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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
8
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Posted - 2013.04.07 01:22:00 -
[1] - Quote
IDEA
What if there were certain planet and district criteria that a corporation had to meet before they could attack, conquer, build on, and profit from? Lets say for example: Every planet has a level or rating say 1-5 that only corps of a certain size (corp, megacorp, and transtellar empire) could occupy, attack, or profit from. Lets say that planets that are a 1 make the least clones/profit and are minimally upgradeable. Then a 5 planet is of course the most profitable and upgradeable, etc.
Now lets say a corp can only start on a 1 planet, a megacorp can only start on a 2 or 3, and an empire can only start on a 4 or 5. Lets say a corp can conquer a district on a 2 planet but cannot attack a district on a 3 planet. A megacorp can attack but NOT CONQUER a district on a 1 planet with HIGH RISK and LOW REWARD. Megacorp can conquer a district on a 4 planet but cannot attack a 5 planet. Empire can attack but not conquer a 3 planet at high risk vs. reward.
What about growth? Lets say corp becomes megacorp. New megacorp holds x districts on lvl 1 planets and y districts on lvl 2 planets. Upon becoming megacorp x districts clone production cut by 50% and all structures/upgrades etc. are either sold or go into an inventory. Lets say these could only be used to upgrade a district on a 2 planet, and so on for transition from mega to empire. ***There would also need to be a threshold on how many districts a corp or megacorp could hold at planet levels 2 and 4 before 'capital gains penalty' would kick in.
I'm thinking of how to get people involved and keep them involved. I'm not thinking about how to dominate the universe, level up, and make money here. I like the idea of still being able to subcontract mercs to and from any level. I think that subbing out work to high level corps should and would have to come at a high cost. There is so much potential in this PC business that it makes me sick to think that its designed so that only BCS schools have a chance to truly participate for any kind of belt.
Sadly it looks to be headed in the opposite direction of ^. FW will not be enough to carry the newer players and corps. A big reason is that corporations are made up of several factions. How do you choose to fight for if you could even choose? FW is decided entirely in space....all Dusties get is some better pay and some fiction that 90% will be clueless about?
Right now the only attractive thing about DUST to EVE seems to be the ability to bombard defenseless ground forces from outer space. (killing defenseless spawns seems to be the only appeal for DUST right now) With all going on in EVE, I don't see why those people would even bother unless they have done all there is to do and are searching for something to keep their interest, which, I am beginning to think is the whole point of DUST. It seems to me that if societies have the ability to, well, do all they can in EVE, then they would have some ground based defenses against spaceships, etc.
I hope anyone who says 'start recruiting' stubs their toe. Especially if they are not a CEO or Director that has/is committed a significant amount of time to operating their corp, but instead, are one of the followers who either only has time to be a condescending fanboy on the forum, or didn't have the intestinal fortitude to found and/or help build a corporation of their own.
Recruiting is already very difficult and it appears PC is going to render it impossible and moot. For starters, noobs to the game are not sticking around and likely won't in the future due to the basic aspects of the DUST 514 battle. I have discussed this here #5.
Before just defending everything that is in place or proposed, ask oneself...If I were a complete noob: 1. do I want to play this ever again? 2. do I want to be part of the larger picture and participate in PC? 3. what corporation should I join? 4. Is it worth while to found a corporation? 5. How can my corporation make its mark in PC?
With what's in place/proposed here is the answer key: 1. Judge by the number of current inactives or the # purged by your corporation. 2. Yes! Definitely! Wait, let me think. Idk. Maybe. 3. One with your friends. Preferably one with hundreds of members and X months head start over everyone else. Oh wait, your friends tried it and gave it up already. 4. Not at all if you want to get in on PC. 5. It won't unless you are one of the '12' corps in BCS conferences.
I agree with the fact that small corps won't be able to sustain. At 80 mil they won't even be able to put chips on the table much less own a casino. I understand that we don't want any fly-by-night corp to throw down a minimal risk just to be a thorn in another corps side. I don't think the 80 mil pricetag is the real issue. The REAL issue is whether or not CCP is willing to listen to the new people and gain more new people, or listen to the FEW that makes the current base and gain few in the future.
Some of you people really need to get over yourselves. What is that one defends so vehemently? The right to glitch and make oneself feel better? The desire to have only a few thousand playing the game? Then several want to throw in a shot at CoD, Battlefield, Halo, or another SUCCESSFUL franchise in defense of this BETA. (beta in every sense of the term) Those are likely the people who feel some sense of accomplishment when they kill a defenseless spawn in DUST, but yet they probably can't hack it in the Big Leagues.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
9
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Posted - 2013.04.07 02:00:00 -
[2] - Quote
 Will the subcontracts be something that the contractor can control? How much control? Will the contractor be able to set a price on a certain district and random mercs can participate? Will contractor be able to extend subcontracts to certain invitation only corporations? Multiple corporations?
Any further information is appreciated. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
9
|
Posted - 2013.04.07 02:17:00 -
[3] - Quote
Fannomos wrote:Well the funny thing is people think the big corps are the only players but what's big? You need only 16 people, to run this and for example TeamPlayers (ranked top 50 therefore a contender in my opinion) has less than 100 people but so many of their players are top 100 on leaderboards for kills. I'm guessing they play enough to defend everyday with the exact same people and probably trust each other enough to donate accordingly. I think the 80million ISK is only sad to us because we're not selfless enough to pull together. Even a corp with over 500 players should only own a few districts max, so that the tax per player wouldn't be overboard but then corp members could then all take turns defending and on occasion use your starting line up of MVPs to defend just to keep the clones from going below a number that your regeneration can't get you back from. 
My thing is, large corps will have enough to attack/defend multiple districts. Also having the most money and making the most profit at the same time. How many can that group of 50 attack/defend at one time? 24 hrs or not they will quickly become exhausted by an empire corp that is attacking multiple districts at different time slots. That's another thing.....people keep acting as is they don't want it to be MMO but instead a little sandbox on a big playground. 'Oh well, we got here first nanny nanny booboo.'
If only 16 is what it takes, why have the ability to have 1500?
If everyone will just come out and say: We don't want participation in the game to grow to its maximum potential. We don't want a game where we can't farm spawn kills. We don't want it to be fun for everybody. We don't want the PC region(s) to be ever-growing and constantly changing hands. We just want some EVE folks to give this part a chance before they give up their subscriptions. We don't really intend to make a top-notch FPS.
