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THE RAIL RIFLE IS NOT OP - STOP THE QQ

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Vermaak Doe SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1289	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:45:00 - [181] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: So you don't like using it but since you hate losing and won't learn how to use the prior weapon you were using, you use the "OP" rifle to make a point? That's kiddish like What's wrong with him using it if it's not op, even though it's so obviously an improvement over his former weapon. "Always fight dirty, the victor writes history" Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
Sam Tektzby Better Hide R Die 134	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:46:00 - [182] - Quote Oki boyos what was was, just let it be. Support - Tactician/Support Deteis - Orator
Izlare Lenix FREE AGENTS LP 117	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:49:00 - [183] - Quote For the weapon with the most range it IS too effective in cqc. The charge up time is a broken balancing mechanic that has too many ways to cheat and get around it. If they reduced the hip fire accuracy that would reduce its cqc potential without harming its long killing power. Gun control is not about guns, it about control. The only way to ensure your freedom is by having the means to defend it
xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN 92	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:52:00 - [184] - Quote I have all the rifles (prof 3)like them all for different reasons but when one outclasses the others the community as a whole will not avoid the weapon because its OP but flock to it instead. (If history has taught us anything) there's no point no one will ever say their toy is OP the only way CCP will balance is through numbers. If more and more people start running it then it will show and I'm now willing to accept the nature of the weapon cycle. If me abusing an OP gun will help push along the hard numbers so be it.
KGB Sleep Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 688	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:56:00 - [185] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: For the weapon with the most range it IS too effective in cqc. The charge up time is a broken balancing mechanic that has too many ways to cheat and get around it. If they reduced the hip fire accuracy that would reduce its cqc potential without harming its long killing power. That would actually make the RR better, as in more hits would land on strafing enemies. The HMG used to suffer from pinpoint accuracy and then when they gave it spread it was a huge improvement. "Because beer, that's why."
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1786	Posted - 2014.02.01 05:56:00 - [186] - Quote I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless. OP, when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR.Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.1 Amarr victor!
Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 656	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:00:00 - [187] - Quote KGB Sleep wrote: Vermaak Doe wrote: And the rr is better than the ar at everything, how do you not see the imbalance? It is supposed to be better. The AR was godly prior to the new weapons dropping. so much so that people were citing lore reasons and everything they could think of to get it nerfed. "Gallente plasma dissipates quickly! lower the range!" and "AR is too strong in cqc!" "Reduce RoF!" and all the same crap that people like you complain about. What happened? The AR got a range BUFF and was brought in line exactly like the community wanted. Now it sucks so guess what that means? QQ is stupid. That's what it means. The Rail Rifle is perfect there are just some whiners that think its OP. That's because they HAVE to find a way to invalidate their mistakes. As long as they can blame a common weapon it somehow excuses them from taking responsibility for their mistakes. Got caught in the open at range? That's a mistake. Got mowed down in cqc with your combat rifle? Think about it while you bleed out in your scout suit. No the AR is still OP, we just have more OP stuff right now overshadowing it. Why the hell should anyone use the HMG or Shotgun over CR? Or RR over Laser or MD? Their optimals just aren't worth it, especially when Rifles still beat them inside of it. All Rifle need to be nerfed down to the level of everything else in the game.
