DUST Search - Announcement:The Future of DUST 514

One Eyed King wrote:

Kevall Longstride wrote:

I just wanted to highlight something from the OP.

This is a new game, built from stratch. As a result no one here should make assumptions about anything or everything making the transition from PS3 Dust to PC Dust. You'll be just setting yourselves up for disappointment or false expectations, something which this new game, I think we can all agree, doesn't need round it's neck on day one.

Zaria Min Deir wrote:

I can personally empathise with how many of the community will feel about this announcement, specifically the console only players. This evolution of the New Eden FPS will leave many of the loyal playerbase behind, and a lot of disappointment and even anger is justified in reaction to how all of this is and has been handled.

No matter how justified, taking that anger out with irrational behaviour on the forums or in game will not help anyone.

I hope the community can come together in a mature manner to discuss the issues and concerns that this announcement has raised, and that those of the community that are disappointed don't resent others celebrating the path CCP has chosen.

I think that we were already set up for disappointment by even thinking that 1.3 may be the last update.

I realize that you, as CPM, were probably under the belief it would be released.

We were told that Rattati was not speaking with us, because he was in holed up working on 1.3.

We were told that CCP already knew what was in 1.3, and when it would be released, implying that 1.3 was indeed coming.

I am less concerned about the port being PC only, as we knew that was a possibility, or at least would start out that way, but why bother even allowing you to mention them working on 1.3 if they weren't absolutely certain they would release it? What better way to have salved the announcement than giving us one last update as a thanks for putting up with their sh*t.

