Because ADS was just that OP. o_O

That being said, there's also a benefit in ensuring newer pilots and more veteran pilots aren't 50% damage different. It's harder to balance for such a wide swing of capabilities. Namely that with such a wide variance of rate of fire, either the newbie will be useless or the veteran will be overpowered. With a smaller difference in the skill bonus, the entire class is easier to balance for.

Seriously, what is the problem with a RoF nerf? Aside from not firing as fast nothing about the ads changes. It is getting a price reduction and a small hp buff (not sure but i'll check) yet you all act like its getting nerfed into oblivion.

The other part of it is that swarms are being buffed so that they can sometimes maybe actually hit ADSes on occasion.

No need to charge for reimbursements, Derrith, when it's impossible for you to die. =)

Now, on the opposite, consider that as a swarm launcher user, I can be instakilled anywhere by a shotgunner, HMG, combat rifle, nova knifer, or of course, your ADS. I have no way to rapidly leave the area faster than any other class in the game.

Do you have any idea of just how ridiculously OP you are? The idea that you can leave an area of engagement until someone takes care of the threat is a luxury no infantry, and certainly no AV has.

And this is the lamest reason ever. Balance > Your SP output

The other part of it is that swarms are being buffed so that they can sometimes maybe actually hit ADSes on occasion.

It was tough figuring out where to start, but I guess I'll give it a go.

@Thread

The RoF reduction was indeed necessary, as it'll bring the TTK to a time that actually makes sense (my alt only has Caldari ADS Operation Level III and I can still drop most suits in less than a second, including PRO ones.

I also find it funny how Pilots forget (more like omit) the fact they have a skill which increases the damage of their Turrets, giving XT-1s 500HP of damage. The only thing that you should have even the slightest bit of trouble killing with that is a tanked out Caldari Sentinel, but you can easily escape their range in seconds (HF Delta won't change that either).

@Derrith Erador

"Dropships Aren't OP"

The ability to kill any Dropsuit within <3s from a mid-long range engagement (50-75m), along with being able to remove yourself from the area the instant any threat arrives with 0 recourse or consequence for an indefinite period of time is indeed overpowered.

It removes the risk involved with operating an ADS, and is significantly disproportional to the risk involved with operating an Anti-Vehicle weapon.

"Use Kinetic Catalyzers"

They don't compare to the efficiency of the Afterburner. The most a KinCat will ever yield (on a MinCom) is +0.78m/s, bringing your Sprint Speed to 7.03m/s. Considering how ADSs have a base movement speed of 50m/s, they'll be running circles around you (not saying that MinComs should be as fast as 59m/s.

When you also take into account that 7.03m/s isn't fast enough to escape any engagement (beyond being pitted against a Sentinel w/SG or NKs), your comparison is so laughable that it makes me begin to question your credibility.

Not only that, but KinCats are completely impractical to fit, as to use them without ruining your AV fit you need to use a PG Extender, in which case you'll have no buffer (making you lunch to any ADS Pilot with a light investment), or have no Armor Repair, making your buffer useless.

"Assault Dropships Require Teamwork"

You must've never looked at the definition of require.

After extensively experimenting and flying ADSs myself I can confirm that the only thing about it that requires teamwork is skill stacking. You can operate every aspect of the aircraft without the need for intervention or assistance from an ally, along with 1v1 most AVers.

"Pilot's Are Just Skilled"

Yes, I'm sure sprinting to the flight ceiling every time something that as much as breathes at you, along with slaughtering entire group of people by looking in their general direction requires skill. Heck, even surviving 20GJ Particle Cannons are that difficult if you stay out of the FOV and have an AB.

Maybe you're referring to the skill stacking bug (which technically does require skill), but after my tests I can confirm that most of players assertions of ADSs being difficult are wild exaggerations.

No need to charge for reimbursements, Derrith, when it's impossible for you to die. =)

So do you not get on the high ground with swarms? Seems stupid not too as it brings you closer and range you say is a problem as well as making it next to impossible for infantry to kill you depending on where you are.

I hope that was humor. In PC, the place Derrith mostly flies, dropships do not last long without support. That's where your "Teamwork" comes in, Soraya.

Don't forget about the nerf to Swarm's turning radius.

What reason do you need to shoot 50% faster than someone else?

I swore I wouldn't say anything more on this thread, but apparently I have to break that vow.

