I support restricting logos to a sidearm.......but here's an alternative rather lengthy but would add a little more diversity


Make a medium weapon class......this would include mass drivers.....sniper rifles......swarm launchers......scrambler rifles....and the new rifles


All suits can use medium weapons but logistics suits

Future suits could limit weapons in this manner

I.e. a scout suit that can't use medium weapons but in turn is faster and more durable....or a heavy that is the same(faster than a commando but with 1000hp but can only use light weapons


There's a lot that it could open up

If that doesn't do the trick, then consider a minimum CPU total for equipment on proto suits to something like 100 CPU. Any proto logi worth his salt has at least that much equipment on his suit. Reduced figures could be set for advanced and standard logi suits.

I agree with you, but what about Gallente Logistics?

They could probably squeeze less CPU/PG than that because of the reduction they have to equipment.

Well HERE IT IS , a balancing idea im pretty sure ALL Logis will agree on, without the need to loose the right to use a Light weapon.
please read and comment.

BTW, sidearm only logis is not a very good idea thou... :3

Let me preface this thread by saying I want to discuss this idea, how it would affect the logi class, how it would be implemented, etc. If you disagree with the argument, I would urge you to explain why, because if you simply write, "lol this is a bad idea," then I will simply read it as, "pwease don't take away my crutch!"

Also, I'd like to throw out some stipulations before I make my own argument. First, Amarr logi's, in this situation, would receive only a single light weapon. Second, I would not expect CCP to implement this idea until there have been AT LEAST three more sidearms released for us to use, so that not every logi is running a Winmatar SMG.


Alright, so let me start with the implications. What would happen if every logi had to run a sidearm at this exact moment from now on? Well, I imagine that most logissaults would come to the forums to cry, and to be fair to them, it is a very drastic change, so a respec might be justified in this situation. (when I say respec, I mean specifically SP taken out of logi dropsuit command skills, and nothing else.) All pure logistics players, on the other hand, would also likely come to the forums to complain that their light weapon skills are now useless to them, so a respec specifically in the light weapons tree would also be justified. The logistics class as a whole would become more vulnerable, but not actually useless, there are people that run dual sidearms despite having a light weapon slot because they WANT to, I imagine logi's will still be able to defend themselves in CQC. Outside of CQC, of course, they would be shooting practice, so logi's that currently run lone-wolf mode(myself included) would be encouraged to stick close to team-mates to keep them safe over long distance combat.

Overall, it means that logi's can still combat, but not as effectively as assault players.


As for how it would be implemented, I would expect a few buffs to help the logi out with this extreme change. First, the maximum amount of equipment carried should be increased to five, so that Amarr/Caldari would get four slots at the proto tier, and Minmatar/Gallente would get five at proto. Obviously, this is strengthening the logistics role. Second, logi speed should be buffed to be exactly at level with assault, currently logi speed is about 5% below assault. This would allow logi's to keep pace with their assault brethren, so that they don't get left in the dust trying to keep up with a group. Lastly, stamina and stamina regeneration would be buffed to an area somewhere between assaults and scouts. Logistics suits will need to be mobile to cope with the new change, and this will help tremendously.

Overall, it makes the logistics class more logisctic-y.


So let's talk about the other classes and how they might be affected by this difference. Assault suits would become more popular, because a large majority of assault players are currently residing in god-mode logistics suits. Heavy suits would come out of hiding if they thought there was a high chance that they would find a logi bro in most games, and scouts would be pretty much the same. I think removal of the assault suit's equipment slots would be appropriate, to make logistics player more needed on the battlefield, and it would be wise to increase the scout's equipment max to two so that nanohives don't become too rare.

Overall, I'd say the other classes would be happy not getting outperformed in every way by the logi.


My TL;DR: Yes, I am advocating that the logistics class should get only a sidearm. If you didn't read the thread and just scrolled down here to get a quick version, then suck it up and read the rest of my post. Constructive criticism is welcomed if you actually have a reasonable argument, like I said before, don't give me a "lolno," because it makes you look like a crutch-using tool.

Well HERE IT IS , a balancing idea im pretty sure ALL Logis will agree on, without the need to loose the right to use a Light weapon.
please read and comment.

BTW, sidearm only logis is not a very good idea thou... :3

The logistics class if fine where it is.

Sure it can preform the tasks of all roles, but it can't do so at the same time .

And why does everyone assume that logistics should only be in the back repping and resupplying everyone.

Run with literally nothing but ONE sidearms for 2 weeks and see how well you perform.

This argument is idiotic and not worth explaining in vast amounts of detail

Then limit light weapon slots to light weapons and heavy slots to heavy weapons. Hey, while we're at it, make all module slots specific to a certain module. Let's kill all of the sandbox character creation ideas behind Dust 514 and shove each suit into cookie cutter fits. You see my point?

So your idea is to take a class that is designed on the idea of trading base stats and offensive capabilities for equipment and customization instead of completely ignoring the core issues that make anything other than shield extenders and armor plates completely useless? Ask yourself a serous question, would you put 5 levels into any of those 4 logistics suits?

I'll miss my plasma cannon on my logi suit

nope you are comparing apples to arseholes

This whole logi vs assault thing started over the idea that logis can remove their equipment and get extra tank to be a better assault. If that's the case, why hasn't anyone complained about heavies with ARs. The get the extra tank and a sidearm.

First off, I do not Logi.

Second, I think it would be a bad idea to take away the Logi self defense ablity. It's not the Logi being able to use a light weapon, it's the Logis that choose to stack DMG mods and maybe a few armour plates that are the problem(nyan san or whatever they are called...cough)

Not make DMG mods have a really large stacking penalty and or make it so they draw even more CPU/PG. The guys that are skipping equipment and throwing only dmg mods on proto weapons are going to get real Logis nerfed(as they already did once)

I can see making a type-2 suit and giving it two sidearm slots but I can not see taking away light weapons.