And lastly, I am curious as to what would constitute irrational behavior? As a community, we have largely been yanked around, rang out like a rag for money, and misled. That behavior, on the part of CCP, whether intentional or not, suggests a fundamental lack of respect for the player base. Why should anyone bother showing them the respect they have not shown us?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
Talonas Ja'haren Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 0	Posted - 2016.02.03 16:55:00 - [211] - Quote How has nobody mentioned anything about the transfer of skill points yet? I am all for dust coming to PC finally, have been for a while. There definitely needs to be more information on this tier system. I'm very positive I remember somebody saying that skill points would transfer over to project legion, is this still the case for this new new project?
Thumb Green Elephant Riders 2	Posted - 2016.02.03 16:56:00 - [212] - Quote I'll probably be there but most of the people that I enjoy playing with won't. Kind of sad, Dust was the only game I really played on my PS3, now it'll just be a netflix machine for my wife & kids. Oh Whitsy is curious what sort of compensation players that won't or can't make the move will get since those that do are getting a reward. It was a rhetorical question but I figured since him and quite a few others have dropped a couple grand on this game, y'all could send them a nice gaming rig..... yeah I know, I know, not going to happen. But man, it really sucks there's no mention of a ps4 version. Here's to hoping it gets to a console eventually. Look at them, it's like they're the star attraction in a fucking flea circus.
Lightning35 Delta514 Federation Marines 62 3	Posted - 2016.02.03 16:57:00 - [213] - Quote NOOOOOO NOO NONONONONIOOOO CEO of Federation Marines 62 - Bravo Company Gallente Loyalist - Quafe Gk.0s - 61m SP
Ankbar Latrommi Roghnaigh Do Scrios 214	Posted - 2016.02.03 16:58:00 - [214] - Quote I will now break form and say something positive: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3092143#post3092143 Ankbar Latrommi wrote: As Icelanders I wonder if CCP knows an equivalent phrase to "Go hard or go home." They have finally done something. Reiner Knizia-"When playing a game, the goal is to win, but it is the goal that is important, not the winning." Eve> FPS
Yoda Boss Dem Durrty Boyz 660	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:00:00 - [215] - Quote jNs Vit4l wrote: What happens with ur AUR? Do we get reimbursment or what? Best post yet. You enjoyed your happy meal at McDonald's.... Nevermind. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒGû¬.°n+í¤GÿåGùÅ.° GÖñGÖíTrade/saleGÖºGÖñ
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 14	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:00:00 - [216] - Quote Talonas Ja'haren wrote: How has nobody mentioned anything about the transfer of skill points yet? I am all for dust coming to PC finally, have been for a while. There definitely needs to be more information on this tier system. I'm very positive I remember somebody saying that skill points would transfer over to project legion, is this still the case for this new new project? I assume this will be part of the tiered transfer that was discussed. I am sure SP will be considered in such a scenario. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Aeon Amadi 13	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:00:00 - [217] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Kevall Longstride wrote: I just wanted to highlight something from the OP. This is a new game, built from stratch. As a result no one here should make assumptions about anything or everything making the transition from PS3 Dust to PC Dust. You'll be just setting yourselves up for disappointment or false expectations, something which this new game, I think we can all agree, doesn't need round it's neck on day one. Zaria Min Deir wrote: I can personally empathise with how many of the community will feel about this announcement, specifically the console only players. This evolution of the New Eden FPS will leave many of the loyal playerbase behind, and a lot of disappointment and even anger is justified in reaction to how all of this is and has been handled. No matter how justified, taking that anger out with irrational behaviour on the forums or in game will not help anyone. I hope the community can come together in a mature manner to discuss the issues and concerns that this announcement has raised, and that those of the community that are disappointed don't resent others celebrating the path CCP has chosen. I think that we were already set up for disappointment by even thinking that 1.3 may be the last update. I realize that you, as CPM, were probably under the belief it would be released. We were told that Rattati was not speaking with us, because he was in holed up working on 1.3. We were told that CCP already knew what was in 1.3, and when it would be released, implying that 1.3 was indeed coming. I am less concerned about the port being PC only, as we knew that was a possibility, or at least would start out that way, but why bother even allowing you to mention them working on 1.3 if they weren't absolutely certain they would release it? What better way to have salved the announcement than giving us one last update as a thanks for putting up with their sh*t. And lastly, I am curious as to what would constitute irrational behavior? As a community, we have largely been yanked around, rang out like a rag for money, and misled. That behavior, on the part of CCP, whether intentional or not, suggests a fundamental lack of respect for the player base. Why should anyone bother showing them the respect they have not shown us? In regards to 1.3, fate is a cruel mistress. CCP does not intentionally mislead players, they do not go out of their way to exploit them. Take that from me, of all people, and you might know that to be true. CCP goes a -long way- to making sure the highest respect for their player base with the current team (and they should not be held responsible for the sins of their predecessors). This announcement is evidence of that. They didn't wait for Fanfest for a big reveal, they didn't wait for E3 or some other marketing frenzy, they didn't go straight to the Eve players - they came to you first in a format you're most familiar. But most of all, they didn't have to. That courtesy has become expected of them when, as far as I know, they're the only non-indie developer that takes the time to engage their community and receive feedback on things that the community really isn't 100% necessary for. Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog Skype: nomistrav
IAmDuncanIdaho II Nos Nothi 5	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:02:00 - [218] - Quote o7 fellow mercs There are 10 kinds of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't
ID G4f Capital Acquisitions LLC 135	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:02:00 - [219] - Quote I stayed when my friends left, and argued our character's had a future, frame promised character transfers after the rouge wedding & i stuck it out. If my character transfers onto the pc dust, i will be there, but if I lose everything then I will not be starting over. I have spent hundreds on this game because I was told it would be perpetual like wow, or eve. Please do not kill my effort. If you kill us mow, nobody will trust the next iteration of the game and invest money, simply because it is implied it will be wasted. Please prove my faith in you valid by announcing character transfers. 110mil sp and counting Playing since 2013-03-12 06:21 Bernie sanders for president! Finally a president of the people
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:03:00 - [220] - Quote Lightning35 Delta514 wrote: NOOOOOO NOO NONONONONIOOOO I think Vegeta says it best; no no no Purifier. First Class.

