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Appia Vibbia wrote:

Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:

Spartan MK420 wrote:

Meh, not wasting anymore of my time here.

This game is just becoming worse, and worse, with no light at the end of the tunnel for any role.

You balance 1 mechanic, by breaking 3. Not very productive. But good job security I suppose.

Seriously. I make multiple posts showing how terrible these cloak changes are for all but the Gallente scout and I don't even get a word in response?

It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person?

I legitimately want a respec if these changes go through and I hope i can get one because I will no longer be able to fulfill my role on the battlefield in my Minmatar scout. Even now it's hard to be a minmatar scout. It's clear they're balancing everything around casual and pub play and aren't going to address the problems when people are coordinated and have half a brain to make the correct fit to counter 3/4 scouts.

Exactly. I've been pushing for more people to play Minmatar Scout because they can dedicate a way to get under scans. That's completely gone now.
I just had this conversation with Ghost Kaiser, to salvage the suit to be useful when you know you're going to get scanned relegates you to hit and run or flanking. . . which the Minmatar Assault will do better.

I've got 3 proto scout suits and one at level 1. These changes are going to force me into only use the Gallente Scout. Congrats you've changed the meta from 608 HP Gal Scouts to 459 HP Gal Scouts. Removed Amarr and Minmatar Scouts from play.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 19 post(s)
Master Smurf Nos Nothi 469	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:48:00 - [121] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Can we make assault swarms have longer range with less dmg? And bump up the normal swarm dmg but leave the range as is. Assault swarms are on the top of my list of "useless" variants to fix Ze Flaylock Your new Locus Grenade Ion and Bolt pistol Snipers other than Charge and Thale Proximity Explosives Hope these are on that list too. "Shine bright like a diamond"
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn 3263	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:48:00 - [122] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Can we make assault swarms have longer range with less dmg? And bump up the normal swarm dmg but leave the range as is. Assault swarms are on the top of my list of "useless" variants to fix What about the Plasma Rifles variants >: Fixed or Dodo, I am leaning towards the second The TAR isn't so bad, but dat burst and breach... Maybe a slightly larger mag on the breach? "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 5722	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:49:00 - [123] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Can we make assault swarms have longer range with less dmg? And bump up the normal swarm dmg but leave the range as is. Assault swarms are on the top of my list of "useless" variants to fix What about the Plasma Rifles variants >: Fixed or Dodo, I am leaning towards the second Dodo? Like, extinct? Or Todo list o.o? Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 377	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:54:00 - [124] - Quote Meh, not wasting anymore of my time here. This game is just becoming worse, and worse, with no light at the end of the tunnel for any role. You balance 1 mechanic, by breaking 3. Not very productive. But good job security I suppose. Official Unofficial D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N team mascot.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 1929	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:55:00 - [125] - Quote How the hell are we addressing Armor In DUST 514 before we have Even made Shields Competitive except in very situational instances.. Shield Energizers and Rechargers = Low slot?
