There are some similarities in playstyle to TF2.
The whole rock/paper/scissors game of scout/heavy/sniper and so forth.
Might be worth marketing in that direction a bit.

This game isn't going to be "for" everyone, we know that. But what's there already is deep and rewarding. We'll see.

Dust isn't COD competitor - it's an alternative.
So this game's audience isn't targeted at casual COD teenagers.
This game is for people who wants to shoot people in face, but don't want to play casual games like COD

Problem solved

Actually we don't have a true rock/paper/scissor system.
What we have is a mountain/paper/scissor system.
Statistical advantages/disadvantages are in place and they are impacting heavily on the game BUT a FPS that relies on stats is bad, very bad, because FPS relies almost entirely on player's skills.

Also negative feedback is coming for many reasons, and rightfully so.

Gamepaly in Dust is not on par any FPS on PS3 and despite our constant critics CCP has shown no interest in changing it as we suggested.

COD, BF, KZ Halo are better FPS and if Dust 514 wants to succeed it has to at leas match them because nobody will play a mediocre FPS, even if it is free.
Better spend time and money on a solid product that waste time on a mediocre one.

I met a EVE players that said to me " EVE is simple, it's just that its UI is a mess".

Dust just like EVE indeed has a terrible UI and it's not a complicated game; as a Physicist would say "Dust is not very elegant".
Simplicity doesn't mean stupidity, here people instead think: complexity = clever, simple = stupid.
As Shakespeare said "Brevity is the souls of the wit" and Dust is unnecessary long.
Accessibility is important in any VG but here people think that putting a wall of inaccessibly in front of Dust is going to help and that it's making it better.

Dust is not a true sandbox MMO, and it's evident if you are in the beta, but still for the rest of the world it's advertised as such.

People come here expecting total freedom like in any MMO but instead get red unsafe zones/invisible walls & matchmaking just like in any FPS.
They rightfully feel disappointed/deceived.

Frankly I see on the forums way too many people here defending Dust from any sort of negative feedback, just because it's negative, without thinking that those feedback have a reason to exist.
Dust is getting negative publicity, from reviews and players alike, because there's indeed something wrong in Dust BUT here fanboys don't want to see it.
Negative feedback are essential to make e game better, to correct its mistakes, but here they are always censored/buried.
I understand the desire to see Dust succeed but protecting it from everything you don't like isn't helping.
This kind of behavior has made Dust 514 the unappealing game it is now.

[8/27/2012 9:49:33 PM] [REDACTED]: As a hardcore congamer i can tell you this would have been better off on PC
[8/27/2012 9:50:17 PM] [REDACTED]: We're just too diffrent from you PC gamers, completely diffrent mindset on whats good
.

Guys when Dust starts there will be:

PVE (drone regions or/and probably wormhole exploration)- for those who likes some kinde of mobs or lone wolf play

PVP in high sec space / low sec space (factional warfare) for guys who wan't a pvp with meaning but not to deep ;)

PVP in null sec. Some kind of deepest gameplay for hadcore gamers. Close integration to EVE players

PVP like today in beta but with more customization /game mods / maps for casual players.

Some big events in EVE/DUST engaging a lot of players

IT'S FREE :)

Explain me how this model could fail? Ofcourse when all technical stuff will work well not like today.

Friend of mine got on Skype today and talked to me about his experience with the Beta.

...


I find myself fearing that this will be a somewhat common opinion on this game as a whole if more people continue to be exposed to it in this form, as its hard for the uninitiated to tell it apart from any other shooter except for what seems like an excessive level of complexity.

Why the hell does everyone around here say cod is for casual players?

Actual numbers to show how ignorant you all are.

Black ops statistics from June 2012. 2 years after release are:

35 billion headshots and counting,nine trillion shots fired and counting,300 billion minutes played and counting...three hundred billion minutes equals 570,397 years.

Nearly half a million years of person-hour spent on a 'casual' game.

If your friend does not want to reroll characters and do it again without all the errors that is his problem.

I screwed up last build so bad. This build fresh start with an idea of what's good and things are going much better.

Please just stop with the cod crap though. Makes you all look stupid.

Have you flown a dropship up a few kilometers? If you think this game is going to be limited to 15m 12v12 matches, you are dead wrong. The physical stage is clearly set for kilometers of combat flowing from one zone into another. The game mechanics are under wraps, but I think we're going to get a lot closer to a planetside 2 scale than people realize, albeit not as dense for performance reasons.

