DUST Search - Balance Scouts.. remove cloaks

All Channels

General Discussions

Balance Scouts.. remove cloaks

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 :: [one page]

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1742	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:09:00 - [1] - Quote Everyone wants balance and so do I and that is why the cloak must go, immediately. I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner. The fact I go to hack an objective and nothing shows on my radar, so I begin to hack and of course a SG goes off or CR I turn to return fire and my weapon will not fire do to a glitch yet to be fixed. So I am standing for 2-3 seconds trying to survive as the Cal scout bounces all over the place. Or your heading to your destination and three scouts will decloak and begin to make your life miserable. The fact a scout can appear out of nowhere, then proceed to whittle you down with a basic CR or militia SmG as you try and hit them is almost impossible. The fact there is not one negative to being a scout at all. They can tank more than an assault, run the same equipment as a Logi, and is faster and better at CQC than a heavy which still boggles the mind. The scout had issues before the cloak but the cloak has ruined this game IMO. If it was removed then balance would be possible. My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2711	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:13:00 - [2] - Quote Cloaks don't make people invisible. I die plenty while cloaked, and kill plenty while they are cloaked. It is not the problem you think it is. This is how a minja feels
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5296	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:16:00 - [3] - Quote '' I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner.'' Sorry Mr.Calvin. Being Butthurt is not a good reason to remove something from a game. Plus= Cloaks = More scouts = More fun for my HMG Stealth Storm
The Eristic Dust 90210 569	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:27:00 - [4] - Quote Eh, I have no real problem with the cloak. I honestly think they should last a little longer and have a bit more dampening than they do now. (Not as much as when they first dropped, though.) The problem with scouts is the ability to hit pretty big HP for their inherent speed/mobility combined with dodgy hit detection (which might be related to said speed). Cloak is a non-issue for me except on certain maps/moods where the shimmer doesn't render correctly. Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1742	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:28:00 - [5] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: '' I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner.'' Sorry Mr.Calvin. Being Butthurt is not a good reason to remove something from a game. Plus= Cloaks = More scouts = More fun for my HMG Plus : Scouts are MEANT to play solo. They cannot move with a whole squad due to their location being revealed due to their squadmates precision. They are low HP solo players most of the time.... If you were hacking an objective...ALONE... means you were trying to do the scout's job. You deserve a SG/NK/ACR to the neck. Go in a squad or at least 2 other friends, check for R/E, hack safely. Its not being butthurt. Second one does hacking become a scout only roll. The cloak is OP and no matter how many come to the cloaks defense it will be until there is a way to counter it without the use of another scout. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
hfderrtgvcd Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 221	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:29:00 - [6] - Quote If we remove hmgs
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 66	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:35:00 - [7] - Quote calvin b wrote: Everyone wants balance and so do I and that is why the cloak must go, immediately. I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner. The fact I go to hack an objective and nothing shows on my radar, so I begin to hack and of course a SG goes off or CR I turn to return fire and my weapon will not fire do to a glitch yet to be fixed. So I am standing for 2-3 seconds trying to survive as the Cal scout bounces all over the place. Or your heading to your destination and three scouts will decloak and begin to make your life miserable. The fact a scout can appear out of nowhere, then proceed to whittle you down with a basic CR or militia SmG as you try and hit them is almost impossible. The fact there is not one negative to being a scout at all. They can tank more than an assault, run the same equipment as a Logi, and is faster and better at CQC than a heavy which still boggles the mind. The scout had issues before the cloak but the cloak has ruined this game IMO. If it was removed then balance would be possible. My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You can see a cloaked scout, it kinda like in the predator movies and when they run you see a blue shimmer. Also your cross hairs turn red when they cross your path so that is a second way to see a cloaked scout. They also a made a delay in the time to fire when you switch to your weapon but it does not work if the cloak just runs out of time. All in all i agree that scouts are OP and the new flavor of the month, but let wait to see what the next hot fix brings us in the way scouts work. I am a scout and sometimes sniper and i have no trouble seeing a cloaked scout on the field
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1742	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:43:00 - [8] - Quote its not about seeing the scout it is the fact they do not show up on radar and is able to see your position and the way your facing. A flux should be able to prevent a cloak from working temporary and should cause a cool down before reuse. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2716	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:49:00 - [9] - Quote calvin b wrote: its not about seeing the scout it is the fact they do not show up on radar and is able to see your position and the way your facing. A flux should be able to prevent a cloak from working temporary and should cause a cool down before reuse. Cloaks offer such poor dampening now, this isn't a problem. Std cloaks have 0% dampening. I believe Adv cloak, which I use, only has 5%. That is not what makes us invisible to your tacnet. Its dampeners. Removing cloak will do nothing to prevent people from blind siding you. Even newer scouts would eventually learn to find cover, and learn the nooks and crannies and ways of getting around that help prevent being seen. Then what would you have them remove? Scouts aren't supposed to be seen. That is the point of them. That is why the new hotfix is enabling all scouts to be tacnet invisible with enough sacrifice. If you know that there could be dampened scouts, turn around every now and then. I can promise you a target that checks his back regularly is a much scarier target to approach as a scout. I can promise you that your problem isn't going away soon. Adapt or die. This is how a minja feels
Atiim Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 10573	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:55:00 - [10] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: ' Go in a squad or at least 2 other friends I don't support the removal of Cloaks, but that's "Tanker's Logic". The Snack That Smiles Back, Tankers! -HAND

Mike De Luca STOP TRYING TO RECRUIT ME 190	Posted - 2014.07.17 02:55:00 - [11] - Quote Dude, if you're in a heavy....you're not gonna see jack shot on the tacnet other than other heavies, you want ewar? join the scouts or be quiet. And turn around every once in awhile, specifically when entering and leaving buildings, idk how many I've killed with an std smg on my av fit (cal sent w/iafg) just because i use my eyes instead of trying to rely on tacnet 24/7. what i think of when charging fg
Beastlina Ostrakon Agency Gallente Federation 13	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:02:00 - [12] - Quote Damn ninja's.
Minion Max Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 12	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:07:00 - [13] - Quote I do not use the Cloaking Fields, but it sure is fun to drop someone running across open space cloaked. Each Suite and Roll should have one advantage to make it worth someones time to play. I hate Warbird Strikes on a home spawn point, but it is a game, vent and move on to next battle. Semper Fi. Cpl, 87-95
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5301	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:19:00 - [14] - Quote calvin b wrote: Its not being butthurt. Second one does hacking become a scout only roll. The cloak is OP and no matter how many come to the cloaks defense it will be until there is a way to counter it without the use of another scout. Nono, dont put words in my mouth. I never said hacking was a scout only role. HACKING ALONE is. You think the cloak is OP!? USE IT! YEs run around in a 200-500HP scout and FEEL the HMG...XD But dont worry,you'll do fine.Its so Op you will surely start going 30-3 with ti. GG Calvin. Stealth Storm
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5301	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:21:00 - [15] - Quote Atiim wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: ' Go in a squad or at least 2 other friends I don't support the removal of Cloaks, but that's "Tanker's Logic". No its not. *I can still be taken out by a single enemy infantry unit.* : O Im just saying that since Calvin here assures its impossible to kill cloaked scouts. Stealth Storm
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 11945	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:22:00 - [16] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Atiim wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: ' Go in a squad or at least 2 other friends I don't support the removal of Cloaks, but that's "Tanker's Logic". TANKERS LOGIC #Mindfuckingblownwideopen "Your Faith stands as a shield for the Faithful, and you are one of His Angels." - Soren Tyrhannos to Templar Ouryon
Fizzer94 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2945	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:23:00 - [17] - Quote calvin b wrote: Its not being butthurt. Second one does hacking become a scout only roll. The cloak is OP and no matter how many come to the cloaks defense it will be until there is a way to counter it without the use of another scout. Gal logi. It doesn't even NEED to be a Gal Logi. A focused scanner will pick up 99% of all scouts. Only a small fraction of Gal Scouts will be able to avoid it. My best match on Dust, 23/6/4 Placon. Please unnerf ScPs and fix IoPs...
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1211	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:34:00 - [18] - Quote I'm sorry, Calvin, I'll try not to do it again. :)
Thurak1 Psygod9 820	Posted - 2014.07.17 03:55:00 - [19] - Quote I hate the cloaker scouts myself but mostly for how devastating the SG is up close and how hard the buggers are to hit. When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Scouts that are newbs well they sometimes just stand there like a practice dummy.
One Eyed King Land of the BIind 2722	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:03:00 - [20] - Quote Thurak1 wrote: I hate the cloaker scouts myself but mostly for how devastating the SG is up close and how hard the buggers are to hit. When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Scouts that are newbs well they sometimes just stand there like a practice dummy. My favorite noob scouts are the ones that don't dampen, and then cloak, running around all blurry with a red chevron above their head. Silly noobs. This is how a minja feels

KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5307	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:05:00 - [21] - Quote True Adamance wrote: #Mindfuckingblownwideopen WTH!? Im never implying scouts shouldn't be taken out 1 v 1! THATS tanker logic. 1inf cant beat 1 tank <==tank logic 2+infs to beat 1 tank <=== Tank logic You know what!? im not even going to discuss this. If someone is having this much trouble fighting cloaked scouts they obviously do not belong here. As it is,the scout is the squishiest thing o the battlefield, so much NANOHIVES have more HP than some of my proto scouts that cost 190k+ The Cloak is the thing that makes it work. You remove it , you nerf scouts. You nerf scouts , scouts get stressed and LEave or even worse, become heavies... here is a tip: Im lately playing as a Heavy if the enemy is swarming scouts,mostly because i find it easier the Heavy vs Scout matchup than the Scout vs Scout one. When im playing as a heavy, this is the trick....ITs secret, dont tell anyone : ''I dont hack objectives if im alone, if i get to an objective and i clear it/its clear i use my mic and ask for backup.'' Let the smucks do the dirty work... They get 100wp for hacking the objective and you get 50wp X each scout trying to stop the hack... I know.im genius. Stealth Storm
Clone D Grundstein Automation 575	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:11:00 - [22] - Quote calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Echoist Dogs of War Gaming 314	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:12:00 - [23] - Quote my solution to scout is quite simple... well actually I have two. 1.) My Ion Pistol will make quick work of scouts it's actually quite funny since they don't expect people to run the Ion Pistol, so they just think you only have automatic weapons. 2.) If I know there are a lot of scouts in the match I'm in I'll put myself in a look out position with my Laser Rifle, it's amazing how many of those scouts think no one is looking until they're burning... Dropship Rail Gunner STINGY: Yes I did nickname my laser rifle. Owner of a "Insta Bacon Machine" called STINGY
Mike De Luca STOP TRYING TO RECRUIT ME 192	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:16:00 - [24] - Quote Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa, he's a beta vet? wtf?!? I know more about this **** than he does and I'm just at 5 months! what i think of when charging fg
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1215	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:19:00 - [25] - Quote Thurak1 wrote: When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Huh? Are you serious? How you can possibly tell who is using a MKB and who is using a DS3 by how they jump or how erratically they move is COMPLETELY beyond me, and I suspect you are simply projecting false logic to a problem of varied skill levels in your opponents. The best five scouts I know all use DS3. In fact, I don't know of a A+ scout (or, frankly any top infantry slayer) that uses MKB. They might be out there -- and if anyone knows of one, please do correct me -- but I've not met them. Have you used a MKB with Dust? It's what I usually play with -- so please trust me when I tell you it's not MKB that you're seeing.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1216	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:29:00 - [26] - Quote Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? God love him, Calvin just likes to complain. That's his MO, and this thread is simply one of many -- all with the same tone. I think it's kind of cute and often make fun of him. He rarely takes my bait any more. Calv, All jokes aside, I hope you're doing well.
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1713	Posted - 2014.07.17 04:51:00 - [27] - Quote This thread.
Thurak1 Psygod9 821	Posted - 2014.07.17 05:05:00 - [28] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Thurak1 wrote: When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Huh? Are you serious? How you can possibly tell who is using a MKB and who is using a DS3 by how they jump or how erratically they move is COMPLETELY beyond me, and I suspect you are simply projecting false logic to a problem of varied skill levels in your opponents. The best five scouts I know all use DS3. In fact, I don't know of a A+ scout (or, frankly any top infantry slayer) that uses MKB. They might be out there -- and if anyone knows of one, please do correct me -- but I've not met them. Have you used a MKB with Dust? It's what I usually play with -- so please trust me when I tell you it's not MKB that you're seeing. its pretty simple really. With the ds3 there is a acceleration curve with movement. With the keyboard there isnt a curve. I am surprised you can't tell. Its far easier to move around in different directions with a kb than with a controller. Yes i play with a keyboard and mouse from time to time. I am still getting used to it and the menu controlls stink but otherwise it is far better for movement. Just because you havent meet such a player does not actually mean anything. Honestly though i think you are just trolling because i can't believe anyone thinks that something with an acceleration curve is better than something with 0 curve.
Yeeeuuuupppp uptown456 Dark Taboo 478	Posted - 2014.07.17 06:10:00 - [29] - Quote Cloaks definitely need to go. I don't care what your argument is against the removal, it should have never been added Rage Proficiency V Mic status: Muted Storage Wars Champion.
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1109	Posted - 2014.07.17 09:02:00 - [30] - Quote calvin b wrote: Everyone wants balance and so do I and that is why the cloak must go, immediately. I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner. The fact I go to hack an objective and nothing shows on my radar, so I begin to hack and of course a SG goes off or CR I turn to return fire and my weapon will not fire do to a glitch yet to be fixed. So I am standing for 2-3 seconds trying to survive as the Cal scout bounces all over the place. Or your heading to your destination and three scouts will decloak and begin to make your life miserable. The fact a scout can appear out of nowhere, then proceed to whittle you down with a basic CR or militia SmG as you try and hit them is almost impossible. The fact there is not one negative to being a scout at all. They can tank more than an assault, run the same equipment as a Logi, and is faster and better at CQC than a heavy which still boggles the mind. The scout had issues before the cloak but the cloak has ruined this game IMO. If it was removed then balance would be possible. My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. Yeah man, I agree with Checkmate.... It soulds like you got caught with your pants down and got killed by a scout. Should you have been in a squad like a heavy is supposed to be this would not have happened. The scout was playing to his strengths and you were not. Cloaks are fine. PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8. That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.

