No.

I take it you are a fan of this method

Proto AV + proto suit + proto dmg mods vs basic hull with basic mods and proto turrets

Heavens forbid you actually have a challenge and maybe have to use teamwork

I take it you are a fan of this method

Proto AV + proto suit + proto dmg mods vs basic hull with basic mods and proto turrets

Heavens forbid you actually have a challenge and maybe have to use teamwork

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

Close. IAFG + Complex Damage Mods + Advanced Frame. You can blame LLAVs for all the high meta AV gear in the game right now.

Nah you need to do it this way

IA Swarm Launcher

Proficency lvl 3

2 Complex Damage mods

Basic Precicon Enhancers (So you can lock on to railgun tanks)

Lai Dai Packed AV Grenades

K-4 Nanohives

KLO-5 Scrambler Pistol or M512-A SMG

Fit your low power slots however you want, but you may need a CPU/PG boost.

Make sure that you have a backup weapon incase the guy jumps out the tank.

Close. IAFG + Complex Damage Mods + Advanced Frame. You can blame LLAVs for all the high meta AV gear in the game right now.

and you guys say fu to people who invested over 10 mil sp into being tankers and complain about everything you cant take down with minimal intelligence.

Minimal Intellegence?

Do you know how hard iris to take down a squad of tanks?

Do you know how frustrating it is to shoot your swarms and have it go straight for a wall?

Basically your saying that you want to be able to kill loads of people without any challenge or AV resistance whatsoever?

Dude I say FU to ppl who come right in the open and expect to live long enough to get away.

No i can blame CCP from taking skills from pilots which added more shield/armor hp and giving it as a general buff to all vehicles standard HP so standard scrub got more base hp where as back in the day a pilot would have these skills and a non pilot wouldnt thus you can tell the difference

It started from that, then the LLAV having a good base resistance but required at least some SP into it and ISK to run it, hell i went level 5 in it and had resitance of 60% but also i used the best mods

Its still more tanker than my tank is now and the logi DS didnt even get a hp buff at all and didnt have the base resistance that the LLAV had

But all logi vehicles are getting removed so we have lost 12 vehicles when the vehicle rebalance comes into place

Anyway back to the point

Basic AV with proto suit and mods vs basic hull vs proto mods and turrets - seems fair

Minimal Intellegence?

Do you know how hard iris to take down a squad of tanks?

one guy with a forge a nanohive and a tower or lav. or 2 swarmers. also 1 lolnader, use any o these 3 things and youl lock down the whole map forever from tanks. iv been on both ends of the argument, its harder to kill av than it is to kill us. it only takes 1 av guy to lock down an entire map for the whole match from a full squad of tankers, but it takes a full squad to lock down the map from any kind of av.

Do you know how frustrating it is to shoot your swarms and have it go straight for a wall?

that's good for us, do you know how frustrating it is to invest around 10 mil sp or more into a specific class that costs around 1 mil ISK just to deploy an average fitting just to have it blown up in under 6 seconds by some prick who barely put 2 mil sp into his suit that only takes less than a fraction of the ISK we need?

Basically your saying that you want to be able to kill loads of people without any challenge or AV resistance whatsoever?

no iv never said anything like that, if you look at my forum history, youl see that I want to be a viable class in this game that has survivability when going solo but much more power when I have competent squad friends around. the thing is, you guys are ******* ******** because you think requiring teamwork to kill a tank makes him godly mainly because you yourselves cant use teamwork worth **** and you know it, otherwise you wouldn't be bitching about not being able to solo us with standard and militia av.

Dude I say FU to ppl who come right in the open and expect to live long enough to get away.

dude, I say fu to people who don't have any regard for others and just want everything handed to them.

Minimal Intellegence?

Do you know how hard iris to take down a squad of tanks?

Do you know how frustrating it is to shoot your swarms and have it go straight for a wall?

Basically your saying that you want to be able to kill loads of people without any challenge or AV resistance whatsoever?

Dude I say FU to ppl who come right in the open and expect to live long enough to get away.

IT IS NOT FAIR

Yeah are you incapable of wrapping this around your thick headed skull?

IT IS NOT FAIR

BASIC AV DOES THE SAME DAMAGE AS MIILITIA AV

Do you hear yourself? Proto suit vs Proto turret jump in front of an 80GJ Particle Ion Cannon and see who wins. Thg tank or dropsuit?

Basically you want us to use Millitia AV against a basic tank with proto turrets. A basic tank can easily get 6k Armor and nothing would take that down with Millitia AV

A dropsuit vs a tank?

800 armor vs 6000 armor.

Yeah not fair

Dude if a tank is not in the open or keeps moving through cover than it is not easy, and if your dumb enough to get close enough for Lai Dais than you deserve it.

LOL, uses fire and forget scrub weapon, can't do his job with it, and wants to cry.

HTFU scrub.

No.

Did you even read the OP?

He wants us to use Basic/Millitia AV against a 6-7k armored hull with proto turrets?

Fire and forget? Yeah unless your swarms crash into a wall or decide to glitch and go backwards (what usually happens)


Lol Tankers without situational awareness and good tactics need to HTFU.

Tell me one time where you were killed by proto AV and it wasn't your fault?

Don't worry tankers, you will get good someday.

Did you even read the OP?

He wants us to use Basic/Millitia AV against a 6-7k armored hull with proto turrets?

Fire and forget? Yeah unless your swarms crash into a wall or decide to glitch and go backwards (what usually happens)


Lol Tankers without situational awareness and good tactics need to HTFU.

Tell me one time where you were killed by proto AV and it wasn't your fault?

Don't worry tankers, you will get good someday.

