DUST Search - Sticky:[Feedback] HP Modules and Strafe Speed

Piercing Serenity wrote:

Jadd Hatchen wrote:

CCP Rattati wrote:

P.S. Medium speeds may get shaken up in light of the Assault HP boost , Logistics may get a speed boost, Commandos as well, Assault speed reduction, all very small.

Okay first you state the issue and then you come up with a good plan to fix the issue and they you CREATE A LOOPHOLE THAT NULLIFIES YOUR FIX?????!!!!

Seriously if you apply it to only heavies and all mediums except for logistics dropsuits, then guess what players will do? Oh they will return to the days of the logi-slayers! Of course!

If you make this change,then make it apply game-wide to all suits. Making exceptions is what breaks the game balance. If it is mass based as you say, then that implies it should be a defining part of the physics in your game and thus Scotty would shame you for trying to break those laws!

Shame on you CCP!!!

I am always surprised when I read post like this - one that reflects so little reading comprehension that I am truly baffled.

Here is the current EHP layout by class, the combination of armor and shield strength, from greatest to least:

Sentinel
Commando

Assault

Logistics
Scout

Here is the actual speed layout by class, from greatest to least:

Scout

Assault

Logistics
Commando
Sentinel

As you can see, the position of the logistics class doesn't make sense. It has less EHP than an assault, yet it is slower than the assault. If a mass based system were to be implemented, it would require that logistics become faster than they currently are, and that assaults become slower than they currently. This would yield the following ranking of speed <--> EHP, where 1 is high speed and 5 is high EHP