I don't like it that this game for me to play it with a keyboard to stand a fair chance against other players who used keyboard.
Personally, i don't play this game any longer, just watching the beta forum now and then.
Don't get my wrong, i like the deep and hardcore idea of this game, but I'm a console gamer, and as a console gamer i like sitting in my easy chair drinking coffee or beer (depending on time and weekend day)and playing it with a game-pad. I Did try this new build of Dust and i was shocked of how much i suck at it, and i play a fuckload of first person shooters on the console, so my aim is very very well with the pad. I use to win every 2nd "duel" in gun play and now its may be ever 5th.

Please spare me the "this is not CoD bla bla, use a vehicle bla bla, ltp bla bla" i know what i want, and i want it to be fair.
And for a game to be fair, every one needs to have a initial situation, all pay with pad, or all play with keyboard.

Actually we don't have a true rock/paper/scissor system.
What we have is a mountain/paper/scissor system.
Statistical advantages/disadvantages are in place and they are impacting heavily on the game BUT a FPS that relies on stats is bad, very bad, because FPS relies almost entirely on player's skills.

Also negative feedback is coming for many reasons, and rightfully so.

Gamepaly in Dust is not on par any FPS on PS3 and despite our constant critics CCP has shown no interest in changing it as we suggested.

COD, BF, KZ Halo are better FPS and if Dust 514 wants to succeed it has to at leas match them because nobody will play a mediocre FPS, even if it is free.
Better spend time and money on a solid product that waste time on a mediocre one.

I met a EVE players that said to me " EVE is simple, it's just that its UI is a mess".

Dust just like EVE indeed has a terrible UI and it's not a complicated game; as a Physicist would say "Dust is not very elegant".
Simplicity doesn't mean stupidity, here people instead think: complexity = clever, simple = stupid.
As Shakespeare said "Brevity is the souls of the wit" and Dust is unnecessary long.
Accessibility is important in any VG but here people think that putting a wall of inaccessibly in front of Dust is going to help and that it's making it better.

Dust is not a true sandbox MMO, and it's evident if you are in the beta, but still for the rest of the world it's advertised as such.

People come here expecting total freedom like in any MMO but instead get red unsafe zones/invisible walls & matchmaking just like in any FPS.
They rightfully feel disappointed/deceived.

Frankly I see on the forums way too many people here defending Dust from any sort of negative feedback, just because it's negative, without thinking that those feedback have a reason to exist.
Dust is getting negative publicity, from reviews and players alike, because there's indeed something wrong in Dust BUT here fanboys don't want to see it.
Negative feedback are essential to make e game better, to correct its mistakes, but here they are always censored/buried.
I understand the desire to see Dust succeed but protecting it from everything you don't like isn't helping.
This kind of behavior has made Dust 514 the unappealing game it is now.

you know it could just be that players who never used a controller before used to be easy for you, but now after some weeks of play they (we) are getting better at using them, and you are just not as great as you thought you were ?

I don't like it that this game for me to play it with a keyboard to stand a fair chance against other players who used keyboard.
Personally, i don't play this game any longer, just watching the beta forum now and then.
Don't get my wrong, i like the deep and hardcore idea of this game, but I'm a console gamer, and as a console gamer i like sitting in my easy chair drinking coffee or beer (depending on time and weekend day)and playing it with a game-pad. I Did try this new build of Dust and i was shocked of how much i suck at it, and i play a fuckload of first person shooters on the console, so my aim is very very well with the pad. I use to win every 2nd "duel" in gun play and now its may be ever 5th.

Please spare me the "this is not CoD bla bla, use a vehicle bla bla, ltp bla bla" i know what i want, and i want it to be fair.
And for a game to be fair, every one needs to have a initial situation, all pay with pad, or all play with keyboard.

I use a red DS3 with orb extended triggers and analogue rubber grips. No turbo triggers and zero dropshot buttons.

That is a standard DS3 controller except for colour and orb add-on.

Have not used a mouse and keyboard to game in over 3 years. I way prefer the comfort of my lounge suit than my office chair.

I have platted more than 20 games ranging from 3ps,fps,rpg,racing and even an old genisis arcade simulator. I have platted vanquish also which has a difficulty rating of 9.9 I think.

Maybe I'm slightly more used to the DS3 controller than others. Have not even noticed in game if someone is using a keyboard and mouse yet.

Actually we don't have a true rock/paper/scissor system.
What we have is a mountain/paper/scissor system.
Statistical advantages/disadvantages are in place and they are impacting heavily on the game BUT a FPS that relies on stats is bad, very bad, because FPS relies almost entirely on player's skills.