:Then we can all quit wasting each other's time.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
9
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Posted - 2013.04.08 11:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
DJINN Kujo wrote:OK for all the small corps that are claiming such a hard idea to take part into Planetary Conquest, I am actually with CCP on their new ideas. All the smaller corps that are out there we can assume are playing this game for the short term and to play it just as a FPS and not a game that's implemented with a Massive RPG Online via EVE Online.
In other terms; I know there's lots of players that have hibernated to DUST from Call of Duty, Battlefield or even Halo; just to name a few. That's great, their use to having some spectrum of gun game somewhere buried in their minds that they get to unleash on this game.
I don't mean offense to smaller corps, but I have already been seeing smaller corps merging with bigger corporations already to get ready for Planetary Conquest.... just throwing that up in the air for whomever is willing to catch it and obtain that knowledge.
Throughout the Closed Beta to even the Open Beta, we have seen corps come and go with still a few corps from Closed Beta rocking out everything they have against one another to take that #1 spot in Dust. Corps will remain to come and go as friendships are made and enemies are made in retrospect. It's the game we envelop ourselves into, take it for what it is, or don't judge it to begin with without previous knowledge on why everything works the way it does.
Hope this is helpful to a lot of people
I think you meant immigrated to DUST. Once arriving at DUST is where the hibernation begins.
I understand that nobody really knows what's coming on the 6th. I also understand that this game is an extension/integration of EVE. I understand that there is a decade's worth of fiction and ever-changing demographics that the new people are not going have knowledge of at first. I think I can speak for most of the people new to it when I say it is not a matter of NOT understanding the complexities of EVE and how integration might work. The concepts of EVE are no excuse for a public match that sucks. The concepts of EVE are no excuse for spawning dead at the possible cost of REAL MONEY. The concepts of EVE are no excuse for shooting through mountains.
I honestly don't see how the post is supposed to helpful to people unless that's just the long version of what I said about sandboxes earlier. If the little guy with the DUST corp is only meant to be contracted by the big guy with the EVE corp, why even give the little guy the option to create a corp? Does anyone really expect someone to play for seven years before they ever get to experience the "concepts of EVE"?
Then, after all of ones time spent, divorce, weight gain, and effort, his corp still doesn't have a snowball's chance of having any real success. For they have not been in PC X amount of time raking in Y amount of profit from Z amount of districts. NOW ITS JUST TARGET TRYING TO COMPETE WITH WALMART. Target might have the initial startup capital, a warehouse full of goods, and an excellent location, but Wally World has warehouses nation wide, Unlimited resources, and will be moving a supercenter AND neighborhood market right across the street in a day or two.
Again, we can go back to recruiting. Why on earth does a noob want to join with anybody that's not kicking butt in PC? They don't unless they have the ********* to try and build a corp from the ground up. That appears to be a lost cause because nobody want to join one that's not in PC. Chicken or the egg? And again, why even have the option to create one if it is not intended for HUNDREDS or THOUSANDS to be competing (realistically) for territories? Seems to me that if only the transstellar empires are supposed to participate and have any real chance, everyone should have been forced to stay in their default corps. Oh wait, that would have screwed the new people too.
The fact that public matches are complete garbage also will play into recruiting. Out of every 100 people who download it, then play 10 battles, how many do you think are going to want to dedicate ANY kind of time to a game that had ONE relatively balanced outcome. How many people is everybody counting on to think that spawn camping is fun, or that being held for 30 minutes inside of the redline is fun? Is that one of the great concepts of EVE? I don't think so.
Its just sounding more and more like what I feared early on and this just reaffirms it. People are supposed to accept it as an integrated FPS. Okay, it doesn't make the cut as FPS and it appears that the RPG integration part makes one no more than a lackey even if they are a CEO. I will see what the build has to offer before I form a full opinion on the integration.
I completely understand that people envelop themselves into the fiction and other aspects of EVE. Nobody has anything against that. Heck, I spent who knows how long writing up a history for my corp. Did a lot of research and tried to make it fit best I could while still having some originality. I thought this might help recruit some of those with more knowledge of it than I have. That's not going to help with whats on the table.
I think that 99% of us can accept the fact that we are 10 years late on showing up at EVE kindergarten. But, when you say accept it for what it is, then we all have to accept doodoo. Because that's what is here at this point is doodoo. If that's intention behind the design, to make a game just for the hardore EVE people; where spawncamping, ridiculous blowouts, and falling asleep during a gunfight is apparently the standard, then just somebody say it. Don't urinate down everyone's back and tell them it's raining.
We'll see. Just sure sounds to like the ones who have it all don't want play with the cool kids. I would just hate to see it stagnate and not gain any real support when there were measures that could have been taken to make it MORE successful. It would be nice to here a dev tell us flat out "Don't get ur hopes up" |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
10
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 11:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
Also, if it was always going to be necessary to merge with another corp to get in on PC, why have the option to create one? Why does one want to put in all of the effort and time just to have to be a subsidiary? People keep throwing the whole merger thing around like EVERYBODY should have known! Well, people didn't know because they weren't expecting it to be an exclusive country club. People were probably under the impression that it would be on a comparable scale to what is happening in EVE as far as the territorial aspect goes.
Its whatever. It just amazes me that there are those that are quick to tell you to 'start recruiting' and 'merging happening' when, like what was pointed out, nobody knows what the build holds.
I guess my bottom line is the basic, the start it up and lets me play vs. you isn't good enough to keep many around for any period of time. If the estimate was always that the smaller corps (ALL THE ONES STARTING OUT) would not be around for anything but the short term, again, why not keep everyone in their default corps? That logic just says to me that they wanted to slap together a turd because the EVE people will get involved no matter what kind of garbage it is. Just because its associated with EVE.
If you are a noob and you play your first 20 games and 18 of them were lame as duck, are you going to want to go out and learn more about EVE? I said it in another thread but FPS people are very unforgiving. They typically turn their backs on companies that release a garbage shooter. They are skeptical of companies bringing in new development teams.
Now, if we all just have to accept it for what it is...then why have a beta and ask for feedback? Why when someone offers some feedback or criticism do the bandwagoners have to jump to CCP's defense? Why are people so hellbent on this game not being all that it could be?
