DUST Search - GAME DESTROYING: Separating Players by Controller Type Is Completely Unacceptable

Kain Spero wrote:

Alderstaz wrote:

The whole reason for playing an FPS on a console is that everyone is on same playing field.

I've noticed issues with small subset of fights where I can't get a single shot in out of more than one Gek 38 clip. It couldn't be lag because there are no other issues in same match. Its mostly happens with a hopper, and I never get a single shot in( I'm on chest, never get red cross hair). I always assumed it was some back end flaw in update priority due to it happening usually with squadded/corp players. Now I assume the invincible players are good KBM players and there IS some kind of sync issue. I know a good player when I fight one, I'm not talking about them. These are weird fights. Happens rarely. But too often with squad/corp player to be just random internet gods issue.

CCP already has the hard data on KBM users, that's why they are giving a heads up...

They should do it old style, give a check box on type of match we want.

My preferences:(by default, nothing changes)
[X] - Complete match only
[X] - Dual axis controller only
[X] - No HAV
[X] - No Dropships
[ ] - No LAV
[ ] - No Aur items in fittings

My vehicle issue is due to balance/exploit issues, I would eventually allow them in my matches I assume.

I'm not OK with dying to Killswitch fitted Scouts strafe jumping all over, but at least it increases the ISK reward. So many of them since new level 3 Aur proto suits.

And lastly, for someone who played FPS on PC before PS3/Xbox was out, nothing beats the control advantage of KBM. If it were not for the fact that you cannot re-assign keys and bad/missing defaults, the console shock controller players would be crying.
Also I'm guessing, due to same reason as us, we don't have a KBM capable area. Like most PS3 owners, I assume.

No, just no. We are all in this sandbox together. The last thing we need is putting up artificial walls between each other. The community is one of the most vital aspects of this game. The game is what brings you in, but its the community that makes you stay.