Izlare Lenix FREE AGENTS LP 117	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:01:00 - [188] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: I have all the rifles (prof 3)like them all for different reasons but when one outclasses the others the community as a whole will not avoid the weapon because its OP but flock to it instead. (If history has taught us anything) there's no point no one will ever say their toy is OP the only way CCP will balance is through numbers. If more and more people start running it then it will show and I'm now willing to accept the nature of the weapon cycle. If me abusing an OP gun will help push along the hard numbers so be it. Sadly thus is true. Anyone that plays EVE will remember the days when the Dramiel was the most OP frigate in the game. It outshined dozens of other frigates by a huge margin. CCP finally nerfed the dramiel when that was the ONLY frigate you ever saw on the battle field. Everyone used it because the other frigates sucked by comparison. The irony is back then the dramiel lovers often posted on the forums claiming dramiels weren't OP when they clearly were. Sounds familiar. Gun control is not about guns, it about control. The only way to ensure your freedom is by having the means to defend it
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2965	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:04:00 - [189] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless. OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. So I lose creditability for stating my opinion? I lose creditability because I come across guys who use the CR that drops me like 3 day old dog turd? Really? Oh I got it, I'm not saying what the cool kids club are saying...so I lose creditability. Frankly I don't give a ** about the creditability, I am firm believer that given any time with a weapon, you can maximize its potential. I still go up against guys who drop me with a CR and even a AR for that matter. And c'mon man, before the BRs yall were complaining about ARs. Yall always complaining. Never looking for a way around a problem, just *** and moan all the damn time. It's old, especially for folks who call themselves mercenaries in a frentic universal war in New Eden. So I'm speaking from experience. I actually play the game. I just don't run my mouth on the forum based off of information that is not up to date. Any weapon can be beast given the right time. The CR is beast itself. But most who just play pubs only see RRs because in pubs folks grab whatever they got killed with and use that weapon. Instead of learning how to maximize the lethality of other choices. I choose RR because its Caldari. And I still face considerable competition with experienced players who know how to use other rifles. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN 93	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:04:00 - [190] - Quote Justin Tymes wrote: KGB Sleep wrote: Vermaak Doe wrote: And the rr is better than the ar at everything, how do you not see the imbalance? It is supposed to be better. The AR was godly prior to the new weapons dropping. so much so that people were citing lore reasons and everything they could think of to get it nerfed. "Gallente plasma dissipates quickly! lower the range!" and "AR is too strong in cqc!" "Reduce RoF!" and all the same crap that people like you complain about. What happened? The AR got a range BUFF and was brought in line exactly like the community wanted. Now it sucks so guess what that means? QQ is stupid. That's what it means. The Rail Rifle is perfect there are just some whiners that think its OP. That's because they HAVE to find a way to invalidate their mistakes. As long as they can blame a common weapon it somehow excuses them from taking responsibility for their mistakes. Got caught in the open at range? That's a mistake. Got mowed down in cqc with your combat rifle? Think about it while you bleed out in your scout suit. No the AR is still OP, we just have more OP stuff right now overshadowing it. Why the hell should anyone use the HMG or Shotgun over CR? Or RR over Laser or MD? Their optimals just aren't worth it, especially when Rifles still beat them inside of it. All Rifle need to be nerfed down to the level of everything else in the game. So much truth +1 the duvolle was thought OP (and was) then the RR and CR came into being destroying all notion of OP by setting the bar high above that of its predecessor making the duvolle (compared to the new weapons) balanced or UP.

Vermaak Doe SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1289	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:06:00 - [191] - Quote KGB Sleep wrote: Izlare Lenix wrote: For the weapon with the most range it IS too effective in cqc. The charge up time is a broken balancing mechanic that has too many ways to cheat and get around it. If they reduced the hip fire accuracy that would reduce its cqc potential without harming its long killing power. That would actually make the RR better, as in more hits would land on strafing enemies. The HMG used to suffer from pinpoint accuracy and then when they gave it spread it was a huge improvement. I think it works so well on the hmg because of how much higher the rof and magazine is. "Always fight dirty, the victor writes history" Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
Izlare Lenix FREE AGENTS LP 117	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:09:00 - [192] - Quote Vermaak Doe wrote: KGB Sleep wrote: Izlare Lenix wrote: For the weapon with the most range it IS too effective in cqc. The charge up time is a broken balancing mechanic that has too many ways to cheat and get around it. If they reduced the hip fire accuracy that would reduce its cqc potential without harming its long killing power. That would actually make the RR better, as in more hits would land on strafing enemies. The HMG used to suffer from pinpoint accuracy and then when they gave it spread it was a huge improvement. I think it works so well on the hmg because of how much higher the rof and magazine is. This. For a high damage, low rate of fire weapon like the RR, a missed shoot is a lot of damage not being applied to your target. Reduce hip fire accuracy will hurt the RR in cqc but not effect it's long range abilities. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN 93	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:24:00 - [193] - Quote +1 to sig Izlare
