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Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 551	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:19:00 - [1] - Quote And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock.
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 6595	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:22:00 - [2] - Quote Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. Level 6 Forum Warrior Lenin of the glorious armoured revolution Gallente FW - 'Turalyon'
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2430	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:24:00 - [3] - Quote No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less.
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1485	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:28:00 - [4] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 551	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:28:00 - [5] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 552	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:31:00 - [6] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. do you have friends? are you in a squad? are the helping you and vice versa? a squad with AV nades and fluxes with a dedicated swarmer/ PLC guy has absolutly ZERO fear of tanks, its almost laughable how easily most of the tankers are to destroy, and the experianced onces are forced to leave yoru squad alone. yah maybe one or two of you will fall, but that guy in a tank isnt going to be acomplishing much around you guys
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:32:00 - [7] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is?
medomai grey WarRavens League of Infamy 381	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:34:00 - [8] - Quote I have an anti-tank fit... It's called a tank. The problem with swarms and AV grenades is that they're not effective against vehicles on their cool down, when vehicles are suppose to be vulnerable. Theses weapons have trouble taking out LAVs and dropships, not just tanks. Although for some of you the entire game seems to revolve around tanks... Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart. Blatant Dust_514 recruiting in the silliest of places. :P
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1002	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:35:00 - [9] - Quote funny how always the same players step out to defend their crutch first of all, if a tank drivers gets caught by a squad of swarms, PLC and AV nades then he did an error and deserver to explode but driver making bad choices is not a factor for balance. factor for balance is risk vs reward. tank speed is still high and what was true for only dropships & LAVs before is now also true for tanks, if things are not going well you turn on that nitro and none of those weapons can keep up. beside that there should not be something that requires the attention of a that many players in a game with limited amount of players per side, this creates artificial power advantage for those teams with less tanks. this should especially not happen when tanks for 100k isk are able to shrug of proto AV weaponry. second, not everyone has skilled into forges and heavies. beside that, this weapon still needs a good position to fire on a slow frame. you still need atleast proto level to bother a tank. and the tank driver can still gtfo. third, no one wants to wait half a minute, just to see the tank driver gtfo out at the speed of sound when the hardeners are down. waiting the whole game just for a minor chance to kill a tank when the driver did an error? no thanks. and last, tanks are the better AV, they are cheaper require no SP and rails can even hurt tanks when their hardeners are up. and the best part about tanks? they do not give up any killing power against infantry.
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:37:00 - [10] - Quote medomai grey wrote: I have an anti-tank fit... It's called a tank. The problem with swarms and AV grenades is that they're not effective against vehicles on their cool down, when vehicles are suppose to be vulnerable. Theses weapons have trouble taking out LAVs and dropships, not just tanks. Although for some of you the entire game seems to revolve around tanks... Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart. Yeah nerf AV, it's so OP! And nerf flaylocks and contact nades while you're at it

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 552	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:37:00 - [11] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 552	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:43:00 - [12] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: funny how always the same players step out to defend their crutch with what they call "arguments". how often does everyone needs to facepalm and bust your so called "logic" till you understand that the nerf hammer is inevitable? first of all, if a tank drivers gets caught by a squad of swarms, PLC and AV nades then he did an error and deserver to explode but driver making bad choices is not a factor for balance. factor for balance is risk vs reward. tank speed is still high and what was true for only dropships & LAVs before is now also true for tanks, if things are not going well you turn on that nitro and none of those weapons can keep up. beside that there should not be something that requires the attention of a that many players in a game with limited amount of players per side, this creates artificial power advantage for those teams with more tanks. this should especially not happen when tanks for 100k isk are able to shrug of proto AV weaponry. second, not everyone has skilled into forges and heavies. beside that, this weapon still needs a good position to fire on a slow frame. you still need atleast proto level to bother a tank. and the tank driver can still gtfo and you just wasted your time. third, no one wants to wait half a minute, just to see the tank driver gtfo out at the speed of sound when the hardeners are down. waiting the whole game just for a minor chance to kill a tank when the driver did an error? no thanks. and last, tanks are the better AV, they are cheaper require no SP and rails can even hurt tanks when their hardeners are up. and the best part about tanks: tanks do not give up any killing power against infantry. im not a tanker i destroy tanks using this method with laughable ease your a scrub defending a crtuch with no friends who refuses to run in a squad and use teamwork to acomplish tasks. im using a LP basic PLC and a militia swarm launcher, with a few guys skilled into proxes/remotes to block retreat routs/set traps. we basically ignore tanks now, if they come near us they die. a few tanks have givin us some trouble, but they susually back off to find easyer prey, most tanks just die instantly. its a counter to this militia tank spam, sure good tankers will still be alive and kicking, but they will be off nowhere near your objective hiding. if they come back you simply AV them again, if their hardeners are on you simply take some damn cover for 10 seconds THEN AV him
Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 549	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:43:00 - [13] - Quote It's a bit more complicated than that, OP. You run have to run a purpose built AV fit and more importantly you have to have two other guys working with...full time during the match...to put up a credible AV threat. I gave this a go the other night with the following set up: AV guy #1 - proto swarms, 3x complex dmg mods, locus nades, hives, SMG, cardiac booster; CalAssault AV guy #2 - proto swarms, prof 2, 1 complex dmg mod, uplinks, AV nades, SMG; CalAssault AV guy #3 - combat riffle, rep tool, hives, RE, AV nades All of us experienced at working together and doing AV. Let me say first that we were successful at killing some militia tanks. However, we couldn't even come close to killing enough of them fast enough to really slow them down and ultimately we would have had a way bigger impact on the outcome of the match by fighting together taking objectives. Our individual suits cost more than than most of thanks we were hunting. We made absolute poo for WP. One quick note, you know pretty quick when you run into a real tanker...we had zero luck against those guys. Risk vs reward just isn't there.
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1003	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:47:00 - [14] - Quote I edited my post slightly and I can only repeat this... this guy suggests you to squad up with a team full of AV nades and a single AV weapon dude. and this works exactly against one type of tank driver => the scrub that just tries out MLT tanks the first time in a public match. have fun running after a good pilot with awareness & map knowledge with lolnades. your AV dude just gets insta killed by a rail the moment he tries to shoot.
Monkey MAC Lost Millennium 1302	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:50:00 - [15] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. I disagree I know plenty of old time 'full time AV', that's what the commando was built for after all. But One man with AV doing his Job can't even hamper a tanks progress, let alone stop an assault. Pair AV's complete lack of destructive force, with the lack of WP reward for spending ten mins chasing a tank round the map, its not suprising. Besides if AV is to be a full time job, as I would expect it to be, we need a full complement of AV gear, both offensivd and tactical in nature. Tanks 514 I told you, I bloody well told you. Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior of the Trees Lvl.1
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2431	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:50:00 - [16] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit I did say militia tanks.
DJINN Marauder Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 3519	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:50:00 - [17] - Quote Why use team work to kill a tank... When I can solo one with a Mlt tank? Av is extremely underperforming. While tanks are the best at av and infantry killing on most maps. GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢ Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà Forum Warrior LV. 3 \| Warframe is awesome! \| PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2431	Posted - 2013.12.23 00:58:00 - [18] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources. Why should my whole squad have to have av grenades to take on ONE TANK WHO ONLY NEEDS ONE PERSON. Also lets mention how AV grenades are horribly ineffective against tanks and that any good tanker would have the squad killed before they're within grenade range. Also it is by far easier to AV in a tank then with infantry AV. Even your idea of AV isn't as effective as a single tank for AV because they have: 1. 400m optimal range for railguns so they can do AV while in the safety of their redline (Main AV turret) 2. Are much faster 3. Have a hell of a lot more survivability Also please stop with the unnecessary line breaks. They make your posts look horrible.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2411	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:00:00 - [19] - Quote I have to concur. And I think the people that are disagreeing don't employ the teamwork in the actual game to do so. It can be done. I have experienced this myself when the enemy just called in tank after tank. And you're absolutely correct, no one wants to adapt. You see folks who have 8 different dropsuits for different infantry purposes but yet doesn't have a fit to combat the tanks. Instead of working together to concoct a solution, they take to forums and want the devs to change it. And it's repetitive with every build. They want content. We need content!! But nerf this! And nerf that! I don't understand and I truly believe plenty of folks are not even trying what you suggested. How could they when they're countering the very thing that empowers this game and creates monsters corporations...teamwork. It's an odd combination. Mercenary. New Eden. Brutal War. Constant death. Backstabbing. Spies. The reputation that the universe is a brutal place to be. All that in the package but we complaining that tanks are ruining the game? Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens League of Infamy 441	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:01:00 - [20] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing. I do full time Forge. Militia HAVs driven by poor pilots, unlucky pilots, and pilots who made a bad choice go down just fine. But pilots with some actual common sense driving HAVs above militia grade are a different animal all together. You, and your squad, have been wiped by HAVs on many occasions I'm sure. You're just glossing it over. Either that or you've been popped by too many locus grenades and want everybody to switch to AV grenades so you don't have to worry about locus spam. As for your platter. You've mistaken a flimsy aluminum disposable bake tray for something of value. I still can't find tanks on the market. All I see are those HAVs.

Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2411	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:02:00 - [21] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources. Why should my whole squad have to have av grenades to take on ONE TANK WHO ONLY NEEDS ONE PERSON. This is what I mean. If the tanks are a problem and you are unwilling to adapt to change the situation, then what are you complaining for? Yea the tanks needs one person to drive a machine that is causing incredible havoc on the field. Who cares about the numbers? Switch over, give em hell back. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:03:00 - [22] - Quote aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you shouldn't have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam?
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2432	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:04:00 - [23] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources. Why should my whole squad have to have av grenades to take on ONE TANK WHO ONLY NEEDS ONE PERSON. This is what I mean. If the tanks are a problem and you are unwilling to adapt to change the situation, then what are you complaining for? Yea the tanks needs one person to drive a machine that is causing incredible havoc on the field. Who cares about the numbers? Switch over, give em hell back. I did by using a militia tank. Lot more effective then proto swarms with prof 4 and three complex damage mods. Also did you not read the rest of my post?
Tectonic Fusion 775	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:04:00 - [24] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. Solo Player Squad status: Locked
Wurm FOOD The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 6	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:09:00 - [25] - Quote I have an AV fit that costs 5k. Militia Gallente light frame with a plasma cannon, AV grenades, REs, MLT kincat, and a scrambler pistol for infantry. Seriously, I killed about 8 tanks in a Dom using this fit. You run up behind them, shove 3 REs on the exhaust plate, hit their shield with grenades and plasma, then BOOM (REs finish them off). Use stealth ;)
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2432	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:09:00 - [26] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you should have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam? PROXY MINES! Now I know your lying through your teeth. Proxy mines are the worst form of AV ever. Even the plasma cannon is more effective. I can kill tanks with AV but why put the effort in when you can just call in a tank yourself that's a lot more effective. You guys seem to forget what Risk vs Reward is. Why risk doing something when there is something with less risk and more reward.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:10:00 - [27] - Quote Tectonic Fusion wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives.
dogmanpig black market bank 86	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:10:00 - [28] - Quote i fear for what people are asking for. asking for infantry based weapons to outclass and out DPS large vehicle mounted weapons. the day when no tank is going to fight another because it will take 5 minutes or more to kill each other because a large blaster having less DPS then a MLT AR, large missile launchers having less killing power then breach MD, and rails that even a scout could survive a full clip. You hate me, I hate you. Lets keep it that way. Level 8 1/10 Forum alt. "Its worth half a penny and a reach around"
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2433	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:11:00 - [29] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. Like I said any good tanker would have the whole squad killed before they get into AV grenade range. That is unless the tanker is stupid enough to go into a city (?Which only two or three sockets have)
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:11:00 - [30] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you should have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam? PROXY MINES! Now I know your lying through your teeth. Proxy mines are the worst form of AV ever. Even the plasma cannon is more effective. I can kill tanks with AV but why put the effort in when you can just call in a tank yourself that's a lot more effective. You guys seem to forget what Risk vs Reward is. Why risk doing something when there is something with less risk and more reward. FW anti tank trap 4x proxies and 4x remotes thats more than 12000 damage. if its not a brick tanked proto gunnlogi with 2 hardeners running its DEAD instantly because if you lose the objective because you were off trying to kill tanks in a tank then youve lost the match and no longer get your reward (in FW and PC)

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:12:00 - [31] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. Like I said any good tanker would have the whole squad killed before they get into AV grenade range. That is unless the tanker is stupid enough to go into a city (?Which only two or three sockets have) sow aht your saying is you can negate a tank without any AV whatsoever just by holding HALF THE DAMN MAP best anti tank solution EVER, IGNORE THE DAMN THING it cant shoot you in the city, then win because you hold 3/5 objectives.
Goric Rumis Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 258	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:15:00 - [32] - Quote AV is... ...less powerful... ...less mobile... ...more vulnerable... ...more expensive... ...harder to do with one or two people... ...than a militia tank. The purpose of AV at this point is to discourage vehicles from camping your objective when you're near a supply depot.
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2433	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:15:00 - [33] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you should have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam? PROXY MINES! Now I know your lying through your teeth. Proxy mines are the worst form of AV ever. Even the plasma cannon is more effective. I can kill tanks with AV but why put the effort in when you can just call in a tank yourself that's a lot more effective. You guys seem to forget what Risk vs Reward is. Why risk doing something when there is something with less risk and more reward. FW anti tank trap 4x proxies and 4x remotes thats more than 12000 damage. if its not a brick tanked proto gunnlogi with 2 hardeners running its DEAD instantly That is if you get all of them to actually hit the tanks and if the tanker is stupid and can't hear the beeping from proxy mines (which is pretty easy to hear). Also that only works if the tankers resist are down which to trap a tank with resists down is not very easy at all. (Which goes back to risk vs reward)
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2433	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:17:00 - [34] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. Like I said any good tanker would have the whole squad killed before they get into AV grenade range. That is unless the tanker is stupid enough to go into a city (?Which only two or three sockets have) sow aht your saying is you can negate a tank without any AV whatsoever just by holding HALF THE DAMN MAP best anti tank solution EVER, IGNORE THE DAMN THING it cant shoot you in the city, then win because you hold 3/5 objectives. There are only two sockets with cities that tanks can't navigate easily out of the what like 15 others. So I can only do that what like a third of the time if that even.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:18:00 - [35] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you should have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam? PROXY MINES! Now I know your lying through your teeth. Proxy mines are the worst form of AV ever. Even the plasma cannon is more effective. I can kill tanks with AV but why put the effort in when you can just call in a tank yourself that's a lot more effective. You guys seem to forget what Risk vs Reward is. Why risk doing something when there is something with less risk and more reward. FW anti tank trap 4x proxies and 4x remotes thats more than 12000 damage. if its not a brick tanked proto gunnlogi with 2 hardeners running its DEAD instantly That is if you get all of them to actually hit the tanks and if the tanker is stupid and can't hear the beeping from proxy mines (which is pretty easy to hear). Also that only works if the tankers resist are down which to trap a tank with resists down is not very easy at all. (Which goes back to risk vs reward) i get them all to hit the tank... its called learning how to set them down properly. i get them to run over them... its called hiding them and positioning them in optimal locations aka escape routes and entrances. those 300mph tanks dont stop so quickly :P and it works on EVERY tank reguardless of resists EXCEPT for a single tank build that requires about 5+ mil SP into it. aka gunnlogi with complex extender and 2 hardeners, and BOTH hardeners have to be running at the time.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 555	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:19:00 - [36] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. Like I said any good tanker would have the whole squad killed before they get into AV grenade range. That is unless the tanker is stupid enough to go into a city (?Which only two or three sockets have) sow aht your saying is you can negate a tank without any AV whatsoever just by holding HALF THE DAMN MAP best anti tank solution EVER, IGNORE THE DAMN THING it cant shoot you in the city, then win because you hold 3/5 objectives. There are only two sockets with cities that tanks can't navigate easily out of the what like 15 others. So I can only do that what like a third of the time if that even. i can do it in EVERY city.... now what? hell i can do it only EVERY map that isnt manuous peak.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2414	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:20:00 - [37] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Michael Arck wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources. Why should my whole squad have to have av grenades to take on ONE TANK WHO ONLY NEEDS ONE PERSON. This is what I mean. If the tanks are a problem and you are unwilling to adapt to change the situation, then what are you complaining for? Yea the tanks needs one person to drive a machine that is causing incredible havoc on the field. Who cares about the numbers? Switch over, give em hell back. I did by using a militia tank. Lot more effective then proto swarms with prof 4 and three complex damage mods. Also did you not read the rest of my post? You are correct, I did not. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2433	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:21:00 - [38] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: [quote=Ghosts Chance]before they get into AV grenade range. That is unless the tanker is stupid enough to go into a city (?Which only two or three sockets have) sow aht your saying is you can negate a tank without any AV whatsoever just by holding HALF THE DAMN MAP best anti tank solution EVER, IGNORE THE DAMN THING it cant shoot you in the city, then win because you hold 3/5 objectives. There are only two sockets with cities that tanks can't navigate easily out of the what like 15 others. So I can only do that what like a third of the time if that even. i can do it in EVERY city.... now what? hell i can do it only EVERY map that isnt manuous peak. Kill a good tanker with that method not one of the scrub FOTM tankers. Also proof or GTFO
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 557	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:22:00 - [39] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Kill a good tanker with that method not one of the scrub FOTM tankers. Also proof or GTFO did you just ask me to kill a good tanker by ignoring it?
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2433	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:24:00 - [40] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: aparently your all bad since i solo tanks with my militia/basic gear hell ive killed tanks more then 600m away before.... prox/RE traps are wonderful if you know wher eto put them and hide them as a solo infantry guy tanks havnt givin me any trouble whatsoever... as a squad tanks are laughably easy to kill that only vertens and old chromo tankers survive. how is it that i can do these things but all of you that are complaining cant? AND why is it that when i hand you an amazing tank killing anti-militia tank spam solution instead of using it you ***** that you should have to? what exactly are you looking for if not a way to kill off the militia tank spam? PROXY MINES! Now I know your lying through your teeth. Proxy mines are the worst form of AV ever. Even the plasma cannon is more effective. I can kill tanks with AV but why put the effort in when you can just call in a tank yourself that's a lot more effective. You guys seem to forget what Risk vs Reward is. Why risk doing something when there is something with less risk and more reward. FW anti tank trap 4x proxies and 4x remotes thats more than 12000 damage. if its not a brick tanked proto gunnlogi with 2 hardeners running its DEAD instantly That is if you get all of them to actually hit the tanks and if the tanker is stupid and can't hear the beeping from proxy mines (which is pretty easy to hear). Also that only works if the tankers resist are down which to trap a tank with resists down is not very easy at all. (Which goes back to risk vs reward) i get them all to hit the tank... its called learning how to set them down properly. i get them to run over them... its called hiding them and positioning them in optimal locations aka escape routes and entrances. those 300mph tanks dont stop so quickly :P and it works on EVERY tank reguardless of resists EXCEPT for a single tank build that requires about 5+ mil SP into it. aka gunnlogi with complex extender and 2 hardeners, and BOTH hardeners have to be running at the time. i get 2+ kills with those traps a game in FW I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING)

Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:26:00 - [41] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Kill a good tanker with that method not one of the scrub FOTM tankers. Also proof or GTFO did you just ask me to kill a good tanker by ignoring it? Sorry quoted the wrong post. Also if you can ignore tankers on every map except for manus peak then why would you have to use AV at all. Why not just leave the tankers alone instead of trying to kill them with remotes and proxy mines since they obviously aren't bothering you at all.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:27:00 - [42] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING) heres another trade secret, you can place them in such a way that the proxies are futherst away and the REs are closest, alowing you to detonate and cause a chain reaction dealing damage to the tank from the range of that beeping noise :P meaning if they hear it... its too late. proxies in a U shape with remotes in a line from the U almost like a rounded arrow
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:28:00 - [43] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Kill a good tanker with that method not one of the scrub FOTM tankers. Also proof or GTFO did you just ask me to kill a good tanker by ignoring it? Sorry quoted the wrong post. Also if you can ignore tankers on every map except for manus peak then why would you have to use AV at all. Why not just leave the tankers alone instead of trying to kill them with remotes and proxy mines since they obviously aren't bothering you at all. because explosions are fun and i wanted to kill tanks with a plasma cannon, as well as the unfortunate reality that blueberrys will for some reason walk strait at the tanks shooting their ARs at it rather then doing something productive. so killing the tanks gives me a whole bunch of unmolested blueberrys to use as meat shields
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:29:00 - [44] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING) heres another trade secret, you can place them in such a way that the proxies are futherst away and the REs are closest, alowing you to detonate and cause a chain reaction dealing damage to the tank from the range of that beeping noise :P meaning if they hear it... its too late. proxies in a U shape with remotes in a line from the U almost like a rounded arrow That sounds like a lot of work for very little reward. I'd rather call a tank in and destroy 3 before you even destroy 1. I never said AV wasn't good enough to destroy tanks but why do it when your less effective and get a lot less reward over time.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:31:00 - [45] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING) heres another trade secret, you can place them in such a way that the proxies are futherst away and the REs are closest, alowing you to detonate and cause a chain reaction dealing damage to the tank from the range of that beeping noise :P meaning if they hear it... its too late. proxies in a U shape with remotes in a line from the U almost like a rounded arrow That sounds like a lot of work for very little reward. I'd rather call a tank in and destroy 3 before you even destroy 1. it takes 20 seconds to set up... and a fraction of a second to detonate.... you wait longer for your RDV to show up then i take on my trap ive even completly forgotten about it and gotten tank kills with it before.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 1411	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:33:00 - [46] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. If that's the case it should take a team of tanks to win a match/kill infantry. Not one solo scrub in a MLT tank tanking proto Swarms and forge guns.
DeadlyAztec11 2857	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:33:00 - [47] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. do you have friends? are you in a squad? are the helping you and vice versa? a squad with AV nades and fluxes with a dedicated swarmer/ PLC guy has absolutly ZERO fear of tanks, its almost laughable how easily most of the tankers are to destroy, and the experianced onces are forced to leave yoru squad alone. yah maybe one or two of you will fall, but that guy in a tank isnt going to be acomplishing much around you guys AV may not fear tanks but they do fear infantry. A squad of AV is easy to clean up with a rail rifle. »We still have our honor!
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu 2414	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:34:00 - [48] - Quote I like this guy. He's using his brain and not letting the game get the best of him. Commendable Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. For the State!! [email protected]
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:34:00 - [49] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING) heres another trade secret, you can place them in such a way that the proxies are futherst away and the REs are closest, alowing you to detonate and cause a chain reaction dealing damage to the tank from the range of that beeping noise :P meaning if they hear it... its too late. proxies in a U shape with remotes in a line from the U almost like a rounded arrow That sounds like a lot of work for very little reward. I'd rather call a tank in and destroy 3 before you even destroy 1. it takes 20 seconds to set up... and a fraction of a second to detonate.... you wait longer for your RDV to show up then i take on my trap But then you have to wait for a tank while I'm going to the tank and destroying it. Then I can continually use the tank until it is destroyed or I recall while you have to have nanohives (Which take time to refill and explosives eat through them fast) or run to a supply depot to refill. So while you destroyed maybe one I destroyed more and got infantry kills too.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:34:00 - [50] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. do you have friends? are you in a squad? are the helping you and vice versa? a squad with AV nades and fluxes with a dedicated swarmer/ PLC guy has absolutly ZERO fear of tanks, its almost laughable how easily most of the tankers are to destroy, and the experianced onces are forced to leave yoru squad alone. yah maybe one or two of you will fall, but that guy in a tank isnt going to be acomplishing much around you guys AV may not fear tanks but they do fear infantry. A squad of AV is easy to clean up with a rail rifle. a squad of infantry with 1 AV guy was the suggestion i believe.... not quite the same thing and not really vulnerable against infantry in the same way :P

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:36:00 - [51] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: I can roll over proxy mines with my afterburner before they can even blow up. Also they stop pretty quickly. Quickly enough for someone who actually pays attention to his surroundings and listens for certain sounds (Such as swarms being fired or PROXY MINES BEEPING) heres another trade secret, you can place them in such a way that the proxies are futherst away and the REs are closest, alowing you to detonate and cause a chain reaction dealing damage to the tank from the range of that beeping noise :P meaning if they hear it... its too late. proxies in a U shape with remotes in a line from the U almost like a rounded arrow That sounds like a lot of work for very little reward. I'd rather call a tank in and destroy 3 before you even destroy 1. it takes 20 seconds to set up... and a fraction of a second to detonate.... you wait longer for your RDV to show up then i take on my trap But then you have to wait for a tank while I'm going to the tank and destroying it. Then I can continually use the tank until it is destroyed or I recall while you have to have nanohives (Which take time to refill and explosives eat through them fast) or run to a supply depot to refill. im either defending the objecive in LOS to it or i leave it to detonate itself. in fac war the proxes trigger the remotes, as well as the remotes triggering the proxes. so you can either use manual LOS defence or automatic explosive modes if you have to cover a secondary objective.
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:38:00 - [52] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: [quote=Kane Fyea] it takes 20 seconds to set up... and a fraction of a second to detonate.... you wait longer for your RDV to show up then i take on my trap But then you have to wait for a tank while I'm going to the tank and destroying it. Then I can continually use the tank until it is destroyed or I recall while you have to have nanohives (Which take time to refill and explosives eat through them fast) or run to a supply depot to refill. im either defending the objecive in LOS to it or i leave it to detonate itself. in fac war the proxes trigger the remotes, as well as the remotes triggering the proxes. so you can either use manual LOS defence or automatic explosive modes if you have to cover a secondary objective. Except the automatic part isn't reliable since proxy mines have quite a delay before they actually explode. Also I added a little more to that post.
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:44:00 - [53] - Quote Oh and can you tell me why I would use AV when it is less effective and gets less reward over time (Since tanks can kill vehicles 3x faster then infantry AV can. Oh and tanks are still very effective against infantry still while someone with swarms is limited to a sidearm)
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:46:00 - [54] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Oh and can you tell me why I would use AV when it is less effective and gets less reward over time (Since tanks can kill vehicles 3x faster then infantry AV can. Oh and tanks are still very effective against infantry still while someone with swarms is limited to a sidearm) \ because teamwork fool. adapt or die by tank. and it kills tanks REALLY quickly :P about the same time as it takes with a tank. and its still effective against infantry :P as you have 5 other guys watching your back while you pal around on your sidearm.
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:49:00 - [55] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing. So you answered my question 'Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is?' by saying that six AVers (AV grenade=AV) are better than one tank at anti-tank. You should try a career in politics. The way I remember rock-paper-scissors, one paper would beat one rock. So let's try again. Is one AV better at taking out a tank than one tank? Or if you prefer, you can answer this one: What has a better chance of taking out a convoy of six tanks - six tanks or six AVers?
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 01:53:00 - [56] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing. So you answered my question 'Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is?' by saying that six AVers (AV grenade=AV) are better than one tank at anti-tank. You should try a career in politics. The way I remember rock-paper-scissors, one paper would beat one rock. So let's try again. Is one AV better at taking out a tank than one tank? Or if you prefer, you can answer this one: What has a better chance of taking out a convoy of six tanks - six tanks or six AVers? AV nades a dedicated AV class does not make. your point is now invalid. 6 tanks arnt fitting into the city at the same time, and in the city they cant cover each other due to LOS... so the 6 man squad wins there too. tanks also cant cap objectives, so a dug in squad on an outside obejctive wins there as well. all they have to do is take cover and hold position to win that fight. also your an idiot, this isnt a solo game.
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:00:00 - [57] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing. So you answered my question 'Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is?' by saying that six AVers (AV grenade=AV) are better than one tank at anti-tank. You should try a career in politics. The way I remember rock-paper-scissors, one paper would beat one rock. So let's try again. Is one AV better at taking out a tank than one tank? Or if you prefer, you can answer this one: What has a better chance of taking out a convoy of six tanks - six tanks or six AVers? AV nades a dedicated AV class does not make. your point is now invalid. 6 tanks arnt fitting into the city at the same time, and in the city they cant cover each other due to LOS... so the 6 man squad wins there too. also your an idiot, this isnt a solo game. Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR.
Flix Keptick Red Star. EoN. 1724	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:01:00 - [58] - Quote Tank destroyer (with a tank) has also become a full time job again, especially with the separated blaster and railgun skills. Matches where I don't kill at least 2 enemy tanks are now extremely rare. Going to stay out of AV/V debates, better for my sanity. GÿåTank driverGÿå
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:05:00 - [59] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage.
danthrax martin Butcher's Nails 22	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:08:00 - [60] - Quote It took a little figuring out, but 1 av tank supported by lav with 3 swarmers and a couple medics in another lav is f'ing fun as hell! Adv. Commando, AR / swarm Adv. Sentinel, AR / HMG "I need More Ammo!!!"....."Medic!"

Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens League of Infamy 441	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:09:00 - [61] - Quote I gave in. I set aside my forge for a single match and called in a HAV. Being that I'm not very experienced running an HAV, I made over twenty kills. Sure I lost three HAVs, but I only lost them to other HAVs. One match wasn't a good baseline I admit, but I felt dirty and cheap for using those HAVs. It was much easier than I expected and it didn't cost me anywhere near what a single one of my proto forge fits cost. I still can't find tanks on the market. All I see are those HAVs.
Darken-Sol BIG BAD W0LVES 1003	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:10:00 - [62] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. yep. Anything less than proto gets you killed. I get plenty of tanks but the cost is thru the roof. by increasing charge time you have given my enemy 4 more seconds of sustained blaster fire. Since forges do so little dmg it really does a number on my wallet. I'll just call a tank. Cheaper and easier. hex what do you think? You still out punchin scouts? Watch my back does not mean look at my spine.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:11:00 - [63] - Quote Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: I gave in. I set aside my forge for a single match and called in a HAV. Being that I'm not very experienced running an HAV, I made over twenty kills. Sure I lost three HAVs, but I only lost them to other HAVs. One match wasn't a good baseline I admit, but I felt dirty and cheap for using those HAVs. It was much easier than I expected and it didn't cost me anywhere near what a single one of my proto forge fits cost. it wouldnt be the case if people would jsut start trying to kill the tanks instead of standing in open ground shooting at it with ARs
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 559	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:12:00 - [64] - Quote Darken-Sol wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. yep. Anything less than proto gets you killed. I get plenty of tanks but the cost is thru the roof. by increasing charge time you have given my enemy 4 more seconds of sustained blaster fire. Since forges do so little dmg it really does a number on my wallet. I'll just call a tank. Cheaper and easier. hex what do you think? You still out punchin scouts? my AV fits are STD plasma cannon with AV nades and militia swarmer with AV nades or fluxes.... aparently you just suck. i do it without any skills invested and i dont die while i do.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 560	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:23:00 - [65] - Quote Start a thread complainign about tank and nobody bats an eye start a thread detailing how to kill them easily and everyone loses their minds! i cant even tell people how to kill the damn things without people freaking out saying they shouldnt have to....if you dont want to know how to kill the damn things easily what DO you want? This thread is proof that the problem isnt tanks, its the players.
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:31:00 - [66] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage. Again you fail at reading comprehension. When did I ever say anything about you being non-infantry? But I really want us to get along. I like your spunk, in a totally hetero way. So let me assure you that you'll never see me in a tank of any description. I'm just pointing out that when the field is full of tanks but I don't even think about bringing out my proficiency 5 forge gun, something is seriously wrong with the game. I might get the tank, but it's just not worth putting down my AR when any scrub in a militia rail tank will do a better job than my forge. The game CAN be played by infantry, but it involves a lot of hiding in buildings, which makes it very boring. I've played three matches in the last two weeks; before that I capped every week for six months+. I'm sure you're having fun making every squad member give up their locus for AV nades, but in that case you'll all die quickly the moment you come in contact with a decent squad. You do realize core locus is a primary weapon for many PC-level players? If you're relying on your rifle you're giving yourself a 600HP disadvantage in most engagements. But I'm sure what you're doing works in pubs, anything does <3
Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:32:00 - [67] - Quote I'm a bit surprised spunk got through tbh.
Akdhar Saif Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 113	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:37:00 - [68] - Quote After or maybe even before we get all racial suits CCP should add specialist suits. Like a dedicated AV suits with bonuses to AV weaponry only? Just like in eve where you have the general classes which then lead into more specialised ones, a clear progression path.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 560	Posted - 2013.12.23 02:41:00 - [69] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage. Again you fail at reading comprehension. When did I ever say anything about you being non-infantry? But I really want us to get along. I like your spunk, in a totally hetero way. So let me assure you that you'll never see me in a tank of any description. I'm just pointing out that when the field is full of tanks but I don't even think about bringing out my proficiency 5 forge gun, something is seriously wrong with the game. I might get the tank, but it's just not worth putting down my AR when any scrub in a militia rail tank will do a better job than my forge. The game CAN be played by infantry, but it involves a lot of hiding in buildings, which makes it very boring. I've played three matches in the last two weeks; before that I capped every week for six months+. I'm sure you're having fun making every squad member give up their locus for AV nades, but in that case you'll all die quickly the moment you come in contact with a decent squad. You do realize core locus is a primary weapon for many PC-level players? If you're relying on your rifle you're giving yourself a 600HP disadvantage in most engagements. But I'm sure what you're doing works in pubs, anything does <3 if you cant solo a tank with a prof 5 forge gun no wonder your pissed off... that should be simple! thats not somethign wrong with the game, thats just you sucking at it. a scrub in a milita tank wont kill a good tanker.... even YOU have better odds with your forge then that. your last point is conflicting... as a PC team doesnt really give a **** about tanks because of how easy they are to destroy so they dont NEED AV nades..... i gave a simple and VERY effective solution with a low skill cap that just about any group of 6 can use to solve the problem, and instead of using it i get bitched at for even suggesting its possable. i dont even need the solution i presented, i solo the damn things when they get anoying both as infantry and in a tank. dont talk of PC level tactics if you cant solo a tank with a forge as THAT plus tanks are the current anti-tank platform at competitive levels. your obviously not competitive and so have zero insight into those tactics outside of getting stomped by them. core spam is another issue entirely. what more do you want other then a way to kill tanks without using a tank?
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens League of Infamy 441	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:09:00 - [70] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage. Again you fail at reading comprehension. When did I ever say anything about you being non-infantry? But I really want us to get along. I like your spunk, in a totally hetero way. So let me assure you that you'll never see me in a tank of any description. I'm just pointing out that when the field is full of tanks but I don't even think about bringing out my proficiency 5 forge gun, something is seriously wrong with the game. I might get the tank, but it's just not worth putting down my AR when any scrub in a militia rail tank will do a better job than my forge. The game CAN be played by infantry, but it involves a lot of hiding in buildings, which makes it very boring. I've played three matches in the last two weeks; before that I capped every week for six months+. I'm sure you're having fun making every squad member give up their locus for AV nades, but in that case you'll all die quickly the moment you come in contact with a decent squad. You do realize core locus is a primary weapon for many PC-level players? If you're relying on your rifle you're giving yourself a 600HP disadvantage in most engagements. But I'm sure what you're doing works in pubs, anything does <3 if you cant solo a tank with a prof 5 forge gun no wonder your pissed off... that should be simple! thats not somethign wrong with the game, thats just you sucking at it. a scrub in a milita tank wont kill a good tanker.... even YOU have better odds with your forge then that. your last point is conflicting... as a PC team doesnt really give a **** about tanks because of how easy they are to destroy so they dont NEED AV nades..... i gave a simple and VERY effective solution with a low skill cap that just about any group of 6 can use to solve the problem, and instead of using it i get bitched at for even suggesting its possable. i dont even need the solution i presented, i solo the damn things when they get anoying both as infantry and in a tank. dont talk of PC level tactics if you cant solo a tank with a forge as THAT plus tanks are the current anti-tank platform at competitive levels. your obviously not competitive and so have zero insight into those tactics outside of getting stomped by them. core spam is another issue entirely. what more do you want other then a way to kill tanks without using a tank? Yep. Your reading comprehension failed again. He didn't say he can't solo a HAV with his forge, he said it's easier with another HAV. Not everybody pulling down militia HAVs are unskilled scrubs. You didn't state your idea as an option. You din't even state it as a possibility. You stated it as an absolute. Not everyone wants to use your playstyle. I still can't find tanks on the market. All I see are those HAVs.

Ryme Intrinseca 405	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:11:00 - [71] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage. Again you fail at reading comprehension. When did I ever say anything about you being non-infantry? But I really want us to get along. I like your spunk, in a totally hetero way. So let me assure you that you'll never see me in a tank of any description. I'm just pointing out that when the field is full of tanks but I don't even think about bringing out my proficiency 5 forge gun, something is seriously wrong with the game. I might get the tank, but it's just not worth putting down my AR when any scrub in a militia rail tank will do a better job than my forge. The game CAN be played by infantry, but it involves a lot of hiding in buildings, which makes it very boring. I've played three matches in the last two weeks; before that I capped every week for six months+. I'm sure you're having fun making every squad member give up their locus for AV nades, but in that case you'll all die quickly the moment you come in contact with a decent squad. You do realize core locus is a primary weapon for many PC-level players? If you're relying on your rifle you're giving yourself a 600HP disadvantage in most engagements. But I'm sure what you're doing works in pubs, anything does <3 if you cant solo a tank with a prof 5 forge gun no wonder your pissed off... that should be simple! thats not somethign wrong with the game, thats just you sucking at it. a scrub in a milita tank wont kill a good tanker.... even YOU have better odds with your forge then that. your last point is conflicting... as a PC team doesnt really give a ** about tanks because of how easy they are to destroy so they dont NEED AV nades..... i gave a simple and VERY effective solution with a low skill cap that just about any group of 6 can use to solve the problem, and instead of using it i get bitched at for even suggesting its possable. i dont even need the solution i presented, i solo the damn things when they get anoying both as infantry and in a tank. dont talk of PC level tactics if you cant solo a tank with a forge as THAT plus tanks are the current anti-tank platform at competitive levels. your obviously not competitive and so have zero insight into those tactics outside of getting stomped by them. core spam is another issue entirely. what more do you want other then a way to kill tanks without using a tank? Yet again, you fail to read plain English. I said I can** kill a tank with a forge but taking my AR (=a potent anti-infantry threat) off the field isn't worth it to the team, when any nooblet (=not normally a threat to anybody) could do the job just as well in a militia tank. I'm just going to leave it there to save you from disgracing yourself and your country's educational system any further.
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens League of Infamy 441	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:12:00 - [72] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: I gave in. I set aside my forge for a single match and called in a HAV. Being that I'm not very experienced running an HAV, I made over twenty kills. Sure I lost three HAVs, but I only lost them to other HAVs. One match wasn't a good baseline I admit, but I felt dirty and cheap for using those HAVs. It was much easier than I expected and it didn't cost me anywhere near what a single one of my proto forge fits cost. it wouldnt be the case if people would jsut start trying to kill the tanks instead of standing in open ground shooting at it with ARs I don't think it was an issue of them not trying to kill me. I think it might have had something to do with me keeping infantry at range, prioritizing LAVs as targets, avoiding choke points, paying attention to my surroundings, and activating hardeners while performing a tactical retreat when I saw significant force being applied to my shields. I still can't find tanks on the market. All I see are those HAVs.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 560	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:20:00 - [73] - Quote Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Who said anything about this being a solo game? I even asked you what's better at anti-tank, six tanks or six AV. Not only are you unable to give a straight answer to simple questions, you can't even read. You just went FR. first, im infantry dumbass. and 6 infantry are better at winning the game then 6 tanks, pure and simple. i added more to the other post as well to flesh out the point. your an idiot if you thank you going to kill proper tankers in your damage mod sica/soma i have my railtank of old, but im not pulling the thing out just to kill off tanks when im runnign as infantry. if im running in a tank its fromt he start of the tgame till the end. its not an AV solution you pull out in the middle of a game. also you wont kill me with your crappy militia tanks, so YOUR more effective against my tank as the 6 man squad then in your stupid tank. hell your more effective in your 6 man squad then if you were all to hop in 6 tanks vs my 1 fighting on a vetrens terms wont kill him, hes better then you at tanking. but your probably better at infantry so use an infantry based solution and you gain the advantage. Again you fail at reading comprehension. When did I ever say anything about you being non-infantry? But I really want us to get along. I like your spunk, in a totally hetero way. So let me assure you that you'll never see me in a tank of any description. I'm just pointing out that when the field is full of tanks but I don't even think about bringing out my proficiency 5 forge gun, something is seriously wrong with the game. I might get the tank, but it's just not worth putting down my AR when any scrub in a militia rail tank will do a better job than my forge. The game CAN be played by infantry, but it involves a lot of hiding in buildings, which makes it very boring. I've played three matches in the last two weeks; before that I capped every week for six months+. I'm sure you're having fun making every squad member give up their locus for AV nades, but in that case you'll all die quickly the moment you come in contact with a decent squad. You do realize core locus is a primary weapon for many PC-level players? If you're relying on your rifle you're giving yourself a 600HP disadvantage in most engagements. But I'm sure what you're doing works in pubs, anything does <3 if you cant solo a tank with a prof 5 forge gun no wonder your pissed off... that should be simple! thats not somethign wrong with the game, thats just you sucking at it. a scrub in a milita tank wont kill a good tanker.... even YOU have better odds with your forge then that. your last point is conflicting... as a PC team doesnt really give a ** about tanks because of how easy they are to destroy so they dont NEED AV nades..... i gave a simple and VERY effective solution with a low skill cap that just about any group of 6 can use to solve the problem, and instead of using it i get bitched at for even suggesting its possable. i dont even need the solution i presented, i solo the damn things when they get anoying both as infantry and in a tank. dont talk of PC level tactics if you cant solo a tank with a forge as THAT plus tanks are the current anti-tank platform at competitive levels. your obviously not competitive and so have zero insight into those tactics outside of getting stomped by them. core spam is another issue entirely. what more do you want other then a way to kill tanks without using a tank? Yep. Your reading comprehension failed again. He didn't say he can't solo a HAV with his forge, he said it's easier with another HAV. Not everybody pulling down militia HAVs are unskilled scrubs. You didn't state your idea as an option. You din't even state it as a possibility. You stated it as an absolute. Not everyone wants to use your playstyle. what playstyle DO you want exactly? its stated as an aboslute becuase it absolutly works. why would i give an example of somethign that works effectivly as an "opinion" its not an opinion its a fact, it works , its easy, and its accesable to everyone. also the EASYEST way is a prox trap, no effort involved. your confuseing easyest with quickest, not the same thing. as you arnt killing a decent tanker unless you are one yourself, making it suddenly not so easy. never said that the method was the only method, ive made about 5 threads now each detailing completly different simple to use low SP required methods to easily dispose of tanks. all different playstyles. what playstyle DO you want exactly? you *** about me providing solutions but dont ever actually explain why your so damn angry that im doing so
ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 730	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:21:00 - [74] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. This has to be a joke. There is no possible way anyone on these forums is that stupid. I refuse to believe it. This is a troll thread. Has to be. Taking away 6 players from a side to hunt tanks instead of helping win the game with objective capping. Ridiculous. Ghosts Chance wrote: You dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. Right. Because being able to do the work of 6 separate players is in no way easier. CCP, Geth Infiltrator is OP! plz nerf.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 560	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:24:00 - [75] - Quote ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. This has to be a joke. There is no possible way anyone on these forums is that stupid. I refuse to believe it. This is a troll thread. Has to be. Taking away 6 players from a side to hunt tanks instead of helping win the game with objective capping. Ridiculous. Ghosts Chance wrote: You dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. Right. Because being able to do the work of 6 separate players is in no way easier. your an idiot, that squad is designed so that you dont have to hunt tanks... you defend an objective and either the tank doesnt effect you or you destroy it on your turf, your not going anywhere to kill it. the only "stupid" here is being handed a solution, and instead of trying it out you ***** that it doesnt work before hand then continue to complain about tanks without ever trying anything to kill the damn things. how many solutions must i test and provide to GD, what exactly will make people happy? how many new and interesting ways can i give people to kill off a tank before people actually start doing it themselves. how about this, YOU tell me what you want to use to solo a damn tank and ill do it. DONE, its not hard to do. ive killed tanks with plasma cannons FFS, and i diddnt even leave my objective to do so. ive killed tanks with a mass driver and flux granades prox/re traps militia swarms + AV nades you name it ive done it at this point. ive even killed the damn thing by using fluxes and a squad shooting ARs and SMG rounds into its armor.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2426	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:36:00 - [76] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. So having multiple people less effective at killing other infantry and ignoring objectives to attempt to kill a tank is better than being one man down because you've got a tank that is supporting you? You'll have to break that down because I'm not seeing it. Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 2426	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:38:00 - [77] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. This has to be a joke. There is no possible way anyone on these forums is that stupid. I refuse to believe it. This is a troll thread. Has to be. Taking away 6 players from a side to hunt tanks instead of helping win the game with objective capping. Ridiculous. Ghosts Chance wrote: You dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. Right. Because being able to do the work of 6 separate players is in no way easier. your an idiot, that squad is designed so that you dont have to hunt tanks... you defend an objective and either the tank doesnt effect you or you destroy it on your turf, your not going anywhere to kill it. the only "stupid" here is being handed a solution, and instead of trying it out you ***** that it doesnt work before hand then continue to complain about tanks without ever trying anything to kill the damn things. how many solutions must i test and provide to GD, what exactly will make people happy? how many new and interesting ways can i give people to kill off a tank before people actually start doing it themselves. how about this, YOU tell me what you want to use to solo a damn tank and ill do it. DONE, its not hard to do. ive killed tanks with plasma cannons FFS, and i diddnt even leave my objective to do so. ive killed tanks with a mass driver and flux granades prox/re traps militia swarms + AV nades you name it ive done it at this point. ive even killed the damn thing by using fluxes and a squad shooting ARs and SMG rounds into its armor. It sounds like you've won Dust dude, pat yourself on the back. Remove time in battle from ISK payout formula and provide a bonus to winning team... Watch battles become fun again.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 560	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:41:00 - [78] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Tectonic Fusion wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit He's saying why get proto prof 4 swarms when you can just get a no SP militia tank kill your tank with less effort, and it only takes one person rather than 2-6 people. because calling in a tank and leaving your squad alone to go kill something is ALOT more work then just sticking AV nades on all yoru fits and waiting for the tank to come to you while you kill off infantry with support from your squad... thats not easyer, its more of a pain in the ass, it takes you away from objectives, and its time consuming as while yoru doing that your not helping take or defend objectives. So having multiple people less effective at killing other infantry and ignoring objectives to attempt to kill a tank is better than being one man down because you've got a tank that is supporting you? You'll have to break that down because I'm not seeing it. ok heres the part you diddnt understand.... you seem to think that this involves ignoreing objectives.... when in reality it involves sitting on top of one (or back and fourth between two) and not leaving it :P does it make more sence now? and if for some strage reason you absolutly NEED locus granades in order to defend an objective (said objective wich probably has a supply depot or you picked the wrong one to defend so you CAN swap back and fourth ya know) you probably suck. ALSO said objective being assaulted by tanks would you rather your core locus or some AV granades...cores dont do so well against tanks if you havnt heard. also not all objectives your defeding are really suitable to have a member of your squad sitting in a tank for :P what else are you having trouble with ill do my best to point out the obvious for ya
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2424	Posted - 2013.12.23 03:49:00 - [79] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: im not a tanker i destroy tanks using this method with laughable ease your a scrub defending a crtuch with no friends who refuses to run in a squad and use teamwork to acomplish tasks. im using a LP basic PLC and a militia swarm launcher, with a few guys skilled into proxes/remotes to block retreat routs/set traps. we basically ignore tanks now, if they come near us they die. a few tanks have givin us some trouble, but they susually back off to find easyer prey, most tanks just die instantly. its a counter to this militia tank spam, sure good tankers will still be alive and kicking, but they will be off nowhere near your objective hiding. if they come back you simply AV them again, if their hardeners are on you simply take some damn cover for 10 seconds THEN AV him Then why did I see you in a tank a few days ago? Nope. All I saw was you inside a railgun tank. Along with the rest of your squad inside of a tank. Basic PLC? MLT SL? You must have been going up against some mighty scrublords. Vids or it didn't happen. Die instantly? I can has booster? LOLOLOL. 10s? LOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. I can easily butcher people well before they get to cover. And if I have my Missile launcher then I can easily kill them with splash damage. Vids or it didn't happen. Your clearly lying. We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 562	Posted - 2013.12.23 04:05:00 - [80] - Quote Atiim wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: im not a tanker i destroy tanks using this method with laughable ease your a scrub defending a crtuch with no friends who refuses to run in a squad and use teamwork to acomplish tasks. im using a LP basic PLC and a militia swarm launcher, with a few guys skilled into proxes/remotes to block retreat routs/set traps. we basically ignore tanks now, if they come near us they die. a few tanks have givin us some trouble, but they susually back off to find easyer prey, most tanks just die instantly. its a counter to this militia tank spam, sure good tankers will still be alive and kicking, but they will be off nowhere near your objective hiding. if they come back you simply AV them again, if their hardeners are on you simply take some damn cover for 10 seconds THEN AV him Then why did I see you in a tank a few days ago? Nope. All I saw was you inside a railgun tank. Along with the rest of your squad inside of a tank. Basic PLC? MLT SL? You must have been going up against some mighty scrublords. Vids or it didn't happen. Die instantly? I can has booster? LOLOLOL. 10s? LOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL. I can easily butcher people well before they get to cover. And if I have my Missile launcher then I can easily kill them with splash damage. Vids or it didn't happen. Your clearly lying. me + Inf4m0us erich + bad furry in rail tanks having some good ole chromosome style railgun fun. i either run as infantry OR as tank, i dont use my tank as an infantry AV solution. and yah i killed tanks with those, its hilarious, if they dont have a hardener up they die, simple. watch for the glowyness to go away, if they are near you without super glowy powers they die. even good tankers get caught without glowy pwoers sometimes. but yah mostly scrubs caught by the PLC i wont lie. but since scrub tank spam is what everyones complaining about i dont see how that matters. if scrubs are easy to kill why are people bitching about them still? hmmm? mostly because they arnt even trying to kill em. last time i pulled out a railgun i was to nuke some reline rail tankers.... took out 5 dmg mod sica in less then a minuite by calling in my tank in a better position.... aparently they were the best counter to me... i killed them all, some infantry dude stood a better chance then they did. milita tanks arnt the best AV, your just giving half decent tankers free points. infantry AV stands 100% more chance of killing a a decent tanker then calling out a crappy tank does... when in my tank i usuually just shoot those ****** tanks out of the air before the land.... no hardeners on when its still in the air after all. infantry guys with AV nades ambushing me when i drive my tank up into their objective though would put some serious hurt on me though. i wouldnt be able to stick around and would have to bail out. i may not run blasters or missles but im a crack shot with a railgun, i use rails against infantry better then most people use blasters. as a tanker, infantry AV is more of a threat to me then another tnak is. when im running as infantry (most of the time) i dont even bother calling out my tank to deal with tanks, it usually costs me the objective i was defending (in fac war anyways depending on who im fighting for) its easyer to grab an infantry AV fit and give the tank the hint to GTFO and i dont have to leave my objective vulnerable to do so. as a tank... other tanks are so cute when they think they are going to kill me, unless you were a tanker in chrome or you catch me when i just killed another tank or two you really dont stand a chance. as infantry tanks are so easy to negate that unless your a a pre 1.7 tanker with months of experiance your not worth leaving my objective unguarded for, ill wait for you to come to me, and if you dont come to me then you arnt doing anything productive and i win. (dammit CCP its so unbelievable that i killed a tank with a PLC that people think im lieing, but that damn thing already so it stops being a joke....)