Scout
Logistics
Assault
Commando
Sentinel

TL:DR - Speed changes would be required for the mass based system to make sense with the current EHP values of the suits as they are. We won't be returning to Slayer logis if they get a little faster. What it will likely mean is that logis will be able to rep more classes than just a heavy because they can keep up.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 2232	Posted - 2014.11.20 01:03:00 - [91] - Quote SponkSponkSponk wrote: Alaika Arbosa wrote: It simply doesn't make sense to me that Shield mods would affect strafe speed at all; Armor mods, yeah, that make complete sense, Shield mods don't. The flux caused by shield generators makes a reciprocal directional impedance effect on the suit. Since more generators are on the front and back compared to the sides, it's easier to move in those directions compared to stepping sideways. +1 for trying, I still prefer the idea of Sig Bloom on Shield mods over reduction in strafe speed. Cal Scout (or any Scout for that matter) stacks shield mods? ok, you just threw stealth out the window Everyone one the opposing team stacking Shield mods? Looks like scanners will be useless this match since we'll already know where everyone is I honestly think Sig Bloom is a much more elegant way to balance them. Gò¡Gê¬Gò«(Gùú_Gùó)Gò¡Gê¬Gò«
Booby Tuesdays Tuesdays With Boobies 1003	Posted - 2014.11.20 01:15:00 - [92] - Quote I think this change will hurt the Min Logi the hardest. CCP already has admitted you need to stack extenders just to make it barely survivable. Look at the APEX Min Logi, nothing but shield mods. How many profile dampeners will I have to stack to make up for the need for some shields? So now what, do I brick it to avoid being instantly passively scan able? Make myself a very slow, low HP support suit? Half-Assed Forum Warrior / Half-Decent Commando / Damn Good Logi
Kensai Dragon DUST University Ivy League 90	Posted - 2014.11.20 01:17:00 - [93] - Quote manboar thunder fist wrote: Kensai Dragon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Dear Players, We are going to add separate strafe penalties to HP modules. We will not be reducing normal speed, nor running speed, only left-right speed, making the "dodging" of bullets more difficult, and Sentinels lack of mobility to become a real vulnerability when stacking eHP. The calculations will theoretically be based off of relative mass (Scouts) and total mass (Sentinels). Medium Frames will not be affected as much as these two. Basic Frames may end up not having any penalties at all. .... Couple of things - are you suggesting that my brick tanked Amarr Sentinel is too quick to hit? They're already quite vulnerable, especially when brick tanked. Additionally, it sounds like two different calculations to penalize both Scouts and Sents the same for a given shield plate. If this is the case, are you planning to implement different plates for each class? ie - light basic plates with less hp than heavy basic plates? If not, I'm struggling with how a heavy would suffer equally with a light for a given mass increase. Your suit may be fatter but your clone isn't. More burden more hp more slow Except for, the dropsuit augments your movements. You aren't necessarily carrying all that weight around, the suit is. You just control the suit.
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 2232	Posted - 2014.11.20 01:25:00 - [94] - Quote Kensai Dragon wrote: manboar thunder fist wrote: Kensai Dragon wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Dear Players, We are going to add separate strafe penalties to HP modules. We will not be reducing normal speed, nor running speed, only left-right speed, making the "dodging" of bullets more difficult, and Sentinels lack of mobility to become a real vulnerability when stacking eHP. The calculations will theoretically be based off of relative mass (Scouts) and total mass (Sentinels). Medium Frames will not be affected as much as these two. Basic Frames may end up not having any penalties at all. .... Couple of things - are you suggesting that my brick tanked Amarr Sentinel is too quick to hit? They're already quite vulnerable, especially when brick tanked. Additionally, it sounds like two different calculations to penalize both Scouts and Sents the same for a given shield plate. If this is the case, are you planning to implement different plates for each class? ie - light basic plates with less hp than heavy basic plates? If not, I'm struggling with how a heavy would suffer equally with a light for a given mass increase. Your suit may be fatter but your clone isn't. More burden more hp more slow Except for, the dropsuit augments your movements. You aren't necessarily carrying all that weight around, the suit is. You just control the suit. Allowing someone to walk around with a 5 ton cage encasing them is one thing, allowing them to do the same gracefully is another entirely. Gò¡Gê¬Gò«(Gùú_Gùó)Gò¡Gê¬Gò«
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9235	Posted - 2014.11.20 02:11:00 - [95] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: In DUST, not EVE, why would shield power generators not have weight/mass, even though the shield, being energy, would be weightless? The idea would be to normalize the strafe penalty on HP added. Why would that be unfair? With Extenders granting lower HP than Plates, obviously we would be talking about way lower penalties. Dual brick tanking should, however, be extremely slowing. Someone said, just make them all strafe slower, but that "is" punishing everyone for the sins of the few. Aren't all dropsuits basically exo suits, in a sense? And thus they require additional energy besides your muscles to move. Basically the suit would sensor which muscles are working and then provide additional energy to help move the hefty suit (even the scout suit would probably be pretty heavy for a normal Joe to walk around in on his own). So if shield extenders must have a movement penalty, just say it is drawing this extra energy away from the suit. Amarr are the good guys Join "PIE Ground Control" for secure Amarr FW syncing and orbital support