If it is just designed to envelop the EVE people and not really provide any real rewarding experience to the DUST folks, then we have been duped. And, it offends PS3 owners. The kind of saps ya'll were looking for are on Xbox. That's another thing that makes me curious. Why not Xbox? Ohhhhh yeah. Free 2 play. Looks like free PSN to be sullied with F2P garbage.
I don't mean to offend anyone either man. It's extremely aggravating because I like the idea, but it just needs some serious tuning, At the heart of it all, when you put a loaded firearm into a gamers hand, its a shooter. This needs to have a whole lot of management and customization and bells and whistles. Because as a shooter, its not that great. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
10
|
Posted - 2013.04.08 14:23:00 -
[6] - Quote
Well, I didn't mean to give anybody the impression that I was in a five man corp. I also didn't mean to give anybody the impression that I wasn't recruiting diligently. Since we gonna toot our own horns: I started mine with myself. Took me almost a week to get 1 other guy to join me. A week later I think we had 5. 6 weeks later, now we have right under 50. That's having purged several due to inactivity and lost a handful to bigger corps and maybe 2 that founded their own. Have probably had 30 come and go for whatever reason.
I really don't think the 80 mil buy in is a big deal. Yeah, its a stretch for a lot of folks but I don't think our group would have a problem raising it in any amount of time. Its a big risk and it should be. Where the whole thing falls flat and really disappoints is in the long term economics of it. A corp goes in, gets it handed to them, then they go reorganize and try again. Sounds great! Well its NEVER going to be able to happen that way. Lets say it does. Lets say that this corp is the baddest bunch of sobs playing the game but they only have about 50 online at any given time. At what point can those guys really hang with the corp with twice the numbers, who has held numerous districts for some time now, and has virtually unlimited resources? How especially do they hold onto their few districts if they have differing time slots?
Lets present a hypothetical question: After PC under the current structure is around for a while. Will it be possible for a corp to break in to PC, gain and sustain a few territories then, gain and sustain a few more, and a few more until THAT corporation has one of the largest 1-2-3 areas on the map?
If one can answer yes, then cool. But the answer is No, not possible, or the odds are slim to none. So then I'm back at what's the point? Now, that's really far fetched all issues with this game aside, but, its nice to aspire.With the way the economics looks to shape things, the max members in a corp should be about 500 which would only triple the number of corps with the ability to really compete on the ground. That's my rough guestimations, I wasn't a math major.
If or when there is another region added, the handful of corps that own all of the districts in this first region are going to march right in and easily conquer 90-99% of the new region. I will give some hope to a few corps that will be able to hang at that point. I also realize that the build may change several things and that more EVE people may become interested in this aspect of it all IF it is successful AND there is some real benefit to going out of their way.
I don't know if there is any way to crunch the numbers from PC profits and the little guys OR, what maybe I should say, the newly organized guys have a realistic chance of huge success. That's why I think if there were a planet level and certain criteria it took to occupy them on the ground then several more can participate and actually gain. This would also make the young corps and small corps more relevant to EVE corps....I think.
Really though think about it, if the small corps all started where they could only conquer one another on the lowest level planets, then they would be wiping each other out while gaining some assets/profit, and generally moving up toward the ones in the middle. Its kind of how the "free" market is supposed to be regulated. If its really about competition, make it so everyone has an opportunity to be competitive.
Everyone will not have the opportunity to be competitive if Mom and Pop are supposed to come in and open up in between two Walmarts. They wont get the people, 1. pub match/basic game wont carry it, 2. Walmart is the largest employer on the planet next to the governments of the worlds largest nations. (US and China basically) People typically regard those involved with these governments and their programs as socialists. Well, we all don't like that stuff, but the whole trickle down from the wealthiest monopolies theory has FAILED time and time again.
I don't know how one can rationalize saying to get up get out, work harder, hit the pavement, make it happen, it ones own reponsibilty, etc. etc. insinuating that the people who are not happy about PC being designed for the elite and huge few are just not working hard enough. This while saying some will have to swallow their pride and just merge. Now there is some REAL crazy logic.
Nothing at all against them taking measures to prevent a massive buyout on day one. There just needs to be an incentive for people to keep playing first off. Building a corp and participating in PC, sovereignty and pride are the ONLY incentives that many people have had to play it. This doesn't look like its going to do much to draw people in. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
10
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 00:18:00 -
[7] - Quote
Wow. A large portion of the conversation that was here this morning is just gone. How neat. There it is in a nutshell. The great defense of all defenders and defenses; the ole delete peoples posts entirely tactic. I could understand if the discussion taking place was off-topic or becoming too intense and personal between people. However, its just a case of abusing power too control information. Its a good thing that the EVE base loves you all so much because CCP isn't doing itself any favors if they're trying to win over any new people.
Anyway I think I made my point about all of this. The fact that a good portion of the conversation and my last rebuttal have been removed just validates my view on it all. The fact that people were starting to agree and see my arguement's side, and making really good points from both sides got it shut down I guess.
Well, for those who didn't get to see, we established that it is a FACT that the current PC system will leave virtually NO CHANCE for a new corp or a smaller corp, or even a mid-level corp to break into PC and actually make a mark. I think we also established that it is pointless to found a corp if you want in on PC and that all the recruiting in the world will not matter because all of the noobs who are actually willing to stick with a game that isn't that good, will all gravitate toward the corps in PC.
I guess that information like that gets your conversation shut down. Oh, not shut down, but removed altogether. Its ok. It is quite apparent that conflict is not looked at in a good light. I guess we all should have known seeing as how the game offers little REAL conflict, but a whole lot of glitching and spawn camping. Again, how neat.
Rather than waste time trying to articulate a VALID point, I guess I'll just join in with those that think CCP can do no wrong. So, here goes: Wallah wallah, wallah wallah, smack, slurp. Wallah wallah, smack, smack, smack, slurp slurp. 'I think you guys are right on the money with this one. Yeah, nobody wants it to be about anybody but us. Lets make it so people either have to be subservient to our established group, or they have to play public matches that are no fun.' Wallah wallah wallah....... |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
10
|
Posted - 2013.04.09 22:01:00 -
[8] - Quote
I think a lot of people are overlooking the issue that PC will be at the base of....Gaining new players and keeping the current noobs. What the game offers in skirmish and ambush (IB and FW) will not be able to do these things if the glitches aren't fixed, the spawning isn't tweaked, and the MCCs dump people into the line of fire. WHEN the blowout or redline happens, people need to feel that the fight isn't over and that their actions will have some effect of the outcome whether it be turning the tides and winning, or just putting a dent in the clone count.