BAHAHAHAHAHA Blasters are CQC BAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I have seen a Blaster Turret annihilate from +75m . You tankers are just plain pathetic

Why do you jump out in CQC range of a blaster turret?

PC tanker here, all i play against is proto AV, i bet you are an ambush tanker

I actually want to see basic AV vs a basic hull for once since we wont see proto hulls for quite some time anyways

So what if it takes 2ppl with basic AV to kill that basic tank, are ppl that afraid of teamwork? i have to use teamwork so i just dont get alpha'd by proto AV

Also you are wrong, after the vehicle changes tanks will start with around 5k HP, maybe another 1k added if they use extenders/plates but with only 3 slots for your tank pilots may skip the extra hp for something else, 8k lol no resistances yea no

2million SP for proto AV so hard, how about 10+mil to get a basic tank and basic mods we have now just to survive against proto AV

Did you even read the OP?

He wants us to use Basic/Millitia AV against a 6-7k armored hull with proto turrets?

Fire and forget? Yeah unless your swarms crash into a wall or decide to glitch and go backwards (what usually happens)


Lol Tankers without situational awareness and good tactics need to HTFU.

Tell me one time where you were killed by proto AV and it wasn't your fault?

Don't worry tankers, you will get good someday.

Hmm that 10 Mil SP can easily be put towards other things, and tanks can do more than one thing, while all AV can do is kill tanks (except FGs, which I don't use).

What was your argument again?

Why do you jump out in CQC range of a blaster turret?

BAHAHAHAHAHA Blasters are CQC BAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I have seen a Blaster Turret annihilate from +75m

I love hearing double standards from infantry players

You complain basic AV vs a basic tank with proto mods and turrets even tho you can use proto dmg mods and on a proto suit to fit more dmg mods but of course you ignore that to suit your argument

But you like using proto AV and proto mods with a proto suit to kill a basic vehicle with basic mods and a proto turret but of course that is fair

You are a bad player, you said it yourself you find it hard to kill a tank with lolprotoswarms and lollaidai av nades

So i expect a bad player like yourself to struggle with any kind of fairness because if you cant kill a basic tank with basic mods using proto AV you prob dont stand a chance in killing a basic tank with basic AV because you are that bad, im suprised you know what end the missiles come out of

Hmm that 10 Mil SP can easily be put towards other things, and tanks can do more than one thing, while all AV can do is kill tanks (except FGs, which I don't use).

What was your argument again?

I have seen a Blaster Turret annihilate from +75m

BAHAHAHAHAHA Blasters are CQC BAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I have seen a Blaster Turret annihilate from +75m

Question, when your in a Tank vs Tank fight would it Mae you angry if you died because your shots would either dive staight towards a wall or glitch up so bad that they fly backwards or just run around in circle?

Can we get a better definition of annihilation please?

Did an infantry stand out in the open on a roof top trying to forge?

Was the tanker using a stabilized blaster?

Were they in a Vayu? Or a triple damage modded Falchion with a Scattered Ion Cannon?

Was the target infantry in a scout suit?

All of these things could have an effect on why it would seem that someone got cut down at that range. None of which has anything to do with the blaster being or not being CQC.

Although, given the way that CCP defines ranges, the blaster turret is more mid range, the overall effect is quite similar.

Yes, a blaster turret can chop down an infantry at over 100m, but only if they do not move, or do not seek cover for the 5 seconds or so they are getting hit.

Question, when your in a Tank vs Tank fight would it Mae you angry if you died because your shots would either dive staight towards a wall or glitch up so bad that they fly backwards or just run around in circle?

And yeah I use a proto AV against basic tanks? That's common sense. If you were in your proto suit and you saw somebody in a STD suit would you kill him, or go to a supply depot to kill him with your basic suit?

I love hearing stupid posts and requests from tankers

Doesn't happen.

Stop making up excuses for you not being able to use a tracking weapon properly.

If 90% of the playerbase can roll around like rambo popping tanks with swarms, but you can't, that means there is something wrong with you.

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

Have you ever used swarms?

With vehicles we just have the basic hulls but now with prototype modules and we keep the prototype turrets

The turrets themselves have also gone back to basics and do no have any variations, so fragmented/cycled missile launchers are gone and same with blaster/railgun variations

So we have a basic hull with possible proto turrets/mods provided we can fit them


So AV needs to go through the same gutting and lose all varients (breach/assault) and also lose the adv/proto AV weapons so it is basic AV vs basic hull

Now before you complain about basic hulls having access to proto modules, you still have access to proto damage modules

Also with proto turrets, AV players can still use proto suits


So overall the fight could look like this

Basic hull + adv/proto modules + adv/proto turrets vs adv/proto dropsuit + adv/proto damage mods + basic AV weapon


Then give it a good month or 2 of testing to get feedback and stats from PC then add in adv hulls and AV weapons and repeat and then add in proto hulls and AV weapons

I have

No skill required and broken as ****

I've already tested this for you. Here are the results:

Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage

VS

Basic Armor HAV (fully specced)

Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge.


Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate.

I've already tested this for you. Here are the results:

Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage

VS

Basic Armor HAV (fully specced)

Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge.


Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate.

I'm not trying to question anyone's reasoning ability here, but wouldn't it make more sense for AV users to still get Proto AV and just have to fit it on a basic suit? If the argument is that tanks only have Proto weapons and modules but not hulls, it would seem to reason that keeping the Proto weapons across the board and limiting the shell that they are equipped to would even the playing field more.

I'm not trying to question anyone's reasoning ability here, but wouldn't it make more sense for AV users to still get Proto AV and just have to fit it on a basic suit? If the argument is that tanks only have Proto weapons and modules but not hulls, it would seem to reason that keeping the Proto weapons across the board and limiting the shell that they are equipped to would even the playing field more.