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1788	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:34:00 - [194] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless. OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. So I lose creditability for stating my opinion? I lose creditability because I come across guys who use the CR that drops me like 3 day old dog turd? Really? Oh I got it, I'm not saying what the cool kids club are saying...so I lose creditability. Frankly I don't give a ** about the creditability, I am firm believer that given any time with a weapon, you can maximize its potential. I still go up against guys who drop me with a CR and even a AR for that matter. And c'mon man, before the BRs yall were complaining about ARs. Yall always complaining. Never looking for a way around a problem, just *** and moan all the damn time. It's old, especially for folks who call themselves mercenaries in a frentic universal war in New Eden. So I'm speaking from experience. I actually play the game. I just don't run my mouth on the forum based off of information that is not up to date. Any weapon can be beast given the right time. The CR is beast itself. But most who just play pubs only see RRs because in pubs folks grab whatever they got killed with and use that weapon. Instead of learning how to maximize the lethality of other choices. I choose RR because its Caldari. And I still face considerable competition with experienced players who know how to use other rifles. You lose credibility because "adapt and use the RR" is not a valid defense of the argument that it's not OP. Personally, I hate the RR. The spool up annoys me. I prefer the ScR but it takes too much CPU/PG and limits the quality of equipment I can carry so I use the closest equivalent with lower fit costs, the regular CR. But, I'm forced to use the RR on open maps because otherwise I'm killed by a weapon with nearly the same DPS, 40m greater range, and no goddamn bullet trails. I have all 4 racial rifles plus the LR to proto (yes, I play the game too, it did occur to me to do that before discussing the weapons, but thanks for the advice.). The RR is the only one I don't have prof in (again, I don't like it) but I have no choice, even though I don't have prof 3 like I do the CR it just works too well... it's the only counter to itself, which is not a terrible definition of OP, if you think about it. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.1 Amarr victor!
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2966	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:47:00 - [195] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: Michael Arck wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless. OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. So I lose creditability for stating my opinion? I lose creditability because I come across guys who use the CR that drops me like 3 day old dog turd? Really? Oh I got it, I'm not saying what the cool kids club are saying...so I lose creditability. Frankly I don't give a ** about the creditability, I am firm believer that given any time with a weapon, you can maximize its potential. I still go up against guys who drop me with a CR and even a AR for that matter. And c'mon man, before the BRs yall were complaining about ARs. Yall always complaining. Never looking for a way around a problem, just *** and moan all the damn time. It's old, especially for folks who call themselves mercenaries in a frentic universal war in New Eden. So I'm speaking from experience. I actually play the game. I just don't run my mouth on the forum based off of information that is not up to date. Any weapon can be beast given the right time. The CR is beast itself. But most who just play pubs only see RRs because in pubs folks grab whatever they got killed with and use that weapon. Instead of learning how to maximize the lethality of other choices. I choose RR because its Caldari. And I still face considerable competition with experienced players who know how to use other rifles. turns around and comes back to thread You lose credibility because "adapt and use the RR" is not a valid defense of the argument that it's not OP. Personally, I hate the RR. The spool up annoys me. I prefer the ScR but it takes too much CPU/PG and limits the quality of equipment I can carry so I use the closest equivalent with lower fit costs, the regular CR. But, I'm forced to use the RR on open maps because otherwise I'm killed by a weapon with nearly the same DPS, 40m greater range, and no goddamn bullet trails. I have all 4 racial rifles plus the LR to proto (yes, I play the game too, it did occur to me to do that before discussing the weapons, but thanks for the advice.). The RR is the only one I don't have prof in (again, I don't like it) but I have no choice, even though I don't have prof 3 like I do the CR it just works too well... it's the only counter to itself, which is not a terrible definition of OP, if you think about it. If "adapting" means everyone has to use the same weapon to compete, then that's bland, generic, boring, and I want no part of it. I say good day to you, sir! walks away again man take that creditability and shove it up your ass Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 1789	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:48:00 - [196] - Quote My work here is done. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Forum Warrior lv.1 Amarr victor!
