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Vermaak Doe
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Posted - 2014.01.30 01:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Most of the rail rifle complaints are based in hard facts, do the math and you'll see how the rail rifle is almost identical to the Ar's dps except with 30km more optimal and an almost ignorable charge time.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1256
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Posted - 2014.01.30 01:19:00 -
[2] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:Stop.
TTK is bad enough, and you propose to buff ALL other weapons instead of nerfing ONE?
Just don't.
This, a little common sense goes a long way.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
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Posted - 2014.01.30 02:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:deadlyAztec11 :''Well, the RR is simply OP because it is incredibly effective in CQC, the one range it is not suppose to be good at much less dominate''
GÖª The RR ''dominating'' in CQ is perception not a hard fact. The weapon i designed to be good at ALL ranges not only long ranges. Its a rifle , which are designed for this. If it only worked at long ranges , it would be considered a niche weapon same as the Laser R.
Kane Fyea:''I think all the rifles are OP (By rifles I mean the Rail, Combat, Scrambler, and Plasma rifles). They're clearly better then most other weapons in this game''
GÖª Nope. Incorrect. More like the rest of the weapons are Underpowered. Weapons like the shotgun and the LR need to be buffed to overpower Rifles in their niche, say Shotgun being overall OP at close range 1 HKO all light suits ,1 HKO med frames and 2 HKO Heavies and Tanked med frames.
Vermaak Doe:''Most of the rail rifle complaints are based in hard facts, do the math and you'll see how the rail rifle is almost identical to the Ar's dps except with 30km more optimal and an almost ignorable charge time.''
Logi Bro:''Stop.
GÖª There are no Hard facts, Most other rifles out DPS the Rail rifle ,not to mention they all apply MORE damage in less time due to RoF. Calculate this, i 5 seconds how many times you can shoot a CR and how many bullets come from a RR. Remember , each R1 press from a combat rifle does 96 AT LEAST with a STD CR, while being able to shoot faster than the RR.
Logi Bro:''Stop.
TTK is bad enough, and you propose to buff ALL other weapons instead of nerfing ONE?''
GÖª TTK is not bad enough.Actually is pretty fine and its mostly a Forum myth.Compared to Every other single FPS out there , dust gives you the ability to tank suits enough to take simultaneous fire from multiple enemies for a good 2+ seconds and survive.The perception that TTK is low comed from the fact we PAY for our suits and weapons, and we think that a PROTO suit that costs 150k+ than the ADV one deserves to last 5+ seconds more,and this is incorrect. want to last longer? tank a heavy.
Even though they apply more damage in lesd time because of a lower rof, the damage difference not only compensates for this, but the higher rof of the other rifles causes less controllable recoil, ensuring not every shot will hit.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
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1262
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Posted - 2014.01.30 03:44:00 -
[4] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:
Even though they apply more damage in lesd time because of a lower rof, the damage difference not only compensates for this, but the higher rof of the other rifles causes less controllable recoil, ensuring not every shot will hit.
This is complete and utter BS.
the AR has NO recoil whatsoever , the CR has minimal recoil....
Actually you were halfway right, the recoil on both is minimal, but pretty much every rifle needs to empty half the magazine to start recoiling. However that's where you stop being right, a lower rof makes the Rr's recoil more manageable.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1263
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Posted - 2014.01.30 04:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:
Even though they apply more damage in lesd time because of a lower rof, the damage difference not only compensates for this, but the higher rof of the other rifles causes less controllable recoil, ensuring not every shot will hit.
This is complete and utter BS.
the AR has NO recoil whatsoever , the CR has minimal recoil.... Actually you were halfway right, the recoil on both is minimal, but pretty much every rifle needs to empty half the magazine to start recoiling. However that's where you stop being right, a lower rof makes the Rr's recoil more manageable. At longer ranges.again, they RR owns , TRUE, but at longer ranges.
40 mts or less any weapon can easily manage.If not , this is a player's skill level problem and not a balaning issue. SURE, other rifles should have a little of advantage on ANOTHER area since the RR has RANGE, and they do! CR: RoF
AR:Hip fire + Clip Size + Easiest gun to use requiring the LEAST skill
SCR: Charged shot + Lack of need to restock ammoIf its Range whats bothering people, they might as well use the RR themselves! But then dont come whining in the Forums on how fast CR/SCR Drop you .... ;)
I do use it myself, and my stats thanked me
Note that range alone is never an issue, but the damage done at that range is.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
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Posted - 2014.01.30 05:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:
Note that range alone is never an issue, but the damage done at that range is.