I'm not trying to question anyone's reasoning ability here, but wouldn't it make more sense for AV users to still get Proto AV and just have to fit it on a basic suit? If the argument is that tanks only have Proto weapons and modules but not hulls, it would seem to reason that keeping the Proto weapons across the board and limiting the shell that they are equipped to would even the playing field more.

Why would you use a basic dropsuit? you have adv/proto suits so that means more proto dmg mods

Also you dont know what the new AV numbers are so is this current AV vs current HAVs or current AV vs new vehicles?

Im on about with the vehicle respec we take it back to basics for both sides, currently a proto AV weapon will decimate the new vehicles, also we dont have passive resisatances so the AV will do a full lot of damage, 135% current swarms do unless we have our hardners on but they only last so long

Also or stats are wrong if its against shield, generally it will 3/4 shot it

No see you are being reasonable and using logic
To really understand where tankers are coming from you need to shove a pineapple up your ass to experience the same amount of butt hurt they are

Inb4 Taka and Void start rambling about how this is a crutch and if you die you must play better when I have personally see these guys play and they both make a bonehead basic mistake, they over extend and go without support
Drive by runs work so much better guys and parking yourself next to a CRU or something and expecting not to get blown up, well really who needs to play better

Oh and as for the "Waaah we spent 10 million SP" did you guys ever stop and look at the skill screen and actually compare costs or did you go "Well this one weapon skill is at 3x so that means thats all you need"
I mean hell if thats what you did your main turret skill has the same SP cost but you wouldnt say only getting the turret is what matters on a tank fitting right, just like how only having the weapon is not part of a full AV fitting

Right now... 3 low level suits runing together with militia swarms is a fun fight against a well fit tank. Killing them is pretty rare unless they make a mistake, but can keep them close to death for plenty long enough to chase them off the map and make them recall.

This is current. And this is an example of a proto assault forge gun (fitted on a basic dropsuit) vs a "basic" armor tank. Two complex damage mods would deal 2238 HP damage to a "basic" HAV. What I'm trying to get at is why does it take a full proto forge such as this to take a full volley of 4 hits to drop a basic? And you want basic vs basic? Lol.

I sometimes run my Ishukone on a basic Dren heavy because it's a free suit and costs me only 59,000 isk to lose per fit. But more often I run the DAU assault forge cause its cheaper. 27,000 per fit. And in the world of AR's, running a fat expensive suit is very costly.

1. Swarm missiles dont fly backwards if target is infront, you are making this up
2. Swarm missiles do not fly in circles unless chasing a dropship which is flying in a circle pattern, you are making this up
3. Swarms only hit a wall if the vehicle is behind something but yet you can still lock onto part of the tank, the missiles always travel towards the middle of the tank and if the middile is behind cover the missiles will hit cover. Not ewhen a vehicle is in the open and missiles are fired and then the vehicle goes behind cover the missiles track to where the target once was then tracks to where it is now, this results in missiles which go around corners and hit even tho they should traget to where the target is and not where it once was

You use proto AV vs a basic tank, we do not have proto vehicles at all so this idea you do not like because you would be on level terms with vehicles thus it would be harder for you to kill it and since you have trouble with basic tanks when using proto AV it means you wouldnt have a chance in hell of killing a basic tank with basic AV because you are bad

You havnt seen me play because you dont play PC

PC is completely different to pubs because its actually harder and also we only have now 20skills out of 52 which are SP sinks and offer nothing of value while we have lost skills/lost mods/lost 12 vehicles/lost turrets/lost slots

Frankly ive heard so far is that they are looking swarms/av nades/FG splash radius and maybe a 33% reduction in damage for swarms but frankly your the type of player that has trouble with basic vehicles while using proto AV

Also you never noticed that i replied to the OP, do you really think the tryhard will allow you to remove adv/proto suits?

Sometimes I f a vehicle circles around you, while you are locking on, and you continue to strafe with the vehicle (typically derpship or LAV) when you fire, depending on where the vehicle is, the swarms will fire, but they will just fly around in circles.

I've only managed to reproduce this with the Wirykomi Specialist Swarms Launcher, and it happens about 20% of the time! but then again you don't use Proto swarms so I guess you wouldn't know that.

As for swarms crashing straight into walls, Yes it does. If a vehicle makes a turn and the Swarms are following it, 9 times outta 10, it's gonna crash into a wall.

But I guess I could also say that invisible swarms don't exist, and that Loltankers and derpship pilots just want CCP to beat us to death with the nerf bat

I run a basic tank and mods with a proto turret, it costs 1.7mil per fit

Also your FG has a 300m range and i cant see you because lolrendering

Also where are you positioned? whats the skill of the pilot? whats the tank fit? are hardners on or off? was the repper used? its very situational at best

Also the FG does do more damage to armor by an extra 10% but generally you want to use swarms since FG is alot better vs shield but shield has to passive tank and has **** active hardners, the armor tank is the best tank in the game mainly due to good long active hardners and the broken repper which keeps us in the fight

Frankly in PC it takes 2 proto FG to kill me but i have eveything active at the time while the FG themselves are up high and i cant defend myself and need a sniper to get rid of you or an OB

Isnt 4 shots just a clip of a FG? and its assault which means usper fast firing

I saw you literally two days ago in a pub match, hell and it even took concentrated fire from two guys, one being myself, to blow you up because surprise surprise you drive in someplace and parked and expected to be fine but tell me if you play PC so much and its so much harder than pub matches and you must need such a high skill level to survive tell me why you made such a rookie mistake

And dont get me started on SP sinks, lets use your main turret again as an example compared to the swarms you cry about so much
You need turret operation to lvl 3 to skill into a large turret and its a 1x multiplier skill correct
A 1x multiplier skill that also boosts your damage and is the only stepping stone to going into a large turret, repeating that just so we are clear
Now to even unlock the light weapon operations skill, not even a specific weapon itself just the categories operations skill, we have to get weaponry up to level 3, its also a 1x skill but offers absolutely no bonus to anything at all
Oh but it gets better, to even unlock the swarms we must get light weapons operations to lvl 3 which isnt all that daunting I mean its a 2x skill and does offer some benefit
But you know what, large hybrid turret operations is also a 2x skill, so that means you get advanced turrets with a damage boost for the exact same SP cost we have to only unlock the swarm skill for level up, not use mind you but just so we have the option to start skilling into them

So what did you want to cry about SP sinks again?