Jaysyn Larrisen OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 553	Posted - 2013.12.23 04:20:00 - [81] - Quote Michael Arck wrote: I have to concur. And I think the people that are disagreeing don't employ the teamwork in the actual game to do so. It can be done. I have experienced this myself when the enemy just called in tank after tank. And you're absolutely correct, no one wants to adapt. You see folks who have 8 different dropsuits for different infantry purposes but yet doesn't have a fit to combat the tanks. Instead of working together to concoct a solution, they take to forums and want the devs to change it. And it's repetitive with every build. They want content. We need content!! But nerf this! And nerf that! I don't understand and I truly believe plenty of folks are not even trying what you suggested. How could they when they're countering the very thing that empowers this game and creates monsters corporations...teamwork. It's an odd combination. Mercenary. New Eden. Brutal War. Constant death. Backstabbing. Spies. The reputation that the universe is a brutal place to be. All that in the package but we complaining that tanks are ruining the game? Note that I said we had some success. Three man element running as a dedicated AV team, veteran players...we do adapt. My point is that it's not impossible to kill tanks, the point is the cost to do so is so high relative to the benefit it's not worth it. As Marauder said earlier...it's a helluva lot easier and cheaper to call In a militia tank. I don't have a problem with tanks being the top killer of tanks. I have a problem with how easy it is for a guy with no SP invested and less ISK than my suit invested to dominate a match and the counters that are offered to us feel so out of whack.
NOAMIzzzzz BIG BAD W0LVES 78	Posted - 2013.12.23 04:22:00 - [82] - Quote Lol an "argument" ok bro...
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 727	Posted - 2013.12.23 04:24:00 - [83] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. Hmmm... A fascinating read with a lot of blank spaces. Now pray tell me - which infantry AV can take out five simultaneous tanks backed up by 11 infantrymen in the red team? I am just curious as to how your thought process works. Oh, sht! I just learned you can make a signature! Thanks, CCP! Forums are getting better!
Shijima Kuraimaru WarRavens League of Infamy 445	Posted - 2013.12.23 10:59:00 - [84] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: what playstyle DO you want exactly? its stated as an aboslute becuase it absolutly works. why would i give an example of somethign that works effectivly as an "opinion" its not an opinion its a fact, it works , its easy, and its accesable to everyone. also the EASYEST way is a prox trap, no effort involved. your confuseing easyest with quickest, not the same thing. as you arnt killing a decent tanker unless you are one yourself, making it suddenly not so easy. never said that the method was the only method, ive made about 5 threads now each detailing completly different simple to use low SP required methods to easily dispose of tanks. all different playstyles. what playstyle DO you want exactly? you ***** about me providing solutions but dont ever actually explain why your so damn angry that im doing so I'm not angry. Never said I was. But you sure are. You obviously have some RL issues that have you in a mental state that shakes your credibility. The ranting, raving, and continual childish insults do nothing to get people to consider your opinion. It does however make them think much less of you while they all point and laugh. Find a good therapist to prescribe you some mood stabilizers and maybe the rational players will be able to take you seriously. I still can't find tanks on the market. All I see are those HAVs.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 2026	Posted - 2013.12.23 12:03:00 - [85] - Quote OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant Intelligence is OP
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1493	Posted - 2013.12.23 12:09:00 - [86] - Quote I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 303	Posted - 2013.12.23 12:54:00 - [87] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. Yep - this is it. A Tank can kill tanks better than any infantry AV, plus they can also kill infantry.. so it's a pretty easy choice. Just spam tanks. That's what works and that's what people are doing...
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 303	Posted - 2013.12.23 12:56:00 - [88] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. I did read that thread!!! I agree that it's worthwhile as a solution to balancing the problem. It's true that there is no "anti-vehicle" skill tree for infantry and there are so few weapons that can hurt tanks. Different ammo types for the swarms might be a start, and just a start...
Roy Ventus Foxhound Corporation General Tso's Alliance 780	Posted - 2013.12.23 13:16:00 - [89] - Quote Give us an Anti-Vehicle design Dropsuit with bonuses to racial light AV weapons. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
Ryme Intrinseca 408	Posted - 2013.12.23 14:13:00 - [90] - Quote Justicar Karnellia wrote: pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. I did read that thread!!! I agree that it's worthwhile as a solution to balancing the problem. It's true that there is no "anti-vehicle" skill tree for infantry and there are so few weapons that can hurt tanks. Different ammo types for the swarms might be a start, and just a start... It's a trap! At the moment there are several suits (e.g. Min assault, which makes your sidearm beastly; Ama logi, which gives you the sidearm plus slots for REs; heavy basic frame, for two damage mod forge) that are especially suited to AV. If you introduced a new AV suit that was worth using, dedicated AV would have millions of SP trapped in what used to be a good proto AV suit. Do we really want to screw infantry over yet again by making their good choices into bad ones by changing the rules of the game? Couple that with the fact that infantry already have plenty of SP trapped in other once useful but now useless places because they didn't get a respec like the precious vehicle users did, and you can see that not many players would have the SP to spare to go into this new suit. The idea is just an elaborate tanker distraction from the 30%+ damage buff that is evidently needed for all AV weapons, no strings attached.

pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1497	Posted - 2013.12.23 14:24:00 - [91] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Justicar Karnellia wrote: pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. I did read that thread!!! I agree that it's worthwhile as a solution to balancing the problem. It's true that there is no "anti-vehicle" skill tree for infantry and there are so few weapons that can hurt tanks. Different ammo types for the swarms might be a start, and just a start... It's a trap! At the moment there are several suits (e.g. Min assault, which makes your sidearm beastly; Ama logi, which gives you the sidearm plus slots for REs; heavy basic frame, for two damage mod forge) that are especially suited to AV. If you introduced a new AV suit that was worth using, dedicated AV would have millions of SP trapped in what used to be a good proto AV suit. Do we really want to screw infantry over yet again by making their good choices into bad ones by changing the rules of the game? Couple that with the fact that infantry already have plenty of SP trapped in other once useful but now useless places because they didn't get a respec like the precious vehicle users did, and you can see that not many players would have the SP to spare to go into this new suit. The idea is just an elaborate tanker distraction from the 30%+ damage buff that is evidently needed for all AV weapons, no strings attached. ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
The Attorney General 1688	Posted - 2013.12.23 14:30:00 - [92] - Quote These types of threads show why this game will never get a good player base growing. Too many cowards and scrubs. The only thing they ever consider is what is easiest, then do that. No attempt for a challenge, just stomping if they can, nothing more. That is why none of them have any heavies in their squads, because when the heavy was no good vs infantry, they avoided it like the plague. Now when they need someone in a fat suit with a forge, they have none. So because they went the easy route with swarms, and now want to go the easy route with MLT tanks, it doesn't matter how you try and argue with them. All they want is easy mode, however they need it. If it is difficult, they move on to something else, because trying is overrated to most of the people who play this game. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 221	Posted - 2013.12.23 14:34:00 - [93] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. An Anti-Vehicule Dropsuits would be kinda Nice.
Mitch Laurence The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 7	Posted - 2013.12.23 14:38:00 - [94] - Quote Are tankers even considered usefull to the team? Or are they just k/d farming? And is someone who runs around trying to blow tanks considered usefull? "People will say we're in love." -Hannibal Lecter
Ryme Intrinseca 409	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:07:00 - [95] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Justicar Karnellia wrote: pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. I did read that thread!!! I agree that it's worthwhile as a solution to balancing the problem. It's true that there is no "anti-vehicle" skill tree for infantry and there are so few weapons that can hurt tanks. Different ammo types for the swarms might be a start, and just a start... It's a trap! At the moment there are several suits (e.g. Min assault, which makes your sidearm beastly; Ama logi, which gives you the sidearm plus slots for REs; heavy basic frame, for two damage mod forge) that are especially suited to AV. If you introduced a new AV suit that was worth using, dedicated AV would have millions of SP trapped in what used to be a good proto AV suit. Do we really want to screw infantry over yet again by making their good choices into bad ones by changing the rules of the game? Couple that with the fact that infantry already have plenty of SP trapped in other once useful but now useless places because they didn't get a respec like the precious vehicle users did, and you can see that not many players would have the SP to spare to go into this new suit. The idea is just an elaborate tanker distraction from the 30%+ damage buff that is evidently needed for all AV weapons, no strings attached. ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. You can fling around all the childish insults you like, but anyone in their right mind can see that AV needs an outright buff. Even decent tankers know something is wrong when a prof 5 swarm or forge is outperformed by a militia rail tank. The AV suit would do nothing about that. I've already put about 20 million SP in my AV fit (3 mil for suit, 3 mil for weapon, and 14 mil or so in supporting skills). Why should I have to spend millions more on a new SP sink just to achieve parity with a militia tank? Your idea of balance is for AV to need 23 million SP to be as effective at their role as a zero SP tank. And vehicle users did get a respec. CCP even called it that. You could at least try to get a grip on basic game concepts before you start spouting your ill-informed opinions.
Ryme Intrinseca 410	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:09:00 - [96] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: These types of threads show why this game will never get a good player base growing. Too many cowards and scrubs. The only thing they ever consider is what is easiest, then do that. No attempt for a challenge, just stomping if they can, nothing more. That is why none of them have any heavies in their squads, because when the heavy was no good vs infantry, they avoided it like the plague. Now when they need someone in a fat suit with a forge, they have none. So because they went the easy route with swarms, and now want to go the easy route with MLT tanks, it doesn't matter how you try and argue with them. All they want is easy mode, however they need it. If it is difficult, they move on to something else, because trying is overrated to most of the people who play this game. If militia tanks are easy mode, that would make maxed out tanks Godmode.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:25:00 - [97] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: These types of threads show why this game will never get a good player base growing. Too many cowards and scrubs. The only thing they ever consider is what is easiest, then do that. No attempt for a challenge, just stomping if they can, nothing more. That is why none of them have any heavies in their squads, because when the heavy was no good vs infantry, they avoided it like the plague. Now when they need someone in a fat suit with a forge, they have none. So because they went the easy route with swarms, and now want to go the easy route with MLT tanks, it doesn't matter how you try and argue with them. All they want is easy mode, however they need it. If it is difficult, they move on to something else, because trying is overrated to most of the people who play this game. Funny. I invested into Swarm Launchers because I wasn't a heavy at the time. Why would a Scout/Logi/Assault spec into Forge Guns? You do realize that the FG's ability to OHK infantry from 200m away makes it far more "easymode" than Swarms right? Not sure if that statement about people not having heavies in their squad is valid considering how my corp squad usually has 1-2 heavies. Trying is overrated? Then why are you a tanker? Especially an Uprising 1.7 Tanker. MLT Tanks are easymode. That also makes average to maxed out tanks godmode. Might want to check your facts on some of those statements. Oh wait, you didn't use facts at all and just conjured up a statement based on your heavily biased, and non-credible perspective. We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2434	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:28:00 - [98] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. Kind of like every thread ever made by AV about V/AV balance. Ironic isn't it? We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Psyon Sebiestor FACTION WARFARE ARMY 65	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:30:00 - [99] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: And nobody wants to actually fullfill the role. now that being infantry AV is more then just a swap at a supply depot and intakill your problem type of job, nobody wants to actually fill the role as a dedicated tank hunter. its not like infantry AV doesnt do the job, in skilled hands it even kills tanks solo, both as heavys with forge guns, and infantry with swarms and PLCs. the problem isnt that these things dont work, they do. the problem is that nobody wants to sit around as AV infantry all game, nobody wants to fill that role. and the team that DOESNT fill that role is going to get a whole lot of tanks on their doorstep. its not that tanks are OP, its that players arnt adapting into nessesary roles. everyone wants to play that slayer assault suit, or that brawler tank. pub matches have degraded into pure kill farming, objectives being secondary used as a means to an end. the game doesnt work like that guys, if you want to win, the team as a whole is going to have to bring the tools nessesary to win, if nobody brings those tools then you dont win its simple. remember when murder taxi was at an all time high and each and every single foot soldier started equiping AV nades to deal with it? notice how its now tanks doing the same thing but now infantry isnt even bothering with the AV nades? its not like 6 people with AV nades cant mess up a tank, its likely it will maim and or destroy it nearly instantly and if an entaire team swaped out to AV nades a tank would think twice before driving into the middle of an objective. its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. Whats the point in being infantry AV when you could just skill into Tanks and do the job better, cheaper and with more protection as well as being able to do it without having a few other people to take down 1 tank People who want to spend their entire game hunting Tanks ... are tankers themselves
Gelan Corbaine Gladiators Vanguard 262	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:32:00 - [100] - Quote Once again..... I see Ghost has failed to comprehend what exactly is the problem . Here's a hint ... it has nothing to do with destroying the damn tank . No job is worth doing if you don't get paid in the end .

Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2435	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:37:00 - [101] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. Nope, your a serious liar, and definitely beyond all help. Vehicle users got a complete respec from the vehicle tree. All SP and ISK invested in all of the skillbooks in Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation were completely refunded, which is the definition of a respec. I'd actually be perfectly fine with an AV suit, but it needs to have an ACTUAL bonus. I'd say a 3% bonus to AV weaponry is fair, and it also follows a design similar to the Minmatar Scout Suit bonus. What SP? You don't even need to spend SP to not get killed by anything other than a tank. If your a pilot who gets killed by conventional AV in this build than you are either unlucky or a complete scrublord. We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2435	Posted - 2013.12.23 15:42:00 - [102] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant You say this as if tanking has teamwork as a prequisite. We could AV. Or we could use the better AV, which is a MLT HAV. Lets see here. 200k per suit with the guarrantee to die 3-4 times trying to kill the tank, while also being shredded and pounded by infantry at the same time. OR 78k tank with a MLT Railgun that does more damage than any AV weapon in this game could possible hope to achice, theoretical invulnerability from infantry, and the guarantee to die 0-1 times. Which one should I pick? We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
The Attorney General 1688	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:07:00 - [103] - Quote Atiim wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant You say this as if tanking has teamwork as a prequisite. We could AV. Or we could use the better AV, which is a MLT HAV. Lets see here. 200k per suit with the guarrantee to die 3-4 times trying to kill the tank, while also being shredded and pounded by infantry at the same time. OR 78k tank with a MLT Railgun that does more damage than any AV weapon in this game could possible hope to achice, theoretical invulnerability from infantry, and the guarantee to die 0-1 times. Which one should I pick? Your example only works if you are bad on foot and good in tanks. However, if you are bad in both, then you will be dying regularly to everything. Well, unless you are hiding in the redline, in which case you are just searching for easy mode because you are a scrub. Mr. Hybrid Vayu.
Darken-Sol BIG BAD W0LVES 1006	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:23:00 - [104] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Darken-Sol wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. yep. Anything less than proto gets you killed. I get plenty of tanks but the cost is thru the roof. by increasing charge time you have given my enemy 4 more seconds of sustained blaster fire. Since forges do so little dmg it really does a number on my wallet. I'll just call a tank. Cheaper and easier. hex what do you think? You still out punchin scouts? my AV fits are STD plasma cannon with AV nades and militia swarmer with AV nades or fluxes.... aparently you just suck. i do it without any skills invested and i dont die while i do. squad up. If you get one I will give you a mil. neither fit sounds effective. Watch my back does not mean look at my spine.
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1498	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:29:00 - [105] - Quote Atiim wrote: pegasis prime wrote: ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. Nope, your a serious liar, and definitely beyond all help. Vehicle users got a complete respec from the vehicle tree. All SP and ISK invested in all of the skillbooks in Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation were completely refunded, which is the definition of a respec. I'd actually be perfectly fine with an AV suit, but it needs to have an ACTUAL bonus. I'd say a 3% bonus to AV weaponry is fair, and it also follows a design similar to the Minmatar Scout Suit bonus. What SP? You don't even need to spend SP to not get killed by anything other than a tank. If your a pilot who gets killed by conventional AV in this build than you are either unlucky or a complete scrublord. right *** lets get this strait DONT you ever call me a liar you *** piece of scum......you are nothing but the load that should have been swallowed you *** moron how di you even manage to climb out of your *** testtube you *** freek .... right now thats out of the way ........vehicle sp was refunded because of a major overhaul of how the vehicle skill tree works as well as the removal of specific skills .....any skills that were left behind had different prerecs and functions or we would have Kept them or are you too stupid to understand that concept . im beginging to think you ether are an autistic piece of *** rubber or just a lame troll.. now ** off . Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1498	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:34:00 - [106] - Quote Atiim wrote: pegasis prime wrote: I put up a thread to discuss the possibilities of an av suit with bonuses generated towards each races av weponary but it was soon forgotten and buried beneath all the QQ nerf tank threads. Kind of like every thread ever made by AV about V/AV balance. Ironic isn't it? look look everyone we have a ***** smart arse here wow everyone bow down to this croch sniffing, windowlicking, paste eating *** smurf that probably should have been aborted ..... come on everyone lets all gather round the ***** guru of idiocy.... Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
DeadlyAztec11 2878	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:37:00 - [107] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Atiim wrote: pegasis prime wrote: ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. Nope, your a serious liar, and definitely beyond all help. Vehicle users got a complete respec from the vehicle tree. All SP and ISK invested in all of the skillbooks in Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation were completely refunded, which is the definition of a respec. I'd actually be perfectly fine with an AV suit, but it needs to have an ACTUAL bonus. I'd say a 3% bonus to AV weaponry is fair, and it also follows a design similar to the Minmatar Scout Suit bonus. What SP? You don't even need to spend SP to not get killed by anything other than a tank. If your a pilot who gets killed by conventional AV in this build than you are either unlucky or a complete scrublord. right *** lets get this strait DONT you ever call me a liar you *** piece of scum......you are nothing but the load that should have been swallowed you *** moron how di you even manage to climb out of your *** testtube you *** freek .... right now thats out of the way ........vehicle sp was refunded because of a major overhaul of how the vehicle skill tree works as well as the removal of specific skills .....any skills that were left behind had different prerecs and functions or we would have Kept them or are you too stupid to understand that concept . im beginging to think you ether are an autistic piece of *** rubber or just a lame troll.. now ** off . So you admit that you lied? Because in your other post you said that only SP for skills that were changed were refunded, but now you admit that all vehicle SP was refunded regardless of any skills that did not suffer change. »We still have our honor!
DeadlyAztec11 2880	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:39:00 - [108] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: Atiim wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant You say this as if tanking has teamwork as a prequisite. We could AV. Or we could use the better AV, which is a MLT HAV. Lets see here. 200k per suit with the guarrantee to die 3-4 times trying to kill the tank, while also being shredded and pounded by infantry at the same time. OR 78k tank with a MLT Railgun that does more damage than any AV weapon in this game could possible hope to achice, theoretical invulnerability from infantry, and the guarantee to die 0-1 times. Which one should I pick? Your example only works if you are bad on foot and good in tanks. However, if you are bad in both, then you will be dying regularly to everything. Well, unless you are hiding in the redline, in which case you are just searching for easy mode because you are a scrub. It is hard to be bad in tanks though. »We still have our honor!
Ryme Intrinseca 416	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:40:00 - [109] - Quote The Attorney General wrote: Atiim wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant You say this as if tanking has teamwork as a prequisite. We could AV. Or we could use the better AV, which is a MLT HAV. Lets see here. 200k per suit with the guarrantee to die 3-4 times trying to kill the tank, while also being shredded and pounded by infantry at the same time. OR 78k tank with a MLT Railgun that does more damage than any AV weapon in this game could possible hope to achice, theoretical invulnerability from infantry, and the guarantee to die 0-1 times. Which one should I pick? Your example only works if you are bad on foot and good in tanks. However, if you are bad in both, then you will be dying regularly to everything. Well, unless you are hiding in the redline, in which case you are just searching for easy mode because you are a scrub. I think Atim is right. If I spend an entire skirmish chasing tanks on foot with proto forge and suit, I will usually die 3 or 4 times unless my team is stomping. I'm a pretty good infantry player, 27,000 kills and KDR over 3 (about double that for the month). It's just that a heavy with a forge and SMG is too slow to choose its engagements and is highly vulnerable to both tanks and infantry. It's true that I could die less by towerforging but I don't because that's just as scrubby as hiding in the redline. I don't use tanks at all, but I really doubt that competent tankers are frequently dieing 3 or 4 times in this build even in militia tanks.
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1498	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:40:00 - [110] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Atiim wrote: pegasis prime wrote: ok dude you might be beyond help but ill give it a go.... vehicle users did not get a respect we had sp returned from skills that were REMOVED.. Giving av a specific suit fr=or each race that will give some sort of inherent bonus towards that races racial wepon will help the AV cause , it will also end any QQ from any tanker about the difference in cost of sp to run a fully fit complex tanc compaird to proto av... it would also let avers be a class into their own what is your problem with this ??? do you have any other sollutions other than buffing av outright ????? if not then jog on. Nope, your a serious liar, and definitely beyond all help. Vehicle users got a complete respec from the vehicle tree. All SP and ISK invested in all of the skillbooks in Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation were completely refunded, which is the definition of a respec. I'd actually be perfectly fine with an AV suit, but it needs to have an ACTUAL bonus. I'd say a 3% bonus to AV weaponry is fair, and it also follows a design similar to the Minmatar Scout Suit bonus. What SP? You don't even need to spend SP to not get killed by anything other than a tank. If your a pilot who gets killed by conventional AV in this build than you are either unlucky or a complete scrublord. right *** lets get this strait DONT you ever call me a liar you *** piece of scum......you are nothing but the load that should have been swallowed you *** moron how di you even manage to climb out of your *** testtube you *** freek .... right now thats out of the way ........vehicle sp was refunded because of a major overhaul of how the vehicle skill tree works as well as the removal of specific skills .....any skills that were left behind had different prerecs and functions or we would have Kept them or are you too stupid to understand that concept . im beginging to think you ether are an autistic piece of *** rubber or just a lame troll.. now off . So you admit that you lied? Because in your other post you said that only SP for skills that were changed were refunded, but now you admit that all vehicle SP was refunded regardless of any skills that did not suffer change. what skills did not suffer a change ???????? oh that's rigt 2 of them turret operation and vehicle command...... ohj forgive me . every other vehicle skill had something to do with either its function, bonus pre req or follow on skill changed , so no im not a lier . you are just picking at threads now so you can go ** off as well . Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior

Pocket Rocket Girl Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 75	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:42:00 - [111] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit kane fyea did say milita tanks .....
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1498	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:43:00 - [112] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: The Attorney General wrote: Atiim wrote: Takahiro Kashuken wrote: OP is correct AV players can defo make out a living killing tanks and can do it every game aswell if they really want to, problem is they dont want to because they cant do it solo because they have the IQ of a teaspoon and teamwork is nonexistant You say this as if tanking has teamwork as a prequisite. We could AV. Or we could use the better AV, which is a MLT HAV. Lets see here. 200k per suit with the guarrantee to die 3-4 times trying to kill the tank, while also being shredded and pounded by infantry at the same time. OR 78k tank with a MLT Railgun that does more damage than any AV weapon in this game could possible hope to achice, theoretical invulnerability from infantry, and the guarantee to die 0-1 times. Which one should I pick? Your example only works if you are bad on foot and good in tanks. However, if you are bad in both, then you will be dying regularly to everything. Well, unless you are hiding in the redline, in which case you are just searching for easy mode because you are a scrub. I think Atim is right. If I spend an entire skirmish chasing tanks on foot with proto forge and suit, I will usually die 3 or 4 times unless my team is stomping. I'm a pretty good infantry player, 27,000 kills and KDR over 3 (about double that for the month). It's just that a heavy with a forge and SMG is too slow to choose its engagements and is highly vulnerable to both tanks and infantry. It's true that I could die less by towerforging but I don't because that's just as scrubby as hiding in the redline. I don't use tanks at all, but I really doubt that competent tankers are frequently dieing 3 or 4 times in this build even in militia tanks. that depends on whether there is another competent tanker on the opposite team , if so then both of them can stand to loose many tanks as we often don't stop going to battle each other even after severall losses . Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1498	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:44:00 - [113] - Quote Pocket Rocket Girl wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. you should probably mention that its mlt tanks your talking about as my fully complex and proto fit gunlogi is most certainly not cheeper than your av fit kane fyea did say milita tanks ..... ye I see than now it was late here when I responded to that one lol , had bags like binliners under my eyes at that time. Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 568	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:47:00 - [114] - Quote this thread was started to discuss interesting, simple, and not oftin used ways to kill tanks. the nerf tanks brigade showed up and ruined proclaiming that they are aware that tanks are easy to kill, instead they just dont like the tools available to kill them. dont come and tell me its easyer to call in a miliita **** fit to destroy a tank, its not, a good tanker wont be killed by that. unless you yourself are ALREADY in a tank, and a good tanker yourself, its not easyer to just call in a tank. infantry AV is alot easyer to do if you are in a squad of infantry and are infantry yourself. so far the resounding complaint is that its "easyer to call in your own tank to counter a tank" and thats true one some level, its not true if your not a tanker yourself. for me since i DO have a tank, and was a chromo vetren railtanker back when a tank fight was won before the first shot was fired, its ALOT easyer for me to call in a tank and remove any and all tanks from the bored with my tank, but thats because im better then them at tanking, if i wasnt then my tank would explode and i wouldnt be countering tanks very well in my tank. rather then do that when i see tanks however, i find infantry solutions, becuase calling in a railtank is a playstyle of its own, and if i wanted to play around in a railgun i would of called it out at the begining of the game, infantry solutions are what people should be focusing on, as their little sicas and somas arnt solving anything, sure your going to kill soe new guy whos using militia, but your going far out of your way to do so. sure militia tanks can go 20-0 without SP involved, but thats against people who dont understand what cover is, and when faced with ZERO oposition whatsoever. this "its easyer to call in a tank" thing is complete BS, it only works when your a better tanker then they are, and if your infantry with no SP or interest in tanks.... your clearly not going to be a better tanker. quite bitching and moaning, every point in this thread complaining about tanks is complete and total BS. pick up some damn AV and work as a squad, becuase you should be working as a squad ANYWAYS, why would a tank on the field suddenly change that? you dont even have to leave your objective, dont have to gimp yourself against infantry, you dont even have to worry about them shooting you, thats what cover and battle lines are for.
Pocket Rocket Girl Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 75	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:49:00 - [115] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its not that rock is OP, its that nobody wants to play paper and everyone wants to play scizors and rock. My recollection of rock-paper-scissors is that paper is better at beating rock than rock is. Can you honestly say that AV is better at destroying a tank than another tank is? yes, because my paper comes in the form of a whole squad.... without diminishing its AI capabilities 6 man squad with AVs and fluxes with a SINGLE av guy in the mix and you NEVER have to worry about tanks again, not only that but you dont have to get into a tank if you dont want to, and you get to run on the gorund shooting people in the face all you want uninterupted by vehicles. thats what everyones bitching about wanting isnt it? to run around as infantry and not ahve to worry about a tank owning you unmolested? im literally handing the solution to everyone on a silver platter, a solution that bends to everyones collective will of "i dont want to run around hunting tanks all game" "i dont want to run a tank" "i want to destroy tanks easily" "i want to just run around shooting infantry" the solution is RUN IN A DAMN SQUAD WIITH A SINGLE AV GUY, the collective action of a squad with AV nades and fluxes alone is deadly to a tank, adding the AV guy in there is just the icing. I AM THE PAPER !!!!!!!!
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 684	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:56:00 - [116] - Quote Tanks are still easy to kill. All it takes is ONE person who knows how to use their AV weapon properly and that's it. I get 3-4 tank kills minimum per game now since there are so many noob tankers on the field. It's easy to AV full time if you build your suit right. Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
DeadlyAztec11 2880	Posted - 2013.12.23 16:58:00 - [117] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: this thread was started to discuss interesting, simple, and not oftin used ways to kill tanks. the nerf tanks brigade showed up and ruined proclaiming that they are aware that tanks are easy to kill, instead they just dont like the tools available to kill them. dont come and tell me its easyer to call in a miliita **** fit to destroy a tank, its not, a good tanker wont be killed by that. unless you yourself are ALREADY in a tank, and a good tanker yourself, its not easyer to just call in a tank. infantry AV is alot easyer to do if you are in a squad of infantry and are infantry yourself. so far the resounding complaint is that its "easyer to call in your own tank to counter a tank" and thats true one some level, its not true if your not a tanker yourself. for me since i DO have a tank, and was a chromo vetren railtanker back when a tank fight was won before the first shot was fired, its ALOT easyer for me to call in a tank and remove any and all tanks from the bored with my tank, but thats because im better then them at tanking, if i wasnt then my tank would explode and i wouldnt be countering tanks very well in my tank. rather then do that when i see tanks however, i find infantry solutions, becuase calling in a railtank is a playstyle of its own, and if i wanted to play around in a railgun i would of called it out at the begining of the game, infantry solutions are what people should be focusing on, as their little sicas and somas arnt solving anything, sure your going to kill soe new guy whos using militia, but your going far out of your way to do so. sure militia tanks can go 20-0 without SP involved, but thats against people who dont understand what cover is, and when faced with ZERO oposition whatsoever. this "its easyer to call in a tank" thing is complete BS, it only works when your a better tanker then they are, and if your infantry with no SP or interest in tanks.... your clearly not going to be a better tanker. quite bitching and moaning, every point in this thread complaining about tanks is complete and total BS. pick up some damn AV and work as a squad, becuase you should be working as a squad ANYWAYS, why would a tank on the field suddenly change that? you dont even have to leave your objective, dont have to gimp yourself against infantry, you dont even have to worry about them shooting you, thats what cover and battle lines are for. and if the tank lives through the game but you hold the objectives then YOU WIN. You don't gimp yourself? You reduce shields because of damage mods and your only defense against infantry is a pistol. Your fit also cost twice as much as a militia tank. I think you are talking yourself up too much, militia tanks are way better than AV. You don't have to worry about being scanned, you don't have to worry about anti-infantry weapons and to top it off your tank costs more than Proto AV. Let's face it, AV is really a thing of the past, militia HAV's do it far cheaper and better. »We still have our honor!
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 440	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:07:00 - [118] - Quote Didnt read much past the OP, so forgive me if im repeating. To OP: you're either a bad tanker, or you dont use AV. Yesterday my squad was running dom. The opposition had three tanks and 2 LAVs. Normally, i wouldnt switch to AV as Im much more usefull as a logi, but the tanks were tearin our team up, and i notived they were bad tankers, like really bad (one sat at our spawn and never moved, thought he dc'd till i realized he was still shooting.) So i switched to my proto swarms with adv AV nades. A squadmate was already running proto AV nades. It took our combined forces to take out the one (really bad) tanker and a LAV, and it took damn near the whole match. Less than a minute later, our tanker pulled out his tank, and destroyed every vehicle on the field in what seemed like seconds. Moral here is, dedicating even one AV guy to hope he can take a bad tanker is just stupid when you can grab a tank and do it so much better.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 570	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:10:00 - [119] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Didnt read much past the OP, so forgive me if im repeating. To OP: you're either a bad tanker, or you dont use AV. Yesterday my squad was running dom. The opposition had three tanks and 2 LAVs. Normally, i wouldnt switch to AV as Im much more usefull as a logi, but the tanks were tearin our team up, and i notived they were bad tankers, like really bad (one sat at our spawn and never moved, thought he dc'd till i realized he was still shooting.) So i switched to my proto swarms with adv AV nades. A squadmate was already running proto AV nades. It took our combined forces to take out the one (really bad) tanker and a LAV, and it took damn near the whole match. Less than a minute later, our tanker pulled out his tank, and destroyed every vehicle on the field in what seemed like seconds. Moral here is, dedicating even one AV guy to hope he can take a bad tanker is just stupid when you can grab a tank and do it so much better. im both a good tanker, AND us infantry AV just killed some poor militia tank with a PLC you dont need to kill the tank, you just need to get it away form the objective your defending. the fact that you abandoned the game to follow a tank around makes you a bad player. now do YOU think you would of been able to kill off every tank ont he firld with a shitfit sica of your own? or would you of went BOOM and lost the objective you were defeneding with your squad while you did it? thats the thing most people dont get, you dont have to kill the tank, and leaving your objective to do so is a a TERRIBLE idea the infantry squad in the OP is a base defence squad if your leaving the objectives to go tank hunting then you lose the game. if a tank enters teh objective that the squad is guarding its going to have to leave immediatly pure and simple. and a tank thats not shooting at you is as good as dead.
DeadlyAztec11 2882	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:13:00 - [120] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Didnt read much past the OP, so forgive me if im repeating. To OP: you're either a bad tanker, or you dont use AV. Yesterday my squad was running dom. The opposition had three tanks and 2 LAVs. Normally, i wouldnt switch to AV as Im much more usefull as a logi, but the tanks were tearin our team up, and i notived they were bad tankers, like really bad (one sat at our spawn and never moved, thought he dc'd till i realized he was still shooting.) So i switched to my proto swarms with adv AV nades. A squadmate was already running proto AV nades. It took our combined forces to take out the one (really bad) tanker and a LAV, and it took damn near the whole match. Less than a minute later, our tanker pulled out his tank, and destroyed every vehicle on the field in what seemed like seconds. Moral here is, dedicating even one AV guy to hope he can take a bad tanker is just stupid when you can grab a tank and do it so much better. im both a good tanker, AND us infantry AV just killed some poor militia tank with a PLC you dont need to kill the tank, you just need to get it away form the objective your defending. the fact that you abandoned the game to follow a tank around makes you a bad player. now do YOU think you would of been able to kill off every tank ont he firld with a shitfit sica of your own? or would you of went BOOM and lost the objective you were defeneding with your squad while you did it? You do realize that a standard Plasma Cannon does more damage than Proto Swarm Launchers right? »We still have our honor!