Also negative feedback is coming for many reasons, and rightfully so.

Gamepaly in Dust is not on par any FPS on PS3 and despite our constant critics CCP has shown no interest in changing it as we suggested.

COD, BF, KZ Halo are better FPS and if Dust 514 wants to succeed it has to at leas match them because nobody will play a mediocre FPS, even if it is free.
Better spend time and money on a solid product that waste time on a mediocre one.

I met a EVE players that said to me " EVE is simple, it's just that its UI is a mess".

Dust just like EVE indeed has a terrible UI and it's not a complicated game; as a Physicist would say "Dust is not very elegant".
Simplicity doesn't mean stupidity, here people instead think: complexity = clever, simple = stupid.
As Shakespeare said "Brevity is the souls of the wit" and Dust is unnecessary long.
Accessibility is important in any VG but here people think that putting a wall of inaccessibly in front of Dust is going to help and that it's making it better.

Dust is not a true sandbox MMO, and it's evident if you are in the beta, but still for the rest of the world it's advertised as such.

People come here expecting total freedom like in any MMO but instead get red unsafe zones/invisible walls & matchmaking just like in any FPS.
They rightfully feel disappointed/deceived.

Frankly I see on the forums way too many people here defending Dust from any sort of negative feedback, just because it's negative, without thinking that those feedback have a reason to exist.
Dust is getting negative publicity, from reviews and players alike, because there's indeed something wrong in Dust BUT here fanboys don't want to see it.
Negative feedback are essential to make e game better, to correct its mistakes, but here they are always censored/buried.
I understand the desire to see Dust succeed but protecting it from everything you don't like isn't helping.
This kind of behavior has made Dust 514 the unappealing game it is now.

I hate to say it but every one of my friends that has played dust thinks it plays like crap. I fire back saying its a closed beta and that it needs a lot of work. Any new PS+ members playing most likely feels this way. I personally think they released it to the public early. Its far from ready. We need to see more with the gun play and hit detection.

Guys when Dust starts there will be:

PVE (drone regions or/and probably wormhole exploration)- for those who likes some kinde of mobs or lone wolf play

PVP in high sec space / low sec space (factional warfare) for guys who wan't a pvp with meaning but not to deep ;)

PVP in null sec. Some kind of deepest gameplay for hadcore gamers. Close integration to EVE players

PVP like today in beta but with more customization /game mods / maps for casual players.

Some big events in EVE/DUST engaging a lot of players

IT'S FREE :)

Explain me how this model could fail? Ofcourse when all technical stuff will work well not like today.

I do have this to say. If any of you have been to the eve forums to look. There is a vocal minority hoping that this game fails. Some of them are coming up with ways to try to drive you off. Yes it's not CoD or not super polished etc. I get that.....however, by hoping in. Saying the game is complete crap because it's beta etc. And that they need to make it more like CoD, BF or something. Well you're just proving the naysayers that don't like you, don't even want you here or even affecting "their" game, and that think you're all 12 years old with a "I want it NOW NOW NOW" complex completely right. So you want those people to win? I certainly wouldn't. I'd do my damndest to prove them wrong and make them scream in bloody rage when it turns out they were full of fedo dung.

Guys when Dust starts there will be:

PVE (drone regions or/and probably wormhole exploration)- for those who likes some kinde of mobs or lone wolf play

PVP in high sec space / low sec space (factional warfare) for guys who wan't a pvp with meaning but not to deep ;)

PVP in null sec. Some kind of deepest gameplay for hadcore gamers. Close integration to EVE players

PVP like today in beta but with more customization /game mods / maps for casual players.

Some big events in EVE/DUST engaging a lot of players

IT'S FREE :)

Explain me how this model could fail? Ofcourse when all technical stuff will work well not like today.

Dude, I don't want to play a sub par shooter to shoot ai all day. The shooter part of this game is just bad

No worse than MAG tbh

Its a beta but tbh for me its better than all other FPS shooters i have

Do you know you are lying to yourself or is it the urge to be a fanboy that makes you so irrational?

This what you think and if you believe so you are never, ever going to listen to any of us that criticize Dust, even if we have valid points.
Dust could be a man with 1 leg and you would still say he's faster then Usain Bolt.