As for the last bit, you contradict yourself, if you claim Ive never seen you play logically that means you have never seen me play either so that means you have no idea I would do against vehicles
But then again by your own claims since I have proto swarms I must be popping tanks left and right with no effort so logically I cant be having trouble against them so you trying to insult me just falls apart


Think about what you say Taka instead of posting butt hurt rants because you get blown up and maybe, just maybe, people that arent whiny tankers such as yourself will take you seriously

But you are doing something the vast majority of AV players dont do

You are working as a team, you have 3 of you even tho its milita you are taking the initative, you are not trying to solo it with milita which frankly wont work even against an average pilot but 3 militia can give the pilot a suprise and if not careful the pilot can lose his tank

Once you skill upto adv taking a basic tank out wont cause any problems dependent on pilot skill but you already have an advantage you work together to do a job that most ppl want to do on ther own with no support

Ive seen the swarms circle like that, I was cruising in an LAV headed to a hot spot and this guy I didnt see launched a swarm at me from like 10 meters away when I drove past him and they all spun around me in a circle some going clockwise and some going counter clockwise, it was hilarious and scary as hell
I bailed out and just watched it for a few seconds but they never corrected their flight path and just vanished after a bit

Thank you. See the glitch has been confirmed.

Now what was the argument about this not happening?

No.

LIES

When I first got my CBR7 I thought that I was the best around, and no tank could ever bring me down!

But then I met CEOPrex CloneA's derpship and got whooped.

You aren't crap for AV untill you go proto

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

Tankers would love complex module fitting costs, e.g.:

INFANTRY
Basic Armour Repairer CPU 20 PG 1
Complex Armour Repairer CPU 45 PG 11 (2.25*CPU, 11*PG compared to basic)

VEHICLES
Heavy Armour Repair Unit CPU 26 PG 1,120
Complex Heavy Armour Repair Unit CPU 58.5 PG 12,320 (2.25*CPU, 11*PG compared to basic)

Nah you need to do it this way

IA Swarm Launcher

Proficency lvl 3

2 Complex Damage mods

Basic Precicon Enhancers (So you can lock on to railgun tanks)

Lai Dai Packed AV Grenades

K-4 Nanohives

KLO-5 Scrambler Pistol or M512-A SMG

Fit your low power slots however you want, but you may need a CPU/PG boost.

Make sure that you have a backup weapon incase the guy jumps out the tank.

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

Minimal Intellegence? Well.... yeah. Tankers have suffered numerous back to back nerfs, while infantry have had back to back buffs to AV. Infantry still complains about tanks being OP, so what does it boil down to? Tankers still overcoming the odds to make tanks viable, thus using superior intelligence.

Do you know how hard iris to take down a squad of tanks? = It's not fair when tankers use teamwork!!!!!

Do you know how frustrating it is to shoot your swarms and have it go straight for a wall? = It's not fair that some vehicles can evade lock on swarms!!!!!!

Basically your saying that you want to be able to kill loads of people without any challenge or AV resistance whatsoever? = Again... STD hull, STD mods and PRO turret vs STD AV weapon, complex DMG mods and a PRO suit.

Dude I say FU to ppl who come right in the open and expect to live long enough to get away. So how do you expect any vehicle to get from point A to point B? Do you even drive? Maybe you should relinquish your driver's license because a tsunami might take out a highway.

Yeah are you incapable of wrapping this around your thick headed skull?

IT IS NOT FAIR

BASIC AV DOES THE SAME DAMAGE AS MIILITIA AV

Do you hear yourself? Proto suit vs Proto turret jump in front of an 80GJ Particle Ion Cannon and see who wins. Thg tank or dropsuit?

Basically you want us to use Millitia AV against a basic tank with proto turrets. A basic tank can easily get 6k Armor and nothing would take that down with Millitia AV

A dropsuit vs a tank?

800 armor vs 6000 armor.

Yeah not fair

Dude if a tank is not in the open or keeps moving through cover than it is not easy, and if your dumb enough to get close enough for Lai Dais than you deserve it.

wait.....did u just say that the std cycled missile turrets i like putting on my derpships of been removed?

Did you even read the OP?

He wants us to use Basic/Millitia AV against a 6-7k armored hull with proto turrets?

Fire and forget? Yeah unless your swarms crash into a wall or decide to glitch and go backwards (what usually happens)


Lol Tankers without situational awareness and good tactics need to HTFU.

Tell me one time where you were killed by proto AV and it wasn't your fault?

Don't worry tankers, you will get good someday.

Why do you jump out in CQC range of a blaster turret?

Hmm that 10 Mil SP can easily be put towards other things, and tanks can do more than one thing, while all AV can do is kill tanks (except FGs, which I don't use).

What was your argument again?