I never said weren't OP. In this thread, show me EXACTLY where I said it. I even said it was OP. What I DID actually say is that the nerf they're giving is WAY overboard.

Kin cats: I don't see how everybody is so scared to run this thing on their AV fit. I run this thing on every fit I own, and I enjoy it greatly. Works wonders with everything I do. I even have on on an Amando, and like using it.

it requires teamwork: You ever got shot down by two sets of swarms about 10 meters apart from each other? If those swarms are ADV, I'm going to die if they catch me slipping. And if I escape, then that area is completely blocked off to me, unless I get someone to drop out and help me handle them, I will remain useless in the fight.

It is true I can solo most AV, but when the two most common forms of infantry AV requires you to be deadly accurate in a sentinel suit, and the other requires you to lock on and release, it becomes a question of who is the most skilled. If I can take out a forge or swarm solo, it becomes a true and proper 1v1. Your only backing statement i see is slamming the flight ceiling, in which if you remember anything of what I said, you'd know that I despise this tactic unless I have no other choice. I even said proposed to lower the flight ceiling, it gets very tiring having to have incubus pilots duel me by slamming the flight ceiling.

And no, I'm not referring to the skill stacking bug.

So do you not get on the high ground with swarms? Seems stupid not too as it brings you closer and range you say is a problem as well as making it next to impossible for infantry to kill you depending on where you are.

Holy crap I have a chance to return fire against skilled pilots. Maybe now basic drop ships won't be used as attack platforms.

Most vehicles in one volley? Ever tried taking on even a basic Soma with no reps or a Hardener?

Even with the damage bonus against armor it'll take me at least 2 full magazines with every missile hitting to actually get the kill, and that's pretty hard to pull off when they start moving and snapping backwards and forwards to throw off your aim.

I declare ADS useless being nerfed by buff

Looking back to ADS history, many have forgotten why the full dmg build was chosen. It was not because it was op, it was simply because the role of derpship pilot was not viable and the only way to not have a pointless role in gm was to turn it into a killing machine. That's all you would've of done. Anything else was considered trolling.

While the ADS has not been affected directly, it was been getting nerfed after every hot-fix because of the buffs in other areas. ADS is already shut down because of installation tankiness buff, to further the nerf, blaster installations received the ability to auto attack ADS without aggro. 2-3 unmanned installations force the ADS to remain out of battle.

Nerfing the RoF... I dont really care much about it in itself. But look at the other changes. Afterburners also because a major ingredient in the Full offensive derpship role. they are getting nerfed as well with that 40 sec CD increase. What allowed a derpship to perform hit and runs will now have to fire 2-3 missiles, only to remain out of battle for 40 sec.

Again, but buffing AV weapons, which i dont mind either, indirectly nerfs the ADS. Swarm missiles will travel faster and do more dmg, which really isnt required anymore since most afterburners will be on CD so ADS wont have speed boost.

As to buffs, only the standard derpships are receiving ehp/pg/cpu increases. ADS is only getting a price reduction


As you can see, it seems that many of the changes outside of ADS has been with the goal of shutting down ADS indirectly. Each buff alone would merit the buff and still allow for a fair fight with ads. but the combined changes in all the past hotfixes have been to combat the ADS to the point of meeting it utterly useless.

I agree that the ADS shouldnt be a full dmg vehicle. but taking away that role does not introduce new ones. by shutting down the ADS it will not turn it into the transport vehicle we all dreamed it would be, it will not turn it into the sup vehicle we all wanted (logi DS), and it will not become that rescue vehicle expected to go into hotzones for extractions. By taking away its only role, we are returning to its former and most notable role of being a flying sightseeing vehicle where its only use will be to appreciate the background art of each map and to sacrifice in order to reach a roof.

PLEASE remember that a dropship is an extra piece of equipment, a vehicle, that is brought into the match by a player. It cannot be equal in force to the other players who are only carrying what their dropsuits can hold.

The problem is, this statement doesn't negate for the notion that it allows that player to be way more powerful than they should be.

While flying around and escaping death, you are useless to your team.

I am also useless to my team while dead. The difference is, my death cost me money.

On a completely seperate note, I wouldn't have minded as much if the rate of fire skill for ADS was actually BUFFED and they removed the gun from the pilot seat. Get more gunner/pilot combos out in the sky.

Then it would not be an ADS, and every single ADS pilot in the game would quit, as opposed to the half of them that will because they don't like game balance. I think a standard dropship with a gunner should be more powerful than an ADS pilot solo.