Wtf did I just read. I talked to people who play planetside 2 beta n they say its more lag then dust. I like both planetside 2 and dust but these pc planetside 2 trolls are annoying. Ps2 has bugs too

Wrong

Its just that i have alot of patience, i put up with MAG for long enough which had problems AFTER RELEASE just like BF3 has tbh except the difference is this is in BETA still and has yet to even come out of closed beta or even have a set release date plus i have more confidence in CCP

No worse than MAG tbh

it feels weird to see how many of you don't get the full scale of the 'full' game we will (hopefully) have at release.

what we have right now is a halfway decent shooter with unbalanced weapons, a deep skilltree and an interesting fitting mechanic that is still missing a lot of must or should have stuff (laser rifles, ewar modules...)

what we do not have yet is an industry system, a persistant world, a place we can call home, battles that matter, interaction with eve, friends and enemies,

you don't need enough mercs to have constant battle on all 7000(?) planets, quite a lot of them will be peaceful most of the time, happily producing tanks for the battles concentrated on the few "hot" ones. others will be completely uninteresting because they lack certain resources. others will only be interesting because a very important station is orbiting them or because They have a worthy moon.

also dust is not a fire and forget game made to sell 40 million copies, it's a game made to keep a few hundred thousand more or less active players.

there really needs to be some kind of kiddie pool for the beta, based on sp invested.
this will be higsec for the released game, but the beta sorely needs some kind of starting bracket for newbies
and dont bring in some bullshit eve comparison, even that doesnt drop you in nullsec with a rookie ship

the current bracket system flat out does not work

the objective should be to ease people into the complexity of eve. spend a few months in highsec before the sirens song of nullsec makes you sign up with a corp, ect

oh the kids today
dont want too Learn How to play a game, want all the cool items just handed to them

Why the hell does everyone around here say cod is for casual players?

Actual numbers to show how ignorant you all are.

Black ops statistics from June 2012. 2 years after release are:

35 billion headshots and counting,nine trillion shots fired and counting,300 billion minutes played and counting...three hundred billion minutes equals 570,397 years.

Nearly half a million years of person-hour spent on a 'casual' game.

If your friend does not want to reroll characters and do it again without all the errors that is his problem.

I screwed up last build so bad. This build fresh start with an idea of what's good and things are going much better.

Please just stop with the cod crap though. Makes you all look stupid.

I think the vast majority of the problems with the game can easily be chalked up to this still being a 'closed' beta. I use the term closed loosely because so many people can easily get access to it. That being said, its got its problems, and I think the biggest one is the difficulty in navigating your way through the game, which could be a big turn off, especially for console players.

As unfortunate as it is console players, for the most part from my experience, want and expect to be able to pick up a game and immediately start playing, with just a bit of character customization. Dust has that, but it just doesn't feel fluid. The game has a major social aspect but its a pain to figure out you actually have to turn voice chat on first and select team/squad as the setting. Its easier now than it was in previous builds but it is still to much work. Voice should be on, regardless of the situation, and turning it off the option.

Took a bit for me to figure out today how to leave a squad I created and once in that squad I couldn't see incoming invites to another squad... I had to click my own name to leave the squad. There's something wrong with that and it is going to push people away.

Like many others in this thread I'm doing what I can to defend the game because it has so much potential. That being said, I can't cover up the obvious issues it has. For those of you who say anyone that doesn't have the patience to figure it out can just leave, your shooting yourself in the foot. The idea should not be to make the game so difficult to get into that no one want to find out what its worth, but rather teach them, show them a bit, and make them want to see how deep it goes as they learn and progress. You build a community that way.

MAG was a great game, but had some problems, and its difficulty without aid to players at its start pushed a lot of people away, and where is it now? Dust 514 has a crapload of problems right now and is EXTREMELY difficult for the uneducated ... where do you think it will end up?

I hope for the best and I'll continue to defend it and try and educate friends but I won't be surprised if we don't see big changes if it doesn't amount to anything.

i think many people are underestimating the power of a game costing nothing. many people who own a ps3 will try it simply because it's there. if a fraction of them decide its fun and stick around that's going to be a pretty good chunk of people streaming in well after launch. the world will also be dynamic so every time you log on to play you get something different without having to drop money on a map pack. that alone will get people to at least try the game and will get a few folks to stick around

and aside from obvious bugs with hit detection i also wouldn't think of the gunplay as terribly sub par. it does feel incredibly different than other shooters i've played - but i like the fact it feels different and i'm sure there are quite a few who agree with me on that, and there is only room for improvement as new features, weapons and items get added bringing many new strategies and aspects with them.

not everyone needs to play the same game. i'm ok with dust not toppling cod as king of console shooters.

p.s. stating what bugs and specific issues you have with the game is great for everyone. posting non-stop about how the game is sub-par and it's going to fail without giving specifics is getting old.

