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Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 844	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:27:00 - [61] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Stop with the freking risk/reward. If you are not willing to do sht about it, then it's your own fault. My sniper suits costed 130k isk in 1.6 and were easily killable by a standard tactical sniper. Get good you scurbs and stop tying to keep a shtty weapon in the dirt. The only viable sniper right now is the thale's. Snipers are an unliked class but you deserve to be sniped if you don't want to counter them. I kill 90% of sniper I face with level 2 in sniper operation, a scout suit and a tactical sniper rifle and I best most lose over 100k isk per death when I start sniping. They all need a zoom and damage buff. Tactical needs it's clip size increased. Charge needs a cooler word in front of the name, a damage buff and a huge zoom capability buff. Basic needs a damage buff. People might call me a class traitor but I think higher tier sniper rifles are fairly well balanced. The charge sniper rifle is a good example. The Thales is another. The sniper rifles at the middle and lower ends of the spectrum are pretty near useless. You sometimes have to get four shots on a target to drop it. Two or three should be sufficient for fatties. Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 6779	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:29:00 - [62] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Remove the redline and I'll talk. Or you could improve Map Design to the point where the Redline doesn't contain the only vantage points actually worth a damn. Stop trying to cure the symptoms as opposed to te diesease. #LivingLikeLarry [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 889	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:37:00 - [63] - Quote Atiim wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Remove the redline and I'll talk. Or you could improve Map Design to the point where the Redline doesn't contain the only vantage points actually worth a damn. Stop trying to cure the symptoms as opposed to te diesease. The redline doesn't though, there are lots of vantage points, the redline merely provides safety. Back when every map was the giant bowl I'd agree with you but it's not like that anymore. Still would be nice to have some buildings that are enterable, tall, and actually have windows.
lrian Locust Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 378	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:37:00 - [64] - Quote Poonmunch wrote: The sniper rifles at the middle and lower ends of the spectrum are pretty near useless. You sometimes have to get four shots on a target to drop it. Two or three should be sufficient for fatties. The same goes for proto. There's no way to 2- or 3-shot fatties with a proto rifle, unless it's a Charge (which is hardly a sniper rifle, with 2x zoom) and the Thales (unavailable for most players). Let's buff headshots and increase zoom for proto sniper rifles. This gives a sniper rifle more power in the right hands. It also affects targeted scouts less (harder to headshot) and fatties more (slower to escape, thus more chance to land a headshot).
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 844	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:38:00 - [65] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Sniper has the double problem of being both a disliked playstyle from the rest of the player base and a pretty poor one in terms of raw viability. Thale snipers still hurt me, and I've seen good scout snipers use the cloak to hit and re-locate before I can track them down. So, options are available. Really, you need a scout suit that caters to sniping, rather than buffing the weapon itself. Lest you run the risk of making it potent for any old fool. For me, if it's a play style, it needs a suit, not a weapon or equipment piece,to define it and make it work. A cloak on any sniper rig is a sick, nasty combination. Especially on some of the higher tier scout suits or Caldari commando suits. I can sit right in the middle of some maps and cull the herd nicely. Sit in a big, bright nanohive glow (two or three in one place is ideal) and you can really go to town. Then cloak, move and repeat. Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 844	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:44:00 - [66] - Quote Eko Sol wrote: [quote=Sir Dukey]I can't run scout every match. Oh, yes you can. Nowadays 50% of the suits I see are scouts. Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 6779	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:47:00 - [67] - Quote I'm failing to see how Sniping is low-risk, when you are vunerable to: Scouts Assault Dropships Heavies w/LAVs and/or Transport Dropships Infantry w/Active Scanner(s) Can somebody please explain this notion to me? Or do people hate Snipers simply because killing one requires them to actually search for one? #LivingLikeLarry [s]Text[/s] <-------- That's how you make a strike-through -HAND
Everything Dies Inner.Hell 650	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:53:00 - [68] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Hmm... So basically, you have to bring a tank to counter a tank? So what are you arguing? That the sniper rifle's range needs to be decreased to the point where people with ARs/CRs/RRs can hit them? Kein Mitleid Für Die Mehrheit. Eight months has been long enough...guess it's time to learn how to play with a squad.