Vermaak Doe SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1291	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:49:00 - [197] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: Michael Arck wrote: John Demonsbane wrote: I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless. OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. So I lose creditability for stating my opinion? I lose creditability because I come across guys who use the CR that drops me like 3 day old dog turd? Really? Oh I got it, I'm not saying what the cool kids club are saying...so I lose creditability. Frankly I don't give a ** about the creditability, I am firm believer that given any time with a weapon, you can maximize its potential. I still go up against guys who drop me with a CR and even a AR for that matter. And c'mon man, before the BRs yall were complaining about ARs. Yall always complaining. Never looking for a way around a problem, just *** and moan all the damn time. It's old, especially for folks who call themselves mercenaries in a frentic universal war in New Eden. So I'm speaking from experience. I actually play the game. I just don't run my mouth on the forum based off of information that is not up to date. Any weapon can be beast given the right time. The CR is beast itself. But most who just play pubs only see RRs because in pubs folks grab whatever they got killed with and use that weapon. Instead of learning how to maximize the lethality of other choices. I choose RR because its Caldari. And I still face considerable competition with experienced players who know how to use other rifles. turns around and comes back to thread You lose credibility because "adapt and use the RR" is not a valid defense of the argument that it's not OP. Personally, I hate the RR. The spool up annoys me. I prefer the ScR but it takes too much CPU/PG and limits the quality of equipment I can carry so I use the closest equivalent with lower fit costs, the regular CR. But, I'm forced to use the RR on open maps because otherwise I'm killed by a weapon with nearly the same DPS, 40m greater range, and no goddamn bullet trails. I have all 4 racial rifles plus the LR to proto (yes, I play the game too, it did occur to me to do that before discussing the weapons, but thanks for the advice.). The RR is the only one I don't have prof in (again, I don't like it) but I have no choice, even though I don't have prof 3 like I do the CR it just works too well... it's the only counter to itself, which is not a terrible definition of OP, if you think about it. If "adapting" means everyone has to use the same weapon to compete, then that's bland, generic, boring, and I want no part of it. I say good day to you, sir! walks away again man take that creditability and shove it up your ass Lol "Always fight dirty, the victor writes history" Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2966	Posted - 2014.02.01 06:59:00 - [198] - Quote lol yea, try to make it sound like you orchestrated something grand. Corny. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Faunher Ivory Vanguard 127	Posted - 2014.02.01 07:26:00 - [199] - Quote As a user of the CR (and ACR) by choice, I find it OP in its intended range. Outside of that it is near to useless. As a user of the RR by necessity, I find it horribly OP up to its ridiculous range, and in CQC. It is down right stupid to be using another weapon. The downfall of the RR was supposed to be its spool up time and its ineffectiveness at CQC. The spool up time does hamper it a bit, but I find that the RR is one of the most effective CQC rifles in the game. I set up a test where I would play a few matches with the RR and the ACR, and I would only engage the enemy within the first ring on the radar, using hipfire (what I determined to be true CQC). I did 10 matches in total, five of each, and I switched the rifle every match to ensure consistent gameplay (or rather that a run of bad gameplay on my part didn't foul up the data for one rifle). On average, I got 6 kills more with the RR every match. I used AA on the ACR, and no AA on the RR. I am an absolutely terrible shot. The RR and ACR both have very similar recoil and very similar DPS. They are both fully automatic rifles. The argument, "You are just better with the RR" is entirely discarded in this sense. The RR is meant to be a medium-long ranged rifle. The ACR is supposed to be a short-medium range rifle. The RR is broken in the sense that it is comparable, and often favorable in CQC to the ACR. It is also worthy of noting that most of the targets I engaged were armor tanked, and the RR is favorable to the CR in engaging armor (20% for RR, 10% for CR, correct me if I am wrong). This may have been a considerable factor in my trials. This trend of armor tanking, as a result of the relative incompetence of shields as anything other then buffers, may be one of the leading reasons that RR are dominating in the current build. Possible solutions would be to possibly increase the amount of shield in extenders, to buff the other shield modules by a degree, or to retract the previous nerf to shield recharge. On a sidenote: I am not some lobbyist for the CR, nor am I butthurt because of the RR. Nowhere in this post will you find an opinionated piece of data. This is pure observation. This is just a post to show how the RR is not performing as intended, compared to other rifles.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2967	Posted - 2014.02.01 07:48:00 - [200] - Quote The Bad Assery of the RR Great track and video by Bolsh Lee. Loving the snares and the gunfire...great intro Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]