But you are doing something the vast majority of AV players dont do

You are working as a team, you have 3 of you even tho its milita you are taking the initative, you are not trying to solo it with milita which frankly wont work even against an average pilot but 3 militia can give the pilot a suprise and if not careful the pilot can lose his tank

Once you skill upto adv taking a basic tank out wont cause any problems dependent on pilot skill but you already have an advantage you work together to do a job that most ppl want to do on ther own with no support

Question, when your in a Tank vs Tank fight would it Mae you angry if you died because your shots would either dive staight towards a wall or glitch up so bad that they fly backwards or just run around in circle?

And yeah I use a proto AV against basic tanks? That's common sense. If you were in your proto suit and you saw somebody in a STD suit would you kill him, or go to a supply depot to kill him with your basic suit?

I love hearing stupid posts and requests from tankers

LOL basically you are saying that I should have to work together with lol berries to get something done? That's like relying on lol berries to drive your tank?

And have you seen me and Lo jack the tire popper? XD

I'll rely on blueberries to help take down your Loltanks when you tankers start letting blueberries drive.

Till then why don't ya GET GOOD when it comes to tanks or don't drive your MLT tank in the open. And I call 'em Millitia because they drive around kill some peps and then drive into the open and then

+150 LOLTank Destruction
+50 Kill
+50 Kill
+50 Kill

LOOOOOOOOOL XD GET GOOD

Have you ever used swarms?

I've already tested this for you. Here are the results:

Ishukone Assault Forge Gun + Basic Dropsuit = 2079 HP damage

VS

Basic Armor HAV (fully specced)

Result: 5-6 volleys to destroy a Basic Armor HAV with proto assault forge.


Is there something wrong with this picture? A proto weapon vs a "basic" hull of an HAV and yet it cannot be destroyed by one volley (4 rounds) of a proto Ishukone forge. Your balance suggestions leans to the favor of tanks. Not a balance. If it takes two or more protos to take down a basic, then proto HAV's will dominate.

No see you are being reasonable and using logic
To really understand where tankers are coming from you need to shove a pineapple up your ass to experience the same amount of butt hurt they are

Inb4 Taka and Void start rambling about how this is a crutch and if you die you must play better when I have personally see these guys play and they both make a bonehead basic mistake, they over extend and go without support
Drive by runs work so much better guys and parking yourself next to a CRU or something and expecting not to get blown up, well really who needs to play better

Oh and as for the "Waaah we spent 10 million SP" did you guys ever stop and look at the skill screen and actually compare costs or did you go "Well this one weapon skill is at 3x so that means thats all you need"
I mean hell if thats what you did your main turret skill has the same SP cost but you wouldnt say only getting the turret is what matters on a tank fitting right, just like how only having the weapon is not part of a full AV fitting

LIES

When I first got my CBR7 I thought that I was the best around, and no tank could ever bring me down!

But then I met CEOPrex CloneA's derpship and got whooped.

You aren't crap for AV untill you go proto

LOL basically you are saying that I should have to work together with lol berries to get something done? That's like relying on lol berries to drive your tank?

And have you seen me and Lo jack the tire popper? XD

I'll rely on blueberries to help take down your Loltanks when you tankers start letting blueberries drive.

Till then why don't ya GET GOOD when it comes to tanks or don't drive your MLT tank in the open. And I call 'em Millitia because they drive around kill some peps and then drive into the open and then

+150 LOLTank Destruction
+50 Kill
+50 Kill
+50 Kill

LOOOOOOOOOL XD GET GOOD

I play in a squad and use that squad to work together so a couple of tanks dont get instagibbed

I dont rely on bluedots to do anything for me because they are bad and useless which is exactly just like you

I mean you cant destroy a basic tank with proto AV when the weapons do it all for you and rarely if ever miss the target

Im a vehicle pilot and i use more teamwork than you

Who said that is was bad at AV? LOL tanks have a survival ratio of 259:1

The only tank that has ever survived is my own, and that's cuz I was feeling generous.

All I said is that AV gets hard when the game starts glitching to PC level heights, in a PUB match.

Lol you ppl and your assumptions.

And I have a corp squad filled with tankers and AV. Ask anybody in my corp and they will tell you how much teamwork I have. And besides murdering LOLTanks I also run logistics, which requires more teamwork than killing peps and trying to be good in LOLTanks

30% Proto 20% adv 10% std damage nerfs. - Easier to drop adv/proto and balance by basic vs basic

Standardize Swarm launcher to 4 missiles every tier instead, adjust their damage to make up for it. - the number of missiles hasnt been a problem, its the tracking around corners and locking on through objects and firing while not looking at target and keeping lock and also jumping while getting a lock on and firing while jumping etc

Increase the Assault Forge Gun's dispersion by about 10-20%
Give Assault Forge guns a significant amount of kick requiring re-aiming between shots. - can deal with

Reduce forge gun splash. Replace with conal splash if ever possible. - FG splash should be lower than a vehicle mounted large railgun

Give PLC a sticky mechanic and damage aura. - sticky? meaning what exactly it sticks to the target and doesnt say home into the target?, anything homing is bad
PLC Breech Variant - Holds the charge instead of lashing out. Slows the operator down. May justify with damage or projectile speed change.