Dude, I don't want to play a sub par shooter to shoot ai all day. The shooter part of this game is just bad

Finally...... rifle.

Finally a topic where i can relate and actually debate.

1. I think this game might be a bit too complex for a simple gamer. This is almost a fact. There are no other FPS's out there that you have to build a character with skill points in certain areas. This for the immediate reality will hurt the community because it will make certain people not want to play thanks to them not understanding the power of specialization and determination to get specific skills in order. Although in the end i think this is how the game will flourish because it is different from everything else. Which will also lead to my second point.

Dust is not complex!
Everything is just explained very badly or not explained at all.
Dust takes 10 words to say "Hi" and 6 steps to go from a menu to another while 2 would suffice.
People don't understand some mechanics because there is not an explanation for them, anywhere.
Take chess: you can learn how each piece can move in 2 minutes but it will takes years to become good at it.
Dust is the opposite: intricate, ill conceived explanation for a simple, very immediate, gameplay such as the one in FPS.

2. Please stop relating this to COD. You will not see most of the COD community here because they are dedicated to COD and COD play. If it takes more than 3 bullets to kill someone you will not draw the COD community. IMO this game is more like battlefield, especially battlefield 2 for those of you who used to play, in the fact that it takes strategy a bit of team work and staying together as a team to win a round. Capturing points in this game is going to be important. Who isnt going to love getting a reward from someone who doesnt even play ur game because you held a planet for them in a different game. This is why i think this game will draw a decent amount of the battlefield community.

TTK was never used to compare Dust to COD.
I prefer very low TTK but I as well understand high the reasons TTK shooter.
Capturing planets/points will be important but if it's not funny it's pointless.
This is a VG and fun should be number 1 priority and not make a great concept.
The lackluster gameplay is not making Dust funny for me and many other.
Dust should look at COD for how to make things fun, because millions of people have fun in COD
I do't like COD because it's too arcade but it's undoubtly funny if you accept it for what tit is.

3. As a disclaimer i have to say that I am not an Eve player but trust me im not even close to a noob in eve ;). I have lived with and or hung out with an Eve player who has been part of BoB in the good old days, fought with titans and carriers and motherships (supercarriers) so i know how to make load outs and everything. In saying this I do believe I have a jump on most non Eve players because i realize tanking is important. I realize you cant both shield and armour tank something (usually). But also i have taught my 15 year old brother the basics of Eve logic and even he picked it up in under a week. This leads to my fourth point.

4. Any good FPS player with an Eve sponsor and mentor can easily pick this game up and start to kick some ass. This game has the ability to become something big because of cool things like orbital strikes and shared markets and isk and all that. Basically, if we stick to it and do our jobs by telling CCP what we see wrong with the game i feel we can make on of the biggest online games with a dedicated following who wont need to go out and buy a new product every year.

And this is what's wrong with Dust.
This is a FPS, the only things you need to be good are you reflexes and you tactical thinking.
Why should I need a EVE player to teach me how to shoot in a FPS when I have been doing it for ages?
What EVE players can do is to tech me the "vocabulary" of EVE but not much more.
In-game skills and the rest here are used to establish a connection with EVE and as I said countless of times what works for EVE gamepaly does not work for FPS gamepaly.
Stats in FSP have no place because it's a genre in which the player has total control of the action.

Moral of the story... Stop bitching and keep playing. If you dont like the aiming try a keyboard and mouse. If you hate tankers try researching swarm lauchers and forge guns. Finally, go through and read the perks to every skill people... some things have hidden perks like researching assualt rifle operations doesnt make it stronger but instead makes it more accurate... that was a shocker to me but ill be damned its nice to have a more accurate rifle.

Stats, stats and more stats.
You what the game to help you while in FPS we want as little help as possible from the game.
That is RPG/EVE mentality where players without the right in-game skill are useless, while in FPS a player with talent/skill and the basic gear is deadly.

cod is gay

Anyone is free to enjoy anything but there are objective things in VG like performance & video quality that don't depend on personal taste.
Dust is weak in those aspects and those are the things that I can measure and comment and that are undeniable.
Most of my comments are about things that are purely technical!

Unresponsive controls = technical.
Poor animation = technical.
Weightless weapons = technical, because it'a matter of programming
Poor graphic = technical.
Poor net code = technical.
Poor, unclear, badly organized UI = technical.
Barren empty maps =tehcnical.