Nega Matix Speed-Maverick 25	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:03:00 - [221] - Quote GG o7 "I'm no Hero...Never was, Never will be..."
Aeon Amadi 13	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:03:00 - [222] - Quote Forlorn Destrier wrote: jNs Vit4l wrote: What happens with ur AUR? Do we get reimbursment or what? Do you get a refund for your milk when you buy a new gallon at the store? No offense, but you purchased something and got value for it; no refund incoming, I suspect. But that's ok - they plan to do something for the vets that move to the new game. A better example is having an 1987 model vehicle and getting a 2017 of the same model. There's only so much you're going to want to bring over, only so much that you can bring over. Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog Skype: nomistrav
Zaria Min Deir CASSETTE 514 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:04:00 - [223] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: And lastly, I am curious as to what would constitute irrational behavior? Because I personally want the disappointment and even betrayal I know some of the community are feeling, as it's been stated to me in private conversations enough times, to be voiced in ways that CCP can't dismiss as "incoherent raging" and thus ignore even more easily. Irrational in this context simply means calling devs names, and other immature behaviour, that has no merits in a constructive conversation. One Eyed King wrote: As a community, we have largely been yanked around, rang out like a rag for money, and misled. That behavior, on the part of CCP, whether intentional or not, suggests a fundamental lack of respect for the player base. Why should anyone bother showing them the respect they have not shown us? Because you don't have to stoop to their level. If you feel disrespected (and I certainly understand if you do), you can still take the high road. I can't answer your questions about how 1.3 was handled, because even without NDA, I really wouldn't have the words. zariamindeir on Twitter&Gmail
Celus Ivara DUST University Ivy League 435	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:05:00 - [224] - Quote Before anything else, I want to say how much it means that you came here to talk directly with us about this. The temptation for the huge reveal at Fanfest is immense; that you would forgo that to speak with your existing player-base speaks volumes. There has always been this dichotomy within Dust; the game it was meant to be vs the game we actually had. The question has always been, how do we get to that game the players & devs both longed for? When and where do you iterate? And when do you throw-out the old and invest in building from a blank slate? Despite some trepidation at such an upheaval, and the years of wait that will go along with it, I'm happy to hear that CCP has decided to walk away from the broken foundation of the PS3 client. There's a phrase in programming, "Plan to throw one away; because you will anyway." This New Eden FPS will be the third "throwing away". Many players will rightly wonder why they should think fourth-time's the charm. If I may illuminate the back-end of our rebirths: - CARBON Dust was crippled by the limits of the engine. - Dust 514 was crippled by the limits of the PS3. - EVE Legion was crippled by the hardcoded limits of Dust. CCP in burning the Earth and rebuilding from a blank slate, gets to take only lessons from their history and none of the burdens of legacy code. The move to PC will understandably upset many, but as someone who understands game dev I'll vouch it's the only way to build something that requires rapid iteration. (And though it's a bridge CCP will have to choose to cross when they come to it, I will remind people that porting from PC to PS4 is far easier than PS3 to PS4.) Going forward, I have but two pieces of worry: First, how will player migration be handled? This rebirth will be fundamentally different from the game we've played these last three years, and as such our characters must be fundamentally different. But, for the promise of New Eden to hold, the actions of our time in Dust must carry heft into this new future. I need to be very clear on this point: CCP does not sell EVE; nor do they sell Dust. They don't sell BPOs or SKINs; AURUM or PLEX. They sell New Eden. And likewise we have not been playing Dust for these last three years; we have been living in New Eden. If CCP burns that basic covenant with the player-base, that you live in New Eden and your actions have longterm weight within this sandbox, that will be a catastrophic breach of trust. So how are we to square this need for permanence with the necessity of change? I have faith a compelling solution exists, and that the community and devs are very capable of finding it together. :) This leads into my second concern, CCP has long had a very mixed history with communicating with it's player-base. Sometimes they are the most communicative devs in the industry, and other times they are a stone wall. Sometimes the stone wall is good; it's good for getting a fun, big reveal; it's