Anything that tries to divide up the community it something that will hurt the success of this game.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
IRuby Heart DIOS EX. 361	Posted - 2013.03.01 22:16:00 - [91] - Quote I want this thread to hit 100+ replies. I know CCP Is already listening but I want them to know we're serious about this.
Beld Errmon Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 485	Posted - 2013.03.01 22:20:00 - [92] - Quote CCP Cmdr Wang wrote: We are also planning to introduce Matchmaking improvemtns that will take controller input into account. This is the most idiotic idea ever, currently your match maker system is doing a pathetic job of balancing, it can't even do something basic like making sure that 3 corporate squads don't get stacked on one side against 16 randoms, your going to completely Fing break it trying to do crap like this.
Bald Crusader Two Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2013.03.01 22:32:00 - [93] - Quote slap26 wrote: Why would they split up a small playerbase even more, another CCP flop This basically. More poor design choices.
DJINN leukoplast Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 304	Posted - 2013.03.01 22:58:00 - [94] - Quote I would like to know who plays with kb/m, and if they are any better than somebody of equal talent using a DS3. This is a console game first and foremost, and if kb/m gives a massive advantage against those of us with analog sticks, then it should be dealt with accordingly. However I kinda doubt it makes that much of a difference, and I honestly can't tell who in the game uses a DS3, Move, or kb/m. And unless there is a ton of players using kb/m, splitting us up would be devastating for them.
Monkxx Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 22	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:04:00 - [95] - Quote I am KB/M user and I bought PS3 only for Dust514. I can't handle the controller so I am using kb/m setup I am familiar with. In my corp people are playing with controllers and go 16-0 with ARs and Assault Suits. Adding KB/M icon would be great but separating community? It is a big NO-NO.
AWZX Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 5	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:04:00 - [96] - Quote DJINN leukoplast wrote: I would like to know who plays with kb/m, and if they are any better than somebody of equal talent using a DS3. This is a console game first and foremost, and if kb/m gives a massive advantage against those of us with analog sticks, then it should be dealt with accordingly. However I kinda doubt it makes that much of a difference, and I honestly can't tell who in the game uses a DS3, Move, or kb/m. And unless there is a ton of players using kb/m, splitting us up would be devastating for them. I played a lot of MAG with the same people in my corp. MAG was Dualshock and Move only, no kb/m. A lot of people with better KDRs than me on MAG still have better than me on Dust. People with similar KDRs with me on MAG are similar on Dust. There's a mix of DS3 and kb/m usage in these people, no real correlation or trend between KDR and input scheme as far as I can see. It's really more about preference and what a player feels best with using more than anything else. (disclaimer: this does not mean KDR is everything, it's just using a constant stat for comparison purposes)
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2305	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:08:00 - [97] - Quote lol good luck finding games fast now.......GG
Alderstaz Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 3	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:13:00 - [98] - Quote The whole reason for playing an FPS on a console is that everyone is on same playing field. I've noticed issues with small subset of fights where I can't get a single shot in out of more than one Gek 38 clip. It couldn't be lag because there are no other issues in same match. Its mostly happens with a hopper, and I never get a single shot in( I'm on chest, never get red cross hair). I always assumed it was some back end flaw in update priority due to it happening usually with squadded/corp