Right off the bat, the basic fight is flawed. This is going to be the same structure for PC and FW? Right there we lose a bunch. The noob just played how ever many matches, got kicked around for however many minutes, and got lucky enough to be on the winning side how ever many times. Either way, do they leave feeling like they affected anything? Right there goes a bunch more.
So, the noob shows some heart. They like the game and want to try and get better, level up, and focus some skills training. They get some bigger and better weapon, suits, and shields so now they consistently around a 1.0 kdr, wlr, and feel like they are having an effect on the battlefield. Now the rookie not making as much money so levels up some more for the bigger and better stuff. Now the rookie is fighting with a majority of meta level 3 gear and is still the 1.0 merc, but now they are not making ANY money but just breaking even after restocking. So now they have to fight with free gear and go back to getting kicked like a dog just to be profitable? There goes a bunch more.
Now, the aspiring merc decides that FW and PC, and maybe the management aspects of corporations will make it all worth his while. The merc builds on their skills, is actively online, and diligently strives to help build his corporation. The corporation is able to field a team or two and believes they are ready to get involved. The startup is exorbitant and members are having to fight with free gear to save money? ^^^^^^^^
So, aspiring merc and his corp buy in, gain a district and then turn around and lose the district due to the fact that the group that held the district or another group nearby had a significant economic and numerical advantage. An insurmountable advantage resulting from the profits of being involved in PC first? An insurmountable recruiting advantage resulting from being involved in PC first? Right there goes a bunch.
So aspiring mercs decide that they need to cut their teeth and reap the benefits of FW for a while. Mercs are of different races so their corp must choose 1 faction over the other? Mercs can fight for any faction whenever they want? Mercs never see any significant change on the FW map? There goes a bunch if not what's left.
The systems design will prevent small guys or new guys from growing therefore prevent them from being able to ever realistically compete in PC. People can say whatever they want along the lines of 'its one's own responsibility', 'start recruiting', etc. The ones with only 10 or 20 KNOW that they aren't ready for it or capable so everyone can drop that rationalization.
First and foremost the glitches and spawn camps need to be addressed and the pub matches need some alternative game modes, AND a way for the noobs to compete amongst themselves. This would get people to give it a chance again or give it longer initially.
I would like to see a way for the scrubs to fight for scrub turf in PC. I had an off the top of my head idea in post #256. There should be a way for all who aspire to get involved and stay involved. I like the subcontracting idea but at the end of the day that's not going to get any corp over the hump and into PC. How realistic is it that a sub corp will become strong enough to enter a market where all the big corps can afford to sub corps like the sub corp?
I think that if certain criteria were in place to own, attack, conquer, profit, and upgrade then a lot more people would want to AND have the ability to get involved. I think it would also help the strictly DUST people to get integrated with more EVE people too. I don't see the basis for the defense of a system that doesn't allow people in. Whatever the system is the upstarts and the small guys are likely never going to kick around the BCS guys with the most powerful EVE affiliations.
So I don't know what all the 'kaiju' folks would be worried about. I don't see what bragging right there really are for the few that will surely dominate the PC spectrum of DUST when the system's design will keep any real competition and growth from happening. The people who can get in on it at the very beginning will be the only people relevant to the whole thing. Their corps will have been involved and will have unlimited resources to expand their territory if/when there is a new region added.
Let's say people are actually willing to play for 10 years just to get in on PC. We right back at square one. What's the point? Ok neat we got a little spot that we held for 24 hrs until the guys took it right back or the vulture swooped in and stole the kill. If the management aspects of the game are only reserved for PC then creating a corp will be a FAIL if you can't get involved and have the opportunity to manage EVEN a low-level district(s).
If its only meant for the few, why offer it to all? If its only meant for EVE loyalists, why put it out on PS3? If its only going to be a handful that can get involved and sustain, why not keep everyone in their default NPC corps? If it is going to take a huge investment of time and ISK to participate, then why only 1.5 mil to found a corp? If we are actually meant to have 1500 members, then why is the system designed so that NO ONE will want to join a group that doesn't already have half that?
I will see like everyone else. But, I fear that when this PC business released, its over with for a lot of folks.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
11
|
Posted - 2013.04.10 12:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
I think the opportunity to counter attack might be the only 'fair' thing about this.....game. Oh wait, no its not...or is it?
Setting the timer immediately upon capture might be relevant to the upstart corp that wants to take a snapshot of their one territory before it gets ripped from their hands while being shoved off the boat.
Lets be realistic in real life. Timer or no timer, only the handful of 'kaiju' corps will ever redraw any borders. Out of those, the ones with the 'kaiju' EVE alliances on their side will have the lions share of the dots. Just like EVE.
Since this is the nether realm, let's try something unlike real life. Lets try a true free-market economy where everyone can compete for some share of the market. The upstarts share is of course going to be smaller and less valuable at first, and yes, they may be ran out of the market from time to time by competitors. But with proper regulation there could be a level playing field where as the aspiring entrepreneur could realistically gain a significant share of the market meanwhile opening the market to another optimistic corporation.
Dang it! I'm wasting my time talking about timers and such because I'm one of the 99%ers that is never intended to own my own business nor create any wealth in the current system. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
11
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 00:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Robert JD Niewiadomski wrote:SUGGESTION C
Put a hackable structure on the district battle, which upon hacking would let change RT while battle is still waged. A RT computer? . Hacking would be optional and would not influence battle result. Only it's aftereffects. It could be marked as objective RT and put inside some Comand Center kind of building. It would give fair chance for tackling TZ differencess for attackers and defenders...
Any takers?
I think if it woill take a few days to capture a district then this would only be relevant in the deciding fight. Which, judging by the dynamics of the entire game and the imbalance within it, if you are a defender in a 'deciding fight' you are probably already beat. Also, does one really need to be playing with the timer while they should really be concerned with the primary task of winning the battle?