Tech De Ra Electronic Sports League 519	Posted - 2014.07.17 11:55:00 - [31] - Quote Quote: This entire thread lol Prime League champion SGL Sidearm champion Fanfest '14 All star champion
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1499	Posted - 2014.07.17 11:59:00 - [32] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: If we remove hmgs Beat me to it "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1499	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:04:00 - [33] - Quote Mike De Luca wrote: Dude, if you're in a heavy....you're not gonna see jack shot on the tacnet other than other heavies, you want ewar? join the scouts or be quiet. And turn around every once in awhile, specifically when entering and leaving buildings, idk how many I've killed with an std smg on my av fit (cal sent w/iafg) just because i use my eyes instead of trying to rely on tacnet 24/7. And then you get gang banged by me and Bor "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 160	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:29:00 - [34] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Cloaks don't make people invisible. I die plenty while cloaked, and kill plenty while they are cloaked. It is not the problem you think it is. You are sub par and you are in no way a point of balance reference. Service with a smile
RogueTrooper 2000AD Neckbeard Absolution 160	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:30:00 - [35] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Thurak1 wrote: When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Huh? Are you serious? How you can possibly tell who is using a MKB and who is using a DS3 by how they jump or how erratically they move is COMPLETELY beyond me, and I suspect you are simply projecting false logic to a problem of varied skill levels in your opponents. The best five scouts I know all use DS3. In fact, I don't know of a A+ scout (or, frankly any top infantry slayer) that uses MKB. They might be out there -- and if anyone knows of one, please do correct me -- but I've not met them. Have you used a MKB with Dust? It's what I usually play with -- so please trust me when I tell you it's not MKB that you're seeing. Its cool for people to say they use a ds3 when really they use a k/b and mouse. Your welcome. Service with a smile
VikingKong iBUN G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 117	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:33:00 - [36] - Quote Balance Entire Game.. Remove Heavies
Izlare Lenix Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 778	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:37:00 - [37] - Quote Lol. I love hearing players cry about something because they suck at killing it. I have been a scout for 8 months. I maxed out Caldari day 1 since I always wanted a cal scout. Very recently I started specining into heavy/hmg because they are WAAAYY stronger than scouts. I only have lvl 1 amarr/cal heavy suits and only lvl 4 hmg, and guess what...I can murder everything with a basic suit and mh-82 especially scouts. And the burst makes scouts my ***. So why can I kill most scouts I come across as a very new heavy while long time heavies *** and moan about scouts? Because I'm always thinking like a scout. I know how scouts operate, how they flank, how they hide, how they set traps and when they like to attack. And I am not blind as I can clearly see scouts shimmer, and with the hmg when you see a shimmer, point, click, +50. So many heavies are stupid morons with zero situational awarness. Too many heavies have allowed their high hp suits and death dealing OP as fuk hmg to make up for thier lack of gun game. So if you are using the highest hp suit in the game with the highest dps weapon in the game, and a scout with 1/3 your hp kills you there are two possibilities. The scout got the best of you, which is his role, or you suck balls with the best death dealing weapon in the game. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
Jimmy Slapnuts Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 68	Posted - 2014.07.17 12:44:00 - [38] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: If we remove hmgs I keep reading this as "...remove HUGS" lol
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1747	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:06:00 - [39] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Atiim wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: ' Go in a squad or at least 2 other friends I don't support the removal of Cloaks, but that's "Tanker's Logic". No its not. *I can still be taken out by a single enemy infantry unit.* : O Im just saying that since Calvin here assures its impossible to kill cloaked scouts. No I can kill scouts all day, its the fact the cloak gives one class such a huge advantage over others. It needs removal or way needs to be implemented to prevent the cloak from working temporary or have a counter to there ability to hide on radar. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1747	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:10:00 - [40] - Quote Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? I am proto cal. I specced into it first day. Problem was it became FOTM and that was when I left it in the closet. Second heavies are also going that way and so I started to skill into assaults. Today I turn proto in Cal Assault. I choose what I think will be a challenge, the scout was a bust and the heavy is well everyone is either going heavy or scout that is why I am choosing assault as my new toy. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique

calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1747	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:14:00 - [41] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? God love him, Calvin just likes to complain. That's his MO, and this thread is simply one of many -- all with the same tone. I think it's kind of cute and often make fun of him. He rarely takes my bait any more. Calv, All jokes aside, I hope you're doing well. I hope your doing well, second yes I am ball of anger that is why I like to run heavy it allows me to wade into Hell and kill as many as I can before I succumb to the dreaded frame rate drop. Just letting everyone know I do not like to lose and I am a tryhard. Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1747	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:21:00 - [42] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: Lol. I love hearing players cry about something because they suck at killing it. I have been a scout for 8 months. I maxed out Caldari day 1 since I always wanted a cal scout. Very recently I started specining into heavy/hmg because they are WAAAYY stronger than scouts. I only have lvl 1 amarr/cal heavy suits and only lvl 4 hmg, and guess what...I can murder everything with a basic suit and mh-82 especially scouts. And the burst makes scouts my ***. So why can I kill most scouts I come across as a very new heavy while long time heavies *** and moan about scouts? Because I'm always thinking like a scout. I know how scouts operate, how they flank, how they hide, how they set traps and when they like to attack. And I am not blind as I can clearly see scouts shimmer, and with the hmg when you see a shimmer, point, click, +50. So many heavies are stupid morons with zero situational awarness. Too many heavies have allowed their high hp suits and death dealing OP as fuk hmg to make up for thier lack of gun game. So if you are using the highest hp suit in the game with the highest dps weapon in the game, and a scout with 1/3 your hp kills you there are two possibilities. The scout got the best of you, which is his role, or you suck balls with the best cqc weapon in the game. Its not about situational awareness. It is the fact there is no counter to 3-4 scouts decloaking beside you and as soon as you start to lay waste they cloak and run off, or they toss RE into the air that glide and then land at your feet, or the fact they can jump over your head but I cant even jump onto a 6in curb. When a cloaked scout decloaks besides you and then proceeds to climb his way into your inner bowels remember scouts are easier, as he puts round after round into as you fail to kill them, why? Because you forgot how to think like a scout Closed Beta Vet and Heavy, so no I am not FOTM I am an Antique
Clone D Grundstein Automation 575	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:40:00 - [43] - Quote calvin b wrote: It is the fact there is no counter to 3-4 scouts decloaking beside you and ... It feels like 3-4 scouts, but it is really just 1. Seriously, if they are ganging up on you, then good for them. Did you expect anything less with your 1800 eHP mobile death beam? A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Jimmy Slapnuts Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 68	Posted - 2014.07.17 13:47:00 - [44] - Quote They should never have put cloaks into the game without also adding a direct counter to them. By "direct counter", I am referring to a means by which to disable or forcibly deactivate an enemy's cloak. IMO Flux Grenades should negate any active cloaks in their AoE. Also, any damage taken while cloaked should also immediately deactivate it. If I manage to spot a cloaked character, but am not in a position to kill him myself, I should at least be able to de-cloak him with a couple of shots or a Flux Grenade, in order to reveal him to my teammates.
BLOOD Ruler The Lionheart Coalition 546	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:32:00 - [45] - Quote So an xray thing,however it should cost alot like the cloak,side-effects are seeing the bones of the enemy. Feel the pain of my knives and the piercing pain your skull has felt to my pistol.I am the Assassin.
Michael Arck 4877	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:51:00 - [46] - Quote Scouts were sucker punching us long before cloaks. Cloaks just brought about new scouts. You should always be aware of your surroundings anyway. I like the challenge cloaks provide. If they get me, I make sure to watch my six so that doesnt happen a second time. Archistrategos *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain*
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 15:58:00 - [47] - Quote Only the ones who can't use their brains to counter a cloak scout are the ones crying and whining that cloaks need to be removed......as a heavy you have absolutly crap for passive scan and the best you can do is scan another heavy.....im not sure if that includes the scan passive skill or not......but if it doesn't then get smart and put some dam points into your passive scan skills.......as a heavy if your not running with your squad and you running solo then you deserve to get killed by cloaked scouts.....unless it changed we have shared tacnet so try sticking with your squad and the people with better scans will show up the red dots on the map for you........ before any of you go off, i am a scout and i know how easy it is to die by the smart players that know what to look for when i run my cloak build.......and no i dont always use a cloak......there are better equpiment i can fill those slots with
Cody Sietz SVER True Blood Dark Taboo 3607	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:01:00 - [48] - Quote If they do remove cloaks, I better get my extra 10 percent of damps back. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2245	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:07:00 - [49] - Quote Your being ignorant and frankly stupid. Planetside 2 you can shoot while cloaked.. And good luck seeing someone actually cloaked. The way DUST 514 and CCP did cloaking.. It doesn't get more balanced. What makes cloaking a problem in DUST? the Radar. CCP trains noobs in this game to look for red... and a red chevron. And players build up total dependency on that radar for nearly everything. Me Personally? I have stopped using it except to tell me the general direction of the action. Your EYES are OP. Specially against DUST 514's cloaks. You would literally only have had played couple of games in your life time to even see DUST's cloak mechanics in that way. Cuz when compared to cloaking mechanics in several games it doesn't get more balanced.
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:13:00 - [50] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Your being ignorant and frankly stupid. Planetside 2 you can shoot while cloaked.. And good luck seeing someone actually cloaked. The way DUST 514 and CCP did cloaking.. It doesn't get more balanced. What makes cloaking a problem in DUST? the Radar. CCP trains noobs in this game to look for red... and a red chevron. And players build up total dependency on that radar for nearly everything. Me Personally? I have stopped using it except to tell me the general direction of the action. Your EYES are OP. Specially against DUST 514's cloaks. You would literally only have had played couple of games in your life time to even see DUST's cloak mechanics in that way. Cuz when compared to cloaking mechanics in several games it doesn't get more balanced. Don't forget the uber OP cloaking in the Crysis series......talk about unbalanced

