u do realise the other side pertains to that as well right?
oh u won the district and 2 secs later changed it to aus tz now we never have a crack at it again ....RL!!! damn, didnt see that one coming....
it works both ways, the reason ccp did this way is because if YOU attack YOU have shown that YOU can already make HIS TZ, its not certain he can make YOURS for a counter attack.

funny thing is u know in advance that the enemy could launch a counter attack and if u didnt plan for that counter then thats on u.

also never said the TZ thing would make it a snooze fest. the PEOPLE that play in PC will make it a snooze fest
nothing CCP implements can stop a Donut if the players want it no matter how enticing CCP makes attacking

as for splitting fights between EU and US thats more your concern since pretty much all the good EU corps are in ur alliance.

US is more split and will still has enough EU presence on the US heavy sides to attack EU. U winning a fight and auto switching the timer means there is no other big name EU corp to even challenge u whereas US has to worry about other US and ur guys cuz u guys do make fights on both US and EU TZs

the ONLY ppl that can complain about timers is the AUS TZ guys imo

My Corp has people based all over the world with pretty variable timezones, but I have friends in Aus/NZ timezone Corps (I'm NZ-based myself). This WILL screw Aus over even more than they already are by the downtime and post-downtime locked hour.

Lets just ignore all that for now, though.

Lets pretend there are US and EU Corps with US and EU timezone RTs. Now lets imagine that one of the US Corps wants to invade a district held by one of the EU Corps because it's the last district in the way of them having complete control of their own planet.

They plan, and arrange for 3 days where they can field a solid team. That's all they're going to be able to spare, but they're sure it'll be ok because they can win the battle maybe on the first day with a bit of luck, and definitely on the second, giving them a day of turnaround to secure the district properly. More than half the Corp will be at work on that 4th day though, so they NEED to have it stable by then.

So they attack, and sure enough, they win on the first day.

The defeated Corp, who have support from EVE, know their attackers are crossing timezones, and know they just need to press the attack for a few days to reclaim "their" district, because until they ease off, the defenders can't reset their RT to a suitable time. They ask for a billion ISK loan from EVE-side, and repay the majority of it 3 days later when the defenders can't field anyone to defend, because the game is rigged to make cross-timezone attacks impractical.

Now, when you consider the viability of such an obviously out-of-universe "strategy", it makes it clear that the Aus/NZ local Corps will be locked into a district or two with no ability to expand and minimal ability to even hold onto their own territory and keep the RTs in a comfortable range.

Something NEEDS to be done for this to be sustainable as a worldwide playing field.

My Corp has people based all over the world with pretty variable timezones, but I have friends in Aus/NZ timezone Corps (I'm NZ-based myself). This WILL screw Aus over even more than they already are by the downtime and post-downtime locked hour.

Lets just ignore all that for now, though.

Lets pretend there are US and EU Corps with US and EU timezone RTs. Now lets imagine that one of the US Corps wants to invade a district held by one of the EU Corps because it's the last district in the way of them having complete control of their own planet.

They plan, and arrange for 3 days where they can field a solid team. That's all they're going to be able to spare, but they're sure it'll be ok because they can win the battle maybe on the first day with a bit of luck, and definitely on the second, giving them a day of turnaround to secure the district properly. More than half the Corp will be at work on that 4th day though, so they NEED to have it stable by then.

So they attack, and sure enough, they win on the first day.

The defeated Corp, who have support from EVE, know their attackers are crossing timezones, and know they just need to press the attack for a few days to reclaim "their" district, because until they ease off, the defenders can't reset their RT to a suitable time. They ask for a billion ISK loak from EVE-side, and repay the majority of it 3 days later when the defenders can't field anyone to defend, because the game is rigged to make cross-timezone attacks impractical.

Now, when you consider the viability of such an obviously out-of-universe "strategy", it makes it clear that the Aus/NZ local Corps will be locked into a district or two with no ability to expand and minimal ability to even hold onto their own territory and keep the RTs in a comfortable range.