P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 440	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:15:00 - [121] - Quote MassiveNine wrote: Tanks are still easy to kill. All it takes is ONE person who knows how to use their AV weapon properly and that's it. I get 3-4 tank kills minimum per game now since there are so many noob tankers on the field. It's easy to AV full time if you build your suit right. Not everyone has a caldari proto suit, cus thats the only way to solo a tanker.. try it in gallente and tell me its easy
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 685	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:16:00 - [122] - Quote Seriously, people here talking about being a bad A/V or bad tanker. Fact is there are tons of both, and few decent people. Tanks are most definitely easier to kill other tanks with but the fact remains that anyone who is decent with A/V can still take out a tank just as easily. Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 570	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:17:00 - [123] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Didnt read much past the OP, so forgive me if im repeating. To OP: you're either a bad tanker, or you dont use AV. Yesterday my squad was running dom. The opposition had three tanks and 2 LAVs. Normally, i wouldnt switch to AV as Im much more usefull as a logi, but the tanks were tearin our team up, and i notived they were bad tankers, like really bad (one sat at our spawn and never moved, thought he dc'd till i realized he was still shooting.) So i switched to my proto swarms with adv AV nades. A squadmate was already running proto AV nades. It took our combined forces to take out the one (really bad) tanker and a LAV, and it took damn near the whole match. Less than a minute later, our tanker pulled out his tank, and destroyed every vehicle on the field in what seemed like seconds. Moral here is, dedicating even one AV guy to hope he can take a bad tanker is just stupid when you can grab a tank and do it so much better. im both a good tanker, AND us infantry AV just killed some poor militia tank with a PLC you dont need to kill the tank, you just need to get it away form the objective your defending. the fact that you abandoned the game to follow a tank around makes you a bad player. now do YOU think you would of been able to kill off every tank ont he firld with a shitfit sica of your own? or would you of went BOOM and lost the objective you were defeneding with your squad while you did it? You do realize that a standard Plasma Cannon does more damage than Proto Swarm Launchers right? STD swarmer does 960 DMG (4x220) STD plasma deals less then a hundred damage more check your math also a swarmer does more against armor then any PLC does, weapon efficiancy matters :P
Darius Ashran Bragian Order Amarr Empire 31	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:20:00 - [124] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: funny how always the same players step out to defend their crutch with what they call "arguments". how often does everyone needs to facepalm and bust your so called "logic" till you understand that the nerf hammer is inevitable? so lets see, this guy suggests you to squad up with a team full of AV nades and a single AV weapon dude. and this works exactly against one type of tank driver => the scrub that just tries out MLT tanks the first time in a public match. have fun running after a good pilot with awareness & map knowledge. first of all, if a tank drivers gets caught by a squad of swarms, PLC and AV nades then he did an error and deserver to explode but driver making bad choices is not a factor for balance. factor for balance is risk vs reward. tank speed is still high and what was true for only lower ehp vehicles (dropships & LAVs) before is now also true for high ehp tanks, if things are not going well you turn on that nitro and none of those weapons can keep up. beside that there should not be something that requires the attention of a that many players in a game with limited amount of players per side, this creates artificial power advantage for those teams with more tanks. this should especially not happen when tanks for 100k isk are able to shrug of proto AV weaponry. second, not everyone has skilled into forges and heavies. beside that, this weapon still needs a good position to fire on a slow frame. you still need atleast proto level to bother a tank. and the tank driver can still gtfo and you just wasted your time. third, no one wants to wait half a minute, just to see the tank driver gtfo out at the speed of sound when the hardeners are down. waiting the whole game just for a minor chance to kill a tank when the driver did an error? no thanks. again piloting errors are not a factor for balance. and last, tanks are the better AV, they are cheaper require no SP and rails can even hurt tanks when their hardeners are up. and the best part about tanks: tanks do not give up any killing power against infantry. So much opinionated subjective bullshit in such tight proximity. I don't honestly know if the fabric of the universe can handle it.
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 440	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:22:00 - [125] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Didnt read much past the OP, so forgive me if im repeating. To OP: you're either a bad tanker, or you dont use AV. Yesterday my squad was running dom. The opposition had three tanks and 2 LAVs. Normally, i wouldnt switch to AV as Im much more usefull as a logi, but the tanks were tearin our team up, and i notived they were bad tankers, like really bad (one sat at our spawn and never moved, thought he dc'd till i realized he was still shooting.) So i switched to my proto swarms with adv AV nades. A squadmate was already running proto AV nades. It took our combined forces to take out the one (really bad) tanker and a LAV, and it took damn near the whole match. Less than a minute later, our tanker pulled out his tank, and destroyed every vehicle on the field in what seemed like seconds. Moral here is, dedicating even one AV guy to hope he can take a bad tanker is just stupid when you can grab a tank and do it so much better. im both a good tanker, AND us infantry AV just killed some poor militia tank with a PLC you dont need to kill the tank, you just need to get it away form the objective your defending. the fact that you abandoned the game to follow a tank around makes you a bad player. now do YOU think you would of been able to kill off every tank ont he firld with a shitfit sica of your own? or would you of went BOOM and lost the objective you were defeneding with your squad while you did it? You do realize that a standard Plasma Cannon does more damage than Proto Swarm Launchers right? STD swarmer does 960 DMG (4x220) STD plasma deals less then a hundred damage more check your math also a swarmer does more against armor then any PLC does, weapon efficiancy matters :P i killed that tank within a minuite of it being called in, diddnt go chasing it around i waited at the objective i was defending and it came to me. then i dual fluxed and PLCed and BOOM, its not hard, it doesnt take effort and you dont even have to stop defending your base. I can kill shield tanks with dual flux and a mass driver.. done it numerous times. The only point your proving is that shield tanks suck or flux are OP. Of course you can take out a tank with a PLC when it had a couple hundred armor... Edit: if you read my post, the tank was at our spawn and never moved, so i never left the point to chase him... AV is bad and you should feel bad
DeadlyAztec11 2882	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:23:00 - [126] - Quote Darius Ashran wrote: Jack McReady wrote: funny how always the same players step out to defend their crutch with what they call "arguments". how often does everyone needs to facepalm and bust your so called "logic" till you understand that the nerf hammer is inevitable? so lets see, this guy suggests you to squad up with a team full of AV nades and a single AV weapon dude. and this works exactly against one type of tank driver => the scrub that just tries out MLT tanks the first time in a public match. have fun running after a good pilot with awareness & map knowledge. first of all, if a tank drivers gets caught by a squad of swarms, PLC and AV nades then he did an error and deserver to explode but driver making bad choices is not a factor for balance. factor for balance is risk vs reward. tank speed is still high and what was true for only lower ehp vehicles (dropships & LAVs) before is now also true for high ehp tanks, if things are not going well you turn on that nitro and none of those weapons can keep up. beside that there should not be something that requires the attention of a that many players in a game with limited amount of players per side, this creates artificial power advantage for those teams with more tanks. this should especially not happen when tanks for 100k isk are able to shrug of proto AV weaponry. second, not everyone has skilled into forges and heavies. beside that, this weapon still needs a good position to fire on a slow frame. you still need atleast proto level to bother a tank. and the tank driver can still gtfo and you just wasted your time. third, no one wants to wait half a minute, just to see the tank driver gtfo out at the speed of sound when the hardeners are down. waiting the whole game just for a minor chance to kill a tank when the driver did an error? no thanks. again piloting errors are not a factor for balance. and last, tanks are the better AV, they are cheaper require no SP and rails can even hurt tanks when their hardeners are up. and the best part about tanks: tanks do not give up any killing power against infantry. So much opinionated subjective bullshit in such tight proximity. I don't honestly know if the fabric of the universe can handle it. This is the most polite the forums have ever been. Should have been here back in Chromosome... And you think tankers be mad now, just damn. »We still have our honor!
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 394	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:30:00 - [127] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: No I would happily destroy vehicles 24/7 but why do that when militia tanks are better then my proto swarms with prof 4 and three damage mods and cost less. Exactly why risking my clone by sacrifiying most of my anti infantry self defensive powers (while HAVS don't sacrifice anything) just to realise that even with smart play a whole clip of proto AV will not destroy a milita tank. I do run with RE's and if I get the chance I will use them if not I can at least defend myself with my primary weapon against the infantry trying to kill me. Its possible to kill tanks you can maybe solo stupid militia HAV's but against tankers with brain the best counter is another HAV, so why in hell should I even bother to bring AV and die several times against Infantry AND HAVs as ost of them are running scanners when the best result in most cases is scaring HAV pilots? And even if I scare him (and for that one flux grenade will do the job better as my swarms) the HAV will come back after a few seconds...
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 394	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:32:00 - [128] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: Well. We could bring AV, or we could bring our own tanks, which do it better than infantry AV while being more versatile. a 6 man infantry squad all carrying AV granades with a single dedicated AV guy in the mix WILL mess up vehicles without sacraficing infantry power. you dont HAVE to run tanks, its easer not to in all honesty. all those threads crying about tanks written by people who both arnt organised, and arnt even willing to put AV nades on their fits just peeve me off. tanks do it DIFFERENTLYT then infantry AV not really more effectivly, its just easyer for a solo player to use a tank then as solo infantry. squad wise its alot easyer to have an AV infantry guy with your squad + AV nades on every member then it is to have that one squad mate in a tank. your other squad mates cover your infantry AV guy (who should probably be very good with a sidearm, SMGs are amazing at this) and that AV guy leads the charge against any vehicle that apears. i cant figure out why everyones complaining when they arnt even trying to deal with the problem using in game resources. 6 man with AV nades and the HAV Pilot not recognizing one of them? Honestly any Pilot THAT stupid deserves to die again and again...
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 571	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:36:00 - [129] - Quote all im hear is people agreeing with me, saying tanks are easy to kill.... then bitching that they dont want to have to do it.
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 394	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:45:00 - [130] - Quote Wurm FOOD wrote: I have an AV fit that costs 5k. Militia Gallente light frame with a plasma cannon, AV grenades, REs, MLT kincat, and a scrambler pistol for infantry. Seriously, I killed about 8 tanks in a Dom using this fit. You run up behind them, shove 3 REs on the exhaust plate, hit their shield with grenades and plasma, then BOOM (REs finish them off). Use stealth ;) Yeah this works well against bad tankers that do not pay any attention otherwise you are dead. If the tank brings 5 friends running with rifles you are in serious troubles. So even the example the OP brings will fail if the Pilto is running with a squad on his own, so the six vs 1 theory fails. As in this scenario the HAV + 5 Infantry squad will obliberate any 5 AV nade + AV guy squad. That currently HAV pilots do not even bother to run with a squad (or second HAV) clearly shows how much fear AV causes to them...

TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 259	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:49:00 - [131] - Quote This tread is just biased for OP underpriced tanks I can run a good AV fit .... Minmatar Mk.o Allotech Plasma Cannon Lai Dai packed AV Boundless RE/PE Shield extenders in highs Cardiac reg and CPU upgrade If a tankers is a dumbass I can just about solo him, but the real problem is my suit costs 3x more than most of the tanks out there......... So I have to take on a missile/blaster with a very high chance of dying, and if I do it's a serious ISK sink How the hell is an infantry fitting worth more than a tank?? even if I try to cheap out on things It still costs 100k + ..... Tanks can kill proto suits so they should cost more ... and if that tank can kill a proto squad so it should cost 6 x 150k = 900k ... so I think If tankers want their OP vehicles they should be paying over that to set it up Like this thread if you think HAV should cost 1,000,000 ISK minimum
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 572	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:50:00 - [132] - Quote Korvin Lomont wrote: Wurm FOOD wrote: I have an AV fit that costs 5k. Militia Gallente light frame with a plasma cannon, AV grenades, REs, MLT kincat, and a scrambler pistol for infantry. Seriously, I killed about 8 tanks in a Dom using this fit. You run up behind them, shove 3 REs on the exhaust plate, hit their shield with grenades and plasma, then BOOM (REs finish them off). Use stealth ;) Yeah this works well against bad tankers that do not pay any attention otherwise you are dead. If the tank brings 5 friends running with rifles you are in serious troubles. So even the example the OP brings will fail if the Pilto is running with a squad on his own, so the six vs 1 theory fails. As in this scenario the HAV + 5 Infantry squad will obliberate any 5 AV nade + AV guy squad. That currently HAV pilots do not even bother to run with a squad (or second HAV) clearly shows how much fear AV causes to them... and EVERYONE ELSES example of calling ina militia tank becuase its "easyer" will ALSO fail against a decent tanker with a squad of his own.... if you think HAV pilots arnt running in squads you are mistaken, they most certainly are. and theres no reason to fear somethign that nobody is using, when i run tank games i am both in a squad and nobody ever brings out AV against me....
Krom Ganesh Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 971	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:51:00 - [133] - Quote The problem with tanks is that there is no easy way to balance them so that people who use them and people who fight them are happy. If they are powerful and cheap as they are now, dedicated AV players become exceedingly rare (as we see now). If they are not powerful and cheap or powerful and not cheap, tankers will be upset (as we saw before 1.7). This is because CCP has designed the tank to be the most effective killer of everything. This leads to bad balance with no simple way to fairly rebalance tanks with everything else. Simply put, tanks are way too versatile and effective. Ideally, I would like for the V vs V and V vs I balance to be like this: Heavy vehicles should be very effective against all forms of vehicles Heavy vehicles shouldn't be very effective against infantry - As it is meant to be the heavy hitting vehicle, the tank should absolutely wreck other vehicles... but this should come at the cost of effectiveness vs infantry. They should be still be able to kill them, but it should be more of a pain than it is worth if there are other vehicles on the map. Light AV should be effective against light and medium vehicles * Additionally, light AV should either also be effective against infantry or be extra effective against vehicles, but not both Light AV shouldn't be very effective against heavy vehicles (Light AV in large groups (4+) should still be able to combat heavy vehicles with good coordination) - The greatest asset of light AV should be its versatility. Weapons like the PLC can be effective methods of fighting infantry. However, weapons like the Swarm Launcher cannot be used against infantry and thus should be even more effective against light and medium vehicles though not through damage such as the Swarm having increased range over other light AV and its tracking capabilities. Heavy AV should be very effective against all vehicles Heavy AV shouldn't be very effective against infantry - Same as heavy vehicles, heavy AV should give up its ability to effectively fight infantry for the ability to effectively fight all vehicles. However, while AV should be quite deadly to tanks, Heavy AV is still handheld weaponry and shouldn't be as effective as a tank for taking out a tank but it should get the benefit of being cheaper and being a smaller target. Medium and light vehicles should be effective at fighting infantry and other medium/light vehicles Light vehicles should have less power and defense but have great speed and handling Medium vehicles should good power and defense (not tank levels) but be slower (again, not tank levels) (Same as light AV, medium and light vehicles in groups should be able to take on heavy vehicles) - These are the vehicles that pilots should look towards to fight infantry (along with their non-combat roles like troop transport) !
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 259	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:55:00 - [134] - Quote Nobody brings AV because you are guaranteed that even if successful the ** tankers are going to call another tank... and another I had to kill a Madrugar 3 times last night till he took the hint that our squad wasnt going to take his ** So I lose say 5/6 suits, I'm down near 1 mil ISK and the tankers are managing to make more profit than AV despite the fact they lost multiple tanks ......
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 440	Posted - 2013.12.23 17:57:00 - [135] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: This tread is just biased for OP underpriced tanks I can run a good AV fit .... Minmatar Mk.o Allotech Plasma Cannon Lai Dai packed AV Boundless RE/PE Shield extenders in highs Cardiac reg and CPU upgrade If a tankers is a dumbass I can just about solo him, but the real problem is my suit costs 3x more than most of the tanks out there......... So I have to take on a missile/blaster with a very high chance of dying, and if I do it's a serious ISK sink How the hell is an infantry fitting worth more than a tank?? even if I try to cheap out on things It still costs 100k + ..... Tanks can kill proto suits so they should cost more ... and if that tank can kill a proto squad so it should cost 6 x 150k = 900k ... so I think If tankers want their OP vehicles they should be paying over that to set it up Like this thread if you think HAV should cost 1,000,000 ISK minimum Not to mention the crap payout you get for running AV. I double to triple the isk running logi over AV all match
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 1956	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:01:00 - [136] - Quote One important point that has long been agreed on between dedicated tankers and dedicated AVers is that driving off a tank is almost as good as killing a tank. This was one of the key arguments around the notion that a single Infantry AVer should not be able to solo a tank. However, my experience in the week I spent testing AV in 1.7, was that if I managed to drive off a tank, two more tanks would come in and kill me. While tankers always thought that the balance should be 3 Infantry to take out one tank, the current situation often has tanks outnumbering infantry AV. I took a squad of 3 Swarmers into a match. We spent the entire match hunting tanks, and did not manage to get a single tank kill. I was using a Proto Swarm Launcher. I was however able to get solo kills in the first three days of 1.7 against people who I knew for a fact had never driven tanks before and were likely not skilled into them. About 5 days into 1.7 the no skill points invested tankers were getting experienced enough that I could not kill them even when I used Flux grenades and Remote Explosives in combination with my Proto Swarm Launcher. I canGÇÖt help thinking that the deaths of grossly incompetent tankers is being used to prove that AV is fine. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else, there is the Learning Coalition.
Nirwanda Vaughns 256	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:06:00 - [137] - Quote i run a commando from time to time seeing as its the only suit you can have a proto swarm and a half decent 'sidearm' but the damage from swarms is pretty poor. i have a minmatar medium basic frame with proto swarms and 3 complex damage mods with an SMG but its quite paper thin i just need to work up to my minny assaults for something a little sturdier. its a tough job but i'd perhaps like to see a proper AV frame. maybe a Type II class of commando with skill bonus to lock range of 5% per level and 5% per level to Prox mine damage or +1 per level to prox mines active per level, slightly less shield/armor (perhaps the old commando number) but increase movement/sprint speed slightly that way the swarms lock range is about 215-220m and with the +1 prox mines you could lay 10 proto mines keep the cpu/pg so that with proto swarm and mines you can only fit a standard level AR/RR/CR/SCR ect and have it as a dedicated AV commando It's only after we have lost everything, are we free to do anything.... Unless CCP take away your BPOs
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 573	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:12:00 - [138] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: TheD1CK wrote: This tread is just biased for OP underpriced tanks I can run a good AV fit .... Minmatar Mk.o Allotech Plasma Cannon Lai Dai packed AV Boundless RE/PE Shield extenders in highs Cardiac reg and CPU upgrade If a tankers is a dumbass I can just about solo him, but the real problem is my suit costs 3x more than most of the tanks out there......... So I have to take on a missile/blaster with a very high chance of dying, and if I do it's a serious ISK sink How the hell is an infantry fitting worth more than a tank?? even if I try to cheap out on things It still costs 100k + ..... Tanks can kill proto suits so they should cost more ... and if that tank can kill a proto squad so it should cost 6 x 150k = 900k ... so I think If tankers want their OP vehicles they should be paying over that to set it up Like this thread if you think HAV should cost 1,000,000 ISK minimum Not to mention the crap payout you get for running AV. I double to triple the isk running logi over AV all match your doing it wrong
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 259	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:14:00 - [139] - Quote Are you by any chance a tanker?? ... It really seems that way ... And I described my suit not what I do with it, I was highlighting the cost of a good AV suit compared to the cost of HAV
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 573	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:17:00 - [140] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: Are you by any chance a tanker?? ... It really seems that way ... And I described my suit not what I do with it, I was highlighting the cost of a good AV suit compared to the cost of HAV im both, ive been running around getting tank kills with a plasma cannon for ***** and giggles. right now my primary suit is minmatar assault. i have 26 million SP i have a little bit of everything im a logi im an assault im a scout im a tanker im a dropship pilot i have infantry AV (becuase calling in a tank while im running on the ground defeats the purpose of running on the ground) the only thing im NOT is a heavy, becuase there isnt a minmatar heavy yet as a tanker other tanks arnt really going to kill me, its infantry i worry about

thesupertman Better Hide R Die 89	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:18:00 - [141] - Quote Tanks need to cost more.... I think I'm the only person still waiting for mechs/giant robot killing machines..... dangCCPyourslowpickupthepace
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2440	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:18:00 - [142] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: Are you by any chance a tanker?? ... It really seems that way ... And I described my suit not what I do with it, I was highlighting the cost of a good AV suit compared to the cost of HAV He is. I confirmed that a few days ago when I saw him rolling around in a Gunnlogi. He's also bull$#!tting you when he says that he uses AV to destroy tanks as well. We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 933	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:19:00 - [143] - Quote Wait, who's scissors? I'm confused. Do your part. Join the revolution. Sabotage FW. Help this game burn! BURN DUST 2014
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 573	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:19:00 - [144] - Quote Atiim wrote: TheD1CK wrote: Are you by any chance a tanker?? ... It really seems that way ... And I described my suit not what I do with it, I was highlighting the cost of a good AV suit compared to the cost of HAV He is. I confirmed that a few days ago when I saw him rolling around in a Gunnlogi. He's also bull$#!tting you when he says that he uses AV to destroy tanks as well. lol your just bad killing tanks with infantry AV is hilarious
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4937	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:24:00 - [145] - Quote I'll get back to ya when AV can fulfill both AV and AI in one package that costs 70k ISK and called a Soma Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 259	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:26:00 - [146] - Quote lol, thanks Atiim So this is just a biased post, made by a tanker to promote UP AV If thats how thing work in here, I propose a buff to Core Locus/RE/Plasma Cannon and a buff to CR RoF .... oh and minmatar suits need a base 1000 stamina with speed of 11.50 lol, you tell me I'm bad and you make a completely false thread because We all know Tanks are OP and when CCP fix it every infantry in the game will be looking to punish tankers ... I look forward to this Rebel scum since closed beta
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 573	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:28:00 - [147] - Quote TheD1CK wrote: lol, thanks Atiim So this is just a biased post, made by a tanker to promote UP AV If thats how thing work in here, I propose a buff to Core Locus/RE/Plasma Cannon and a buff to CR RoF .... oh and minmatar suits need a base 1000 stamina with speed of 11.50 lol, you tell me I'm bad and you make a completely false thread because We all know Tanks are OP and when CCP fix it every infantry in the game will be looking to punish tankers ... I look forward to this owning a tank a tanker does not make :P thats like calling me a dropship pilot just becuase i have a python or calling me infantry AV specialist becuase i speced into infantry AV i havnt been a "tanker" since chromosome
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2440	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:34:00 - [148] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: right *** lets get this strait DONT you ever call me a liar you *** piece of scum......you are nothing but the load that should have been swallowed you *** moron how di you even manage to climb out of your *** testtube you *** freek .... right now thats out of the way ........vehicle sp was refunded because of a major overhaul of how the vehicle skill tree works as well as the removal of specific skills .....any skills that were left behind had different prerecs and functions or we would have Kept them or are you too stupid to understand that concept . im beginging to think you ether are an autistic piece of *** rubber or just a lame troll.. now ** off . I just looked up the definition of the word "liar". Yes you are a liar. Please don't try to bull$#!t me, or anyone for that matter. Every single skill under the Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation was refunded, regardless of wether or not the skill currently exists. I checked myself the second I finished downloading the 1.7 patch. all 7,195,000 SP into the vehicle related skills were refunded. Otherwise I'd still have a few million still into the Turret Operation. The prerequisites of virtually all skills were changed. I, and everyone still received a complete respec from the skills that still remain unchanged in terms of skill perquisites. I'll bet you 200mil ISK right now that every skill was refunded. Autistic piece of (expletive) rubber? I don't have autism but I don't think it's polite to insult disabiled people is such matter. Lame troll? Aside from obvious trolls or jokes in other threads I have yet to lie about anything, as all of my claims are based from facts that can easily be proven upon desire. We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2440	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:38:00 - [149] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Atiim wrote: TheD1CK wrote: Are you by any chance a tanker?? ... It really seems that way ... And I described my suit not what I do with it, I was highlighting the cost of a good AV suit compared to the cost of HAV He is. I confirmed that a few days ago when I saw him rolling around in a Gunnlogi. He's also bull$#!tting you when he says that he uses AV to destroy tanks as well. lol your just bad killing tanks with infantry AV is hilarious Even before Uprising 1.7 being AV was boring. Bad about what? Let me guess, you are incapable of arguing against my points so you resort to being childish and saying things such as "get gud"? We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 442	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:40:00 - [150] - Quote Anyone notice chances has resorted to ad-hominem the kast few posts? Blatent sign that he is losing the battle