Clone D Grundstein Automation 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:13:00 - [51] - Quote I would argue that, at the speed which scouts move and due to the fact that the server lag creates a fringe of invisibility on TACNET, scouts can race directly toward a precision-enhanced dropsuit and one-shot it before they even show up on the radar. I am all for increasing the default scan range of every dropsuit by another 50%. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2245	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:18:00 - [52] - Quote Clone D wrote: I would argue that, at the speed which scouts move and due to the fact that the server lag creates a fringe of invisibility on TACNET, scouts can race directly toward a precision-enhanced dropsuit and one-shot it before they even show up on the radar. I am all for increasing the default scan range of every dropsuit by another 50%. Common stop with the utter bullshit. just WOW.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:24:00 - [53] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Common stop with the utter bullshit. just WOW. Why the hostility? If a basic light frame scan range is 22m (20m + 2m for range amp bonus), and network lag is ~ 1 second, and the aggressing scout has a speed of ~ 10 m/s and their weapon range is ~12m, and they run directly at you, then by the time they show up on radar, they will be 12m from you and pull the trigger. Is that so hard to work out? A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2245	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:28:00 - [54] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bethhy wrote: Clone D wrote: I would argue that, at the speed which scouts move and due to the fact that the server lag creates a fringe of invisibility on TACNET, scouts can race directly toward a precision-enhanced dropsuit and one-shot it before they even show up on the radar. I am all for increasing the default scan range of every dropsuit by another 50%. Common stop with the utter bullshit. just WOW. Why the hostility? If a basic light frame scan range is 22m (20m + 2m for range amp bonus), and server lag is ~ 1 second, and the aggressing scout has a speed of ~ 10 m/s and their weapon range is ~12m, and they run directly at you, then by the time they show up on radar, they will be 12m from you and pull the trigger. Is that so hard to work out? Because your full of ****. And your basic understanding how the Tac-Net even works is terrible. Just go back to saying "This is OP, that is OP". because WOW.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:29:00 - [55] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Because your full of ****. And your basic understanding how the Tac-Net even works is terrible. Just go back to saying "This is OP, that is OP". because WOW. If you have a contrary understanding, please explain it. I'm all ears. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Sgt Buttscratch R 0 N 1 N 2143	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:30:00 - [56] - Quote I locked down the enemies home point yesterday solo, didn't die.18/0. Running a scan scout with RE's and moar re's. No cloak. Enemy was full squad of hellstorm and some bluenarbs. Cloaks make a lot of scouts complacent. Give me my scrambler pistol back....**
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2245	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:30:00 - [57] - Quote calvin b wrote: Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? I am proto cal. I specced into it first day. Problem was it became FOTM and that was when I left it in the closet. Second heavies are also going that way and so I started to skill into assaults. Today I turn proto in Cal Assault. I choose what I think will be a challenge, the scout was a bust and the heavy is well everyone is either going heavy or scout that is why I am choosing assault as my new toy. So you have the ability to Counter nearly everything DUST 514 has to offer.... But because your to lazy... or you just don't "feel" like countering the stuff used against you.. It should get nerfed. or you quit. This is seriously your argument? OMG GD is getting worse by the day.
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2245	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:33:00 - [58] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bethhy wrote: Because your full of ****. And your basic understanding how the Tac-Net even works is terrible. Just go back to saying "This is OP, that is OP". because WOW. If you have a contrary understanding, please explain it. I'm all ears. There are hundreds of Posts actually explaining the tac-net. Detailed information explaining the tac-net with You-tube videos for example.. People go and read and watch them before they pretend they know what they are talking about. Specially on a Nerf thread. and yes I will call bullshit when it should be called. Everytime.
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:34:00 - [59] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bethhy wrote: Clone D wrote: I would argue that, at the speed which scouts move and due to the fact that the server lag creates a fringe of invisibility on TACNET, scouts can race directly toward a precision-enhanced dropsuit and one-shot it before they even show up on the radar. I am all for increasing the default scan range of every dropsuit by another 50%. Common stop with the utter bullshit. just WOW. Why the hostility? If a basic light frame scan range is 22m (20m + 2m for range amp bonus), and server lag is ~ 1 second, and the aggressing scout has a speed of ~ 10 m/s and their weapon range is ~12m, and they run directly at you, then by the time they show up on radar, they will be 12m from you and pull the trigger. Is that so hard to work out? Wow another player with the inability to compensate for something blame it on server lag........ The only time server lag will be the reason for you to get killed is when your screen freezes for a second or 2 like when you try spawn into the game or when you see the rubber banding effect on screen...other then that lag is not the reason for what scouts can do..BTW no scout even stacking proto kincat can never reach 10 meters a second.....the fastest scout which in min can reach max sprint speed while stacking 3 complex kincats is 8.3055 m/s and i would run out of stamina before i got 100m away from starting point.... Your entire arguement is based on flawed data.....the start of your thread i agree with you on it.....scouts are the top of the food chain.....but if your going to try and say stuff at least make sure your facts are correct.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:38:00 - [60] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: Wow another player with the inability to compensate for something blame it on server lag........ The only time server lag will be the reason for you to get killed is when your screen freezes for a second or 2 like when you try spawn into the game or when you see the rubber banding effect on screen...other then that lag is not the reason for what scouts can do..BTW no scout even stacking proto kincat can never reach 10 meters a second.....the fastest scout which in min can reach max sprint speed while stacking 3 complex kincats is 8.3055 m/s and i would run out of stamina before i got 100m away from starting point.... Your entire arguement is based on flawed data.....the start of your thread i agree with you on it.....scouts are the top of the food chain.....but if your going to try and say stuff at least make sure your facts are correct. My max scout speeds are above 10 m/s. I don't know where you're getting your info. You have a game client and I have a game client and there is a server in between. Let's say that it takes ~500ms for your game client to send info to the server, and ~500 ms for the server to send info to my game client. Your distance from me, time elapsed, information whereabouts 22m, 0ms, your client 18m, 500ms, server 12m, 1000ms, my client (you appear on TACNET to me) you pull the trigger and bang I am dead In this way, there is a fringe of invisibility in TACNET, determined by the relative speeds of objects surrounding the player and where information is being processed and how long packets take to travel from network location to network location. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.

Clone D Grundstein Automation 581	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:41:00 - [61] - Quote Bethhy wrote: and yes I will call bullshit when it should be called. Everytime. You suck monkey asses and eat rhino turds, and you don't know anything. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Sgt Buttscratch R 0 N 1 N 2143	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:46:00 - [62] - Quote The balance to scouts comes from scout v scout intel, and stronger mediums/assault. The cloak is a cool aspect of the game, that a heavy will always have issues with. Calling for removal rather than counter measures isn't the fix needed. Also Flux should decloak a scout. Give me my scrambler pistol back....**
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 30	Posted - 2014.07.17 16:51:00 - [63] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bethhy wrote: and yes I will call bullshit when it should be called. Everytime. You suck monkey asses and eat rhino turds, and you don't know anything. I lol at this statement, as a matter of fact I point the finger and laugh in your face. @ OP cloaked scouts are not a problem, its you. Even if there was no cloak your passive scans wouldn't have seen them behind or beside you. Quit your whining and train yourself in situational awareness. I play all roles and the only role that needs something tweaked is the assault. People like you break the game with this nonsense instead of fixing it. "I can't counter so it's the game. NERF NERF NERF"
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 207	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:09:00 - [64] - Quote The issue might be in your television. You need to get a bigger one or get closer to it or wear glasses or something. If a scout is cloaked standing still they aren't doing much. If they are running, they become blue spoopy ghosts. The rule is fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. If a scout keeps hiding blowing you up with REs or shotgunning you at an objective you need to change your approach.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 582	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:12:00 - [65] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: I lol at this statement, as a matter of fact I point the finger and laugh in your face. @ OP cloaked scouts are not a problem, its you. Even if there was no cloak your passive scans wouldn't have seen them behind or beside you. Quit your whining and train yourself in situational awareness. I play all roles and the only role that needs something tweaked is the assault. People like you break the game with this nonsense instead of fixing it. "I can't counter so it's the game. NERF NERF NERF" You should probably get caught up on the context of this conversation. 1. I am discussing a light frame/scout scan of another light frame/scout. 2. I am not claiming that cloaks are a problem. 3. I play all roles as well and have a firm understanding of ewar. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
RayRay James Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 255	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:16:00 - [66] - Quote calvin b wrote: Its not being butthurt. Second one does hacking become a scout only roll. The cloak is OP and no matter how many come to the cloaks defense it will be until there is a way to counter it without the use of another scout. Use your eyes - you actually can see scouts if they're cloaked Use a Gal Logi with a scanner - those suckers can see everything ( I should know, tis what I use) Quit complaining just because someone kills you. It's a legit tactic. If I can kill a cloaked scout with an ADS, you can kill it on the ground.
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:17:00 - [67] - Quote Clone D wrote: 843-Vika wrote: Wow another player with the inability to compensate for something blame it on server lag........ The only time server lag will be the reason for you to get killed is when your screen freezes for a second or 2 like when you try spawn into the game or when you see the rubber banding effect on screen...other then that lag is not the reason for what scouts can do..BTW no scout even stacking proto kincat can never reach 10 meters a second.....the fastest scout which in min can reach max sprint speed while stacking 3 complex kincats is 8.3055 m/s and i would run out of stamina before i got 100m away from starting point.... Your entire arguement is based on flawed data.....the start of your thread i agree with you on it.....scouts are the top of the food chain.....but if your going to try and say stuff at least make sure your facts are correct. My max scout speeds are above 10 m/s. I don't know where you're getting your info. You have a game client and I have a game client and there is a server in between. Let's say that it takes ~500ms for your game client to send info to the server, and ~500 ms for the server to send info to my game client. Your distance from me, time elapsed, information whereabouts 22m, 0ms, your client 18m, 500ms, server 12m, 1000ms, my client (you appear on TACNET to me) you pull the trigger and bang I am dead In this way, there is a fringe of invisibility in TACNET, determined by the relative speeds of objects surrounding the player and where information is being processed and how long packets take to travel from network location to network location. its called doing the math......percents are something i learned by the 5th grade....if you can't do the math the you need go back to school or stay in school.
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES RISE of LEGION 1343	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:19:00 - [68] - Quote Cloaks are not the problem. Its really quite easy to spot cloakers if you look for them. I think you will find it is the passive scans that give the scouts their true power. Positional awareness is and has been for a long time a scouts main weapon. I sometimes like to run a fully dampened Gallente scout. Its amusing seeing how bad some of these scouts actually are when they cant detect you. (And mind you I am no master Scout by any means myself! lol) -=#[ Gastun's Forge ]#=- MY LIFE FOR AIUR! "I'm wasting away here" - "Get me back into zee fight!
CommanderBolt ACME SPECIAL FORCES RISE of LEGION 1343	Posted - 2014.07.17 17:23:00 - [69] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: Clone D wrote: 843-Vika wrote: Wow another player with the inability to compensate for something blame it on server lag........ The only time server lag will be the reason for you to get killed is when your screen freezes for a second or 2 like when you try spawn into the game or when you see the rubber banding effect on screen...other then that lag is not the reason for what scouts can do..BTW no scout even stacking proto kincat can never reach 10 meters a second.....the fastest scout which in min can reach max sprint speed while stacking 3 complex kincats is 8.3055 m/s and i would run out of stamina before i got 100m away from starting point.... Your entire arguement is based on flawed data.....the start of your thread i agree with you on it.....scouts are the top of the food chain.....but if your going to try and say stuff at least make sure your facts are correct. My max scout speeds are above 10 m/s. I don't know where you're getting your info. You have a game client and I have a game client and there is a server in between. Let's say that it takes ~500ms for your game client to send info to the server, and ~500 ms for the server to send info to my game client. Your distance from me, time elapsed, information whereabouts 22m, 0ms, your client 18m, 500ms, server 12m, 1000ms, my client (you appear on TACNET to me) you pull the trigger and bang I am dead In this way, there is a fringe of invisibility in TACNET, determined by the relative speeds of objects surrounding the player and where information is being processed and how long packets take to travel from network location to network location. its called doing the math......percents are something i learned by the 5th grade....if you can't do the math the you need go back to school or stay in school. Please correct me if I have somehow misunderstood your post but.... My 4 x complex kincat Gall scout would like to laugh at your 8.3055 M/S. Say hello to 11.3 M/S (Sprint speed) on an obviously flawed fit. -=#[ Gastun's Forge ]#=- MY LIFE FOR AIUR! "I'm wasting away here" - "Get me back into zee fight!
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 964	Posted - 2014.07.17 18:52:00 - [70] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: calvin b wrote: Its not being butthurt. Second one does hacking become a scout only roll. The cloak is OP and no matter how many come to the cloaks defense it will be until there is a way to counter it without the use of another scout. Nono, dont put words in my mouth. I never said hacking was a scout only role. HACKING ALONE is. You think the cloak is OP!? USE IT! YEs run around in a 200-500HP scout and FEEL the HMG...XD But dont worry,you'll do fine.Its so Op you will surely start going 30-3 with ti. GG Calvin. I've used the cloak, it's OP. You can talk all you want about how easy they are to see but most the time you can run straight at people and they don't see you. I don't like cloaking and wish it wouldn't have been introduced but I also wouldn't ask that it be removed (although it would make me happy), but don't make the mistaken argument that that is often made that they are easy to see or that scouts could sneak up on you without them. A handful of players used to be able to do this and we knew their names, now I can do it. Because, that's why.

Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 192	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:40:00 - [71] - Quote Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! "Anybody order chaos?"
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:47:00 - [72] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! Im still unclear how the cloak is being abused while being used as intended......a scout ( the real only suit that can fit it without loss of everything else ) usee it to move around the field and get into position while being undetected.....that's abuse? The cloak is just about useless unless its at proto level because it has sh!t dampening at standard and advanced levels not to mention that with the low timers on them they can't be used to go from one side of the map to the other. The only problem is that a sentinel suit has sh!t for passive scans so they can't see anything else but another heavy, unless they stick with their squad and uee the shared tacnet. A solo heavy running around should be nothing more then a moving target for anything else on the map.
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2321	Posted - 2014.07.17 19:49:00 - [73] - Quote Scout with cloak to his buddy in the room: "watch this, he'll never see me coming." Scout with cloak to forums: "cloaks are easy to see!" K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Rusty Shallows Caldari State 1889	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:03:00 - [74] - Quote VikingKong iBUN wrote: Balance Entire Game.. Remove Heavies Complete removal of all Heavy and Light Frames should be considered. At least academically speaking. People always seem angry at something so why bother with any variation? There could be one Frame for each race and people will still post idiotic removal requests like VikingKong. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 560	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:04:00 - [75] - Quote Cloaks are fine except the ability for them to get off shots before the effect drops. A shotgun from an invisible enemy to the face is hard to survive unless you're in a heavy suit. It's not particularly hard to see a cloak even motionless in your LoS, if so just go watch predator a few more times... Observe the public trust. Protect the innocent. Uphold the law.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 192	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:05:00 - [76] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Clone D wrote: Bethhy wrote: and yes I will call bullshit when it should be called. Everytime. You suck monkey asses and eat rhino turds, and you don't know anything. I lol at this statement, as a matter of fact I point the finger and laugh in your face. @ OP cloaked scouts are not a problem, its you. Even if there was no cloak your passive scans wouldn't have seen them behind or beside you. Quit your whining and train yourself in situational awareness. I play all roles and the only role that needs something tweaked is the assault. People like you break the game with this nonsense instead of fixing it. "I can't counter so it's the game. NERF NERF NERF" Not to insult you in any way, but everyone has adapted buddy?! The fact that you refer to them as "OP cloaked scouts" is the problem everyone is referring to?! This game is for squads and teams! Squads and teams win battles! Working together, and letting your squad and team members abilities compliment yours. The Cloak makes for the "one man army" ability. It isn't "crazy' or "crying" to say that the ability to take one scout against 6 other guys and beat them is absurd?! It is illogical completely?! You guys watch to much tv?! If you want a sense of realism then wrap your minds around the fact that you can't take on a full squad of competent fighters in a gun fight and win....... unless you have a cloak (crutch). It's like the "quick scope" ability in call of duty. Why use anything else when I can do something easy that puts me out of range? It's why in every game everyone wants to be a sniper. Not because it's hard, but because it's easy?! (In real life it's unbelievably hard) I can name the scouts that were already good before the cloak, and you aren't one of them! You, like the rest of the fotm bandwagon, are abusing the cloak! Plain and simple! Cut it how you want, but the facts remain. If we gave haevies cloaks tomorrow you'd flip **** until you got a cloak on a heavy?! If assaults had jetpacks you'd want a respec to get a jetpack, and try to fit it on a heavy?! Adaptation is a skill, and like anything else you have to adapt to change in all things. If scouts were using their bonuses without the cloaks I would agree with you, but with the cloak is overkill?! Caldari scouts can see you at all times, and with the cloak you can't see him?! Where's the balance in that? "Anybody order chaos?"
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 67	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:07:00 - [77] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Cloaks are fine except the ability for them to get off shots before the effect drops. A shotgun from an invisible enemy to the face is hard to survive unless you're in a heavy suit. It's not particularly hard to see a cloak even motionless in your LoS, if so just go watch predator a few more times... they made it so weapon switch there is a delay but if the cloak just runs out there is no delay........as far as i was told
Zindorak CaUsE-4-CoNcErN 139	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:09:00 - [78] - Quote One Eyed King wrote: Cloaks don't make people invisible. I die plenty while cloaked, and kill plenty while they are cloaked. It is not the problem you think it is.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 192	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:11:00 - [79] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! Im still unclear how the cloak is being abused while being used as intended......a scout ( the real only suit that can fit it without loss of everything else ) usee it to move around the field and get into position while being undetected.....that's abuse? The cloak is just about useless unless its at proto level because it has sh!t dampening at standard and advanced levels not to mention that with the low timers on them they can't be used to go from one side of the map to the other. The only problem is that a sentinel suit has sh!t for passive scans so they can't see anything else but another heavy, unless they stick with their squad and uee the shared tacnet. A solo heavy running around should be nothing more then a moving target for anything else on the map. Your talking scout against scout. Everyone else is a victim lol! You guys keep comparing dampening and precision stats like the assault guys being shot at by the tank, heavy, ADS, and scouts have time to see if they can play hide and seek with each other lmao! So now I need to replace rep mods and armor to play Ewar with scouts? Thanks, I guess I was doing it all wrong smh?! "Anybody order chaos?"
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 561	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:12:00 - [80] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: Reign Omega wrote: Cloaks are fine except the ability for them to get off shots before the effect drops. A shotgun from an invisible enemy to the face is hard to survive unless you're in a heavy suit. It's not particularly hard to see a cloak even motionless in your LoS, if so just go watch predator a few more times... they made it so weapon switch there is a delay but if the cloak just runs out there is no delay........as far as i was told I dunno cus I don't run the silly ****, not even on my scouts, but I do get shot often while the dude is still invisible. May be a lag in the effect and maybe in his screen he is visible, but quite often I get popped because of it. It's not so much "oh I couldn't see him so he shot me" as much as it is not being able to train my reflexes to respond because of an inconsistency in the game. There shouldn't ever be inconsistencies in competitive play. Observe the public trust. Protect the innocent. Uphold the law.

B145PH3M3R The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 17	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:14:00 - [81] - Quote To me, the cloak is not the issue per se. The fact that nearly every weapon becomes beast mode with a cloak is the issue. Also that scouts have 2 eq slots. If they want to run a cloak, they shouldn't have equipment too. They are solo players, not logis. Cloak+RE is the most OP combo in this game. Toss RE and pop it AS you become visible. If gone undetected, there is no way to beat this, which is pretty damn easy with a cloak. They need to have more of a delay for remotes and cloaks before firing.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 192	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:15:00 - [82] - Quote Look if i'm a scout in 1.6, and needed to cross an area? I used my speed, range amp, dampening, and precision.... and I looked both ways before crossing the damn street in front of the blaster tank! You guys wanna be completely ********, and still survive lol! You don't need a cloak to play?! It just makes it easier to play. "Anybody order chaos?"
Will Driver Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 145	Posted - 2014.07.17 20:51:00 - [83] - Quote I like the cloak, I think it adds an interesting dimension to the game. It seems to me that you may be too dependent upon your eHP. For that you pay a price in speed and maneuverability, which is working as intented. I think you should improve your situational awareness, team work, visual acuity, aim accuracy and anticipation, etc. I'm definitely not in favor of removing a cloak because they are effective against Heavies. That's a reason to KEEP the cloak. I do have an issue with Remote Explosives being tossed like grenades (but without any audio cue and very hard-to-see visual cues). That seems like a broken mechanic to me. And Scouts should not be able to fire while cloaked (which is the intent but in practice it still seems to happen somehow). So these 2 points I'd address, but certainly the solution is not to get rid of the cloak, IMHO. GÇ£Creativity is knowing how to hide your sourcesGÇ¥ GÇò Albert Einstein
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 208	Posted - 2014.07.17 21:19:00 - [84] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Cloaks are fine except the ability for them to get off shots before the effect drops. A shotgun from an invisible enemy to the face is hard to survive unless you're in a heavy suit. It's not particularly hard to see a cloak even motionless in your LoS, if so just go watch predator a few more times... This right here is to me the only valid tweak that should occur to cloaks. There should be a long wait period between cloaking and being able to fire a weapon. By long I mean something comparable to the plasma cannon after its fired, that thing takes like a second or two before it will let you swap to a side arm. As it stands, you can swap from a cloak to a weapon as if you were switching between two weapons unfired. Cloaks should be used to flank and get better positions, NOT to be hard to track while opening fire when the cloak hasn't even worn off.
TYCHUS MAXWELL The Fun Police 208	Posted - 2014.07.17 21:50:00 - [85] - Quote Will Driver wrote: I like the cloak, I think it adds an interesting dimension to the game. It seems to me that you may be too dependent upon your eHP. For that you pay a price in speed and maneuverability, which is working as intented. I think you should improve your situational awareness, team work, visual acuity, aim accuracy and anticipation, etc. I'm definitely not in favor of removing a cloak because they are effective against Heavies. That's a reason to KEEP the cloak. I do have an issue with Remote Explosives being tossed like grenades (but without any audio cue and very hard-to-see visual cues). That seems like a broken mechanic to me. And Scouts should not be able to fire while cloaked (which is the intent but in practice it still seems to happen somehow). So these 2 points I'd address, but certainly the solution is not to get rid of the cloak, IMHO. There is an audio queue unique to remote and proximity explosive, it makes a beeping noise when they throw them. If you mean a audio queue when they are active... well proximity mines beep when vehicles get close to them and adding beeping noises to remote explosive would defeat their purpose. Check objectives either by throwing a flux or looking around them before trying to hack if you want to avoid getting blown up. An undefended objective is almost always a sign of a trap.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1219	Posted - 2014.07.17 21:55:00 - [86] - Quote calvin b wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: Clone D wrote: calvin b wrote: The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You are a closed beta vet so you know all about ewar. What is you reason behind not speccing into cal scout in order to get more TACNET info and achieve greater awareness? God love him, Calvin just likes to complain. That's his MO, and this thread is simply one of many -- all with the same tone. I think it's kind of cute and often make fun of him. He rarely takes my bait any more. Calv, All jokes aside, I hope you're doing well. I hope your doing well, second yes I am ball of anger that is why I like to run heavy it allows me to wade into Hell and kill as many as I can before I succumb to the dreaded frame rate drop. Just letting everyone know I do not like to lose and I am a tryhard. You and me, both, Calvin. The fact that you try hard and play to win is why I always liked you, even if I do give you a hard time when you rage on the forums. :)
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1220	Posted - 2014.07.17 22:10:00 - [87] - Quote p.s. as for the topic at hand, I think the "getting a shot off while cloaked" and the "cloaked and completely invisible" and the "recharge/reengage timer should be like vehicles" should all be implemented to tone down the clear advantage of cloaked scouts. Anyone who says this game is in a good place with scout/cloak as powerful as they are is not being objective, IMO. Now, we can, and should, debate what's the right fix, but to simply look past the issue is wrong, IMO. This is coming from someone who primarily plays Cal Scout with a cloak.
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1220	Posted - 2014.07.17 22:14:00 - [88] - Quote p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that).
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 196	Posted - 2014.07.17 22:47:00 - [89] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that). You're right, but one shouldn't have to be forced to employ a particular scout type to combat a single thing in the game?! Yes, the cal scout IS the immediate fix right now, but that shouldn't be the end all be all should it? "Anybody order chaos?"
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 2142	Posted - 2014.07.17 23:35:00 - [90] - Quote As a full-time scout since beta I would be very happy if cloaks were removed. To be honest, they take some of the elemets I enjoyed out of the game. The cat and mouse, the skill to sneak and the heart pounding fear you get when trying to thread the needle to that high value target while avoiding his squad and not tipping anyone off to your presence before you get your kill shot. Scouting now is more fun to me in my minja which can't fit a cloak because I still have low skills in that suit. I get that a lot of scouts like them, and I want my bro's and sis to be happy, but I never really liked the idea. I'm not convinced they are as a big a problem as the shared scans or armor tanking though. Those are WAY bigger issues in my mind and I hope charlie will clean some of that up. Double posting like a Kaiser.