''So your idea is to take a class that is designed on the idea of trading base stats and offensive capabilities for equipment and customization instead ''
THis phrase is complete bull:
GÖª Trading base stats? Ok i would take that as a good reasoning,but at the moment the differences in ''base stats' are minimal. take away 40 total EHP, and 1 SPRT speed from all logis ad THEN say you are trading base stats.
GÖªOffensive capabilities? While its true 3 out of 4 logis LAC sidearm, the fat the can equip 3-4 compelx damage mods and STILL be able to have over 700 HP is proof they are not lacking in offensive capabilities as many ''dont nerf my cruch''-logis claim.
So overall. Base stats differences are minimal, Logis have more offensive capabilities, DPS wise. AND get more Equipment and Customization.

'' Ask yourself a serous question, would you put 5 levels into any of those 4 logistics suits?''
Well yeah. I would.I made that post with this on Mind actually.
Whats the big deal? You are trading 1 slot for better equipment and Better Logi bonuses.

The fact people are disgusted with the idea proves most logis just want slots to assault/tank,and make me wonder if we really DO deserve a visit from the good old Nerf hammer. Punishment for being close minded selfish basterds....

I've often thought to myself (without expressing it until now) that Logistics having only a sidearm would be fair, so I agree here. Also I agree on increasing their speed and stamina and equipment slots; all sounds like a fair trade-off, and more importantly, sounds much more like the Logistics class should be. The loss of a light weapon (I don't agree with Amarr being allowed to keep one; maybe give them two Sidearm slots instead of one) and slight loss of base HP in exchange for more equipment would also seem to make sense from an in-game design standpoint (though between the Commando and Scout, I wonder if in-game logic is that sound to begin with...).

Using EVE for analogy: as far as I understand it, EVE logistics ships are not (possibly never) used as assault ships; it's almost impossible to use them more successfully than a ship intended for pure combat, so why should Dust's support class be any different?

There's no facts, just a bunch of people sitting back and playing armchair developer, looking at spread sheets and pretending they know everything. With your proposed changes, nobody would play logistics, including the ones that play it to support their team. It completely destroys any survivability the suit needs to help their team on the front lines.

In EVE, Caldari are about as slow as Amarr, if not slower. See if any Caldari assault want to waddle around at the speed of a heavy.

There's no facts, just a bunch of people sitting back and playing armchair developer, looking at spread sheets and pretending they know everything. With your proposed changes, nobody would play logistics, including the ones that play it to support their team. It completely destroys any survivability the suit needs to help their team on the front lines.

Have you ever used a sidearm as a primary??? cause let me tell you they are powerful as ****, your only limitation is range, which is a non issue if you are moving with a group as support, your group takes a lot of heat and you can still be as deadly as the guy next to you, you need to kill some one to pick a team mate up you can still do that.

If sidearms are so strong then, how would this fix anything at all. If they are just as viable as lights this wouldn't fix anything.

You want facts? The Logi suit is OP. It needs a NERF,not even a gentle rebalance like the one i proposed.

you want Facts?
After watching most videos regarding the Squad tournament; 90% Of the players were using Pro Logi suits.
The Highest amount of proto suits is, guess what? yeah LOGI suits.

and believe me, ITS NOT BECAUSE ALL OF THEM ARE SUPPORT.
LOL no, Most of them are using them as modded Scouts, Or Assaults with more HP and the capacity to spam uplings and carry A.Scanners at the same time.


The suit is broken and its sad that people hold on to their ''crutch'' so tightly...

You want facts? The Logi suit is OP. It needs a NERF,not even a gentle rebalance like the one i proposed.

you want Facts?
After watching most videos regarding the Squad tournament; 90% Of the players were using Pro Logi suits.
The Highest amount of proto suits is, guess what? yeah LOGI suits.

and believe me, ITS NOT BECAUSE ALL OF THEM ARE SUPPORT.
LOL no, Most of them are using them as modded Scouts, Or Assaults with more HP and the capacity to spam uplings and carry A.Scanners at the same time.


The suit is broken and its sad that people hold on to their ''crutch'' so tightly...

You call it a crutch. Maybe it is for those that wish to abuse the class. But most of the hubbub out there refers to the so-called "Assault' Logi. But instead of addressing the real issue, it is 'cut off the head of all Logis' to cure the cancer. That is beyond foolish.

The key to pushing Logistics back to where it was intended is not about nerfing the suit, it is about enhancing Assault to a place that makes it the preferred platform for frontline combat. Give it the bonuses it deserves to fight the good fight and make modules like Damages Mods, less effective to keep them the premiere warfighter.

Weak Logi does not equal balance or even strong Assault. It just equals weak support for all classes. And every team is only as strong as the weakest link.

#ThinkAboutIt

You call it a crutch. Maybe it is for those that wish to abuse the class. But most of the hubbub out there refers to the so-called "Assault' Logi. But instead of addressing the real issue, it is 'cut off the head of all Logis' to cure the cancer. That is beyond foolish.

The key to pushing Logistics back to where it was intended is not about nerfing the suit, it is about enhancing Assault to a place that makes it the preferred platform for frontline combat. Give it the bonuses it deserves to fight the good fight and make modules like Damages Mods, less effective to keep them the premiere warfighter.

Weak Logi does not equal balance or even strong Assault. It just equals weak support for all classes. And every team is only as strong as the weakest link.

#ThinkAboutIt