Everything Dies Inner.Hell 650	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:56:00 - [69] - Quote Atiim wrote: I'm failing to see how Sniping is low-risk, when you are vunerable to: Scouts Assault Dropships Heavies w/LAVs and/or Transport Dropships Infantry w/Active Scanner(s) Can somebody please explain this notion to me? Or do people hate Snipers simply because killing one requires them to actually search for one? Favorite part of the game for me is when you're playing as a sniper and you hear/see a shot land nearby. Let the game of cat and mouse begin! Kein Mitleid Für Die Mehrheit. Eight months has been long enough...guess it's time to learn how to play with a squad.
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 2347	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:57:00 - [70] - Quote Galvan Nized wrote: Atiim wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Remove the redline and I'll talk. Or you could improve Map Design to the point where the Redline doesn't contain the only vantage points actually worth a damn. Stop trying to cure the symptoms as opposed to te diesease. The redline doesn't though, there are lots of vantage points, the redline merely provides safety. Back when every map was the giant bowl I'd agree with you but it's not like that anymore. Still would be nice to have some buildings that are enterable, tall, and actually have windows. worth mentioning that on the new large maps, the only time you see mot snipers in the red line is if they are red lined

Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 844	Posted - 2014.04.16 15:59:00 - [71] - Quote lrian Locust wrote: Eko Sol wrote: Sometimes I snipe and only get like 3 kills but I KNOW I saved the team in the Dom match by getting rid of so many of their uplinks. I think it's only fair that there is an award for it. I do think snipers are underrated. But you think too much of yourself. Get 3 kills as a sniper and claiming you've saved the match? Dream on! Kill count can be very misleading. If those three are all hackers and the NULL cannon stays blue for an extra two minutes, those three kills can really help your team. I don`t want to pat myself on the back too much but I`ve done this many, many times. Think of us as NULL cannon extenders. Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui The Containment Unit 565	Posted - 2014.04.16 17:30:00 - [72] - Quote Galvan Nized wrote: Still would be nice to have some buildings that are enterable, tall, and actually have windows. Then those would be the next great thing and those spots would get burned out and prob camped by shotgun scout's . Unless the are near the spawn point or the redline . That's the problem , players say that the map's are too big and some say not big enough , I think and have come to appreciate the variety and the fact that they are rotated .. some I feel like there is not enough room and some I feel could be bigger , with the expansion of players to the battle but for now they are just right . Stop asking for tiercide , your killing variety and the fun of this game at the same dam time .
Tyjus Vacca Valor Coalition Red Whines. 210	Posted - 2014.04.16 17:47:00 - [73] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Tau Lai wrote: I bet sniper rifles will get some kind of buff on the next patch iteration, because right now, a prototype sniper cannot take down a prototype suit. a prototype can barley take out a militia. Shoot them twice, or just once in the head. maybe if hit detection wasn't so crappy so commandos are good now O_o
Summ Dude Direct Action Resources 367	Posted - 2014.04.16 18:26:00 - [74] - Quote Before just making Sniper Rifles more lethal, I'd suggest improving their ability to support a squad, as I understand that to be the central design goal behind Dust. Here's a suggestion for that. As for the redline issues, I have yet to see a viable argument against simply removing any WP gained from actions taken in the redline. Not just a laymen, but the laymen. Winn Summ and lose Summ.
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 847	Posted - 2014.04.16 18:44:00 - [75] - Quote Summ Dude wrote: Before just making Sniper Rifles more lethal, I'd suggest improving their ability to support a squad, as I understand that to be the central design goal behind Dust. Here's a suggestion for that. As for the redline issues, I have yet to see a viable argument against simply removing any WP gained from actions taken in the redline. Well, if you deny WP for actions taken behind the redline, you should probably deny WP for actions outside the redline that affect inside the redline. Whether you do this or not you get the camping issue in spades. If I'm redlined and I can't shoot out of the redline, I'll just hide until the game is over. Why risk being counter-sniped when your team is redlined? I still get WP for being in the game. Why risk a suit by running out to hack or drop an uplink when your team is redlined? At least if the red team goes redline sniper, the blue team can still shoot at them and have a game. I hate sitting around waiting for a red MCC to die when the red team is so badly redlined that they just sit behind cover. Counter-sniping gives me something to do. The redline is a crappy mechanic but I'm not sure how to moderate it. Maybe make the maps 5 times the size they are now but put the objectives in the middle? Some interesting flanking options could pop up. Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
fragmentedhackslash Arrogance. 260	Posted - 2014.04.16 19:48:00 - [76] - Quote 2 things that no one has mentioned. a) As part of the light weapon parity, why where Minmatar Precision Rifles NOT added (Light Weapon/Sniper Rifle - Explosive kinetic with bipod and over the horizon range heavy barrel) Would require prone, and 2 lugg bolt action, 5 magnum rounds. b) CPM Kane Spero is right now activly seeking to halve the sniper rifle range. This can not be allowed to occur, as seen here previous to this, not a single mention of range is too far... but Kane cut the rail turret range, meaning FG can out gun a rail tank at 300 meters and not even be seen by the tanker, and he is going to do the exact same to the sniper rifle with devastating effect, nerfing all sniper rifles, characters, tactical play styles, the whole lot out the window. It's happening. Pain is just weakness leaving your body. Every day is a holiday. Every meal is a feast.