I think one cool thing that would come of this would be that IF there were a 'deciding' battle that were going down to the last HP or clone, there would be a fierce rush to either change the timer, OR defend/capture the null cannon objectives. But, that also makes the decision easy when one must win the battle to be able to change the timer regardless. So, in the end of it all, the one who was always going to win gets to change the timer either way.
I'll say it again, there are 90-95% of people who will never find out if the timer or any of it is even relevant to them. That estimation is based on the fact that around 50% of created characters are not playing for whatever reason.
AND again, how many new people are going to stick around when they find out that the ONLY part of the game that was interesting to them: 1. will require a commitment that people with 'RLs' or that enjoy other games will never be able to make? 2. will take months upon years to break into and realistically compete if they found or join a new corp? 3. will force them to join one of the FEW corps that they see on the PC starmap therefore just being a merc and having no management capabilities nor any possibility of advancement? 4. will force them to be just a merc in their smaller or new corp as they are just subcontractors that are required to have their own tools but not allowed to have an office, or even a company truck? 5.has an economic system in place that will never allow the break-in corp a realistic chance at sustaining?
Then we can go back to why the new corp or the corp not yet in PC will never be able recruit competitively. Then also, will lose members to the PC corps therefore keeping their numbers roughly the same or even lower. By the time there are more districts made available or any fixes to the basic fight, it will be too late. The PC aspect will already be dominated by the FEW and everyone with eyes and a starmap will be able to predict the future. So, if nothing else, put the member cap at 500 rather than 1500. That would in theory triple participation.
Now back to how the basic FPS multiplayer fight is not good enough alone to carry DUST noobs that are NOT FPS and PS3 noobs. Then, back to my question, if it is only intended for the EVE loyalists, why on earth have it on PS3?
It seems to me that the integration might have been easier over on Xbox since it is windows and Microsoft, etc. They'd have had a better chance of roping in sucker children too.
That's another thing and my final point in this latest installation of my critically acclaimed series of defying the establishment. The 10 year EVE vets need to remember that this is not a PC game (PC as in PC) it is a console game. So, please remember that most of the people who try this out are not only new to DUST but they are not likely to be hardcore PC gamers. With that being said, lets all start thinking of how to reel in more fish, rather than just feeding the ones already caught.
If what everyone wants is for the few that had their ear to the ground and got in on this thing at the earliest stages to be the only ones playing, then keep agreeing with and defending the system in place and proposed. If everyone wants this thing to take off and get so big that everyone knows about it, then we need to start thinking about the console gamer and the FPS enthusiast.
If they just want the EVE/PC gamers to have an avenue to kill defenseless spawns and defenseless mercs on the ground, then they should have just kept the whole thing on PC. If the management aspects of PC are only attainable by the FEW PC gamer people, then they should have had it on PC.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
11
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Posted - 2013.04.11 03:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
I think that if a subcontracted corp were able to split or get a cut the profits from 'looting' a district, then that would provide some incentive to join up with a new group or small group. I still don't think it's enough incentive to make a real difference in where the great majority flocks to the established 'Kaiju' and monsters already established in PC.
Again, how realistic is it that an upstart with nothing can enter and compete in a market where the competition has the resources to subcontract the upstart? I realize that there has to be some exclusion but, there also need to be inclusion. This would be possible if there were criteria in place that made certain planets/districts exclusively for those corps at certain levels. Then the upstarts could compete in the 'hometown' or 'regional' market while trying to go 'national' and then 'worldwide'.
If a small corp wanted to stay in the 'regional' market, that's fine. But remove the ability to just annoy a farnchise competing in the 'national' or 'worldwide markets'. In turn, remove the ability for a 'kaiju' or monster corp to profit from low-level planetary holdings and their ability to grief the upstarts. Those in the middle would be in the middle.
Of course, the small, medium, and large markets would have to come with their own respective levels of upgrades and profitability.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
11
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Posted - 2013.04.11 07:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
Orion Decline wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:Again, how realistic is it that an upstart with nothing can enter and compete in a market where the competition has the resources to subcontract the upstart? You're assuming the "upstart" small Corps need to have an equal say in the matter. This is New Eden. We need to feel like we have an impact, but we don't need to go toe-to-toe against the bigger Corps and WIN. If we can break a supply chain, and our actions help another Corp to deliver a real blow, we made a difference. A small Corp may not be sufficient to take and hold a District. But if we're good, we can break a crucial supply line, capture (and abandon) or cripple the district they were relying on for reinforcements, and pave the way for our employer to take and hold. If we can't own the map - and most of us can't - at least give us the tools to help SHAPE it.
Awesome! That will give the new people an incentive to join a smaller or newer corp! Should they run out and grab a subscription to EVE so that they can see how New Eden CAN be really neat?
Where did I ever assume that small guys or new guys should have an equal say? I am not assuming when I say they will NEVER have an equal shot. They will NEVER become 'big' and they will NEVER be able to keep people on board and they will NEVER NEVER NEVER.
What I was suggesting was a way that it could all still be intertwined WITHOUT the upstarts HAVING to go toe-to-toe with the big corps and vice versa.
Again, can't get the MORE PEOPLE PLAYING THE GAME point across to some people. That leads me to believe that those people are some how getting off on spawn camping and the other obvious flaws that the basic battle dynamic has.
If the idea of utter domination without competition sounds like fun, then maybe those folks should just beat their wives instead of playing a game.
If numbers are what is ultimately going to matter, then the system should be designed so that ALL aspiring corps can increase their numbers competitively. Anyone who can argue against that is one of the 'sandbox' people.
If the intention is to build another little sandbox and keep the masses that weren't in the old sanbox, that's not all that cool. If the kids in the sandbox don't want other kids to come play in the sandbox, then they probably shouldn't build their new sanbox at another school's playground.
Still even more, if this game winds up sucking after all, who really loses? Not the EVE people because they are loyal to that. Not the PS3 noob Dusty that has his repertories of better games. The people who get screwed are the PS3ers who tirelessly strived to build their kills and corporations only to never reap ANY REAL fruits of their labor due to a system skewed toward the FEW. And, CCP gets screwed because they get a bad reputation with the PS3 (console) crowd and hardcore FPS folks are so unforgiving that many of them will turn their backs on any product offered in the future. Even if that product were free money and attractive mates, the FPS bunch will be skeptical.