843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 69	Posted - 2014.07.17 23:53:00 - [91] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that). You're right, but one shouldn't have to be forced to employ a particular scout type to combat a single thing in the game?! Yes, the cal scout IS the immediate fix right now, but that shouldn't be the end all be all should it? No one said anyone had to skill into any suit but running with your squad that has a cal scout and getting its shared tacnet is way better then running solo and using the bootleg passive scans that a sentinel suit get.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 583	Posted - 2014.07.17 23:56:00 - [92] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that). You're right, but one shouldn't have to be forced to employ a particular scout type to combat a single thing in the game?! Yes, the cal scout IS the immediate fix right now, but that shouldn't be the end all be all should it? IMO, we need to open ewar up to other dropsuits! Why not have an assault suit with intense scan precision bonuses? This whole "ewar is for cal scouts" developer mentality has got to go. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Baal Omniscient Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1960	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:10:00 - [93] - Quote A hard counter to the cloak module is all that's needed. Simply make a flux grenade deplete the timer on cloaks and we're good. Tacnet-Invisible scouts have been around for a long time but haven't been an issue because your eyes are a hard counter. A stationary cloaked shotty scout in a cqc area however is only counter-able by other scouts or someone with a proto scanner on a fully specced Gallogi, and after the next round of fixes I don't know if that will be enough to get EVERY scout. Don't remove the cloak, it's a fine addition, it just needs something that can cancel it out. Fix the flux for this purpose. Cross Atu for CPM1 Winmatar Assault, Proficiency 5 SMG's & Proficiency 5 Swarms Since Uprising 1.0
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 2146	Posted - 2014.07.18 00:15:00 - [94] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that). You're right, but one shouldn't have to be forced to employ a particular scout type to combat a single thing in the game?! Yes, the cal scout IS the immediate fix right now, but that shouldn't be the end all be all should it? IMO, we need to open ewar up to other dropsuits! Why not have an assault suit with intense scan precision bonuses? This whole "ewar is for cal scouts" developer mentality has got to go. This is tricky. I don't think one suit should have it all. It is totally ridiculous that scouts can tank massive HP with greater speed, smaller hitboxes and vastly superior EWAR (and the cloak). But, I don't want to see Medium suits with EWAR capabilities riviling scouts, racial bonuses to slaying type stuff, more CPU/PG than scouts (which they should have, not sure if they do now since I'm not a medium guy), and higher number of high/low slots per tier than scouts. Moderately improved EWAR would be fine... perhaps similar to current logi ewar stats but I'm against anything beyond that. If we're shooting for balance, that is. Double posting like a Kaiser.
Sylwester Dziewiecki Interregnum. 328	Posted - 2014.07.18 01:22:00 - [95] - Quote calvin b wrote: Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. Sorry dude, but you have to be joking us here - I constantly dying even when I'm not moving with cloak. People are doing it all the time, they look around to check if they cross-hair change red... - everyone can be spoted, there is no "cloaking" in this game.. Gallente Speed Scout. EVE side of me: Nosum Hseebnrido
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 197	Posted - 2014.07.18 01:53:00 - [96] - Quote Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote: calvin b wrote: Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. Sorry dude, but you have to be joking us here - I constantly dying even when I'm not moving with cloak. People are doing it all the time, they look around to check if they cross-hair change red... - everyone can be spoted, there is no "cloaking" in this game.. You, my friend, are in denial! "Anybody order chaos?"
Talon Paetznick II Gallente Federation Resistance 45	Posted - 2014.07.18 05:02:00 - [97] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! cloaks are in no way being abused in fact any cloak short of proto can end up with a conservative use also cloaks are not a direct advantage I mostly use cloaks to slip past units or get the drop on a straggler from a group the advantage is indirect another thing about cloaks is that they reinforce the scouts role as a saboteur by encouraging guerrilla tactics which by the way are focused around pressuring and angering the enemy into making more mistakes, the proto cloak could use a small 5 second nerf in other words you're supposed to hate cloaks dust math: getting killed by ion pistol = dropping the soap,useful item= nerfhammer, protostomp= WHY GOD!!!
Unidentified Caldarian Terminal Courtesy Proficiency V. 126	Posted - 2014.07.18 07:13:00 - [98] - Quote hfderrtgvcd wrote: If we remove hmgs Yes "Falsely misquoted in a bible..." - Jett Pezzin
Velociraptor antirrhopus Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 322	Posted - 2014.07.18 07:16:00 - [99] - Quote calvin... there have been carbon copies of your thread ever since the cloak came out... and it's always been laughed at because the only thing that made the cloak OP was its dampening bonus. they removed it for the most part and only proto has 10% bonus now, which is the only reason anyone even uses the proto cloak anymore. if you're not at least 50 meters out, the cloak ACTUALLY MAKES YOU EASIER TO SPOT DUST 514 Forums. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villa- er, I mean panty weights and neckbeards.
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 197	Posted - 2014.07.18 07:34:00 - [100] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: calvin... there have been carbon copies of your thread ever since the cloak came out... and it's always been laughed at because the only thing that made the cloak OP was its dampening bonus. they removed it for the most part and only proto has 10% bonus now, which is the only reason anyone even uses the proto cloak anymore. if you're not at least 50 meters out, the cloak ACTUALLY MAKES YOU EASIER TO SPOT WHAT?!!!! No it doesn't! You guys are playing an entirely different game because the scouts I see are racing toward me at 8 or 9 m/s with a shotgun, 400 armor, and 300 shield?! I got all of no seconds to fire before he shoots me?! I never see the nova knives?! "Anybody order chaos?"

Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 197	Posted - 2014.07.18 07:40:00 - [101] - Quote Talon Paetznick II wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! cloaks are in no way being abused in fact any cloak short of proto can end up with a conservative use also cloaks are not a direct advantage I mostly use cloaks to slip past units or get the drop on a straggler from a group the advantage is indirect another thing about cloaks is that they reinforce the scouts role as a saboteur by encouraging guerrilla tactics which by the way are focused around pressuring and angering the enemy into making more mistakes, the proto cloak could use a small 5 second nerf in other words you're supposed to hate cloaks And why again do you need a cloak? You're actually helping me make my point ya know. All of that was done just fine before the cloak. It's a gimmick plain and simple. What IS apparently needed is skill for these scouts who only started scouting post 1.8. "Anybody order chaos?"
B145PH3M3R The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 20	Posted - 2014.07.18 11:17:00 - [102] - Quote Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: calvin... there have been carbon copies of your thread ever since the cloak came out... and it's always been laughed at because the only thing that made the cloak OP was its dampening bonus. they removed it for the most part and only proto has 10% bonus now, which is the only reason anyone even uses the proto cloak anymore. if you're not at least 50 meters out, the cloak ACTUALLY MAKES YOU EASIER TO SPOT You almost got a like from me -- until your last sentence.
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 76	Posted - 2014.07.18 18:17:00 - [103] - Quote This thread is pointless because no matter what people say no one will ever agree, and to be honest its mostly a heavy QQ that he can't deal with scouts that have a cloak. When are people going to stop trying to bring dust to the same level as CoD? The only thing that people should be complaining about or QQing is the fact that certain drop suits have been forgotten about or their roles have never been defined. With the addition of the cloaks it helped define the role of a scout as the stealth role, helping them become less of a target then they were before. Lets be real hear, scouts were deadly before but they were totally visible on the field, even with their skills in dampening maxed out. Not to mention that scouts are totally paper thin in every aspect. then they added the cloaks which gave scouts an extra dampening to help them ever more, and they also added a shared tacnet so that even when you can't scan something if you're team mate can scan it you will see it. But that's not good enough for the scrubs of this game, they had to QQ and b!tch and whine and get the cloaks nerfed to the point that only a complex cloak is even worth using, so that the people that only can use an advanced get sh!tted on because it has a crap timer on it and a crap dampening to it so everything under complex is a waste of space. This is DUST 514, not CoD, not BF, its supposed to be an FPS that is unlike anything that has ever come before, so why is everything ruining the game by trying to make it just like all the other crap FPS games out there? The answer is very simple.....if its not like CoD or BF then the scrubs can't do anything but get killed so they whine and cry and b!tch and QQ until the game is the way they want it and ruin it for the rest of us.
medomai grey WarRavens Final Resolution. 868	Posted - 2014.07.18 19:41:00 - [104] - Quote I find it a tad annoying that neophytes think that cloaks gave scouts a defining role in stealth. Playing stealth takes a whole lot more skill than simply pressing a god damn button. As for cloak being removed from the game, I don't want to see cloaks removed from the game. But if CCP can't fix it or figure out what they want to do with it, then I would totally understand why it had to get axed. Medium frame EHP is not medium
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 574	Posted - 2014.07.18 19:45:00 - [105] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: This thread is pointless because no matter what people say no one will ever agree, and to be honest its mostly a heavy QQ that he can't deal with scouts that have a cloak. When are people going to stop trying to bring dust to the same level as CoD? The only thing that people should be complaining about or QQing is the fact that certain drop suits have been forgotten about or their roles have never been defined. With the addition of the cloaks it helped define the role of a scout as the stealth role, helping them become less of a target then they were before. Lets be real hear, scouts were deadly before but they were totally visible on the field, even with their skills in dampening maxed out. Not to mention that scouts are totally paper thin in every aspect. then they added the cloaks which gave scouts an extra dampening to help them ever more, and they also added a shared tacnet so that even when you can't scan something if you're team mate can scan it you will see it. But that's not good enough for the scrubs of this game, they had to QQ and b!tch and whine and get the cloaks nerfed to the point that only a complex cloak is even worth using, so that the people that only can use an advanced get sh!tted on because it has a crap timer on it and a crap dampening to it so everything under complex is a waste of space. This is DUST 514, not CoD, not BF, its supposed to be an FPS that is unlike anything that has ever come before, so why is everything ruining the game by trying to make it just like all the other crap FPS games out there? The answer is very simple.....if its not like CoD or BF then the scrubs can't do anything but get killed so they whine and cry and b!tch and QQ until the game is the way they want it and ruin it for the rest of us. Weren't you just whining about heavies with light weapons? Not hating....Just saying. Observe the public trust. Protect the innocent. Uphold the law.
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1531	Posted - 2014.07.18 20:54:00 - [106] - Quote RogueTrooper 2000AD wrote: One Eyed King wrote: Cloaks don't make people invisible. I die plenty while cloaked, and kill plenty while they are cloaked. It is not the problem you think it is. You are sub par and you are in no way a point of balance reference. You are even worse and your opinion should be blocked. "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4205	Posted - 2014.07.18 21:06:00 - [107] - Quote Dude calvin I respect your player skillz but man can you quit bitchin? I am a scout who doesn't use cloaks at all (have zero SP in them) and I have very little problem with the current state of cloaks: I have killed the numerously, with and without scanning them. I have sniped them, while they were cloaked, SNIPED THEM....just let that sink in & I'm a terrible sniper. I have scanned them so many times without an active scanner and my precision can't get lower than a Min Logistic's passive or a Gallogi with an Active Scanner. I do believe that cloaks should offer no dampening bonus what so ever but that's a hard argument to win over the community. Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 544	Posted - 2014.07.18 21:33:00 - [108] - Quote 843-Vika wrote: calvin b wrote: Everyone wants balance and so do I and that is why the cloak must go, immediately. I am tired of being sucker punched every match, out strafed to the point I lost to a militia SmG as the Cal scout went left and right back and forth and due to poor hit detection , the scout having a quarter of my hit box was able to jump, glide back and forth to the point my HMG could not keep up. I tried to strafe and follow the target but I could not. It was damn near impossible. As soon as your about the to win they cloak and run faster than you can turn a corner. The fact I go to hack an objective and nothing shows on my radar, so I begin to hack and of course a SG goes off or CR I turn to return fire and my weapon will not fire do to a glitch yet to be fixed. So I am standing for 2-3 seconds trying to survive as the Cal scout bounces all over the place. Or your heading to your destination and three scouts will decloak and begin to make your life miserable. The fact a scout can appear out of nowhere, then proceed to whittle you down with a basic CR or militia SmG as you try and hit them is almost impossible. The fact there is not one negative to being a scout at all. They can tank more than an assault, run the same equipment as a Logi, and is faster and better at CQC than a heavy which still boggles the mind. The scout had issues before the cloak but the cloak has ruined this game IMO. If it was removed then balance would be possible. My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Cloaks need to be removed or you have to give us a way of seeing them. If I have to run scout to kill a cloaked scout I will quit. The cloak has been one of the most lopsided items placed in the game IMO and needs to be removed. You can see a cloaked scout, it kinda like in the predator movies and when they run you see a blue shimmer. Also your cross hairs turn red when they cross your path so that is a second way to see a cloaked scout. They also a made a delay in the time to fire when you switch to your weapon but it does not work if the cloak just runs out of time. All in all i agree that scouts are OP and the new flavor of the month, but let wait to see what the next hot fix brings us in the way scouts work. I am a scout and sometimes sniper and i have no trouble seeing a cloaked scout on the field HMG Heavies are clearly FOTM. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 39	Posted - 2014.07.18 21:41:00 - [109] - Quote Clone D wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: p.p.s. Calvin, you still running primarily solo? If so, I suspect that may be, at least in part, why you're taking a bit of a hard line on cloaks. I think you'll find that if you're in a good squad with a good gal logi or passive scanning cal scout, you won't die nearly as much to cloaked scouts. That doesn't mean there's no problem, because there is, but rather that you may be getting the short end of the stick, so to speak, because of running solo (if you're still doing that). You're right, but one shouldn't have to be forced to employ a particular scout type to combat a single thing in the game?! Yes, the cal scout IS the immediate fix right now, but that shouldn't be the end all be all should it? IMO, we need to open ewar up to other dropsuits! Why not have an assault suit with intense scan precision bonuses? This whole "ewar is for cal scouts" developer mentality has got to go. Do you even know what EWAR is? By the looks of it you only seem to understand that precision is EWAR. EWAR is open to all suits (dampening, range, precision) yet LIGHT suits benefit from a bonus to make up for less EHP in comparison to MEDIUM and HEAVY frames. Sorry for the caps, trying to bring you light in a dark room. And it's not the developers mentality that has to go, but it is your "I can't counter so..." mentality that has to go.
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4206	Posted - 2014.07.18 21:49:00 - [110] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: HMG Heavies are clearly FOTM. This is true but there are far more scouts on a field than Assaults and Assaults are the krill of Dust, the basis of the ecosystem. It would be better if there were less scouts on the field. Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C

Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 545	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:05:00 - [111] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Talon Paetznick II wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Mr. Calvin b is right, and we all know it. Like the flaylock pistol before it, the cloak is being abused?! There is no fixing this item, however?! Unless we are able to scan cloaks, they need to be removed. Cool trick, but it has obviously worn out it's welcome. Why this even needs to be explained is beyond me smh?! Those here who run cloaked scouts are here just trolling this forum?! You, most of all, know full well running cloaked scouts is a walk in the park. You should be ashamed, but your the type of guys who just wanna win easily?! Scouting in this game, for the first time ever, was a skill before the cloak. Now it's just a bunch of guys who got killed by assaults taking their revenge lol! Sure you die occasionally, but let's be realistic just a little here?! To come to this forum, and say scouting is balanced is the same as tankers coming here 2 weeks after 1.7 saying tanks and AV are balanced?! Scouts are in a class of their own entirely! No assault player can hang with them! Heavies are shooting at everything, and not hitting the scouts at all?! Now as an amatuer scout I will tell you Mr. Calvin b that if CCP wants to give the cloak to the scouts they might as well use it, but real scouts don't need cloaks. If you are good at scouting the cloak is overkill in all honesty. Soon, with a wing and a prayer, the scouts will see more balance with hotfix charlie and have to choose between dampening, precision, speed, and protection like the rest of us. Currently they can do it all, and cloak?! That isn't balance scouts?! Remember 1.7, and how tanks made the game impossible for you. Instead of trolling anyone who states the obvious about the cloak, how about showing them how practical it is. Suggest some fixes toward imbalance, and help the community understand why you do indeed need the cloak. Alot of you have this "can't beat em join em" mentality that will have everyone in a scout by tomorrow morning if it was up to you?! I implore you to remember why it is that we stopped playing call of duty to play dust in the first place? Diversity, versatility, and customization! The FOTM mentality mustn't shape this game. If that's the case, and I just need to do like everyone else, then I want a respect every time a new weapon drops?! It's absurd right? I want to specialize, and I can't do that if I have to waste points on something I don't run to keep up with the game?! Let's be clear! Nerfing all rifles to fix the fact that the rail rifle and combat rifle was OP didn't work?! That's why the AR got a buff! It, along with the rest of the gallente weapons, are mediocre at best. Dropping everything along with the OP weapons still made the OP weapons OP smh?! If you keep giving amazing evidence to the community as to why the cloak is not needed it will get axed whether you like it or not geniuses?! CCP rattati isn't for imbalance, and if you guys haven't noticed already? He has the reigns on things right now, and he's gunning for balance! cloaks are in no way being abused in fact any cloak short of proto can end up with a conservative use also cloaks are not a direct advantage I mostly use cloaks to slip past units or get the drop on a straggler from a group the advantage is indirect another thing about cloaks is that they reinforce the scouts role as a saboteur by encouraging guerrilla tactics which by the way are focused around pressuring and angering the enemy into making more mistakes, the proto cloak could use a small 5 second nerf in other words you're supposed to hate cloaks And why again do you need a cloak? You're actually helping me make my point ya know. All of that was done just fine before the cloak. It's a gimmick plain and simple. What IS apparently needed is skill for these scouts who only started scouting post 1.8. Alright let's get one thing straight. If what you're saying is true then everybody in this community should be scouts; however this isn't the case, in fact, it's almost the exact opposite, with heavies outnumbering scouts and assaults/logis combined. Secondly, cloaks hardly affect your base scan profile, so don't mislead people by telling past information in the present. A proto cloak will provide only 10% reduction in scan profile, for a scout that's only 3 freaking scan profile points; 3! Third, if the cloak was really imbalanced, we would be seeing some more cloak changes in Hot fix Charlie, because this hotfix is focusing a LOT on scouts, specifically EWAR, we can infer the cloak is pretty balanced. And just as previous posts have mentioned...cloaks HAVE increased stealth, granted stealth isn't just "pushing a button" but, if that's all you did with the cloak, then you don't know it's full potential and therefore only good scouts know how to properly utilize this mechanism. So seriously stop QQing. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 615	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:17:00 - [112] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Do you even know what EWAR is? By the looks of it you only seem to understand that precision is EWAR. EWAR is open to all suits (dampening, range, precision) yet LIGHT suits benefit from a bonus to make up for less EHP in comparison to MEDIUM and HEAVY frames. Sorry for the caps, trying to bring you light in a dark room. And it's not the developers mentality that has to go, but it is your "I can't counter so..." mentality that has to go. Politely, you presume too much, Jack. Yes, I am quite adept at all ewar concepts and regularly plan suits around them. The last I checked, I could counter anything in the game, so I am not aware of ever having had an "I can't counter so that has to go" mentality. What are you getting at? Please, speak directly. A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2327	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:21:00 - [113] - Quote Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4206	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:24:00 - [114] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. By that logic people who use the flaylock should be in academy because they can't get kills with it? Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2327	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:26:00 - [115] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. By that logic people who use the flaylock should be in academy because they can't get kills with it? If they use it consistently enough, yes. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4206	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:29:00 - [116] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. By that logic people who use the flaylock should be in academy because they can't get kills with it? If they use it consistently enough, yes. So flaylocks don't deserve a buff, people spent a mill SP just to be stuck in academy.... Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 39	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:31:00 - [117] - Quote Clone D wrote: Jack 3enimble wrote: Do you even know what EWAR is? By the looks of it you only seem to understand that precision is EWAR. EWAR is open to all suits (dampening, range, precision) yet LIGHT suits benefit from a bonus to make up for less EHP in comparison to MEDIUM and HEAVY frames. Sorry for the caps, trying to bring you light in a dark room. And it's not the developers mentality that has to go, but it is your "I can't counter so..." mentality that has to go. Politely, you presume too much, Jack. Yes, I am quite adept at all ewar concepts and regularly plan suits around them. The last I checked, I could counter anything in the game, so I am not aware of ever having had an "I can't counter so that has to go" mentality. What are you getting at? Please, speak directly. You make it look like EWAR is only open for Cal scouts and that is a load of you know what. What I'm getting at is stated in my post above.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 2702	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:44:00 - [118] - Quote I hate cloaks. They take up more fitting requirements than they're worth. Cloaks aren't even a problem now that the dB bonus has gone down (same with the Almighty Gallente Scout dB).
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2327	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:47:00 - [119] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. By that logic people who use the flaylock should be in academy because they can't get kills with it? If they use it consistently enough, yes. So flaylocks don't deserve a buff, people spent a mill SP just to be stuck in academy.... We're here because of the nerf/buff cycle. Someone's always going to be on the bottom in an arms race. The Flay stinks now, and it's a weeping shame that that's the nature of things. But let's say that tomorrow they buff the Flay to 10 times it's current lethality. Is that "fair"? Nope, just an advantage. If you make those who ply an advantage play against similarly scoring players (however they got there), then the legitimacy of the advantage is tested. With as many variables as we currently play with (and goodness, they're even trying to figure out how to make PG boosters more effective, even though by a per usage test they have been proven totally superfluous), finding the result (KDR) that everyone uses to determine usefulness for everything here and filtering users/abusers through it actually helps demonstrate imbalance and guide what little nerfs/buffs/removals might be needed for variety's sake. However, for sheer lethality, and all other factors being equal, skill would be the deciding factor. KDR matchmaking in an FPS is that winnowing fork that separates the wheat from the chaff. I mean, look at how people couch their complaints of OP weapons. They state that something killed an inordinate number of times to the deaths the user received. K D R. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Clone D Grundstein Automation 617	Posted - 2014.07.18 22:49:00 - [120] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: You make it look like EWAR is only open for Cal scouts and that is a load of you know what. What I'm getting at is stated in my post above. Let's put it this way, there's hiding (profile dampening) and finding (scan precision). Currently, there's one racial suit that can hide better than all of the others, so if you want to hide, then use that. There's also one suit that's best at finding the others. Can all of the other dropsuit classes play hide and seek? To an extent, but they're just not that good at it. In other words, my militia amarr light frame with one complex precision enhancers and two complex range amplifiers might only be able to find 90% of the mercs around me (due to my scan precision vs their scan profiles), allowing those grungy one-shotters to sneak up behind me. Whereas a fully specced scout wearing C-1/Series with two complex precision enhancers and the cool bonuses that go along with cal scout, might be able to find 97% of the mercs around. With that knowledge, why would I ever want to use my militia amarr light frame if my goal is to know where as many of the other mercs are as I possibly can? This log jams everyone who likes to use the TACNET radar into the cal scout ewar funnel. My earlier thought was, "why don't we make some other suits good at hiding and finding too, instead of essentially forcing everyone who wants to play ewar down into one of two classes." A corp for lonewolves where squadding and comms are optional, but exceptional team play is expected.

Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4208	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:23:00 - [121] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: I mean, look at how people couch their complaints of OP weapons. They state that something killed an inordinate number of times to the deaths the user received. K D R. While most of what you said is very true, player skill really is primary influence, take a look at the combat rifle. It has lowest CPU/PG, highest DPS, and -5% +10% damage profile, + very high accuracy rating. How does this weapon not warrant a nerf? It has stats that take player skill and multiply it's effectiveness because of just how much better it is. Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 546	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:24:00 - [122] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Nothing ever has to be removed/buffed/nerfed. Not while personal lethality decides who faces whom. By that logic people who use the flaylock should be in academy because they can't get kills with it? If they use it consistently enough, yes. So flaylocks don't deserve a buff, people spent a mill SP just to be stuck in academy.... We're here because of the nerf/buff cycle. Someone's always going to be on the bottom in an arms race. The Flay stinks now, and it's a weeping shame that that's the nature of things. But let's say that tomorrow they buff the Flay to 10 times it's current lethality. Is that "fair"? Nope, just an advantage. If you make those who ply an advantage play against similarly scoring players (however they got there), then the legitimacy of the advantage is tested. With as many variables as we currently play with (and goodness, they're even trying to figure out how to make PG boosters more effective, even though by a per usage test they have been proven totally superfluous), finding the result (KDR) that everyone uses to determine usefulness for everything here and filtering users/abusers through it actually helps demonstrate imbalance and guide what little nerfs/buffs/removals might be needed for variety's sake. However, for sheer lethality, and all other factors being equal, skill would be the deciding factor. KDR matchmaking in an FPS is that winnowing fork that separates the wheat from the chaff. I mean, look at how people couch their complaints of OP weapons. They state that something killed an inordinate number of times to the deaths the user received. K D R. Lol the flaylock pistol doensn't stink, it's actually a decent sidearm weapon, and if you've used the core, it's like a mini Mass driver that fire straight. "One does not simply" run like a Raptor. Only mk.0 Scouts do ... wait... I'm still outclassed by Gal scouts.
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2327	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:31:00 - [123] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Lol the flaylock pistol doensn't stink, it's actually a decent sidearm weapon, and if you've used the core, it's like a mini Mass driver that fire straight. I am sorry. I didn't intend that characterization to be a generalist review of the Flaylock. I was merely using the other poster's example as an illustration of my greater point. If you can get good kills with a Flaylock, then more power to you. And more competition, too. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2328	Posted - 2014.07.18 23:47:00 - [124] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: I mean, look at how people couch their complaints of OP weapons. They state that something killed an inordinate number of times to the deaths the user received. K D R. While most of what you said is very true, player skill really is primary influence, take a look at the combat rifle. It has lowest CPU/PG, highest DPS, and -5% +10% damage profile, + very high accuracy rating. How does this weapon not warrant a nerf? It has stats that take player skill and multiply it's effectiveness because of just how much better it is. But, if the player using this weapon is constantly pitted against other players with similar lethality, the weapon becomes either less of a factor, or more obvious of a target for tuning. Until then, it's all speculation and knob-twisting. Imagine all the CR crutch-riders having no one to shoot at but each other. You have to break out of the mentality that you can cripple/enhance something as complicated as a wad of people into equality. The Indiana Pacers don't routinely play high school teams. Why? Because it's pointless and a bit cruel. However, almost any serious high school basketball player would love to play in the NBA. They just have to improve to do so. Some make it to college ball and farm teams, some make the NBA, some go to other countries' leagues. It's a fairly flawed analogy, but I hope it helps. I'm not against nerfing anything, per se, but there's no need for leaving a fitting you love just because it gets you killed. Proper KDR matchmaking allows you to test the limits of every tactical aspect available without getting meaninglessly slaughtered while doing so. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Ralden Caster KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 65	Posted - 2014.07.19 01:47:00 - [125] - Quote calvin b wrote: My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Active scanners and precision enhancers. "AHAHAHAHAA, I TELEPORTED BREAD!!!" -Soldier 2014
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 198	Posted - 2014.07.19 02:51:00 - [126] - Quote Ralden Caster wrote: calvin b wrote: My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Active scanners and precision enhancers. Cuz that's working right?! Smh?! "Anybody order chaos?"
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5352	Posted - 2014.07.19 03:11:00 - [127] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Ralden Caster wrote: calvin b wrote: My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Active scanners and precision enhancers. Cuz that's working right?! Smh?! Well. yeah.they are. Unless i put 2 cx Profile dampeners i get picked up with my Gk.0 scout even in pub games. Stealth Storm
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 198	Posted - 2014.07.19 05:42:00 - [128] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Bradric Banewolf wrote: Ralden Caster wrote: calvin b wrote: My question to CCP how do you defend against a target you cant see. Sure I can see what is front of me but how many times have you been ambushed by group of scouts that appeared out of nowhere. Active scanners and precision enhancers. Cuz that's working right?! Smh?! Well. yeah.they are. Unless i put 2 cx Profile dampeners i get picked up with my Gk.0 scout even in pub games. For scouts, but everyone isn't running scouts. Every time this convo comes up scouts jump up screaming about what they can do, but fail to realize that the rest of us have other things to do with our slots besides look for you! Sure I can get scout and stack dampening and precision mods all day, but whose gonna do everything else if e all do that? We're refering to the scout/assault storm that is too fast to hit, doesn't take dmg, dissapears, has 400 armor, combat rifles, and a hitbox the size of a stop sign pole?! The fact that we're having this convo AGAIN should state the obvious?! One simply has to log on, and play any other role in ambush. Sooner than later you will see exactly what we're referring to. "Anybody order chaos?"
Mejt0 Made in Poland... E-R-A 195	Posted - 2014.07.19 13:32:00 - [129] - Quote Stop that already! That hate all around scouts. You think its that easy? Grab one and play vs normal players (read : not blueberrys). My caldari scout can be taken down by 1 charged vizia scr shoot.. no matter if your scout have 300-700ehp, scr melts every scout. No matter if its armor or shield. 15 shoots (without amarr bonus) is egnouth to take down shield + 500+ armor. Now they are taking aways caldari precision. So now you will see what is tanking. Most cals will run 4x shield because there will be no sense to eqiup 2enchancers to scan 1x damp scout. Hitbox is a problem? Then how bad are you? Because militia blueberry can spot and take out my cloaked scout from 60+ meters. If you have problem with tanked scout, eqiup scanner, ScR/CR and kill them. Or can you only qq about how bad are you and cant kill everyone? ... -~-~-~-Caldari Loyalist-~-~-~-My CreoDron wont miss any of you
Talon Paetznick II Gallente Federation Resistance 47	Posted - 2014.07.19 14:05:00 - [130] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: calvin... there have been carbon copies of your thread ever since the cloak came out... and it's always been laughed at because the only thing that made the cloak OP was its dampening bonus. they removed it for the most part and only proto has 10% bonus now, which is the only reason anyone even uses the proto cloak anymore. if you're not at least 50 meters out, the cloak ACTUALLY MAKES YOU EASIER TO SPOT WHAT?!!!! No it doesn't! You guys are playing an entirely different game because the scouts I see are racing toward me at 8 or 9 m/s with a shotgun, 400 armor, and 300 shield?! I got all of no seconds to fire before he shoots me?! I never see the nova knives?! that's because we never attack from the front we will get killed instantly cloaks and cover let us lip behind you even if you're in a large group high risk/reward playstyle dem NK's dust math: getting killed by ion pistol = dropping the soap,useful item= nerfhammer, protostomp= WHY GOD!!!