Something NEEDS to be done for this to be sustainable as a worldwide playing field.

as for splitting fights between EU and US thats more your concern since pretty much all the good EU corps are in ur alliance.

US is more split and will still has enough EU presence on the US heavy sides to attack EU. U winning a fight and auto switching the timer means there is no other big name EU corp to even challenge u whereas US has to worry about other US and ur guys cuz u guys do make fights on both US and EU TZs

take the couple days off from work

Orion, hook your Boss into EVE/DUST then you can both defend your district Or just take the couple days off from work... MMOG have a strange side-effect. It seems the game world is completely detached from RL. But occupying it players' consciousnesses and bodies containing them are not detached from RL. You can't make a perfect MMOG because of this. Somebody will always said that something is rigged or unfair due to TZ.

BTW: wanted to ask if EVE Planetary Interactions can be performed on planets involved in DUST Planetary Conquest? Will this parts of New Eden influence each other? When? How? How much ISK?

Thanx

Yeah right. i hope it's a joke.

"Hmm honey, you know about that WE we planned ? Yeah ? well not gonna be possible, i have to use 3 of my vacation days for this year so i can secure a district on my PS3 game with my friends cause we couldnt change the RT after conquering it this WE during which i got to bed at 6 am and woke you up with my cold feets"

** Wife slaps door **

Few days later

"Yeah guys we did it ! totally worth 3 days off and staying up till 6 am to defend that district !!"

**Wife is woke up by cheering**

Week later

** opens mail, finds note and divorce paper **

Decide then WHAT is more important to you then... Sorry, but in this world you can't eat cake and still have it uneaten
When people get involved into MMOG they really are commiting their RL to it. It cease to be separated...

(...)
Well, first off, congratulations on your lack of anything resembling human interaction.
(...)

(...)
Maybe you have the freedom to abandon the real world for gaming without notice,
(...)

(...)
but it's not rational to build a game which requires that from its players.
(...)

Orion, I would like to remind you that DUST is about killing (eating cakes part) not comforting other peoples (having cake uneaten part). This is really bad example of "human interaction"... Why you play DUST?

(...)
Secondly, when you win an attack on the enemy's terms, you shouldn't be forced to defend under the terms which still give your opponents an advantage. Maybe you have the freedom to abandon the real world for gaming without notice, but it's not rational to build a game which requires that from its players.

If you win, you won, and you now own that district. You should be able to set the terms on which you defend, just like your enemy did when it was theirs. If you can move outside your timezone to attack, they should be able to do the same.

(...)
Does the search function guarantee that you'll find a planet that fits all your intended criteria?

I think the opportunity to counter attack might be the only 'fair' thing about this.....game. Oh wait, no its not...or is it?(...)

Even if it's reasonable to expect a Corp to set aside several days to capture, defend and secure a district before they can reset the RT and really call it their own, it's even more reasonable to expect a Corp who were defeated on their own terms to have to match their opponents' timezone if they want to reclaim the lost territory.

If you're pushing outside your comfort zone to invade, then you DESERVE to do the same to the people who lost the fight.

I think the opportunity to counter attack might be the only 'fair' thing about this.....game. Oh wait, no its not...or is it?

Setting the timer immediately upon capture might be relevant to the upstart corp that wants to take a snapshot of their one territory before it gets ripped from their hands while being shoved off the boat.

Lets be realistic in real life. Timer or no timer, only the handful of 'kaiju' corps will ever redraw any borders. Out of those, the ones with the 'kaiju' EVE alliances on their side will have the lions share of the dots. Just like EVE.

Since this is the nether realm, let's try something unlike real life. Lets try a true free-market economy where everyone can compete for some share of the market. The upstarts share is of course going to be smaller and less valuable at first, and yes, they may be ran out of the market from time to time by competitors. But with proper regulation there could be a level playing field where as the aspiring entrepreneur could realistically gain a significant share of the market meanwhile opening the market to another optimistic corporation.