The ultimate losers will be those who insisted on having the system skewed in their favor. For it will be those people that remain so delusional as to think they are actually are actually having fun, playing alone in the new sandbox. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.11 22:01:00 -
[13] - Quote
Orion Decline wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:
[quote=Orion Decline][quote=Rigor Mordis]Again, how realistic is it that an upstart with nothing can enter and compete in a market where the competition has the resources to subcontract the upstart?
You're assuming the "upstart" small Corps need to have an equal say in the matter. We don't have enough unique players sharing the same timezone for a district to be practical without having reliable merc support. At least in the early days, we expect to see ourselves ONLY working as mercs, or being hired to perform disruption attacks, breaking someone's supply routes and forcing them to pay extra (potentially sacrificing clones to the vagaries of space travel) to reinforce a district that would have been easily held without our involvement. Maybe - MAYBE - we'll get some support, join an Alliance, or otherwise get our Corp into a situation where it's practical to hold one district. We're a tight-knit gaming clan that started outside of DUST, and has no inherent loyalty to the game. We plan to stay small - and not just within DUST, but in general, so being a major player in New Eden won't happen, although as part of an Alliance, we might have more impact than our own personal landholding. If DUST fails, we'll move on. If not, we'll have a stable group of players here for the long-haul. Maybe we'll always be mercs with no true home. Maybe we'll have a growing impact as time goes on. As PC and the related systems backing it are expanded, and move into NullSec (we're getting LowSec to start with), maybe there will be incentives to the larger Corps abandoning their LowSec territory when NullSec is introduced. Just like PC will reduce the pubstomping in instant battles, NullSec should reduce the blue donut effect in LowSec PC. And LowSec PC needs to be brutal and chaotic and I look forward to seeing DUST players shape more than just a single region of New Eden.
Delusions of granger make no argument for or against any talking point. Anybody who looks at the current system and doesn't ALREADY KNOW that if they are in a small corp that they will have to accept being ONLY mercs and not having any say is STUPID. I don't think anybody actually expected to bother with it who were planning to stay small. The thing is, how many people are founding corps with the intention to stay small? If you are wasting your SP, however minute, by founding a corp and staying small then that's one's own prerogative. But then don't get on here and say I'm 'assuming small corps need an equal say' when 1. didn't assume that in any way, and 2. you and your corp have no aspirations for growing.
AGAIN, new people won't get into it if the PC aspect doesn't offer a means to experience the management aspects of the game. AGAIN, the one's that do decide to stick around will undoubtedly flock right to the corps with some control in PC.
If you and your guys are such a tight-knit group from outside of DUST, have no inherent loyalty to the game, and do not aspire to grow, then why on earth are you guys even bothering with it. The fact that you used the term 'pubstomp' tells me that you are probably enjoying killing the defenseless and think that camping out at the redline is fun.
Again, I'm thinking about how to get more people playing in the first place. We in an alliance and our numbers steadily growing. (for now) So, I'm less concerned with how to keep getting cheap kills and more concerned with raising participation. I'm less concerned about personal glory and land ownership, but I am more concerned about collecting on the offer of found or help build a corp and have some sense of the RPG management aspects.
If you're going to quote me, come with some argument or concurrence. Don't quote me and then list all of the wonderful things that you are personally thinking and doing. I want the thing to get better, a lot better. IF you guys think its good the way it is, then your just here farming a cheap kdr.
I guess that's at the heart of it all. The ONLY things that could possibly keep anyone around or win over a new player are, the ability to score easy kills and blowout victories, and the managerial aspects of PC, etc. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 03:51:00 -
[14] - Quote
trollsroyce wrote:Upstart small corps need to be good enough or rich enough to earn foothold in PC as either mercenaries, part of an alliance or renters. This is the leveling up your corporation side of the RPG, deal with it.
If you want to be hand held into all parts of the endgame, find a shallow parallel universe. Do not ask this one to be nerfed.
Lastly, if you consist in your thinking that this game needs to cater to small and weak entities, the big ones will just split to bypass any limitations.
EDIT: I'm really sorry to be rude and I mean no disrespect. I want New Eden to stay harsh, because of it being just that makes it tenfold more intriguing than any game world ever created.
I'll say it again, I'm not worried about me and my group. We are growing our numbers and we are planning to have to tough it out as mercs for hire. We (I hope) are in it for the long haul. Our group isn't small, but its far from huge. It would be nice to eventually have 200 or 1000, but the system, and the flaws in the basic game, will prevent newbies from getting seriously involved or staying involved at all.
Now I'm going to be rude, deal with it.
Maybe if a say it in wuss, u could comprehend. If you are sorry to be rude, why say anything in the first place? Especially when not offering any rebuttal or elaboration, but just wallah wallah slurp slurp.
I was under the impression that this was a beta, for a project that they wanted to be successful on PS3. I thought they were asking for ways to improve DUST, not bottle-feed some babies. The only ones being handheld or nipple-fed, are the ones that benefit from a system that provides themselves the ability to dominate undisputedly while it denies any newly formed competition. If these are the fundamentals of your parallel universe, then your parallel universe is weak. You, in turn, are weak.
Don't bring that weak muled parallel universe idealism to other people's BIGGER parallel universe and ASK them to play with you, give their feedback, get involved and interested in the fiction, then just tell them to deal with the fact that it sucks in their opinion. If the corps will all eventually split ((doubtful because eventually participation in this game will likely be limited to only those faithful to EVE, willing to sacrifice playing a good game (EVE) to play a crappy game (DUST) in order to prosper on the good game)) then like I said, why not put the member max at 500 rather than 1500? That triples participation immediately.
Hypothetically, if a corp has 1500 online and ready to go simultaneously, then they could attack or defend 93 districts simultaneously. That's just a random example of the number of people being excluded when there are only 250 districts to start with. The buy in price is not the issue I am arguing with per se. Its the fact that ones getting into PC in this, THE FIRST BUILD OF DUST PC, will not only stranglehold the initial PC region, but any regions launched in the future.
And again, those same corps will be the only ones landing THE VERY FEW new recruits that can stand or actually like the game after their first 10-20 pub matches. Call me crazy, but I don't see what is so 'harsh' about a system designed only to benefit (be fun) and keep in positions of ultimate power, the largest groups of 'popular' kids.