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2889	Posted - 2014.11.20 03:45:00 - [96] - Quote If you wanna keep making shields worse than armor, give us a ***** shield module that has no penalties like ferros for armor And, if you do this, kin cats better give some *** strafe speed again or something. Im going to say it again--the problem isn't speed, its change of direction. There is no acceleration. Rather than nerf speed, nerf the ***** acceleration. Once again, attacking the symptoms and not the problem... Im disappointed to say the least. "Minja" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ I piss Remote Explosives and shit Shotgun shells.
IZI doro Terminal Courtesy Proficiency V. 7	Posted - 2014.11.20 03:48:00 - [97] - Quote HP Mods vs. Strafe Speed My understanding on the premise: HP mods no longer impact total movement, but instead impact solely lateral movement ("strafing"). Impact to lateral movement is based upon "relative mass : total mass" calculations (need more definitions to give more accurate feedback on this statement). "Extrema" suits (high mobility or high defense frames) will be impacted the most. "Versatile" suits (basic and moderate mobility / defense frames) will receive less impact. Certain biotic implants may offer movement enhancement Feedback: Since Amarr, Caldari and Minmatar suits have "backpacks," should they not be weighed down more? Minmatar in-game description and lore on the other hand state that due to their inherent racial preferences to "minimalism" and "function-over-form," the suits have been stripped down to reduce weight. Would it not be more prudent and effective to address the overall speed anomaly? Penalties relative to frame type make sense. Heavies are already geared for moving under massive payloads. Mediums are geared to be modified to a certain extent. Lights are geared for operating unhindered by additional physical demands to the suit. ________________ Racial Speed Gradient: Minmatar > Gallente > Caldari > Amarr Dropsuit Speed Gradient (reference Piercing Serenity): Scout > Assault > Logistics > Commando > Sentinels *In my understanding, Logistics are slower since the tactical movement subsystems have been downgraded in order to increase the performance of equipment controller subsystems. Dropsuit Frame Penalties: Light (1.5x) > Medium (1x) > Heavy (.5x) *Frame penalties combine with movement penalties: Complex Armor Plates (+5%) * Heavy Low-slot (0.5x) = Movement Penalty (+2.5%) ^ n Every battle is a battle of attrition for me. 100hp in 5 seconds helps though
GLOBAL fils'de RAGE Consolidated Dust 47	Posted - 2014.11.20 04:20:00 - [98] - Quote Piercing Serenity wrote: Jadd Hatchen wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: P.S. Medium speeds may get shaken up in light of the Assault HP boost , Logistics may get a speed boost, Commandos as well, Assault speed reduction, all very small. Okay first you state the issue and then you come up with a good plan to fix the issue and they you CREATE A LOOPHOLE THAT NULLIFIES YOUR FIX?????!!!! Seriously if you apply it to only heavies and all mediums except for logistics dropsuits, then guess what players will do? Oh they will return to the days of the logi-slayers! Of course! If you make this change,then make it apply game-wide to all suits. Making exceptions is what breaks the game balance. If it is mass based as you say, then that implies it should be a defining part of the physics in your game and thus Scotty would shame you for trying to break those laws! Shame on you CCP!!! I am always surprised when I read post like this - one that reflects so little reading comprehension that I am truly baffled. Here is the current EHP layout by class, the combination of armor and shield strength, from greatest to least: Sentinel Commando Assault Logistics Scout Here is the actual speed layout by class, from greatest to least: Scout Assault Logistics Commando Sentinel As you can see, the position of the logistics class doesn't make sense. It has less EHP than an assault, yet it is slower than the assault. If a mass based system were to be implemented, it would require that logistics become faster than they currently are, and that assaults become slower than they currently. This would yield the following ranking of speed <--> EHP, where 1 is high speed and 5 is high EHP Scout Logistics Assault Commando Sentinel TL:DR - Speed changes would be required for the mass based system to make sense with the current EHP values of the suits as they are. We won't be returning to Slayer logis if they get a little faster. What it will likely mean is that logis will be able to rep more classes than just a heavy because they can keep up. Is that a fully laden logi, or a European logi?
Imp Smash molon labe. General Tso's Alliance 411	Posted - 2014.11.20 04:21:00 - [99] - Quote Yeah, like most other commenters I have to say shields should have no strafing penalty -- this coming from an Amarr Assault armor tanker. I still don't get the thing about Heavies and strafing though. They can't strafe as it is. Giant hit boxes. I've HAD heavies sit there and try to strafe like scouts -- and dodge almost none of the bullets. So, color me confused as to how they fit into this...
Jacques Cayton II Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1118	Posted - 2014.11.20 04:54:00 - [100] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: DeathwindRising wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: HP modules, as in, shield extenders and armor plating? im assuming only for armor plates, as extenders dont have movement penalties extender stacking is also under the scope Wtf their will be NO shield tanking fck this planetside 2 We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals

Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8521	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:35:00 - [101] - Quote Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. Its also important to note that while general movement should be Minmatar and faster in every aspect but the Gallente do specialize in MWDs and Micro Jump Drives. Dust 514s equivalent is the Kinetic Catalyzer. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound RISE of LEGION 2202	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:37:00 - [102] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. So what if we simply buff Gallente and leave Caldari where they are? Proof that Rattati/CCP do listen to the playerbase.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8521	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:41:00 - [103] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. So what if we simply buff Gallente and leave Caldari where they are? That could also work and is a lot better than slowing them down anymore. Barely anymore Movement speed but a focus on Sprint speed. Have it very ambush oriented. That idea is a lot better in fact, but one thing is for sure that shield extenders should absolutely not ever slow you down when it comes to speed. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1242	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:51:00 - [104] - Quote extenders have no penalties in eve, they should have no penalties here, this is the dumbest thing ive ever heard, i dont even use shields. theyre completely broken cause they dont rep passively. strafing is a skill. why are we trying to nerf it. if anything there needs to be an inertia modifier which eve has. why are we doing things that arent in eve. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1242	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:55:00 - [105] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. So what if we simply buff Gallente and leave Caldari where they are? That could also work and is a lot better than slowing them down anymore. Barely anymore Movement speed but a focus on Sprint speed. Have it very ambush oriented. That idea is a lot better in fact, but one thing is for sure that shield extenders should absolutely not ever slow you down when it comes to speed. this. all suits should already have different base speeds based on race. but gallente arent ambushers, unless you mean caldari. gallente are run straight at you head on'ers. i swear who comes up with these ideas. we need to pitch in and buy a month long subscription and teach them how eve works. the depleted regen delay penalty is already wrong enough and needs to go. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Kensai Dragon DUST University Ivy League 91	Posted - 2014.11.20 05:57:00 - [106] - Quote Auris Lionesse wrote: extenders have no penalties in eve, they should have no penalties here, this is the dumbest thing ive ever heard, i dont even use shields. theyre completely broken cause they dont rep passively. *strafing is a skill.* why are we trying to nerf it. if anything there needs to be an inertia modifier which eve has. why are we doing things that arent in eve. ROFL! WHAT? LOL
Kensai Dragon DUST University Ivy League 91	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:00:00 - [107] - Quote Shields should carry some kind of balancing penalty, not sure it should be speed though. The increased sig radius in eve, is that the equivalent to hit box or profile in Dust?
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8523	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:04:00 - [108] - Quote Auris Lionesse wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. So what if we simply buff Gallente and leave Caldari where they are? That could also work and is a lot better than slowing them down anymore. Barely anymore Movement speed but a focus on Sprint speed. Have it very ambush oriented. That idea is a lot better in fact, but one thing is for sure that shield extenders should absolutely not ever slow you down when it comes to speed. this. all suits should already have different base speeds based on race. but gallente arent ambushers, unless you mean caldari. gallente are run straight at you head on'ers. i swear who comes up with these ideas. we need to pitch in and buy a month long subscription and teach them how eve works. the depleted regen delay penalty is already wrong enough and needs to go. Well things can be slightly different on the ground than in DUST. Yeah, in EVE we can be straight in and gun but in space there is also no cover to utilize like you would in EVE. We also do not have the choice to use railguns and drones. Whilst in DUST, we are stuck in close range with no utilization of long range weapons (besides the plasma cannon that can hit about 200 meters out ) I also play EVE btw and in fact I'm providing Orbital Support for Gallente FW and headed for Esesier right now. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2322	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:04:00 - [109] - Quote Kensai Dragon wrote: Shields should carry some kind of balancing penalty, not sure it should be speed though. The increased sig radius in eve, is that the equivalent to hit box or profile in Dust? Both since it factors into the tracking equation and the scanning equation. PSN: RationalSpark
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1242	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:10:00 - [110] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Auris Lionesse wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Shield Extenders should not decrease speed. What should happen instead is Caldari suits move slower in general similar to how it is in EVE. Not Amarr slow but the way speed works in EVE is: Minmatar, Gallente, Caldari, Amarr. Currently it's like this but Caldari and Gallente are the same speed. So what if we simply buff Gallente and leave Caldari where they are? That could also work and is a lot better than slowing them down anymore. Barely anymore Movement speed but a focus on Sprint speed. Have it very ambush oriented. That idea is a lot better in fact, but one thing is for sure that shield extenders should absolutely not ever slow you down when it comes to speed. this. all suits should already have different base speeds based on race. but gallente arent ambushers, unless you mean caldari. gallente are run straight at you head on'ers. i swear who comes up with these ideas. we need to pitch in and buy a month long subscription and teach them how eve works. the depleted regen delay penalty is already wrong enough and needs to go. Well things can be slightly different on the ground than in DUST. Yeah, in EVE we can be straight in and gun but in space there is also no cover to utilize like you would in EVE. We also do not have the choice to use railguns and drones. Whilst in DUST, we are stuck in close range with no utilization of long range weapons (besides the plasma cannon that can hit about 200 meters out ) I also play EVE btw and in fact I'm providing Orbital Support for Gallente FW and headed for Esesier right now. i think its the devs who dont play or theyd know stuff like this. and i still use railguns on my gal suit. thats what i did in eve and i went 100% rails when they came out in dust. ive been saying for a year now they need to fix the bonuses so gal can use rails with bonuses. and cal can use blasters with bonuses. its another idiosyncrasy with dust. we need eve parity if we want balance. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.