Reduction of AV grenades to 1, keep the same damage, make it impossible to restock via nano hives (as with all other grenades) Supply depots will still supply them at a slow rate. - would prefer if it had no homing mechanism, requires a direct hit on the hull for it to go off, if it misses and hit the ground disappears 1 second later, fine with no nano hive resupply and slow depot resupply, reduce damage by 50% its an AV support weapon not an AV weapon

Add Burst Forge gun, add significant kick between each firing, requires longer charge and not suitable for long range attacks. No splash, decent damage, just highest damage compression in the shortest amount of time. Total damage similar to other forges. Not sure if i see the need for this one

Change Assault Swarm to fire its missiles one at a time. Magazine accounts for this. Lock is not broken between firings. Semi-auto operation mode with slight delay between each firing. so tech it could fire 12missiles all at once, fastest finger 1st n all that, need numbers for missile delay between each one

Breach Swarm Launcher - Reduce Lock Box Size to that of the forge gun reticle, Longer lock time, significantly more damage but less agility - fix the SL 1st

Give Vehicles Multispectrum Flare Launchers. Prevents swarm launcher lock ons and tracking of active ones. - would it take a slot up? also would it need reloading or falre ammo to be bought and how long till they can be used again

Give Vehicles a Density field. Prevents forge gun strikes and plasma cannon strikes from hitting the vehicle, short life span and saves from one or two shots when its up. - would it take a slot up?also would it need reloading or falre ammo to be bought and how long till they can be used again

Give vehicles a mine thumper, destroys Remote explosive, proximity mines, and other mine devices in front of the vehicle. - would it take a turret slot up?

Give vehicles a mine layer 'turret'. Mines are a bit visible and can be destroyed easily and take time to arm. There is a max limit on how many can be deployed (10) - are the mines AI or AV or both?

Gyrostabilizer small turrets (against base vehicles left and right movement not up and down). Decrease their rate of turn. Allow third person camera for those gunning on the lav. Get rid of the camera scope. - decrease turn? why

Fix desync issues.
Spawn missiles further out from the tube.
Give all av weapons far better trails.

Give vehicles better damage zones, severely damaging one part effects the performance of the vehicle. Readjust the damage effectiveness on these zones. - thats WOT zone and requires a buff to all vehicles, also how do you fix stuff? whats the hp for each mod, how do you hit each mod or is it lucky hit? way too many problems with WOT method which makes everything alot more complicated so no

Who said that is was bad at AV? LOL tanks have a survival ratio of 259:1

The only tank that has ever survived is my own, and that's cuz I was feeling generous.

All I said is that AV gets hard when the game starts glitching to PC level heights, in a PUB match.

Lol you ppl and your assumptions.

And I have a corp squad filled with tankers and AV. Ask anybody in my corp and they will tell you how much teamwork I have. And besides murdering LOLTanks I also run logistics, which requires more teamwork than killing peps and trying to be good in LOLTanks

Did you pull that number out of your backside?

I mean why else do you guys are screaming for the ADS to come back but not the logi or scout lav?


ADS was faster and more agile, scout was useless,

Logi LAV has a 35% base resistance passive i may add

Now they are removing all passive mods and skills and taking them away

I would have loved to have a Logi dropship with 35% passive at base, i would have used the hell out of it

I even wanted a logi tank, no main turret but lots of slots prefitted with remote reps and enough slots to tank it out with a 35% base resistance

Here you go

LOL basically you are saying that I should have to work together with lol berries to get something done? That's like relying on lol berries to drive your tank?

And have you seen me and Lo jack the tire popper? XD

I'll rely on blueberries to help take down your Loltanks when you tankers start letting blueberries drive.

Till then why don't ya GET GOOD when it comes to tanks or don't drive your MLT tank in the open. And I call 'em Millitia because they drive around kill some peps and then drive into the open and then

+150 LOLTank Destruction
+50 Kill
+50 Kill
+50 Kill

LOOOOOOOOOL XD GET GOOD

Here you go

I already did a thread months back

Infantry complained yet again

You aren't crap for AV untill you go proto

Amarr heavy frame, Dau 2 and EX 11 says you are wrong.

So do I need to keep this up or have you come to your senses?

And realized that I'm trolling.

My Standard FG/SL and Sleek AV would also say you're wrong too.

Sleek AV nades?


XD They do so little in comparison to the packed variant, and if we can only carry one (per your request) then al AV nades will be useless except the packed ones.

And Why would anyone use STD gear? Do you like killing tanks? Or do you just like taking 16x as long to do so

Sleek AV nades?


XD They do so little in comparison to the packed variant, and if we can only carry one (per your request) then al AV nades will be useless except the packed ones.

And Why would anyone use STD gear? Do you like killing tanks? Or do you just like taking 16x as long to do so

Doesn't matter if it's PRO or STD, you can't destroy tanks with PRO anyway.

hes using nades like they should be used, as a support weapon, not a primary weapon.

hes using nades like they should be used, as a support weapon, not a primary weapon.

LOL You've never been a tanker. If you had that experience, you wouldn't be so against tanks.

Ok well when I run you over and get away with 100hp because you wen't with the weaker gun (or grenade) I will mail you personally and ask if you regret using them for support as opposed to a YOU SHALL NOT PASS, denial weapon

edit (because I accidentally hit post instead of preview)

I remember those chromosome tanks. Those were scary. And I still know about Logi LAVs. Those things zipping at you full speed with nitrous is pee your pants scary. And I got sick of running against people with vehicles. So instead of being a butthurt scrub I decided to be a Logi LAV driver. Didn't help against other tanks. Then I became a tanker. Wasn't as efficient against entire squads of tanks. Then I tried AV. It sucked. But then I upgraded and upgraded and when I got to proto, Hmm. Getting better. Tried Lai Dais. Hmm. closer.. closer.. Got profecincy lvl 3. Perfect .

I will never chose a STD or ADV when I go up against vehicles. And I will never get a sleek av grenade when the packed ones guarantee a victory. Would you bring a water gun or a Fire Truck to put out a fire?

Why in gods name would you suggest using something weaker. And If I do use something weaker then why should I only carry one?

Give me 5 GOOD reasons why I should use a weaker variant and risk letting them live and I'll stop going AV. And no CPU/PG is not a good reason. Mercy? Don't make me laugh.