If you are going to throw out gimp terms liked 'nerfed', maybe you should take a long look in the mirror and then at the world around you. What on earth have you been doing for the last ten years? In reality? This game and hopefully its success ARE CCPs reality. That's HOPEFULLY why they release an open beta on a DIFFERENT platform and ask for FEEDBACK and ideas.
Then I go back to if you are brand new to the whole thing, how great is EVE if DUST sucks? How great is CCP if you think DUST sucks and you are an avid, lifelong gamer on PC and console, and you never even heard of EVE or CCP before DUST was available for PS3 download?
If its being plugged as FPS RPG, don't tell people that they have to IMAGINE the RPG part for there are actual RPG games where you don't have to IMAGINE that your role is significant. The FPS part speaks for itself.....
If its just a supposed to be a weak muled way of spawn camping, redline griefing, glitching, that is buggy and designed ONLY to facilitate new interests in SPACE, then great. Coulda been a PC game that never asked for the opinions and interest of the console crowd.
If you're just hear to throw around effeminate terminology and to tell people to 'deal with things without offering any rebuttal or elaboration and rationale therefore, then your just here to be mule, or you are a gutless glitcher. If you like it the way its going to be then read the announcements and move on.
Meanwhile I'll take the opportunities to respond, and try to hammer home the same points that I, and several others believe are valid. If you think that warrants some snot-nosed response, then that's fine. If you notice, this discussion does not have 1500 people participating.....hmmmmmm. Any genius ideas as to why? |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 09:26:00 -
[15] - Quote
RE: #337
Apparently you don't comprehend either. Its the overall participation in the game period, not just your beloved PC that is going to suffer. I, and several others have thrown ideas out in the open not just in this thread but elsewhere. So, where on earth here AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN do you offer any ANYTHING at all to make the game better. That's right, you don't want it to be any better cuz ur just a suck tit on here.
My intitial idea, presented in #256 and my only question #258, were posted on here AFTER reading through the thread extensively. Now, I may miss a couple things here and there, but I do TRY to comprehend the material put forth. Its called listening with the intent to understand, rather than with the intent to reply. My posts #s 273, 276, 279, 300, 313, 324, 327, 330, 334 all explain my position in response to some one saying the same kind of bs you are saying, and in the same tone.
If everything's fine by you, that's your opinion. But here again, is a case of some pretentious fanboy chiming in on the opinions/feedback of others. I stated earlier that I would wait and see what the build has to offer like everyone else. Also stated that me and my group were prepared to accept being low level hookers I mean mercs. We have always been approaching it realistically so get over yourself.
The feedback people give on here was asked for, was it not? You seriously want to talk about spouting nonsense in the forum, rather than recruiting and extending diplomacy? When I just said, in the very post above yours, that we are growing our numbers and have made allies in both games. We have accepted it for what it is, we ARE willing to fulfill whatever role is needed by our allies and potential allies.
See, the difference is, you all are concerned with EVE being 'nerfed' or whatever. I completely understand and would feel the same way if I had invested that kind of time into an online RPG. What I don't think you understand, is the basic battle dynamic of DUST is the definition of nerf, or duplo, whatever, to the majority of shooter fans. Heck, there's passive SP! What's more novice than that? Hence, the RPG aspect will be the only thing carrying it if FW doesn't prove worth while, if alternatives for pub matches aren't offered, if there is to be no co-op vs, AI aspect.
I was never saying that it WOULD be possible to own all 250 districts, I never said that a 5man or 20 man corp SHOULD be able to go toe-to-toe with a corp of 500. What I am saying is at least humor people. At the very least. THIS TO GET MORE PEOPLE TO PLAY DUST. NEW PEOPLE. MORE PEOPLE. MORE IDEAS. REASONS WHY CERTAIN IDEAS WON"T WORK. See that nonsense? Is it plain enough English?
If people are just supposed to 'swallow their pride' and join up with the big guys, don't lead them to believe, that they need to lead their members and new recruits to believe, that their particular group has an opportunity. Because they don't have an opportunity and NEVER HAD an opportunity to begin with if they have to 'swallow their pride' and join another group in order to be involved. And at that point, how involved are they? That group of 67 that 'swallowed their pride'. Now at the lowest ranks in a group of 875.
He who possesses the ability to 'swallow' his pride, likely has very little to begin with.
I'm going to see what all the new build offers in and outside of PC and then maybe I will form a different outlook on future participation from new people. Until then I will continue advocate for the small corp even though my corp is SUPPOSEDLY about to become a 'megacorp'.
Now I think that I provided some constructive feedback throughout these failed attempts to make the blind see. I think most of the concerned have done the same. The only ones I see 'bitching' are the ones not providing constructive feedback, but instead 'bitching' about someone giving a rational opinion. An opinion btw, that is asked for not only in the first post of this thread, but upon the release of a beta.
NEW PEOPLE. MORE PEOPLE. DUST WANTS MORE PEOPLE. DUST NEEDS MORE PEOPLE. KEEP THE NEW PEOPLE.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
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Posted - 2013.04.13 10:48:00 -
[16] - Quote
velvetvonblack wrote:f the idea of utter domination without competition sounds like fun, then maybe those folks should just beat their wives instead of playing a game.(quote)
thanks ive done this. my wife hates you!
lol. sorry. I could have used a better analogy.
Does anyone know how the subcontracting will work? Any vague idea? Will subcontractor corps be able to bid on contracts? Or will the general contractor just offer a base incentive? Are neither of these anything close? |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 10:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
NIKIA BETHUNE wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:RE: #337
Apparently you don't comprehend either.
It's kinda a **** move but i'm not going to look for your answer to my question i feel if you could spend the 20-30mins to say all this you could answer the only thing i want to know. how to we make PC for new people? if it was never really intended for new people. that seems to be your main point i scanned of most of this so if i'm wrong correct me. how is a new person that start's out with what 500k sp suppose to do PC at any level? i don't get your point. you say it's not about small corps just what am i missing then.