Kierkegaard Soren Forsaken Immortals Top Men. 188	Posted - 2014.02.01 12:30:00 - [201] - Quote KGB Sleep wrote: Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Most of our maps are weird. Objectives are centered around multiple. Complexes that are separated by vast tracks of open terrain. The RR, once you get into advanced level and above, can dominate infantry at over 100m out, and herein lies the issue; the game rewards keeping your distance, and the RR is a weapon that will never ask you to get in close. Which is why it's all the more galling that it's perfectly viable in CQC too. Between active scanners that allow you to set up the best possible engagement range (and even angle, when you consider that a scanner will show you the direction of your opponents facing), any drawback of the RR, such as it's minimal spool up time, are made largely irrelevant. I often run rr and cr on my suits and yeah, the cr is the most broken of the two. Zero dispersion, great range, best hip fire accuracy in the game and the burst fire is really just fully auto by a different name. But most of my kills came from the rr regardless. Why? Be use it can hit anything, from anywhere, any time. That's a problem that needs to be fixed. You admit the CR is "worse" but here you are in a RR thread. You just want the RR to be weak indoors. It is, but not so much that it can't function. What you want is a weapon that can't function in cqc. F that, that's dumb. Asking for a balance to the rr and the cr is not a mutually exclusive proposition. And I made specific mention to the cr here because the OP did and wanted to acknowledge that he had a good point with that. And no, I do not want the rr to "not function in CQC", something which I didn't actually say. I want it to be less effective in CQC, to the point where an AR will outperform it, all other things being equal. Right now, that isn't so clear cut. The same applies to long range comparisons between the rr and laser rifle. Fundamentally, I want all of our weapons to be equally viable and fun. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." -Paul Atreides.
Bradric Banewolf D3M3NT3D M1NDZ The Umbra Combine 73	Posted - 2014.02.01 18:11:00 - [202] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: @ Bradric Banewolf ''When I get lazy I grab a lvl one rail rifle, and just hipfire in cqc lol! You can say what you like, but you know were not lying lol! First time I used it it felt as if I was cheating! It's sooo easy! '' Yeah,like you cant just hipfire with ALL the rifles at basic level and do great. Sure. ''In fact! Post the stats next to each other, and let the reader's decide :). None of you RR advocates will dare do that because you know what I'm saying is true. My second grader looked at the stats, and said "daddy use the RR it has crazy dmg!" Lol, and he's in the second grade.'' WEll, DPS maths do not include .25 spool time that reduced the true DPS below all rifles. The breach assault rifle, for instance, is a short to mid range weapon offering fully automatic fire. Slow fire rate with high dmg. 51dmg, 400 rpm, clip size 36, and accuracy 56.92. No range stats, thanks ccp, but we all know we're not gonna fire too terribly far with it. It's primarily cqc. At lvl 5 the creadron breach assault rifle has the same fire rate, 56.10 dmg, accuracy 57.96, same clip size, and a higher meta lvl. Oh yeah, and a hefty price tag lol! The Breach AR is UP, loosing to MLT weapons consistently. 51 Dmg is nothing because of the LOW ROF and can be surpassed by all rifles.Comparing a specialized ''COPY'' of the RR is not fair. ''The Rail Rifle! It's a fast-firing, precision weapon designed for field OPerations where penetrative power and RANGE are paramount. Note: it's greater range and power are offset by a smaller magizine capacity and lower rate of fire than similarly classified weapons. Lvl 1 RR 55 dmg, rate of fire 461.54 rpm, accuracy rating 58.28, clip size 42. Oh my! It's already better than the lvl 5 creadron breach at everything the creadron is made for with more range and everything else! Wait! Buy a lvl one rail, and outclass lvl 5 AR's for approximately 75,780 isk less!'' The rail rifle is not fast firing (all Rifles shoot faster), it IS precise (same as all Rifles). Again you are comparing an UP weapon with a fully functional one, this is why CCP is buffing the Breach AR. NOT nerfing the RR. I could do them all, but I know you all can read. What shocks me is some of you want the AR to be nerfed even more so that the only half decently viable weapon to use against the rail is rendered useless?! That whole charge time is utterly unnoticed when using the RR. The scr's heat build up is a crutch, along with the LR's heat build up. The rail easily beats all other rifles in practical applications, stats be damned, and you know it. You saw that what we all saw, and went full ****** into it sp wise. Now your posting this afraid of the inevitable ccp OP weapon nerfing lol! It's not like they're gonna nerf it into oblivion like everyone seems to want them to do with the AR. Just gonna bring it down like the mass driver. I never said the AR needs a nerf, but i do understand that you ARE , in fact a butthurt AR player that finally met his match. ..like the mass driver? so unusable? You are afraid. Its ok bro. Changes are scary. But CCP will not be nerfing the RR