players. Now I assume the invincible players are good KBM players and there IS some kind of sync issue. I know a good player when I fight one, I'm not talking about them. These are weird fights. Happens rarely. But too often with squad/corp player to be just random internet gods issue. CCP already has the hard data on KBM users, that's why they are giving a heads up... They should do it old style, give a check box on type of match we want. My preferences:(by default, nothing changes) [X] - Complete match only [X] - Dual axis controller only [X] - No HAV [X] - No Dropships [ ] - No LAV [ ] - No Aur items in fittings My vehicle issue is due to balance/exploit issues, I would eventually allow them in my matches I assume. I'm not OK with dying to Killswitch fitted Scouts strafe jumping all over, but at least it increases the ISK reward. So many of them since new level 3 Aur proto suits. And lastly, for someone who played FPS on PC before PS3/Xbox was out, nothing beats the control advantage of KBM. If it were not for the fact that you cannot re-assign keys and bad/missing defaults, the console shock controller players would be crying. Also I'm guessing, due to same reason as us, we don't have a KBM capable area. Like most PS3 owners, I assume.
BlG MAMA PLAYSTATION4 0	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:29:00 - [99] - Quote Seems reasonable to me , Kb/M is a huge advantage over DS3 , i know , i used DS3 then switched to Kb/M and now i understand all those people with 25/0 kills or more. CCP also needs to separate AURUM users from regular users. Thats another huge advantage with all the good damage weapons over ISK weapons. Just imagine...AURUM+KB/M users against regular people using DS3 is just game breaking. Regular people will stop playing the game and in the end Dust will become a game only for AURUM users and kb/m users. Might aswell port Dust514 to PC where pay-to-win model is accepted and Kb/M is standard.
Kain Spero Imperfects Negative-Feedback 982	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:29:00 - [100] - Quote Alderstaz wrote: The whole reason for playing an FPS on a console is that everyone is on same playing field. I've noticed issues with small subset of fights where I can't get a single shot in out of more than one Gek 38 clip. It couldn't be lag because there are no other issues in same match. Its mostly happens with a hopper, and I never get a single shot in( I'm on chest, never get red cross hair). I always assumed it was some back end flaw in update priority due to it happening usually with squadded/corp players. Now I assume the invincible players are good KBM players and there IS some kind of sync issue. I know a good player when I fight one, I'm not talking about them. These are weird fights. Happens rarely. But too often with squad/corp player to be just random internet gods issue. CCP already has the hard data on KBM users, that's why they are giving a heads up... They should do it old style, give a check box on type of match we want. My preferences:(by default, nothing changes) [X] - Complete match only [X] - Dual axis controller only [X] - No HAV [X] - No Dropships [ ] - No LAV [ ] - No Aur items in fittings My vehicle issue is due to balance/exploit issues, I would eventually allow them in my matches I assume. I'm not OK with dying to Killswitch fitted Scouts strafe jumping all over, but at least it increases the ISK reward. So many of them since new level 3 Aur proto suits. And lastly, for someone who played FPS on PC before PS3/Xbox was out, nothing beats the control advantage of KBM. If it were not for the fact that you cannot re-assign keys and bad/missing defaults, the console shock controller players would be crying. Also I'm guessing, due to same reason as us, we don't have a KBM capable area. Like most PS3 owners, I assume. No, just no. We are all in this sandbox together. The last thing we need is putting up artificial walls between each other. The community is one of the most vital aspects of this game. The game is what brings you in, but its the community that makes you stay. Anything that tries to divide up the community it something that will hurt the success of this game.

Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 464	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:34:00 - [101] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Cmdr Wang wrote: We are also planning to introduce Matchmaking improvemtns that will take controller input into account. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=587744#post587744 Do not separate by controller type; you will destroy the game community. This is the dumbest thing, If you want to separate us because of controller type, Here's and idea, Make dust for PC and PS3. Then just put is on separate servers and up the graphics on PC. My PC would own a PS3 anyways... Not a god box, but is a Demi God box.
SILENTSAM 69 Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 427	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:37:00 - [102] - Quote I am against this idea. Even if it is not about balance I am still very much against this idea. Obviously making a squad with a mixed group would likely get you passed this issue, but it just seems wrong to me. I want nothing segregating people. It just feels wrong. I hate the idea of segregation in a game where we can all fight together. It may only be a match making thing, but I don't like anything that seems to separate people in a game like this.
IRuby Heart DIOS EX. 366	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:38:00 - [103] - Quote Imagine your favorite PC Shooter, which is mainly to be played with KBM but can also be played with USB controllers, segregating these players into separate playlists. Yeah, just as stupid.
Panther Alpha Blueberries United 62	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:41:00 - [104] - Quote Is only one thing CCP needs to do ; Remove the Aimbot from the mouse input. Simple solution that won't divide the community. I using the mouse at the moment, and my accuracy with the mouse, combined with the Aimbot.... is a bit to much.
Smitty Werbenjaegerman Jensen Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 10	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:46:00 - [105] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: No, just no. We are all in this sandbox together. The last thing we need is putting up artificial walls between each other. The community is one of the most vital aspects of this game. The game is what brings you in, but its the community that makes you stay. Anything that tries to divide up the community it something that will hurt the success of this game. The same community that flames each other every day, loves to promote AFK SP farming, and cries for nerfs every other post? nods in agreement As far as being in the sandbox together, steroids users were in baseball were in the same sandbox together with non-steroid users. Does that mean they didn't have an advantage and it was no big deal? If so, then why is baseball trying to weed out the steroids? Look, I know Kb/M users may not want to hear it, but there is an advantage. Roommate that couldn't aim to save his life with a DS3, is suddenly raking in a 2.5 kdr as a Kb/M user.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 465	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:48:00 - [106] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: Alderstaz wrote: The whole reason for playing an FPS on a console is that everyone is on same playing field. I've noticed issues with small subset of fights where I can't get a single shot in out of more than one Gek 38 clip. It couldn't be lag because there are no other issues in same match. Its mostly happens with a hopper, and I never get a single shot in( I'm on chest, never get red cross hair). I always assumed it was some back end flaw in update priority due to it happening usually with squadded/corp players. Now I assume the invincible players are good KBM players and there IS some kind of sync issue. I know a good player when I fight one, I'm not talking about them. These are weird fights. Happens rarely. But too often with squad/corp player to be just random internet gods issue. CCP already has the hard data on KBM users, that's why they are giving a heads up... They should do it old style, give a check box on type of match we want. My preferences:(by default, nothing changes) [X] - Complete match only [X] - Dual axis controller only [X] - No HAV [X] - No Dropships [ ] - No LAV [ ] - No Aur items in fittings My vehicle issue is due to balance/exploit issues, I would eventually allow them in my matches I assume. I'm not OK with dying to Killswitch fitted Scouts strafe jumping all over, but at least it increases the ISK reward. So many of them since new level 3 Aur proto suits. And lastly, for someone who played FPS on PC before PS3/Xbox was out, nothing beats the control advantage of KBM. If it were not for the fact that you cannot re-assign keys and bad/missing defaults, the console shock controller players would be crying. Also I'm guessing, due to same reason as us, we don't have a KBM capable area. Like most PS3 owners, I assume. No, just no. We are all in this sandbox together. The last thing we need is putting up artificial walls between each other. The community is one of the most vital aspects of this game. The game is what brings you in, but its the community that makes you stay. Anything that tries to divide up the community it something that will hurt the success of this game. Agreed. We also know that eventually pub matches won't exist, when were fully emerged into eve. How can you limit the sandbox? That would be like saying no titan bridges are unfair so ban them from bridging people on me. Granted there are cyno suppression in systems with correct hub upgrades and I could see that happening, But once the hub is dead, cyno's back on. So ya limiting HAV's ect isn't a choice yet, and may one day be an upgrade, But dude your not going to be in pubs forever, this isn't cod.
Smitty Werbenjaegerman Jensen Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 10	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:53:00 - [107] - Quote Y0UR NAME HERE wrote: But dude your not going to be in pubs forever, this isn't cod. Getting rid of "hot join/pub" games from a console FPS is a faster way to kill this game than to segregate Kb/M support.
Logi Bro ZionTCD Legacy Rising 836	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:58:00 - [108] - Quote Y0UR NAME HERE wrote: We also know that eventually pub matches won't exist, when were fully emerged into eve. Unless CCP is purposely attempting to sabotage their own game, this isn't true. Despite the fact this comes form EvE and has a large "hardcore" fanbase, that doesn't eliminate the fact that it has an even larger "casual" fanbase, and you can't remove pubbies without removing the casual audience. On the topic of the thread, I agree, don't segregate based on controller choice.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 465	Posted - 2013.03.01 23:59:00 - [109] - Quote Smitty Werbenjaegerman Jensen wrote: Y0UR NAME HERE wrote: But dude your not going to be in pubs forever, this isn't cod. Getting rid of "hot join/pub" games from a console FPS is a faster way to kill this game than to segregate Kb/M support. Oh that won't disappear. You'll be in faction warfare. So it'll always be an option, but even in eve faction warfare is all low sec, So there are no hubs to limit things, So everything is fair game.
Priss N6FAA2813 Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:00:00 - [110] - Quote Destroying the community ..............The game is gonna crash.......................... wooo gloom and doom(sarcasm) Because CCP plans on separating people who use the default hardware for a CONSOLE system(ds3) from people who want to use KBM a PC UI.......Thats funny listen to this garbage thread. Go ahead CCP please segregate.You have my full support.

Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 465	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:01:00 - [111] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Y0UR NAME HERE wrote: We also know that eventually pub matches won't exist, when were fully emerged into eve. Unless CCP is purposely attempting to sabotage their own game, this isn't true. Despite the fact this comes form EvE and has a large "hardcore" fanbase, that doesn't eliminate the fact that it has an even larger "casual" fanbase, and you can't remove pubbies without removing the casual audience. On the topic of the thread, I agree, don't segregate based on controller choice. Again faction warfare, You can't limit or change the "pub" type matches. It isn't fair to the eve players to win or lose a system because that system just happens to be "infantry" only pub atm.
Clark Hendrix Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:02:00 - [112] - Quote Just want to show my support for the no segregation side of this argument.
Panther Alpha Blueberries United 62	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:04:00 - [113] - Quote Priss N6FAA2813 wrote: Destroying the community ..............The game is gonna crash.......................... wooo gloom and doom(sarcasm) Because CCP plans on separating people who use the default hardware for a CONSOLE system(ds3) from people who want to use KBM a PC UI.......Thats funny listen to this garbage thread. Go ahead CCP please segregate.You have my full support. The PS3 supports KB/M ... so i say it is very much part of the console. If you don't like it, send a E-mail to Sony and complaint about it.
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Legacy Rising 417	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:04:00 - [114] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Cmdr Wang wrote: We are also planning to introduce Matchmaking improvemtns that will take controller input into account. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=587744#post587744 Do not separate by controller type; you will destroy the game community. +1 Kain. I agree. It's unnecessary and damaging to the community - it basically works against the whole single shard ethos. Many players who use only controllers rock the leaderboards. I feel like you are letting a player misconception push you around, CCP. and personally, as a controller user, i want to face the kb/m mouse peeps. They are sweet, sweet kills ;)
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1223	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:07:00 - [115] - Quote Kain Spero wrote: CCP Cmdr Wang wrote: We are also planning to introduce Matchmaking improvemtns that will take controller input into account. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=587744#post587744 Do not separate by controller type; you will destroy the game community. Agreed.
CLOSEDBETA TSTR-est E3 Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 26	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:09:00 - [116] - Quote Segregate
CLOSEDBETA TSTR-est E3 Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 26	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:10:00 - [117] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: Priss N6FAA2813 wrote: Destroying the community ..............The game is gonna crash.......................... wooo gloom and doom(sarcasm) Because CCP plans on separating people who use the default hardware for a CONSOLE system(ds3) from people who want to use KBM a PC UI.......Thats funny listen to this garbage thread. Go ahead CCP please segregate.You have my full support. The PS3 supports KB/M ... so i say it is very much part of the console. If you don't like it, send a E-mail to Sony and complaint about it. reported for flaming.Please read forum rules
First Prophet Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Zombie Ninja Space Bears 36	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:19:00 - [118] - Quote Here to support the separation of mouse and dualshocks. God have mercy on the unholy abominations that have resulted from inter-controller breeding.
Tidaen Nova Corps Marines 25	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:20:00 - [119] - Quote Separating by controller type is lame. +1 OP
Mr McGrumpypants One-Armed Bandits Orbital Rights 1	Posted - 2013.03.02 00:32:00 - [120] - Quote CCP, please don't try to split us up by controller input. Most people I play with use controllers, NOT the keyboard and mouse. I think separating the players by input (or weighing them differently) is a mistake. Stat-tracking things like KDR, objective taking, and SP are what should define how players are divided up, NOT what method they use to play the game. There are terrific controller players and terrible KB/M players. In addition, right now the inputs are terrible. There's no customization for either input option and they need plenty of work. A lot of pilots right now hate flying with KB/M and I personally found driving completely frustrating with a controller. Cooking grenades on a keyboard seems inconsistent, as I frequently end up just throwing a grenade instead of holding on to it when holding the X key. Aside from the fact I find the X key to be awkward, I pretty much avoid using grenades when playing with KB/M. Selecting spawn points right now is also frustrating on a keyboard because the cursor jumps over any spawn points in the middle of the map and leaps to the last spawn point in a direction. So while playing with a KB/M, I have to pick up my controller and select the spawn point. Menus also need better input for the keyboard/mouse. Right now, I'm sure I'm not the only person who finds themselves switching between control methods on the fly in battle because one control type is buggy or poorly implemented in a given feature. To me, controls in DUST are less about controllers making for poorer aiming than a keyboard/mouse and more about how poorly implemented each control method is for certain things. Fix the problems with your input methods first, worry about whether or not you should segregate controllers and KB/M later. ...Re-reading this post, I'm really tempted to call KB/M users mousers just so I don't have to abbreviate ****. Maybe I'm watching too much TMNT lately.



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