The only non technical thighs I disagree on are stats & lack of sandbox elements.
Those are design choice and I have explained many times why for me they are not right for a FPS like Dust.

Shotgun never worked in MAG regis, i should know i used it for long enough and it got nerfed so it became a AR game

As for this thread lolworthy tbh

Shotgun never worked in MAG regis, i should know i used it for long enough and it got nerfed so it became a AR game


As for this thread lolworthy tbh

Agreed shotgun never works... http://youtu.be/tUsLfILrJW0 ..... http://youtu.be/zFEZLHhy-Lc ..... http://youtu.be/mTpc8QDTyCo
i'll just leave those there.

ccp should have never made the CLOSED beta extremely accessible to so many people on a console. To them, a 'beta' is a virtually complete product that is only undergoing "stress tests" and making minor tweaks here and there before launching in 4-6 weeks! DUST 514 at this point, obviously doesn't fit that description. ccp should have played this thing alot more closer to the chest, UNTIL they were ultimately ready to meet the console gamers' definition of 'beta' . Look what they're left with... alot of bad publicity!

Anyone is free to enjoy anything but there are objective things in VG like performance & video quality that don't depend on personal taste.
Dust is weak in those aspects and those are the things that I can measure and comment and that are undeniable.
Most of my comments are about things that are purely technical!

Unresponsive controls = technical.
Poor animation = technical.
Weightless weapons = technical, because it'a matter of programming
Poor graphic = technical.
Poor net code = technical.
Poor, unclear, badly organized UI = technical.
Barren empty maps =tehcnical.

The only non technical thighs I disagree on are stats & lack of sandbox elements.
Those are design choice and I have explained many times why for me they are not right for a FPS like Dust.

Yesterday I testes the comuncation beween EVE and DUST.
Why the f*ck do I must pay for voice chat? I'm really confused.

You think I am trolling, well sorry to disappoint you I am not.
It's easy to say that everyone that disagree a is troll; it very, very easy.
PS+ players and journalists that don't find Dust good are not trolls: they are people and not idiots.

Many people here stay regardless of the insults they get, the personal attacks, or if they find the game funny or not and that's because they want to help: this is true testing.
Sadly for you my, our, way to help is to talk about what's is wrong in Dust 514 and not praise it regardless of the its state.

while i agree with what i think your saying you should take the mic out of your pants and stop TESTES them.

Guys when Dust starts there will be:

PVE (drone regions or/and probably wormhole exploration)- for those who likes some kinde of mobs or lone wolf play

PVP in high sec space / low sec space (factional warfare) for guys who wan't a pvp with meaning but not to deep ;)

PVP in null sec. Some kind of deepest gameplay for hadcore gamers. Close integration to EVE players

PVP like today in beta but with more customization /game mods / maps for casual players.

Some big events in EVE/DUST engaging a lot of players

IT'S FREE :)

Explain me how this model could fail? Ofcourse when all technical stuff will work well not like today.

^^^
We all hate that as if Pay to Win wasn't enough.
Having to pay to communicate is going to create problems especially when Dust is advertised as a F2P.

BECAUSE THE MOTHERFUCKING GAMEPLAY SUCKS ! THAT IS WHY! Shooting people in Dust is not fun, there is something horribly about the mechanics. Until CCP figures this out they can add as much depth and complexity as they want, the game will not succeed except with a few thousand people grinding online for the next best item...

Somebody had to say it!

Part of what we're here for. Keep posting criticism and improvement suggestions, and it'll get better as we go along. Yeah, this patch was kind of a setback from a gameplay standpoint, but there's plenty of time to turn it back around and make more improvements.

About the mechanics. Yes there is something wrong. I can't say what it is. Its just feels blunt, playing the game does not feel cocnnectet, its like we play in a viscous atmosphere where every thing is wrapped. Yesterday I played a little Killzone2. I remember this game as a "boring-action" but playing it after I use to Dust this game (Killzone2) feels like a manifestation.
My curiosity force me to put BF3 back in to the PS3 and holyf*ck, let me tell you it feels so great.
Yes the game mechanic needs a lot more improvement. I'm not talking about the concept, this posting is dedicated only to the feeling of the mechanic.

I'm still trying to figure out whether this game is more P2W, or more G(rind)2W. P2C(hat) runs along the lines of being a big portion of ccp's P2W philosophy, since in the grand scheme of things communication with EvE players will be extremely vital to WINNING

MIlitia gear does plenty in the hands of a good player.
Buying a SP booster helps you get SP 1,5 times faster, but still requires you to actually grind the SP.
Level up Weapons 5 and Your Chosen Weapon 5 and you can do good damage already.

