CeoPyrex is now using an AR...so now there is no question that AR is the FOTM.

See I don't need math either!

See, this whole time everyones been begging not to have their gun nerfed. But somehow AR users, despite being the most used, most powerful, jack and master of all trades, along with plenty of forum posts to back this with math the AR has managed to dodge every nerf. In fact the AR nerf brigade managed to hit everyone else instead. By some miracle CCP has finally started to catch on and begin bringing other guns up to the AR standard. Thanks whoever is responsible for this. You do better work than Obama.

It's true that SMG is a sidearm, but in reality its far better weapon in close range than HMG or AR mainly due to the fact that it's light as hell, usually has very high rate of fire and barely any recoil. Not to mention the fast reloading speed and accuracy. Against shotgun it's 50/50.

It's just that the effective range isn't something to brag about against AR.

I don't think sidearms should be considered somehow inferior to primary weapons. They are more or less just lightweight close range weapons.

AR'S won't just be AR's soon enough, within the next couple of updates you'll have minmatar combar rifle, and the caldari rail rifle, as well as the Amar ??? rifle. They aren't gunna spend the time to nerf it right now, they have other things that are more important right now, like fixing all the vehicles, getting all the other racial suits in, and adding the rest of the racial weapons

I'm not argueing that they are or aren't op i'm just stating that you won't just have the AR anymore.

Firstly using math as the a prominent variable to balance weapons is just lol

OP play consistent PC and then get back to me on weapon balance

I used math so... yeah.


the fact that ARs are pretty much the only weapon used in PC proves more than enough.

I did with 1arm. the facts hold true. but how about this since a militia AR can do everything i mentioned how about a duvolle?

Do you even do PC?

Mass Drivers
HMGs
Scrambler Rifles
Sniper Rifles
Tanks

All of them are used and just one of each can make a MASSIVE difference in a battle.

Do you even do PC?

Mass Drivers
HMGs
Scrambler Rifles
Sniper Rifles
Tanks

All of them are used and just one of each can make a MASSIVE difference in a battle.

None of this even matters.

PC is played by a minority. Dust is bleeding players pretty substantially. This is partly due to the fact that, in the game most players actually see, the AR is stupidly easy and definitely OP.

That's pretty much the long and short of it. AR 514 needs to end if Dust is to succeed.

I whole heartedly Agree. OR we can reduce of the price of the UP weapons so that I can being using proto versions of UP weaponry. because TBH

• PROTO HMG is where the STD should be
• PROTO flaylocks are where the STD should be
• PROTO shoguns are where the ADV should be
• PROTO plasma cannons are where the STD should be
• PROTO flux grenades are where the STD should be. (i mean really who uses proto flux?)
• PROTO MD are where the ADV should be...

basically, the AR from STD level is already on par with many proto weapons, at ADV it surpasses these weapons...

AR noobs always talk about niche. Why does the AR excel in these weapons niches? Why is it that the AR can functinon outside its niche?

the GAR's niche is high rate of fire, low damage, low range... and yet it excels at long range combat with high damage per shot. its better than the burst, breach and TAC combined.

the TAC AR is better than the Scambler considering that with a scrambler you can only fire 15 shots before an overheat...

You are right that the AR operates outside its designed role of a high DPS weapon with low Range. But I guess this will change once the other Assault Rifles will be included. Right now the AR is balanced againt the AsCR (or the other way round) and both weapons operate nearly identical (wich is stupid).

BTW I think the GAR will should be more a medium ROF and Medium to High Damage weapon as I believe the low Damage High Rof part will be filled by the minmatar weapons.

Regarding your list I would only agree to the Shotgun and the Plasma Cannon these weapons are way to weak. Not so sure about the flaylock....

Regarding the TAC AR I disagree the Scrambler Rifle is far better than the TAC AR and barely anyone is using the TAC anymore. The key succes for the Scramber is to know how the overheating mechanic work and the Charged Shot is really nice but difficult to use. The only thing that keeps the Scrambler from beeing as OP as the old TAC AR is the overheating mechanic.

Just on a sidenote the Amarr Rifles do operate uotside their role as well as they have nearly identical or much higher dps that the high DPS weapons (to be fair they don't have the Range advantage they should have so it's sorta balanced but wrong).

everyone should die to every weapon in its niche. there is no such thing as a weapon being too good at its job.

You see AR guys have a problem where if they don't a gun or its function the QQ OP. flaylocks worked perfectly fine. ARs still had way more kills. in fact at its hight the flaylock still only ranked 6th on the list of guns with kills... still below SMGs.

wat

That runs completely against everything you're saying here. You're saying that the AR is too good at general killing, then that there's no such thing as being too good?

You see AR guys have a problem where if they don't a gun or its function the QQ OP. flaylocks worked perfectly fine. ARs still had way more kills. in fact at its hight the flaylock still only ranked 6th on the list of guns with kills... still below SMGs.

