I think the vast majority of the problems with the game can easily be chalked up to this still being a 'closed' beta. I use the term closed loosely because so many people can easily get access to it. That being said, its got its problems, and I think the biggest one is the difficulty in navigating your way through the game, which could be a big turn off, especially for console players.

As unfortunate as it is console players, for the most part from my experience, want and expect to be able to pick up a game and immediately start playing, with just a bit of character customization. Dust has that, but it just doesn't feel fluid. The game has a major social aspect but its a pain to figure out you actually have to turn voice chat on first and select team/squad as the setting. Its easier now than it was in previous builds but it is still to much work. Voice should be on, regardless of the situation, and turning it off the option.

Took a bit for me to figure out today how to leave a squad I created and once in that squad I couldn't see incoming invites to another squad... I had to click my own name to leave the squad. There's something wrong with that and it is going to push people away.

Like many others in this thread I'm doing what I can to defend the game because it has so much potential. That being said, I can't cover up the obvious issues it has. For those of you who say anyone that doesn't have the patience to figure it out can just leave, your shooting yourself in the foot. The idea should not be to make the game so difficult to get into that no one want to find out what its worth, but rather teach them, show them a bit, and make them want to see how deep it goes as they learn and progress. You build a community that way.

MAG was a great game, but had some problems, and its difficulty without aid to players at its start pushed a lot of people away, and where is it now? Dust 514 has a crapload of problems right now and is EXTREMELY difficult for the uneducated ... where do you think it will end up?

I hope for the best and I'll continue to defend it and try and educate friends but I won't be surprised if we don't see big changes if it doesn't amount to anything.

i think many people are underestimating the power of a game costing nothing. many people who own a ps3 will try it simply because it's there. if a fraction of them decide its fun and stick around that's going to be a pretty good chunk of people streaming in well after launch. the world will also be dynamic so every time you log on to play you get something different without having to drop money on a map pack. that alone will get people to at least try the game and will get a few folks to stick around

and aside from obvious bugs with hit detection i also wouldn't think of the gunplay as terribly sub par. it does feel incredibly different than other shooters i've played - but i like the fact it feels different and i'm sure there are quite a few who agree with me on that, and there is only room for improvement as new features, weapons and items get added bringing many new strategies and aspects with them.

not everyone needs to play the same game. i'm ok with dust not toppling cod as king of console shooters.

p.s. stating what bugs and specific issues you have with the game is great for everyone. posting non-stop about how the game is sub-par and it's going to fail without giving specifics is getting old.

Dude, I don't want to play a sub par shooter to shoot ai all day. The shooter part of this game is just bad

Finally...... rifle.

Finally a topic where i can relate and actually debate.

1. I think this game might be a bit too complex for a simple gamer. This is almost a fact. There are no other FPS's out there that you have to build a character with skill points in certain areas. This for the immediate reality will hurt the community because it will make certain people not want to play thanks to them not understanding the power of specialization and determination to get specific skills in order. Although in the end i think this is how the game will flourish because it is different from everything else. Which will also lead to my second point.

Dust is not complex!
Everything is just explained very badly or not explained at all.
Dust takes 10 words to say "Hi" and 6 steps to go from a menu to another while 2 would suffice.
People don't understand some mechanics because there is not an explanation for them, anywhere.
Take chess: you can learn how each piece can move in 2 minutes but it will takes years to become good at it.
Dust is the opposite: intricate, ill conceived explanation for a simple, very immediate, gameplay such as the one in FPS.

2. Please stop relating this to COD. You will not see most of the COD community here because they are dedicated to COD and COD play. If it takes more than 3 bullets to kill someone you will not draw the COD community. IMO this game is more like battlefield, especially battlefield 2 for those of you who used to play, in the fact that it takes strategy a bit of team work and staying together as a team to win a round. Capturing points in this game is going to be important. Who isnt going to love getting a reward from someone who doesnt even play ur game because you held a planet for them in a different game. This is why i think this game will draw a decent amount of the battlefield community.

TTK was never used to compare Dust to COD.
I prefer very low TTK but I as well understand high the reasons TTK shooter.
Capturing planets/points will be important but if it's not funny it's pointless.
This is a VG and fun should be number 1 priority and not make a great concept.
The lackluster gameplay is not making Dust funny for me and many other.
Dust should look at COD for how to make things fun, because millions of people have fun in COD
I do't like COD because it's too arcade but it's undoubtly funny if you accept it for what tit is.