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 2353	Posted - 2014.04.16 19:55:00 - [77] - Quote fragmentedhackslash wrote: 2 things that no one has mentioned. a) As part of the light weapon parity, why where Minmatar Precision Rifles NOT added (Light Weapon/Sniper Rifle - Explosive kinetic with bipod and over the horizon range heavy barrel) Would require prone, and 2 lugg bolt action, 5 magnum rounds. b) CPM Kane Spero is right now activly seeking to halve the sniper rifle range. This can not be allowed to occur, as seen here previous to this, not a single mention of range is too far... but Kane cut the rail turret range, meaning FG can out gun a rail tank at 300 meters and not even be seen by the tanker, and he is going to do the exact same to the sniper rifle with devastating effect, nerfing all sniper rifles, characters, tactical play styles, the whole lot out the window. It's happening. I don't mind a range nerf to sniper rifles, if the weapon was improved in other areas, although sniper rifles have never been improved once in the last year of me being here no matter how bad they got. I doubt that will change and as per usual sniper will just get worse.
Poonmunch Sanguis Defense Syndicate 847	Posted - 2014.04.16 20:07:00 - [78] - Quote fragmentedhackslash wrote: 2 things that no one has mentioned. a) As part of the light weapon parity, why where Minmatar Precision Rifles NOT added (Light Weapon/Sniper Rifle - Explosive kinetic with bipod and over the horizon range heavy barrel) Would require prone, and 2 lugg bolt action, 5 magnum rounds. b) CPM Kane Spero is right now activly seeking to halve the sniper rifle range. This can not be allowed to occur, as seen here previous to this, not a single mention of range is too far... but Kane cut the rail turret range, meaning FG can out gun a rail tank at 300 meters and not even be seen by the tanker, and he is going to do the exact same to the sniper rifle with devastating effect, nerfing all sniper rifles, characters, tactical play styles, the whole lot out the window. It's happening. Is there anyone speaking out on our side of this argument? Munch Minmatar Patriot (Level 7) Dedicated Sniper
Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 833	Posted - 2014.04.16 20:43:00 - [79] - Quote Atiim wrote: I'm failing to see how Sniping is low-risk, when you are vunerable to: Scouts Assault Dropships Heavies w/LAVs and/or Transport Dropships Infantry w/Active Scanner(s) Can somebody please explain this notion to me? Or do people hate Snipers simply because killing one requires them to actually search for one? the worst part of snipers in dust are the fact that they are unusable without sitting still. They need their scope improvised so its like a railrifle scope but with much better zoom. Also it's annoying that 1000s of years into the future and out dropsuits still cant hold their hands still. sniper is like the only weapon that has sway when aiming.
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 485	Posted - 2014.04.16 22:30:00 - [80] - Quote 1Remove redline 2buff sniper lol 160k sniper suit My scout cost more than that and you can one shot me from 300 meters into your redline GO **** YOURSELF War never changes

CRNWLLC Screwy Rabbit ULC 202	Posted - 2014.04.16 22:42:00 - [81] - Quote MOAR POWAH PLEEZE!!! But TBH, there's very little in Dust more satisfying for me than getting back-to-back OHK headshots with a Charge. I just like imagining that they're on the same squad, both saying, "WTF WAS THAT SH!T?!?!?" It requires a delicious mix of skill and luck, gently stirred, never shaken. I'll take it where I can get it. My other dropsuit is a Python.