Then shush and keep getting kills....Thats what a weapon is supposed to do never the less... Before someone accuses me of being biased :My weapons are: SCR Breach AR SMG Shotguns SCR Pistols. I tested the RR and it did not preform to my satisfaction....
it's great for myself, but terrible for the game when a weapon makes another obsolete in every way.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1264
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Posted - 2014.01.30 05:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
Have you read any of my other posts? The Ar mirrors it's stats not the Scr.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1283
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Posted - 2014.02.01 02:04:00 -
[8] - Quote
You seem to not understand quite a few things very well, the rail rifle is better or matches the Ar in every stat except the what it does better, ehich gives it about double the Ars range for no downside.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1283
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Posted - 2014.02.01 02:16:00 -
[9] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:You seem to not understand quite a few things very well, the rail rifle is better or matches the Ar in every stat except the what it does better, ehich gives it about double the Ars range for no downside. The AR has better RoF and a Resistance 2 ''Bullseye'' Ability that prohibits you to miss in CQ while hipfiring.
Ive gone lately 20-2 with an 'Exile' no dam mods while hipfiring all game.
I know i cant do that with the RR , specially vs other RR , SCR and CR....
If you can't do that with an Rr, yet you can do it with an Ar? they're basically identical, except the rr trades the ar's rof for damage per shot. If you can't do it with a Rr too, you're pointing the wrong direction.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2014.02.01 02:43:00 -
[10] - Quote
With the lower rof there's even less recoil than an Ar has to deal woth, so you don't have a reason to miss at mid range besides your skill.
It's not always AA, though it usually is, however a long range weapon shouldn't be dishing out the same damage as a short range weapon period.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2014.02.01 02:54:00 -
[11] - Quote
And the reason we have so many different rifles is that some should excel in certain situation, except the rr makes the Ar obsolete while giving the user more flexibility than an ar also.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2014.02.01 03:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
And the rr is better than the ar at everything, how do you not see the imbalance?
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1285
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Posted - 2014.02.01 03:50:00 -
[13] - Quote
So the solution to an op weapon is to add another weapon that's exactly the same except much more range, it's official you people are either idiots or are depending on your crutch way too much. You can go back to your Rr doesn't make the Ar useless circle jerk, it's a waste of time trying to reason with such ignorant people.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
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1288
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:16:00 -
[14] - Quote
Sigh, because I'm a glutton for punishment I'll reply one last time, and one will quickly turn to many.
@KGB Not mad, but tired of trying to explain simple things
@Sam my only complaint is that it over shadows the Ar, it may shoot faster but the Rr's higher damage per round compensates for the lower rof, and the recoil is identical
@Michael the only advice I've been given in this thread is to use the rail,rifle and stop complaining, not exactly what I would call sound advice. You're forgetting that even in Eve things are balanced by drawbacks which allow other weapons/ships to shine in other scenarios, don't tell me you honestly think that a purely better weapon belongs in any fps? I'm not even asking for fairness, I'm looking for asymmetric balance, which is based on the advantages and disadvantages of weapons to make them unequal but useful.The irony in your post is pretty hilarious, maybe you're not that bright.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:22:00 -
[15] - Quote
I would like to emphasize thst I don't think that the rail is op compared to the cr and scr, just that it makes using an Ar redundant.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:35:00 -
[16] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:@ Vermaak Doe
'' my only complaint is that it over shadows the Ar, it may shoot faster but the Rr's higher damage per round compensates for the lower rof, and the recoil is identical''
my only complaint is that it over shadows the Ar
awwww. missing your crutch? Look. as you said it, AR shoots faster, but RR compensates with damage per round. Recoil is SIMILAR (the AR has a lot less) an the range in the RR is compensated by many little fetures the AR has over the RR like less PG consumption,faster reload , more Mag capacity, etc...
If you dont like the trade off THEN, you should use the RR sinceyou appreciate the range more than all the other Qualities of the rifle.
''You're forgetting that even in Eve things are balanced by drawbacks which allow other weapons/ships to shine in other scenarios, don't tell me you honestly think that a purely better weapon belongs in any fps? ''
1st- this is not EVE nor a ship game
2nd-The weapon is balanced ,you just cant see it. The fact that you say that something doesnt exists because
YOU dont see it does not mean its a fact.
Sorry bro, need to get better arguments here.......
Sorry I forgot to say idiots need not post, however if you must know.
The rail rifle does more damage per magazine, so a larger magazine means nothing
The difference is .20 seconds for a reload.
I can see the imbalance, just compare that stats, but you can ignore the fscts if you want to.
The Eve comment is a generalization, most decent games don't have such a weapon imbalance. What is balanced about a weapon with, identical, and sometimes the same stats except with almost double the range with drawbacks that are too small to make a difference?
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Sigh, because I'm a glutton for punishment I'll reply one last time, and one will quickly turn to many.