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 5722	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:55:00 - [126] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Can we make assault swarms have longer range with less dmg? And bump up the normal swarm dmg but leave the range as is. Assault swarms are on the top of my list of "useless" variants to fix What about the Plasma Rifles variants >: Fixed or Dodo, I am leaning towards the second The TAR isn't so bad, but dat burst and breach... Maybe a slightly larger mag on the breach? IMO, Tar needs more damage for it's low mag count/range/rate of fire. Anything the TAR does the Scrambler does dramatically better. Before overheating you can fire more rounds with the scrambler rifle downrange, faster, than the TAR has in it's mag, at a longer range and with more damage to shields, with higher damage in general -AS WELL AS- the ability to charge it up. TAR definitely needs to be more viable when compared to the Scrambler Rifle. Just my personal thoughts though. Breach -definitely- needs some work, especially with the change to Gal Assault focusing on dispersion since it already has a great hipfire dispersion; just makes it laser accurate. Burst needs to be able to contend with the Combat Rifle in terms of performance without increasing it's rate of fire, so probably more damage. Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 5722	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:56:00 - [127] - Quote Bethhy wrote: How the hell are we addressing Armor In DUST 514 before we have Even made Shields Competitive except in very situational instances.. Shield Energizers and Rechargers = Low slot? Generally the common factor of every bad point release was when they buffed one thing and then nerfed the thing that counters it. It'd be senseless to nerf armor and then subsequently buff shields without even looking at the effects caused by the nerf to armor. Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 944	Posted - 2014.05.23 14:59:00 - [128] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Bethhy wrote: How the hell are we addressing Armor In DUST 514 before we have Even made Shields Competitive except in very situational instances.. Shield Energizers and Rechargers = Low slot? Generally the common factor of every bad point release was when they buffed one thing and then nerfed the thing that counters it. It'd be senseless to nerf armor and then subsequently buff shields without even looking at the effects caused by the nerf to armor. Ladies and Gentlemen, Aeon Amadi. o7 Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5477	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:00:00 - [129] - Quote Spartan MK420 wrote: Meh, not wasting anymore of my time here. This game is just becoming worse, and worse, with no light at the end of the tunnel for any role. You balance 1 mechanic, by breaking 3. Not very productive. But good job security I suppose. Seriously. I make multiple posts showing how terrible these cloak changes are for all but the Gallente scout and I don't even get a word in response? It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? I legitimately want a respec if these changes go through and I hope i can get one because I will no longer be able to fulfill my role on the battlefield in my Minmatar scout. Even now it's hard to be a minmatar scout. It's clear they're balancing everything around casual and pub play and aren't going to address the problems when people are coordinated and have half a brain to make the correct fit to counter 3/4 scouts. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2555	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:11:00 - [130] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Spartan MK420 wrote: Meh, not wasting anymore of my time here. This game is just becoming worse, and worse, with no light at the end of the tunnel for any role. You balance 1 mechanic, by breaking 3. Not very productive. But good job security I suppose. Seriously. I make multiple posts showing how terrible these cloak changes are for all but the Gallente scout and I don't even get a word in response? It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? I legitimately want a respec if these changes go through and I hope i can get one because I will no longer be able to fulfill my role on the battlefield in my Minmatar scout. Even now it's hard to be a minmatar scout. It's clear they're balancing everything around casual and pub play and aren't going to address the problems when people are coordinated and have half a brain to make the correct fit to counter 3/4 scouts. Exactly. I've been pushing for more people to play Minmatar Scout because they can dedicate a way to get under scans. That's completely gone now. I just had this conversation with Ghost Kaiser, to salvage the suit to be useful when you know you're going to get scanned relegates you to hit and run or flanking. . . which the Minmatar Assault will do better. I've got 3 proto scout suits and one at level 1. These changes are going to force me into only use the Gallente Scout. Congrats you've changed the meta from 608 HP Gal Scouts to 459 HP Gal Scouts. Removed Amarr and Minmatar Scouts from play. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia

Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5479	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:13:00 - [131] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Spartan MK420 wrote: Meh, not wasting anymore of my time here. This game is just becoming worse, and worse, with no light at the end of the tunnel for any role. You balance 1 mechanic, by breaking 3. Not very productive. But good job security I suppose. Seriously. I make multiple posts showing how terrible these cloak changes are for all but the Gallente scout and I don't even get a word in response? It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? I legitimately want a respec if these changes go through and I hope i can get one because I will no longer be able to fulfill my role on the battlefield in my Minmatar scout. Even now it's hard to be a minmatar scout. It's clear they're balancing everything around casual and pub play and aren't going to address the problems when people are coordinated and have half a brain to make the correct fit to counter 3/4 scouts. Exactly. I've been pushing for more people to play Minmatar Scout because they can dedicate a way to get under scans. That's completely gone now. I just had this conversation with Ghost Kaiser, to salvage the suit to be useful when you know you're going to get scanned relegates you to hit and run or flanking. . . which the Minmatar Assault will do better. I've got 3 proto scout suits and one at level 1. These changes are going to force me into only use the Gallente Scout. Congrats you've changed the meta from 608 HP Gal Scouts to 459 HP Gal Scouts. Removed Amarr and Minmatar Scouts from play. Seriously, it wasn't that bad when I had to run 2 damps because then I could use my third for a code breaker or a kin cat. Now, it's just not possible so guess whats going in those slots? Plates. Lots and lots of plates. "We're fixing EHP tanking by forcing scouts to forgo their stealth for EHP." Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2555	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:14:00 - [132] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? Just to hone in on this point, I think Zatara Rought made the best case example of why non-scouts (people that never ran scout before 1.8 buff was confirmed) get pissy if they don't have their unbeatable scanners. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 5724	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:17:00 - [133] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? Just to hone in on this point, I think Zatara Rought made the best case example of why non-scouts (people that never ran scout before 1.8 buff was confirmed) get pissy if they don't have their unbeatable scanners. Until gameplay mechanics change (presumable in Legion) than there will always be this sided argument where one side says that there should be a way to be scanned, and the other side says there should be a way to never be scanned. It will always be the case with current mechanics. I do like the proposal for Precision falloff over range, the longer the distance the less chance of actually finding the target. Can't have that in Dust 514 though, so CCP is going to have to pick which side gets the bacon: Profile or Precision. I honestly don't care which one because I'm sure someone's going to lament either way. Useful Links //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588 //forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2555	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:19:00 - [134] - Quote His counter argument was that a few times he saw DISGRUNTLEDev use 4 complex profile dampeners. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 949	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:19:00 - [135] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? Just to hone in on this point, I think Zatara Rought made the best case example of why non-scouts (people that never ran scout before 1.8 buff was confirmed) get pissy if they don't have their unbeatable scanners. Why's that? Appia Vibbia wrote: His counter argument was that a few times he saw DISGRUNTLEDev use 4 complex profile dampeners. :: Facepalm :: 1 EQ > All Scouts (except this useless one). Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2556	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:26:00 - [136] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Just to force players to make a choice between being completely unscannable or scannable and invisible. Expect drastic reduction in number of cloak users. You were easily seen when moving, we all knew this, it was a tool for camping. Since it was pointed out that the cloak gave a reduction to profile I was telling people that, "the invisibility didn't have one percent of the reason it's going to be used, it's going to be used as an active-dampener." Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5480	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:29:00 - [137] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Just to force players to make a choice between being completely unscannable or scannable and invisible. Expect drastic reduction in number of cloak users. You were easily seen when moving, we all knew this, it was a tool for camping. Since it was pointed out that the cloak gave a reduction to profile I was telling people that, "the invisibility didn't have one percent of the reason it's going to be used, it's going to be used as an active-dampener." Correct the cloak, against skilled players, is only good for it's "wave of opportunities" of tacnet stealth because you are by no means invisible nor even close to being invisible. Why no one understands this I have no idea. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Appia Vibbia Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2556	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:37:00 - [138] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Correct the cloak, against skilled players, is only good for it's "wave of opportunities" of tacnet stealth because you are by no means invisible nor even close to being invisible. Why no one understands this I have no idea. Because we started with team shared line-of-sight, moved to squad shared passive scanning (which was useless) and Active Scanners, to abandoning Active Scanners (because duration is too low) and buffing passive scans to an imbalanced place where only Caldari and Gallente Scout matter. We're progressing to a point where it is more and more likely that people won't show up on the TacNet. This game is targets the player that prefers front-line style fighting. They don't want to deal with flanking, they want to deal with stealth even less. Too many people are completely reliant on TacNet pointing out where people are and any change from this is met with resistance. Appia Vibbia for CPM1 AppiaVibbia(at)gmail(dot)com AKA Nappia, AKA Mathppia
Lanius Pulvis Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn 276	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:40:00 - [139] - Quote The cloak duration has never been the problem, the dampening ando fire delay are. I like the CO and AR changes though. Not new, just new to you.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 2651	Posted - 2014.05.23 15:41:00 - [140] - Quote I'm liking the numbers Perhaps I'll come back to test stuff out and possibly give feedback on the appropriate forum. Cheers!

Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 738	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:02:00 - [141] - Quote Appia Vibbia wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? Just to hone in on this point, I think Zatara Rought made the best case example of why non-scouts (people that never ran scout before 1.8 buff was confirmed) get pissy if they don't have their unbeatable scanners. The problem isn't that scouts can now beat scanners. The problem is with the cloak scouts can now beat scanners and be invisible, this is OP, and is why scouts are prevalent. The solution should have been to make everyone have to choose which they want, to be invisible or to be unscannable, you couldnt be both at once. The problem now, as your posts demonstrate, is that Galscouts can still be both but no one else can. Keeping things as they are was not a solution but the changes just made one scout OP instead of the whole class. This is why I thought there should be a dampening penalty to the cloak, so no one, not even Galscouts can have both. Scouts will still run cloak, scouts will still run dampeners but armor tanking stays a problem, hence the greater movement penalties. Because, that's why.
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5482	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:04:00 - [142] - Quote Nothing Certain wrote: Appia Vibbia wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: It's like nobody ran scout prior to 1.8. It's like nobody remembers how terrible it is to get scanned constantly. The tacnet system is the most OP mechanic in this game and you're making the stealth class in this game not stealthy at all. Do you guys even acknowledge the fact that the tacnet is ridiculously OP? Why even have a scout class if it can be countered by 1 person? Just to hone in on this point, I think Zatara Rought made the best case example of why non-scouts (people that never ran scout before 1.8 buff was confirmed) get pissy if they don't have their unbeatable scanners. The problem isn't that scouts can now beat scanners. The problem is with the cloak scouts can now beat scanners and be invisible, this is OP, and is why scouts are prevalent. The solution should have been to make everyone have to choose which they want, to be invisible or to be unscannable, you couldnt be both at once. The problem now, as your posts demonstrate, is that Galscouts can still be both but no one else can. Keeping things as they are was not a solution but the changes just made one scout OP instead of the whole class. This is why I thought there should be a dampening penalty to the cloak, so no one, not even Galscouts can have both. Scouts will still run cloak, scouts will still run dampeners but armor tanking stays a problem, hence the greater movement penalties. You do know that it's pointless being cloaked if there's a chevron over your head right? Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
poison Diego NECROM0NGERS Caps and Mercs 395	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:11:00 - [143] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Alright here's some preliminary findings on the things I actually care about: -Only the Amarr and Gallente will be able to beat a gallente focus scanner. -Caldari and Minmatar will never beat a gallente focus scanner. -In turn Cal and Min will never beat a Caldari scout. long story short: Sucks to be a Minmatar scout even more than currently. Can I get a respec on my Minmatar scout? Not kidding about this. have you checked if they can beat a 3 precision cal scout? yes 3 dampners can barely beat it but it has to be a proto min scout..
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5485	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:19:00 - [144] - Quote poison Diego wrote: Zatara Rought wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: Alright here's some preliminary findings on the things I actually care about: -Only the Amarr and Gallente will be able to beat a gallente focus scanner. -Caldari and Minmatar will never beat a gallente focus scanner. -In turn Cal and Min will never beat a Caldari scout. long story short: Sucks to be a Minmatar scout even more than currently. Can I get a respec on my Minmatar scout? Not kidding about this. have you checked if they can beat a 3 precision cal scout? yes 3 dampners can barely beat it but it has to be a proto min scout.. with a proto cloak. 4 proto modules/slots required. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
Tectonic Fusion 1669	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:24:00 - [145] - Quote Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: -In turn Cal will never beat a Caldari scout. Correction, Caldari Scout = Caldari Scout, but ScR CalScout > CR CalScout.
SirManBoy Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 574	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:28:00 - [146] - Quote Given the new figures, will the complex armor plate get an HP buff?
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 378	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:28:00 - [147] - Quote I know I know....but CCP , I have 1 further question. When are you going to fix the logistic bonus applying to a cloak device? Official Unofficial D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N team mascot.
Booby Tuesdays Ahrendee Mercenaries 512	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:30:00 - [148] - Quote Militia Armor Plate and BPO numbers please?
Cyrius Li-Moody 0uter.Heaven 5485	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:32:00 - [149] - Quote Tectonic Fusion wrote: Cyrius Li-Moody wrote: -In turn Cal will never beat a Caldari scout. Correction, Caldari Scout = Caldari Scout, but ScR CalScout > CR CalScout. Until they realize that putting dampeners in their lows is pointless and put plates there so they have 300 armor ontop of 300 shields. Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
SHANN da MAN D3LTA FORC3 C0VEN 243	Posted - 2014.05.23 16:37:00 - [150] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Can we make assault swarms have longer range with less dmg? And bump up the normal swarm dmg but leave the range as is. Assault swarms are on the top of my list of "useless" variants to fix When you get around to Fixing Swarms, Please consider this Proposal. It's a bit old, but it still mostly applies and would equally address Swarms vs. HAV's, and Swarms vs. Dropships/LAV's And it addresses Assault Swarms to make them relevant. nothing to see here ... move along



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