Meeko Fent Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 2106	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:11:00 - [111] - Quote Jadd Hatchen wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: P.S. Medium speeds may get shaken up in light of the Assault HP boost , Logistics may get a speed boost, Commandos as well, Assault speed reduction, all very small. Okay first you state the issue and then you come up with a good plan to fix the issue and they you CREATE A LOOPHOLE THAT NULLIFIES YOUR FIX?????!!!! Seriously if you apply it to only heavies and all mediums except for logistics dropsuits, then guess what players will do? Oh they will return to the days of the logi-slayers! Of course! If you make this change,then make it apply game-wide to all suits. Making exceptions is what breaks the game balance. If it is mass based as you say, then that implies it should be a defining part of the physics in your game and thus Scotty would shame you for trying to break those laws! Shame on you CCP!!! The fix is to stop lolStrafing Scouts from strafing at such great speeds that they can win toe to toe with aware assaults. Because you wanted to be something you're not. A hero. Do you feel like one now?
Meeko Fent Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 2106	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:14:00 - [112] - Quote Can we stop applying EVELogic to DUST? Please? I'm sure the Army's strategy and gear it uses is different in use and philosophy then The navy. Infantry troops and tanks=/= Battleships. Because you wanted to be something you're not. A hero. Do you feel like one now?
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1242	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:16:00 - [113] - Quote Meeko Fent wrote: Can we stop applying EVELogic to DUST? Please? I'm sure the Army's strategy and gear it uses is different in use and philosophy then The navy. Infantry troops and tanks=/= Battleships. no. look in the top left corner. this is eve:dust 514. same rules. same logic. same universe. same lore. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Imp Smash molon labe. General Tso's Alliance 414	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:22:00 - [114] - Quote It's impractical to apply every feature to a FPS that you have in a point and click MMO. We are going to have to break tradition a LITTLE or the game will be impossible. TLDR (because that may be too long to read); Apply lore when you can. Ignore lore when you can't.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8523	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:26:00 - [115] - Quote Auris Lionesse wrote: Meeko Fent wrote: Can we stop applying EVELogic to DUST? Please? I'm sure the Army's strategy and gear it uses is different in use and philosophy then The navy. Infantry troops and tanks=/= Battleships. no. look in the top left corner. this is eve:dust 514. same rules. same logic. same universe. same lore. It's Meeko's kind of Comments are what make me facepalm hard. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1244	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:31:00 - [116] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Auris Lionesse wrote: Meeko Fent wrote: Can we stop applying EVELogic to DUST? Please? I'm sure the Army's strategy and gear it uses is different in use and philosophy then The navy. Infantry troops and tanks=/= Battleships. no. look in the top left corner. this is eve:dust 514. same rules. same logic. same universe. same lore. It's Meeko's kind of Comments are what make me facepalm hard. the worst comment ive seen is some newberry saying hes never played eve and doesnt care about it because its probably some stupid game and doesnt have anything to do with dust and that dust should be balanced completely seperate of eve. i about put my head through the computer screen and if im being honest i almost filed a ticket requesting he be banned. i lingered over the send button longer than i care to admit before i closed the window without sending it. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2322	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:34:00 - [117] - Quote This discussion is honestly reminding me of the multi-thread multi-page battles we had back in the Mordu's forums. I think one of the punchlines from those bone-crushing forum battles was realistic physics is nice but it messes with what many peeps expect from an FPS. Personally i love torque and rotational inertia, but that kind of realism sucks for kb/m players. It's not a matter of right or wrong it's a question of what do we want the game to be? Right at the core of that question lies strafing/bunnyhopping and gungame. Some need it to make the game have any meaning at all as a competitive shooter, some despise it as unrealistic and ridiculous. It's a fundamental culture clash that can't be resolved to everyones' satisfaction. But strafing/gungame does require genuine player skill. Anybody who can't admit this is in deep denial. DUST, because it is designed as an asymmetric shooter with passive skills and tiered gear, only serves to further exacerbate the culture clash between these groups. Forget the lore and rationalizations. Rattai is proposing a tradeoff: more ehp means less strafe, end of story. Is this acceptable? For me the answer is yes, so long as the effect isn't too big. PSN: RationalSpark