[quote=Arkena Wyrnspire][quote=D legendary hero]
the GARs niche is high rate of fire, low damage, low range. So, it should not be insta dropping heavies at 66m range.
So, yeah. it should be good at what its designed to do.

Its not designed to out gun HMGs. so, like I said its OP. no weapon can be too good at what its designed to do. But, you must then look at what its purpose or design is which will balance it.

General purpose, means lack of effectivity in specific areas. so, when niche comes verses general niche should win hands down (in the niche's area of course).

See CCP wolfman's dev blog on the patch for that it spoke about explosives balancing. Again, if you are not going to READ my comments do NOT respond. Several times I mentioned that the RoF was too high. but, at the same time the flaylock was fine. Why?

• People were using proto flaylocks, with 2 side arm damage modifiers, all their kills were close range kills.
• most people who used them were scouts (with the broken speed mechanic), and caldari logistics (have we all forgot about the caldari logis with more ehp than heavies could dream?)

If you used the ARs extended range the flaylocks would have been no problem. but, AR guys just rush.

And com'on man I cant respect anyone in this game who complains about splash damage. splash weapons have a trajectory and hit detection/latency issues affect them the most. or lest we forget when direct hits where impossible because rounds would go right through people.

non splash weapons are literal hit scans that instantly hit any target from any range. and AR hipfire is so accuracte you practically don't have to aim if the enemy is 20m away or closer.
AR is an instant application of dps from 0-88m. starting from 467 maxing out around 670+ dps. which is so easily applied its crazy.

zero respect man, zero respect.

None of this even matters.

PC is played by a minority. Dust is bleeding players pretty substantially. This is partly due to the fact that, in the game most players actually see, the AR is stupidly easy and definitely OP.

That's pretty much the long and short of it. AR 514 needs to end if Dust is to succeed.

It doesn't outgun HMGs, in their range.
And it doesn't insta-drop heavies at 66m. At that range, the DPS of a triple damage modded, high proficiency Balac's is less than 300 - if all of those shots land. Even militia assaults have more than that.



The flaylock does not have a trajectory. It flies straight and explodes after approximately sixty metres.
Direct hits weren't a concern when splash damage did almost the same damage as a direct hit.

I'm not really sure how something being accurate means you don't have to aim it - of course you still have to aim it, you're just more likely to hit with it if you aim it properly. Oh, and a six metre wide explosion requires much less aiming than a hitscan weapon.

The optimal range of the AR is 40m. After that the damage drops severely.
So no, it's not as simple as instantly applying that DPS at those ranges. At 88m the damage is negligible and if you get killed by it you deserved it or were wearing a scout suit. That DPS is not 'so easily applied its crazy' at that range, not even close. And neither is it anywhere near those figures you quoted.

I have zero respect for you either if you need a six metre wide explosion to hit anything within 60m.

after playing dust 514 for several days straight the ar really isnt op.

mass driver will destroy it at close range and laser rifle can destroy it at longer ranges.

so can assault scrambler rifle.


thats is pretty much it and the math being done here to use as evidence of the ar being op is basically stupid.


this thread just needs to die as several other guns r better or if not equal to the assault rifles killing potential.

the stats alone are stupid i think it all comes down to player skill. with the ar. no need to nerf it currently.

and off topic here.
has any else noticed the base damage of the scrambler pistol being buffed from 72 to 80 damage per shot?


and now back on topic.

the ar has more recoil than all of the other guns in the game much much more recoil.

after playing dust 514 for several days straight the ar really isnt op.

mass driver will destroy it at close range and laser rifle can destroy it at longer ranges.

so can assault scrambler rifle.


thats is pretty much it and the math being done here to use as evidence of the ar being op is basically stupid.


this thread just needs to die as several other guns r better or if not equal to the assault rifles killing potential.

the stats alone are stupid i think it all comes down to player skill. with the ar. no need to nerf it currently.

and off topic here.
has any else noticed the base damage of the scrambler pistol being buffed from 72 to 80 damage per shot?


and now back on topic.

the ar has more recoil than all of the other guns in the game much much more recoil.

i claim the damage mods added to the md make it op so stfu...

but then again i hate on all the damage mod lovers out there...


so stop bringing up stupid things i dont even remember happening.

mass driver didnt need any massive nerfing in damage or other stuff what it did need was a nerf in the rate of fire for it.

now stop stalking me...

those posts r centuries old so its really stupid to bring it up.

The basic assault rifle does 34.0 damage per shot. It fires at a rate of 750 RPM.
The DPS of this weapon, assuming every shot hits, is 425....

Mass Driver

Damage per shot is 242, direct hit, or 116, splash hit. It fires at 60 RPM. ThatGÇÖs 1 shot per second, or 242 DPS direct, 116 DPS splash.

It's public information on a web forum, far from stalking, it's called using facts. I like to do that instead of talking about trees, flowers and feelings when giving feedback on here. Here's some more facts about the MD's DPS:

Source


AR has ~183 of a DPS advantage over the MD, and that's based off direct hit damage. Splash damage, it's a difference of ~309. What were you saying about nerfing the MD's ROF again?