just because a small part of the community , mostly Armor tankers that run in the open and AR users, (funny enough, CR,SCR users dont QQ so much about rail rifles). AGAIN,this is not when the TAC or FLaylock were used by 90+% of the people playing dust514. You've said nothing here, and are just denying cold facts regardless of how true they are. I gave you in-game stats verbatum. The rail rifle has a faster fire rate than the breach and tactical rifles. Just look for crying out loud. And we both know the spool up time is barely felt. I never said I didn't like the rail rifle, or that I was an AR user. Those were your assumptions as you have been on the defensive for some time now. What I am saying is that the rail rifle has more dmg than most, if not all rifles, with no shortcomings in any department. The spool up time is too miniscule to be considered a serious drawback. I compensated for that immediately. The AR is for assaulting or defending points, period. Any AR user trying to run around in the open is a lunatic. It's class has multiple variant types for multiple applications. I actually like where it is right now. It needs no buff! Buffing it back to where CCP nerfed it from originally is just stupid, and will ruin TTK?! Remember! TTK is what seperates a strategically tactical game from playing story mode on call of duty?! Buffing the weapons only makes players stack as many dmg mods as they can, forsaking shields, armor, and rechargers because they know they won't last long enough for any of this to be of use?! Is this the game you guys want? Weapons capable of bypassing armor and shields in less than a second? At the rate your talking the first player seen is dead?! Leading down the path of more snipers in game. Tanks are buffed so players either go anti armor, only to be wiped out by buffed rifles, or head to the redline to snipe?! Some fun?! Longer TTK leads to better battles, strategical and tactical application, and more thought put into dropsuits to help squad tactics. Less TTK turns this game into call of duty. Where there's just a race to get the game first, and get the betterweapon first?! The proverbial "I win button" I was referring to earlier. The rail rifle doesn't need to be nerfed because "I'm butthurt"?! It represents another idea from CCP that could ruin the potential of this game. Like the district locking episode?! We called that a disaster before it started?! Now look at the market we seem to not be getting because of it. Corpswith bilions due to district locking. The market will be flooded! Ever hear of inflation? If we just buff weapons making dropsuit defenses useless, I hope your next thread is about buffing armor and shields lol! "Anybody order chaos?"
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 268	Posted - 2014.02.02 12:59:00 - [203] - Quote The only thing that is broke is the clip size . Of you want to nerf it cq just nerf the clip size buy 30% give or take 5 Long range clip size do not matter sence you can reload 2-3 times before the charging red gets close any way. In CQ you should be ****** if you need to reload War never changes
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4326	Posted - 2014.02.03 00:28:00 - [204] - Quote John Demonsbane wrote: I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless and I'm not going to bother. OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. 1st-Im not a RR user 2nd-''OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument'' Well its not actually. Basically, this says, if YOU DONT HAVE THE SKILL TO KILL WITH AN AR, THEN USE THE RR. I use the SCR and the AR and i have no problem with RR, slightly vs Combat rifles. You see, the real ''STUPID'' argument here , is : '' I got killed while using an AR by a RR, so its OP'' when probably mopst people are trying to engage RR in their optimal range or get shot in CQ from behind , etcetc... Numbers dont SHOW the RR being the predominant weapons as other weapons have been in the past, and there is not enough hard facts to show how the RR is OP. Whinning because something kills you, now THATS stupid. 3rd- '' Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter? '' Say all the ASSAULT RIFLE USERS , HAHAHA.... Bro, this is a joke right...? CCP should first balance EVERYTHING to RIFLE level, then we can talk about rifle balance, which in my opinion already exists. 4th-''You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR'' NOT the same, since tanks only have 2 counters, while hundreds of players fight vs RR with other weapons and win, me included, and dont come to the forums to QQ. The concept is different, Tankers say they can be killed easily by a variety of weapons, WHEN ITS NOT TRUE. You people say the RR is OP, when there IS NOT a meaningful number of players using it , like the TAC or the Flaylock before it, and you even have lots and lots and lots of players that own RR's with their own weapons. You are reading Adapt or Die, but what it really says there is: '' Get Good or You'll have to use the FOTM to compete''. [i]THIS IS WHAT IM SAYING. if you CANT defeat the RR with your own weapon , go to the FOTM, because its not a problem of the game, its lack of skill.... AceOfJokers666 [ + ] AimBot / VALOR / MAG \| YOU EITHER LOVE BACON OR YOU ARE WRONG
bamboo x Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 65	Posted - 2014.02.03 00:38:00 - [205] - Quote Honestly they shouldn't nerf anything. Just balance it. And anyone who thinks AR stands a chance against CR or RR is an idiot.
