70 depending on how you set up your cycles. Infrastructure Example: Production facility: Produces 300/500/675/800 widgets during a 12/24/36/48 hours cycle. Stores 1600 widgets. Ships/exports max of 800 widgets per cycle. Excess widgets are destroyed. Raids: can steal 50% of a cycle's produced widgets. Warehouse: Produces 0 widgets Stores 10,000 widgets/5000 advanced widgets. Ships/exports max of 2,000/3,000/5,000 widgets every 12/24/48 cycle. Raids: can steal 25% of a warehouse's stored widgets/advanced widgets. Research Lab: Produces advanced widgets from widgets at an efficiency of 40%/35%/25% every 12/24/48 hour cycle (max of 1,000 adv widgets per cycle). Stores: 2,500 widgets total. Ships/exports: 1,000 widgets per cycle Raids: can steal 50% of a cycle's advanced widgets. Every cycle, if your infrastructure has an output, it can be stored/shipped/or exported. If it is exported it moves to the planetary custom's office where someone from the corp with access rights can retrieve it. Hopefully you'd get the basics of this. There would be logistics supply chains that would need to be defended constantly in order to maintain maximum production. Minimal production would still be possible and profitable with much less risk, but also less profit.
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 1343	Posted - 2014.01.02 21:46:00 - [194] - Quote Free Beers wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: Kain Spero wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: Let PC burn, close the broken faucet down and focus on FW. The only problem I see with this course of action is that the farmers will get to keep their dirty lucre and those who didn't participate in the Blueberry Muffin circlejerk with be locked out of the ranks of being stupid rich like the farmers. In the interest of the longterm health of Dust, I'd suggest CCP reclaims the Isk distributed thus far via PC. Yes, I understand that this may drive many to ragequit Dust though I honestly feel it it the best thing that can be done currently to ensure the longterm health of Dust and the future player market. The players who have participated in Planetary Conquest have done nothing wrong in doing so. They played the game and used the rules set up by CCP to put themselves in the best position possible. The footprints are in the sandbox already and the ISK is in the system. Even if PC were to be shut off the fairest course of action would be for CCP to sell off the clones at whatever the Genolution purchase price was at that time and refund the cost of any clone pack attacks in process. Back on topic though the fact that without a player market faction warfare will just wither on the vine and this is the primary issue that needs to be addressed. If the player market can't be implemented in a timely fashion then the stop-gap measure of putting ISK into FW in addition to LP needs to take place. You bring up the player market and how without it, FW will just "wither on the vine". Once we get it, it will matter very little to anyone who wasn't a farmer if the ISK from PC is left alone. Would the loss of the ragequitting farmers be a good thing for Dust? It is arguable that it would be, though almost definitely wouldn't be viewed that way. CCP made a mistake similar to paying AFKers for going 0-0-0 with 0 WP in allowing the passive ISK faucet that PC started out as to run for as long as it did. Changing it did nothing to solve the issue of the Blueberry Muffin either, it simply made it even more difficult for newer/smaller corps to get involved in PC without fellating a member of the farmer circlejerk for help with ringing or rental agreements. Yes, in the shortterm, causing the loss of the farmers though the removal of the PC ISK would appear to be a fatal blow to Dust, though IMHO, it is necessary for the survival of Dust in the longterm. It would create an environment where there would actually be market competition rather than a market dictatorship led by a cabal of farmers turned merchants. Don't get me wrong, I am not disagreeing that the players who got rich on PC farming were only using the means given to them by CCP to be in the best position. I will however assert my opinion that CCP made a grave mistake in releasing PC as it was and allowing the tools to be so readily exploited. The mistake should be erased for the health and longterm benefit of this game we all love/hate. If people truly had the best intentions for this game and being able to play it for a long time to come, they'd suck it up and deal with returning the ISK. I mean, let's face it, who has truly been happy with the state of PC since its release? Which is more important to you? Being stupid rich in a game that has a bleak outlook and potential short forecast for lifespan or leveling the imbalanced playing field created by foolish choices made by CCP and potentially greatly extending the potential lifespan of this game we all play?? The answer is obvious if you're not an entitled selfish **. IF PC was turned off hardly any players would leave. CCP would just have to put isk in FW and be done with it. CCP says the next version of PC will be totally different so why the hell leave the ** farming on in its current state (disclamer my 5 accounts i am worth close to 1 bill dust isk so i am not being a hater) I wouldn't expect players to leave if PC was simply turned off, now if the Isk distributed via PC were to be reclaimed by CCP, I could imagine a large number of players getting their panties in a twist. Just for full disclosure, I am not a hater either. If I felt like dealing with a 10:1 exchange rate, I too could be a Dust billionaire (several times over no less). I simply am more interested in the longterm health of this game that I enjoy (beyond all logical understanding) than I am in having a wallet that was stupid bloated with play money. Praise St. Arzad and Pass the Nanohives Karin Midular, gone, never forgotten Executing Amarr Trash since Closed Beta
Priss N6FAA2813 Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 9	Posted - 2014.01.06 01:30:00 - [195] - Quote Aisha Ctarl wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. To be fair it was easy to see this early on. Even if Amarr were winning the flaws would be there, it would just be less of an impact on your wallet. For now it's a good way to try new stuff without spending AUR (if that stuff is Gallente or Minmitar). I saw it coming as well, but it's still kind of a surprising that Aero, the number one Amarr, the dude with the unflappable spirit has now at least imo has become a bitter vet that has pretty much had it with the game. I squaded up with him earlier and he did about a match and a half before he was fed up...I felt his pain, I wanted to cry for him. Rage quitters will never be good at this game or any fps for that matter. I dont know who these 3 people are but Im sure the Amarr Fw loyalist dont consider your half efforts a great loss.
True Adamance Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 5405	Posted - 2014.01.06 01:38:00 - [196] - Quote pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: pyramidhead 420 wrote: Aisha Ctarl wrote: Faction warfare is so beyond broken that even AAA (Adamance, Aero, and Aisha) have given up. Until FW is fixed... 1) your fighting will be for naught (Caldari and Amarr) 2) you'll never turn a profit due to FW not paying out So in the end, we are still restricted to pubs. i told you bums, you'd be licking my boots come dec 10th (1.7 deployment date) , now with your 0% district owership, all you wanna do is cry how broken it is. It's idiots like you that makes me want to beat you to death...CCP has stated that FW is not want they want it to be and admits it's flawed. Buy hey, congrats, you're kicking ass in a flawed system when the three of us even separate are better at this game than you can dream to be. Dumbass. got your skirt all ruffled up kid, dont get so mad about the ass kickings were handing you scrubs Don't you wish you had a battle skirt. Dat **** is legit. Either way I am hoping that CCP will take into account both the issues highlighted by Aero last FW iteration in regards to how battles are generated E.G- a sliding scale of offensive to defensive contract ratios depending on factional system ownership. And this iterations issues with poor LP pay outs, squad selection for OB drops, and the more general issues of factional equality in terms of representation with regards to the mind set of the "idiot" consoler FPS playerbase. To a Texan like you, a hero is some type of weird sandwich, not some nut who takes on three Gunlogi. Reference = ISK


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