good for building a bunch of Drifter lore and then slowly letting the players unwrap it. But for critical systems? For core design and tech decisions that will be near impossible to fix years down the line when you do the big reveal? Failure to have a dialogue with the player-base about the big decisions as they are being made has been the root of (almost) every big catastrophe in CCP's history. A massive rebuild & reimagining of the New Eden FPS is something big. It will shape the firmament of The Second Decade. The decisions made here will carry immense legacy. A long time ago during CPM0, Nova Knife made a post about the dangers of developer silence, and made the most on point argument I've ever seen regarding the pitfalls and missed opportunities there-in: Quote: -without enough trust that early player input is an essential part of examining a designed element for potential problems, CCP potentially risks that they'll have to revisit a system again later. We've often seen them ask for feedback much too late in the process, after a design is finished, and well past the time when a community-spotted problem could potentially be addressed and resolved before becoming an issue on the live servers. This cycle of releasing content, receiving negative feedback, and revising in subsequent patches is both inefficient and carries a heavy cost in community goodwill. At the same time, we don't expect CCP's designers to adopt a "Customer is always right" mindset either. The proper proverb to apply here should really be "Two heads are better than one". If CCP builds this game behind a stone wall, expect to yet again hardcode tech and design issues that will be unfixable two years out. And six years from now we'll be begging Hilmar to greenlight round five. If we instead approach this like the hyper-successful early access games, and bring in the thousands of passionate bunnies to provide an ocean of free alpha feedback, then the planets will finally join the stars in "EVE Forever". It has been a decade long road to New Eden on the planets. Let us walk this last few miles together. :) #PortDust514
Yaerus Steel Wolf Pack Special Forces Shadow of Dust 118	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:05:00 - [225] - Quote I'm so happy we finally got some news, medium happy about the port news. But ecstatic about the fact it will be on UE4. All praise the coming of the new DUST!
TOW SECOND Dead Man's Game Preatoriani 0	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:06:00 - [226] - Quote I just want to know ist comin on ps4 or its only on( pc ) ?
Echo 1991 warravens Imperium Eden 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:08:00 - [227] - Quote TOW SECOND wrote: I just want to know ist comin on ps4 or its only on( pc ) ? PC only by the looks of it. Though it isn't confirmed. Change the Ion Pistol Fitting Skill Pls. #PortDust514 'Echo is a dirty hooker' - UnclS2
scisco Teebag Ghosts of Dawn General Tso's Alliance 21	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:08:00 - [228] - Quote It wouldnt matter how you told us the shutdown of dust on ps3 was coming we would mostly be mad its why i own a ps3. There is no good way for them to tell me atleast they are not doing the count to 3 then shoot at 1 trick SMERGE or DIE. Nerf the pilot not the vehicles. P.S. we know we are bads. We came anyway.
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:08:00 - [229] - Quote ID G4f wrote: I stayed when my friends left, and argued our character's had a future, frame promised character transfers after the rouge wedding & i stuck it out. If my character transfers onto the pc dust, i will be there, but if I lose everything then I will not be starting over. I have spent hundreds on this game because I was told it would be perpetual like wow, or eve. Please do not kill my effort. If you kill us mow, nobody will trust the next iteration of the game and invest money, simply because it is implied it will be wasted. Please prove my faith in you valid by announcing character transfers. If they transfer too much and give a massive advantage to some, then we'll have the whole lack of balance right from the start in the new game... As much as possible needs to be wiped clean... I'll miss my dropships and my tanks, but it'll be better to have a balanced playing field. Also Dust lasted a decent time for a console game... You paid for that, not for all future releases by CCP, anything they do is better than what they are required to do.
Alex-ZX Valor Coalition 348	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:09:00 - [230] - Quote For me dust is until this day the most exiting fps I have ever played, in my opinion it had a lot of potential in many ways, but the limitations were pretty heavy I believe... I don't regret spending all this years since the beginning (beta) where the game for me was funny as hell and also as officer of three weapons, it was a honor for me being able to play this game. O7 If there's ever a transfer all I would like to keep are my named weapons :p Alex's modified ZX-030 HMG Luis' modified VC-107 CR Alex's modified VC-107 SMG *Owner of this beasts*