#256 was what I threw out there. Took me about 5-10 min of thought to just throw that one out there. IDK if something like that is even feasible. It was just an idea I had to give the upstarts or small guys some incentive. And, some one might have to explain to me why something like that couldn't work as afr as the integration to EVE would pertain to it. Just a random brainstorm. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 11:15:00 -
[18] - Quote
NIKIA BETHUNE wrote: What's to stop it from getting worst? What I mean by that is I consider small based on the largest corps to be 1-100 members medium would be 101-300 large is 301-1000+ now just using this model how is it fair for the 1 man corps to face the 100 man corps? The 100man corps would farm that tier then to have the 100vs the 300 you get my point? So I don't understand how ur tier system would work I might miss understand what you meant. And what's to stop farming to happen with this? Like I said I not sure this is the system your suggesting its just what I understand u to mean. Now how is that going to be better? And how would what what happen if a corp had one too many member and moved to the next tier? Or a director kick enough members to take them the next bracket down I see too much room for error and no benefit but please clarify.
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
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Posted - 2013.04.13 11:26:00 -
[19] - Quote
NIKIA BETHUNE wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:NIKIA BETHUNE wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:RE: #337
Apparently you don't comprehend either.
It's kinda a **** move but i'm not going to look for your answer to my question i feel if you could spend the 20-30mins to say all this you could answer the only thing i want to know. how to we make PC for new people? if it was never really intended for new people. that seems to be your main point i scanned of most of this so if i'm wrong correct me. how is a new person that start's out with what 500k sp suppose to do PC at any level? i don't get your point. you say it's not about small corps just what am i missing then. #256 was what I threw out there. Took me about 5-10 min of thought to just throw that one out there. IDK if something like that is even feasible. It was just an idea I had to give the upstarts or small guys some incentive. And, some one might have to explain to me why something like that couldn't work as afr as the integration to EVE would pertain to it. Just a random brainstorm. Ok read the first paragraph and stopped. Your idea is bases on numbers. It's just breaking it down to a small form of what is already here IMO. Just taking that idea you threw together level 1 is 1-50 again we have the issue your talking about with PC just on a much smaller scale. I'll put it in prospective again if I'm wrong simply say so. But the 50 person corp would be like the PRO they have more members to take more planets so on and so forth then we have the say my corp 100 members on on this scale say we have 5 members how do we compete how do we get our foot in the door where is our incentive? I'm not being a troll I honestly just want to understand ur point.
Well, that's where I am saying that I was never trying to envision the 5 guys burgers and fries competing or sustaining in PC. Now if there were say like some 8 v. 8 districts then maybe a group that small would have a snowballs chance at holding one. If the battle is 16 v 16, then I think all could assume that 16 is the MINIMUM of what you want to go in with. So, if you were going in with 5, you must be some real bad mama jamas that doo doo ISK. |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 11:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
NIKIA BETHUNE wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:NIKIA BETHUNE wrote:Rigor Mordis wrote:RE: #337
Apparently you don't comprehend either.
It's kinda a **** move but i'm not going to look for your answer to my question i feel if you could spend the 20-30mins to say all this you could answer the only thing i want to know. how to we make PC for new people? if it was never really intended for new people. that seems to be your main point i scanned of most of this so if i'm wrong correct me. how is a new person that start's out with what 500k sp suppose to do PC at any level? i don't get your point. you say it's not about small corps just what am i missing then. #256 was what I threw out there. Took me about 5-10 min of thought to just throw that one out there. IDK if something like that is even feasible. It was just an idea I had to give the upstarts or small guys some incentive. And, some one might have to explain to me why something like that couldn't work as afr as the integration to EVE would pertain to it. Just a random brainstorm. Ok read the first paragraph and stopped. Your idea is bases on numbers. It's just breaking it down to a small form of what is already here IMO. Just taking that idea you threw together level 1 is 1-50 again we have the issue your talking about with PC just on a much smaller scale. I'll put it in prospective again if I'm wrong simply say so. But the 50 person corp would be like the PRO they have more members to take more planets so on and so forth then we have the say my corp 100 members on on this scale say we have 5 members how do we compete how do we get our foot in the door where is our incentive? I'm not being a troll I honestly just want to understand ur point.
That's all anybody want on here is to have a legitimate discussion. Not be belittled for having an idea, or not knowing much about space.
I think that 80 mil ISK and the 16 v.16 battle would deter those who weren't serious. enough to get in and stay in. If you were the guy with 5, don't you think your odds of getting to 16 or 20 are better than your odds of getting 100, 500, or 1500. Once your group got to 50, didn't it get a lot easier to get to 100?
That's where I'm trying to go with this. |
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Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
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Posted - 2013.04.13 11:44:00 -
[21] - Quote
NIKIA BETHUNE wrote: What's to stop it from getting worst? What I mean by that is I consider small based on the largest corps to be 1-100 members medium would be 101-300 large is 301-1000+ now just using this model how is it fair for the 1 man corps to face the 100 man corps? The 100man corps would farm that tier then to have the 100vs the 300 you get my point? So I don't understand how ur tier system would work I might miss understand what you meant. And what's to stop farming to happen with this? Like I said I not sure this is the system your suggesting its just what I understand u to mean. Now how is that going to be better? And how would what what happen if a corp had one too many member and moved to the next tier? Or a director kick enough members to take them the next bracket down I see too much room for error and no benefit but please clarify.
I guess that model assumes that a corp is awarded a level 1 territory upon its founding and that's not what I intended to imply. I meant that any corp wanting to buy in would start at a level 1 territory. But again, that's just an idea thrown to the wind. I needed people all along to tell me if something like that is possible or desirable. If that's not anything within the realm of possibility lets forget it altogether.
I just thought something like that could create more isolated competition between those of the same rank and file. Where I get concerned is when I hear those getting excited about 'griefing' |
Rigor Mordis
Imperial Populicide Legion
13
|
Posted - 2013.04.13 12:21:00 -
[22] - Quote
The casual part of this blows. I've been including that in my stances. I think that's why we're seeing so many that are disappointed with the proposed initial build of PC.
Start selling it as RTS makes it more attractive then selling it as RPG. I don't play EVE at the moment, I was going to get a trial membership to see whats up with it but, in all sincere honesty, after spending some weeks interacting with the condescending part of the community on here, I decided against it.
And my calm response is in response to the extension of civility that is hard to come by in forums. Not just this forum, but any forum attached to a game. So, I apologize to those I may have snapped at. |
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