Dang it! I'm wasting my time talking about timers and such because I'm one of the 99%ers that is never intended to own my own business nor create any wealth in the current system.

Decide then WHAT is more important to you then... Sorry, but in this world you can't eat cake and still have it uneaten
When people get involved into MMOG they really are commiting their RL to it. It cease to be separated...

"if you can't reach it you should not have it"

Okay. Most people are unhappy with the way how the District-losing Corp (L) would be able to use their own favorable RT day after day after day against the Winning Corp (W).

The newly captured district being locked from any actions of it's own is a good thing. It would be a pity to give up that just because of abovementioned reason.


Background:
It is clear and intended way that capturing a district is going to take multiple days (barring cases of opportunity when sniping weak districts).
Multiple fights on RT of (L)'s choosing before (W) takes a district.



[SUGGESTION A:]
Keep the newly captured district in the state of 'Under attack' still 24h AFTER being captured. Or create a new state 'Captured'.

That would mean that captured district couldn't act in the first day (good) but it couldn't be attacked before it's next RT is gone. After which (W) directors could change RT if they have faster fingers. Note: they would have to choose whether to transfer in more clones or change the RT - a choice which is always a good thing.




[SUGGESTION B:]
Let district go onto an unlocked state after victorious battle EXCEPT right after being captured. That way after one won defence, it's possible to change RT. Earn the change.

After capture, one more battle to win on old timer. Just one.

note: this does have implications during initial attack - defender could play RT games

SUGGESTION C

Put a hackable structure on the district battle, which upon hacking would let change RT while battle is still waged. A RT computer? . Hacking would be optional and would not influence battle result. Only it's aftereffects. It could be marked as objective RT and put inside some Comand Center kind of building. It would give fair chance for tackling TZ differencess for attackers and defenders...

Any takers?

SUGGESTION C

Put a hackable structure on the district battle, which upon hacking would let change RT while battle is still waged. A RT computer? . Hacking would be optional and would not influence battle result. Only it's aftereffects. It could be marked as objective RT and put inside some Comand Center kind of building. It would give fair chance for tackling TZ differencess for attackers and defenders...

Any takers?

Here's what i suggest. Kinda goes in your direction by the way kero.

New "captured Hour" or "flipped Hour" state
=> Works kinda like the attacker "Dibs Hour". Giving the owner one hour to do one of the following things :
- Change RT. Nothing else to add. District is locked right after.
- New action : "Loot District" only available when flipping an owned district : takes all the remaining attack clones and "loots" the entire coming clone production. Then allows you to either sell the whole thing or move them back to a friendly district only. Would incentive corps raiding district for extra cash\clones and annoy the enemy. District is then left unclaimed and can be captured. (ISK wise, it would be a 6.4M or 8M ISK loot depending on the nature of the district)

That's it. Two options answering two reason that would push a corp to attack a district in the first place : owning it (and thus defending it on its terms) or out of financial\material interest

Again, how realistic is it that an upstart with nothing can enter and compete in a market where the competition has the resources to subcontract the upstart?

SUGGESTION C

Put a hackable structure on the district battle, which upon hacking would let change RT while battle is still waged. A RT computer? . Hacking would be optional and would not influence battle result. Only it's aftereffects. It could be marked as objective RT and put inside some Comand Center kind of building. It would give fair chance for tackling TZ differencess for attackers and defenders...

Any takers?

You're assuming the "upstart" small Corps need to have an equal say in the matter.

This is New Eden.

We need to feel like we have an impact, but we don't need to go toe-to-toe against the bigger Corps and WIN. If we can break a supply chain, and our actions help another Corp to deliver a real blow, we made a difference.

A small Corp may not be sufficient to take and hold a District. But if we're good, we can break a crucial supply line, capture (and abandon) or cripple the district they were relying on for reinforcements, and pave the way for our employer to take and hold. If we can't own the map - and most of us can't - at least give us the tools to help SHAPE it.