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4326	Posted - 2014.02.03 00:42:00 - [206] - Quote bamboo x wrote: Honestly they shouldn't nerf anything. Just balance it. And anyone who thinks AR stands a chance against CR or RR is an idiot. Thanks for the insult, let me repay you my friend. Anyone who cant kill a RR or a CR user with an AR is a skill-less noob. AceOfJokers666 [ + ] AimBot / VALOR / MAG \| YOU EITHER LOVE BACON OR YOU ARE WRONG
Izlare Lenix FREE AGENTS LP 132	Posted - 2014.02.03 00:57:00 - [207] - Quote The RR is the only weapon in the game that can kill from zero meters out to 100 meters. Its "balancing" mechanic, the charge up, is easily overcome with scanner spams, pre-charging and pre-fireing. And more and more people are flocking to it since it has similar dps as the other rifles but significantly more range. Sounds OP to me. Regardless of what people think about the RR, the only thing CCP will look at when they consider changing an item is numbers. More and more players are useing the RR because it does cqc, medium and long range. And as more people use the RR, the closer it gets to dominating the kill feed, the closer it gets to getting nerfed. So spam them "not OP" RRs. It's days are numbered. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4327	Posted - 2014.02.03 01:23:00 - [208] - Quote Izlare Lenix wrote: The RR is the only weapon in the game that can kill from zero meters out to 100 meters. Its "balancing" mechanic, the charge up, is easily overcome with scanner spams, pre-charging and pre-fireing. And more and more people are flocking to it since it has similar dps as the other rifles but significantly more range. Sounds OP to me. Regardless of what people think about the RR, the only thing CCP will look at when they consider changing an item is numbers. More and more players are useing the RR because it does cqc, medium and long range. And as more people use the RR, the closer it gets to dominating the kill feed, the closer it gets to getting nerfed. So spam them "not OP" RRs. It's days are numbered. Lol, the RR will never be nerfed. People said the same about the SCR and insted got a buff. You know why? Because more people using the weapon means nothing if they all do horrible. And why will people do horrible with a RR? Well, because we have the trully skilled, (that there are about 30 players per weapon) and the whole rest that are sad FOTM chasers looking for a new crutch. You can have 90% of the people using Breach AR, But if all of them have 1 K-D ratio with it, CCP will consider it as balanced. Tough luck big guy. AceOfJokers666 [ + ] AimBot / VALOR / MAG \| YOU EITHER LOVE BACON OR YOU ARE WRONG
Izlare Lenix FREE AGENTS LP 132	Posted - 2014.02.03 02:03:00 - [209] - Quote The ScR has the best balancing mechanic in the game. You can't get around the heat buildup of the ScR like you can the chargeup time of the RR. And you seriously used the breach AR as an example? Another weapon with only half the range of a RR. Only time will tell what happens with the RR, but considering its only draw back can be easily nullified it is only going to get more popular. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 3025	Posted - 2014.02.03 02:08:00 - [210] - Quote I wouldn't be surprised if its nerf because of the community. And then the community is going to want a buff. The formula never dies and people never learn. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]



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