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2324	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:40:00 - [118] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Dear Players, We are going to add separate strafe penalties to HP modules. We will not be reducing normal speed, nor running speed, only left-right speed, making the "dodging" of bullets more difficult, and Sentinels lack of mobility to become a real vulnerability when stacking eHP. The calculations will theoretically be based off of relative mass (Scouts) and total mass (Sentinels). Medium Frames will not be affected as much as these two. Basic Frames may end up not having any penalties at all. This is quite blunt, but it's been a long time coming. Extenders and Armor Plates are obviously the focus here, and Reactives and Ferroscales may be omitted in the first pass. P.S. Medium speeds may get shaken up in light of the Assault HP boost , Logistics may get a speed boost, Commandos as well, Assault speed reduction, all very small. My bolding. Relative mass/total mass is your funny way of saying F=ma, right? PSN: RationalSpark
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1244	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:41:00 - [119] - Quote Imp Smash wrote: It's impractical to apply every feature to a FPS that you have in a point and click MMO. We are going to have to break tradition a LITTLE or the game will be impossible. TLDR (because that may be too long to read); Apply lore when you can. Ignore lore when you can't. its not impractical its integeral. btw dust is supposed to be an 'mmo'fps eve has established mechanics that work. dust is the same game as eve. eves mechanics should apply everywhere. as long as the numbers are right everything needs to be on par with eve. the only difference between dust and eve is that eve has 8 guns instead of 1. thats a fair trade off when we can control the 1. everything else is 100% applicable and required to be present for this game to be a part of new eden. otherwise change the name, cut out all the descriptions and words linking it to eve. and just call it call of warfare dutyfield. new eden has rules and standards that must be followed. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.
Auris Lionesse Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 1244	Posted - 2014.11.20 06:45:00 - [120] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: This discussion is honestly reminding me of the multi-thread multi-page battles we had back in the Mordu's forums. I think one of the punchlines from those bone-crushing forum battles was realistic physics is nice but it messes with what many peeps expect from an FPS. Personally i love torque and rotational inertia, but that kind of realism sucks for kb/m players. It's not a matter of right or wrong it's a question of what do we want the game to be? Right at the core of that question lies strafing/bunnyhopping and gungame. Some need it to make the game have any meaning at all as a competitive shooter, some despise it as unrealistic and ridiculous. It's a fundamental culture clash that can't be resolved to everyones' satisfaction. But strafing/gungame does require genuine player skill. Anybody who can't admit this is in deep denial. DUST, because it is designed as an asymmetric shooter with passive skills and tiered gear, only serves to further exacerbate the culture clash between these groups. Forget the lore and rationalizations. Rattai is proposing a tradeoff: more ehp means less strafe, end of story. Is this acceptable? For me the answer is yes, so long as the effect isn't too big. its acceptable for armor plates and reactives but i dont like it. its unacceptable for ferroscales or extenders. its just not how new eden works. this is only an issue because light suits can stack the same health mods as a medium or heavy suit while retaining higher speed. ideally theyd have their own subdivision of light plates. just as frigates do. Don't vote for iron wolf saber. Vote for someone who will help the community i.e. anyone else.



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