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12355	Posted - 2014.04.16 22:54:00 - [82] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Sorry, but your Thale's doesn't render when it's 200m deep in the redline. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. EUrobro
Tyjus Vacca Valor Coalition Red Whines. 212	Posted - 2014.04.16 23:09:00 - [83] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Sorry, but your Thale's doesn't render when it's 200m deep in the redline. Idk why your assault rifle can shoot out to 250 m and RR can still kill at 150m so commandos are good now O_o
Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 838	Posted - 2014.04.16 23:18:00 - [84] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Sorry, but your Thale's doesn't render when it's 200m deep in the redline. What do you mean? Are you saying thale's is the only good sniper? Well, you are correct. It's as if the made a officer plasma cannon that doesn't have charge and shoots much faster with no arc. STD-Proto are useless and the officer one is only viable one but it still sucks compared to many other weapons.
Sir Dukey KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 838	Posted - 2014.04.16 23:20:00 - [85] - Quote Piraten Hovnoret wrote: 1Remove redline 2buff sniper lol 160k sniper suit My scout cost more than that and you can one shot me from 300 meters into your redline GO **** YOURSELF If you get killed by a sniper while in a scout suit. You deserve to be killed because 1 you utterly suck or 2 you were standing still like a noob calling for snipers to head shot you..
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12356	Posted - 2014.04.16 23:21:00 - [86] - Quote Tyjus Vacca wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Sorry, but your Thale's doesn't render when it's 200m deep in the redline. Idk why your assault rifle can shoot out to 250 m and RR can still kill at 150m Would you like to attempt to kill a target at 250m with an assault rifle then? Do tell me how it goes. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. EUrobro
Tyjus Vacca Valor Coalition Red Whines. 212	Posted - 2014.04.17 00:04:00 - [87] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Tyjus Vacca wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Sorry, but your Thale's doesn't render when it's 200m deep in the redline. Idk why your assault rifle can shoot out to 250 m and RR can still kill at 150m Would you like to attempt to kill a target at 250m with an assault rifle then? Do tell me how it goes. not the point the assault rifle ,RR, CR ,ScR all have no probs killing in their effective range , but the Sniper Rifle suffers from hit detection ,rendering, and just overall low damage/zoom and honestly is better from 300m or less but its all fine because I can get maybe 10 kills from the red line with no deaths.......... let me on to a little secret you can do the same or better with the rifles by picking of stragglers so commandos are good now O_o
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8449	Posted - 2014.04.17 02:33:00 - [88] - Quote It's funny really, how you say the Thale's is the only viable sniper when it's absurdly OP. I can one shot nearly every scout bar the most tanked one, I can one shot most non proto medium frames, and it's not problematic to get multiple shots into a heavy. All so deep within the redline that I didn't lose a single Thale's in a few dozen matches. Overlord of all humans CAT MERC
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8449	Posted - 2014.04.17 02:35:00 - [89] - Quote Atiim wrote: I'm failing to see how Sniping is low-risk, when you are vunerable to: Scouts Assault Dropships Heavies w/LAVs and/or Transport Dropships Infantry w/Active Scanner(s) Can somebody please explain this notion to me? Or do people hate Snipers simply because killing one requires them to actually search for one? I have ZERO problem with snipers that actually leave the redline. It's the snipers that I literally can't reach, no matter how much I try that annoy me, hard. Look above ^ Overlord of all humans CAT MERC
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 8449	Posted - 2014.04.17 02:37:00 - [90] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Risk/Reward is a huge problem and while it is where it is, I wouldn't buff snipers one bit. You expect to make people lose 200k dropsuits from the safety of your redline while dying maybe once a blue moon? You would think people are smart enough to pick up a sniper themself and kill us glass cannons but they continue to run around. Still it's practically impossible to kill a proto suit without the thales that is moving. Hmm... So basically, you have to bring a tank to counter a tank? no, it requires a weapon of the same type. to kill a tank you use a forgegun (mini railgun or you use swarms which are minny missile launchers.) Stop being lazy, if you are not willing to kill a dude sitting still, you deserve to be killed. Anyway, not everybody snipes from the redline. Stop nerfing the ones that don't. I am willing to kill a dude sitting still. I go sniper hunting all the time, if they come out of the redline. But when they sit deep within it, I'm pretty much stuck with a 400 damage cannon aiming at me that I can't retaliate at. Overlord of all humans CAT MERC



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