3. As a disclaimer i have to say that I am not an Eve player but trust me im not even close to a noob in eve ;). I have lived with and or hung out with an Eve player who has been part of BoB in the good old days, fought with titans and carriers and motherships (supercarriers) so i know how to make load outs and everything. In saying this I do believe I have a jump on most non Eve players because i realize tanking is important. I realize you cant both shield and armour tank something (usually). But also i have taught my 15 year old brother the basics of Eve logic and even he picked it up in under a week. This leads to my fourth point.

4. Any good FPS player with an Eve sponsor and mentor can easily pick this game up and start to kick some ass. This game has the ability to become something big because of cool things like orbital strikes and shared markets and isk and all that. Basically, if we stick to it and do our jobs by telling CCP what we see wrong with the game i feel we can make on of the biggest online games with a dedicated following who wont need to go out and buy a new product every year.

And this is what's wrong with Dust.
This is a FPS, the only things you need to be good are you reflexes and you tactical thinking.
Why should I need a EVE player to teach me how to shoot in a FPS when I have been doing it for ages?
What EVE players can do is to tech me the "vocabulary" of EVE but not much more.
In-game skills and the rest here are used to establish a connection with EVE and as I said countless of times what works for EVE gamepaly does not work for FPS gamepaly.
Stats in FSP have no place because it's a genre in which the player has total control of the action.

Moral of the story... Stop bitching and keep playing. If you dont like the aiming try a keyboard and mouse. If you hate tankers try researching swarm lauchers and forge guns. Finally, go through and read the perks to every skill people... some things have hidden perks like researching assualt rifle operations doesnt make it stronger but instead makes it more accurate... that was a shocker to me but ill be damned its nice to have a more accurate rifle.

Stats, stats and more stats.
You what the game to help you while in FPS we want as little help as possible from the game.
That is RPG/EVE mentality where players without the right in-game skill are useless, while in FPS a player with talent/skill and the basic gear is deadly.

cod is gay

Anyone is free to enjoy anything but there are objective things in VG like performance & video quality that don't depend on personal taste.
Dust is weak in those aspects and those are the things that I can measure and comment and that are undeniable.
Most of my comments are about things that are purely technical!

Unresponsive controls = technical.
Poor animation = technical.
Weightless weapons = technical, because it'a matter of programming
Poor graphic = technical.
Poor net code = technical.
Poor, unclear, badly organized UI = technical.
Barren empty maps =tehcnical.

The only non technical thighs I disagree on are stats & lack of sandbox elements.
Those are design choice and I have explained many times why for me they are not right for a FPS like Dust.

Shotgun never worked in MAG regis, i should know i used it for long enough and it got nerfed so it became a AR game

As for this thread lolworthy tbh

Shotgun never worked in MAG regis, i should know i used it for long enough and it got nerfed so it became a AR game


As for this thread lolworthy tbh

Agreed shotgun never works... http://youtu.be/tUsLfILrJW0 ..... http://youtu.be/zFEZLHhy-Lc ..... http://youtu.be/mTpc8QDTyCo
i'll just leave those there.

ccp should have never made the CLOSED beta extremely accessible to so many people on a console. To them, a 'beta' is a virtually complete product that is only undergoing "stress tests" and making minor tweaks here and there before launching in 4-6 weeks! DUST 514 at this point, obviously doesn't fit that description. ccp should have played this thing alot more closer to the chest, UNTIL they were ultimately ready to meet the console gamers' definition of 'beta' . Look what they're left with... alot of bad publicity!

Anyone is free to enjoy anything but there are objective things in VG like performance & video quality that don't depend on personal taste.
Dust is weak in those aspects and those are the things that I can measure and comment and that are undeniable.
Most of my comments are about things that are purely technical!

Unresponsive controls = technical.
Poor animation = technical.
Weightless weapons = technical, because it'a matter of programming
Poor graphic = technical.
Poor net code = technical.
Poor, unclear, badly organized UI = technical.
Barren empty maps =tehcnical.

The only non technical thighs I disagree on are stats & lack of sandbox elements.
Those are design choice and I have explained many times why for me they are not right for a FPS like Dust.