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3070	Posted - 2014.07.19 14:25:00 - [131] - Quote calvin b wrote: A flux should be able to prevent a cloak from working temporary and should cause a cool down before reuse. Agreed with the statement above. The rest ... not so much. In the next few builds, I suspect that (1) Assaults will become the go-to slayer suit, (2) Scout populations will plummet and those who remain will be less tanky, and (3) Heavies will likely remain OP for a spell but will inevitably be brought into balance with the others. That said, a Scout behind you with knives or a shotgun will always be deadly, as will finding yourself face-to-face with an HMG. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1765	Posted - 2014.07.19 15:56:00 - [132] - Quote Mejt0 wrote: Stop that already! That hate all around scouts. You think its that easy? Grab one and play vs normal players (read : not blueberrys). My caldari scout can be taken down by 1 charged vizia scr shoot.. no matter if your scout have 300-700ehp, scr melts every scout. No matter if its armor or shield. 15 shoots (without amarr bonus) is egnouth to take down shield + 500+ armor. Now they are taking aways caldari precision. So now you will see what is tanking. Most cals will run 4x shield because there will be no sense to eqiup 2enchancers to scan 1x damp scout. Hitbox is a problem? Then how bad are you? Because militia blueberry can spot and take out my cloaked scout from 60+ meters. If you have problem with tanked scout, eqiup scanner, ScR/CR and kill them. Or can you only qq about how bad are you and cant kill everyone? ... Or the fact you suck as a scout. If you cant go 30+ kills running in a cal scout with a CR or SG you suck. The fact is it is too easy to use the scout and I cant wait for the scrubs hiding behind another FOTM to have to play on an even field and not hide behind another crutch. The cloak and built in scanners give the scout such a huge advantage over other suits its ridiculous. The fact your defending them says a lot about you. Also hit box is 1/4th of any other suit, so the question how terrible are you that you cant pull off more than 30 kills a game with such an easy crutch? Closed Beta Vet and Retired Heavy. Assaults 07
Baal Omniscient Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1973	Posted - 2014.07.19 16:23:00 - [133] - Quote Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. Cross Atu for CPM1 Winmatar Assault, Proficiency 5 SMG's & Proficiency 5 Swarms Since Uprising 1.0
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 199	Posted - 2014.07.19 21:06:00 - [134] - Quote calvin b wrote: Mejt0 wrote: Stop that already! That hate all around scouts. You think its that easy? Grab one and play vs normal players (read : not blueberrys). My caldari scout can be taken down by 1 charged vizia scr shoot.. no matter if your scout have 300-700ehp, scr melts every scout. No matter if its armor or shield. 15 shoots (without amarr bonus) is egnouth to take down shield + 500+ armor. Now they are taking aways caldari precision. So now you will see what is tanking. Most cals will run 4x shield because there will be no sense to eqiup 2enchancers to scan 1x damp scout. Hitbox is a problem? Then how bad are you? Because militia blueberry can spot and take out my cloaked scout from 60+ meters. If you have problem with tanked scout, eqiup scanner, ScR/CR and kill them. Or can you only qq about how bad are you and cant kill everyone? ... Or the fact you suck as a scout. If you cant go 30+ kills running in a cal scout with a CR or SG you suck. The fact is it is too easy to use the scout and I cant wait for the scrubs hiding behind another FOTM to have to play on an even field and not hide behind another crutch. The cloak and built in scanners give the scout such a huge advantage over other suits its ridiculous. The fact your defending them says a lot about you. Also hit box is 1/4th of any other suit, so the question how terrible are you that you cant pull off more than 30 kills a game with such an easy crutch? +1 "Anybody order chaos?"
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5362	Posted - 2014.07.19 21:47:00 - [135] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. UNLESS, you have to match the Cloak's level to be able to disrup it. If you have Proto Flux Equipped i could live with a little disruption here and there...But then EVERYBODY and their mothers would run around with Flux grenades and i think Caldari's suffer enough as it is. And to Calvin B. I understand your chate for FOTMers, but what about people that have always been scouts? Dont we deserve to keep cloaks and good scotus AFTER we've been struggling with them for SO long? Have everyone already forgotten Med frames with Duvolles have ran this game for a VERY long time? Stealth Storm
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4240	Posted - 2014.07.19 22:42:00 - [136] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: But, if the player using this weapon is constantly pitted against other players with similar lethality, the weapon becomes either less of a factor, or more obvious of a target for tuning. Until then, it's all speculation and knob-twisting. Imagine all the CR crutch-riders having no one to shoot at but each other. You have to break out of the mentality that you can cripple/enhance something as complicated as a wad of people into equality. The Indiana Pacers don't routinely play high school teams. Why? Because it's pointless and a bit cruel. However, almost any serious high school basketball player would love to play in the NBA. They just have to improve to do so. Some make it to college ball and farm teams, some make the NBA, some go to other countries' leagues. It's a fairly flawed analogy, but I hope it helps. . That works if you want a very boring game. All you'd get is Calscouts playing calscouts, combat rifles versus combat rifles. It would kill the diversity of the match and it would not resolve PC. Basically PC would continue to be a CR fest and pub matches would be limited in what gear appears on the field. The wad of people to whom you refer to may be complicated as a whole but at the epicenter they are based on items. Only until the epicenter of the wad of people is not itemcentric then you will have balance. Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Baal Omniscient Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1979	Posted - 2014.07.19 23:52:00 - [137] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. Not to sound snarky but..... you could... avoid the grenade? A basic Locus grenade can kill many scouts. Losing your cloak at least leaves you the opportunity to defend yourself or run. Cross Atu for CPM1 Winmatar Assault, Proficiency 5 SMG's & Proficiency 5 Swarms Since Uprising 1.0
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5366	Posted - 2014.07.19 23:57:00 - [138] - Quote Baal Omniscient wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. Not to sound snarky but..... you could... avoid the grenade? A basic Locus grenade can kill many scouts. Losing your cloak at least leaves you the opportunity to defend yourself or run. Well, not to sound snarky but....you guys could...shoot the invisible scouts instead of doing Nerf/QQ/Anti cloak threads...? Plus a flux grenades has even at basic level more splash range than a locus. Stealth Storm
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD 199	Posted - 2014.07.20 00:01:00 - [139] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. Not to sound snarky but..... you could... avoid the grenade? A basic Locus grenade can kill many scouts. Losing your cloak at least leaves you the opportunity to defend yourself or run. Well, not to sound snarky but....you guys could...shoot the invisible scouts instead of doing Nerf/QQ/Anti cloak threads...? Plus a flux grenades has even at basic level more splash range than a locus. Shoot the invisible scout?! ok "Anybody order chaos?"
trollface dot jpg The Bacon Corporation 226	Posted - 2014.07.20 03:23:00 - [140] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. Not to sound snarky but..... you could... avoid the grenade? A basic Locus grenade can kill many scouts. Losing your cloak at least leaves you the opportunity to defend yourself or run. Well, not to sound snarky but....you guys could...shoot the invisible scouts instead of doing Nerf/QQ/Anti cloak threads...? Plus a flux grenades has even at basic level more splash range than a locus. If I could shoot through walls at the invisible scouts hiding inside of buildings, I would. You may like being forced to round corners right into areas with cloaked shotty scouts waiting within without a counter, but most of us do not. Just like most of us don't like having to spec into one of two things to counter cloaks because everyone else is doing so. =P If you like, you can make flux grenades drain the cloak without draining your shield if you cloak is active when you are hit, but cloaks need a hard counter and this is not only fair but also likely the easiest solution. RIP MAG, you will be missed. MAG Vet ~ Raven

KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5374	Posted - 2014.07.20 03:35:00 - [141] - Quote trollface dot jpg wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Baal Omniscient wrote: Just to reiterate, making flux grenades deplete the timer on the cloak makes the cloak balanced. A flux can be equipped by anyone, whereas other counters require you to either skill a certain class of suit OR skill a certain class of suit AND an equipment. A flux is a STD grenade anyone can use. Fully depleting a cloak with a flux not only renders a scout visible, but also makes the scout have to wait until it's cloak recharges to use it again. I DONT AGREE. Having a grenade ANYONE can equip with only Level 1 in Grenadier, Disrupt my prototype cloak on my 190k Scout suit doesnt seem at ALL fair to me. Not to sound snarky but..... you could... avoid the grenade? A basic Locus grenade can kill many scouts. Losing your cloak at least leaves you the opportunity to defend yourself or run. Well, not to sound snarky but....you guys could...shoot the invisible scouts instead of doing Nerf/QQ/Anti cloak threads...? Plus a flux grenades has even at basic level more splash range than a locus. If I could shoot through walls at the invisible scouts hiding inside of buildings, I would. You may like being forced to round corners right into areas with cloaked shotty scouts waiting within without a counter, but most of us do not. Just like most of us don't like having to spec into one of two things to counter cloaks because everyone else is doing so. =P If you like, you can make flux grenades drain the cloak without draining your shield if you cloak is active when you are hit, but cloaks need a hard counter and this is not only fair but also likely the easiest solution. People forget im not ONLY a scout. I play as assault and Heavy too depending on the situation. But i understan how a scout thinks. You people talk about using Flux to drain teh cloak right? well a M-1 grenade will plain literally just KILL 99% of the scouts and if not, believe me that the scout with 1EHP left WONT stay still after being hit. Chuck a M1 or Core and kill the scouts hiding.Simple enough. 'If you like, you can make flux grenades drain the cloak without draining your shield if you cloak is active when you are hit, but cloaks need a hard counter and this is not only fair but also likely the easiest solution'' I dont really think the cloak NEEDS another hard counter. Passive/active scanning reveals the exact location and while moving scouts are VERY visible. Stealth Storm
Patrick57 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7788	Posted - 2014.07.20 03:44:00 - [142] - Quote Cloaked Scout FoTM and Proto Heavy here. o/ I can honestly say that I have far more trouble dealing with Heavies than Scouts anymore. Especially when most matches consist of 25-50% Heavies. In fact, the only cloaked Scouts I've had trouble with for my past two days of no-lifing the game are TTW3x and CatDog. King Thunderbolt is my number one fan. :D TFR
Leanna Boghin Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 248	Posted - 2014.07.20 03:52:00 - [143] - Quote Cloaks in my opinion are for lazy people that dont want to bother to spec into profile dampening or for people who have no skills at this game what so ever. If your good enough in the game (i use a cloak btw so i will admit im a crappy scout) as a scout you will have no need for a cloak. And the cloak itself isnt a problem just the delay the cloak has before changing to visible when someone is shooting you in the back. Getting killed by an invisible target is a big pain in the ass. I let my sniper rifle bullet to your face do all the talking :P
KING CHECKMATE Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 5376	Posted - 2014.07.20 04:26:00 - [144] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Cloaks in my opinion are for lazy people that dont want to bother to spec into profile dampening or for people who have no skills at this game what so ever. I have ALL E-war Skills at 5 and i have a decent 3-ish (i dont really check it but...) K-D ratio, while wearing scouts suits since Chromo.... So even if im not a ''beast player'' I have enough skill and i dont use the CLoak as a crutch,but more as a tool to prepare an assault/retreat. So as you see, you are assuming stuff that is not correct. MAny players with cloaked are SKILLEd. So much it makes scrubs think the cloak is broken ;) Stealth Storm
trollface dot jpg The Bacon Corporation 226	Posted - 2014.07.20 06:10:00 - [145] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: People forget im not ONLY a scout. I play as assault and Heavy too depending on the situation. But i understan how a scout thinks. You people talk about using Flux to drain teh cloak right? well a M-1 grenade will plain literally just KILL 99% of the scouts and if not, believe me that the scout with 1EHP left WONT stay still after being hit. Chuck a M1 or Core and kill the scouts hiding.Simple enough. 'If you like, you can make flux grenades drain the cloak without draining your shield if you cloak is active when you are hit, but cloaks need a hard counter and this is not only fair but also likely the easiest solution'' I dont really think the cloak NEEDS another hard counter. Passive/active scanning reveals the exact location and while moving scouts are VERY visible. So as a trade off for not killing you, the flux just makes you not invisible and takes away your extra dampening given by your cloak. AND you've been a scout since Chrome apparently, so you can cope without having your cloak for the minuscule amount of time it takes to get it halfway charged. So what's your beef with it having a hard counter again? And yes passive/active scanning does work... if you've specced into one of the two classes who specializes in those things. Without a proto Gallogi dodging the scan with a good cloak requires no effort whatsoever, simply stacking on a few proto damps which have pitifully low fitting req's. RIP MAG, you will be missed. MAG Vet ~ Raven
The True Inferno Myrmidon Syndicate 23	Posted - 2014.07.20 10:16:00 - [146] - Quote What I would suggest to fix this would be to increase the CPU on scouts, though right now your probably thinking "WTF you saying!? BUFF them again? Yo crazy" first, let me finish and second yes I am. I would suggest to increase the CPU on scouts WHILE severely reducing the PG, why may you ask? because every E-war module only takes CPU. This would intern emphsise the usage of scan modules and dampeners on scout suits, mainly because you would not be able to fit much hp modules on. This would have scouts become more stealthy, scanny and, if they fail to ambush you, easier to kill. ScP = GÖÑ Recent fat scout (sentinel w/shotty and cin-cats)
Dovallis Martan JenusKoll Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 874	Posted - 2014.07.20 10:49:00 - [147] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Plus : Scouts are MEANT to play solo. They cannot move with a whole squad due to their location being revealed due to their squadmates precision. They are low HP solo players most of the time.... ...Who can out-tank and out-dodge an assault suit. Dodging + more health than assaults = 2-3x more EHP due to bullet loss that otherwise would have hit. http://youtu.be/dtXupQg77SU Dust to Dust Remember the dream you had before the day you were born.
Mejt0 Made in Poland... E-R-A 196	Posted - 2014.07.20 11:18:00 - [148] - Quote We use cloaks as a tool. It helps when you want run around group of enemies at open arena. As some already said, skilled players actually use cloak too. If it help with doing scout things, im gonna use it. If i have 300hp, i have right to suprise atack over your 2-5x more hp suit. But we all know that its not really about cloaks. Its your hate against scouts and you like complaining than doing something. Scout with SG (no cloak) will still wreck you, no matter what, so will you complain about that also? I think you will. -~-~-Caldari Loyalist-~-~- Those are people!, Those are people!, I'm gonna go say hi to the people! < Markiplier
Ralden Caster KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 66	Posted - 2014.07.20 17:08:00 - [149] - Quote How about make precision enhancers increase scan precision with an active scanner? "AHAHAHAHAA, I TELEPORTED BREAD!!!" -Soldier 2014
843-Vika BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 91	Posted - 2014.07.20 17:41:00 - [150] - Quote Leanna Boghin wrote: Cloaks in my opinion are for lazy people that dont want to bother to spec into profile dampening or for people who have no skills at this game what so ever. If your good enough in the game (i use a cloak btw so i will admit im a crappy scout) as a scout you will have no need for a cloak. And the cloak itself isnt a problem just the delay the cloak has before changing to visible when someone is shooting you in the back. Getting killed by an invisible target is a big pain in the ass. only a proto cloak has any real kind of dampening and only 10% at that. if your running as a scout and you have not finished your passive scans, passive scan range and passive dampening, then your going to be nothing but a red blip on the tacnet and nothing more then a moving target. until the the next hot fix, the only scout that could even come close to not needing level 5 dampening is the gal scout since its passive does the same thing, but at the same time any skilled scout, even a gal scout knows that to be effective you need to max out your passive scout skills to be any kind of effective on the battle field.

calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1769	Posted - 2014.07.20 19:41:00 - [151] - Quote This length of discussion shows how divided we are as a player base. I would like to see the radar eliminated for it brings false since of awareness. It should look like this on top of the screen where the radar once was. 150/150 <------ Clone count 100/100 100/100 <-------- First number is shields and the second is Armor % for the MCC That's it CCP lets make it simple and do away with radar and give me visual Closed Beta Vet and Retired Heavy. Assaults 07
KING CHECKMATE Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 5387	Posted - 2014.07.20 20:16:00 - [152] - Quote Dovallis Martan JenusKoll wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Plus : Scouts are MEANT to play solo. They cannot move with a whole squad due to their location being revealed due to their squadmates precision. They are low HP solo players most of the time.... ...Who can out-tank and out-dodge an assault suit. Dodging + more health than assaults = 2-3x more EHP due to bullet loss that otherwise would have hit. This is the Assault suit being underpowered. Plus you are talking about a TANKED scout, not real scouts. Whats so scary about a tanked scout? they have little less Scan profile, less scan precision? Cloak? Because they are not fully dampened, dont have full radar functions and are not fast. The scout suit is working as intended and has solid numbers. If someone wants to use them as Light assaults so be it, but they are not using the scout for its intended purpose and there by only using the Cloak Bonus of the Scout. Stealth Storm
KING CHECKMATE Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 5388	Posted - 2014.07.20 20:22:00 - [153] - Quote trollface dot jpg wrote: So as a trade off for not killing you, the flux just makes you not invisible and takes away your extra dampening given by your cloak. AND you've been a scout since Chrome apparently, so you can cope without having your cloak for the minuscule amount of time it takes to get it halfway charged. So what's your beef with it having a hard counter again? And yes passive/active scanning does work... if you've specced into one of the two classes who specializes in those things. Without a proto Gallogi dodging the scan with a good cloak requires no effort whatsoever, simply stacking on a few proto damps which have pitifully low fitting req's. Its not like i cant play without a cloak. To be quite honest these Scout suits we have are the best ive played since the Type-II Proto in Chromo. I could easily (and i sometimes do) play without Cloak ( Uplinks + Remote Explosives) on a 300ish scout and do just fine. ( Range Amps/precision enhancers,Profile damps and kin cats + SG) the reason im against another hard counter is because i truly believe is not needed. As i mentioned before i dont play ONLY as a scout and i REALLY think is all about thinking as a scout a little... Im ALSO against it because the hard counter proposed is the Flux grenade, and even if I dont currently own more than 1 ADV Caldari basic Frame , i think Caldari soldiers are already against the tide and if the Flux was a hard counter for scouts they would end getting owned because of all the flux spam. Stealth Storm
The Eristic Dust 90210 578	Posted - 2014.07.20 20:23:00 - [154] - Quote The True Inferno wrote: What I would suggest to fix this would be to increase the CPU on scouts, though right now your probably thinking "WTF you saying!? BUFF them again? Yo crazy" first, let me finish and second yes I am. I would suggest to increase the CPU on scouts WHILE severely reducing the PG, why may you ask? because every E-war module only takes CPU. This would intern emphsise the usage of scan modules and dampeners on scout suits, mainly because you would not be able to fit much hp modules on. This would have scouts become more stealthy, scanny and, if they fail to ambush you, easier to kill. This would be ok if not for bloody kincats. Reality is the original Rorschach. Verily! So much for all that.
Kira Takizawa Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 199	Posted - 2014.07.21 07:16:00 - [155] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Leanna Boghin wrote: Cloaks in my opinion are for lazy people that dont want to bother to spec into profile dampening or for people who have no skills at this game what so ever. I have ALL E-war Skills at 5 and i have a decent 3-ish (i dont really check it but...) K-D ratio, while wearing scouts suits since Chromo.... So even if im not a ''beast player'' I have enough skill and i dont use the CLoak as a crutch,but more as a tool to prepare an assault/retreat. So as you see, you are assuming stuff that is not correct. MAny players with cloaks are SKILLED. So much it makes scrubs think the cloak is broken ;) Saying scouts like Mollerz,Mr.Musturd,Dagger,Frosty kitty.Ozarow (well, Frosty Kitty is IMO, a FOTM chaser but hell, he has skill so whatevs...) are lacking in skill is demented... Many players with cloaks aren't skilled some of the scouts you've named started to really lack in skills and in fear factor like they used to. I see some of them now I know they will cloak and I just leave battle unlike pre 1.8 I loved to see them on the battlefield as I could fight them faced to face other than hunting them down and trying to find which cloaker is the one I want to stab. I might not have a decent K/D either but I have been scouting since 1.4-1.5 and it was harder back then than now.. I rather the struggle than seeing those that I've looked up to stoop to using cloaks.. If you are a true scout you don't need a cloak I've realized it a bit too late as I specced and wasted SP trying to use the cloak as a stealth hacker but doesn't go well with spam of Cal and Gal scouts. Honestly for balanced I do want to see what the Cal scouts will become in Charlie and the Gal's passive needs to be toned down as well. I mean I've seen a gal scout today that had 120ish shields and 550ish armor run as fast as my min and cloaked/off the radar that's something I don't like to see as a scout user. I'm just like you King I'm an assault/logi/scout/heavy I just want balanced but something on the Gal suit have to give now whether it's their cpu/pg, their bonus gets changed or whatever it be then we will see where the scouts stand
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1241	Posted - 2014.07.24 05:13:00 - [156] - Quote Thurak1 wrote: Leadfoot10 wrote: Thurak1 wrote: When facing a scout there are a few things i can figure out instantly. Like if they are using a kb/mouse and if they have a clue. KB/mouse scouts that know what they are doing are dammed near impossible to kill they are like bouncing flying cat ninjas! they are just all over the dam place. Even with my HMG at nearly point blank i am lucky to even hit them never mind take their shields down. scouts using a controller even if they are experienced are much easier to hit and their movements far less erratic. Most of the time i can turn them into a pile of ooze. Huh? Are you serious? How you can possibly tell who is using a MKB and who is using a DS3 by how they jump or how erratically they move is COMPLETELY beyond me, and I suspect you are simply projecting false logic to a problem of varied skill levels in your opponents. The best five scouts I know all use DS3. In fact, I don't know of a A+ scout (or, frankly any top infantry slayer) that uses MKB. They might be out there -- and if anyone knows of one, please do correct me -- but I've not met them. Have you used a MKB with Dust? It's what I usually play with -- so please trust me when I tell you it's not MKB that you're seeing. its pretty simple really. With the ds3 there is a acceleration curve with movement. With the keyboard there isnt a curve. I am surprised you can't tell. Its far easier to move around in different directions with a kb than with a controller. Yes i play with a keyboard and mouse from time to time. I am still getting used to it and the menu controlls stink but otherwise it is far better for movement. Just because you havent meet such a player does not actually mean anything. Honestly though i think you are just trolling because i can't believe anyone thinks that something with an acceleration curve is better than something with 0 curve. I'm not trolling, I've tested it. Extensively. It is only simple in your mind. There is virtually no difference in "acceleration curve" between MKB and DS3, and to the contrary, there is input lag with MKB and a lack of AA that make it much harder to play/slay with. Movement has virtually no affect on the game -- and circle strafing is far easier with a DS3. Let me ask you a direct question, since you use both: Which do you do better with?


Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.