Ok well when I run you over and get away with 100hp because you wen't with the weaker gun (or grenade) I will mail you personally and ask if you regret using them for support as opposed to a YOU SHALL NOT PASS, denial weapon

edit (because I accidentally hit post instead of preview)

I remember those chromosome tanks. Those were scary. And I still know about Logi LAVs. Those things zipping at you full speed with nitrous is pee your pants scary. And I got sick of running against people with vehicles. So instead of being a butthurt scrub I decided to be a Logi LAV driver. Didn't help against other tanks. Then I became a tanker. Wasn't as efficient against entire squads of tanks. Then I tried AV. It sucked. But then I upgraded and upgraded and when I got to proto, Hmm. Getting better. Tried Lai Dais. Hmm. closer.. closer.. Got profecincy lvl 3. Perfect .

I will never chose a STD or ADV when I go up against vehicles. And I will never get a sleek av grenade when the packed ones guarantee a victory. Would you bring a water gun or a Fire Truck to put out a fire?

Why in gods name would you suggest using something weaker. And If I do use something weaker then why should I only carry one?

Give me 5 GOOD reasons why I should use a weaker variant and risk letting them live and I'll stop going AV. And no CPU/PG is not a good reason. Mercy? Don't make me laugh.

Trust me if you run me over its because I wasn't trying to kill you.

Ok well when I run you over and get away with 100hp because you wen't with the weaker gun (or grenade) I will mail you personally and ask if you regret using them for support as opposed to a YOU SHALL NOT PASS, denial weapon

edit (because I accidentally hit post instead of preview)

I remember those chromosome tanks. Those were scary. And I still know about Logi LAVs. Those things zipping at you full speed with nitrous is pee your pants scary. And I got sick of running against people with vehicles. So instead of being a butthurt scrub I decided to be a Logi LAV driver. Didn't help against other tanks. Then I became a tanker. Wasn't as efficient against entire squads of tanks. Then I tried AV. It sucked. But then I upgraded and upgraded and when I got to proto, Hmm. Getting better. Tried Lai Dais. Hmm. closer.. closer.. Got profecincy lvl 3. Perfect .

I will never chose a STD or ADV when I go up against vehicles. And I will never get a sleek av grenade when the packed ones guarantee a victory. Would you bring a water gun or a Fire Truck to put out a fire?

Why in gods name would you suggest using something weaker. And If I do use something weaker then why should I only carry one?

Give me 5 GOOD reasons why I should use a weaker variant and risk letting them live and I'll stop going AV. And no CPU/PG is not a good reason. Mercy? Don't make me laugh.

im a tanker, everyone knows that, im wont get run over, il shoot you with my railgun before you get 30m next to me.

give me 5 good reasons why some prick who only spent 2 mil SP and 3K ISK should be able to solo my tank when I have over 10 mil SP skilled and I pay over 1 mil to deploy.

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds. But I also happen to be Proto AV.

And no. If we use standard swarms (which does the exact same damage as Millitia swarms) we would get dominated by basic hulls.

I think that the problem with most tankers is that they just don't know when they should get outta there and then wonder why Proto AV hurts.

Basically your saying, we should say FU to ppl who invested 2 million SP into being Proto AV and make them use Millitia swarms against tanks with 6-8k armor. No.

Don't cry because you suck at tanking.

you obviously can't use teamwork nor have you ever tanked, we have to get to cover every 2 seconds cuz some noob is using proto AFG accross the map.
ps. use dmg mods

Don't cry because you suck at tanking

Did you even read the OP?

He wants us to use Basic/Millitia AV against a 6-7k armored hull with proto turrets?

Fire and forget? Yeah unless your swarms crash into a wall or decide to glitch and go backwards (what usually happens)


Lol Tankers without situational awareness and good tactics need to HTFU.

Tell me one time where you were killed by proto AV and it wasn't your fault?

Don't worry tankers, you will get good someday.

I use basic tanks all the time when I'm low on funds.

BAHAHAHAHAHA Blasters are CQC BAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I have seen a Blaster Turret annihilate from +75m

Arrighty duel me in your basic MLT tanks, bring it tank to tank. I want to fight something!

GÖª ''You are not a tanker so your opinon doest count
GÖª We (all tankers) are ALSO AV'ers so we do know what we are talking about ''

This excuse is lame and its getting old and opinions based on this are ridiculously biased and obviously to be ignored.

we are all playing the same game and OBVIOUSLY see stuff from a different point of view, unless you are willing to think outside YOUR box, opinions on ''balance'' are pointless.

And yes, Av'ers have most of the times AV thoughts based on their experiences but so do tankers and we are both Biased.
Here is when CCP must step in and decide the best for us based on the NUMBERS, not listen to our suggestions,because 1 suggestion wrongly taken = More umbalanced AV vs Vehicles....

So if we're both sides of the coin, how does our opinion not count? You don't make any sense.

1.) If nobody can destroy you, then that would be a 30/0 per match and a 300k isk payout, while "cheating" infantry units out of a fair game.

I rarely ever go 30/0 per match even with no av on the field. that's a stupid reason non the less, the biggest payout iv gotten from a pub match is 450k and that's because I destroyed enemy vehicles the whole match, killing infantry doesn't allow me to make a profit while tanking.

2.) Because being AV sacrifices a lot because you are still in a dropsuit and are still exposed to normal infantry on the ground

being a tanker, you sacrifice the ability to fight outside of your vehicle. when outside, we can barely hold our own against anyone unless we have enough SP to skill into infantry.

3.) 2 Million SP is a lot compared to 10 Million into tanking. Tanks can do anything from sniping (kinda), to assualt, to AV and more. AV (except FGs) can only be used to kill vehicles. Ever see someone kill a dropsuit with Lai Dais?