Nahtlog Isuuaya Tactical Caldari State 22	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:13:00 - [231] - Quote Well, the game certainly has been a blast these past few years. I'm glad that I made friends here while it lasted, and well, it is with deep sadness to see this happen, but I hope this next project will be a beacon for us. Fight brave brothers and sisters. o7 -Betamax Logibro, Nahtlog
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 14	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:13:00 - [232] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: In regards to 1.3, fate is a cruel mistress. CCP does not intentionally mislead players, they do not go out of their way to exploit them. Take that from me, of all people, and you might know that to be true. CCP goes a -long way- to making sure the highest respect for their player base with the current team (and they should not be held responsible for the sins of their predecessors). This announcement is evidence of that. They didn't wait for Fanfest for a big reveal, they didn't wait for E3 or some other marketing frenzy, they didn't go straight to the Eve players - they came to you first in a format you're most familiar. But most of all, they didn't have to. That courtesy has become expected of them when, as far as I know, they're the only non-indie developer that takes the time to engage their community and receive feedback on things that the community really isn't 100% necessary for. I appreciate that they came here first, and that they didn't wait for FF (even if they had been working on this quite awhile, but I understand why they waited). What I can't understand, with all their caution in not wanting to say anything before something more concrete was in place, is why even discuss 1.3 and allow the CPM to mention they were working on it, if they weren't sure they were going to release it? And why, seeing as how they created an expectation of 1.3s release, they couldn't release it in some form or fashion as a thank you to the community. As it stands, there are a lot of people, who spent many hours not only playing the game, but arguing, creating spreadsheets, and even websites to help better the game, who as a whole helped with both Dust and indirectly Dust 2.0, who will not be in any way, shape, or form be able to reap any rewards for their efforts. 1.3 could have been both a "thank you" and "sorry you can't come with us, we value you" Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:16:00 - [233] - Quote All I'm asking for in any 'transfer' is my character names reserved, controller support so I don't have to use KB/M and the presence of a Sentinel suit and Forge Gun or equivalents. Maybe some sort of a badge or shiny profile thing that says I was a Dust merc. If those are all covered, hell, I might actually follow this to PC. Would still prefer a PS4 port to go along with Eternal Crusade's PS4 release. For the record, I don't care about SP or ISK, or even BPOs and SKINs. I'm all for a fresh start on an even footing. Purifier. First Class.
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 14	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:16:00 - [234] - Quote TOW SECOND wrote: I just want to know ist comin on ps4 or its only on( pc ) ? At this point, only PC, but I imagine they have are not ruling out anything for the distant future, but don't want to give anyone any hope for a console version either. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
ROEG X LEVEL 5 SAVAGE 108	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:17:00 - [235] - Quote Get ready to move to PC ladies !!! Because PlayStation 4 doesn't have the power for their next ambitious project. Unreal Engine 4 is old, and there building a new game on a 4 year old engine. They just screwed the console community hard. You are going to see a lot of hacks and cheats just for better visuals and frame rates.
Brahma El Indio KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 175	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:17:00 - [236] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Brahma El Indio wrote: snip made sense I don't doubt what you say at all. Maybe the other way to do it is for console manufacturers to make longer lifespan products. Now that really applies only to the current generation, because for all intents and purposes, PS3 is still getting games released on it and it has been a very successful platform for single instance or franchise releases as you aptly described. But my point is that with the current gen many games had to be modified so that they would perform. Games could not run at 30fps 1080p on current gen and some had to be cut to 900p. So thats hardware limitation within the first year of decent volume uptake of both current gen consoles. Therefore even if CCP tried to take the new project to console, they are eventually going to hit the same brick walls as they did on PS3.
Lost Apollo Moose Knuckle Pros Devil's Descendants 295	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:17:00 - [237] - Quote I'm at a loss. I understand the port to PC (hopefully ps4) was needed. Fck though. Been around a long time. It's been fun. It's been terrible. The news of Dust shutting down has destroyed my day. Completely. As a father of 4, I can't afford a damn pc with enough power to run a new version of Dust. I can do a ps4. Fck, fck, fck. My armor is weak, but my shields are relentless. State 'Rasetsu' Assault Born - April 1, 2013
Aeon Amadi 13	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:18:00 - [238] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Aeon Amadi wrote: In regards to 1.3, fate is a cruel mistress. CCP does not intentionally mislead players, they do not go out of their way to exploit them. Take that from me, of all people, and you might know that to be true. CCP goes a -long way- to making sure the highest respect for their player base with the current team (and they should not be held responsible for the sins of their predecessors). This announcement is evidence of that. They didn't wait for Fanfest for a big reveal, they didn't wait for E3 or some other marketing frenzy, they didn't go straight to the Eve players - they came to you first in a format you're most familiar. But most of all, they didn't have to. That courtesy has become expected of them when, as far as I know, they're the only non-indie developer that takes the time to engage their community and receive feedback on things that the community really isn't 100% necessary for. I appreciate that they came here first, and that they didn't wait for FF (even if they had been working on this quite awhile, but I understand why they waited). What I can't understand, with all their caution in not wanting to say anything before something more concrete was in place, is why even discuss 1.3 and allow the CPM to mention they were working on it, if they weren't sure they were going to release it? And why, seeing as how they created an expectation of 1.3s release, they couldn't release it in some form or fashion as a thank you to the community. As it stands, there are a lot of people, who spent many hours not only playing the game, but arguing, creating spreadsheets, and even websites to help better the game, who as a whole helped with both Dust and indirectly Dust 2.0, who will not be in any way, shape, or form be able to reap any rewards for their efforts. 1.3 could have been both a "thank you" and "sorry you can't come with us, we value you" I dunno about you, but I generally don't eat pizza - regardless of how delicious it looks - after the cat sits on it. Negative Introspection - Aeon's CPM Blog Skype: nomistrav
Ares 514 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N 3	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:18:00 - [239] - Quote CCP lives up to expectations, unfortunately. o7
Al the destroyer 0.P. 1	Posted - 2016.02.03 17:18:00 - [240] - Quote My personal opinion is they should not let any form of SP, ISK, or assets port over. This would not be good for any new players and would put a stranglehold on any new growth.



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