I'm an average player tops (K/D ratio at about 0.8) and don't feel I would gain too much by burning AUR for gear.

Do you actually feel one is able to manage positive K/D ratio right off the bat, by burning AUR?

average is 1.5 good is 2.0 great is anything above a 3.0

Dust isn't COD competitor - it's an alternative.

The OP here sums up exactly what I have been trying to get across on these forums since joining last week.

I play a variety of FPS's with a bunch of PSN friends (roughly 14-15 guys). All of them have access to the Dust beta and each and every one of them thinks the game is a complete disaster. They have completely lost interest in it and most likely will NEVER bother with it again.

"LOLZ THEY CAN GO BACK TO COD AMIRITE?". Wrong. Dust needs a big population of players all buying things to keep it alive.

These guys play Battlefield, CoD, Ghost Recon, Counter Strike and others, night after night. They aren't dumb, clueless gamers. They know what makes a FPS work, what makes it addictive and most of all FUN.

Put simply, it's the GUN and how it feels. The feedback you get from firing it. The thrill of taking down the an enemy, of racking up kills, of holding an objective point. The SOUND. Tactile and aural feedback via the controller and the TV screen. The GUN IS YOUR CHARACTER in an FPS. That's why players love to customise, get attached to and even make Youtube videos detailing pros and cons of weapons. CoD: Black Ops let you put your emblem and clan tag on the gun. Do you think these additions are accidental? No, they aren't. Every CoD game lets you add attachments, launchers, camos, color schemes. In BF3 you unlock things as you use your weapon more. Are these additions accidental? WHY ARE THEY BEING ADDED?

Because FPS players identify the on screen gun as being THEIR character.

Dust doesn't have any of this and after searching menus and options I don't see anywhere this will be implemented at launch.

Every AR looks the same and sounds the same thus far. They have the most hideous ADS view I've ever seen in an FPS. The weapon sounds are so poor it's unbelievable. When you get a kill, you hear what sounds like a windows error message. It's a sub par shooting experience. It's as simple as that. NO ONE is going to play this game for RPG elements.

I am losing my faith in the intelligence of the community while reading this topic. Couple sentences that stuck out to me.

"80% of shots don't register." Someone can't aim. Im just saying.
"Average is the top 10% of players?" If it's the top 10% then it isn't average.

Also any sentence saying COD or BF3 are what FPS games should be like. I don't want to play those anymore. I've played those all I ever care to play them, people who play this want something different. I don't care about putting a clan symbol on the side of my damn weapon, when that becomes important I have to ask if you are like 8 years old. That's fu ck ing stupid.

Also, everyone needs to remember it's BETA and has alot of stuff that needs to be fixed. Im sure CCP is aware of it, because it's posted on the forums every single day.

Personally, I like the game for the fact it doesn't play like COD or BF3 or any other shooter Ive played in a long time. There seems to be less of those retards bunny hopping all over the place, which is ineffective and quite funny to watch them die when they could have been actually shooting someone accurately. The skill system rewards reading, if you can put the skills together to be effective, to me you deserve it for not reading what you're training. Im enjoying watching the Lottery Tank drivers Ive been seeing the last week get blown up in 2-3 shots cause they ain't train any kind of defense skills. Oh and it's a teamwork type game, which beats a lone wolf game any day of the week.

I say if you don't like the game, can't adapt and overcome, or can't figure it out, go play something simpler, COD BF3 MOH or perhaps a nice easy game of Viva Pinata, something more suited to your particular talents, but please stop trying to get a game alot of us enjoy made simpler because it's too complex for that brain of yours to understand.

Once again, in EVE and DUST everyone is NOT created equal.

I am losing my faith in the intelligence of the community while reading this topic. Couple sentences that stuck out to me.

"80% of shots don't register." Someone can't aim. Im just saying.
"Average is the top 10% of players?" If it's the top 10% then it isn't average.

Also any sentence saying COD or BF3 are what FPS games should be like. I don't want to play those anymore. I've played those all I ever care to play them, people who play this want something different. I don't care about putting a clan symbol on the side of my damn weapon, when that becomes important I have to ask if you are like 8 years old. That's fu ck ing stupid.

Also, everyone needs to remember it's BETA and has alot of stuff that needs to be fixed. Im sure CCP is aware of it, because it's posted on the forums every single day.