2 mil does not = 10 mil. tankers earn the privilege to be effective in anything thanks to the amount of personal investment we put into tanks.

4.) Why shouldn't I be able to destroy you? What should we bring in cromo tanks and buff them to 20k armor? Nah that's too low I bet you want MCC Level health and armor. What should be able to destroy you? Should we just make you invincible like 98% of the loltanking community wants to be?

why does me not wanting to be one shoted or soloed by you mean I want unlimited health? does that mean you know without a doubt that you cant use teamwork worth **** and completely suck at what you do so you automatically believe "they don't want me to one shot them so that means they want to be godmode"? I think so.


5.) Because that same prick who only Spent 2 Million SP and 77k ISK is that same prick who is gonna get whipped and beaten by the enemy infantry on the ground.

guess what genius, so do tankers that spend all their SP into tanks, tankers have to sacrifice skilling into anything else in order to complete tank basic skills. and guess what, that's ok, because your not supostu be master of everything. that's why AVnades need to be nerfed to hell or removed altogether, they do too much damage for what they are and they allow you to ignore the basic rule being that you must sacrifice in order to gain.

1 Million ISK per deployment please.

yeah, it costs around 1 mil isk to deploy a decent tank fitting, the lowest cost is around 900k isk which doesn't survive long. aks any tanker, theyl tell you how much it costs to deploy a decent tank.. if you don't believe me on that, then you truly are ignorant.

MLT Tanks? Umm. No

I use madrugars.

When I said basic tank I meant a tank with basic gear.

XD Millitia Tanks. I freaking take those things out with mass drivers

edit: Sure I'll go tank vs tank. But don't cry when your hull gets smashed with Lai Dais

So basically what you are saying you would do is go tank to tank, at the first sign of loss you would ***** out, and run AV.

******* hell you have no honour sir.

Retracted my offer. I have more skilled and more honourable players to fight.

1.) If nobody can destroy you, then that would be a 30/0 per match and a 300k isk payout, while "cheating" infantry units out of a fair game.

2.) Because being AV sacrifices a lot because you are still in a dropsuit and are still exposed to normal infantry on the ground

3.) 2 Million SP is a lot compared to 10 Million into tanking. Tanks can do anything from sniping (kinda), to assualt, to AV and more. AV (except FGs) can only be used to kill vehicles. Ever see someone kill a dropsuit with Lai Dais?

4.) Why shouldn't I be able to destroy you? What should we bring in cromo tanks and buff them to 20k armor? Nah that's too low I bet you want MCC Level health and armor. What should be able to destroy you? Should we just make you invincible like 98% of the loltanking community wants to be?

5.) Because that same prick who only Spent 2 Million SP and 77k ISK is that same prick who is gonna get whipped and beaten by the enemy infantry on the ground.

1 Million ISK per deployment please.

... Have you read the my replies from other people?

Teamwork?!?!

I 1v1 you while my squad beats you to death with AV. It's what normally happens when I tank vs tank.

Hey it was the tankers who said that they wanted to see more teamwork outta AV. Irony hurts doesn't it? XD

And it's hard to find honourable people in this game. Honorable people however is a different story.

He's saying that none of our opinions should count, because we all have a bias in this argument

No, I'm pretty sure he's taking it to a personal level.

Yep double standards FTW.

I once rage a PUB chat a few months ago from I guy who's tank I destroyed

It basically said that I'm a no good f***ing scrub who uses lolswarms against loltanks.He said that I should be forced to use teamwork to take me down, and that I use noob tubes and all that other stuff.

I saw the same guy a few days later and decided to troll him some more by having 2 of my friends come with me to take him out. He charged right into us and got pounded by 12 Lai Dais.

I mailed him and asked if I should use still use teamwork. I think he blocked me after that.

Tankers rage even harder if they encounter a full squad of lolswarms, yet have the nerve to cry about using teamwork should be mandatory, as if everybody has GOOD and when I say it, I mean GOOD AV.

i only say that we shouldn't always need teamwork because not everyone has GOOD AV.

We both adhere to double standards, but I have reasoning behind mine. Loltankers (most of them) are just plain hypocritical.

But aren't we all hypocrites in New Eden?

Because you're still using crutch weapons. I can at least respect forge gunners on ground level because they play a dangerous game of cat and mouse, and have to aim their weapon to destroy me.

What, you think good tanks don't cost 1mil ISK? See, I told you you've never tanked.

i didnt read anything in the post but i had an idea about tanks. i think it would be good if there was some item or some way to damage the track of a tank so it is either temporarily immobilized or something. right now in a pub for example its so easy for a tank to just engage then run away when its low and rep up. tank can go completely untactical without any infantry support and beast mode too easy. maybe an immobilization grenade that will make it move 20% speed for 30 seconds, or hitting a track with a forge gun makes it unable to move for 10 seconds or something. maybe let us shove logs in the track like the finns of the winter war eh

My Madrugar, costs me 450k, and it's got a good repper, 180mm steel plates, 2 beta PG extenders, a heavy armor remote repairer, and a light converse shield transporter. Along with an ST-1 missile launcher (or whatever that basic missile turret is). And I could reduce that cost to 300k if I really wanted to.

Don't believe me? Then I'll post a picture when I get home.

Tanks cost 1 Mil when you make them cost one mil

I have a 450k tank which could vaporise it, the reason a decent tank costs 1mil is mainly due to the turret which needs to be good enough to whack AV infantry and any tanks you come across

Hmm a S*** tank tho huh?

Never had a problem with killing infantry when I have my missile launcher on. 6899 armor isn't that crappy, considering that that's what all the Madrugars I've ever seen have. And I could make that 7k if I didn't design my tank to rep other tanks.

Then again I guess maybe everyone has a **** tank, which is most likely true.