@KGB Not mad, but tired of trying to explain simple things
@Sam my only complaint is that it over shadows the Ar, it may shoot faster but the Rr's higher damage per round compensates for the lower rof, and the recoil is identical
@Michael the only advice I've been given in this thread is to use the rail,rifle and stop complaining, not exactly what I would call sound advice. You're forgetting that even in Eve things are balanced by drawbacks which allow other weapons/ships to shine in other scenarios, don't tell me you honestly think that a purely better weapon belongs in any fps? I'm not even asking for fairness, I'm looking for asymmetric balance, which is based on the advantages and disadvantages of weapons to make them unequal but useful.The irony in your post is pretty hilarious, maybe you're not that bright. I find it interesting that most of you daisies who don't like my post often try to attack my intelligence when I have been quite easy going and respectable towards you. Now I'm not that bright? But I think you are a punk that is used to having someone always wipe your tears and kiss your boos boos. Because mainly softies talk you. Always has and always will. They cry about fairness and balance instead of taking charge and making things happen for yourself. Your fortitude is weak. And you crumble at the sight of difficulty. That isn't the mind of mercenary or warrior. Maybe you're in the wrong line of work.
Yes, attack my character and mention nothing on topic that I posted I'm sure that'll make you feel good about yourself. And yes, of course I'm taking the easier route when, you're trying to defend something so obviously a complete improvement over another weapon of similar type. So, continue to hide behind your mountain of ignorance, in time it'll be nothing more than pebbles as fact wears it down.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:43:00 -
[18] - Quote
KING CHECKMATE wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:I would like to emphasize thst I don't think that the rail is op compared to the cr and scr, just that it makes using an Ar redundant.
in my opinion FIXED.
Compare that stats yourself then, I'll wait.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 05:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:So you don't like using it but since you hate losing and won't learn how to use the prior weapon you were using, you use the "OP" rifle to make a point?
That's kiddish like
What's wrong with him using it if it's not op, even though it's so obviously an improvement over his former weapon.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1289
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Posted - 2014.02.01 06:06:00 -
[20] - Quote
KGB Sleep wrote:Izlare Lenix wrote:For the weapon with the most range it IS too effective in cqc. The charge up time is a broken balancing mechanic that has too many ways to cheat and get around it.
If they reduced the hip fire accuracy that would reduce its cqc potential without harming its long killing power. That would actually make the RR better, as in more hits would land on strafing enemies. The HMG used to suffer from pinpoint accuracy and then when they gave it spread it was a huge improvement.
I think it works so well on the hmg because of how much higher the rof and magazine is.
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood
Public Disorder.
1291
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Posted - 2014.02.01 06:49:00 -
[21] - Quote
Michael Arck wrote:John Demonsbane wrote:Michael Arck wrote:John Demonsbane wrote:I'm just going to say one thing here, because RR users will never consider that it's OP so arguing stats is pointless.
OP/Arck when your argument becomes "well then just adapt and use this weapon too if it's so much better" you lose credibility because that's frankly a stupid argument. Why do the other weapons exist then? Why bother with trying out new fits and load outs, you know, the WHOLE POINT OF PLAYING DUST instead of some other generic shooter?
You may as well go over there into the reality distortion field currently occupied by spkr4theHAV and tankahiro because you are making the same exact ridiculous argument they are. The best counter for an RR is another RR. Cool, we all run the same exact fitting now. Good job, you fixed dust. So I lose creditability for stating my opinion? I lose creditability because I come across guys who use the CR that drops me like 3 day old dog turd? Really? Oh I got it, I'm not saying what the cool kids club are saying...so I lose creditability. Frankly I don't give a **** about the creditability, I am firm believer that given any time with a weapon, you can maximize its potential. I still go up against guys who drop me with a CR and even a AR for that matter. And c'mon man, before the BRs yall were complaining about ARs. Yall always complaining. Never looking for a way around a problem, just ***** and moan all the damn time. It's old, especially for folks who call themselves mercenaries in a frentic universal war in New Eden. So I'm speaking from experience. I actually play the game. I just don't run my mouth on the forum based off of information that is not up to date. Any weapon can be beast given the right time. The CR is beast itself. But most who just play pubs only see RRs because in pubs folks grab whatever they got killed with and use that weapon. Instead of learning how to maximize the lethality of other choices. I choose RR because its Caldari. And I still face considerable competition with experienced players who know how to use other rifles. *turns around and comes back to thread* You lose credibility because "adapt and use the RR" is not a valid defense of the argument that it's not OP. Personally, I hate the RR. The spool up annoys me. I prefer the ScR but it takes too much CPU/PG and limits the quality of equipment I can carry so I use the closest equivalent with lower fit costs, the regular CR. But, I'm forced to use the RR on open maps because otherwise I'm killed by a weapon with nearly the same DPS, 40m greater range, and no goddamn bullet trails. I have all 4 racial rifles plus the LR to proto ( yes, I play the game too, it did occur to me to do that before discussing the weapons, but thanks for the advice.). The RR is the only one I don't have prof in (again, I don't like it) but I have no choice, even though I don't have prof 3 like I do the CR it just works too well... it's the only counter to itself, which is not a terrible definition of OP, if you think about it. If "adapting" means everyone has to use the same weapon to compete, then that's bland, generic, boring, and I want no part of it. I say good day to you, sir! *walks away again* man take that creditability and shove it up your ass
Lol
"Always fight dirty, the victor writes history"
Eve toon: Drake Doe, professional hero tackler, full time pretzel boy
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