Personally, I like the game for the fact it doesn't play like COD or BF3 or any other shooter Ive played in a long time. There seems to be less of those retards bunny hopping all over the place, which is ineffective and quite funny to watch them die when they could have been actually shooting someone accurately. The skill system rewards reading, if you can put the skills together to be effective, to me you deserve it for not reading what you're training. Im enjoying watching the Lottery Tank drivers Ive been seeing the last week get blown up in 2-3 shots cause they ain't train any kind of defense skills. Oh and it's a teamwork type game, which beats a lone wolf game any day of the week.

I say if you don't like the game, can't adapt and overcome, or can't figure it out, go play something simpler, COD BF3 MOH or perhaps a nice easy game of Viva Pinata, something more suited to your particular talents, but please stop trying to get a game alot of us enjoy made simpler because it's too complex for that brain of yours to understand.

Once again, in EVE and DUST everyone is NOT created equal.

if anything, you should be investigation your own intelligence because you've completely missed the point of my post. I mean, you couldn't actually get further away if you tried.

YOU might not care about the things I posted about but the VAST majority of FPS gamers DO.

Dust will need A LOT of players purchasing vanity items to survive. If it doesn't have the player base it will die off.

Do you get it now?

It's not what you or I want for the game, it's what sells. It's what keeps gamers coming back, night after night. No one I know wants to play Dust right now.

Why do you think that is?

if anything, you should be investigation your own intelligence because you've completely missed the point of my post. I mean, you couldn't actually get further away if you tried.

YOU might not care about the things I posted about but the VAST majority of FPS gamers DO.

Dust will need A LOT of players purchasing vanity items to survive. If it doesn't have the player base it will die off.

Do you get it now?

It's not what you or I want for the game, it's what sells. It's what keeps gamers coming back, night after night. No one I know wants to play Dust right now.

Why do you think that is?

it would be better if ccp actually interacted more with the testers . and don't give me they are busy with the game because if they where that busy . it would be less buggy and they would want more input . as it stands i was enjoying it because it seemed to be active towards the testers and fans . but now i see its just like any other DEV team they don't check in they don't talk they hand out what they think is good and ignore what the testers tell them.

if thats how this keeps going its going to fail. and if it keeps going like that it should fail. because it will be another train wreck , just like bf3 just like black ops just like mass effect 3 sad and broken
howling in the gutter like the rest of the trash.

(yes its harsh but its not like the DEVS are reading this lols . and if they are speak up we want you to talk to us, it seems you have forgotten us all anyway . ) if you interacted daily then this would be a much better game. still is a good game though but it has no life to it just kinda "meh"

actually seeing the elitist your all stupid because you cannot play this game comment

its going to fail. people don't like dic*(KITTENS) . .

Why should they ease you into DUST? No one eases you into EVE. What's with everyone wanting someone else to hold their damn hand all the time. Sit down and read, use some of those skills you learned in Elementary school. Read, you know, top to bottom left to right, a group of words makes a sentence. And comprehend what you're reading. That'll help immensely in improving some of the horrid KDRs ive seen.

The 1.5kdr being average is bullshit btw. If 1.5 was average you wouldn't have anyone dying because everyone is killing 1 1/2 people before they die. 1.0 is average, it means you killed someone and then you died.

Second everyone is bitching about hit detection. Maybe Im special because I get ****** over every night with damn Invalids, but I don't have hit detection issues. Am I just better than everyone else? I don't think I am, I don't even consider myself a good player, Im decent but I do know how to aim, and I don't have the hit detection problems everyone seems to be bitching about. And definitely not at 80% of my shots not registering. You cross-eyed or something? Pauly already told you to hit the one in the middle Rock.

And someone said something about BF3 Unlocking everything wasn't pay to win cause it doesn't make you better etc etc. Well Ill agree, someone pays money to unlock stuff and save time. If I buy the booster, Im not paying to win, Im paying to save myself time. Ill train 1.5x faster than you, which means Ill max all my skills out before you, which at the end of the day is the same thing in BF3. I don't want to wait to open up all the **** for the chopper, Ill just pay for it. Well, I don't want to wait 6 months to get everything trained for my tank, so Ill pay for it and do it in 4. Same idea, try again. Also, maybe I don't have 24 hours a day to sit and grind and make SP, so I use the boost to keep up with the curve. No harm No foul. It won't matter anyway, if you can't READ the skills, figure out how they work together, and train accordingly, you'll still get killed by people who can, regardless of gear or SP boosts or anything else.

no reason why ps3 games cant be as deep and complex as pc games, except economically