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 574	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:40:00 - [151] - Quote Requesting thread lock due to it devolving into apes throwing **** at each other instead of discussing infantry AV solutoins you all should be ashamed of yoruselves
Darken-Sol BIG BAD W0LVES 1009	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:40:00 - [152] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: all im hear is people agreeing with me, saying tanks are easy to kill.... then bitching that they dont want to have to do it. theres two groups here those that believe tanks are easy to kill and they just dont want to have to kill tanks in a game with tanks. and those that think tanks are invincable and they are just terrible at killing them. wich group does everyone belong in i wonder? and since tanks are so damn easy to kill as infantry (they are) why are people still compaining about em? there is also an objective group who want a fair fight. People want this game to succeed. When I can get off four shots with a gatsuns forge gun because a tank feels no sense of danger something is wrong. 2x complex mods. The tank just turned and blasted me down. I also have Prof 4. wait till their hardeners are down. Ok. I'll just weather sustained blaster and infantry fire for 24-36 seconds. work as a team. That's a good idea, but there is only so much a squad can do. I will just have to drop a tank. They are cheap and effective. This isn't my job though and getting forced into something even a hobby like tanking sucks. There was a time we fought good tankers. Now we just fight good tanks.
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2440	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:44:00 - [153] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Requesting thread lock due to it devolving into apes throwing **** at each other instead of discussing infantry AV solutoins you all should be ashamed of yoruselves Well it could have been a discussion, but then people started spreading lies around about things, and we can't allow that now can we? You won't have much luck though. CCP will only lock the thread if they find that it violates the rules of the General Discussions section, which it has yet to do (by technicality) We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 687	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:45:00 - [154] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Requesting thread lock due to it devolving into apes throwing **** at each other instead of discussing infantry AV solutoins you all should be ashamed of yoruselves What is there to discuss? The only solution here for infantry AV is to get gud scrub. None of the heavies in my corp have any problems dealing with tanks on their own. God forbid two of us are AVing in the same match cause no tank would survive. Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2440	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:47:00 - [155] - Quote MassiveNine wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Requesting thread lock due to it devolving into apes throwing **** at each other instead of discussing infantry AV solutoins you all should be ashamed of yoruselves What is there to discuss? The only solution here for infantry AV is to get gud scrub. None of the heavies in my corp have any problems dealing with tanks on their own. God forbid two of us are AVing in the same match cause no tank would survive. Now what about the people with Swarm Launchers or Plasma Cannons? Oh wait, your probably another tanker who thinks that the FG should be the only viable AV weapon We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
Bones McGavins TacoCat Industries 397	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:48:00 - [156] - Quote I've said it a hundred times. The issue is AV isn't fun. Not for most people. Nobody wants to run around these maps trying to kill tanks when they can just drive over a hill or around a corner after their regen or hardeners run out. Rail rifles actually make this a lot worse because side arms are not remotely competitive at the ranges rails have. So you pass up bring able to fight 12 players abd leave yourself vulnerable to them so you can fight the 4 guys in tanks? Nope. Not fun at all. Everyone talks hav vs AV in terms of balance but not in terms of what is fun. You could also make it so if I read 100 pages from a dictionary out loud all tanks die and that would be amazing AV. But nobody would do it because it'd be boring and this is a game that we play for fun.
ER-Bullitt Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 694	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:51:00 - [157] - Quote Been forced to run my forge gun/av nade fit again whenever there is a tank on the field. When I run the forge I can keep 1-2 tanks off my squad with decent success rates. I don't always get the kill/destroy, but area denial works well when the rest of my squad backs me up. Of course the battlefield plays a role in this, do I have cover, does the enemy have good infantry supporting their tank, etc. Then it gets a bit hairy when there are 3+ tanks on the field. And the games that get really messy are those where our team doesn't have any tankers running. My fix would be simple and like many others have suggested.. limit the number of tanks per side to 2-3 max, and many of these QQ threads will go away. 5-6 tanks per side (or whatever is the max) is ludicrous given the current state of Tanks/Dropships versus AV.. 16 player max... low cost of tanks, survivability through running and cooldowns, and lastly the ability to recall the tank and drop a new one with fresh cooldowns. Its pretty broken.. they can drop em wherever, recall them wherever, but if I am running my infantry suit the only way I can switch to AV is to visit a supply depot or die/suicide and come back. Most good tankers destroy enemy supply depots to remove the ability for players to switch to AV to take them out. I understand why they put in the "recall" button months ago, but now.. with the low cost... and infantry not having a "recall" button for their suits which are twice as expensive as a MLT tank.. broken broken broken. It would be awesome if I can call in a fresh suit that drops down from the sky that I can switch to by pressing a button. SoonTM. lol I ran into Snuggles from R* last night in a domination on the rings map. He went 33-0 with his DS.... we had two dedicated forge gunners blasting him whenever he would come around, and his shield hardeners along with missile turrets and strong infantry presence was destroying us. That map is ideal for a DS by the objective, since all the buildings block any outside tankers from hitting him.. and his insane ability to kill infantry and equipment with those damn missiles. The funny part was he went away for about 5 minutes towards the end of the match.. we cleared the infantry, took the point, setup a perimeter and the battle swayed to our side.. he came back in his DS and the tide of the battle turned again instantly. I know he is one of the best DS pilots in the game, but the feeling of helplessness was ever present in that battle. It was a good one, and without the DS pilot we would have certainly won...
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 688	Posted - 2013.12.23 18:52:00 - [158] - Quote Atiim wrote: MassiveNine wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Requesting thread lock due to it devolving into apes throwing **** at each other instead of discussing infantry AV solutoins you all should be ashamed of yoruselves What is there to discuss? The only solution here for infantry AV is to get gud scrub. None of the heavies in my corp have any problems dealing with tanks on their own. God forbid two of us are AVing in the same match cause no tank would survive. Now what about the people with Swarm Launchers or Plasma Cannons? Oh wait, your probably another tanker who thinks that the FG should be the only viable AV weapon lol atiim. You have no grounds to talk as you're just another FOTM chaser. You can call yourself a tanker or infantry AV guy but truth is just because you can do something doesn't mean you're good at it. And by the way I've been dedicated AV/heavy since chromosome. Seriously, stop trying to act like you're some expert at everything when you're really just some punk kid who gets a couple of kills and thinks he's a professional. Swarm launchers had their time to shine when the range was ridiculously OP, now I agree the range should be buffed back up to 200m but fact remains you can still kill a tank with them. All the crybabys talking about how they cant kill tanks with just 2 volleys anymore, get over yourself. It was OP and now it's mostly balanced maybe instead of insta-locking and firing you could push it somewhere where you can swarm it better and wait for it's reppers/hardeners to wear off. It's not that hard but I guess it is when you're stupid. Seriously Atiim you're like that guy who thinks "oh I tried it once now I know everything there possibly is to ever know and anyone who says different is wrong." Here's a good idea, pull your head out of your ass and smell the roses sweetheart cause you have a long way to go before you're a professional at anything. I've seen you play. Between the lack luster gun game, hissy fits, and horrible suit loadouts it's hard to imagine where you even got the idea you know what you're talking about. Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 2443	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:11:00 - [159] - Quote MassiveNine wrote: lol atiim. You have no grounds to talk as you're just another FOTM chaser. You can call yourself a tanker or infantry AV guy but truth is just because you can do something doesn't mean you're good at it. And by the way I've been dedicated AV/heavy since chromosome. Seriously, stop trying to act like you're some expert at everything when you're really just some punk kid who gets a couple of kills and thinks he's a professional. Swarm launchers had their time to shine when the range was ridiculously OP, now I agree the range should be buffed back up to 200m but fact remains you can still kill a tank with them. All the crybabys talking about how they cant kill tanks with just 2 volleys anymore, get over yourself. It was OP and now it's mostly balanced maybe instead of insta-locking and firing you could push it somewhere where you can swarm it better and wait for it's reppers/hardeners to wear off. It's not that hard but I guess it is when you're stupid. FoTM Chaser? How So? You can also kill a tank with a Flaylock Pistol or Assault MD. Just because you 'can' kill think tank doesn't mean that you will kill the tank. You just lost all credibility with that statement. A tank can easily GTFO when they have both NOS and the ability to cycle 2 hardners. Question. What is your AV weapon of choice? Forge Gun I assume? No *good* tank fit has ever died within 2-3 volleys of my Swarm Launcher. Not even with Prof V and 3 complex damage mods MassiveNine wrote: Seriously Atiim you're like that guy who thinks "oh I tried it once now I know everything there possibly is to ever know and anyone who says different is wrong." Here's a good idea, pull your head out of your ass and smell the roses sweetheart cause you have a long way to go before you're a professional at anything. I've seen you play. Between the lack luster gun game, hissy fits, and horrible suit loadouts it's hard to imagine where you even got the idea you know what you're talking about. Hissy fits? I only remember raging twice when playing DUST, and I wasn't in a squad so I honestly have no idea what your talking about. Fittings? Do you even know my fittings? I don't claim to be the best at anything, in fact in multiple threads I have said that I'm not the best at anything. However you don't have to be the very best at everything to form an educated opinion on something. "Gun Game". My gun game seems to do just fine considering how I win most of the gunfights I get into. Say what you want. Doesn't make what I'm saying any less true. P.S. Do I know you? I don't remember playing with you before. Should I know you? We finally deployed in the MinFW Match! \o/
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 261	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:35:00 - [160] - Quote Apes throwing *** at each other* That is general reaction when 'Tanker' apes threaten the smaller and more numerous 'AV' monkeys and give us a load of **** about because they think as they are bigger they should own the tree .. I run demolitions and with support from team Tanks can be dealt with, especially with FG support As right now the FG is the only thing challenging most tanks while they run away. There is a common opinion that 1 guy should not take on a tank solo, which makes sense ..... but doesn't work If a Tank doesn't look out for the dangers of Infantry he deserves to be punished, In most battles now it is tricky dealing with tankers that aren't exactly skilled and coming up against the better tankers is a nightmare, Why shouldn't a HAV be solo'd if he remained completely oblivious to the Infantry flanking or trapping him in a tight spot ??? Tankers need to be smart and they have 2 seats to have squad intel available, along with the use of scanners so they should know exactly where the AV infantry are positioned so If a tanker isn't paying attention and covering himself he should die. if 4/5 infantry are running AV in squad then a HAV breaching that area should be impossible Right now we have to deal with tanks that are clearly too hard to take out without another HAV I don't see why anyone is trying to disagree with this Rebel scum since closed beta

pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1499	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:44:00 - [161] - Quote Atiim wrote: pegasis prime wrote: right *** lets get this strait DONT you ever call me a liar you *** piece of scum......you are nothing but the load that should have been swallowed you *** moron how di you even manage to climb out of your *** testtube you *** freek .... right now thats out of the way ........vehicle sp was refunded because of a major overhaul of how the vehicle skill tree works as well as the removal of specific skills .....any skills that were left behind had different prerecs and functions or we would have Kept them or are you too stupid to understand that concept . im beginging to think you ether are an autistic piece of *** rubber or just a lame troll.. now off . I just looked up the definition of the word "liar". Yes you are a liar. Please don't try to bull$#!t me, or anyone for that matter. Every single skill under the Vehicle Command, Vehicle Upgrades, and Turret Operation was refunded, regardless of wether or not the skill currently exists. I checked myself the second I finished downloading the 1.7 patch. all 7,195,000 SP into the vehicle related skills were refunded. Otherwise I'd still have a few million still into the Turret Operation. The prerequisites of virtually all skills were changed. I, and everyone still received a complete respec from the skills that still remain unchanged in terms of skill perquisites. I'll bet you 200mil ISK right now that every skill was refunded. Autistic piece of (expletive) rubber? I don't have autism but I don't think it's polite to insult disabiled people is such matter. Lame troll? Aside from obvious trolls or jokes in other threads I have yet to lie about anything, as all of my claims are based from facts that can easily be proven upon desire. sigh you really are stupid arnt you did you read my other posts in this thread no....because your a *** moron that's why.......just stop really stop before you look even more traded........ also so your saying that the extensions of the vehicle command and turret operation didn't change so they didn't need refunding ????? look again son and come back when your not having your dumb as moments... folks like you should just delet dust and never come back all you do is moan about vehiles in a game that advertises its vehicle content extensively can you not see how moronic that is ....probably not because you are just a *** ****.... Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 576	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:51:00 - [162] - Quote Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives
DeadlyAztec11 2887	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:53:00 - [163] - Quote smh. All are punished. ALL ARE PUNISHED! »We still have our honor!
Seymor Krelborn DUST University Ivy League 1771	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:56:00 - [164] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives productivity from the dust community? you'd have better luck getting cows milk from a gorilla no, unproductive threads and QQ are the signature of the dust community. this thread belongs at the top of page one. don't run from your own thread coward! stop the lol bans in FW.... instead make teamkillers purple! https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=129910&fi
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 576	Posted - 2013.12.23 19:57:00 - [165] - Quote Seymor Krelborn wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives productivity from the dust community? you'd have better luck getting cows milk from a gorilla no, unproductive threads and QQ are the signature of the dust community. this thread belongs at the top of page one. don't run from your own thread coward! fine then this thread is now about bacon, those that love it, those that hate it, and its uses on the battlefield as a form of AV i lure tankers out of their tanks witht he smell of bacon
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1499	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:03:00 - [166] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives ill move on when you send me some of that bacon ... Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 576	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:16:00 - [167] - Quote pegasis prime wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives ill move on when you send me some of that bacon ... this thread is BYOB - Bring your own bacon
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 446	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:19:00 - [168] - Quote Can we get the title changed to "bacon sammich?"
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 689	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:21:00 - [169] - Quote Atiim wrote: MassiveNine wrote: lol atiim. You have no grounds to talk as you're just another FOTM chaser. You can call yourself a tanker or infantry AV guy but truth is just because you can do something doesn't mean you're good at it. And by the way I've been dedicated AV/heavy since chromosome. Seriously, stop trying to act like you're some expert at everything when you're really just some punk kid who gets a couple of kills and thinks he's a professional. Swarm launchers had their time to shine when the range was ridiculously OP, now I agree the range should be buffed back up to 200m but fact remains you can still kill a tank with them. All the crybabys talking about how they cant kill tanks with just 2 volleys anymore, get over yourself. It was OP and now it's mostly balanced maybe instead of insta-locking and firing you could push it somewhere where you can swarm it better and wait for it's reppers/hardeners to wear off. It's not that hard but I guess it is when you're stupid. FoTM Chaser? How So? You can also kill a tank with a Flaylock Pistol or Assault MD. Just because you 'can' kill think tank doesn't mean that you will kill the tank. You just lost all credibility with that statement. A tank can easily GTFO when they have both NOS and the ability to cycle 2 hardners. Question. What is your AV weapon of choice? Forge Gun I assume? No *good* tank fit has ever died within 2-3 volleys of my Swarm Launcher. Not even with Prof V and 3 complex damage mods MassiveNine wrote: Seriously Atiim you're like that guy who thinks "oh I tried it once now I know everything there possibly is to ever know and anyone who says different is wrong." Here's a good idea, pull your head out of your ass and smell the roses sweetheart cause you have a long way to go before you're a professional at anything. I've seen you play. Between the lack luster gun game, hissy fits, and horrible suit loadouts it's hard to imagine where you even got the idea you know what you're talking about. Hissy fits? I only remember raging twice when playing DUST, and I wasn't in a squad so I honestly have no idea what your talking about. Fittings? Do you even know my fittings? I don't claim to be the best at anything, in fact in multiple threads I have said that I'm not the best at anything. However you don't have to be the very best at everything to form an educated opinion on something. "Gun Game". My gun game seems to do just fine considering how I win most of the gunfights I get into. Say what you want. Doesn't make what I'm saying any less true. P.S. Do I know you? I don't remember playing with you before. Should I know you? Lol. Credibility. On a forum. Cute. It's obvious that you're young and dumb and you think you know it all, so at this point there's no reason to argue with you since you think you have these amazing comebacks to everything. Just because you play a fit a few times by no means gives you an educated opinion. Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 577	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:22:00 - [170] - Quote MassiveNine wrote: Lol. Credibility. On a forum. Cute. It's obvious that you're young and dumb and you think you know it all, so at this point there's no reason to argue with you since you think you have these amazing comebacks to everything. Just because you play a fit a few times by no means gives you an educated opinion. off topic post that has no referance to bacon... im disapointed in you

CrotchGrab 360 687	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:22:00 - [171] - Quote oh dayum the gloves have come off!
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 446	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:29:00 - [172] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Can we get the title changed to "bacon sammich?" U no like toast?
bear90211 Nyain San Renegade Alliance 146	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:43:00 - [173] - Quote https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=131426&find=unread Heavies are still squishy to my AR, just 5 rounds into them extra ;D hmm, I want taco's...
pegasis prime BIG BAD W0LVES 1499	Posted - 2013.12.23 20:45:00 - [174] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: pegasis prime wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Stop guys just stop, nothing productive is happening here. everybodys wrong, everybodys been an ass let the thread die and move on with your lives ill move on when you send me some of that bacon ... this thread is BYOB - Bring your own bacon sigh *kicks stone on the ground turns round and walks away.....looks back longingly for bacon only to be disappointed. Its gone from suck .....to blow level 1 forum warrior
medomai grey WarRavens League of Infamy 387	Posted - 2013.12.23 23:02:00 - [175] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: medomai grey wrote: I have an anti-tank fit... It's called a tank. The problem with swarms and AV grenades is that they're not effective against vehicles on their cool down, when vehicles are suppose to be vulnerable. Theses weapons have trouble taking out LAVs and dropships, not just tanks. Although for some of you the entire game seems to revolve around tanks... Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart. Yeah nerf AV, it's so OP! And nerf flaylocks and contact nades while you're at it English is your second language, isn't it. Blatant Dust_514 recruiting in the silliest of places. :P
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 360	Posted - 2013.12.23 23:03:00 - [176] - Quote So is my new corp. What a coincidence.
Ryme Intrinseca 421	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:05:00 - [177] - Quote medomai grey wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: medomai grey wrote: I have an anti-tank fit... It's called a tank. The problem with swarms and AV grenades is that they're not effective against vehicles on their cool down, when vehicles are suppose to be vulnerable. Theses weapons have trouble taking out LAVs and dropships, not just tanks. Although for some of you the entire game seems to revolve around tanks... Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart. Yeah nerf AV, it's so OP! And nerf flaylocks and contact nades while you're at it English is your second language, isn't it. 'Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart' confirms (1) that you're trying to nerf the only halfway viable AV and (2) that my English is better than yours. Get good, grammar scrub
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 577	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:06:00 - [178] - Quote Ryme Intrinseca wrote: medomai grey wrote: Ryme Intrinseca wrote: medomai grey wrote: I have an anti-tank fit... It's called a tank. The problem with swarms and AV grenades is that they're not effective against vehicles on their cool down, when vehicles are suppose to be vulnerable. Theses weapons have trouble taking out LAVs and dropships, not just tanks. Although for some of you the entire game seems to revolve around tanks... Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart. Yeah nerf AV, it's so OP! And nerf flaylocks and contact nades while you're at it English is your second language, isn't it. 'Assault forgeguns need to less damage than their regular counterpart' confirms (1) that you're trying to nerf the only halfway viable AV and (2) that my English is better than yours. Get good, grammar scrub thats definatly not about bacon GTFO of the bacon thread
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 689	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:07:00 - [179] - Quote Bacon sandwich with pork loins as buns... yum.... Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic
P14GU3 The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine 453	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:10:00 - [180] - Quote MassiveNine wrote: Bacon sandwich with pork loins as buns... yum.... Beats the pants off toast..

XxWarlordxX97 Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 4105	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:14:00 - [181] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: This thread is now about bacon SSSSSSHHHHH the bacon is mine Level 5 forum warrior A Solo heavy Boss I support tanks not being OP
MassiveNine 0uter.Heaven 690	Posted - 2013.12.24 00:30:00 - [182] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: MassiveNine wrote: Bacon sandwich with pork loins as buns... yum.... Beats the pants off toast.. DATS WHAT IM TALKIN BOUT YO Official DUST514 LAV Mechanic


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